In defense of Brian Cashman

What are ya gonna do?
Bad omens abound for Yankees

The Yanks’ loss tonight sure was disheartening. They failed to hit; their star set-up kid — and remember, he’s just a kid — couldn’t deal with a swarm of bugs and was a little wild; the back end of their weak bullpen failed to get outs in key situations.

For a small but vocal minority of Yankee fans, the fault for this team lies with Brian Cashman. The Yankees GM hasn’t been able to field a World Champion team since 2000, and even then, that team was largely the product of his predecessors Bob Watson and Gene Michael. So Cashman, because his teams are continually flawed, despite a payroll that has finally grown to $200 million, should be fired.

Well, I do not buy it for one second. When Brian Cashman inherited the Yankees — a team he, as an assistant general manager, helped construct — they were at the start of a great run of World Series championships. His work led the team to three World Series championships, five American League Championships and a playoff berth every single season.

But for some Yankee fans, the team has failed every year after 2000. Who cares about the two AL Championships and the seven playoff appearances? Who cares about the 686-445 record with a.607 winning percentage tops among all Major League teams from 2001-2007.

So are we supposed to blame Brian Cashman because he’s put together a team that wins during the regular season but can’t win during the playoffs? I don’t think so. If you put together teams that win in the postseason but can’t get there, what’s the point?

The bad part are these best-of-five series. While I hate to make excuses, they’re hardly indicative of a team’s ability over the course of 162 games. Cashman has, while working with a very overbearing boss who insisted on giving Jason Giambi a contract about two years and $40 million too long, to name one, put together one of the most successful baseball games of all time. You can’t top that no matter how poorly the Yanks have done in October.

Meanwhile, the Yanks are down but not out at all. They face Jake Westbrook on Sunday and, if they survive, Paul Byrd on Monday. If the team clicks, there’s no reason to count them out and every reason to expect a game five. If they make it that far, you’ll see far less criticism of a team that, while flawed, isn’t exactly a disaster.

What are ya gonna do?
Bad omens abound for Yankees
  • E-ROC

    Thank you. He has helped re-stock depleted minor league system. Look at the influx of youth. Re-energized an old team. Now, it’s up to Torre to make some adjustments to the lineup. Maybe some Shelley and Giambi or Betemit? SI’s Tom Verducci had a nice take on last night’s game. It’s a good read. We’ll win in 5. By the way, I think CC Sabathia and Carmona will pitch twice in this series. Just a hunch.

  • Mark

    I’m one of those vocal critics of Cashman. 2 wins- 13 losses last 15 post season games is not a coincidence. He demanded to be the man got the money and responsibility. You forgot to mention Igawa, Pavano. He is a sympathetic figure for many people. When things go wrong it’s the meddling owner. He was quoted 3 yrs ago as saying would re-stock minors. Finally showing progress–gets a lot of points for Joba. But let’s not over look all the errors–the list is too long to forget.

  • brxbmrs

    Cash actually has transformed this team pretty quickly in a few months – Joba, Hughes (although you guys overrated him), IPK, getting Molina – he’s done almost the impossible – getting younger and better.

    As a pessimist, even I have to say, I think our future is really bright – Miranda, Tabata, Jackson, Horne, maybe even Sanchez plus Cano, MELKY!, etc.

    I also think we could possibly get Santana if we were willing to part with Hughes, Bet and Melky (as much as I love the Melkman) – in other words going forward we have lots of options.

    Cash needs at least another year to purge the team of the Moose, Giambi, contracts as well.

    The real problem is the older, overrated offense and no D – Matsui, Giambi, Abreu (nice that he can’t hit the cutoff man).

    Yanks have also to consider that Posada and Jeter aren’t going to be here forever.

    I hate acknowledging the old saw – Good pitching beats good hitting – but it does – especially overrated hitting.

    Many of us have been crtiticized for being too negative about the Yanks going into October – I think alot of us realized that this team is still largely comprised to punish weak pitching – we should get that the next two games – its gonna show us what this team is made of and what effect Dr. Torre has inspiring his team to perform.

    I wanted Cash gone mid season, now, I think that would be a huge mistake – even though my only real goal for October was not to be embarassed in the playoffs – I didn’t even care if we got out of the ALDS, I just didn’t want to see all the 0 fers our offense put up, nor Wang get totally shelled.

