Hal wants Cash back

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Last Night on Earth

I’m still working on putting together a post about the final game. I took a lot of pictures, and the whole evening was very emotional. Plus, there’s this Civil Procedure reading too. I’ll have the photo post ready to go in the morning for you. In the meantime…

In the clearest indication of where the Yanks’ organization may be headed this off-season, Hal Steinbrenner unequivocally said that the team wants Brian Cashman back as the General Manager. Kat O’Brien has the story:

The Yankees want Brian Cashman back as their general manager next year, and have told him so, Yankees co-chairman Hal Steinbrenner told Newsday in a phone interview Monday.

“He knows that we’re with him, that we want him back,” Steinbrenner said.

Cashman confirmed that to Newsday in a phone interview, saying: “Yes, we’ve talked. They’ve mentioned that during the season.”

Steinbrenner said conversations took place among himself, brother and co-chairman Hank Steinbrenner, father and principal owner George Steinbrenner and Cashman when the Yankees played in Tampa earlier this month. Hal Steinbrenner said: “We did talk in Tampa. We didn’t talk about dollars, but we talked about time frame, length.

Interestingly, O’Brien’s sources hedge their bets when it comes to Cashman’s ultimate decision. While the Yanks want him back, it’s no sure thing that he wants to come back. “I think obviously, it’s quickly approaching that type of decision,” Cashman said to O’Brien. “There’s no doubt about it. I’ll sit down with my family — with the Yankee family and my family. We’ll do what’s best for everyone involved. I love what I do. We’ll just have to see what happens.”

In the end, I think Cashman will come back. I think the Yanks will offer him a very lucrative deal, and I don’t think Cashman can just give up 22 years of organizational ties. I think this story lays out what we’ve all thought for a long time: Hal is more in charge than the backpage editors of The Daily News and The New York Post would have you believe, and if that is indeed the case, I think we’ll see Brian Cashman return.

We’re Cashman supporters here. But we know he has his detractors. Those opponents, though, appear to come largely from outside the organization, and the people making the decisions for the Yankees recognize what they have in Brian Cashman. To give up on him now, in the middle of his restocking plan, would be folly.

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  • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos

    BUT CASHMAN IS TEH STUPID SHULDA GOT JOHAN!!!!11!1!1!one!!!

    • pat

      one.. hahaha

  • Hitman

    Let’s hope Cashman decides not to come back. Everyone does realize that Gene Michael is still an option right?

    • Jack

      You do realize that the reason Michael’s teams were so successful was the talent that was allowed to grow in the minors. Why, then, is everyone so quick to show Cash the door when that is precisely what he is trying to do?

      • Hitman

        Because a GM is supposed to do alot more than sit on his hands while he hoards prospects and players. Even if we were to excuse every dumb signing this team has made in FA due to George how can he be excused from all the bad trades that has occurred under his watch for the the last 10 seasons he’s been GM? He has never actually brought in anyone who was a viable player for more than 1 or 2 seasons and then left. Compare what he’s done in 10 years to what Bob Watson did in 3 and you’ll be blown away with their trade histories.

        • Mike P

          Alex Rodriguez?

        • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos

          Brian Cashman and Bob Watson existed in two totally separate environments.

          Watson was GM of the Yanks during a period of time where small market clubs virtually never retained their players, so there were many more potential trade partners and more good pieces were acquirable. And, Watson operated in the era before modern advanced scouting and sabermetric analysis, where teams evaluated prospects less rigorously and had a harder time discerning quality talent from mediocre talent, further enabling Watson to hype and value a midrange prospect to the level where he could have sufficient trade value to acquire a superstar (like flipping Marty Janzen and Jason Jarvis for David Cone, for example, a deal that could never EVER happen today.)

          The economics and environment have changed. Now, the Abreu and Lidle for C.J. deals are the exception; in Watson’s day, they were the rule. Now, players like Carl Crawford, Justin Morneau, and Troy Tulowitzki are resigned by their teams; in Watson’s day, their teams would have been calling the Yankees daily to see what they could get in return for their stars.

          Stop holding Cashman up to a standard that no longer exists.

          • Steve

            Excellent post. Well said TSJC.

    • steve (different one)

      i hate to break it to you, but Michael is one of Cashman’s closest advisors.

      all of these “stupid” decisions that you disagree with, were probably made with Michael’s input.

      also, Michael is 70 years old.

      i doubt he has any desire to be a major league GM at this point in his life.

