Open Thread: Out of work camp
By
Phil Rogers of The Chicago Tribune wrote an interesting little nugget yesterday that I found at (where else?) MLBTR. Check it out:
There has been so little interest in Frank Thomas he doesn’t even land in the rumors. He’s not going to get ready while he’s out of camp, which is why the Players Association needs to organize a spring training camp for out-of-work players. The White Sox’s abandoned Tucson complex would be a perfect place.
First, let me plug this post from earlier today about Thomas. Secondly, it makes a ton of sense for the union to run something like this, especially in today’s market. There’s still roughly sixty free agents out there still looking for work, and a good chunk of those guys can still be assets to a MLB team and would benefit from such a camp. You could elementarily break them down into three groups:
- Players hurt by the market: Bobby Abreu, Garret Anderson, Joe Biemel, Orlando Cabrera, Juan Cruz, Adam Dunn, Orlando Hudson, Braden Looper, Doug Mientkiewicz, Will Ohman, Dennys Reyes
- Players looking to prove themselves coming off injury: Joe Crede, Scott Elarton, Randy Flores, Tom Glavine, Orlando Hernandez, Chuck James, Mark Mulder, Matt Wise
- Veteran players looking to prove they have something left: Moises Alou, Rich Aurilia, Ray Durham, Damion Easley, Jim Edmonds, Keith Foulke, Nomar Garciaparra, Luis Gonzalez, Ken Griffey Jr., Mark Grudzielanek, Livan Hernandez, Jon Lieber, Kent Mercker, Jay Payton, Ivan Rodriguez, Curt Schilling, Rudy Seanez, Julian Tavarez, Frank Thomas, Mike Timlin, Ron Villone
Camp certainly wouldn’t be mandatory, and the players would have to pay for their own living arrangements, etc. Pitchers could throw bullpens and live BP, position players could hit everyday and take fielding drills, stuff like that to help prepare them for the season and show what they have. Essentially it would just give these players a place to work out and gain exposure, while the thirty teams could go to one central place to see who could help them. They could even play a game against a club once a week or something.
I know there’s a lot more that goes into this idea than I could possibly imagine, but it seems like something MLBPA should be seriously considering for it’s members. Anyway here’s your open thread for the night. Talk about whatever you like, just please be civil, especially when talking about A-Rod.
Photo Credit: First Base Tickets
185 Comments»
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Since I’m a nitpicker I have to point out that you spelled Jon Lieber wrong
i before e, except after c. Bah, stupid rule. Thanks, fixed now.
Feel like the Yanks should give a Lieber deal to Mulder… though I guess they don’t have a ton of use for him.
Can never have enough pitching. I’d love to see them at least take a look at Mulder. Don’t go crazy to get him, but if he’s got something, take a shot.
Definitely, never too much depth.
Wow Pro Bowl halftime show….why bother
Wow Prow Bowl
show…why botherThere. Fixed.
Out of work coaches could run it?
There has to be someone around to run it.
I’ll do it. Who’s with me?
I’m in.
I guess that is what the WBC is for but there isn’t a WBC every year. I’m all for a FA team.
Well a lot of guys aren’t going to make their WBC clubs.
Didn’t Timlin say he’s retiring?
Did he? My bad if he did.
I love the pro bowl. Its really underrated.
This has to be a joke, right?
No its really not, I kind of like it. Its more enjoyable than most people think.
agree to disagree on that one
The top QB’s with top receivers across the board.
And no blitzing or defense allowed. I’m with A.D., agree to disagree. Didn’t mean to come off like a dick before, sorry if I did – just haven’t ever really heard anyone liking the Pro Bowl.
I agree with you. I like the Pro Bowl too. Hopefully, the Pro Bowl will stay in Hawaii in the future.
i agree i live in indiana and it fucking blows.. whats the incentive to come to indy when its cold as hell here.. hell have it in lambo..
Interested to hear Jamal’s take on the A-Rod situation.