    IOW, we still to a large part have an older, flawed team that can’t win a short series. They still have a chance to prove me wrong.

    • dan

      Say what you want about Hughes, but Baseball America rated him as the #1 pitching prospect in the country this year.

      An offense that leads the league in runs can’t be overrated.

      • brxbmrs

        They rated Eric Duncan and Drew Hensen highly also – how’d that work out?

        Hughes is a nice pitcher – a real nice one to use as a big part in a deal for Johan Santanna

        • dan

          Have Yankee fans not learned?

          Once they get great young pitching, some people still want to trade it for veterans and rentals

          • brxbmrs


            I think we have learned – i.e. in the past we would have jumped at Melky for Mike Gonzalez or IPK\Horne for Gagne.

            Just keep in mind Santana is probably the best pitcher in mlb – and he’s in his prime. Nothing is without risk, but I’m just considering the possibility – also its kinda cool b\c we actually have alot of young, valuable ml talent – pretty awesome.

            I actually like Hughes and think he’s pitching hurt (I just can’t resist rubbing it in a little since our esteemed blog owners were so smitten with him).

            However, Hughes is never going to be lefty like Santana, and while none of us really know where his ceiling is, I think even if Hughes picks up a few more mph on his FB he’s not going to be a true Ace like Santana or Webb – I think he’s more a #2/3 – still fantastic, but I think we see that alot of teams the last few years in October don’t fear us – one big reason, we don’t have that “lock” starter.


            Now, lets make Westbrook and Byrd our bitches and get back to the mistake on the lake.

            • dan

              sorry for the delay, i didnt see ur response to my post, and idk if you will see this…

              I respect your opinion about hughes, im a little biased since im such a huge fan of his. Before he had pitched 4 games in tampa i was telling people that he’d be pitching opening day in 2009. I personally hate it when people say anything about involving hughes in any kind of trade

  • DKA

    If I were to blame him for anything, it would that, if there was that “doomsday scenario” Peter Abraham mentions on his blog, then it would be Cashman’s pompous attitude in not attempting to negotiate contract extensions for Mo, Posada, etc., that made it all worse. That reason, and only that reason, would lead me to want his head on a platter.

  • brxbmrs


    Mo’s my favorite player of the last 30+ years and I’ve always loved Jorge. But lets realize that they are both more of our past than future.

    Hypothetically, lets say the Mets go crazy and offer Jorge 4 years 60 mil or Mo the same deal, maybe in that case its time to let them go and move on.

    Now having said that, I think we will be more frustrated by the Status Quo in the offseason. THe Yanks now are now mostly run by money men and marketers and even if we get swept, those guys are going to look at the 4.3 mil fans that packed the Stadium this year and are going to be reluctant to even partially tear down the hot dog stand b\c we sold too many hot dogs to alot of fans who didn’t realize how vulnerable this team still is in a short series.

    That could mean Dr. Torre, Mo, Jorge, A-Rod (getting 300 mil from us) all returning and just some mild tweaking – I really don’t know.

    I do think we need an Ace like Santana, and I think we may make a big trade to do that.

  • NYFan50

    The good news for Sunday is that the Yankee offense hits .310/.368/.525 against Westbrook.

  • E-ROC

    Who would u trade to get Santana? You can sign him without giving up anybody. We’ll need our young pitchers like Kennedy and Horne because there aren’t any starters in our system that are ready for the majors. Steven White? Maybe. Especially if Pettitte, Rivera and Posada follow Torre out the door.

  • Rick in Boston

    How is Cashman responsible when the 4-5-6 hitters go 0-fer the series, leaving guys on base? The only way A-Rod, Jorge and Matsui have gotten on base this series is by drawing a walk. The offense has come from Damon, Cano and Melky. That’s great, but it’s not fully expected of them.

    If the Yanks don’t get hot and at least make this a series, we have to look at what Jeter, A-Rod, Posada and Matsui DID NOT do, and that’s hit. But for all of that, we don’t have a playoff series to watch if Cashman doesn’t stick around. Without him guiding the ship, Proctor’s arm falls off on the mound, Bernie keeps playing everyway, and some combination of Enrique Wilson and Miguel Cairo play 2B while Cano and Melky play elsewhere.

