Waiting for Pettitte, Yanks ponder Manny
ByJon Heyman had a few interesting reports pop up on his Hot Stove News Tracker blog last night. First, he reported that the Yanks are still eying Derek Lowe. Then a few minutes later, he noted that the Yanks still think Andy Pettitte will come back. I still don’t know how these reports don’t contradict each other.
Anyway, Heyman’s post on Andy Pettitte features two intriguing gems. First, Heyman notes that the Yanks have been looking at Ben Sheet’s medical records. That could indicate an impending offer. But of potentially more importance to the team going forward is this:
If Pettitte does say yes, the Yankees will save some money on the final starter, since Sheets and Lowe would cost more — and that could enhance their chances to add a big bat, meaning either Mark Teixeira or Manny Ramirez.
Now, while I’ve been a bit lukewarm on bringing back Pettitte, I really like the sound of adding a bat — and especially adding the bat the Red Sox appear to be targeting.
Maybe Mark Teixeira is just a pipe dream. Maybe the Yanks can shoulder only so many $160-million contracts. But as Ken Rosenthal writes, “If the Yankees want to draw a line, they should draw it with paying Andy Pettitte $10 million to be their fifth starter or Mike Cameron $10 million to be their center fielder. Not with Teixeira, for crying out loud.”
Meanwhile, Mark Feinsand has a different take on things. It’s not Teixeira but rather Manny Ramirez who is on the Yanks’ radar. According to Feinsand, Manny may in fact be causing a Front Office debate of sorts. Hank & Hal want Manny while Brian Cashman is more reluctant to pursue the enigmatic and expensive slugger. There’s nothing like a good old fashioned power play in the Bronx over an issue that has no right or wrong answer.
No matter the outcome, the Yanks seem to be going all in this off-season. They’ve spent a lot of money to improve the team. What’s another $23 million between friends? The right investment in the right bat certainly would make them clear early-season World Series favorites. Now, we just have to see who rules the day and if the Yanks can actually pull the trigger.
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The Mason Williams Watch
Imagine a rotation of
CC
Wang
Sheets
Joba
Burnett
.
I;m pretty sure they could stick me in centerfeild if that happens.
but then hughes doesnt get a sniff until at least sheets leaves/burnett gets injured/cc opts out
youre burying your star prospect
Id rather have
CC
Wang
AJ
Pettitte
Joba
Then try to add Manny
Me too.
May I say Me three? I will anyhow. 27/09.
To be perfectly honest, I’d rather have
CC
Wang
AJ
Joba
Hughes
if we go after Manny/Tex/Dunn
Pettitte and his agents can take a hike with their phony 3-year-offer bullshit. He is overplaying his hand, and looking silly in the process.
You’d rather have this guy back, over saving the 5 spot for the prospects to battle it out? You’re off your nut.
I don’t know what’s happened to Andy Pettitte……whether Clemens has rubbed off on him, or what………but he now seems way more interested in cashing in than winning another championship. I don”t know if it’s just his agents or him as well, but he is coming off looking like a prima donna. And that is something I don’t believe he is.
Unfounded and completely slanderous character assassination for the win!
Chris, you really seem to take the free agent negotiating process very personally, with a good amount of righteous indignation. I can’t tell you what to do, but I personally just don’t get it. I’m not offended by a player or an agent trying to do everything they can to get as much money as they can, and I’ll welcome Andy back (at a one year committment), as he can help this 2009 team win.
YEAH he does, lol. He was FURIOUS when CC was just using us. Now he is all heated over Andy.
Chris, would you ever leave your job to go to another? Would you ever ask for a raise? Would you accept a large paycut? I am not saying that what Andy may or may not be asking for too much or giving the team a run around, but to bash him like that makes you look worse then him, and gives meaning to the “NY fickle fan”
Jumping in late but isn’t this the same crap Pettitte pulled a couple of years ago: the waiting game. Kinda like his buddy Roger (retiring, not retiring???) I feel like a selfish little kid on Christmas morning. I just opened two great presents (C.C and A.J) but I want MORE!!!! TEX!! or least I don’t want the sux to get him. I know: GROW UP! Hey, at my age I can claim I’m have a ‘senior moment’. Thanks to EVERYONE on this board who keeps me up to date on the Yankees 5,000 miles away. I wish the BEST holiday season to everyone and your families. May your new year be safe and prosperous. and may we all return next holiday season basking in the glow of #27!!!!!!!