We asked the same question on the just-recorded podcast.
You guys recorded another podcast?
Special A-Rod edition. It’ll be up on the site later tonight.
With a surprise.
I’m thinking some Elaine-like tones to the recording?
I figured.
Will it be on iTunes today?
Crazy what 8 years can do. In 2001 Oakland’s big 3 put up the following:
Mulder: 21-8 3.45 ERA
Hudson: 18-9 3.37
Zito: 17-8 3.49
…and all put up 210+ IP
in 2008:
Mulder: 1.7 IP 10.80 ERA
Hudson: 3.17 IP… missed 1/3 of the season to TJ
Zito: 10-17 5.15 ERA
….and no one pitched 200 IP
How old were each of them in 2001?
http://tinyurl.com/cgbdt3
How did you do that?
If I told you, I would have to kill you.
AWESOME
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ontrx8LkZ78
Guillermo for Jimmy Kimmel goes and talks to Jeter, lol he shaves his mustache!
Juan Cruz!
What about him?
Just boredom.
Ah okay. You had me running around the interwebs thinking he signed.
Me too, thanks for the false hope
Ditto.
LOL, my bad!
ESPN’s own Jamal Anderson caught with cocaine. I wonder what ESPN has to say about this incident. I wonder if Anderson did the “Dirty Bird” while playing with the magic powder.
Read the story, haha, he was doing lines off the top part (some may know it as the ‘upper deck’) of the toilet bowl, haha….
Think he’ll be on cold pizza…er…1st take tomorrow?
Heh, an upper decker.
Where I work, the regulars at the bar do that in the bathroom all the time. Bunch of tools.
At least they’re just doing coke off the upper decker, and not leaving and upper decker.
Do you know of an upper decker ever occurring? I know it’s been contemplated many times, but I don’t know anyone who’s actually gone thru with it.
I did one at some frat house when I was in college, the guys were douches…
Lol
I don’t know anyone who’s done it either, sadly.
They should pool their millions and start their own league- all the borderline guys- think about how horrid the defense would be- an outfield of Dunn, Abreu and Griffey, Jr.
Would be a very interesting camp. Maybe they could play exhibition games too.
I’d totally be down with that camp. It’s really not a bad idea. And it’d be cool for people that can’t get tickets to their own team’s spring training, too.
espn sportsnation has a great question:
if it guaranteed you a $250 million contract, like ARod, would you take performance enhancing drugs?
63% say yes
I wouldn’t do any PEDs.
for $250 mill? id do it in a second
There are side effects to PEDs and my moral values wouldn’t allow me to do that stuff. Money isn’t everything, at least not to me.
Id take what Arod did to gaurantee me that kind of money. No questions asked.
sarcasm?
Its not sarcasm.
I respect you for that but you crraaaaazzzzzyyyyyy!!!
What good is $250m if your body is falling apart by the time you’re 35 ? If these guys are already in horrible shape at that age, I’d imagine they’d going to die a lot younger than they would have otherwise. If not, they’re going to be in horrible shape and completely miserable throughout their old age years.
Yeah, because ARod looks about ready to fall apart.
I’d take 6-8 years off my life for 250 million.
Yeah, because ARod looks about ready to fall apart.
a) We know very little about A-Rod, and before yesterday had absolutely no reason to think he did steroids.
b) He’s not quite at the age where the steroid abusers generally fall apart.
I’d take 6-8 years off my life for 250 million.
Are you also ready for your joints to be falling apart by the time you’re 40, potential tumors, shrunken testicles that no longer produce testosterone, etc? You’re going to spend about half your life feeling like you’re 80 years old.
I’d do them if it guaranteed me a $10 mil contract.
In a related poll 37% of people admit they are big day liars.
I enjoyed this.
As opposed to small night truthtellers? Lol, I’m assuming you meant to type big fat liars and your hands weren’t lined up right but maybe there’s a new term going around?
There is now.