  • Pfistyunc

    Spare me Ben. It is very convenient to blame every poor decision he makes on “the mysterious Tampa contingent” or the meddling owner, yet praise him for anything that works out. Cashman’s success is due to his giant checkbook and that is all. His rings were orchestrated by Stick Michael’s work and he hasn’t done it since. He has been able to ride Stick’s coattails into several years of undeserved employment. It is fun to try and score 1000 runs and destroy Oriole, Devil Ray and Royal pitching along the way, but the guy simply can’t create a roster that will succeed in the postseason. I understand that there is room for disagreement here, but at what point does his pre-2001 success stop automatically giving him a free pass? To me, as the years pass those rings are being proven to be the product of other people’s work.

    As for the whole playoff success thing, I would much rather not make the playoffs as often but then actually win when we get there rather than get blasted in the first round every year. If I wanted it the other way, I would become a Braves fan.

    • dan

      go away. If you want to watch a team with david eckstein and juan pierre-type players (who are very “winner-ish” yet somehow suck at baseball) watch a different team. It’s not like the Yankees were the only team that destroyed bad teams: they are bad teams because a lot of teams beat them.

      • Pfistyunc

        As an ardent Miguel Cairo hater, the last thing I want to see is more shitty Yankee players. What I was trying to say is that I would like to see the roster better constructed for the postseason. Cashman has pretty much punted on assembling a front-loaded pitching staff over the past few years and I think that is why they are where they are now. His bullpen construction is a whole other bag of fun.

        • Zack

          I am sure Cashman would really love to assemble a stocked pitching rotation with a few shut down starters too. I don’t think he has “punted” but rather there hasn’t been jack crap out there. Meche, Lilly? Have you noticed that the Angels and Indians have HOMEGROWN staffs and the Sox had to break the bank to get their #1.

          The Yankees do have a front end starter for next year, his name is Joba. And Phil Hughes.

          As for creating a roster that will succeed in the postseason, what the hell does that mean? A roster like the Indians? B/c they were really effective last night. A roster like the Angels? Yuck. One like the Red Sox? Please, you can have that lineup. Its pretty damn hard to put together a better lineup and bench, top to bottom, than what the Yankees threw out there the last two days. Who would you replace? Jeter and Posada? A-Rod? Damon? Cano and Hideki? I hate to break your bubble, but Jeter, Posada, Damon, Minky, A-Rod, Giambi have all won in the post season before. You are being truly the epitome of an arm-chair GM.

          There is no such thing as a “lineup built for the playoffs.” A rotation maybe, but hitters don’t/can’t be somehow better in the postseason. What, they might bunt more? They might have those “intangibles.” I hate to break it to you, but those vaunted heroes of the championship run also set the record for worst hitting in a WS.

          This is the kind of crap ass discussion that the whole offseason will consist of: fire Torre, let A-Rod walk, Cashman sucks, The Red Sox are the greatest team in the history of the world, Joba should be a closer, Hughes is overrated, Jeter is still a clutch God who has great defensive ability, Cashman screwed up the whole season by not resigning Mo and Jorge at the start, we need more Scott Brocious types, etc etc etc. Going to be a long winter

        • Count Zero

          Not being combative here — just curious. What exactly would you have done about the pitching staff last off-season? Name names, please.

          • Pfistyunc

            It wasn’t just a last winter issue. This problem has manifested itself for several seasons. A huge part of the problem is that he gave Farnsworth the main setup role when the rest of baseball simply scratched their heads as they observed that huge fucking blunder. That event has spun the bullpen out of whack and forced Torre to burn up certain relievers because he was stuck with so much dead weight in the bullpen. It is Cashman who seems to think that Villones and Myers of the world are good signings. He also trusted 40% of the starting rotation to Igawa and Pavano this winter. Last winter, I would have signed Lilly over Igawa (it would have cost less money). I also would have let Moose walk and given a rotation spot to Hughes out of spring training. I know those aren’t huge transactions, but you asked specifically about this winter.

            Look, Cashman has done some great things in the past, but to me the Igawa and Farnsworth signings pushed me past the brink; those moves demonstrate that he is completely unable of gauging pitching talent.

            • NYFan50

              Right, because Lilly in the AL East has such a great track record…good job getting those front-of-the-rotation shut down starters you talked about.

