Jun
30

Why isn’t a bigger deal being made of this?

By

Shawn Chacon throws his GM to the ground, and gets released without pay. Manny Ramirez pushes a club official to the ground, and it’s just Manny being Manny. I fully understand the difference in status between the two players, but that shouldn’t matter when you physically assault someone. What if you or I pushed someone at work to the ground like that? What a bunch of crap.

Categories : Asides
  • B

    Someone please shave that morons hair!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Andrew

      This was over tickets. It’s pointless for this to be made bigger than it is. Yankees suck. Stop bitching trying to bring the Red Sox and their players down.

      • ceciguante

        it was over tickets, so everyone should look the other way? i bet you’re no professor, fella.

        suspension without pay should be mandatory from the team, if not the league.

        • Jim

          As a Sox fan, I don’t condone the action but these are grown men; fire an assault charge if you think you’ve been wronged and disagree with the penalty.

          Didn’t Reggie Jackson do something similar over a uniform #?

          • Dave

            One of the men is 67 years old, the other in his 30’s.
            One is very strong the other not.
            So you condone throw old men to the ground.
            Do you step on baby chicks as well?
            Or throw puppies off a cliff?

      • Really

        Exactly. It’s over tickets. Manny Ramirez physically assaulted someone because he wasn’t getting enough free stuff. Here’s a crazy idea–buy your own tickets, Manny. I’m not excusing Chacon and am glad he’s cut but to me I can more understand a guy being that angry when the manager and GM are trying to confront you about their decision to put you in the pen than I can pushing a secretary because your unreasonable prima donna demands aren’t being met.

        • http://www.workwithpete.com Pete

          Exactly. Chacon was way out of line as well, but his actions now look pretty explainable compared to Manny’s.

          Not even a fine? Please.

          When are the excuses for this moron’s behavior going to stop?

          • Dan

            When are the excuses for the Yankees’ horrible playing despite a $200 million payroll going to stop?

            • tommiesmithjohncarlos

              When are the excuses for everybody hating on the Yankees out of sheer jealousy and trying to pretend that it’s out of “fiscal irresponsibility” going to stop?

            • Johnny Fun Stuff

              There is no excuse for the Yankees performance with a $200 Million pay roll, and most rational fans will agree with that… when are you going to get over the money thing and actually deal with the reality of what’s going on? Cripes you’d think it’s still been 90 years with all the whining of Red Sox Nation… come up with a new argument, and face the music when it comes to your own ridiculous ball club.

      • B

        Hey Manny, how about taking a crap in the green monster this time! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

      • beantownbosoxh8er

        Ahhhhh well said Andrew . Spoken like a true saux fan .
        Just Manny being Manny. I suppose Youk was asking for it as well?

  • A.D.

    Very odd that Manny has 2 incidents in one year, when he seems to be a fun loving guy without a care in the world.

  • Tripp

    I would have never even known had I not checked this site….typical media.

    Must be something in the water in Houston.

  • Number 27

    roid raid.

  • RustyJohn

    The guy is an imbecile, always has been. It will be great watching Boston having to eat 20 million a year for someone who can’t play rudimentary defense- his schtick will wear thin in 2010 when he is hitting .220- then he can see all those lovable racist Boston fans abandon him in droves.

    • Chris

      His contract expires at the end of this year, with team options for the next two. Unfortunately, if the Red Sox decide he’s done, they can get rid of him without a second thought.

      • http://gftf2.proboards80.com/index.cgi Double-J

        Hey, Manny and Ortiz are the only two guys on that team I’d love to see in pinstripes. For all the crap Manny brings with him, if we’re talking about possibly bringing in Barry Bonds here, if Manny becomes available (which he won’t), I’d say it’s open season on Shawn Chacon pt. 2.

        • Ben C

          umm… UGH

    • Grant

      Manny’s defense is bad, but Jeter was determined by UPenn to have been the worst defensive SS in all of baseball from 2004-2006. And he was the second worst last year, behind only Hanley Ramirez. For all of Jeter’s leadership, he was unable to swallow his pride and move to third to allow a better defensive SS in ARod take his place and give his team a better chance to win.

  • AndrewYF

    Well, also consider that Manny pushed a club official, while Chacon pushed the GM. Things probably would have been different if Manny had clobbered Theo.

    • Ben C

      Doubt it

    • http://2009 Haggs

      Yes. Things also might have been different if the really good version of Roy Oswalt beat up Wade instead of Chacon, who stinks.

      I doubt they would have been so quick to release a good pitcher, or a pitcher they owed a ton of money to.

    • Chris

      I thought Houston was planning on sending Chacon to the bullpen, and that was part of what started that altercation. No team has a use for a mediocre long reliever with an attitude problem. As for a HOF left fielder or ace pitcher with an attitude problem… well they always seem to find room for those types of guys.

    • yankeemonkey

      The fact that Manny clobbered some poor schmuck instead of Theo makes it even more asinine. Throw down McCormick = impunity. Throw down Theo = at least a fine and/or suspension. Manny may pretend to be an imbecile but he’s not retarded.