So Hal too wants Manny. That’s news to me. I thought the Manny-led contingent consisted of Hank and any intern who thinks he wields actual power.
This brings back memories of the Sheffield versus Vlad.
A lineup including Manny could score anywhere from 916 to 925 runs, depending on who else is there:
http://actyankee.blogspot.com/.....tions.html
MLB.com is also reporting that the Yanks are going to be taking a long look at Manny. Its interesting that both Hank AND Hal want ManRam … if they stay resolute on that stance, it’d be hard to imagine us not going after him eventually. I’ll agree that there is no wrong answer here, but I’ll also say that Manny brings a lot more positives than negatives to the table.
My personal theory is that if Boston gets Teixeira, we will go all in on Manny. If Tex lands up elsewhere, than Manny will continue to be a hotly debated topic and we’d probably only lock him up if the price is right.
i believe i read it as MLB.com was reporting that there was a report that Hank/Hal wanted Manny, so its not really a second source confirming the interest, but just confirming there is a rumor of interest.
but i could be wrong.
I’d think of it more as “rumbling” than “rumors”
I hope you’re right. 27/09.
I would just hope that if Manny comes here, we don’t have to call him ManRam. That is hands down the gayest nickname in sports. It sounds like a gay pornstars handle.
Can people please refrain from calling him “ManRam” or “Man-NY”, it’s lame; what is so hard about typing or saying “Manny”?
But what about two years from now when we acquire Hanley Ramirez?
I must have the right to refer to them both as ManRam and HanRam. Don’t abridge my constitutional freedoms.
Alex Rodriguez = A-Rod
Felix Hernandez = F-Her
“Bullpen” Joba Chamberlain = B-Job
Awesome.
“Bullpen” Joba Chamberlain = B-Job
Can we refer to anyone who seriously advocates for putting Joba in the bullpen as a “B-Jobber”?
sold!
“MLB.com is also reporting that the Yanks are going to be taking a long look at Manny.”
How long a look do they need? They’ve seen him pound their collective asses for almost 10 years in Boston, and his selfish exploits are well documented.
Do you really think they’re now mulling over scouting reports and gathering character references?
At this point, you either want the guy and all the crap that comes with him, or you don’t.
They’re probably just looking at possible contract numbers and options.
after the signings this off season..lets cross the finish with a hefty bat…you know as well as i do that the yankees can afford tex….he is worth every penny to get him….if not,,then manny….is a good aquisition…either way the stadiums will fill up to watch this show…
get manny he is even better than tex when it comes to hitting
I agree with Ryan S. I think the Yanks hope the Angels get Tex because that means the Sox don’t get him and Manny doesn’t have the Yanks and Angels fighting for him so his price goes down.
I don’t think there’s any chance Teixeira re-ups with the Angels.
From everyting I read, his wife (from Georgia) is adament about NOT being on the WEST coast. Any guy who’s married knows what this means.
I think the Angels know it too. They put their best offer on the table out of courtesy, but they are moving on.
CC+ AJ + (Manny + Tex) * Yankees = 27th World Championship
CC + AJ – (Manny + Tex) = many, many missing hot dogs; many, many trips to Dr. James Andrews; many, many 3-2 losses.
A lack of Manny/Tex are going to cause CC & AJ to be less healthy?
Take it to the bank.
Dreadlocks + Georgia Tech Pedigree = Mystical Healing Powers
It’s surprising you would even question this.
this made me laugh
I trust Jon Heyman information.
But do you ever notice Davidoff informtion always has the Yankees not going after cetain guys but then states that the mets should go after them and it always seems he thinks the Mets can add payroll and the Yankees cant.
Yeah, Heyman information is great.
