Jun
24
Some pre-game stuff
ByJust a couple of items of note before we get to the game tonight:
- When the lineup was posted today, Melky was playing right and batting sixth. Rob Thompson then took down the lineup, and Nick Swisher went into a closed-door meeting with Brian Cashman and Joe Girardi. When they emerged, the lineup went back up, with Swisher in place of Melky.
- All of the hitters were later called into a meeting. Does anyone like meetings? I guess they kill time, but they usually accomplish little else.
- CC threw a bullpen and declared himself fine to start on Friday against the Mets. So that’s one less thing to worry about.
- Xavier Nady is starting in right for Scranton tonight.
- I laughed a bit at this.
I’m back guys! Hope there’s a change in the roster these next few days.
I don’t think the roster needs to chance, the outcomes do. This team showed it could win and win a lot.
Very true, but a good return on selling Melky high wouldn’t hurt.
Selling high on Melky would have meant moving him after his 2006 campaign. The Yanks aren’t going to fool too many GMs with Melky right now.
Not sure why you say that. Melky has been better this year than at any previous point in his career. I know he has been pretty bad since April, but the total numbers suggest that he is a 24 year old solid fielding CF’er. My eyes tell me that his approach at the plate is a lot better. I think you can fool a number of GM’s at this point.
Well they’ll fight back with he’s been bad the past 2 years, and just had a hot start this year. I think a full season of Melky hitting pretty well would solidify his value.
But in ‘06 he cost a lot less, still had full arb left, and had put up a solid rookie year with no other bad years to scare someone.
Fair enough. I just think that you could sell high on him right now and get something of value for him, but you are probably right, he was more valuable then.
Yeah he’s at a high of sorts now, way higher than this offseason, but gotta agree with Ben, after the rookie year is prob the highest.
If Melky can sustain above-average or even average production for a full season, he’ll have a lot of value. He hasn’t done that yet in his career, and he’s again been awful since early May. We’re approaching 140 PAs of a sub-.300 OBP and a sub.-700 OPS. No matter what his “approach the plate” looks like, the results have been the same. I would contend too that his approach at the plate did look better but in April. Now, it’s back to the same Hacky McHeadfirstslide we saw last year.
I want Melky to be good. I really do. But I also don’t want to see the Yanks give 400 PAs to someone who won’t help the team again, and I also realize that scouts were never high on Melky as a prospect. He was pressed into service when the Yanks had no choice and had a good debut. Since then, he’s been more hype than results.
No, I think the approach has stayed pretty good. He is working counts at a career high rate, and I’m pretty sure that has been fairly constant. Listen, I’m not a big Melky fan. However, I do think he has some trade value.
What kind of player do you think we can get for Melky? I doubt we can get a guy that would have a much bigger impact than Melky could provide.
I mean straight up you should only get another Melky, or expensive okay veteran. More likely he’s now part of a package where a team wants a prospect (i.e. Kontos or Z-Mac) and a ML ready player, Melky.
It depends on what you need. If you do not have faith in Marte coming back and think Hughes should be in the minors, you might trade him for the right bullpen arm.
Fair enough.
But they aren’t.
I don’t think they really need to change the roster, maybe something internal such as Marte for Tomko.
Otherwise they should be getting Damon back, which is a plus, maybe shuffle some guys in the lineup, but there’s nothing that sticks out as a real black hole, just guys not hitting that should be.
*Mitre for Tomko
cameron at 35 or home grown melky at 24 yanks make this trade they lose alot of chemistry
Chemistry hasn’t done much of anything for this team lately.
Periods are your friend.
I’m not sure where the Cameron rumors have come from. They’ve been dormant since the winter, and other than fans, no one with sources is speculating on a Cameron-for-Melky swap.
The Red Sox have only 2 “home grown” players in their everyday line-up. Nothing wrong with their chemistry.
Eh, three homegrown.
Three, four when Lowrie comes back.
Depends if Tek counts, since Seattle really developed him
Yeah, he was pretty much in the majors from day 1 with the Sox.
Not even counting Varitek. Ellsbury, Pedroia, Youkilis are the three homegrown guys I’m talking about.
Yeah i was thinking between 3 and 4
http://www.amazon.com/Eats-Sho.....amp;sr=8-1
H/T TJSC
Thank you, thank you.
true you just get the feeling thier gonna lose, bad vibes
Until they win. Then we’ll all be happy again.
I won’t. I try to stay terminally grumpy.
Do you have any idea how many greenhouse gases your terminal grumpiness is causing?
