Jul
29
Wednesday trade deadline open thread spillover
ByLee to the Phils, Snell to the M’s, and hell, even Balentin to the Reds. We’ll be closing the comments to the first thread in a few, so make sure to get in your digs.
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Is it wrong to be happy by reading this?
GrEEn, Papelbon Combine for Loss | Oakland 9, Chokeland 8
The Theo Epstein Patchwork Plan at Shortstop Ain’t Working Again
Nothing Gained: The Jury Is Still Out on Mystery Man Clay Buchholz
OC Goes 3-for-5 with No Errors… Why Can’t We Get Shortstops Like That?
Even Nomah Goes 2-for-6, and No Errors at DH
Lone Bright Spot: J.D. Drew May Soon Earn His Salary
Can Manny Delcarmen Be Part of the Halladay Package?
Bard Would Have Closed It. No Question. No Doubt About It.
Papelbon Was Busy Thinking About His Weekly Media Gig
This Just In: Saito Blames the Red Sox Throwing Program for the Loss, Okajima, Too
The Oakland AAA’s Had 21 Hits vs. Boston Pitching. Unacceptable.
Rice Was Just a Side Dish Last Night
From Bostondirtbags
Even Nomah Goes 2-for-6, and No Errors at DH
That’s the best one.
Ha – I read that too. It made feel icky to read a BoSox Blog.
I cracked up when I read the web site with Papelbon in the dugout.
“• But if Boston decides it must have Roy Halladay, the Yankees will have to at least get in the mix somehow. I personally would do Joba and Jesus Montero for him, but that’s just me.”
Wow, PeteAbe is off his rocker. Thank goodness he’s a beat writer, and not a GM.
I know that trade would make his job writing articles easier for the next few weeks, but damn, that’s way too much to give up.
Not to mention, but if the idea is to WIN NOW AT ALL COSTS, I’d rather deal the reliever than the starter (Hughes instead of Joba).
They’re both starters next year, and Hughes could move to the rotation for the rest of the season and playoffs while Joba would have to miss some of that time. I don’t know that I have a preference between which one I’d prefer to trade.
As for Pete’s original comment, that’s certainly too much. The Yankees would need to get involved. Not necessarily get Halladay, but at least prevent the Red Sox from getting a Santana-to-the-Mets kind of deal.
I think Hughes is the more stable of the two so I’d vote for Joba and Montero if needed Jackson.
He’s in the media, it’s his job to make news. Defending the Yankees doesn’t get nearly as many hits as demanding a trade.
Balentien too? TRADER JACK’S GOING ALL IN, BABY!
I bet he trades for Scott Rolen next. Watch. In for a penny, in for a pound.
From the last thread since it didn’t get a chance to be discussed:
So, since J-Dukes is apparently available for a “modest” prospect, what exactly does that mean? Who would it take to get him? Starter or reliever? He’d have to start at this point, right? But are we confident in him holding up enough? There is probably room enough to add a starter but there’s also a starter to be added w/o giving away anything, and I think that’s a course that should be taken rather than looking instantly for outside help.
WLDR?
That’s what I was thinking.
WLDR?WDLR.
Unless he changed his names to Wilkin le da Rosa.
Whoops, my bad. Thanks.
You’ve shamed yourself.
Damn. I feel like jsb.
jeez, what’s with all the digs lately?
Football season’s around the corner. This is like training camp, I’m rounding back into shape with two-a-days.
I would say reliever now because of his health issues, but he could spot start a few times for Joba and gradually stretch out. I don’t think he can start now.
As for who it would be, supposedly it only takes a modest prospect or two, so some B prospects in the lower minors probably.
if hes just a reliever then theres no point of trading for him
How so? It’s not that different than trading for Chad Qualls or Scott Downs.
Again, he’s throwing in the minors now. He’ll probably be ready to join a big league rotation, as a starter, in 2-3 weeks.
He’ll probably be ready to join a big league rotation, as a starter, in 2-3 weeks.
I’m less enthusiastic than you.
