Nov
06

Yanks still interested in Cameron?

By

This one’s coming a bit late, but that’s because we have so many other damn rumors to share. Plus, we like the idea of Nick Swisher much more. Anyway, Anthony DiComo, writing for MLB.com’s Hot Stove Blog, reports that the Yankees have contacted the Brewers regarding a trade for Mike Cameron which would center around Melky Cabrera. I’m not sure who else would be involved in the trade. Despite Cameron’s disproportional $10 million salary, I have a hard time believing Doug Melvin would trade him for Melky Cabrera straight up. While Cameron would be a short-term upgrade in center, it’s difficult to evaluate this proposal without knowing the other players involved.

Categories : Asides

89 Comments»

  1. christopher says:

    ny post is saying melky betemit and a pitcher for him. is that a joke? IS Cameron the strike-out machine worth 3 players even if they are not too highly regarded anymore

    • It’s the New York Post. That should answer your question.

      • Chris C. says:

        This Cameron crap is getting ridiculous. The Yankees are better off sticking Brett Gardner in center to see what he can do, rather than getting a guy who strikes out a ton just for a “short term upgrade”.

        The Yankees should really use 2009 to see what they have in their system moving forward, because it is the perfect time. The Red Sox will be very good next year. The Rays will be very good next year. But after that, these teams may take steps back.
        To think that one year of Mike Cameron will tip the scales is silly. The Yankees should be thinking more long term right now, instead of looking for guys in their mid to late 30′s on short contracts.
        THAT WILL NOT DO IT!

        This kid Gardner can run like the wind, covers tons of ground in the outfield, has a decent arm, and improved his hitting the more chances he got last season. If the Yankees, or their fans, can’t see what a tremendous weapon this guy can be at the top of the order if given the chance to produce, then I don’t know what more to say.

        I mean geez, has Cameron even been ANY team’s answer?

        • This Cameron crap is getting ridiculous.
          Agreed. The amount of crap that people are bitching and moaning about over an acquisition of a plus defender on a one year deal is ridiculous. If we acquire Mike Cameron, it’s not going to alter or upset any of our long term plans, or make us any less competitive. It’s just going to give us much needed roster flexibility in having a major-league average bat that can play all three outfield positions competently for one year while we try and prepare Brett Gardner and Austin Jackson for full time roles, and give us insurance against Johnny Damon and Hideki Matsui’s injury concerns and Xavier Nady’s probable return to earth.

          The Yankees are better off sticking Brett Gardner in center to see what he can do, rather than getting a guy who strikes out a ton just for a “short term upgrade”.
          I agree with you. Acquire Cameron for spare parts, and give Gardner every opportunity to win the CF job. If he can man it, Cameron spot-starts in left and right, spelling Nady and Johnny and giving us two good defensive outfielders instead of one. If Gardner struggles, Cameron steps in. Getting a “short-term upgrade” that doesn’t eliminate your long term solution is a good thing, not a bad one.

          The Yankees should really use 2009 to see what they have in their system moving forward, because it is the perfect time.
          And trading Melky Cabrera and spare parts for Mike Cameron doesn’t stop us from doing that.

          To think that one year of Mike Cameron will tip the scales is silly.
          Nobody is saying that but you. You’re overreacting and resorting to histrionics to make something seem bigger than it is, once again.

          The Yankees should be thinking more long term right now, instead of looking for guys in their mid to late 30’s on short contracts.THAT WILL NOT DO IT!
          We are thinking that way. None of the long term fixes to CF, other than Gardner or Jackson eventually winning the job outright, are available to us because teams don’t trade quality, young centerfielders without receiving a boatload of prospects. Adding Cameron to the Gardner option gives us good major league caliber production while we wait for Austin Jackson. There is no long term commitment so Jackson’s path remains clear. And if Gardner, or Jackson, amazes us and becomes the starting CF for the next ten years, Cameron will be gone before you know it and none of this will matter.

          This kid Gardner can run like the wind, covers tons of ground in the outfield, has a decent arm, and improved his hitting the more chances he got last season.
          And he can’t play all three outfield positions at once. He’s only one man. With Bobby Abreu leaving, Hideki Matsui aging, and Melky Cabrera sucking, we now only have three ML caliber outfielders in Damon, Gardner, and Nady. There’s no way we can make it through 2009 with only three outfielders. Mike Cameron would be our 4th outfielder, at worst. If we can get him for nothing, that is not a bad thing.