      • Hitman

        What does that mean? Absolutely nothing. Cashman was assistant GM for the longest time before finally be made GM. Are you saying he had a direct say in all those great trades the yankees were involved in somehow once he became GM almost every trade he was involved in turned into duds? Michael is just an advisor. Cashman doesn’t have to follow any of his suggestions. At the end of the day it’s his call.

        • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

          Of course Cashman, in his pre-GM days, didn’t have decision-making power, but that has nothing to do with the extent of Michael’s influence on a Cashman-led front office. From what I’ve read about them, Michael mentored Cashman as he came up through the organization and is still considered a trusted advisor by Cashman. You’re right, at the end of the day it’s Cashman’s call, but I don’t think we have any reason to think Michael’s input is not taken seriously within the front office.

        • steve (different one)

          no, i am saying Gene Michael is not very different from Cashman and that Michael also makes mistakes. did you know that in 2006/2007, Michael was the strongest supporter of Andy Phillips in the organization? Andy Phillips, who couldn’t hit a curve ball if he knew it was coming. Same with Watson. do you remember Watson trading Tony Armas Jr. for half a season of Mike Stanley? and then by virtue of not having Armas, the Yankees were unable to trade for Pedro Martinez?? do you remember that?

          i am also saying that he is 70 years old and if he were hired, the Yankees would need ANOTHER GM in a few years anyway. it makes little sense to hire Michael.

          but then again, i am trying to reason with someone who thinks Cashman hasn’t done anything in the last 10 years.

          this argument has so many nuances to it: who replaces Cashman, how much autonomy would he (or she) have, what happens to the reporting lines that Cashman established, how do we evaluate all of the trades that we know for a fact that Cashman wasn’t part of, etc. etc. etc.

          but you don’t want to have an intelligent debate. you just want to talk in absolutes and spew insults.

  • Brian

    By “Hal Wants Cash Back,” do you mean he wants Pavano to play the next four years for free?

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

      Hah. Well played.

    • KW

      very nice!

    • Steve

      No, it means he uses his DISCOVER Card.

  • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

    I posted this comment last week and hope it’s ok for me to re-post here. I was responding to something another commenter posted and I think my comment is much more relevant to this thread than the one I originally posted it in. I’d like to re-post it because I’m interested in seeing if any of Cashman’s detractors would like to respond. Here it is (with a minor edit):

    “I’m scared Cashman will leave not because I think he’s some sort of genius, but because if he goes, I don’t think the Yankees are bringing in a top-level GM (or even an up-and-comer) and giving them any sort of authority, and I don’t think any baseball executive with good career prospects would take the job with the Yankees. Why would someone with any sort of prospects willingly walk into a situation where they’ll not have authority over personnel decisions? Cashman has been with the Yankees his entire career, has said this is basically his dream job, and has the opportunity to stay with the Yankees past this season. If he (of all people) turns that down because he thinks he’d be happier and have a more successful career elsewhere,, I’d think that would be a MAJOR deterrent to any potential replacement. And before you know it you don’t have a strong G.M. in place to run the organization. Welcome to 1989 (shudder to think).

    Personally, I think that’s the biggest question the Cashman detractors need to address. This isn’t just about Cashman, it’s about the future of the F.O. in general. Cashman’s significance and value to this organization is in his intent/ability to form an effective front office and player development system. If he leaves there may be a power vacuum and I for one do not have too much faith that it will be filled by the right people.”

  • Jesse

    Civil Procedure….. Glannon’s book is the hornbook to get. Explanations and Examples.
    Your Welcome

    • eddyb

      All this law school speak.. Where do you all go to law school? I’m a 1L at Wake Forest (and takin Civ Pro of course) … another good book for CP is Acing Civil Procedure by Benjamin Spencer. Might be worth a look.

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

        I’m a 1L at NYU right now. We’re using Civil Procedure by Friedenthal, Miller, et al. in class.

        • Tripp

          International Shoe!

          • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

            Stop… flashbacks…

        • Jesse

          Do not Matter what book you are using in class. Read Glannon, then read the class assignment. It will take half the time even though twice the reading.

          • ceciguante

            i second that recommendation. glannon’s is still on my shelf, but my civ pro textbook is long gone.

            1L exams are not about mastering every detail. only people with extraordinary memories can do that, and they’re law review by default. it’s about grasping the framework, the basic concepts, and then layering on top of that with sufficient detail to move up the curve. how much detail is a judgment call, just don’t lose the forest for the trees.

            glannon’s is a great resource b/c it illustrates the principles clearly as a narrative. once you understand that, you’ve got your B or B+. the rest is mud against the wall. nailing the exams won’t come down to whether you memorized the dissent and dicta in every minor case.* if it does, then your prof’s an asshole and the situation’s a toss-up, anyway. it’s a matter of triage.