He has started all of 27 games in the ML with all but 5 coming in 2008. He missed a chunk of 2005 with back spasms, he missed 36 games in 2006 with a bad elbow, he missed most of 2007 because of a bad hip, had surgery, missed the beginning of 2008 with a sore bicep, started 22 games, then sat out the rest of the season because of his hip again, had elbow surgery this spring, and has missed all of 2009 to this point. In the last seven seasons, he’s managed to pitch ~400 innings with 147 coming last season. And he’s 31.
My apologies, but 2 IP in Class A doesn’t make me optimistic that he’s ready to start in 2-3 weeks. Especially with the history of gimpy pitchers coming back from injury only to shoot right back to the DL as soon as they start letting it fly.
I know this is rehash territory, but if the Yankees are trading for the Duke, it’d be best to stick him in the pen, bring Hughes to the rotation. Or try and find a guy with a little better prognosis to pitch more than 30 innings.
MLBTR: Sean McAdam of the Boston Herald reports that the Red Sox are focused on their talks with the Blue Jays. However, Ryan Westmoreland and Casey Kelly are “off-limits” and the Red Sox want to keep Daniel Bard.
Shorter version: It’s not gonna happen.
Can we have Halladay? You can pick any of our prospects, except the good ones.
So saying “according to industry sources” and “A baseball source with knowledge of the Red Sox thinking…” basically translates to – “A person who knows nothing really but can speculate and make wild ass guesses and assumptions…
Is Casey Kelly really all that great?
On the mound, he’s like a cross between Sandy Koufax and Tom Seaver. At shortstop, he’s like a combination of Ozzie Smith and Honus Wagner.
For Diamond Cutters, I’m Peter Gammons, ESPN.
As long as his tears don’t cure cancer, we’re good then
Did they rule out Rocco Baldelli, Smoltz and Saito too? You know, because they’re going to help the Red Sox win the World Series.
Hughes will be signing autographs at a local mall next month. Why would they trade him if he is scheduled to appear at our mall. Sheesh!
What mall?
Roosevelt Field Mall on Long Island.
what? when? i live there. i can has phil’s autograph?? DETAILS MAN!
sonuvabitch. it’s a weekday. and long before i’d be able to get there from work.
stupid real life and job…
take the day off, if you bring enough stuff to be signed you could make up selling some of it in any lost wages.
The good thing about our situation is we can always add a reliever and put Hughes back in the rotation and move Mitre as a long man/piggy back on Joba’s innings limitations.
* the yankees situation… unless I marry into the “brenner Family.
Yup. You could say that Phil Hughes is like our “golden ticket”.
And you’re too much of a Pussy to Cash(men) it in.
/Ben Aflecked
wah waaaaaaaaaaah
http://www.sadtrombone.com
Agreed.
SI.com’s Jon Heyman says the Giants are in serious talks for Sanchez. The teams are discussing John Bowker, Kevin Frandsen and Jesus Guzman.
If I was a pirates fan I walk the plank right now…
Hmm, shouldn’t they be looking to add a power bat?
why? they’re trading overpaid guys who have 1 or 2 years left on their contract. they’re finally stocking their farm system
Agreed. The Pirates knew they were gonna suck this year. They gave away a bunch of guys who aren’t special and probably don’t amount to much for a good haul of younger talent.
Trust me, a few years from now, nobody in Pittsburgh will be pining for the days of Eric Hinske, Nyjer Morgan, Freddy Sanchez, Adam LaRoche, and Nate McLouth. That team is taking a baby step forward.
exactly. they were going to lose 90 games with those guys anyways. i guess you could make the argument of move McLouth to a corner OF and hold on to him but they got a good haul
You make trades for 2 reasons:
1. To get better now and thus put you on top for a championship.
2. To get better long term with younger and cheaper players.
we lost 90 games with you. we can lose 90 games without you/
Especially when 3 years from now when The Bronx’s own Pedro Alvarez is hitting 35+ HR a year, then those shitty players really become an after thought.