            • zack

              Two moves proved to you that Cashman is “completely unable of gauging [gaging] pitching talent?” Wow, you must be some kind of super GM or something. I mean, because no GM misses the mark a few times. I mean, hey, Lugo, Drew, Crisp, Gagne, and Dice-K had masterful seasons for the Sox, so I guess Epstein is worse than Cashman. And Dan Kolb worked wonders for the Braves, so ditto John Schuerholz. Nevermind that Pettitte was probably the single best offseason pitching signing, or that the Yankees not only managed to get rid of Johnson, but got usable, contributing parts in return. Ditto Jaret Wright.

              Cashman didn’t “trust” the rotation to Igawa and Pavano, he recognized that anyone else out there wasn’t any better. He also recognized that the kids in the minors needed a bit more time, but not enough to validate going out and signing a guy like Lilly for a ton of $ and years.

              No GM is perfect. They all make mistakes. We would too. Get over yourself

              • Pfistyunc

                You are entitled to your opinion. I was just pointing out two examples of why I have completely lost faith in Cashman, but that list is way longer than two names long. Cashman apologists tend to blame everything on Tampa or the Boss, but I place the blame for bad moves on the one who is responsible for the moves, which is the general manager.

                Also, by no means am I saying that Lilly is the difference or anything of the sort. I was asked what I would have done specifically last winter and I answered. However, the pitching mess he has created is not fixable in one offseason. They might be on the right track now trusting Hughes, IPK, Joba and the other kids and I think that is fantastic. However, for me, that doesn’t excuse Cashman’s horrible job performance since 2001.

                • younguns

                  What pitching mess are you talking about?

                  Is it the fact that until Brian Cashman went hard into rebuilding the Yankee Farm System just 2+ years ago, we had a system that couldn’t even produce relievers?

                  Before Hughes, Andy Pettitte was the last starter produced by a grossly mismanaged & neglected farm system whose only purpose for existence was to produce trade bait in return for other teams’ garbage aka “over-the-hill veterans.”

                  It was this inabilty to produce anything that was ready to help the MLB team by the Yankee Farm System that forced Cashman to go out onto the free agent market & sign guys such as Pavano, Farnsworth, Wright, & Igawa in order to rebuild & compete for a title at the same time. In addition, it was the obsession to trade for square pegs such as Randy Johnson by Steinbrenner that made Cashman’s job even more difficult.

                  What Cashman has desperately been doing these last 2 years is rebuild the farm system, produce cheap, good young talent who will be ready to replace the big or bad contracts which will be off the books after the 2008 season. All this while at the same time trying to field a team that will not only make the post-season, but win a title at the same time.

                  Here’s a list.

                  Jared Wright (Bad contract that’ll be off the books after this season)
                  Mussina (Big, not necessarily bad)
                  Abreu (Again, Big, not necessarily bad)
                  Clemens (BIG, Not Bad, & Gone after this year)
                  Pettitte (Again, Big, Not Bad, & could he be gone after this year or next year)

                  The money saved, besides going to a big extension for A-Rod, can easily be used to buy out the arbitration years of Wang, Cano, & Melky and sign them to discounted, long-term contracts. The money saved from these signings can further be used to do the same thing for the next group of young players such as Hughes, Joba, & IPK when their time comes.

                  Finally, the money will be there for Cashman so that if ever Johan Santana or another elite player hits the free agent market, we can sign him and do so without possibly paying the luxuary tax.

            • younguns

              Signing Lilly would have cost us our 2006 1st Round Draft pick AND $50+ Million. Igawa only cost us ca$h. Rebuilding your farm system by losing your 1st & 2nd Round Draft picks by way of signing 2nd & 3rd tier free agents is a recipe for perpetual defeat.

              Perpetual defeat is what the Mets are looking at in the next few years with that aged rotation of theirs unless they can get Humber & Pelfrey straightened out. The Shea front office will be forced to jump into a 2007 free agent class where the top starters, Schilling Glavine, & Kenny Rogers, are all over 40 years old.

              The Mets’ 2007 free agent signing plans died when Carlos Zambrano reupped with the Cubs, who got bounced when they went 3 & out in the NLDS.

              Wait, isn’t Ted Lilly pitiching for these same 2007 Cubs?

  • Mac

    How is Cashman responsible for the fact that the number one offensive team in the majors (a team he put together) is now hitting .121 in the short series? He just isn’t. Just like he isn’t responsible for the act of freaking God that stopped Joba from pitching like a beast.