He had the Yankees going after Sabathia, Burnett, Lowe, Pettitte, Peavy, Teixeira, and Ramirez. I don’t know who his inside sources are, but they’re brilliant. How else would he know this stuff? The Yankees are so tight-lipped. Hank Steinbrenner is another Bill Belechick.
Let’s go Cash.
That’s odd.
What pay 60+ Million for Lowe to your fifth starter. That’s just wasting money.
Hey I would like to get Sheets but only to replace AJ Burnett and I don’t want AJ Burnett and Sheets in the same rotation.
If Pettitte doesn’t sign just go into ST with the 5th spot open and let the young guys battle it out for the spot.
Totally agreed. No need to spend a shitload extra cash (and just as importantly, lock up a 3rd spot in the rotation for 3-5 years) when you have an ace in waiting like Phil Hughes in addition to potential quality starters in IPK and Aceves. Even if we could have Andy, I am tempted to let those 3 and Chase Wright duke it out in ST for the spot.
i dont buy the Yankees interest in Lowe at all anymore. i think he was a fall back if they didnt get Burnett.
Except he wouldn’t be the fifth starter. Maybe in terms of stuff, but it would basically break down as:
#1: CC
#2 Wang
#2: AJ
#2: Lowe
#5: Joba
Just because a guy is the 4th starter in the rotation doesn’t mean he has to pitch like a fourth starter.
Just say no to Lowe. Please.
lowe is consistent good and always healthy look at his era last year
Hey T-Dizzle, +1
what does that mean
You have a good point Mike A, Lowe is still a #2 in terms of quality stuff. In fact, if we could get a one year rental out of him (an absurd impossibility, I know), I would be all for it. But why do we need to sign another big pitching contract when can use either Andy (if he’s interested) or have 3 good prospects duke it out? Joba already has ace quality stuff, he just can’t handle the workload, which adds to the lack of a need for Lowe.
Leave Lowe alone. Sure he stays healthy but he’s his consistently good numbers have also come in a pitcher friendly park in an the pitcher friendliest division of the pitcher friendly league. He’ll be slightly above average in the AL East, albeit probably consistently slightly above average, which is valuable, but not 4 yrs/60M valuable.
I would’ve preferred we pass on Burnett, bring back Pettitte for a year, and go get Tex. Now that we have Burnett, forget Pettitte. I love the guy, but we have enough starting pitching. We need the big bat more. Let our #4 and #5 starters be a combination of Joba, Hughes, IPK, and Aceves. Chances are you should be able to get 350-400 overall slightly above average innings out of that combination, which is all you need out the back of the rotation.
That’s tru, but nevertheless, I wouldn’t in my opinion go after Lowe if Pettitte didn’t sign.
why not if u look at his numbers last year compared to hughes they dont even come close i would put lowe in their for 2009 before i put hughes there
2009, maybe. What about 2010, 2011, 2012…? Lowe won’t sign a 1-year deal, he’ll want at least 3-4.
in 2011 make joba the new closer to replace rivera and put both hughes and keep lowe in the rotation
please tell me this is sarcasm. PLEASE GOD!
Yeah, I think he’s just pulling our leg now.
No, he’s serious, and ABSOLUTELY RIGHT!!!
JOBA TO THE PEN, HUZZAH!!!!
im not pulling your leg cuz hes dominant in relief i mean i agree he would be better for us as starter but i dont wanna have edwar closing games for us so if we have rotation of cc wang lowe burnett hughes than we dont really NEED joba in the rotation so whats wrong with having a lights out closer
I can’t believe you’re serious. A 200+ IP starting pitching putting up Joba’s numbers is way more valuable than a closer tossing 70 innings of relief.
Plus Joba >>>> Derek Lowe.
i understand hes more valuable starting but what im saying is if we sign lowe we dont NEED him there anymore cuz our rotation would already be very dominant so lets just keep the dominant rotation and have a dominant closer added to it remember this is all IF they sign lowe
Don’t forget that Lowe will be 40 in the last year of his contract too. Ugh.