Alvarez, McCutchen, Milledge, Gorkys, Doumit, Diaz, Jaramillo, Clement, Cedeño, LaRoche, Pearce, Tabata, Tony Sanchez, and Miguel Angel Saño (probably)
+
Duke, Maholm, Ohlendorf, Gorzelanny, Locke, Morton, McCutchen, Morris
There’s the beginnings of a team there. They’re still way too many pitchers short, but another couple drafts and making smart decisions in free agency… there’s green shoots.
You mean they shouldn’t trade Rajai Davis for Matt Morris?
and pay all of morris’s salary?
No, they shouldn’t.
Neal Huntington >>>>>>> Cam Bonifay and Dave Littlefield
Agreed. The Pirates knew they were gonna suck.
this year.They gave away a bunch of guys who aren’t special and probably don’t amount to much for a good haul of younger talent.They pretty much have to do this though. Hopefully they can get lucky with a few of these prospects and contend in a few years.
Look for Cash to add a bat and a starter/reliever in the same deal, just as he did last year with Nady/Marte. Duchsherer and Kennedy to take Ransom’s spot for a duo of modest ’spects, perhaps?
Who would the bat replace? Maybe if he can get a CF, but I doubt that will happen.
Mike Cameron could still be a possibility, now that the Brewers are 4.5 out and below .500.
He really isn’t. Come on, man.
Why wouldn’t Cameron be a possibility?
Dependent on price, he’s a perfect fit for this team. Always has been.
“Dependent on price” being the key words.
He’s essentially Nick Swisher:
.249/.356/.447, 14 HRs
Which is more power than Melky (.287/.353/.434, 8 HRs).
5.9 UZR/150 is down from last year, but still good and better than Melky (-3.9).
But, unlike Swisher, he can play CF. And well.
Hehe, since 2006, the average Pedroia homer traveled just 369.7 feet. This is the shortest average distance of any player with at least 30 homers in that span. And he has never hit one to center field or right field…NEVER!
That’s why he’s having a power outage and why Fenway is the only reason he’s hitting HRs. He only averages 373.7 feet per homer away from Boston.
Here’s the source:
http://online.wsj.com/article/.....jie/6month
I remember reading last year that he’s never hit a 400 foot homerun. And people say Yankee Stadium inflates homeruns, can you imagine if they played in Fenway 81 times a year?
Also, his career splits are
Home – .333/.391/.494
Away – .288/.351/.409
plus he can’t hit the high inside fastball
He sounds like a rich man’s Ian Kinsler.
Yea but Melky and Damon are 6th and 7th on the list of shortest HRs. Mike Lowell is 2nd, another Fenway guy.
Yeah Damon has been helped by not only the new YS but the old one too.
Still though he has more power than expected.
Melky and Damon aren’t going to win MVP awards. There’s nothing wrong with hitting the shortest homeruns in baseball (someone has to), the problem is when that person is supposed to be a middle of the order bat.
A hitter benefitting from the frindley confines of Fenway Park? Who Knew.
Well, Pedroia’s road OPS of .760 is only a fraction worse than Jim Rice’s road Ops (.789). But, as we all know, Pedroia is the “most feared hitter” of his generation just like Rice.
On Pedroia: I wish people in the MSM would stop acting like he was some diamond in the rough. The dude was a 2nd round pick; he wasn’t some undrafted free agent that the front office found in a stroke of genius or some late-round risk/reward pick.
But…he’s so gritty…
And he’s just such a little guy…..how cute
And his Lucky Charms cereal is so delicious.
And he has the family pedigree. All the Pedroias are bred for success
Yea, I know huh? Not only that, he’s incredibly overrated as a player (kinda like Kinsler)
Kinsler is still a pretty solid player. Sad thing is, last year when Pedroia won the MVP he wasn’t even the best 2B in the AL.
He’s a solid player in the same way that Matt Holliday is a great player, or Dante Bichette was a solid player.
So if Halladay isn’t traded, this could be a critical blow for JP for the simple fact that Halladay’s Value decreases from this point foward once the trading deadline comes and goes.
it would be a bigger blow if he trades him for less talent just to cash in on his value.