    • http://www.yfsf.org Nick-YF

      The difference is that Manny is very good and Chacon isn’t. That’s about it. Now, I think Andrew is probably right that there would be a greater punishment if Theo were the victim, but that just points to how messed up the power dynamic is in this industry and in most businesses. That club official has every right to feel safe at his job. That’s the least you can expect from your bosses. Manny violated that. Are the officials’ bosses acknowledging that the work place they set up is not safe for him by not punishing Manny? Doesn’t seem so. It would take Manny pushing Theo for them to maybe understand that first-hand.

      • RustyJohn

        Theo would be protected from injury by his gorilla suit.

  • tommiesmithjohncarlos

    Critics will be quick to point out that while Shawn Chacon and Manny Ramirez were both involved in physical altercations last week, the press seems to have given Manny a pass. However, insiders report that the reason Manny was so upset with Red Sox traveling secretary Jack McCormick was because McCormick was unable to get 16 tickets to the Astros-Sox Saturday afternoon game, tickets that Manny had planned to give to the 16 Rwandan and Yugoslavian nuns and infant refugees (who were tragically stricken with polio, cancer, AIDS, Lou Gehrig’s Disease, vaccine-resistant tuberculosis, lupus, and shingles) that his new Foundation, The Manny Ramirez Foundation To Cure All Diseases, was to host that day.

    Manny’s plan was to heal all the sick with his tears (which cure disease) and use the proceeds from the impromptu telethon broadcasting the healing to fund the new Manny Ramirez World Peacekeeping Militia, an army ready to deploy at a moments notice to end the conflict in Darfur. Sadly, since McCormick couldn’t get the tickets, the whole thing had to be called off, and the nuns and refugees all died.

    For Diamond Cutters, I’m Peter Gammons, ESPN.

    • http://2009 Haggs

      Now get your mute buttons ready, here’s REO Speedwagon’s version of Take Me Out to the Ballgame!

      • RustyJohn

        They get information out of suspected terrorists in Guantanamo by playing Peter Gammons and Bronson Arroyo’s albums over and over again….4 out of 5 detainees said they preferred having cigarettes put out on their testicles over Gammons’ cover of Warren Zevon.

    • Smitt Dog

      This is comedic genius. You should work for the onion.

      • steve (different one)

        incredible.

        • Andy in Sunny Daytona

          Manny was pissed that the Yankees hadn’t called up Brett Gardner yet.

          Just kidding.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=594331910 Jamal G.

        Same thought crossed my mind. This guy is GOLD Smitt! GOLD!

        • tommiesmithjohncarlos

          Why do they call it “Ovaltine?” The jar is round… the mug is round… They should call it “Roundtine!”

    • http://www.workwithpete.com Pete

      >> …tickets that Manny had planned to give to the 16 Rwandan… >>

      You had me right up to here. LOL.

  • McCaff

    I want ARod to push Susan Waldmen to the floor and see how much fuss is made about that.

    • Number 27

      she’d prob start crying again.

      • jsbrendog

        no she woulnt she’d start waxing poetic on how he’s oen of the greatest shovers of all time and his technique for shoving is unparalleled.

        • usty

          Unparalled unless the shove was done in a “Jeterian” fashion.

          • jsbrendog

            touche. and i have an english degree…yikes

  • jyates29

    Manny Ramirez is and always will be one of the biggest d-bags to ever put on a baseball uniform. I know the hall doesn’t elect people for their personalities but if he gets the call I will go to his induction just to boo. His attitude, arrogance, antics and (need to find another a-word…which one should I choose? I’ll leave that for you to decide) make him impossible to root for. As much as I loathe the Red Sox, I love a player like David Ortiz because of his heart, enthusiasm and respect. He plays with class. I would personally rather see Barry Bonds and the traveling winstrol circus get into the Hall than Manny. It’s complete B.S. that he doesn’t face some kind of discipline for his actions. If I punched a co-worker, my ass is on the street and possibly in court. I hate everything Manny is and stands for, thus him being himself drives me completely up the wall.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos

      As a Knicks fan, I hated Jordan. Had the Knicks drafted or acquired Jordan, I would have LOVED Jordan.

      As a Jets fan, I hate Tom Brady. Had the Jets drafted or acquired Brady, I would LOVE Brady.

      If you are a member of one of the teams I love, and you produce for us, all sins are forgiven. And Manny is easily one of the 10 best right-handed hitters in baseball history. (Ortiz is probably a creation of Fenway Park and Deca-Durabolin, but that’s another story…)

      Just like Pedro and Beckett, I tip my caps to the Sox for getting him, poke fun at him every chance I get, but would have loved to watch him dominate for the Yanks…

  • michael

    manny ramirez is washed up. checkout greatseatsltd.com!

  • steve (different one)

    i will have to laugh next year if the Sox decline Manny’s option and he is willing to DH in the Bronx…

    • Z

      Manny would never go to the Yanks. He would never cut his hair. All this talk about shoving people just reminds me of Pedro flooring Don Zimmerman. Which is by far one the greatest things I have ever seen on a ball field.

  • Beau

    The difference? Manny shoved a man, Chacon wrestled one to the ground and choked him with both hands while on top of him.