            *nb: you should stay familiar with the dissents in landmark cases like palsgraf or int’l shoe.

            • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

              We’ve got an open book exam anyway. My prof actually wrote the textbook so that’s slightly intimidating.

              • ceciguante

                having a good outline or review book is important for open book. tab it up good! it’s about getting to the info quickly, b/c everyone has it in front of them. the exams are very much time trials (which has little to do w/ being a good lawyer, but i digress). watch the clock and points per question!

                don’t sweat the “prof wrote the textbook.” many of them do, it keeps em published and gets em a check, but it doesn’t mean the exam is any harder (and if it is, the curve renders this moot). difficulty of an exam is overrated: only relative achievement counts. i’ll take an A- where i felt stupid for 3 hours over a B+ where i was kicking ass for 3 hours along side everyone else.

                just pay attention all year to how much treatment prof gives certain topics / cases (in lectures and in the text). his favorites are most likely to turn into an essay. remember: triage. nobody can remember it all.

        • eddyb

          We’re using the same. … Oh, International Shoe… how much fun it is to long arm in pretty much anyone you want… And with that said, make Joba a starter

  • ortforshort

    I don’t think Cashman is a genius either. Building a farm system and using big money to sign youngsters who otherwise would have gone to college is a no-brainer and way too long in coming. Other than that, you can’t think of much out of the ordinary that this guy has done. The question really is, what are the alternatives? You may be right in that the Steinbrenners will bring in a basket case and things will get worse. How about they go the other way and sign Billy Beane out from under Oakland’s nose? Or whoever runs the Twins – I don’t know who that is off the top of my head, but the guy has done a lot with a little for years. They’d have to give these guys full control, but if you’re willing to give that to Cashman, why not to someone with a real track record?

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

      Billy Beane’s under contract with the A’s. That’s called tampering, and it’s not allowed.

      Plus, last time I checked, Cashman owned three more rings than Beane, no? ;)

    • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

      No… The problem is none of those guys would even WANT the Yankees job if Cashman leaves (especially if the Yankees create some sort of “advisory council”).

      Cashman has a “real track record,” that’s a pretty unfair statement.

    • steve (different one)

      also, i believe Beane has an ownership stake in the A’s.

      he’s not going anywhere.

  • Ajit

    Cashman is good and i hope he comes back. Its hard to find even a competent gm these days and we have a pretty good one. by the way ben… civ pro thats law school… which one u at? i graduated st johns.

  • Ajit

    dumb me didnt read… nyu lol, u better watch those readings… good luck man

  • Bo

    This job isn’t brain surgery. 100 guys can do this GM job here with all the resources and all the money the Yanks have. Let’s not pretend that Cashman is a great GM here and the team is done if he leaves for Seattle.

    • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

      Regarding what I wrote above, though, if Cashman leaves, do you think the new GM would have ANY authority/autonomy? Isn’t that a major issue here?

      • steve (different one)

        yes.

        that is absolutely the #1 issue.

      • ceciguante

        i think this is looking at it backwards. if you’re going to assume that any new GM wouldn’t have autonomy (i.e., wouldn’t be acting as a true GM), then there’s clearly no discussion.

        i don’t think the steinbrenners are foolish enough to bring in a GM and tie his hands at the same time. if they were going to replace cashman, i think they would do it with a mind to give the reins to someone they thought would be better. maybe i’m giving them too much credit, but by appearances they are smart enough to let baseball people do their jobs.

        i agree it’s an issue of “if not cashman, who?”. but if i were hal or hank, cashman wouldn’t have much slack with me. it recently hit me that the matsuzaka/igawa debacle, alone, would have made all the difference in the past 2 seasons. i don’t hate cashman, but he’s screwed up too often.

        • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

          I appreciate your arguments, but respectfully disagree. I don’t think a new GM would enjoy the level of authority that Cashman has (whatever that level may be). I think the driving force behind Cashman leaving, if he so chooses, would BE his lack of complete authority/autonomy, and I think that situation would only worsen should the Yankees have to hire a new GM. Call me a shell-shocked child of the 80s (and the depressing reign of King George during that period), but I think the worst possible thing for the health of this organization would be to decapitate the head that has fought for efficiency and control. And honestly… I do think you’re giving them too much credit. I don’t see what in recent history would leave you to believe that the Yankees will hire a good GM and give him autonomy to make personnel decisions on his own. George ran this organization into the ground in the late 80s, and then when he was suspended and out of the picture in the early 90s the framework for the dynasty was built. As the strength of the dynastic teams faded, he (and the Tampa faction) again exerted more influence, and we’ve seen how that went. We don’t yet know how Hal/Hank will run the organization, but if Cashman leaves because of a lack of control wouldn’t that be the best (and, really, only) evidence/harbinger of things to come?