Stupid Blackberry autotype! I guess soon “Big Day Liars” will be as famous as “pwned”.
lol
It still baffles me about Juan Cruz…the Yanks only have to give up a 4th rounder for this guy and not even any rumors about him?
What would it really take? 2yrs 5 or 6 million?
Think of a mix of edwar rameriez, coke, cruz, marte, bruney leading up to Mo…
Maybe it’s too obvious of a solution, I dunno.
I mean I’d be happy to DFA Steven Jackson for the guy, but there is the roster flexibility, giving home grown players a chance, and wanting a 4th round pick.
Overall I think they should sign Cruz to a 2 year deal
They can always deal him at the deadline if all the homegrown guys are just that nasty.
yup, can always deal off some parts
Well we also have Robertson, Melancon and a few others in the minors, far from a guarantee I know. But you also forgot Veras and Albaladejo. I’m not worried about the bullpen.
Would I love to have Cruz? Absolutely. Do we need him? No. As far as I am concerned he is just a luxury.
Why not though. I can certainly understand some teams not wanting to give up a 1st or even a 2nd round pick, but the Yanks only have to give up a 4th rounder.
why would the Yanks even give him 5 or 6 mil? Don’t overpay. The market is so depreciationed, it is best to wait till they are desperate. Right now, Cruz is far from a need adn so waiting only helps us.
Boy the Royals suck giving Farnsworth 2 years and 9.875 mil or something like that.Wow that deal really blowed.
Bruney and Marte are pretty close stuff wise to Cruz. All three have blazing fastballs, a nasty breaking pitch and so so control. Cruz may miss a few more bats, but its not like he fits a profile/role we don’t currently have.
Sportscenter is interviewing Bernie Williams right now. Anyone watching?
i am now
That was like…the third or fourth time that segment has been on, haha.
Eh, Pineapple Express is more important right now.
such a good movie haha
Hope your in the right, er, mindset for that movie
40 Year Old Virgin > Superbad > Forgetting Sarah Marshall > Knocked Up > Pineapple Express > Zack & Miri > Step Brothers
Did I miss any?
Screw Forgetting Sarah Marshall. Also I like the Express over Knocked Up.
The Express > Knocked Up > Pineapple Express
Pineapple Express is a movie you have to watch with friends or else it won’t be nearly as funny. Same with Superbad and Step Brothers.
If you guys like those movies you should check out Adventureland.
It’s written and directed by the guy who did Superbad. Coming out in March I think.
I wrote a song thats going to be played a few times throughout the movie so everyone should see it!
With Bill Hader. I’ll see it.
I kind of agree with that list, I just haven’t seen Zack & Miri yet(Don’t think the parents would be pleased with a movie with the word “Porno” in our Queue)
Wedding Crashers. I’d put it before Knocked up.
I really hate to speculate, but I’m a little worrited that Teixeira might be outed in regards to this whole steroid debacle. That Ranger clubhouse with A-Rod and Pudge makes me nervous. I should say that Teixeira is my favorite baseball player so I would be crushed, but also from a Yankee standpoint it could get real messy. I don’t think (maybe just hoping) that Teix has done steroids, but honestly at this point, can you really be surprised by anyone? Does anyone share this concern?
Yea man. Anything can come out, would suck so much if he did it. I’m not suprised about anyone doing it anymore, I just hope A-Rod says something by tomorrow.
Speaking of Movies, Mike have you seen Transformers yet?
It’s next in the Netflix queue. I’ll have it Monday or Tuesday.
nice. I just got Zohan, its pretty goof. Not one of Adam Sandlers best movies though.
Netflix is the second best thing invented in the past 10 years(of course, Rockband is number one)
I loved Zohan.
Zohan was a bust to say the least. The Day The Earth Stood Still was a big bust, just saw it yesterday, and my friend told me it was really good.
I disagree. I thought Zohan was hilarious. Go see Taken. So awesome.
Standard action flick. Absolutely nothing special.