    Seems to me like a pretty big difference.

    People say Manny gets unfair treatment because of his status, but lets not jump all over this for the same reason. These incidents were not equal and do not receive equal treatment.

    • UNION YES.

      Lets not forget Manny pushing Youkilis. When is enough going to be enough? That’s two incidents already before the All-Star break. Manny isn’t above the Red Sox organization nor MLB and should be put in his place.

      • steve (different one)

        Chacon wrestled one to the ground and choked him with both hands while on top of him.

        source?

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos

      However, (and it’s asinine to be arguing over which mid-30’s, physically ripped professional athlete was more in the wrong for assaulting a man in his 60’s)…

      Chacon wrestled to the ground and choked his boss who was demoting him and who was yelling and cursing at him in an incident that the Rocky Mountain News described as one where both Wade and Chacon were to blame and where they say that Wade is “supposed to be the leader of the franchise and has a responsibility to owners to handle his job with dignity, which doesn’t include profanity-filled shouting matches with players.”

      Manny, meanwhile, shoved to the floor a team underling who did nothing to provoke Manny other than failing to get him a hook-up on some free tickets in an incident that McCormick said “escalated on [Manny's] part.”

      Both of them took a guy old enough to be their father and shoved him to the ground. Chacon’s incident is worse, because he then proceeded to climb on top of his victim and try to fuck him up some more, while Manny was instantly restrained before anything else could happen (which didn’t happen to Chacon) and subsequently apologized (albeit likely under direction of management). But Chacon was provoked by a guy who is admittedly a bit of an asshole (read the rest of the stories about the Houston clubhouse… nobody likes Ed Wade), and Manny wasn’t provoked by shit, other than his own stratospherically large ego and sense of personal entitlement. He was acting like Tommy Devito shooting Spider in the foot for not bringing his drink fast enough.

      He’s a douche.

  • Douchebag Yankee fans are beggin again

    How is any of this different than Cashman smoking ARod’s pole after he threatened to leave?

    • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      Speaking of smoking pole, what’s Schilling up to these days?

      • jsbrendog

        smoking pole in a shoulder sling

    • Ben C

      You mean A-Rod begging to come back to the Yankees because no one else would give him even close to the money he wanted?

  • Rafi

    just so you all know, they said on mike and the dog(or i guess ‘the dog show’) that gardner’s playing LF and batting lead-off

    • Ben C

      That’s awesome, did they say anything on Damon’s injury status?

      • Rafi

        They didn’t say anything…not saying that there’s nothing, just that they didn’t say anything. Also, they said that Christian was sent down.

        • http://www.workwithpete.com Pete

          Not sure why we couldn’t have seen Gardner a few days earlier instead of Christian…

    • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=594331910 Jamal G.

      One moron is not as frustrating nor as entertaining as two. I’m bored listening in now.

      • tommiesmithjohncarlos

        They should have Francesca in the mornings with Joe Morgan, and Russo at drivetime with Tim McCarver.

  • Parker

    You guys are a bunch of idiots that dont known what you are talking about. Manny will end up staying with the Sox. I highly doubt he will go play for some suck team like the yankees. One reason why half of you guys dont known what you are talking about. and that reason is that Manny is one of the best baseball players mlb has ever seen. Another reason is that you dont no anything about Manny or how acts or what he wants in the comeing future. And one of the things he wants is to play with the sox the rest of his career. And im shure the red sox orginzation thinks the same. Maybe not the rest of his career but most of it. even if the sox lost Manny and ortiz theres still no chance for the yakees to beat them. You guys should be talking about your boy Arod. They pay him all that money and he sucks balls. He will only have one good year and that was last year. the rest of his career will be average or worse. They should of cut his pay in half and used it for there pitching rotation and there lineup. And maybe they would be a better team. The Yankees are dumb for paying him that much money. There paying him that money just because of that one year thats stupid. they should wait a couple of years and see if he has another good year and then pay him all that money. Its pretty bad when there paying him all this money and Giambi has more home runs then Arod. The red sox tripple A team could beat the yankees team.

    • Realist

      There are so many grammatical and spelling errors in this piece of crap you wrote that you actually have the nerve to tell people that THEY are idiots and “no” (its KNOW) nothing?????? Thats laughable at best!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      Manny is a great player, no doubt….but this isn’t acceptable no matter what the circumstance.

    • Ben C

      I mean.. if that’s not a joke…

    • Smitt Dog

      Wow. Quite simply wow. I propose we just let that comment sit there as its written…

      Parker couldn’t have articulated his or her point any better. Congrats Red Sock Nation, this is what you’ve raised for the future.

    • Red Sux

      Parker,
      You should learn to spell before calling anyone a moron.

    • TheLastClown

      Parker, I’m not sure why you resent spelling, grammar, and in truth, the English language, but no one will take any offense, or be insulted, or be whatever it is that you meant them to be with your bitter and pandering flame unless you make it legible.

      For the record, last year and this one are the ONLY two years when Manny WASN’T clamoring to be traded. This includes the 2004 season when they won their first title is so many years.

