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Make sure you VOTE today
Mixing baseball and politics

EXTRA! EXTRA! Read all about it! The Yankees have room for Mike Mussina in their 2009 rotation. Stop the presses! Derek Jeter isn’t a very good defensive player. I bet you didn’t see any of this coming.

Update by Joe: Holy crap! The Yankees are going to make CC Sabathia their top target! Why aren’t we making a bigger deal of this?!?!?!?!?!*

* Multiple interrobangs brought to you by tommiesmithjohncarlos.

Make sure you VOTE today
Mixing baseball and politics
  • A.D.

    Interesting given that Jeter was #7 in ZR this year among “qualified” SS. Though his RF was pretty poor, RF is also a more biased statistic than ZR.

  • Adam

    Derek Jeter was probably the least effective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.

    wow, i knew he was bad, but not this bad!

    • steve (different one)

      this is such horseshit.

      he wasn’t even the least effective defender on his team, that would be Bobby Abreu or Jason Giambi.

      trust me, i have been knocking Jeter’s range for years, but he actually improved in 2008 with better positioning and better conditioning in the off-season.

      even if Jeter is among the worst SS in baseball, i have no idea where this notion that he is the least effective player at any position is coming from. worse than Dunn? worse than Manny? worse than Cust? absurd.

      • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

        Before I make my point, I admit up front that I am not familiar with fielding statistics. But regarding your comparison of Jeter to Cust/Dunn/Manny and the like… None of those guys play shortstop. I could see why, even though he’s clearly a better defender than those guys if they were to play the same position, he could be called less effective when position is taken into account.

        • steve (different one)

          yeah, i understand that, and you are making a logical point.

          but i still think it’s an absurd statement. Abreu was something like 22 runs below average this year in RF. Jeter was somewhere around average for SS.

          runs are runs.

          • Slugger27

            i agree… hes 7th in ZR and not even the worst in RF…

            we can all agree he is average to below average defensively at this point in his career… but the “least effective defensive player in baseball” is a fuckin joke

            damn sox bias…

          • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

            Yeah I agree. I just don’t know enough about defensive metrics, maybe that’ll be an offseason hobby for me.

  • radnom

    “(BIS) watched video from every major league game, and had recorded every ball off the bat by the direction in which it was hit (the vector) the type of hit (groundball, flyball, line-drive, popup, mob hit, etc.) and by how hard the ball was hit (softly hit, medium, hard hit),” James, baseball statistician and author, wrote on the Web site.

    “Given every vector and every type of hit, they assigned a percentage probability that the ball would result in an out, and then they had analyzed the outcomes to determine who was best at turning hit balls into outs. One of their conclusions was that Derek Jeter was probably the least effective defensive player in the major leagues, at any position.”

    Ok. At this point, it is time to get a girlfriend.

    • jsbrendog

      he does, his laptop, when its in his lap it whirrs silently

    • Dylan

      Yeah, word. Its a freaking game of baseball, its dissected enough.

  • A.D.

    Yeah despite the fact that Stephen Drew & Ryan Teriot both were worse in both RF, ZR, and Fielding %

    • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

      Yes, but Drew and Theriot are both white, so their RF and ZR are calculated on the scrappy scale, while Jeter’s is calculated on the athletic scale. Once you recalculate for the 25% discount rate between ARF/AZR and SRF/SZR, Drew and Theriot’s numbers are better than Jeter.

      It’s pretty straightforward.

      • Andy In Sunny Daytona

        But Jeter is only half athlete, the other half is, obviously, grit. When you combine the athlete gene with the grit gene you get a grithlete, and everyone knows a grithlete can’t go left.

  • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

    Thanks for the hat tip. I’ll pass it along to Ken Tremendous.

  • E-ROC

    Refried Beans.

  • Ol Dirtay

    None of this much matters. They still haven’t pulled the trigger on Melky and Kennedy for Peavy. Cashman is a bum.

  • Ivan

    Hey guys I voted for the first time today. It was quite a cool experience despite only lasting only 5-10 minutes.

    • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

      Awesome. Proud of you. May I ask how old you are, out of curiosity?