Why would want to overpay for Derek Lowe when you have a cost-controlled and better Joba Chamberlain you can, should and will be starting? I can’t even believe we’re having this conversation.
theyre clearly interested in lowe so im just saying IF that happened we could put hughes in the rotation and joba in the pen and if it doesnt we leave joba starting that way we are dominant if either happens
T-Dizzle = “B-Jobber”
the reason rivera was put in relief was because he stnk, thats right, was no good, as a starter.
Joba is a starter, end of discusion (say Yanks). Melancon will be the closer of the future…may even be the set-up man this year, after a little trip to AAA. That guy is lights out. 27/09.
which blocks all 5 spots for hughes:
cc at least 3 yrs, possibly 7
burnett 5 yrs (not counting injury time)
wang doesnt seem to be going anywhere so let’s say 2 (if they trade him or he falters) – 5 or 6 (assuming continued success and a normal drop off)
joba forever like eleventy billion rs cause he’ll be like randy johnson
and lowe for 4 yrs.
That means hughes has no chance to sniff the majors other than spot starts or injury fill ins until 20011 and thats ONLY if cc opts out. its 2012 if u sign lowe
to quote johnny cochrane, if chewbacca lives on endor you must qcquit. It does not. make. sense.
Blocking Phil and the other guys for 3-5 years makes no sense at all. If you must put up a block, make it for one year only. Comparing Phil and Lowe is not fare to Lowe, Phil is much younger with a better up-side then Lowe, plus we have a few others that may get thrown into the mix if anyone goes down. What should we do with all these young arms…trade them away? Andy, if we must, Lowe, no way. 27/09.
“If Pettitte doesn’t sign just go into ST with the 5th spot open and let the young guys battle it out for the spot.”
Yeah, but now you’re sounding way too logical. But forget about spreading that plan around……you’re beating a dead horse.
Ben, not to switch gears, but I read this morning that Rocco Baldelli’s condition was mis-diagnosed and the condition he actually has (don’t recall the name) is treatable. If this in fact is true, could Yanks make a run at him for CF?
We’ll have more on this in about a half hour.
before the winter meetings, the Yanks have interest and were planning to platoon him with Gardner.
No. He’s not healthy enough regardless of the misdiagnosis. Baldelli does intrigue b/c he could always hit well. But next season he’s still a DH’er.
He hits okay…………….c’mon already.
He’s another guy who strikes out a ton and doesn’t draw walks.
i dont get y they dont just sign both they still have plenty of money to spend before they hit last years total so get pettit and manny and lets win us a championship already
RAB actually addressed that issue yesterday. Yanks might have more of that payroll already spent than you think.
i read that but what i dont understand is why they trying to lower it when theyre getting a new stadium so it seems like they should be able to go even higher if they need to
I would agree, and I am indeed totally in favor of resigning Pettitte and Manny as well, even if we go over 2008′s payroll. I think those two completely solidify our roster.
go get teixeira
Love Manny’s bat, but he’s a locker room cancer and our chemistry would stink. Can’t see Cash or Joe having fun with him when he throws his first tantrum. The Traveling Secretary would need armed guards too. But it would be funny to see him cut off the dreds. Hope we pass, as it doesn’t get the team any younger.
Remember, Cash is one of the only GMs to have visited with Tex face-to-face. I just have to believe we’re involved.
Finally, adding Baldelli and the assets a healthy, developing former #1 pick would bring just has to be a smarter play than adding an aging, K prone player such as Cameron.
So Manny has been in the Majors for the better part of 16 years now. In 1993, he played only a handful of games. In 1994, there was a strike. In the other 14 seasons, his team has made the playoffs 10 times, and they’ve won two World Series. I’d take that “cancer” in a minute. That’s such an overblown argument.
Its just Manny being Manny
i agree sign manny and live with the consequences which is probably a 330 average and 40 homers
Scott Boras was as much to blame for that bullshit last year as Manny. Manny is a mercenary, but he isn’t a negative clubhouse presence, and he is an amazing hitter who is without peer in the current free agent market. Actually, one of his few peers as a hitter happens to be A-Rod … I would love to see those guys hit side by side.