      Besides Boston fans, guess who the people are that know the most about Manny, or indeed about any Boston Red Sox anything, and that’s us. Fans of the good ol’ Yankees, a “suck team”.

      Go to MLB.com and look up A-Rod’s stats, you may be surprised. I think he had a good year or two before last year.

      And while I’m at it….no, actually, I think responding to you is making me lose IQ points, so that’ll be enough

    • Number 27

      you should trying noing english before you try showing people how much you no about baseball.

    • http://www.workwithpete.com Pete

      Well we should have seen this coming — after all, elementary schools just let out for the summer.

      Then again, with all the errors I’m not ‘shure’ that school is a factor.

      • RustyJohn

        He needs to go to the Derek Zoolander Center for Children Who Can’t Read Good.

        • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

          But how are they supposed to learn … if they can’t even fit in the building?

          • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

            What is this, a center for ANTS?

            • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

              Have you ever wondered if there was more to life, other than being really, really, ridiculously good looking?

    • murphy

      uh… what?

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos

      For Diamond Cutters, I’m Peter Gammons, ESPN.

      • Smitt Dog

        Perfect…

        When you read that comment in his voice, it starts to make more sense.

    • nmc

      The greatest thing about this comment is that ARod’s career is already better than Manny’s.

      Also, Giambi has more HRs than Manny so I don’t know what that proves. Except that Alex also has 1 fewer than Manny in 57 fewer ABs… so uh, you’re dumb. but we already knew that.

  • Number 27

    also, leading off the yanks tonight: mr. brett gardner

  • mustang

    Mike A hit it on the head.
    This is why I have never agreed with the Manny being Manny stuff. It’s just a free pass so when he acts like an idiot everyone can just be fine with it.
    Why should Manny have a different set of rules compared to everyone else?

  • mustang

    Congrats to Mr. Gardner.
    Looks like the Yanks are trying to see what they have in the minors before the trading deadline that’s a good sign.

  • Bill N.

    Good thing the boston fans that taint this site have moved to a 2nd grade reading level, well than again they did shut the city down over “the aqua teen hunger force movie” promos .

    Any way the fact that there is going to be no punishment for this assbag kills me, you would think that the mlb would step in but I guess pushing a secretary is socially acceptable. Also I hope Shields lights somebody up tonight.

  • Whitey14

    Fuck, Fuck, Fuck, Fuck, Fuck (sorry for the language guys)

    I came in here with a well thought out plan and then I see this idiot parker has come in, claiming to be a Red Sox fan, and has undone all the hard work I’ve undertaken over the past several months. I’ve been trying to prove that Red Sox fans aren’t the complete idiots that many yankee fans think we are. I’ve been trying to point out that we can have civilized conversations amongst ourselves and that even if we disagree, we can be truthful in recognizing our team’s faults. In general, I’ve just tried to prove that there are some intelligent Red Sox fans out here and we don’t want to fight, provoke or antagonize.

    Remember that demonstration from your Wood Shop class in the seventh grade, the one where your teacher showed you the damage caused by sanding one stroke across the wood’s grain and then having to go fifty strokes with the wood’s grain to remove that damage? This is what that feels like :-(

    I won’t comment on Manny, not having all the facts about what happened behind closed doors, how the issue was settled, etc. Just know that not all Red Sox fans will condone his behavior, just as we haven’t for the balance of the past 8 years. I still refuse to root for our right fielder because he held the Phillies hostage when they drafted him and I despise that in an amateur athlete. If that begs the question of whether I root(ed) for eli manning, bo jackson or john elway…nope, not on your life.

    • mustang

      There are idiots on both side of the line I for one have change my opinion of some Red Sox because of what you write here.
      Don’t get me wrong I still hate your core, (LOL) but at least I can value your opinion.

      • Whitey14

        That’s very kind of you sir and much appreciated. If we were neighbors I bet we’d enjoy the occasional beer in the backyard (except on Sox vs. yankees nights ;-)

  • Grant

    Just for the record in the ARod vs. Manny debate

    ARod career line: .307/.389/.579
    Manny: .312/.408/.590

    Manny has been slighly better in every category throughout their respective careers, although ARod is better now.

    Not to take sides here (I’m a fan of neither team), but the Yankees have spent $1.4 Billion since 2001 and not won a single championship. In what other field is such incompetence tolerated?

    • D

      If they hadn’t sold a single ticket, piece of merchandise, or ad on their TV network over that time, then it would be intolerable incompetence…that $1.4 billion isn’t exactly a sunk cost.

      BTW, Manny’s slight advantage in the triple-slash stats is offset by the fact that he’s a brutal defender at a low value position and ARod spent the first 8 years of his career as an above average defender at (arguably) the highest value position…plus SBs if you want to throw them in there.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos

      The Yankees have spent 1.4 Billion since 2001, and made well in excess of 2 Billion in revenue. We’re a cash cow, dominate in gate receipts, merchandising sales, and ad revenue, and we have a cable network that probably makes as much as all the other 29-teams cable nets combined. We’ve made so much money that we’re about to open a new billion dolalr stadium that we own, and we get to fucking write the whole thing off thanks to stadium financing rules that we helped put in place. The other 29 teams are boats and the Yankees are the rising ocean that they all float in. How the hell is that incompetence?

