Comments on: Yanks, city accused of deception on park deal http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/ A New York Yankees Blog Wed, 15 Feb 2012 05:49:55 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: River Ave. Blues | City Parks Official: Replacing the parks is hard work http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-99998 River Ave. Blues | City Parks Official: Replacing the parks is hard work Wed, 25 Jun 2008 16:54:47 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-99998 [...] some groups have criticized the Yankees and the City of New York for deceiving the Bronx community on issues relating to the new Yankee Stadium and replacement park land, officials from the Parks [...] [...] some groups have criticized the Yankees and the City of New York for deceiving the Bronx community on issues relating to the new Yankee Stadium and replacement park land, officials from the Parks [...]

]]> By: David Brown http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92421 David Brown Mon, 09 Jun 2008 17:13:35 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92421 The issue behind the park replacement (And other projects for that matter), is NOT a case of breaking promises, it is a case of economics (The declining value of the dollar (Which affects commodity prices (And NOT just oil (i was a Finance Major)), has made all projects much more expensive (An issue NEITHER McCain or Obama has discussed). It is sad to say, but that is a reality of the times we live in. As for the Stadium itself, one of the major reasons I support it (Besides the improvements inside and out), is the fact, that it is very difficult to get the perfect storm needed to accomplish this Politicians, economy, jobs, currency all had to be in line to get this done (Check out what is happening in California when the three WORST stadiums in the NFL are all there, and they HOPE to finish a new one in LA (For a team to move (I bet the Chargers))). I agree about the attendance issue, no question about it. But what about 10 years from now, after Arod breaks Bonds Home Run Record. and Yankee Stadium is approaching 100 years old? Will people still go or the novelity have worm out? I am a New York Islander fan, and I know what a bad building can do to a franchise (I am praying for the Lighthouse Project or I lose my hockey team). So getting the New Yankee Stadium means that we can have a top of the line facility and (I expect team) for decades to come. The issue behind the park replacement (And other projects for that matter), is NOT a case of breaking promises, it is a case of economics (The declining value of the dollar (Which affects commodity prices (And NOT just oil (i was a Finance Major)), has made all projects much more expensive (An issue NEITHER McCain or Obama has discussed). It is sad to say, but that is a reality of the times we live in.
As for the Stadium itself, one of the major reasons I support it (Besides the improvements inside and out), is the fact, that it is very difficult to get the perfect storm needed to accomplish this Politicians, economy, jobs, currency all had to be in line to get this done (Check out what is happening in California when the three WORST stadiums in the NFL are all there, and they HOPE to finish a new one in LA (For a team to move (I bet the Chargers))).
I agree about the attendance issue, no question about it. But what about 10 years from now, after Arod breaks Bonds Home Run Record. and Yankee Stadium is approaching 100 years old? Will people still go or the novelity have worm out? I am a New York Islander fan, and I know what a bad building can do to a franchise (I am praying for the Lighthouse Project or I lose my hockey team). So getting the New Yankee Stadium means that we can have a top of the line facility and (I expect team) for decades to come.

]]> By: Ben K. http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92406 Ben K. Mon, 09 Jun 2008 16:43:22 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92406 Don't rewrite history. The Dodgers left Brooklyn for three reasons: 1. Walter O'Malley knew he could get more money for heading west. 2. Attendance at Ebbets Field was declining. 3. Robert Moses, hardly some liberal, refused to grant the Dodgers the land at Atlantic Yards. It hard absolutely nothing to do with civil groups protesting a move to a railyard. You're confusing the 1950s with the anti-Atlantic Yard folks in the 2000s (who have yet to put forth any sort of better plan). Your comparing Willets Point's mess to the Yankees' takeover of parkland is also a flawed comparison. The Yankees and the City promised to replace the parkland, and now they are going back on that promise. This isn't a hard point to understand, and in no way does it belie any sort of liberal/conservative leaning. You seem to like to see the world in black and white, but the stadium itself is a shade of gray. I don't think the Yankees <em>need</em> a new stadium, and I think that consecutive seasons of record-breaking attendance numbers are a testament to that fact. That said, I like what I see with the new stadium and how it appears. So therefore, I am both for and against the new stadium. Not a tough concept for the vast majority of fans who feel the same way. Don’t rewrite history. The Dodgers left Brooklyn for three reasons:

1. Walter O’Malley knew he could get more money for heading west.

2. Attendance at Ebbets Field was declining.

3. Robert Moses, hardly some liberal, refused to grant the Dodgers the land at Atlantic Yards.

It hard absolutely nothing to do with civil groups protesting a move to a railyard. You’re confusing the 1950s with the anti-Atlantic Yard folks in the 2000s (who have yet to put forth any sort of better plan).

Your comparing Willets Point’s mess to the Yankees’ takeover of parkland is also a flawed comparison. The Yankees and the City promised to replace the parkland, and now they are going back on that promise. This isn’t a hard point to understand, and in no way does it belie any sort of liberal/conservative leaning.