          If the Yankees, or their fans, can’t see what a tremendous weapon this guy can be at the top of the order if given the chance to produce, then I don’t know what more to say.
          If you can’t see what value there is in adding a plus-defending centerfielder who OPS+’ed 110 last year on a one-year contract to a club that only has three outfielders on it, two of whom are too shitty to play centerfield, then I don’t know what to say to you.

          I mean geez, has Cameron even been ANY team’s answer?
          No, because he’s never supposed to have been anybody’s ANSWER, including ours. He’s just supposed to be a good option, and he is one.

          Stop overreacting to everything.

          • Chris C. says:

            “I agree with you. Acquire Cameron for spare parts, and give Gardner every opportunity to win the CF job. If he can man it, Cameron spot-starts in left and right, spelling Nady and Johnny and giving us two good defensive outfielders instead of one.”

            I agree that this is a good plan. But the reality is, the more money the Yankees spend on outfielders, the less of a chance guys like Gardner and whomever else at the lower level pushing for a spot will get.

            When is Gardner supposed to get this opportunity to win the CF job? Last Spring training, the guy cruised through hitting around .400, impressing every coach in sight. Then he was promptly sent to Scranton.

            • He was promptly sent to Scranton because the Yankees had Abreu locked into RF, Damon/Matsui locked into left, a 22 year old defensive whiz named Melky Cabrera coming off a 40 XBH/73 RBI season penciled in as their CF of the future, and the Yankees feared Gardner would rot on the bench.

              Now, all four of those other players are either gone or held in much lower regard, and Gardner has big league experience with a modicum of success. The circumstances have changed drastically.

              • Chris C. says:

                Okay, good point.

                I just hope they really do hold those guys in lower regard this time around, and we don’t have to hear something like, “well, we gotta play the guy…..he’s making 12 mill per year!”
                Because it’s still hard for me to believe that when camp opens, and the Yankees have at least 4 of the 5 following players: Cameron, Nady, Matsui, Damon, and Abreu on the roster, that Gardner will get a fair chance.
                I hope you’re right.

        • waswhining says:

          I thought so too (Cameron crap getting ridiculous) until I read that Cameron and Sabathia are good buddies. So thing CCC instead of CC. I’m now a big Mike Cameron fan. Think of the ARod and Doug Mientkiewicz connection. Mega stars bring along others.

  2. dan says:

    If Cameron is 1.4 wins above average in ~500 PAs, then he’s around 1.5 wins above average over 600 PAs, accounting for aging. Knock that down a half-win because he’d be moving from the NL to the AL and he should be about 1 win above average hitting next season. That’s about 3 wins above replacement, not including fielding or positional adjustment. If we say he’s slightly above average for a CF, then that bumps him up around a full win (including position adjustment now), making him 4 wins above replacement. As a free agent, that’s worth around $17-$18million for one season. Conservatively (if he regresses a lot), if we project him at 3 wins above replacement, that’s still $13.5 million. All of that is using $4.5million per win by the way

    If he were available on the FA market, he’d be worth more than $10 million. If we value him in the middle at $15 million for one year, then the yankees only have to decide if Melky + somebody else is worth $5million to them. The “other” guy probably wont be worth a whole lot. Do it.

    • dan says:

      Oh, and the 1.4 number came from using his WPA/LI this past season.

      • Murph1010 says:

        Prove it. I mean, can you prove any of that?

        • dan says:

          You’re questioning that he was worth 1.4 wins above average last season?

          Check his fangraphs page and look here for an explanation:
          http://www.tangotiger.net/wiki.....ar_Weights

          The $4.5 million per win is pretty simple…. look at how many total wins free agents produced and then see how much money they signed for, in total. Divide dollars by wins, and you’ll get around $4.4 million for last off-season, 4.0 for the previous off-season, and with the recession I figured 4.5, which is extremely conservative (most people would say it’s around 4.84, which is 110% of last year).

          His fielding is generally accepted to be above average, I don’t think you’re disputing that. And center fielders are more valuable than the average player, that’s the positional adjustment.

          So, yea, I can prove all of that.

    • Ed says:

      I never got into the estimates of how many wins players are worth, so I’m not questioning if that value is right or not.

      However, if he really is worth the money you’re suggesting, why did he sign for so much less a year ago?

      I realize he had the drug suspension, but suspensions are without pay, so that theoretically shouldn’t effect the contract value.

      • dan says:

        There wasn’t a lot of demand for his specific services. I’m talking about what his market value is now, but his actual contract may not reflect that value.

  3. steve (different one) says:

    here is the problem with Melky:

    1. i believe he is out of options
    2. he is arb eligible and is going to start making actual money based on the fact that he was the starter for much of the last 3 seasons

    the yankees probably have to at least consider moving him this winter.