Naw, he’ll still have plenty of value come this offseason. The only way this really kills him is if Halladay demands a trade and takes all the leverage away from JP
there is no difference if he demands it or not at this point. with one year left on the deal come the offseason his value is lower than it is right now when you have a shot at two titles not one.
I’ll say the Sox pick up V-Mart and the Yankees get either Scott Downs or Duchscherer
I hope we get Duchscherer anyway.
He is my target as well.
I’d take both. A bullpen of Mo, Downs, Duchscherer, Coke, Bruney, Melancon, and Ace would be just sick. Also, it’d allow either Duchscherer or Hughes (or Ace I suppose but he apparently has some shoulder fatigue which doesn’t help his case) to go to the rotation.
Any chance the Orioles deal George Sherrill within the division? And what would it probably take from the Yankees to get him?
Probably more than we want to part with. The hot rumor is Sherrill to the Dodgers, who have been dangling elite lefty reliever prospect Scott Elbert.
Would it take someone like McAllister or more like one of The Untouchables? I read that too but I don’t know enough about Elbert to compare him to someone in the Yanks organization.
Elbert = Melancon, except he gets a bonus for being a lefty, so I’d say maybe Ivan Nova?
Gracias
Remember when Elbert was a top SP prospect?
I think he can be a top notch reliever.
But can he pitch the 8th?
I wonder if Sanchez is upset that his girlfriend got traded to the Mariners.
J.P. should demand a package of Buccholz, Lars, Bowden, a high ceiling prospect, and a major-league ready player. Probably best package he could get now. Dodgers won’t give up Billingsley/Kershaw, Yanks wont give up Hughes/Joba, Brew Crew wont give up Gamel/Escobar. But the Sox seem focused on getting V-Mart who now seems available. But the Yanks should be fine. They do need to pick up another starter a la Washburn. The M’s will ask for a lot, but Washburn is in his walk year and will only be Type B, so I wouldn’t give up much more than McAlister. Zach Duke, Garland, Doug Davis, and many others are still available. J-Dukes is an option coming out of rehab, but is a risk.
From Buster Olney’s Twitter:
Reports: Victor Martinez will be traded by the deadline. Red Sox most likely destination.
2 minutes ago from web
The Red Sox are out of the Halladay sweepstakes. Lester is untouchable.
8 minutes ago from web
Red Sox deal for Halladay is unlikely, to focus attention on trading for Victor Martinez.
about 1 hour ago from web
Does that mean the Jays asked for Lester? Wow, they really are looking to be “wowed” in order to trade Doc if that’s true.
Olney doesn;’t have a Twitter. It’s a fake account.
^^ That is why I hate Twitter.
And this knowingly fake Michael Kay account is why I love Twitter.
https://twitter.com/yesmichaelkay
https://twitter.com/yesmichaelkay/status/2880797901
This is one of my favorites
https://twitter.com/yesmichaelkay/status/1789584417
https://twitter.com/yesmichaelkay/status/2869247417
Theo lives a charmed life. If Cashman had Ortiz, Lowell, Youkilis, LaRoche, and Victor Martinez (all DH-1B essentially)on his roster at the same time, he’d be a laughingstock.
Interesting, it is going to take quite the haul to get Martinez. I wont mind it as it takes a lot away from their farm and goes to another team that’s not in the division (though still in the AL).
It’s not real.
http://twitter.com/mlbtraderum.....2914621291
Buchholz, Hagadone, and Reddick? That sounds like what they’ll do for Martinez. They can keep Bowden, Bard, Kelly, and Westmoreland, but they’d still need two arms and a bat, I’d guess.
J.P. really missed his oppurtunity at getting a decent package. Think Happ, Taylor, Marson, and Carrasco could have been had.
or the Dodgers become worried because they were going after Lee so now they offer a better deal for Doc. we’ll see aug 1st
has there been any word with Ben Sheets coming back from his injury? didnt the Rangers have a foot in the door in regards to signing him
ETA: 2010
With all the problems Wang has been having lately (that’s what she said) I wouldn’t be surprised if we targeted Sheets for our 5th starter next season.