      The Florida Marlins have won two titles in the past 15 years and yet they’re so constantly on the verge of insolvency that they can’t retain players or a fanbase, and if the Yankees didn’t exist, they would have folded up shop like the Spirits of St. Louis or the New Jersey Generals long before that second title happened. The Twins have a fiercely loyal fanbase and won two titles in our lifetimes and their owner basically colluded with the “guardian” of the sport in an attempt to have his own team assassinated. You should be asking how that type of incompetence is tolerated.

      And, to anticipate your “retort” that it’s about titles, not money (since that argument is total bulshit), fine. If it’s about titles, every year one team is “competent” and 29 are “incompetent”. Over the past “whatever time period you’d like to choose” – decade, two decades, generation, half century, century, etc., the Yankees have been “competent” more than any other team in baseball. Whether the standard is wins, individual awards, division titles, playoff appearances, World Series appearances, or World Series victories, we’ve got more successes and fewer failures than EVERY OTHER TEAM HANDS DOWN. The only way you can win that argument is to reduce the sample size down so small as to make it absurd.

      STFU.

  • Grant

    Tell me in what other industry is such a result tolerated? Microsoft spends more than Apple and sells more, the Lakers were the furthest under the cap during their three-peat, etc…The bottom line is, if you invest the most resources in a group of players or products, your expected to garner better results than the competition. Something which the Yankees have not done.

    You seem to be a little defensive here as well. I did not say that over the entire course of baseball history the Yankees have not been good, on the contrary they are the most successful team there has even been, but recently they have failed to achieve a WS title.

    While it may not be all about titles for some people, such as your loudmouth, boisterous, owner, it is all about titles for the players and for Cashman. No Yankee players benefit from the teams profit, they would get huge contracts regardless from Steinbrenner, so for the Yankee players, yes it is all about titles.

    “The Florida Marlins have won two titles in the past 15 years and yet they’re so constantly on the verge of insolvency that they can’t retain players or a fanbase, and if the Yankees didn’t exist, they would have folded up shop like the Spirits of St. Louis or the New Jersey Generals long before that second title happened.”

    This doesn’t make any sense. Are you saying that the Yankees keep the Marlins in existence? You also for some reason equate a the apathy of a fanbase with poor management. It’s not the players’ fault that Miami doesn’t seem to like baseball.

    Overall, incompetence is defined by an organization that has a monopoly on the resources of an industry, and still fails to achieve it’s ultimate goal. And in that sense, the Yankees have most certainly been incompetent as of late.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Doug_Chu/15305165 Doug

      “Overall, incompetence is defined by an organization that has a monopoly on the resources of an industry, and still fails to achieve it’s ultimate goal. And in that sense, the Yankees have most certainly been incompetent as of late.”

      So you’re saying the New York Yankees have a monopoly on the resources of American baseball? Yeah, that’s kind of true.

      You know, I don’t know how the Red Sox, Cubs, A’s, etc, etc, keep avoiding contraction every year, with those big bad Yankees controlling all the precious and rare baseball resources. It’s a miracle.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos

      Grant: You have no clue.

      You’re comparing things that are not even remotely the same. You’re measuring in dollars on one side and wins on the other, when there isn’t a direct correlation between the two. The point of investing money into the team with higher payrolls and salaries isn’t to win more ballgames, it’s to MAKE MORE MONEY. Winning ballgames is the strategy by which they hope to accomplish the end goal of making more money, but as is evidenced by the Royals, Twins, Devil Rays, etc, there are many other ways to make money and turn a profit. We choose to do it by trying like hell to win, and we do win, more than ALL of our peers.

      Again, in your direct words, “The bottom line is, if you invest the most resources in a group of players or products, your [sic] expected to garner better results than the competition.” And the Yankees have garnered better results than the competition, whether in the direct translation of better results (the MONETARY one) or by the “wins” metric. Again, we spent all that money, made buttloads more money in return, and still made the playoffs and the World Series and won the title more often than we didn’t. Nobody bats a thousand. This isn’t the Zimbabwean election. Some of the other teams won a title or two and then the next year they sucked ass, missed the playoffs, and didn’t earn hundreds upon hundreds of millions of dollars in the process. We never did that, we stayed on top.

      And I love your analogies. Apple and Microsoft, hmm… Apple makes oodles and oodles of amazing products, and Microsoft churns out shit that doesn’t work and looks like the technological stone age, and yet both companies make their shareholders super rich. Do you think that because Bill Gates didn’t come up with the iPhone that he’s a loser? Is Steve Jobs a failure because he didn’t gain market share by bundling IE with an operating system? No, they’re both highly competent and highly successful. You know who’s incompetent? Enron and Arthur Andersen, companies that make horrible gambles and stupid, unethical business decisions. Companies like Circuit City and Bear Stearns that misjudge their market and destroy their profit margins by not responding to the world around them.