Where’s Ben Sheets on that list
“Where’s Ben Sheets on that list”
He’s Physically unable to pitch. He needs surgery.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....index.html
Yeah right.
Not with a .294 OBP/.359 SLG. Yeesh.
Has anyone ever came back from being that horrible?
Not when he has extreme plate indiscipline. 652 plate appearances last year, just 39 walks, and only 93 plate appearances where he got to a three ball count. Terrible.
“On the back of his batting gloves, Francoeur has written Joshua 1:9, a Biblical verse which reads, in part, ‘Be strong and courageous; do not be terrified, do not be discouraged.’”
Unfortunately for Francoeur, it says nothing about taking pitches.
FWIW Robinson Cano had 26 walks in 634 plate appearances. I’m sure you were well aware, just throwin’ it out there.
Francoeur was a product of that awesome lineup. Edgar Renteria, Chipper Jones, Andruw Jones, Adam Laroche, etc. To quote Jim Mora Sr. “Are you kiddin’ me?” I could have batted in 100 RBI in that lineup (No way). Feels like I left someone out.
McCann had a big year in 06, too. .33/.388/.572, 24 HR, 93 RBI
Anyone else think he’s pretty underrated?
Me. Dude is awesome. Without a doubt 2nd best C in the game RIGHT NOW. (Wieters)
No love for Joe Mauer?
I meant McCann will become the 3rd best behind Mauer/Wieters.
I’ve been looking over odds for betting and I want to bet on the twins (I think they are an awesome organization) but I just don’t like how many holes they have. Do you guys think they’ll sign abreu (assuming he goes for like 4 mil), dunn, looper or crede?
Would those signings make them a better team?
What’s the twins’ odds?
25 to 1
Not a bad play…what’s Cleavland’s?
plus, according to mlbtr, they are 14 mil under payroll from last year so they could made some moves now or later in the season should it suit them.
We talked about this a couple of days ago.
http://riveraveblues.com/2009/.....odds-7722/
Here is the link to all the odds
http://www.thespread.com/sport.....ers-a.html
Twins odds are 25/1
“Would those signings make them a better team?”
Abreu: Yes
Dunn: Yes
Crede: Yes
Looper: A little bit, eventhough they don’t need him. Good depth though, but I’d imagine he wants to start.
That said, those signings would make all 30 teams better.
http://nyfaninboston.blogspot......ou-do.html
Just to spark some conversation.
Blasphemy!!! You shall be excommunicated from RAB. GET OUT!!!!
On a more serious note, Blasphemy!!!
I just don’t care anymore. Lots of players in all the major sports have been taking a variety of banned substances to improve performance for years.
greenies, roids, HGH, that blood doping stuff that cyclists do…
I enjoyed watching baseball before all the guys started getting caught, and I’ll still enjoy it next season. Unless ARod gets so screwed up by the boos that will almost certainly be rained upon him that he can’t hit a baseball anymore.
Mike/Joe,
Looking forward to the bonus podcast. Will it be posted anytime soon? Wanted to listen before hitting the hay.
same.
9
Awesome
Should I:
A- Read 3 chapters of a book I have to read for tomorrow.
B- Listen to the RAB podcast
C-Both
C.
Oh and, what’s the book?
Still reading Slaughterhouse 5. I was sick this week and stayed home from school for a couple of days and now I’m playing catch up with all the reading.
LOVE SH5.
same. Easily the best book I’ve ever read in school.
It’s one of those books that helped shape my life. Vonnegut is a genius.
I wish I got to read Slaughterhouse 5 in high school.
Its only my teacher that does Slaughterhouse 5, so I guess I consider it a privilege.
I kinda wish Andruw Jones had signed a minor league deal with us, but I guess it is a much better situation for him in Texas.
I really don’t see how he thinks it is a better oppurtunity for him. They have Cruz, Hamilton, Murphy, and Byrd. All he would have to do here is beat out Melk and Gardner. A guy with his talent, not that hard to do.