      • Ivan

        21

        • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

          Cool. Congrats, welcome to enfranchisement. I hope you continue to fulfill your civic duty and participate in the democratic process.

          An uneducated, nonparticipatory electorate is easily lead astray and exploited.

          • Andy In Sunny Daytona

            I voted Whig.

            • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

              I voted for Tina Fey.

              • Mike Pop

                I voted for Nader

    • Slugger27

      ive never done it either… its really only 5-10 minutes?

      • steve (different one)

        depends where you live.

        • Slugger27

          how long would it take in queens?

          in my defense, this is the first time im eligible

          • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

            In the Bronx, where I live, it’s never taken me more than 10 minutes. (I’m 31 and have been voting since the Clinton-Dole election of ’96.)

            The only polling places with long lines are generally spots at the end of the day, where everyone’s trying to get in before 8pm, or fucked up backwater counties like in Ohio and Florida where the boards of elections are either too inept or too corrupt to have enough booths/supplies/workers to accomodate the registered voters.

            NYC is generally pretty good money. Walk right in and do your business.

            • Andy In Sunny Daytona

              It took me less than 5 minutes to vote this morning. Early voting has helped a lot. Now I just hope that the actually count all the votes. That would be a nice step for Florida.

            • Slugger27

              Sweet, appreciate the info. 19 here so im new with all this. sounds pretty easy, ill get to it later today

              • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

                Make sure you do. It’s 1 day every 4 years. Even if you have to wait a little while in the polling place, you should do it.

                I know I’m annoying about this, I just think it’s very important and takes minimal effort. It’s a privilege to be able to vote.

                • Andy In Sunny Daytona

                  Typical congressman, pandering for votes.

                • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

                  Make sure you do. It’s 1 day every 4 years two days every year.

                  There’s elections every year, primaries and generals. Congressional elections every two years, and plenty of odd-year elections with important issues as well, like the NYC Mayoral election.

                  Non-presidential election years are super important as well, and shouldn’t be discounted. Like I said, an uneducated, nonparticipatory electorate is easily lead astray and exploited.

                  And, there’s definitely no two-hour long lines for an off-year primary. That one would take you like 13 seconds to vote in.

                • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

                  Agreed. I had a parenthetical in my comment about it being more often than once every 4 years but I deleted it for some reason. Think I must have just wanted to emphasize how important it is to vote today. My bad.

            • UWS

              The line at my polling place was snaking around the corner and down the block this morning. Almost 2 hour wait.

              • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

                Oof.

          • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

            Shouldn’t take more than an hour. I voted in Brooklyn this morning and it took about 40 minutes.

            • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

              Damn, for real? Where’s your polling site? How many booths do they have there?

              • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

                Boerum Hill, so my polling place is right near a bunch of residential neighborhoods as well as downtown Brooklyn. I guess most other polling places in the outer boroughs are better/quicker than mine. They had like 6-7 machines I think.

                • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

                  Wow, that’s nuts. I’ve never heard of that, or UWS’s 2 hour wait, in the city before. I do some work with the Bronx board of elections, and we literally have to turn volunteers away.

                  That sucks.

                • Andy In Sunny Daytona

                  Only 6 or 7 machines? Damn. At my polling place we had at least 30 spots for voting. That is crazy that you only had 6 or 7. No wonder that people find it inconvienent to vote.

                • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

                  Yeah it’s a pain. My girlfriend got to the polling place at 6 am so she could get to work early and it took her about 30 minutes, even though she got there so early. Such is life, though. I heard the waits in Park Slope (in Brooklyn) were over an hour this morning. It’s a very politically active area, I think they just get very high voter turnout and don’t have enough machines to handle it too efficiently.

                • whozat

                  That sucks. This is ostensibly the most important part of Democracy, right? Instead of dumping cash into computerized voting machines I could hack with my pinky, why not put the funds into making sure states can just get everyone into a voting booth in the first place? Basically, people who live in poor, crowded areas are de-facto disenfranchised.

                  Bullshit.

                  Also…why, why, why is it on a tuesday? Oh noes! We don’t have enough poll workers! THAT’S BECAUSE EVERYONE WHO’S NOT RETIRED IS AT WORK!!!!!!

                • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

                  Co-sign. Election Day should be a national holiday. Nobody works.

                • Smokey Robinson

                  I second that emotion.

          • tracy

            i voted in queens this morning…was on line at 6, cast my vote at 7.

      • Dylan

        Might be longer wait this election, my experience has always been quick. …Thats what she said.

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

        I haven’t voted yet today (I will at some point), but the previous two times I voted it was done in 5 mins.

  • Murph1010

    I have been saying move him to 1b for a long time now. That way they can sign Renteria for cheap. Then they sign Manyy to DH and CC and AJ to pitch and they are all set with no holes.

    • steve (different one)

      what an awesomely terrible idea.

      you managed to replace Jeter with a player who is currently inferior both offensively and defensively, while filling your 1B hole with Derek Jeter.

      Jeter/Teixeira would outproduce Renteria/Jeter by a HUGE, HUGE margin.

      actually, so would Jeter/Giambi.

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

        Perhaps Miranda/Jeter would outproduce Jeter/Renteria too. That’s basically the last combination, outside of anything involving Adam Kennedy or Orlando Hudson, I’d ever want to see in the infield.

        • T-Dizzle

          What’s wrong with Orlando Hudson?

          • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

            He’s six years older, more expensive, and not nearly as good of a hitter as Robinson Cano, for starters.

            • Slugger27

              He plays great defense, maybe he could be moved 1b. He may drop off coming to AL but he certainly would out-produce meranda or betimit.

              • Slugger27

                that was my “T-Dizzle” impression

                • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

                  I liked it.

                  Maybe we can trade for Mike Cameron and bring Ozzie Smith out of retirement and platoon them at first base.

          • UWS

            Outside of the fact that he’s coming off a serious wrist injury, is on the wrong side of 30, and will want lots of $ and lots of years, nothing.

    • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

      I have been saying move him to 1b for a long time now. That way they can sign Renteria for cheap. Then they sign Manyy to DH and CC and AJ to pitch and they are all set with no holes.

      That’s the most nonsensical crap I’ve read all day that wasn’t written by Wallace Matthews.

      • Murph1010

        He is clearly a better option than Furcal. Furcal will want more years and more money, so if we move Jete off short, who would YOU suggest oh wise one? Renteria is low-risk high-reward and probably for only 1 year. He’s not even that old.

        • whozat

          Don’t move Jeter to 1B if Renteria is your best SS option. It makes the team a lot worse overall.

        • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

          What would I suggest? I’d suggest:

          A.) Not moving Jeter from short to first base, since that would be incredibly, incredibly, incredibly stupid, especially when he’s not that bad at shortstop yet and he can move to the outfield, a much better and more natural fit

          B.) Not acquiring a 33 year old shortstop who was too crappy to keep a job on the Detroit Tigers, one of the crappiest teams in the league, and who just put up a 270/.317/.382, since that would be incredibly stupid (but admittedly, not a stupid as Jeter to First),

          C.) Not worrying about this until 2010 at the earliest, and definitely not making a stupid kneejerk reaction like Furcal, Renteria, Hudson, or anyone else. Derek Jeter should be our shortstop for all of 2009. If he has a good year, he’s our shortstop for 2010. If he has a bad year, we move him to the outfield and find a new SS next offseason, when there will be new options available (like Bobby Crosby, Khalil Greene, Jack Wilson, etc. etc.) and when our farm system has had another year’s worth of opportunity to produce an in-house option (or prospects to acquire one).

          Yes, I’d like to be proactive in upgrading Jeter’s defense at the critical SS spot. No, none of the options this year is an improvement, because whatever they add in defense over Jeter is negated by their drastically inferior offense. And as I said, it’s a moot point. Jeter’s fine for now, he’s way down on our priority list and we can easily afford to wait a year if this year doesn’t provide any good alternatives (it doesn’t.)

          But what I objected to most in your comment was the Jeter to First nonsense. That’s idiotic.

  • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

    You know, there is actually one possibly useful nugget of info in that otherwise worthless McPaper article on Mike Mussina.