“Scott Boras was as much to blame for that bullshit last year as Manny. Manny is a mercenary, but he isn’t a negative clubhouse presence”
No, he’s not a negative clubhouse presence. Refusing to enter a ballgame, prolonging injuries because your moody, demanding to be traded every September, and shoving down a 64 year-old longtime employee all goes over well with your teammates.
Nevermind that the entire Red Sox front office, manager, and team wanted him gone……he isn’t a negative presence.
Shit, the only reason they put up with him at all is because he could hit. You don’t put lovable clowns who hit like Ramirez on the waiver wire, that’s for sure!
Nevermind that the entire Red Sox front office, manager, and team wanted him gone……he isn’t a negative presence.
No team in baseball shits on its stars on the way out of town like the Red Sox. One day, they love you, the next day you’re the scum of the earth.
Jon Lester had cancer… and the Red Sox won the World Series with him.
Cancer = good
Look if the fact is that we know we need a bat, and if we lose out on Tex then we’re going after Manny, I would much rather have Tex. Let’s go all out for him.
Manny strongly hurts our already below average defense. Tex upgrades our defense. Plus if we get Tex, then we can move Swish to center, where most stats show he’s at least average defensively if not above average, while the same stats show he’s a below average defensive 1B.
If we get Manny, then he and Matsui will rotate at RF/DH, strongly downgrading that position. Then you either move Damon back to CF, where he’s below average and Nady to LF, or keep Damon in LF and start Gardner in CF, which will strongly improve the D, but obviously leave a hole in the lineup.
It’s a no-brainer, if we know we need a bat, and we know it’s either Tex or Manny, then go get Tex.
Rotoworld –
According to the New York Daily News, “one baseball official” believes that the Yankees are “going hard” after Manny Ramirez.
According to the unnamed source the Yankees may offer Ramirez a three-year deal worth at least $22 million per season, but the newspaper notes that “two other officials are skeptical” about the team offering him three years and both the New York Post and New York Newsday don’t expect the Yankees to heavily pursue Ramirez
You realize you are quoting a rotoworld report copy and pasting from the exact same article I linked to in this post, right?
yes but i still agree with what he pasted cuz manny would be a force in our lineup
Forget Manny save the money for Dunn and Cameron
That is the most idiotic statement I have ever heard in my life.
You lucky bastard. You obviously don’t read these boards too much. There’s WAY dumber crap than that said here every day.
lol I know man I read them but this statement is just ridiculous.
cameron and dunn are good players too if we got both manny and dunn there would be no stopping us
He didnt say that though he said screw Manny and get Cameron and Dunn which i think is idiotic…..I am in the minority here and absolutley do not like Dunn what so ever….I dont mind Cameron that much because he is only here for a year and plays a mean center field and we are giving up two hot dog vendors for him that I can live with….but I think Dunn is absolutley stupid…he cant play the field he strikes out a shit load of times. Stupid if you ask me. Get Manny one of the most clutch hitters of all times and one fo the greatest right hand hitters of all time he will strive for us because he wants to stick it to the Red Sox and the guy single handedly brought the Dodgers to the play offs. And two guys who are all about the club house and want a good club house enviorment in Joe Torree and Donald Arthur Mattingly were absolutley in love with Manny. Get Manny.
Rob Deer + Ichiro + Hank Aaron = Adam Dunn.
He’s better than you’re portraying him.
If the Red Sox get Teixeira the Yankees will get Manny. If the Sox lose out to Teixeira…the Yankees will stay put or just get a Mike Cameron type. It’s pretty obvious this is scenario…
And after Matsui is gone…and Manny can DH full time and be happy…I’m sure he won’t be as much of a cancer. He loves to hit. He’ll be too happy to act up I think…
I don’t know if he can hit without his dreads (or what ever they are called)…it may put to much pressure on him, after all; “Yanks are about winning”. 27/09.
What about the mis-diagnosis of Rocco Baldelli? If he’s properly treated he could be a great option for CF, no?