      It is mind boggling to me that anybody with half a brain would ever call anything the Yankees have done in the past 20 years “incompetent”. If you think that acquiring the most popular athletes in the sport, assembling a team full of superstars and attractions that fans across the country come out to see like a carnival or a world’s fair, constantly reinvesting in the quality of our own product from new cable networks to new stadiums to new cosponsorhips, being in contention EVERY SINGLE DAY and making the playoffs EVERY SINGLE YEAR and winning more titles than anyone else, totally rewriting the book on how to make ASSLOADS of money in the process, and pretty much protecting the financial health of the entire freakin’ sport… all while not even being satisfied with our own totally unprecedented and unequaled level of phenomenal success and constantly wanting and working for more, in any way is “incompetent”, then you don’t know what the hell incompetent means.

      And if we are “incompetent”, WHO THE @#$% IS “COMPETENT”? The Red Sox, who won a title and then took the next three @#$ing years off? The Cardinals, who have had one-tenth of the success of the Yankees by every single measuring stick? The White Sox, who can’t even outdraw a team that’s sucked ass for 100 years? The Oakland A’s, who have a “supergenius” GM that can’t seem to figure out how to keep his team in contention more than 4 years in a decade, sell off every good player they’ve ever had, and is so utterly irrelevant that they play in a crappy football stadium with the upper deck tarped off and will be in San Jose within the next ten years? Was I asleep and missed that part where the Padres won 9 division titles in a row and 4 World Series in 5 years? When the schedules come out in February, do fans in Seattle circle the calendar when the Reds come to down so they can go watch Jeff Keppinger and Josh Fogg?

      No professional baseball club is as good as the Yankees in ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM. We win more, make more money, and have more fans. Those are the only things that count and we’re so much better than all of our peers that it’s practically insulting for them to be called “peers”.

      So please, Grant, do us all a favor and SHUT THE @#$% UP.

      • Grant

        “The point of investing money into the team with higher payrolls and salaries isn’t to win more ballgames, it’s to MAKE MORE MONEY” Simply untrue, the point of Major League Baseball is for the players to win games, and ultimately to win championships. At the end of the year millions of fans don’t congregate together to watch the league announce how much profit each team made, they watch the WS. For some big-wigs in the Yankee FO it might be about making more money, but for everyone else it’s about winning.

        You repeatedly refer to the Yankee’s past championships, none of which I am discrediting. I am saying that RECENTLY they have been a failure. Not over the entire course of history, but RECENTLY.

        The Apple/Microsoft comparison is valid because Microsoft outspends Apple and still dominates the market. Even though Apple is much more creative, Microsoft can beat it by outspending it. Something the Yankees have not been able to do.

        “If you think that acquiring the most popular athletes in the sport, assembling a team full of superstars and attractions that fans across the country come out to see like a carnival or a world’s fair” Yes, I do think it is incompetent to acquire the best players, put on the best show, and still fail. Also, fans across the country support the Red Sox much more than the Yankees today.

        “The Red Sox, who won a title and then took the next three @#$ing years off?” First of all, the Red Sox won a title and then didn’t win for two years. Second, yes the Red Sox are an example of a well-run franchise. They have been able to be superior to their biggest rival when it counts the most even though their biggest rival has the most to spend. It is considered competence when a team wins while at an economic disadvantage. The A’s are competent, the Rays are competent, the Cardinals are competent.

        Just to finish I’ll assemble a starting lineup and rotation that costs as much as the Yankees lineup:

        C: Victor Martinez
        1B: Albert Pujols
        2B: Chase Utley
        SS: Michael Young
        3B: David Wright
        CF: Ichiro
        RF: Vlad
        LF: Holliday

        SP: Johan
        SP: Dan Haren
        SP: Erik Bedard
        SP: Verlander
        SP: Beckett

        You could have that at less than a third of what the Yankees spent. All those players were either FA’s, traded (and thus available for anyone to sign), or drafted after the Yankee’s first pick.

        • Grant

          *EDIT*

          Didn’t mean to put Verlander in there he was picked early.

          • Realist

            Wow hindsight is 20/20……………

            The Sox could have had them too…**rolling eyes**

        • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

          Chase Utley was drafted 15th overall in 2000, 13 picks before the Yanks first selection.

        • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

          C: Victor Martinez – $4.25M
          1B: Albert Pujols – $16M
          2B: Chase Utley – $7.5M
          SS: Michael Young – $16M
          3B: David Wright – $5M
          CF: Ichiro – $17M
          RF: Vlad – $14.5M
          LF: Holliday – $9.5M

          SP: Johan – $19M
          SP: Dan Haren – $4M
          SP: Erik Bedard – $7M
          SP: Verlander – $750k
          SP: Beckett – $9.5M

          Those players combine to make $130M this year, roughly equal to 65% of the Yanks payroll this year. I am interested in hearing your explanation for how the Yanks “could have that at less than a third” of what they’re spending now.