  4. Bo says:

    I think they’d want to settle the rotation before they solve CF.

    • radnom says:

      You can’t prioritize in that way, you’ve got to take the opportunities as they come they might not be there later in the offseason.

      Don’t worry, I’m sure they’ve got a little something budgeted away for the rotation.

      • Bo says:

        The thing is they would survive with Damon and gardner playing CF heading into the yr if they stood pat.

        They won’t with Ponson and Rasner and Kennedy in the rotation if they wait on SP.

        There are priorities.

        • radnom says:

          You misunderstood. I didn’t mean to imply CF and the rotation were of equal priorities.
          But its not like Cashman is playing hooky from negotiations with Sabbathia to chat up Melvin about Cameron.

          Even thought the rotation is a bigger need, it would be foolish not to explore other needs while they are available just because we havn’t aquired any starting pitchers yet.
          So if we ignore Cameron/Swisher until after we sign a few pitchers and then come back to a market possibly without them we would either have to settle or overpay for something.
          The only thing they could do wrong here would be to allocate money or prospects in a deal that would handcuff us from signing pitching later on.

          But that is not the case here.

          • Chris C. says:

            So if we ignore Cameron/Swisher until after we sign a few pitchers and then come back to a market possibly without them we would either have to settle or overpay for something

            Why do you care? It’s not like your ticket price will go down if the Yankees don’t overpay for someone.
            Do you realize how much money Cashman has thrown away over the years by NOT extending the contracts of Jeter, Williams, Matsui, Posada, and Rivera before they became free agents?

            This team can’t possibly care about what they spending when they keep making that same silly mistake time and time again. Because Cashman claims he has a “rule” that he won’t re-up a guy until his contract comes due.
            Then of all people to make the exception for, he makes if for Cano!

            Yeah, I too was also once concerned about the money the Yankees would spend on incoming players. Not anymore.

            • Joseph P. says:

              “Do you realize how much money Cashman has thrown away over the years by NOT extending the contracts of Jeter, Williams, Matsui, Posada, and Rivera before they became free agents?”

              You were disproven in a different thread on the Jeter and Bernie fronts.

            • radnom says:

              Why do I care if the Yankees overpay a bad player in money/prospect and hinder their ability to sign better players in the future like has happened a ton of times over the past 5 years?

              You’re right, we shouldn’t………

              /sarcasm

              • Chris C. says:

                When has a bad signing ever hindered the Yankees abilities to sign better players in the future?
                Overpay in prospects? Perhaps. Money? No.

              • radnom says:

                Overpaying prospects is still overpaying, especially when the positions we are looking to fill are only on the trademarket in the near future.

                Also, I didnt mean that overpaying a bad player hindered us in the sense that the Yankees would run out of money…more like getting stuck with a declining player locked into a roster position because of his contract which hinders roster flexibility and prevents us from improving.

                Its not hard to think up some examples of that, is it?

                • Chris C. says:

                  “Also, I didnt mean that overpaying a bad player hindered us in the sense that the Yankees would run out of money…more like getting stuck with a declining player locked into a roster position because of his contract which hinders roster flexibility and prevents us from improving.”

                  This I agree with. But I was talking more along the lines of year to year. Like if the Yankees went out and signed a starter, and he stunk in 2009, they could replace him in 2010, regadless of the cost.

  5. Marcus says:

    Who would have thought a slow and maybe one of the worst players in baseball would be the hot topic of Yankee blogs.

    Pass! You say on Derek Lowe. I say PASS! on Cameron. This dudes a complete dud. You statistic freaks need to calm down and realize he has nothing to offer.

    Make a trade somewhere else where the player coming back can actually do something potentially good for this organization.

    I’d rather talk all day about Derek Lowe than this aged baseball player.

  6. Manimal says:

    Some people say Betemit is involved, in which case I am all for this deal.

  7. christopher says:

    dont like cameron, but love the idea of swisher as long as it does not cost the farm system – can the yanks get him without giving hughes or AJAX? Damon, IPK, & a good AA arm? I have no idea what they would want based on his aweful 2008 campaign. They will defenitly trade him, Kornerko, or Thome, but i doubt anyone wants them.

    If they got him instead of Tex they could use that Money for Ramirez making for a pretty good line-up even with gardner in CF. no need for cameron.