The only thing I meant by that is he has a great ballpark to mash the ball in down there and he doesn’t have to deal with the circus that is the NYY.
Oh, I wasn’t trying to “call you out”. I was just saying, I think he has a better shot at playing time with the Yanks.
If the Rangers absolutely ignore defense, then yes. But he could benefit from a lot of things in Texas–being a good defender and getting to play in a hitter’s park. Maybe he has a rebound year in 09. I predicted one for him in ’08 and drafted him in fantasy…bad move. I still won the league, though.
I suspect you made that comment just to mention you won your fantasy league. Ha.
Hamilton’s a BAD CF, Jones was still good last year in CF despite being a fat lard, Murphy’s still bad, Cruz’s played two games in CF; Byrd is a decent CF, but Jones is far and away better on D than all of those guys.
Just wondering, for you stat guys, what do Jones’ defensive stats say for the last couple of years? How do they match up against Melky/Brett?
Jones UZR/150 (runs are over average): 12.5 in 496.1 innings (career: 22.3)
Melky: 0.0 in 973.2 innings (career -11.3)
Gardner: 40.2 in 160 innings so take taht with a big grain of salt.
Funny, the last few years, Barry Bonds had a horrible reputation as a fielder yet he posted the following UZR/150 tallies:
02: 12.9
03: 15.3
04: 4.0
05: 22.6 (only 13 games)
06: -1.9
07: -8.0
So, really, he was only a liability in the field his last two seasons.
Meanwhile, one recently retired player wanted to know how Rodriguez’s name got out. Sean Casey, who spent last season with the Red Sox, said he felt violated by the leak.
“A little bit, because it was supposed to be a survey test and those results were supposed to be confidential,” he said. “The only reason we opened up the collective bargaining agreement was on those terms.”
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....id=3893240
I know hardly anybody here cares, but the Knicks loss tonight mightve been more sickening that the Arod news.
Well it was pathetic but not worse than the Arod news, lol.
Brutal loss. How was there no mandate for a foul with one to give? And nice to see Jared Jeffries, our defensive stopper, making a play on Roy to end the game. He’s not at all a waste of money or space.
even boston is backing arod…
http://www.boston.com/sports/c.....s_aro.html
TOny Maaaaaz.
Man, as he says, you know when people are tired of it when
This has been the best offseason that I can remember: A new park and new players who have great ability and character (CC & Tex), which gave me a lot of hope in winning it all. But Mr. Jinx (Also known as Alex Rodriguez) struck this team again, making that job even harder. First he does the Madonna thing, then he chooses the DR over the US (Including letting DAVID ORTIZ announce it, which is revealing in and of itself (If he really cared what the fans thought about him, he never would have done that, just like when he opted out. Or is he so arrogant, did not believe it possible they would boo him?)), then he gives that stupid answer about “Taking it up with the Players Association”. He either cheated or did not. He opted out of his contract, he fails to produce in the clutch, he has ZERO loyality to anyone (Even to Scott Boras), and now he is shown to be a cheater, and a liar (Remember 60 Minutes?).
There are many jerks in professional sports such as TO, Bonds, Strawberry, Gooden, Clemens, McGwire, Kobe, John Daly, Burress, and Manny. But, at least they performed in the big spot and played in a Championship, this guy never did. If they win this year, it will happen because Jeter, Damon, Posada, CC, Tex, and of course, Mariano (The players of this team with character), will overcome this self-destructive clown.
TO has never played in a big spot
i take that back as soon as i hit add….
i forgot the superbowl
What about the Super Bowl with the Eagles where he had over 100 yards receiving?
“First he does the Madonna thing,”
So a grown man isn’t allowed to spend time with who he wants? All of Derek Jeter’s relationships combined barely got the amount of press Madonna/A-Rod did. Whose fault is that?
“then he chooses the DR over the US ”
For good reason. The fact that that incident still gets under the skin of some people is ridiculous.