You seem to like to see the world in black and white, but the stadium itself is a shade of gray. I don’t think the Yankees need a new stadium, and I think that consecutive seasons of record-breaking attendance numbers are a testament to that fact. That said, I like what I see with the new stadium and how it appears. So therefore, I am both for and against the new stadium. Not a tough concept for the vast majority of fans who feel the same way.

]]> By: David Brown http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92401 David Brown Mon, 09 Jun 2008 16:36:44 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92401 The reason I brought up the draft, is Wilpon and company do all they can do to possibly appease the commissioner, and "Slot" players (At the cost of improving the team and pleasing the fans), while the Yankees try to get the best players available. At the same time, they built Citi Field without cleaning out the junkyards (Unlike the far superior Yankee approach). This is the way that they run their franchise............. Making people like Selig and politicians like Hiram Monserate happy, but hurting the team and the fans. As for the stadium vs parks issue is concerned, you your self acknowledged that Ben "Sort Of supports the new stadium". You either are or you are not. It is just like being a little pregnant. I think the answer is crystal clear when you guys say "Because We Won't Tear Yankee Stadium"............... You are NOT for it. The parks issue (In my opinion, to be honest) has NOTHING to do with parkland, and everything to do with anti-development and (Or) being nostalgic. This is the harping you see at Field Of Schemes, anything to impede progress (Neil is an admitted Socialist, so its to be expected). People complain about Yankee Stadium (And Atlantic Yards for the matter (Guess why the Dodgers left Brooklyn. I wonder if it had anything to do with certain groups being opposed to a baseball stadium there?)), but I do not hear word one about cleaning up areas such as Brook Ave or St Ann's St? The Democrat run City Council and Bronx Borough President's Office had DECADES to do that, and still have not. (Just like Willets Point). I happen to like River Ave Blues draft coverage (It beats No Maas, NYY fans (And in particular Peter Abraham's), but the politics behind it is right up there with Field Of Schemes, and I am pro-growth (Just like being pro-Yankee). The reason I brought up the draft, is Wilpon and company do all they can do to possibly appease the commissioner, and “Slot” players (At the cost of improving the team and pleasing the fans), while the Yankees try to get the best players available. At the same time, they built Citi Field without cleaning out the junkyards (Unlike the far superior Yankee approach). This is the way that they run their franchise…………. Making people like Selig and politicians like Hiram Monserate happy, but hurting the team and the fans.
As for the stadium vs parks issue is concerned, you your self acknowledged that Ben “Sort Of supports the new stadium”. You either are or you are not. It is just like being a little pregnant. I think the answer is crystal clear when you guys say “Because We Won’t Tear Yankee Stadium”…………… You are NOT for it. The parks issue (In my opinion, to be honest) has NOTHING to do with parkland, and everything to do with anti-development and (Or) being nostalgic. This is the harping you see at Field Of Schemes, anything to impede progress (Neil is an admitted Socialist, so its to be expected). People complain about Yankee Stadium (And Atlantic Yards for the matter (Guess why the Dodgers left Brooklyn. I wonder if it had anything to do with certain groups being opposed to a baseball stadium there?)), but I do not hear word one about cleaning up areas such as Brook Ave or St Ann’s St? The Democrat run City Council and Bronx Borough President’s Office had DECADES to do that, and still have not. (Just like Willets Point).
I happen to like River Ave Blues draft coverage (It beats No Maas, NYY fans (And in particular Peter Abraham’s), but the politics behind it is right up there with Field Of Schemes, and I am pro-growth (Just like being pro-Yankee).

]]> By: A.D. http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92400 A.D. Mon, 09 Jun 2008 16:36:37 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92400 Link isn't working for me But the people to really blame is whomever agreed upon the contract on behalf of the city, the Yanks are always going to be about making money, and the city I'm sure could have negotiated the contract correctly so that there was no issue, and if necessary file an injuction against the Yanks if they failed to comply. The issue is beaucratic, and another excellent case of poor government management (regardless of party/affiliation). Ideally would the Yanks just build as much parkland as they could, sure, but they're a business in the business of making money, so in general they're unlikey to go above & beyond their city contract. That's why the city should have though it through, at least Bloomberg was smart enough to option out of Guiliani's Tax-payer financed deal Link isn’t working for me

But the people to really blame is whomever agreed upon the contract on behalf of the city, the Yanks are always going to be about making money, and the city I’m sure could have negotiated the contract correctly so that there was no issue, and if necessary file an injuction against the Yanks if they failed to comply. The issue is beaucratic, and another excellent case of poor government management (regardless of party/affiliation).

Ideally would the Yanks just build as much parkland as they could, sure, but they’re a business in the business of making money, so in general they’re unlikey to go above & beyond their city contract. That’s why the city should have though it through, at least Bloomberg was smart enough to option out of Guiliani’s Tax-payer financed deal

]]> By: Rich http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92388 Rich Mon, 09 Jun 2008 15:19:15 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92388 Really. I am so sick of people using the "liberal politicians" canard as a stalking horse for their inability to articulate a coherent alternative solution to any given problem. Really. I am so sick of people using the “liberal politicians” canard as a stalking horse for their inability to articulate a coherent alternative solution to any given problem.