          Agree to disagree.

        • steve (different one)

          you’re right, we don’t know.

          what really opened my eyes though were Hanks comments from about 2 weeks ago.

          i don’t see how an “advisory panel” that presumably reports up to Hank could be a good thing.

          the current structure is what they should have, and we can argue if at the top of that structure should be Cashman or another GM.

          but having the coaches, scouts, international scouting, drafting, etc all report up to the GM is how it should be. that is the advisory group.

    • Count Zero

      I’ve heard this argument 100 times and it’s just as dumb now as it was then. Which do you think is harder: Being the General Manager of a $1BB company or the General Manager of a $100MM company?

      Let me disabuse you of the notion that the only job of a GM is to make personnel decisions. Brian Cashman doesn’t sit around all day thinking of who to trade or who to draft — that’s one of his many responsibilities to the corporation that is the Yankees. For the most part, he is a manager — he directs the strategy behind most of the departments in the company, aggregates and processes what they deliver to him and then makes decisions based on that information. If those departments aren’t doing their jobs well, he has to decide how to improve their functionality so that he gets what he needs.

      Being GM of the Yankees isn’t easier than being GM of the Mariners — it’s much, much harder. Believe me, you would get fired within one week. What you seem to think is a GM’s job is actually the responsibility set of a senior person in the scouting staff.

      • Old Ranger

        Count, you and I disagree on many things…but, not this time.
        The only thing I see wrong with it is…I didn’t think to put it into words myself. Intelligent people, or those that have run (or owned) a business take all that for granted.
        Again, good going!

      • Slugger27

        thank u count…. i cant stand ppl constantly thinking that b/c the yanks have a ton of money that the GM position could be run by anyone. its only common sense for anyone that knows anything about business that the yanks resources (money, tampa faction, huge internatinal scouting dept) actually make the GM job much more difficult than other teams

        thank u count, u made the point before i could

    • Old Ranger

      Nuts!

    • Steve

      If We Had 200 Million Dollars to Burn, The Yanks Would Never Lose Another Game.

      http://www.nomaas.org/

  • Reggie C.

    Congrats Ben K.

    Didn’t know you’d just started law school. Not that you need this advice but try not to have this blog interfere with your readings. Its all about memorization. Now try your darndest to get onto Law Review !!

    • Reggie C.

      p.s. I attended and graduated from Fordham Law.

  • Old Ranger

    Honorable C.M…
    I liked your comments (and the 1st time), hit it very well!
    Cash will and should be back! Who else knows the inner workings of the front office and the things that (still) need to be changed?
    People still criticise Cash for the pitcher he didn’t get last winter (Johan)…get over it! It would have been a bad move, with the players we would have given up. And people that say the Yanks have $$$$$ to burn are dumb. There are many teams (TB for one) that have built their teams with the money Yanks pay above the (what I call) Free Gift Line. Do we want to support other teams, or build our own?
    Cash knows what he is doing, let him do it…he has more information on the players then we do, and some good people to help him (Stick, Opie, etc.)

  • Steve S

    I don’t think Cash is a must get or deserves at this stage an extremely lucrative contract (and I don’t mean he should get his salary cut). I think they have an obvious replacement in Damon Oppenheimer (if he is interested) who has a grasp of the farm system and would have a belief in these kids.

    I would think this is a dream job for Cashman in its current state. He has unlimited resources, a brand new facility, built in cache and the framework or some pieces of a championship caliber team. I understand the whole authority thing but in the end is it different than any other organization. Ultimately the owner of a team has authority over the GM. In most cases the owner approves a budget and allows a GM to operate under that. Brian isn’t given a firm budget (or at least in the past he hasn’t been) but he has to deal with the owner’s input on certain player and contract decisions. I dont think thats the worst thing in the world, especially when Hank and Hal have demonstrated that they are willing to listen and be reasonable.

    • Old Ranger

      Opie has said time and again, he is happy were he is. Also, because one can judge talent, doesn’t mean one can run the Yanks (see article above by Count Z).