THINK OF THE CHILDREN, FOR MOSAKES!!!!!
Has anyone ever speculated how losing Melky would affect Cano, or if this is at all a concern of the front office? I know they sent him down last year but that’s not nearly the same as trading him.
I think they’re more concerned with how it’ll affect the team. Cano’s a big boy. He can handle it. I’m not sure about myself though. I’ll probably cry myself to sleep for weeks.
Cano was a monster in the second half of last year. Wasn’t Melky sent down by then?
in red sox lneup maybe but thier p staff is alot of homegrowns plus they have 4 in the lineup lineup has pedoria varieteck elliburry youKILLus
ellsbury, pedroia, youk
lester, papelbon, delcarmen, bard, masterson
jason catcher captian is homegrown isnt he ?
No, he was part of one of the greatest swindles in MLB history: Derek Lowe and Jason Varitek for Heathcliff Slocumb.
no. he was drafted by seattle in 95, traded to Boston in 97, played 20 games in AAA for Boston, in 98 he split time with Scott Hatteberg at C before becoming full time starter
Please use the reply button.
And punctuation.
I called the meeting last night on the recap…
And if it was a hitters meeting, I wonder if starting pitchers had to attend too as they are technically hitters for now?
You notice teams never call a hitters meeting just before they face Tim Lincecum or Zack Greinke.
jeter has got to stop hitting into so many dps this guy is making 22mil per year and cant lay down a bunt way overated
He is not overrated at RAB. He is underrated here. I bet most people here expect Jeter to do that often and was not surprised. Jeter puts the ball into play and he usually hits it hard. Sometimes he finds a hole in the infield and sometimes he hits it right at guys. It happens.
+1
Jeter has been pretty damn solid this year. Even last year, he was solid. Not the Jeter we’d seen, but solid nonetheless.
As long as my shortstop keeps OPS+ing 116, I’ll take the occasional DP.
(3… 2… 1… )
/ironhorse’d
How many is “occasional?”
Jeter always seems to improve something…he’s now at the stage where things are declining, but you still get the idea he’s trying to get better. His fielding, this year, has been noted to be better. Maybe he’s listening to his coaches on positioning, or maybe it’s just work he’s putting in on his own.
I remember there was a time 7-8 years ago maybe when teams seemed pretty successful getting him out by jamming him, and then the next season he seemed to figure out the “Jeterian” inside out swing.
We might make too big a deal of the DPs, but he does ground into a few too many, and I wonder why he hasn’t been able to “fix” this. You’ll all say “IT’S A FUNCTION OF THE NUMBER OF RUNNERS ON BASE…IT’S AN OPPORTUNITY THING…BLAH BLAH BLAH.” Maybe. But I have this fantasy type belief that a star baseball player could somehow teach himself not to GIDP. If anyone could figure it out, it would be Jeter.
The answer is to never hit the ball on the ground and never hit line drives below 9-10 feet. Jeter is simply not that type of hitter. He hits the ball and hard, and if he hits it on the ground, so be it. He has had many clutch hits where he found a hole in the infield. The flip side to that is that he may hit into more double plays. There is no way he can avoid that. He is not an uppercut, homerun hitter.
“But I have this fantasy type belief that a star baseball player could somehow teach himself not to GIDP. If anyone could figure it out, it would be Jeter.”
http://www.baseball-almanac.co.....idp1.shtml
Top 5 GIDP:
Cal Ripken, Jr.
Hank Aaron
Carl Yastrzemski
Dave Winfield
Eddie Murray
I understand it’s frustrating when he grounds into double plays (I yell a lot, myself) but you don’t have a guy who can hit at his level of ability bunt.
It may feel like he’s hitting .150 with a double play every at bat after the weekend, but he’s .298/.370/.446.
He can lay down a bunt, its that he shouldn’t lay down a bunt in almost all of the situations.
With Nady enroute soon, maybe they were asking Swisher how he feels about playing some CF.
I know Gardner has been hot but they gave him a shot already and he blew it.
When the bats went cold last year they did the same thing, only it was Damon who slid over to center.
yeah having the same OBP, SLG, and OPS as Ellsbury really means he “blew it”
When did Ellsbury become the standard for a good centerfielder. I’m not saying that Gardner is bad, I’m just saying that Ellsbury is not that good.
I’m not saying Ellsbury is standard for good CF, but saying that Gardner blew his shot and Swisher should be in CF and Nady in RF is just wrong
Without getting into whether Gardner should be in CF or not, the reasoning underpinning your criticism of matthaggs is flawed. His point was that the Yanks gave Gardner the first–crack at holding down the CF position in April, and he didn’t perform well enough to remain the everyday CFer when given that opportunity, so he doesn’t think Gardner would hold down the everyday CF slot now, either. His stats today, and how his stats stack up against Ellsbury’s stats, are irrelevant to his statement.
