Derek: This time, it shouldn’t count

First Half Review: Catchers
Damaso Marte lives! (Or at least rehabs)

Derek Jeter is no novice when it comes to the All Star Game. Tonight is, in fact, his tenth appearance in the last twelve seasons, and the AL is 9-0 with Jeter on the team. Yesterday, when speaking of the Game and how it is truly about the fans, Jeter slammed baseball’s decision to have the outcome of the All Star Game count for anything. “I don’t like that,” Jeter said. “I just don’t think this should determine home field advantage. I’ve said that year in and year out. I think it adds some excitement and more people pay attention to the game, maybe, but I don’t think it’s necessarily a situation where players play harder because of it. Even when the game didn’t matter, players came and played hard.”

Nothing about the All Star Game makes it a good indicator of home field advantage for the World Series. It’s a glorified exhibition game put on for the fans, and it should have remained that way. If only Bud Selig would listen to the Yankee Captain.

First Half Review: Catchers
Damaso Marte lives! (Or at least rehabs)
  • Thomas A. Anderson

    Homefield should go to the league that wins interleague play during the season.

    It’s the fairest, most logical way to do this.

    Since that is the case, of course it’ll never happen.

    • RAB poster

      Absoutely right, + 1.

      • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

        If we don’t look at strength of schedule to apportion playoff spots, why should we use it to apportion home field advantage?

        • RAB poster

          Because at least you’re working in the same league.

          • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

            But being in the same league doesn’t eliminate the disproportionate difficulty of schedule issues. If the AL champion shouldn’t be penalized over the NL champion vis-a-vis homefield advantage because of the differences between the leagues, the AL East champ similarly shouldn’t be penalized over the AL Central or AL West champ vis-a-vis homefield advantage in the LCS and LDS.

            • RAB poster

              It doesn’t eliminate it, but it makes it much fairer.

              • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

                No, it just makes the arbitrary nature of it more consistent.

                I’d rather make the superior method of determining HFA during the LDS and LCS be extended to the World Series, not the other way around.

                • RAB poster

                  All right.

                • RAB poster

                  You’ve beaten me down with big words (yes I’m joking, I know what you’re saying).

                  But if some sort of system rating the difficulty of each division were devised, then I’d be all for using it in every playoff series.

                • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

                  You’ve beaten me down with big words (yes I’m joking, I know what you’re saying).

                  It’s my secret weapon: Vis-a-vis.

                  Seriously, though, I think using the strength of schedule idea is a bad one. Reward wins and losses. That’s enough. Don’t overcomplicate it.

                • RAB poster

                  All right.

                  No one is going to devise such a system anyway.

  • r.w.g.

    Home field advantage should just go to the team with the better record.

    If the Cardinals play the Yankees in the World Series, other national league players from other national league teams aren’t going to be on the Redbird roster. And vice versa. Why should players who have absolutely nothing to do with who is currently in the World Series have any impact on it at all?

    I understand the other arguments.. well they play in two different leagues and different rules.. competition levels and all that. Those, in my opinion, aren’t really good arguments. It’s still baseball.

    Wins and losses over the 162 game season.

    • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

      Home field advantage should just go to the team with the better record.

      That.

      • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

        +1

      • RAB poster

        Unfair. Their are tougher divisions within the leagues, and the AL is tougher thanthe NL.

        Home field advantage should go to whoever has the best record in interleague play.

        • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

          Unfair. Their are tougher divisions within the leagues, and the AL is tougher thanthe NL.

          True, but not the central point.

          The thing that makes the current format of the ASG determining home field is that it allows the actions of other players not on your team to control your team’s destiny. Your interleague play is just a more watered down version of that same problem.

          If you base it on each team’s individual record, it doesn’t make it 100% fair, but it makes it much closer to the desired result of an autonomous meritocracy system.

          If I’m Derek Jeter, even if I have to play a tougher schedule than the Cardinals or Braves, I want to be rewarded based on what MY TEAM does. If we won more games than the NL champion, we get home field. If not, we don’t. We don’t control our strength of schedule, but we still control our destiny.