    Several times over the past week, in numerous NY columnists and writers pieces, I’ve heard the following Cashman quote:

    “I just know that we need starting pitching, and it’s not just one. We’re not going to be one and done. We need multiple.”

    They’ve used the quote to argue that clearly, the Yankees will sign two of the CC/Burnett/Sheets/Lowe/Perez group. But, the full quote is:

    “We just obviously have needs in the starting rotation. He [Mussina] certainly could be one of those guys that fills a need, without a doubt. I just know that we need starting pitching, and it’s not just one. We’re not going to be one and done. We need multiple.”

    When you read the whole thing, Cashman seems to say that Mussina could concievably be one of these “two” free agent starters we “add”. Which would lend credence to the thought that some of our internal free agents (Mussina, Pettitte, Pavano) could be one of the two, and we may only sign ONE of the CC/Burnett/Sheets/Lowe/Perez group.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      Are you suggesting that the media deliberately ignored part of a quote to make an article more interesting and sexy? You crazy bastard.

    • Slugger27

      wow, never realized that was the full quote… gotta love the media

      personally, i hope its CC and pettitte/moose…. since the topic has opened on this blog ive been a huge AJ hater while a huge advocater of signing lowe… but even i must admit a 1 year deal for pettitte or moose would be a much better alternative than either of those for 5 or 4 years, respectively

    • Slugger27

      hey i think i read on mlbtr that cash apparently still really likes pavano… u think hes a realistic possibility.

      i dont see how its possible that cash is still that high on him, but i suppose if they miss out on everyone else its not the worst idea ever

      • SWB

        Cash may see him as a low risk/high reward type player like the Mitre signing. You sign him to an incentive laden deal and make him earn the money this time though.

  • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

    Another interesting nugget, this one from the Heyman/CC article:

    “The agenting group… Legacy Sports… represents Orlando Hudson as well as Sabathia, Adam Dunn and Pat Burrell. That’s quite a quartet.”

    Hmm, CC, Dunn, Burell, and O-Dog… Fuck, let’s just call Legacy Sports and see if we can get a 4-for-1 discount!!!

    • Mike Pop

      all for for 250 mill

  • Mike B

    out of curiousity, how many SS’s in MLB have been starting since 1996? where do they rank?

  • Mike Pop

    Red Sox offering Crisp for Khalil Greene

    • steve (different one)

      this is interesting. a few weeks ago i noted that Greene might be an interesting buy low target.

      either that or Boston is just trying to assemble the whitest team since 1947.

      • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

        This just in: The Red Sox traded David Ortiz, Diasuke Matsuzaka, Chris Carter, and Devern Hansack to the Blue Jays for Lyle Overbay, Brad Wilkerson, Scott Downs, Jesse Litsch, and the rights to Canada.

        • Whitey14

          DAMN IT! What the hell will we do with a shit hole like Canada? Can it pitch?

    • A.D.

      Why do the Sox seem to hate Jed Lowrie

      • Whitey14

        They don’t hate him, they love him. They just envision him more as a third baseman than a shortstop.

  • Mike Pop

    Man what do ya know Heyman wrote the same column again

    • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

      Ctrl-X, Ctrl-V, Insert Date, DONE!!!

      Time for Mimosa Monday!

      • Mike Pop

        Lol exactly

  • ko

    Of all the problems the Yankees have, moving Jeter off of shortstop is way down on the list – not worth mentioning really. Looking at the list of the players ranked ahead of him, I wouldn’t take any for their overall performance and value to the club for this year and I would only take a handful of them long term because of their age. I think a lot of this fixation on Jeter bashing has to do with envy. Derek is a model human being in so many respects that there are certain types of people (losers) who feel compelled to try to drag him down.

    • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

      I think you mean to say, “Derek dates model human beings”.

      • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=15305165&ref=profile Doug

        I think you mean to say, “Derek smashes model human beings with remarkable efficiency.”

  • DonnieBaseballHallofFame

    THE SPORTING NEWS…polled 16 former big league shortstops, spanning five decades, on Jeter vs. Alex Rodriguez. Eleven picked Jeter, three said it was too close to call and only two chose A-Rod outright.