I hope that Cashman does not screw this up and they let Manny go to the Angels. I mean this guy behind AROD, would trump Texeira. Manny in my mind is a much better hitter than Teixera not nearly the fielder. I think you have an outfield of Nady Gardner/Cabrea and Manny/Matsui alternating DH and Right field we are golden. My feeling is after three years if things work out Montero will be at first Romine will be catching and Jackson in center. I know that is all perfect world optimism but that has to be teh plan. I hate Teixera for eight years, he is a slow starter and I dont think made a huge impact in Atlanta and he did not do much in the playoffs for the Angels. At least with Manny you know he will mash regular and post season. I think he has three good years left and I would love to see him hit a bomb in Fenway and pose. The only issue here is Cashman I get the sense with him he is ashamed to have to spend money and he seems apologetic for the Yankees payroll and if that is the case then he is teh wrong guy for the job he can go work for the Pirates or Twins. ets be bold get Manny done now and keep Canrear send Pettite out to pastuer he got a 10 Million dollar offer and that is a favor and after what he pulled last year he should be offering money back.
Reports of Sox being front runners for Texeira are killing me. Manny is 2nd choice and I guess Swisher really is there to play 1B, but damn…. Tex is an awesome player; who cares if it’s a 7 year contract… if you have that level of player, I want that player for that long.
Also, pitching… with inning restrictions on Joba, how long can he last as #5 starter. Do we need Pettitte and Lowe or Sheets? or 1 of these guys and then fill with Joba/Hughes/Aveces?
I’m just seeing big need for 1 more big bat and 2 more pitchers than what we have now.
Yes, but Tex won’t be that level of player for all seven, eight or nine years of his contract.
Meh, our best case scenario is probably Tex taking the money from Baltimore or Washington (thus, putting his bat on a non-contending team) and we sign Manny.
We get better, the Sox and Angels don’t.
Totally agree with you; but if Sox get him, that would suck… and I think he’s a premiere player, gonna be good for a long time, he’s been this good for the last 5…
Pettitte needs to show love back and take a hometown discount….is there such a thing with the yanks…It’s amazing no one takes a cut on this team …you actuall get more money as time goes and you get older and more injury prone,as evidence by mo and posada. you’d think that after all that “it’s not about the money , I have enough money” talk he’d realize he is now a 4th starter and not the #2 he was 2 years ago. It’s never about the money when the contract is signed to an insanely overpriced contract. So in the end andy is only a yankee if the price is right. Im not shcked bc it’s been this way for a long time but im just sick of hearing hw these guys came to NY cuz they wanted to be a yankee $$$$
Ryan, the next time you have a job performance evaluation, I’m calling your boss so he can tell you to take a “hometown discount.” I don’t believe Pettitte should be paid $16 million ever again, but the idea that should take a hometown discount is, frankly, ludicrous.
I never expect these guys to take a “hometown discount” it’s a sefless act that only few that are true to their team do. Why should a man who’s made an insane amount of money for a decade do anything to help the team free up money and increase it’s chances of winning a world series by using it’s resources on areas of weakness. I guess it is ludicrous to expect what you’ve said urself, that pettitte should never again make 16 mill a year….so what then .. I was using a nicer word for pay cut ..I guess what I meant to say is take the paycut the team is giving him….and if i ever make millions of dollars for a decade and I am richer than God then u can tell my boss whatever u want… and if my hometown discount is 10 mill in one year i’ll take that with a smile. My paycut could been not meeting my bills …his paycut means he wont be able to wipe is arse with 6 millon more dollars.
GO GET MARK TEIXIERA
GO GET MARK TEIXIERA
GO GET MARK TEIXIERA…….if only to keep him from the red sox. go get him. Why let them put another bat behind ortiz? Why not take pressure off A-rod? and,and WE NEED A FIRST BASEMAN. He is in his prime,switch hitter and defensive whiz.GO GET MARK TEIXIERA
You said it five times, and spelled it wrong all of them.
Me? I’d prefer the Yanks to sign Mark Teixeira, but if you’re dead set on Teixiera, I won’t stop you from saying so.
this is what we have to look forward to if we sign manny:
http://www.fannation.com/si_bl.....ref=fromSI