          • RAB poster

            I always thought off the problem as one game not being enough to determine the superiority of either league, which is why I like basin it on the winner of the interleague play record.

            • RAB poster

              of is of, basin is basing.

            • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

              No, it’s about the intellectual disconnect between best records being sufficient to determine who gets into the playoffs but not to determine who plays at home.

              If we’re concerned about the strength of schedule discrepancies between the NL and AL and use some league-strength-test mechanism to decide it, why don’t we use intra-league, inter-division aggregate records to determine who has homefield advantage during the LCS and LDS? That’s an equitable concept, but nobody would suggest it in good faith.

              • RAB poster

                If someone took the time to devise such a system, I’d go for it actually. But nobody will.

        • Rob H.

          yeah but you would think the yankees could have run away with their interleague schedule and that wasn’t really the case since they went 10-8.

          However, I do agree with you that the best record should get the home field but as always Selig comes back with the logistics argument about how it takes all this time to book hotel rooms for all the people associated with the world series.

          • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

            Selig comes back with the logistics argument about how it takes all this time to book hotel rooms for all the people associated with the world series.

            Which is hot bullshit, btw. It’s not like it’s the Superbowl where you know what city the WS is going to be in a year in advance. Even with one league winning home field tonight, the date and city of game 1 won’t be known until mid October anyway.

            • Rob H.

              completely agree. But you can’t tell him that. Heaven forbid you call him on his B.S. it wont matter anyway.

            • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

              But it lowers the choices from 4-8, TSJC! It’s so much easier!

              Maybe I’m too young to remember, but I don’t recall there ever being travel problems for teams/media before this creation of Selig.

              • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

                From 8 to 4, rather. Man, I suck lately.

                • RAB poster

                  -1

              • Chris

                It’s not that simple. This isn’t a one game playoff, so you still need to set up logistics at the site that doesn’t have home field advantage, as well as transportation between sites.

                If you decide the league ahead of time, there are 4 cities that could have home field advantage and 4 that could be in the series, but not have home field.

                If you decide based on best record, then there are 7 cities that could have home field, and 7 that could not. If you add in the various permutations for travel between sites, then you have a very large number of possibilities.

                Of course, Selig’s excuse is still BS, even though it actually would be more difficult.

        • r.w.g.

          Good players on last place teams deciding which contending teams will get home field advantage is not something I can get behind.

          What if the Pirates went ballistic and swept all their interleague series and then went 0-fer the rest of the season, but their interleague run put the NL over the top?

          It’s just ridiculous.

          Best record, period. 6 or 7 or however many interleague series per team against pitchers you haven’t seen before deciding homefield is just not making sense to me.

          Everybody does interleague, every plays their divisional teams the same time (except the NL central which has an extra team.. do they get extra consideration?). Just be sensible and logical and make it based on 162 games played through the regular season. Or add in playoff records, too, I don’t care. But it’s got to be based on a totality of work by teams that are GOING TO BE THERE.

        • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

          If overall record determines HFA in every other round of the playoffs, why not the WS? Why should teams that have nothing to do with the WS, the other 28 teams aside from the participants, help decide who gets in the WS? What if the NL rep. had a kickass ILP record and the AL rep. had a shitty ILP record, but the AL happened to win ILP that year? It’s just as arbitrary as the ASG determining HFA, IMO.

  • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

    Bud Selig thinks that the current format of the ASG determining homefield advantage is just fine. His proof is the fact that the last 6 World Series have been evenly split at 3-3 despite the AL’s current ASG streak of dominance.

    Then again, Bud Selig also thinks it’s “unfathomable” than anyone could think the owners are guilty of collusion. I guess his proof of that is the fact that they were found guilty of collusion 4 times in the past 25 years.

    http://twitter.com/tsjc68/status/2636363777
    http://twitter.com/tsjc68/status/2636478784

    • Rob H.

      but none of those collusion cases came up when he was in “office” so obviously it could never happen now. But hey, what do you expect from a guy who can’t even say all 30 teams’ names right in his sport.

      • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

        But hey, what do you expect from a guy who can’t even say all 30 teams’ names right in his sport.

        Maybe that’s why he tried to assassinate the Twins and Expos. Too many names to remember.

  • Rob H.

    and unfortunately this doesn’t look to change anytime soon due to Selig having a patented old-person moment back when the All-Star game was tied the one year. He’s supposed to be the one in charge and able to make these tough decisions but was unable to do that and instead decided to look like a lost boy in the woods. Making an exhibition game mean anything at all is ridiculous and I’m glad some players think the same. This game is supposed to be for fun and making something meaningful like homefield advantage in the W.S. makes little sense.

  • Salty Buggah

    How about rock paper scissors or a coin flip? That’s just as fair (or unfair) as the ASG deciding homefield advantage.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Benjamin Kabak

      But only if we get some odd pairings.

      Hideki Matsui vs. the Phillie Phanatic in rock/paper/scissors.

      • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

        Mariner Moose represents the AL. Kung Fu Panda represents the NL. Marquis de Queensbury rules.

        • Salty Buggah

          I wonder if PEDs can help you in rock/paper/scissors?

          • The Fallen Phoenix

            Probably not, but I bet stealing signs can.

            • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

              Then the AL’s gotta hope A-Rod isn’t around. He’ll relay all the signs to the NL’s representative.

              • The Fallen Phoenix

                Well, there’s a reason why his peers didn’t select him to the All-Star game.

              • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

                Just to pad his own “homefield-not-having” stats.

          • thurdonpaul

            i almost pissed in my pants when i read that :)

  • VO

    The two teams who make it to the World Series should play a game of football for it. The team with the most players injured gets home field advantage. It’s only fair.

    • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

      I like it.

      Or, the franchise who has the most lifetime world series titles gets homefield advantange. I’d be fine with that as well.

      • RAB poster

        That’s my favorite idea so far.

        +1.

      • The Fallen Phoenix

        No, I think the franchise with the highest payroll should get home field advantage. The incompetence of teams like the Mariners and the Tigers have reduced the winning power of the dollar, and we all know baseball is a better sport when the best teams are the ones that bought their championships.

        It’s worked for the Red Sox this decade, after all.

        • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

          What about homefield advantage going to the team who’s owner has been suspended from baseball the most times?

          • http://www.youtube.com/kevyyankees Kevin

            Maybe we could use your 3 vs. 3 basketball tournament idea.

            • Salty Buggah

              I like it A-rod, Jeter, and CC will crush everyone. All 3 were varsity B-ball players.

            • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

              What about a game of flag football? We’ve got Pat White’s rights now…

              • The Fallen Phoenix

                Nah, the Yankees as a whole are not young and athletic enough. I don’t think Pat White would get enough protection from the D-Line.

                And the Cubs have Samardzija, who is already in their organization. White might not sign.

                Basketball’s a much better idea. Jackson’s the best PG in the league.

              • Salty Buggah

                That’ll work. Pat White can be QB/WR/RB. A-rod was recruited to play QB for Miami and I think they were good back then. CC is a good Center/DT. Gardy is a good RB. Slade/A-jax will be good too.

                We’ll win in almost every sport.

          • The Fallen Phoenix

            Because that would just put the power back into Selig’s hands. We need home-field advantage to be earned by a team’s front office, not determined by the whims of the commissioner.

            After all, that’s what started this ASG mess in the first place.

            • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

              We need home-field advantage to be earned by a team’s front office, not determined by the whims of the commissioner.

              The first thing I thought of when I read that line:

              “Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony!”

              http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOOTKA0aGI0

              • The Fallen Phoenix

                Or thunderous applause. I hear that’s how democracy dies, actually.

              • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

                I <3 you.

          • VO

            Or we can just let Varitek choose, he does have all those no-hitters.

            • RAB poster

              Hold on..I always thought that no-hitters were pitched by the person on the mound!

              And to think I’ve been misled all these years…

            • The Fallen Phoenix

              But Varitek can’t catch the knuckleball.