]]> By: Yanks Fan in NY http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92386 Yanks Fan in NY Mon, 09 Jun 2008 14:55:07 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92386 Liberal crocodile tears approach to baseball? What the fuck are you talking about, man? This is probably the dumbest comment I've ever read on RAB, and that's saying something. This issue has <strong>absolutely nothing</strong> to do with liberal/conservative issues. It has <strong>absolutely nothing</strong> to do with whether or not Ben supports the new ballpark (which, if you actually bothered to read any of his other posts on it, he sort of does). And it has <strong>absolutely nothing</strong> to do with the draft. In fact, your statement on the draft is laughably wrong. All of Mike's great coverage last week focused on exactly how the Yankees drafted the best talent available. And leave the terrible Mets out of this site. There's a reason why the tag "Better than the Mets" is still applicable. This is about telling community that they would be getting parkland and then reneging on that promise. It's as simple as that. Why you're bringing in liberal politics when this city has seen nearly 16 years of Republican leadership is beyond me. How wrong you are, man. Liberal crocodile tears approach to baseball? What the fuck are you talking about, man? This is probably the dumbest comment I’ve ever read on RAB, and that’s saying something.

This issue has absolutely nothing to do with liberal/conservative issues. It has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not Ben supports the new ballpark (which, if you actually bothered to read any of his other posts on it, he sort of does). And it has absolutely nothing to do with the draft. In fact, your statement on the draft is laughably wrong. All of Mike’s great coverage last week focused on exactly how the Yankees drafted the best talent available. And leave the terrible Mets out of this site. There’s a reason why the tag “Better than the Mets” is still applicable.

This is about telling community that they would be getting parkland and then reneging on that promise. It’s as simple as that. Why you’re bringing in liberal politics when this city has seen nearly 16 years of Republican leadership is beyond me. How wrong you are, man.

]]> By: Geno http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92384 Geno Mon, 09 Jun 2008 14:52:25 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92384 This isn't about how great the new ballpark will be - I'm sure it will be. This is about giving the people in the community what was promised. I don't see how this is a liberal/conservative issue. This isn’t about how great the new ballpark will be – I’m sure it will be. This is about giving the people in the community what was promised. I don’t see how this is a liberal/conservative issue.

]]> By: David Brown http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92383 David Brown Mon, 09 Jun 2008 14:45:38 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92383 I cannot state how strongly I disagree with River Ave Blues on the concept of a new stadium for the Yankees, and their "Love for Parks". The "Community" has already gained with the improvements to the Grand Concourse and next year's new Metro North train station. Every time the "Community" (Wherever it is in NY)gets coddled by liberal politicians and groups, very little (If anything) gets accomplished. Look at Willets Point as exhibit A. The Mets pleased the politicians by building in back of Shea Stadium and what happened? The same old dirty junk yards will not only still be there, but be about 30 feet from Citi Field, and the Mets, and their fans will suffer by it (Has anyone ever driven on Willets Point Blvd? I have and it is no fun (This does not include the environmental mess that is there. I thought liberals cared about the environment so much?)). The Yankees said NO to Community Board 4, and fans will have a state of the art facility, with easy access for driving and mass transit. That is much better for the fans and the team than Citi Field. The attitude of the Yankees about the new stadium, the draft (Getting the best talent available), and everything else, sure beats the River Ave Blues/ New York Mets liberal crocodile tears approach to baseball. Which is why the Yankees will win title 27, long before the Mets win title 3. In conclusion, River Ave Blues, needs to wake up, and appreciate the first class stadium we will have next year. David Brown I cannot state how strongly I disagree with River Ave Blues on the concept of a new stadium for the Yankees, and their “Love for Parks”. The “Community” has already gained with the improvements to the Grand Concourse and next year’s new Metro North train station. Every time the “Community” (Wherever it is in NY)gets coddled by liberal politicians and groups, very little (If anything) gets accomplished. Look at Willets Point as exhibit A. The Mets pleased the politicians by building in back of Shea Stadium and what happened? The same old dirty junk yards will not only still be there, but be about 30 feet from Citi Field, and the Mets, and their fans will suffer by it (Has anyone ever driven on Willets Point Blvd? I have and it is no fun (This does not include the environmental mess that is there. I thought liberals cared about the environment so much?)). The Yankees said NO to Community Board 4, and fans will have a state of the art facility, with easy access for driving and mass transit. That is much better for the fans and the team than Citi Field.
The attitude of the Yankees about the new stadium, the draft (Getting the best talent available), and everything else, sure beats the River Ave Blues/ New York Mets liberal crocodile tears approach to baseball. Which is why the Yankees will win title 27, long before the Mets win title 3.
In conclusion, River Ave Blues, needs to wake up, and appreciate the first class stadium we will have next year.
David Brown

]]> By: batty http://riveraveblues.com/2008/06/yanks-city-accused-of-deception-on-park-deal-2975/#comment-92374 batty Mon, 09 Jun 2008 14:19:09 +0000 http://riveraveblues.com/?p=2975#comment-92374 Completely agreed. Completely agreed.

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