Now, I don’t happen to think his failure to hold onto the everyday CF position in April is necessarily the best reason to think he can’t handle the position now (although perhaps not every day)… But your criticism of matthaggs’ comment is faulty.
I dont get how someone can lose a job by the end of April, Melky got more playing time more because he was the hot bat and Girardi went with it, and now we see that Melky has disappeared again. Meanwhile Gardner’s stats are up to those of Ellsbury, who I didnt say was the standard of CF, but to act like Gardner should just be a pinch runner now is ridiculous in my opinion
“… but to act like Gardner should just be a pinch runner now is ridiculous in my opinion”
Again… I don’t disagree with your conclusion. I was talking about the reasoning behind your criticism, not your conclusion. He said Gardner “blew it” in reference to the beginning of the season when Gardner was given the starting CF job and proceeded to lose that position. I don’t think what happened in April means Gardner can’t hold the position now. But to say he didn’t “blow it” (to use matthaggs’ words, not mine) because his stats look better now, in June, and are comparable to Ellsbury’s, is wrong, because matthaggs said he blew it when discussing April, not now. I agree with you, I don’t think Gardner can’t be the CFer just because he didn’t perform well when given the position in April, but you can disagree with someone’s comment without mischaracterizing their words or disregarding the intent of those words.
Yeah, Gardner lost his spot, and now he’s earning it back by hitting up to the level that would have kept him in center.
That said I wouldn’t be surprised if they did look to get Swisher at-bats in center with Nady on the way back. Though that’s a poor defensive OF.
All the Melk speculation, and he probably has a sore ankle.
Welcome to Yankee fandom.
But…that’s no fun…
I personally appreciate that it distracted me from work stress for a while and gave me baseball stress.
I’m still trying to figure out how Melky being in the lineup, the manager having a meeting with Swisher, and then Swisher replacing Melky in the lineup has ANYTHING AT ALL to do with Melky being traded.
Shouldn’t MELKY have been the one in the closed door meeting if he was being dealt?
Well, the yanking Melky from the lineup part could be a sign of a personnel move… But yeah, the Swisher meeting doesn’t fit that narrative.
Could be “true, true, but unrelated.” Maybe Melky IS being dealt, and the meeting with him occured earlier, escaping everyone’s notice. The later meeting with Swish was to gauge his interest in playing CF.
[It's probably Melky's ankle...but just sayin'...]
Melky is hardly this team’s problem..in fact 3 or 4 of them could use some of Melky’s enthusiasm. Melky is average-good outfielder on a team that has a handful of poor-average outfielder so lets stop bombing the Melk-man every chance we get. You want to search for a problem..go find the head case at 3rd base. I am now convinced the Yankees will continue to fall below expectations until they unload Kate’s man-toy. A-rod has his head every place but on the field.
I don’t think anyone thinks Melk is a “problem” and any excitement isn’t from getting rid of Melk, but instead for who they might be getting in return.
If A-Rod keeps hitting like he has been, then he is a liability. You have to assume that he will get better though and go on a hot streak at some point. The other problem is that the yanks have nobody who can replace him. Ransom/Berroa/Pena is not going to get that job done. Add that to Melky and Gardner, who often play in the same game, and the games Jorge gets off, and the Yanks are in trouble. Getting A-Rod going is a must.
Girardi saying the original lineup posted was incorrect. C’mon. If that is the case, that is ridiculous. I mean I know its nothing important, but now all this speculation and stuff.
Always something with Girardi….
What if it was a personal thing with Swish and he wanted to keep it private?
I dunno, again I know its not a big deal. But why post the lineup so early then or make a mistake in the lineup. Its always something.
Again no big deal I guess, but its little things like this with Girardi that is so annoying and leads to all this talk.
If the Yanks were winning, I don’t think this would be a big deal in the slightest.
How many issues could you make that statement about, lately? Good grief, we need them to win some games. Having every little issue dissected and discussed as if it’s somehow a symptom of something being wrong with the team/organization is quite tiresome
He made a lineup change about an hour before the game due to new information from Swisher. I don’t see how it is even possible to criticize him for that. It seems like you are looking for reasons to criticize him.
Im not criticizing, I dont care. But now there are rumors about Melky, and even some of the beat writers were speculating because of this lineup switch.