              • RAB poster

                And notice that Wakefield has no no-hitters, do you think that’s coincidence?

                He’s missing Varitek’s game calling!

    • Salty Buggah

      I like it. The Yanks will win as we have an average age of 172.6 years. The Red Sox can never win because their players have too much grit and will play through injury no matter what.

  • Chris

    Why not play a 7 game series between the LCS and the world series at a neutral site. The winner of that series can have home field advantage in the world series?

    • The Fallen Phoenix

      Only if the World Series goes back to Best-of-Nine, and the results from the Best-of-Seven get weighted somehow.

      We need to keep as much consistency between the Home Run Derby and the World Series as possible.

  • josh

    i agree that the ASG shouldnt determine HFA in the WS but i dont think they did this because the alternating HFA system wasnt working, i think they did it because they wanted to make the ASG more interesting for fans to watch. what would be some options to make the game more meaningful for the fans?

    • Little Bill

      Nothing. The ASG is an exhibition, nothing more. It’s importance pales in comparison to the WS. Putting HFA on the line in an exhibition is just ridiculous.

    • Little Bill

      One thing they could do is just to eliminate interleague play. This might restore some of the uniqueness to the ASG and the WS of the two leagues playing each other. Interleague play has run its course anyway.

    • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

      what would be some options to make the game more meaningful for the fans?

      One player from the losing team is executed.

      We could have fans text it in, American Idol style.

      • VO

        I like this idea.

  • Joseph M

    The World Series is different that the playoffs and championship series, both of which use best record. The two teams don’t play the same schedule so to compare records is ridiculous.

    My first vote would be to just rotate the series the way it was done for almost 100 years. My second choice would be to have the league the previous year’s World Series winner was from host the series. Last year the Phils won, therefore the 2009 World Series should start in the National League city.

    The worst choice is allowing the winner to be determined by the All Star Game which has nothing whatsoever to do with the World Series.

    • The Fallen Phoenix

      Yeah, but even competitors in the DS and LS don’t play the same schedule unless they happen to be from the same division, and that can only occur in the LS.

      • The Fallen Phoenix

        *LDS and LCS, rather. As for why rotation is stupid, see 2001. One can make a convincing argument that one of the reasons the Yankees lost that series simply because the National League happened to have home-field advantage that year, even though the Yankees had a better record than the Diamondbacks (and had beaten arguably the two best teams in baseball from the strongest division in baseball that year in the ALDS and ALCS).

        • The Fallen Phoenix

          …though to be fair (and to provide another rebuttal to my own point), the Diamondbacks did have a better 1st order run-differential than the Yankees that season. But the Yankees played against more teams over .500 than the Diamondbacks did, suggesting that the Yankees probably had a stronger strength-of-schedule…

          …point is, you’re not going to develop a perfect system, unless you turn to 2nd-or 3rd-order pythagorean standings, which account and weigh both run-differential and strength-of-schedule in determining a team’s “true” won-loss record.

          But MLB doesn’t use those standings to determine who makes the postseason; it uses a team’s actual records (by division), regardless of run-differential or strength-of-schedule. Ergo, home-field advantage should be awarded similarly – when divisional leaders compete, according to the one with the better record; when a wild-card team competes with a divisional leader, according to the divisional leader; when two wild-card teams compete, according to the wild-card team with the better record.

  • JGS

    What was wrong with what they did pre-2003? Just alternate HFA

    • Little Bill

      It was too arbitrary according to Selig. This way is much more rational and reasoned.

      • JGS

        and the outcome of one game is any less arbitrary? there is a reason why the season is so long. stupid Selig

    • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

      Both systems sucked.

      Best record does not suck.

  • toad

    I don’t know about HFA, but I have a suggestion that I’ve made before to make the ASG interesting. Have every player (and coach, if you like) designate a favorite charity. Then have MLB donate $100K each to the charities of the winners, and $50K to those of the losers. (Numbers arbitrary).

    That would create some interest, especially if the charities chosen were small local organizations. It would cost maybe $5 million, create a ton of good will and promotional material, and generate real interest in the game.

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