      • Steve S

        I understand that Cashman’s greatest responsibility is to manage over these resources. And I dont think he should go, he deserves to see this thing out, its his team and his manager. But I just dont see him as a necessity. This isnt an awful situation like the one Andy Macphail took over last year in Baltimore. This is a primo job considering how things have changed in the last four or five years.

        My point about Oppenheimer is that he is a logical replacement if Cashman wants to leave. I’m just annoyed that Cashman just doesn’t say that he wants to come back and they’ll work out a contract in the off season. I understand the necessity for sacrifice and this year was a transitional year necessary to build a better product. BUT that doesn’t take away from the fact that in the last year of this stadium, this team is playing meaningless games in September. And while its not completely his fault, he shares in this along with the players and the manager and the rest of the front office. And realistically, if Cash walks away, do you honestly think that Oppenheimer would say no to being the GM of the Yankees? I think his quotes are a matter of professional courtesy, not everyone is Gary Carter. And while a GM has to do more than identify and assess talent, I think that should be one of the top things on the list to qualify as GM of a baseball team.

        • steve (different one)

          I’m just annoyed that Cashman just doesn’t say that he wants to come back and they’ll work out a contract in the off season.

          he said he will sit down with his family at the end of the season and decide what to do.

          why would you begrudge him that?

          • Steve S

            I guess I shouldn’t but I do to some degree especially with the rumors that he may go to Seattle or Philly or wherever else, which I understand are pure speculation. I just wouldn’t be happy if the guy started them down this path and then walked away. This is the hard part, this offseason, dealing with the pressures. Thats why I want him to come back, but I don’t think he is absolutely necessary. Especially when he treats this whole thing as a chip on his shoulder. It reminds me too much of Torre, who constantly wanted to be patted on the back for what he did in the past. You are evaluated on two things the merit/thought process of the decisions you make and the results. I think Cashman has been somewhere in the middle on both so I’m not willing to say that someone new couldn’t bring some improvement.

            • steve (different one)

              I think Cashman has been somewhere in the middle on both so I’m not willing to say that someone new couldn’t bring some improvement.

              yeah, i don’t disagree. you seem to have a pretty good understanding of things.

              to me, it’s really a ” the devil you know or the one you don’t know” type of deal.

              Terry Ryan or John Scheurholtz could do Cashman’s job if they had the same level of authority. possibly/probably improve upon it.

              Oppenheimer or some other rookie GM with an unknown level of authority?? i’ll take Cashman every day and twice on Sunday.

              • ceciguante

                i’d jump all over john schuerholz if i were the steinbrenner’s and he were available.

        • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

          “This isnt an awful situation like the one Andy Macphail took over last year in Baltimore. This is a primo job considering how things have changed in the last four or five years”

          But Cashman’s the man who forced the organization to reform. He pushed back against the ownership group, used his leverage wisely, and took back much of the authority that was denied the GM in years past. If he leaves the organization, are you confident that the changes Cashman fought for will survive? I’m not. (And I don’t think that’s a paranoid or unfounded fear, we’ve seen, in the 80s and in the 00s before Cashman gained more control, how poorly this organization can be run.)

          If I am a highly-regard GM candidate… Say Amaro Jr., and I see Cashman (of all people) leave this job because he no longer wants to deal with the negative aspects… I run to another organization as quickly as possible. And even if one of those guys takes the job, I don’t think they’ll have the authority Cashman fought so hard to gain. I don’t know if Oppenheimer would take the job under those circumstances or not, but if he did, I’d think he’d take it with much less authority/autonomy than Cashman has, and that’s not a good thing for the Yankees no matter how you spin it.

    • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

      “I understand the whole authority thing but in the end is it different than any other organization. Ultimately the owner of a team has authority over the GM.”

      First of all, YES, it’s different than any other organization. This offseason may very well be a watershed moment for this latest incarnation of the Yankees. They’ve effectively got new ownership, a developing farm system, a ton of salary coming off the books (some of which may be picked up again), and an aging core. At the heart of this organization for the last couple of years have been efforts by the GM and his staff to create an organized, efficient front office and player development system. And, most importantly, this is the New York Yankees. They’re the biggest, the richest, they’re owned by the Steinbrenners. This is VERY different than other organizations.