        • tommiesmithjohncarlos

          “Simply untrue, the point of Major League Baseball is for the players to win games, and ultimately to win championships…For some big-wigs in the Yankee FO it might be about making more money, but for everyone else it’s about winning.”
          Which is my point. It’s the Yankee front office that’s spending 1.4 billion, not ME THE FAN. So, it’s the Yankee front office who judges “success” and “competency” in dollars and cents, not ME THE FAN. I care about winning and losing, they care about making money. I could give a shit how much they spend as long as I get to keep watching them win, and they do. If those two sets of goals line up (and they do), all the better. But get it straight… your interest as a fan and my interest as a fan of Major League Baseball is to see the teams we root for win, and win championships, but for the actual owners and organizations, the goal is to make money. Winning is merely the strategy by which to accomplish that. But until either you or I own a piece of the Yankees or whatever team you claim allegiance to, how much they spend and how much they make have absolutely no bearing on how competent or incompetent you or I may think they are. Competence and incompetence by the standard of the field of play is only measured on wins and losses; revenues earned or expenditures incurred are utterly irrelevant. GET THAT THROUGH YOUR THICK SKULL…

          “You repeatedly refer to the Yankee’s past championships, none of which I am discrediting. I am saying that RECENTLY they have been a failure. Not over the entire course of history, but RECENTLY.”
          We’ve been a failure recently? Who hasn’t been a failure recently? The Red Sox were the World Champions last year, they were a great success. The year before that, they finished in third place and missed the playoffs… What a bunch of incompetent ass-clown losers they were, I’m surprised John Henry didn’t have the whole team and Theo and Larry dragged out back and shot to death like a mangy dog. YOU DIDN’T WIN THE WORLD SERIES! KILL EVERYONE! Are you serious? I mean, how shortsightedly stupid is this whole discussion? Who are you, Ricky Bobby? Do you have any idea how much luck has to break your way in order to win a SINGLE World Series, much less more than one in a row, something that NO TEAM IN BASEBALL has done in the past 7 years? Do you see me calling the Angels failures for ONLY winning 1 title in the past 7 years? No, they’re a well-run organization that is pretty much always in contention, just like the Braves and the Cardinals and the Red Sox and (gasp!) the Yankees. Except there is a difference… those other teams are “pretty much” always in contention. We are ALWAYS in contention, period, end of sentence.

          “The Apple/Microsoft comparison is valid because Microsoft outspends Apple and still dominates the market. Even though Apple is much more creative, Microsoft can beat it by outspending it. Something the Yankees have not been able to do.”
          Obviously, you don’t get the point of any analogy (which I should have understood since your initial analogy that started this tangent was so hackneyed, but I digress…) Microsoft isn’t beating Apple by outspending it. Both of them have pretty much established highly successful market shares, albeit ones of different scale, and BOTH are successful in what they do even though they go about it in different ways. They BOTH make big profits (again, you need to go look up the difference between revenues, expenditures, and profits and try to guess which one is most important) and they both have individual successes and failures. You can sample-size it down (like you’re trying to do with the Yanks) to try and say that one is more successful or competent than the other, but even when you only look at the recent past, like say, seven years, for every Apple victory (like the iPod) there’s a corresponding Microsoft victory (like Exchange or Office) and on the balance, they’re both pretty damn good companies. You’d be a fool to describe Microsoft as “incompetent” or “failures” just because they didn’t invent the iPhone, just like you’d be a fool to describe the Yankees as “incompetent” or “failures” just because they couldn’t beat the Marlins in a short series… a series that 28 other teams, including the Red Sox, apparently weren’t “competent” enough to even get to, btw.

          “Yes, I do think it is incompetent to acquire the best players, put on the best show, and still fail.”
          Then you must be ready to tar and feather the Red Sox for failing 5 out of the past 7 years… they’ve acquired bunches of the best players. Oh, and how do teams like the Pirates or the A’s figure into this? Are they more or less incompetent than the Yankees… they also haven’t won a title, but they haven’t acquired the best players, they actually give them away; are they therefore somehow less incompetent because they’ve failed without acquiring the best players or spending 1.4 billion dollars? Are they more competent than we are because they choose to fail without spending a lot of money or having a lot of good players? DO YOU SEE HOW STUPID YOUR LOGIC IS?

          “Also, fans across the country support the Red Sox much more than the Yankees today.”
          That’s pure ESPN pro-Sox bias. The Yankees fanbase is the largest in the country and in the world. Check merchandising sales, check away game attendance, check MLB TV viewership ratings, check anything. South and west of Bristol, CT, the “Red Sox Nation” is sparse, but little kids in California, Washington, Georgia, the Dominican Republic, Taiwan, Saudi Arabia, etc. etc. buy Yankee hats. If your fanbase were truly bigger, your team would be worth more… it’s not. Check Forbes – it’s Yankees and Manchester United, and then everybody else is on another page.

          “It is considered competence when a team wins while at an economic disadvantage. The A’s are competent, the Rays are competent, the Cardinals are competent.”
          No, it’s considered competence when you win. You don’t get bonus points for winning when your payroll is low, you simpleton. All of the Rays wins and losses count just as much in the standings as the Yankees and Red Sox wins and losses. And please, if you’re going to be dumb, at least be consistently dumb. First competency is winning titles, and now the A’s and Rays are competent? How many titles did they win the last seven years? How many World Series games did they win? How many days did they spend in the cellar? The Rays have sucked ass for their entire lifetime, and all of a sudden they’re “competent” now that they’re winning and their payroll is low? (It isn’t, btw.) What about before that when their payroll was just as low and they were losing 100 games every year? Do you even understand the words that are floating around in your head?

