Unless, of course, you’re concerned about his mechanics possibly leading to injury, in which case it would be a whole lot better to get 70-100 innings out of Joba for the next 10-15 years than it would be to get 180-200 innings out of him for the next 3-5.

And as much as I certainly understand the math, I do wonder how Joba’s intensity would translate to a starting role. To me, that’s part of who he is, and I wonder if he would tone that down as a starter. I know it’s mathematically incorrect, but I personally feel like he’s a perfect fit where he is, and as the heir apparent to Rivera. He’s, in my opinion, the Yankees’ version of Papelbon.

we are talking about an unknown as joba has to prove stamina and consistancey in pitching..he doesnt look like a starter to me…hell lets try it and see…

Agree with Ben, was waiting for someone to say that while writing my too-wordy comment above. It’s more a surprise that Joba is so good as a reliever than it would be that he’s a good starter. The guy’s always been a starter, he was only put in the pen last season out of necessity (he approached his usage limit and the Yanks had a need at the MLB level). This is not taking a career-long reliever and trying him out in the rotation. This is taking a starter, giving him some innings in the pen, and then moving him back into his appropriate role when the time is right.

When dealing with issues near and dear to our hearts, objectivity is sometimes difficult. It often pays to look at things from another perspective. Let’s use Bucholtz as an example. He’s young, and he’s got dynamite stuff. Now, as a Yankee fan, where would I rather Laptop be - in the Sox rotation, or as Boston’s 8th inning guy?

There’s no question. I would be ecstatic if they relegated one of their best young starters to the pen. When we next faced Boston in the playoffs, Bucholtz would be out of the picture. No way I’m worrying about their 8th inning guy in the playoffs. Potentially dominating young starters? Those I worry about.

8th inning guys are nice luxuries to have during the regular saeson, but come playoff time, it’s starters who dominate and win teams championships.

The whole notion of the Crutch” applies to the media and many fans too I think. There was a void, Joba comes in a fills it, and now lots of people can’t fathom life without him filling that role. In fact, they go so far as to imagine that before Joba, that void was unfillable, that only JOBA could pitch in the 8th successfully. Which of course is ludicrous. If the reverse had happened, if Joba had come up as a starter and been somewhat successful instead of say, Kennedy, then the argument might work the other way (or not happen at all of course).

But now we are in a situation where what is comfortable and working in the short term, and perhaps is a ridiculous and egregious waste of resources in the process (think of, say, using a riding mower to cut a 100 ft patch of grass while you let your huge back yard go wild—sure its fun, quick, and easy to get used to and saves you the hard work behind you, but is it really the best use of your resources? Wouldn’t that mower be better doing the heavy, larger work that so needs attention, and wouldn’t you be best served not wasting money, gas, and , time on that one small spot and instead focus on the bigger picture?), overrides what is best for the team’s longterm health and success. That is an oh so common situation, is it not?

I totally agree with Johnny Damon and I’m happy to hear the other veterans feel the same.
“Our objective is to win games.” EXACTLY.
Right now Joba fills a vital role on this team if his development as starter has to wait in order for the team to win then it should.

Joba is here to fulfill the needs of the team not the other way around. That I think is something that sometimes gets lost when we talk about these 3 guys.

Furthermore if having Joba in the pen helps the Yankees’ psyche or he is being used as crutch, great.
Anything to put WINS on the broad.

I can’t stand it when people use “IT’S THE MINOR LEAGUES” as a crutch in their Joba-to-the-bullpen argument when it comes to his success You say it like minor league success does not translate to Major League success. Check out Tim Lincecum, Justin Verlander and Josh Beckett’s minor league stats. Go check em, thebaseballcube.com.

Nobody is saying it’s a guarantee that his success as a starter will translate in a major league rotation, HOWEVER, to completely disregard it is foolish. 135Ks for a 13.79K/9 in 88.1 innings over three minor league levels is just plain DOMINANT. You can’t look at those numbers and say those mean dick. You just can’t, I understand it is the minor leagues but it is still a high level of competition.

Why do people ignore the fact that Joba had been a *successful* starter his entire life until last July? You could convert a whole ton of top-tier minor leaguers into relievers. But there’s a reason why teams don’t do that.

Also, major league players no nothing about baseball management. They know nothing of developing a prospect or constructing a roster so when these *reporters use their feelings for Joba in the bullpen is just dumb. There’s a reason you see basically no former plays in the front offices of MLB and NFL franchises, just because you can play does in no way mean you can build a team.

*I do not mean Tyler Kepner as he has publicy noted he thinks Joba should go to the rotation. I mean assholes like Joel Sherman (used to be a fan of this guy) who, in numerous articles, has predicted a veteran “revolt in the clubhouse” if Joba is switched to the rotation mid-season. Excuse me sir, but Fuck You. I also mean Bob Klapisch who used the same Johnny Damon quote as an argument for Joba to stay in the bullpen.

Jamal G
I never said that minor league numbers don’t mean dick. You just have to put them in proper prospective that’s all.

I can’t believe anyone would give credence to anything that Damon has to say. Let’s just say that his intellectual abilities are not what make him a successful baseball player.

And I am sure that the ‘majority of the clubhouse’ won’t mind when Joba is locking people down for 6+ innings a clip.

Damon, like many, if not most, veterans, is only focused on what would help the team this season. Consequently, Damon’s opinion should be discounted accordingly.

It’s the GM’s job (and ownership’s) to make decisions based on what is best for the team in the mid- to long-term. That’s what Cashman is doing, and it’s the reason he has said that the decision on Joba’s role will be made based on considerations beyond this season.

To that end, a front of the rotation starter unequivocally has more value than any set up reliever. If Joba isn’t converted into a starter this season, it will restrict his innings cap for next season, and with it his development.

You know, when it’s all said and done, I think on the most part we can agree that Johnny Damon needs to STFU.

This 8th inning guy stuff is such a joke. If we removed the name Joba from the equation and told a person “We have a pitcher in our system with four major league quality pitches. He has the best arm on the team. Where should we use him?” Any baseball person is going to tell you that your best arm should be in the rotation. It doesn’t matter if its and old-timer or a sabrmetrics guy. They will tell you the same thing. If that guy doesn’t work out as a starter because his stuff wasn’t as good as previously thought, or an injury (Smoltz, Kerry Wood) then you can put them in the bullpen.

There is a reason why Johnny Damon wrote a book called “Idiot”. These same sportswriters said that there would be a veteran revolt if Torre left and I haven’t seen any evidence of that.

The problem with this ’simple math’ is that he will surely have a lower ERA in the bullpen than in the rotation. The question is where will he save more runs for the team - in the rotation or in the bullpen. You can come up with reasonable scenarios that would have him saving more runs (relative to his replacement) in either scenario. It’s not a certainty that he would save more runs as a starter just because he pitches more innings, and if the number of runs saved over the course of the season is equal having him as a reliever allows you to leverage his innings more effectively.