    Does anyone remember that pitiful series in Colorado where the team scored like one run in 30 innings? This has happened before, even without the mystical grand mystique of the “post-season,” and as history proved, there’s just nothing you can do about the drought of hits except wait until they start hitting again. Which will be tomorrow I think.

    And trade for Santana? Why pay twice for him?

  • The Scout

    I’ll wait until the season is over and a couple of weeks have passed to assess Cashman. Everyone is distressed over the way the first two games in this series have gone, and for good reason. Judging the best course for the organization calls for some perspective, which is lacking now. And I say this as someone who joined the chorus against Cashman when the team was 21-29.

  • dan

    Count Zero– I dont want it to get lost up there as a reply so ill write down here

    I’m thinking the exact same thing (“name names please”). There wasn’t a whole lot anyone could do last offseason. The Zito signing has so far been terrible for the giants (there are 6 years left, so it could turn around), and he’d be worse in the AL this year.

    So after Cashman signed pettitte, the next best option (remember: I’m looking in hindsight, and couldn’t tell the future as of december ’06) in that class was either Gil Meche or Ted Lilly. Meche has been a little better in a harder league, has a bigger contract, but nevertheless is still around the same as lilly.

    Ruling out the rest of the free agents, what was Cashman to do? He could have offered Arod for Peavy, but such trades generally don’t happen. So instead of giving 55mill to meche or trading the farm for a veteran, he kept the young guys. Because of Cashman’s desire to keep the young pitchers, the yankees could have one of the best rotations in the majors for the next 10 years.

    That’s a mighty fine job by Mr. Cashman

  • dan

    that’s how terrible last years FA class was that Pfistyunc wanted Cashman to choose from

  • yankz

    Why do you guys still read his posts? I quit after game 1, when he said Cashman constructed a poor lineup.

  • D

    Yeah, Cash has made some mistakes on the FA market…which makes him just like every other GM. The FA market is a dangerous place; elite players (ESPECIALLY pitchers) rarely hit the market these days…something we can thank revenue sharing for. Over the last 5 years, the idea has been to build your team’s core either from within or by trading and then supplement it with the odd FA signing.

    Cash’s great strengths (patience on the trade market and a BRILLIANT amateur dept.) are exactly what you want in these circumstances. Teams absolutely HAVE to grow their own pitching and over the last few seasons, he’s assembled the best collection of rookie/MiLB pitching in the game, all through smart moves on the amateur market and good trades that jettisoned damaged, expensive, elderly players for useful prospects (even tho I didn’t like the return on the RJ trade at all when it was made).

    And for like the 8 millionth time, there are exactly 0 good options for replacing Cash…Steve Phillips? Jim Duquette? Try to buy Billy Beane out of his contract (lol)?

  • Rick in Boston

    There isn’t anyone better out there, and even if there was, we’re all forgetting that the baseball part of his job is only part of things. Cashman or whoever else is in charge, has to be seen in a certain way with the press. Phillips? Yeah, it’ll go over well if he ever gets caught with his secretary, again. Or Duquette? He went on record saying a certain pitcher was done.

    Being the GM in New York is a complete 180 deg. turn from anywhere else in baseball. You have to not only be great at talent and acquiring players, but also in dealing with the media, the constant pressure, and people like us. If someone like Cashman can’t win, than nobody can.

    And Cashman has really only been running the Yankees for the last two years. That’s when Steinbrenner gave him complete control. Stick was successful because Steinbrenner had been suspended and he was alone and in control. Watson quit because the Boss ran him down. Has Cashman? No. He stuck it out and has put together an organization, especially in terms of pitching, that any other team would salivate for – Steinbrenner family money or not.

    Let’s get off the “Cashman must go” bandwagon. He’s built a team that gets to the playoffs. Do you want to go 15 years between playoff appearances just to win one series again? I enjoy this time of year – unlike the other ten teams in the AL, we at least get a chance at the random dance that is the MLB Playoffs.

  • bill73083

    Hey everyone, I don’t post here very often, but I hope you don’t mind if I add my 2 cents to the discussion.

    There’s a lot more parity in MLB today than there was when the Yankees made their run in the 1990s and early 2000s. Since the Yankees won it in 2000, a different team has won the WS every single year. In 2007, the Yankees are the only team who made it into the playoffs who also made it to the playoffs in 2006. The fact that there are less and less “big-name” FA’s is also a sign of this parity. The players are already on teams. The fact that the Yankees are consistently in the running, while other teams, such as the White Sox, Astros, and even Red Sox are in and out of the playoffs from year to year. Sure some of that consistency has to do with money, but a lot of it has to do with knowing when to acquire a player and when to get rid of a player.