“then he gives that stupid answer about “Taking it up with the Players Association””
Why is that a stupid answer? There’s a reason the Union is in place. If he says one thing and it proves to be wrong, he looks a whole hell of a lot worse.
“He opted out of his contract”
So did AJ Burnett. Is he some big asshole now? Everyone of us would’ve done exactly what A-Rod did and I’d say it’s worked out pretty well for him. He did, after all, get an even larger contract.
“he fails to produce in the clutch,”
I’m getting so sick of this BS. Go look up his career high-leverage splits and his splits from his time w/the Yankees. They’re good. And before you get on the playoffs, he’s had some monster playoff series, and he’s had some shitty ones–just like everyone else.
“But, at least they performed in the big spot and played in a Championship, this guy never did. ”
So it’s his fault the Yankees have had shitty pitching since he got here in 2004? That has much more to do with the lack of WS titles in the last eight years than than Alex Rodriguez.
“If they win this year, it will happen because Jeter, Damon, Posada, CC, Tex, and of course, Mariano (The players of this team with character), will overcome this self-destructive clown.”
Overcome? He’s on their team. Why would they have to “overcome” him? Regardless of what he did in 2003, he’s still the team’s best player and he will be a gigantic part of their offense like he has been for the last five seasons.
Very well said.
Matt you ignorant slut! I don’t believe in all your fancy stats and book learnin’. I believe in eyes like in my head and heart like in my chest. Have you seen A-Rod!?!? He sucks!!!! And nothing personal, but you suck. No offense.
How is Kobe a jerk? Thaat bitch made it up. Manny? Not really a jerk just has a good time.
And, ya know, one of the best RHH ever.
Seriously? Manny’s not a jerk? Come on man. Faking knee injuries, intentionally tanking ABs, and assaulting a club employee is not “having a good time”, that’s being a jerk. He’s insanely talented, but he most certainly is a jerk.
Ya. Well people make mistakes. I’d take that jerk on my team any day. I guess he is but doesn’t belong in the category with those other guys in my opinion.
Again, this is simply going on the statement that Manny is a jerk, it has nothing to do with his abilities, which are almost unmatched by any RHB of this era. Agree to disagree.
Yep.
Also for the hell of it.
Cowboys>Giants in 09.
Haha, that’s a good one. We’ll see. Can’t wait to watch TO’s reality show. I’m sure the Boys are thrilled about that. Their ticking time bomb of a team will fully explode in 09.
I suspect you made that comment just to try and justify your teams inadequacy in 2008.
There is no question that Manny Ramirez is a jerk, and he is probably my least favorite player in professional sports. That being said, if I was down 4-3 two outs and the bases loaded, I would take Manny over Arod, any day of the week.
Just for funsies:
Career Bases Loaded Splits:
Manny: .326/.378/.692/1.071, in 267 PAs
A-Rod: .347/.404/.718/1.121, in 208 PAs
Come on now. Let’s not let stats get in the way of an argument.
I have heard that Mo’s urine is actually a potent anabolic steroid. Michael Phelps swam in the same pool as Mo and we all saw what he did in the Olympics. This may sound crazy, but I have 27.3 unnamed sources who have confirmed it.
Is the 0.3 Nelson de la Rosa?
RIP.
What would take to get Marlon Byrd from the Rangers now that they signed Jones and have a pretty crowded OF. Is he worth it? What do you guys think?
There’s already a surplus of outfielders; why trade for another one?
Just looking for someone to handle center on an everyday basis with good offensive production in case Brelky can’t get it done.
Any chance we wnt Frank Thomas coming off the bench? He’s going to be on the list though. He’s a friggin condominium. I met him in Vegas. Biggest guy I’ve ever seen up close…..
Does Nomahhh have anything left?
-Scott
i think a rod is a jinx but ortiz is asome. totally hate this story about the yankees needing depth
[...] camp for free agents. With so many unsigned, it would make sense for them to get their work in. We discussed this in an open thread, including possible instructors. It is not to be, though. The players’ association has said [...]