          “Just to finish I’ll assemble a starting lineup and rotation that costs as much as the Yankees lineup: C: Victor Martinez, 1B: Albert Pujols, 2B: Chase Utley, SS: Michael Young, 3B: David Wright, CF: Ichiro, RF: Vlad, LF: Holliday, SP: Johan, SP: Dan Haren, SP: Erik Bedard, SP: Verlander, SP: Beckett…You could have that at less than a third of what the Yankees spent. All those players were either FA’s, traded (and thus available for anyone to sign), or drafted after the Yankee’s first pick.”
          Oh, now I get it. We’re “incompetent” because we’ve failed to assemble a roster that we couldn’t have possibly assembled because 90% of those players were never made available by their own teams before they were resigned… a roster that NO OTHER TEAM IN THE HISTORY OF BASEBALL has ever been able to assemble. Or, we’re “incompetent” because we didn’t draft Michael Young in the first round when we had the chance to, even though EVERY OTHER TEAM IN BASEBALL also passed on the chance to draft Michael Young at least FIVE TIMES, including the Red Sox, btw. No, wait, we’re “incompetent” because we couldn’t trade for Johan Santana, even though the Twins weren’t willing to trade him for fair market value to any AL team, including the Yankees and Red Sox, because they didn’t want to face the “incompetent” Yankee team with Johan as its ace in the ALDS every year (since we are there every year, unlike the Red Sox…

          Seriously, dude, nothing you say makes sense. Go eat some baked beans and STFU.

          • Grant

            I’m tired of this conversation so I’m going to boil it down to this:

            The Yankees are expected to win because they spend the most money attempting to do so. By failing to win, they are proving to be incompetent. Nowhere did I say I expect them to win EVERY year, yet you keep pretending like I said that. I am also not boiling it down to just one year, they didn’t win in 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004 despite having a 3-0 lead in the ALCS and blowing it, 2005, 2006, 2007, and they are in 3rd in the division in 2008. Even though each of those years they have outspent the competition. If you have the most money you should be able to buy the best talent, but the Yankees have proven poor judges of talent, they throw $20 million at guys like Giambi, Jeter, and Clemens. And buy away high name players like Damon that are actually worse than cheaper players.

            • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

              Unfortunately, baseball doesn’t exist in a vacuum. You can believe your arguments, but it’s a least common denominator one. Clearly, things are more complex than you present them. Because if they were that simple, any random hobo on the streets of New York could run the Yankees.

        • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

          It is no coincidence at all that only two of those players are actual teammates. Glad to know that a baseball team is so simple to built. Someone, get this man a GM job.

      • Really

        The Cardinals, who have had one-tenth of the success of the Yankees by every single measuring stick?

        OK, I’ll bite. What are the measuring sticks that the Yankees have had 10 times more success with than the Cardinals? I’m genuinely curious to know.

        Enlighten me.

  • Grant

    Right, thats exactly my point, companies that control the most resources of anybody in their field are expected to dominate their competition. And the Red Sox, Cubs, and A’s, only succeed because they are run better.

    • http://www.facebook.com/people/Doug_Chu/15305165 Doug

      Yeah, I know! Corporations are such great analogies to pro sports teams.

      Here is a article that I think summarizes your point quite nicely and accurately reflects the situation you portrayed:

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Doug_Chu/15305165 Doug
        • Realist

          What does any of this have to do with the subject of this thread? Oh thats right, NOTHING! Not pointed at you Doug…..

          I find it amusing that Manny does yet ANOTHER absolutely ridiculous stunt and gets treated as if it’s OK. Now there is no way anyone can justify this and to try and turn the subject of the thread by calling The Yankees a monopoly is just further proof of fans not getting it.

          Get your head out of the sand and view things objectively on your side before hijacking threads and spewing false propaganda on others.

          • Grant

            What was your personal outcry when it was found out that Jeter had cheated on his taxes?

  • A-Point

    WIth the change in Manny’s demenor I think MLB should immediately order a drug test for him. While its doubtful that he is doing some drugs, it needs to be ruled out. Something strange is going on with him.

    The RS should suspend him for these actions, but they won’t. Hopefully the bad karma from this will destroy them from within. There are probably bad currents in the clubhouse from all this crap from Manny.

  • Parker

    They should check you guys for drugs because you guys don’t known what your talking about. And the reason why the cubs and red sox are good is that they work together as a team. And the yanks don’t thats why they suck. The yanks would have no chance in a world series with the red sox or the cubs. They don’t have a chance now.

  • Realist

    The Yankees couldn’t play The Red Sox in the World Series………..now what’s that about checking for drugs??????????

  • Parker

    ya thats my point they could not get past the Red sox to get to the world series and if they did they wouldn’t beat the cubs

  • Realist

    And that has what to do with this thread???????????????

    Plus, Tampa Bay may have something to say before it’s all over with.