      Re the second point quoted above… Of course the owner ultimately has authority over the GM, but the nature of that authority is the crux of the issue. Look at the well-run organizations out there and you’ll see a common thread – ownership groups that evaluate their GM options and then, once they choose their GM, they let him run the organization as he sees fit. Those ownerships evaluate hiring and firing decisions, but in the interim they let their GMs do their jobs. Now look a the poorly-run organizations out there and you’ll see another common thread – ownership groups that think they’re the GM, that usurp the power of the GM and relegate him to the role of one of many decision-makers.

      I understand some may disagree with me, but I think the most important thing for the Yankees right now is to ensure that they continue to develop the type of front office that will lead to sustained, long-term success. And I think, even if you don’t think Brian Cashman is a genius GM, that if you agree with my assertion, then you have to be pulling for Cashman to re-sign with the team this offseason.

      • steve (different one)

        Now look a the poorly-run organizations out there and you’ll see another common thread – ownership groups that think they’re the GM, that usurp the power of the GM and relegate him to the role of one of many decision-makers.

        exhibit A: the Baltimore Orioles.

        is there ANY reason that a team with the history, resources, and stadium of the Orioles should be so bad for an ENTIRE decade?

        no reason at all. but whenever they try to do anything, Angelos intercedes.

        the ONLY reason they have started to make some progress is that Andy MacPhail came in and basically made a bid for more authority. he has been allowed to make trades that Angelos absolutely would have blocked in the past.

        it’s really that simple.

      • Steve S

        Yeah I get all of that and I see the difference but to me six years ago I understood Cash’s problems, NOW I just dont see it. If the Steinbrenners are vocal I could understand how thats annoying but now they are listening to Cashman. And when it comes to the core issue of choosing certain personnel they are listening to Cashman, they’re only issues are with respect to the finances. They made their opinions open to the public but ultimately they listened to Cashman with respect to Santana which was the biggest offseason decision. And they gave Posada the fourth year against his wishes. Its not like back in the day where Gary Sheffield was negotiating contracts without him present. I think that the Steinbrenner involvement now, is a welcome sacrifice for the resources that Cashman is provided. And that management structure is a parallel to any other organization where a GM may not have as much input from the owners but they less than half the resources. Even Theo deals with Lucchino to some degree when it comes to player decisions.

        • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

          I don’t know man…I want Cashman to stay and I’m sure if he leaves I’ll have a few moments of “WTF, Cashman!” feelings… But can you not see why he might just say “ok, I’ve given it my best shot here, time to move on to someplace where I don’t have to fight for authority every season?” The guy was apparently given just about full autonomy, yet he still has to deal with a prominent member of the ownership group regularly speaking with the media about personnel matters (and who knows how much meddling actually goes on within the front office). Would you not understand where he would be coming from if he just threw his hands in the air and said “too bad, I tried to make it work, time for it to be someone else’s headache?”

          • Steve S

            I want him back to. But I just don’t think its that bad if he leaves. And I think its like any job, if you want the position that pays you the most money or offers you the greatest resources then there are some catches that you wouldn’t have at the place that pays you less and don’t give you as much to work with. I know its the whole quality of life thing which he is entitled to but Im getting sick of hearing about how difficult this can be to work in. And it also ties into the though that Brian wears the Yankee payroll like a Scarlet Letter, he sometimes gives off the impression that this payroll and the Yankee resources diminish his accomplishments as a GM. And I understand that he has his own goals but in the end I as a fan don’t care, I just care about seeing this team win and could give a you know what about how people in Kansas City or Pittsburgh feel.

            • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

              Can you provide an example of Cashman giving “off the impression that this payroll and the Yankee resources diminish his accomplishments as a GM?” I think you’re attributing the opinions of others to Cashman himself.

              • Steve S

                I acknowledge that its my opinion and its completely subjective. But his insistence that they bring down the payroll while the owner or the ownership group has never made a peep about the increasing the payroll seems a little dubious. Why would he care about the payroll when the Steinbrenners’ all authorize him to spend whatever he wants on whomever he wants? I know its my opinion but Im not the only one who has seen this from Cash.

                • steve (different one)

                  depends. bringing down payroll for the sake of bringing it down doesn’t make much sense. agree with you there.

                  but looking at the current payroll and saying “you know, there is something called the law of diminishing returns here and this current structure is wildly inefficient” is totally valid.

                  trust me, Cashman is NOT looking to turn this team into the Twins just to feed his ego.

                  but there is merit in saying “why can’t we win 95-100 games every year and only lead the league in payroll by $25M instead of $50M??”

                  and the way to do that is easy: get at least SOME contributions from your farm system.

                  every useful pre-arb player you have allows you to splurge on a full-priced star and have the 2 of them at a reasonably “average” cost.

                  if your whole bullpen (under Mo) makes $8M, you can give Sabathia $23M/year without blinking.

                  that’s the approach i think Cashman is seeking, a good balance of youth and vets.

                  he has already said a few weeks ago that he still considers the Yankees “big game hunters” and that he wouldn’t hesitate to give up his draft pick and a big contract for the right player.

                • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

                  I hear you… But we really don’t know what ownership’s take on the payroll is. I’ve actually been under the impression Hal Steinbrenner would like to reign in the spending, I don’t think Cashman is alone in that regard nor do I think he’s acting to lower payroll against the wishes or intentions of his boss(es).

                  As far as your question “why would he care about the payroll when the Steinbrenners’ all authorize him to spend whatever he wants on whomever he wants”… Assuming, for the sake of discussion, that he has a blank check, there are still reasons to limit payroll/contractual obligations. You just have to look a little deeper to see the circumstances that tend to result from having such a high payroll – you’re likely to be locked in to long-term contracts at very high salaries with players who may get injured (Pavano, Giambi et al) or just naturally decline (Giambi, Bernie et al). Payroll and roster flexibility are not mutually exclusive concepts.

                  (Just as an aside – I’m NOT saying the Yankees shouldn’t enter into large contracts, ever. I just think they have to be smart about who they enter into those contracts with and find the balance between flexibility/development and FA signings/trades, etc.)

                • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

                  My comment above (at 12:13) was in response to Steve S, obviously. steve (different one)’s comment got in there before mine.

        • steve (different one)

          fair enough.

          but i don’t think people are saying this new structure *can’t* work. what i am saying at least is that this isn’t what he negotiated.

          plain and simple: he negotiated a contract based on several conditions that his “new” boss has reneged on.

          if that is giving him pause about returning, i don’t think that’s unreasonable. if you took a job that ultimately was different than what you signed up for, wouldn’t you think hard about returning?

          i guess my point is this: why don’t we wait until he actually makes a decision before we criticize him for not being willing to work within this new framework?

    • steve (different one)

      I understand the whole authority thing but in the end is it different than any other organization. Ultimately the owner of a team has authority over the GM. In most cases the owner approves a budget and allows a GM to operate under that. Brian isn’t given a firm budget (or at least in the past he hasn’t been) but he has to deal with the owner’s input on certain player and contract decisions. I dont think thats the worst thing in the world, especially when Hank and Hal have demonstrated that they are willing to listen and be reasonable.

      i agree with everything you wrote, but i think the issue here is that in the last year, this has changed. and you are right, it might not be the worst thing, but it is also not what Cashman negotiated for in his contract.

      he negotiated for full authority, and he had it for about 1-2 years. but starting last winter, he lost some of that. now, Hank wasn’t nearly as bad as his father in that respect, he didn’t force Cashman to make a trade he wasn’t comfortable with, but by injecting himself into some of the FA contract negotiations, i think he undermined Cashman’s position a bit.

      i think Cashman, without Hank keeping the press aprised of every step in the process, probably could have saved a little cash on Mariano’s deal and maybe Posada’s deal. everything around A-Rod is always a circus, but i doubt Cashman would have gone more than 8 years if it were up to him.

      Hank seems to be a poor negotiator. Cashman like to keep things close to the vest, Hank announces everything to the press. i think this costs the Yankees money. i mean, he’s already announced he wants Sabathia and Burnett. how does that help Cashman’s position with their agents knowing Cashman’s boss will spend whatever it takes??

  • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

    A point about Oppenheimer: He’s the one to blame for this year’s poor draft. So everyone who’s all over Cashman should think long and hard about Gerrit Cole before signing up for the Damon Oppenheimer fan club.

    • steve (different one)

      ehh, if Bleich doesn’t pan out, i’d criticize him for that choice. same with missing the boat on Bittle.

      but Cole? i know he accepted the blame for Cole, but i don’t blame Oppenheimer for Cole.

      every report says Cole indicated he would sign and most neutral sources have said that this was NOT the Yankees’ fault.

    • AndrewYF

      Oppenheimer is just fine where he is. Let’s not promote to the degree of highest incompetence, shall we?

      • Old Ranger

        Amen!
        Cases in point; Frank Robinson, Ron Guidry, Ted Williams…all great players but, as mgr. or coach’s, they sucked!

    • http://evizions.com eVizions

      I like Oppenheimer in his current role and that’s where I’d like him to stay. Why mess with a good thing?