    Another bit of information that I find interesting is that even though Cashman has been the GM of the Yankees for a while, the current problem with pitching hasn’t really occured until 2004. In 2003, the Yankees had a team ERA of 4.02, good for 3rd place in the AL and a 109 ERA+. They were also 2nd in the league in Ks and HRs, and 1st in the league in BBs. After that year they lost Pettitte, Clemens, and Wells. The team ERA jumped to 4.69, good for only 6th place in the AL and a 96 ERA+. Cashman tried to replace those guys with a mixture of trades for promising young pitchers (in the form of Vazquez who had a 3.24 ERA, 1.11 WHIP, 154 ERA+ in 2003) and veterans (Kevin Brown who had a 2.39 ERA, 1.14 WHIP, 169 ERA+ in 2003 and Jose Contreras who was a promising pitcher at that time). Those guys didn’t work out, so he went with Randy Johnson, Pavano, and Jaret Wright. Each year he has tried something new. Sure he’s made mistakes. But to me that demonstrates the difficulty in developing a good pitching staff more than Cashman’s own ineptitude.

    While he was doing this, Cashman was also developing a barren minor league system to be able to stock the team’s needs. The Yankees were signing guys like Horne, Hughes, Joba, and IPK all along. But it takes time for young guys to develop. That’s the downside of developing your own pitchers. It takes time and patience. The risk of signing free agents is that your not getting them at their prime. So your paying for their past successes, and there’s a risk they could go bust. Cashman has been using both methods. So far the free-agent signing method isn’t working. We’re starting to see the fruit of the prospect method now. Hopefully by next year or 2009, we’ll have a better staff like Cleveland and LAA has.

  • http://RiverAve.Blues Joseph M

    My biggest problem with Cashman is Torre. Torre should have been fired after the Angel series of 2005, and speaking frankly, there is a pretty good case you could make that he should have been fired after 2004.

    The fact that Torre is the Yankee manager in 2007 and that Cashman has not been able to do what has to be done is shameful. Torre makes too much money, and the team payroll is so far removed from the team in second place, that these annual fall pratfalls are unacceptable. The team seems to fold utterly at the first sign of pressure and the manager has got to take responsibility for that.

    Cashman has not been able to aquire/develop capable middle inning relief pitchers, and that coupled with the older starters and the six inning fadeouts contribute to the team being on on the outside looking in year after year.

    Cashman has done alot of good things to redeem himself this year and bringing him back regardless of what happens this post season is not out of the question.

    One thing that can not be tolerated from Cashman would be any suggestion concerning the retaining of Torre beyond 2007. Barring a World Series victory Torre should be fired within 72 hours of the Yankees final game.

    Look no matter how we come at this we all can agree on one thing, it’s not over and we still have a chance.

    Let’s Go Yankees!

    • brxbmrs


      I dislike Torre for all the reasons you mentioned, plus I think he’s a big phony – we never hear about his 3 kids from his first marriage and he’s admitted he was a lousy father the first time around. While this may not have much to do with his job as Yanks manager, IMHO it tells me alot about the man who is revered by many.

      The few good pens we see now days seem to be homegrown – I faulted Cashman for alot but I really think he’s on the right track – wouldn’t want to
      see him go.

      As for how the team folds in October, it doesn’t surprise me at all – its still chock full of aging, one way players who beat up bad teams – this team has been a paper tiger the last 3 years.

      As for Torre, as much as we may feel that he’s the luckiest SOB in the history of the game and a consummate politician, the two things I think we have to say are:
      these simple minded players believe his bullshit and did not give up in the regular season (for a contrast see Randolph, Wille and the Mets collapse) and;

      the Yanks are going to be reluctant to make big changes b\c they are still packing them in at the box office. My hope was that a first round loss allows Cash to go year to year with Dr. Torre.

      My only real goal this October was not to get embarassed in the first round, so much for that…hopefully we can at least not completely fold against two mediocre pitchers and get a shot in Cleveland in Game 5 – a few years ago with the O’Neill\Bernie Yanks they would have shelled a very shaky Sabathia in Game 1 – these guys we have now just don’t have the brains or the balls that those other guys did.