I think it would be far worse for him to make lineup decisions based on how it will affect beat writer speculations.
Has Chipper waxed Kim Jones?? Thats what that little exchange seemed like
If you want more comics like that, go to ctcsports.net.
Who got sent down for Ransom?
Hey BigBlueAL
how about the USA today against Spain?
I guess you didn’t see the last thread, so I’ll say it again. Please keep comments on topic. If you want to talk about USA soccer, do so in the game thread.
Gardner is a 4th OF. He is not an everyday player. I dont know if Melky is either though. Then again, I think Swisher might be a 4th OF too.
Girardi should manage the Mets. They seem to do well under asshole task masters like Bobby V.
How is swisher a 4th OF?
Wait let me answer my own question: his BA is .240!!1!
It’s atrocious!!!!11 To teh bench! I don’t care what his OBP or OPS is! 240 average! It burns!
Nick Swisher’s 2009 wOBA of .377 is tied with Ichiro for 18th best among all baseball outfielders. He’s outproducing Carl Crawford, Nelson Cruz, J.D. Drew, Curtis Granderson, Juan Pierre, Jermaine Dye, Carlos Lee, Bobby Abreu, Nate McLouth, Mike Cameron, Kosuke Fukudome, Nick Markakis, Jayson Werth, Matt Holliday, Jay Bruce, B.J. Upton, and several hundred others.
The question is not “Is Nick Swisher good enough to start for the Yankees?” That question is foolish, the answer is clearly yes. The question is, “Is Nick Swisher good enough to start for the American League in the All-Star Game?” I’d answer that question no. He’s good enough to be an All Star reserve, though.
Even my “eye” view tells me the team is better with Nick Swisher than they were with Bobby Abreu. I realize the stats are close…Bobby was on base alot, but Swish probably has a titch more power. Bobby ran better. Defense? Yikes…we all know who’s better in the OF.
Gardner and Melky are definitely 4/5 outfielders, but so far, they have put together a decent season. I’ don’t know if either of them can really keep it up though. They are bound to come back down to earth, and when that happens, it might not look pretty.
Swish is definitely a starting OF though. He may also be hitting above his head this year so far, but his history says he should be OK.
BRETT GARDNER ISN’T A STARTING OUTFIELDUH!!!!!
/Francesa’d
That is one thing he is right about.
This closed door meeting has me worried. Cash wouldn’t make the trip unless something happened. We all remember the trouble the Knicks got into at that strip club down in ATL. Maybe Swish was seen with a hook last night.
don’t overanalyze…the team’s been playing like shit, end of story.
Or was caught partying with Bobby Abreu and Cano.
I have a transcript of what went down in the Swisher closed door meeting.
Cash: Nick, if the ball is hit to you in the air, catch it.
Swish: Okay.
Joe: Oh, and if you’re on the bases, don’t get thrown out or doubled up.
Swish: Okay.
Joe: Hey, go get a decent fuckin haircut.
Swish: Nawww man.
Swisher was a late scratch from Wednesday’s lineup with an undisclosed injury, the Westchester Journal-News reports.
Recommendation: No word yet as to what the problem is, but Swisher had a closed door meeting with manager Joe Girardi and general manager Brian Cashman. Melky Cabrera will replace him in the lineup against the Braves on Wednesday.
(Rotowire.com)
Isnt he in the line up?
I think that’s reversed, no?
This is just what was posted on Yahoo
swisher is an OK OF. all star what are you smoking??
his lack of contact is a killer, his career high for RBI’s is in the 80’s.. corner OF need to do more then that. high OBP, bad contact hitter, avg fielder and avg speed at best, that =’s all star….no friggin way…
Reply button is your friend. Clicking on him will not bite you. And did you read the post? Or read part of it then went to say what thought about it?
His career high is 95 RBI’s.
Oh God, Cashman is quoted as saying Girardi is doing “an exceptional job”. My how the standards with the Yankees have declined.
remember Cashman also said we weren’t going after Damon or Texiera…
Cashman is not going to bash his manager in public no matter how crappy of a job hes going..
The dreaded vote of confidence?
Other comics from the series that Francoeur image comes from:
http://www.sportsargumentwiki......s_Club_Ads
I particularly like the Schilling one.
Someone needs to explain to me how nick swisher is a bench player. I am tired of hearing this from francesca 6 hours a day. Anyone who would put a guy with a 383 obp, an above 500 slugging percentage, and 13 homeruns on the bench for a light hitting 280 guy with speed is seriously deranged.
gardner is best served pitch running late in tight ball games, where he can be most effective