Here’s my plan to fix the rotation: Melky to the pen, Hughes to the rotation, Jeter to center, Pena to SS.
Problem solved. Now to solve all the others I’ve created…
The headline on ESPN.com is ” Phillies come up Aces.”…. ha, sorry
So the only possible move I can see the Sox making is for Victor Martinez. Does a trade like that make them that much better?
Yes, but not a significant difference.
UPDATE, 5:22 p.m.: Yankees obtained RHP Jason Hirsch from Colorado for a PTBNL. He was sent to AAA. – PeteAbe
So are we doing the whole let’s obtain randoms and see how they work out?
PLAN THE PARADE, BABY!!!!!
Here’s his Cube page
http://www.thebaseballcube.com.....irsh.shtml
No ‘c’ BTW.
Yeah I saw. But I copied it right from him.
We’d get better production out of Igawa no?
PLAN
THE
PARADE!!!
Our preemptive strike to the sox getting Halladay
Yes, we needed to counter with another pitcher who’s name begins with an ‘H’.
its like a mitre AAA replacement.
I guess we should pray for the Sox to get Victor Martinez. If they do, they’re almost definitely out of the Halladay bidding with the package he’d command.
That would leave . . . . lil’ old Cash as the only bidder?
So Buchholz, plus Bowden the untouchable, add in penny, saito, and random player with a really Caucasian name gets it done?
I wasn’t thinking Bucholtz would be moved for V-Mart, just that whatever the package it would be a 3-4 player deal of good prospects, and to do ANOTHER 3-4 players deal for Halladay would either leave their system barren or not be enough to satisfy JP.
Despite what Peter Gammons and Mike Francesa tell you, nobody has 8 great MLB ready prospects in their system.
The sox don’t have 8, they have 100
You forgot this
/Gammons’d
Forgetting the Dodgers.
Nope. JP seems to only like the guys on their MLB roster, and Billingsley and Kershaw are going nowhere.
Still doesn’t make me want to give up Hughes, Joba, or Montero in a deal for him.
Unless it was Montero as the only legit prospect that was involved.
i dont see Halladay going anywhere at this point. JP is not going to want to admit defeat that way. he should still sell the Rolen’s and Downs of the world.
I agree, and I’d rather do quantity over quality myself. But without any high end return, JP might decide to pass for now and just deal him in the off season.
I still think the best fit (which also gets his price down) is to figure out how to get Rios in the deal. Then it can be a 6-2 deal and maybe we keep Montero and everyone (meaningful) on our MLB roster. Anyone else, I deal no problem.
Z-Mac, Nova, Jairo, Higashioka, Romine, and Bleich!
28 teams would revolt
add in the other Zach plus Melky and IPK and i think we have a winner!
No smarty pants. More like
A-Jax, Cervelli/Romine, Z-Mac, Melancon, Manny Bauelos, D-Rob/Alby.
Like what the Phillies just did with the Indians. That’s a decent package, just not any top tier guys.
I’d like that but I’d sure miss Cervelli and the opportunity to watch Ajax.
they dont have the farm to do the move all their best of the last couple years are up. elbert and change for sherill is the most likely move for them.
Exactly. The guys we all heard about for years (Loney, Kershaw, Billingley, Kemp) are all MLB regulars now.
forgetting Either and Broxton
Very Interesting POTENTIALLY:
“4:39pm: Bill Shaikin and Mike DiGiovanna of the LA Times report that the Dodgers have discussed softening their stance on Chad Billingsley and would consider making him available in a trade, but they’re still not expected to do so.”
If they make Billingsley available JP has to take that and run away before the dodgers wake up.
Yeah, probably. Billingsley would be the single best player he’s heard of so far, and probably better than anything he’d get in the winter, too.
Not much meat on those bones.
Why in the world would the Giants give up Tim Alderson for Freddy Sanchez?