  • Slugger27

    Regarding cashman, i just wanna say steve (different one) i think u seem to have the best grasp of the situation. you and i agree wholly here. cashman definitely isnt lowering payroll to say “see, i knew i was good enough to create a winning team while spending less than the padres” … the bottome line is a lower payroll creates more flexibility, it lowers revenue sharing, and it increases potential trading partners, put simply: its just a smarter way to build a team. sure, we’re still the yankees, we’re still owned by the steinbrenners, but theres no reason we cant use good scouting, good drafting, good trades, and smart investments to win the division with a 130M payroll instead of 209.

    Furthermore, while i dont think cashman is the savior of all Gms, he’s the best option we have. His job is tougher than ppl realize, and he’s the only one the steinbrenners would even consider giving full authority (which IMO he still doesnt really have). but as steve different one said, if our options are oppenheimer or some outside hire with limited authority, cashman definitely makes the most sense and all things considered would be the best choice

    however, given how the past offseason went and all the second guessing hank has done with his decisions, i wouldnt be shocked if cashman said screw it and left… heres to hoping that doesnt happen

    • http://evizions.com eVizions

      I agree. A few years back, I was ready to ditch Cashman because he appeared to become George’s whipping boy, as if he was afraid to lose his job if he told George “no”. Then, it appeared as if Cash had an epiphany and negotiated for full authority (and got it) and used that authority to build and promote a true long-term strategy. Now, the organization has turned around dramatically and we actually have a good farm system and a payroll that may be comparable to other teams. No, we didn’t make the playoffs this year, but overall I believe the organization is in a lot better situation than it was 5 years ago. We can look to build a team like we did in the early-to-mid 90’s from homegrown talent with complementary players in-between (and the occasional stud like ARod or Sabathia thrown in there).

      If Cashman leaves and someone else comes in, his authority would be next-to-nothing and Hank would be snatching up every high-priced, middle-aged free agent on the market, as well as trading every Montero or Brackman for bullpen help at the deadline. We need to continue to promote the direction the organization is going and Cashman is probably the only guy that can do that.

      I would be surprised if Cashman decided to leave. I think he has actually come to enjoy the pressures of the job and wouldn’t feel the same sense of accomplishment with success if he went somewhere like Seattle. Plus, he worked as hard as he has to build the organization the way it is, so he would be abandoning his best work and possibly leaving it for someone else to come in and get the credit. Cashman is comfortable and successful and nothing else would ever feel the same as being GM of the Yankees.

    • Steve S

      I have to say, revenue sharing is not tied to the payroll by any stretch of the imagination. The luxury tax is tied to it. The Yankees will more than likely be in the top five of revenue and therefore sharing with the lower half of the league as long as this structure is in place.

      And hank hasn’t second guessed Brian’s decisions. His one critical comment was that mistakes have been made over the last five years which seems to be more of an indictment of his father’s mistakes rather than Brian’s.

      • Slugger27

        hasnt been critical?? he’s made it clear he disagrees with not trading for johan… hes been critical of cashman’s plan to treat joba…. granted, he hasnt come in and changed everything, but hes for sure been critical and done some second guessing

  • Brad Kraus

    So the thinking is that unlike every other team in baseball, the Yanks can’t afford the risk of creating a power vacuum. That’s about the dumbest thing I’ve seen on RAB yet. Let’s look at this problem another way. What if, and it’s just a what if, Brian Cashman simply decides that he’s had enough. What then. What is the most logical direction for the Yanks to go in if THEY are forced into retaining another GM? Since we know that the whole of the civilized world will not cease to exist if Cashman doesn’t come back, who would the Yanks look at and what type of GM would they seek. A builder? A buyer? Instead of assuming that the damage would be irrevocable why not ask where could the team go to bring in the next GM.

    Nobody is arguing with Cashman’s belief that the winning formula is to start from within but many people are questioning his ability to evaluate the talent he is stockpiling and many people are questioning his ability to place the proper value on that talent. Some people are questioning whether he really knows when to hold and when to fold. What could another GM do with the farm system that he has built? Why do we assume that a fresh look at our system would be bad? Why do we assume that only Cashman is capable of knowing and understanding these things?

    • Slugger27

      u make a very good point… i think cashman’s plan is definitely the right course of action, but its not unreasonable to question his judgment of baseball talent… then again, hes probably trusting his scouts to judge the talent for him… in either case, as a GM its also ur job to make sure ur getting accurate information… very fair argument

    • Hitman

      Agreed. All one has to do is look at his trade history or lack thereof to tell you all you want to know about Cashman.