    Obviously, the priortiy is CC and another starter, but i am concerned now with cashman saying he could see mussina and petitte back next year. That would mean the team adds only 1 pitcher and not two as I hope they will. IMO CC is at the top, followed by sheets and burnett. i would take either petitte or moose, but not both as the rotation needs to get younger. i hope they take a chance on sheets.

    dangle around melky and/or betemit for some help off the bench

  8. Z1m says:

    Aaron Rowand of the Giants is who they should be looking at. The Giants will probably do a deal with him to take his contract. Maybe Damon for Rowand. They don’t need any pitching. Gives us a better outfield and a right handed bat. Rowand is also guy who is worth more then just the numbers. Another example of a throw back guy which is what the Yankees have been lacking the last few years.

    Cameron is a total waste.

  9. christopher says:

    does anyone know who the big hitters/pitchers are in next year FA class?

    I think the names that may or may not be out there must have an effect on how the Yankees approach FA’s this season. Looking at it from a long term perpective is their anyone who will probably be a FA next year better than sheets or burnett? i think that needs to be considered when talking about bring back pettite, mussina or both since they will most likely get 1 year deals

  10. Joey H says:

    Maybe Melky and a bullpen arm can get it done. Having said that, is there any chance we can resign Kyle Farmsworth? Given how much he loves NYC and settled in finally half way through last year.

  11. Z1m says:

    Wonder if D-Lee is something the Yanks would look into??? Solid bat-great glove. I think I heard they would take calls on him. Maybe confussing it with someone else.

  12. christopher says:

    by the way – when did the braves start becoming one of the stupidist teams in baseball. Did the old pirate regigm take over in atlanta.

    first they give up the farm for tex when they clearly were not good enough to make the playoffs and then they trade him for less than half what they got.

    now they are going to throw their farm system at Peavy? for what? they are not going to be competitive next year and it isnt like they are an NL West team where a .500 record could win the division. i just dont see it making any sense for them to go after peavy.

    strange as it sounds, i think that the poor economy is going to affect a lot of teams puting the yanks at a huge advantage. dont be surprised if SD is more desperate than we think to unload peavy and this turns into a johan scenario where an AL team gets him for less than what you would think.

    if the yanks get him though he will need a caddy. Only got 2 outs after 7 innings last year. he would be a 5 inning pitcher in the AL East although I do think he would dominate in those 5 innings. it might come down to the yankees getting an offer that they just cant refuse to bring him aboard

    • Bo says:

      They do have a deep system and its not like Peavy isn’t one of the 5 best SP’s in the NL.

      And they know they can’t sign a SP like him on the open market anymore ie Sabathia.

      • Chris C. says:

        They do have a deep system and its not like Peavy isn’t one of the 5 best SP’s in the NL.

        I don’t care if he’s the greatest pitcher in the universe! He’s a small market stud who has little-to-no interest in coming to NY.
        Any Yankee fans who’s been paying attention over the past 30 years knows full well this has real potential for disaster.

  13. dan says:

    I don’t see how Mike Cameron can be seen as a below average player. If your justification involves strikeouts then don’t even bother posting it– it’s virtually worthless.

  14. ko says:

    I think AJax probably won’t be ready to contribute in 2010. Its iffy, at best. So you’re really looking at two or maybe even three years before he’s a solid contributor in the big leagues. That makes trading for Rowand a more attractive proposition to me than one year of Cameron. Either way, its a major upgrade over Damon, Cabrera or Gardner – just for defense alone. Carl Crawford can become a free agent in 2011, I believe. Depending on how AJax looks by then, Crawford may be the guy you want in center long term.

  15. mustang says:

    “5:06pm: More on the Cameron situation: Ken Davidoff says Cabrera and Ian Kennedy have been discussed. However, the Brewers will probably wait to see if they can sign Sabathia, since he’s good friends with Cameron”

    I’m not IPK lover, but him and Cabrera seems like a lot for Cameron to me.

    • mustang says:

      I have to read my own comment closer.
      “probably wait to see if they can sign Sabathia, since he’s good friends with Cameron”

      Cashman trying to bring in the big fish with a smaller one.

    • christopher says:

      i dont give up IPK for cameron for a year

  16. Aj says:

    this is rediculous i hate cameron he sucks, keep kennedy and melky i hate him im gunna boo him when i go to the yankees if they get him

  17. X-Man(Angel) says:

    Cameron, nice and bring back Roberto Alomer to play 2b !!

  18. [...] yesterday we recognized that the Yanks were still interested in Mike Cameron, today a trade with the Brewers seems less likely. Ken Davidoff and Kat O’Brien do not [...]

  19. [...] decided to start this site as I was writing a comment on River Ave. Blues about a potential Mike Cameron to the Yankees trade. Seems kinda weird now, but [...]

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