Dec
06

Cameron not an option for the outfield?

By

One candidate for the Yankees’ left field vacancy might not be one for much longer. Mike Cameron was a decent alternative to Damon, but he may no longer be an option. Will Carrol tweets that the Cubs are ready to sign Cameron, pending a trade of Milton Bradley.

Cubs signing of Mike Cameron is waiting on deal of Milton Bradley, which has been “imminent” for about 72 hours.

The Rays seem to be in the lead for Bradley, with Pat Burrell heading to Chicago. Then there’s the issue of money — Bradley still has two years and #21 million left on his contract, so the Cub will probably pay a portion of that to off-set the dollar discrepancy.

If Cameron is off the table and Bay and Holliday aren’t options, it looks like Damon is the last hope. He’s not atop the priority list, but it looks like he’ll be important for the Yanks if they want to upgrade their current left field situation, which would presumably be Melky Cabrera.

Glove slap, the recently redesigned TYU.

Categories : Hot Stove League
  • http://thetundrablog.blogspot.com/ Jake H

    I don’t think the Cameron signing is as close as WIll Carrol is saying. He is the only guy repoting that since a bunch of different writers are saying that the deal isn’t that close at all.

    • NYYplayfor28

      I agree.

  • 28 next year

    he has to be getting multiple years for him to not even wait for teh Yankees. He knows he will get a one year deal with the Yankees would top anyone but teh Cubs probably are giving him two years.

  • crawdaddie

    If Burrell is heading to the Cubs and they sign Cameron then how many outfield positions do the Cubs have open?

    Also, the Cameron signing will be a sign for what Damon can expect since there is only 10 months difference in their ages.

    • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

      Yeah, I find that curious. Unless they’re really sour on Soriano and are going to sit him, I don’t see where Burrell would fit.

      • Steve H

        I’ve heard that Burrell could be headed to the Mets for Castillo, Mets then sign O-Dawg.

        • crawdaddie

          If so then that makes sense, at least for the Cubs.

    • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

      Soriano in LF, Cameron in CF, Burrell/Fukodome in RF?

      • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

        Perhaps. But I think Fukodome’s earned the starting spot after back to back good on base years (81 and 93 BBs the last two years) with a decent–.142–IsoP.

        • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

          Well Pinella hates him, and they’re committed to dumping Bradley, so they’re in kind of a tough spot.

          • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

            Why does Lou hate him?

            • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

              He’s Lou?

              That’s what I’d go with.

              • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

                Touche.

              • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-Melvin-To-America/193013541601?ref=nf Andy in Sunny Daytona

                Lou believes in tough love. It’s like battered wife syndrome, abuse the players to the point to where they think they need the manager’s approval to finally succeed.

                btw Tommie. Jesus’ brother is in, why aren’t you?

                • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

                  btw Tommie. Jesus’ brother is in, why aren’t you?

                  In what?

                • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-Melvin-To-America/193013541601?ref=nf Andy in Sunny Daytona

                  My name link.

                • Steve H

                  Is Jesus’ brother also name Jesus?

                • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-Melvin-To-America/193013541601?ref=nf Andy in Sunny Daytona

                  Si.

    • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

      That’s what I was trying to figure out as well.

      I don’t see how swapping one overpaid corner OF/DH in Bradley for another in Burrell factors into the decision to get or not get Mike Cameron.

      Especially since money would be exchanged to make the financial impact of the swap nil.

      How Cameron is related to the Bradley-Burrell swap escapes me.

      • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

        See, you’re problem is that you expect the Cubs to act rationally.

        • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

          Good point.

      • Ed Yarnall

        The Cubs need to sign Cameron so they replace Bradley with Burrell so they can trade Soriano to the Yankees…for Edwar Ramirez AND Eric Wordekemper.

        Mindsplosion

        • Crazy Eyes Killa

          I don’t even know if we would do that, next to Wells he has pretty much the worst contract in baseball

  • Reggie C.

    Can’t blame Cameron if he’s getting offered a 2 year contract. I’m not sure if the Cubs are going to contend with the Cards, but WC isn’t out of the question. Cubs are probably likely to give Cam the full-time CF job.

    • crawdaddie

      I’m just saying the Cubs have more trades to do if they sign Cameron and will most likely have to eat somebody’s contract beyond Milton like Fukudome or Burrell.

  • Steve H

    In my best Nancy Kerrigan voice: “Whyyyyyyyyyyyy??????”

    • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

      Haha, TCWA.

  • mike

    this signing, if true, IMO will really show the market the other outfielders can expect as far as $.

    I would think other FA like Damon felt Abreu was a panic move by the Halos, but if Cameron takes less $, and it appears Figgins is getting less $/years than everyone predicted, then I thich hink Damon becomes less likely to return – both because of the Mexican standoff likely with NYY/ Boras and because of the (slightly) discounted rate other players may receive allowing the Yanks to get in on Bay or Holliday

    • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

      I don’t know how much I would make of the Figgins deal. Everyone kind of expected the Phillies to be in on a third baseman, and then they signed Polanco to move him over. Which affects everyone else’s market sure, at least at said position, but I don’t know how much affect it has on everyone else.

      • J

        I think Figgins did alright on years. I believe I read it’s 4 years with a vesting option for a fifth; can’t really expect more then that. Maybe 9 million is a little less then he would have gotten 4 years ago, but a 4 or 5 year deal is about right now or then.

        • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

          Yeah, if he signs for 4 years/$36M it’s basically $1M per less than people thought, which really isn’t much difference at all when you take Philly out of the market.

  • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

    If this signing is a reality, then I expect the ’10 Yankees to look almost identical to the ’09 Yankees.

    • Aj

      Which wouldn’t be a bad thing. The only problem now is that Boras has the Yanks by the balls if all the outfielders sign elsewhere.

      • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

        No, it definitely wouldn’t be a bad thing. It’s just gonna be a bitch to most likely have to rely on Gardbrera for CF again.

        • Aj

          Well, to all the Cameron lovers, if Melky and Gardner play great CF defense, wouldn’t it balance out? But then again, there’s no power between those two.

          • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

            It’s not just that Cameron plays good defense, it’s that he’s a good hitter as well. His bat plays beautifully in CF and he’d be a safe bet to out-do either Melky or Gardner.

            Basically, if they roll w/the same OF as last year, they’ve gotta bank on Melky either repeating ’09, or growing on it slightly.

            • Stryker

              and the jury is still out on whether or not melky cabrera’s 2009 was really a turning point or just luck.

      • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

        I don’t know about that. There’s still the trade market, and the prospect of Carl Crawford.

        • Aj

          Crawfords not free til next year. And there’s no way Tampa trades him within the division.

          • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

            Right, but waiting a year for Crawford > over-committing to Damon.

        • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

          Meh, just wait on Crawford.

    • scoopemup

      If so, Ajax will get a long look in ST.

      • Johan Iz My Brohan

        I hope, he most likely won’t be the opening day starter, but I do see him as a huge contributor in the second half.

        • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

          Not trying to be a Debbie Downer here, but I’d temper my expectations on Jackson being a “huge contributor” in ’09. I’m not saying he’s going to be bad or that he won’t do well, but essentially expecting him to be contributing in a big way is just setting yourself up for disappointment.

          • Tony

            I see you bashing AJax every single time his name is mentioned. I would love to see a full investigation into the matter… are you Brett Gardner’s agent?

      • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

        I really don’t think he’s gonna make the team before like…June or July at the earliest.

  • Januz

    I have never been a Cameron fan, and I don’t get the love for him here. I am HAPPY he is NOT going to the Yankees (Particularly not at a $5-7m multi-year contract). I would prefer going with Gardner, Melky, and Swisher, and either making a trade in July (Adam Dunn?), or bringing up Austin Jackson (If he is ready).
    Let me give some Cameron numbers, to illustrate my point: Last year, he struck out 156 times and hit .250. He has struck out over 100 times TWELVE times (Out of 13 complete seasons). He has struck out 1,798 times in his career, while knocking in 100 times ONCE, and he NEVER scored 100 runs. Is he a great fielder? Well he won THREE Gold Gloves I give him credit for that. However, Paul Blair (Another glove first, Centerfielder) won EIGHT. Amdruw Jones, another big strikeout, good glove CF, struck out 1,542 times in 11 FULL seasons (Pretty comperable), But Jones also knocked in 100 or more runs FOUR times, scored 100 or more runs THREE times, and has COUNT THEM TEN Gold Gloves. Jones, of course, is a direct contemporary of Cameron.
    There is NOTHING in those numbers to suggest that he is worth 1/10 of what the Cubs are paying him. Thank God, he is not coming here.

    • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

      If you look at batting average and strikeouts, Cameron’s not gonna be your guy. He hits for a low average and he strikes out a good deal. However, if you look at other things–like on base skills and power–Mike Cameron’s a damn good player.

      He averages about 75 walks per 162 and between 20-25 homers. Out of CF, that’s incredible production. Add in the fact that he plays great defense and he becomes an even bigger value.

      As Mike posted yesterday, he’s one of seven guys to post an OPS+ of at least 104 in eleven straight years. The only other players to do that? A-Rod, Vlad, Chipper, Magglio, Abreu, and Manny.

    • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

      Also, what do Paul Blair and Andruw Jones have to do with Mike Cameron? Absolutely nothing. You throw their names out there and offer no reason as to why you’re throwing them out there.

      Sure, Jones and Cameron are contemporaries but they have very little to do with each other. Cameron’s been a mark of consistency, whereas Jones fell off of a cliff at age 30. Just because they’ve played the same position during the same time period doesn’t mean that what happened to Jones will happen to Cameron.

    • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-Melvin-To-America/193013541601?ref=nf Andy in Sunny Daytona

      I agree. Signing Paul Blair would be a horrible idea.

      • Steve H

        What about as a PH off the bench?

        • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-Melvin-To-America/193013541601?ref=nf Andy in Sunny Daytona

          A 66-year old Paul Blair or a 27-year old Brett Gardner? Hhhhmmmm? It’s a toss up.

    • steve (different one)

      you don’t like strikeouts, but you want to trade for Dunn?

    • Zack

      just BECAUSE you type LIKE this doesnt GIVE you an EDGE on the discussion

    • Pasqua

      “I would prefer going with Gardner, Melky, and Swisher”

      All due respect, but I would love to see you re-visit this comment in May, should it come to pass.

  • Michael Kay

    OH NOOES! What will The Yankees do without Mike Cameron?

    • whozat

      Commit too many years to someone else? Or play inferior players? Or give up chips in trade so that they don’t have to do either of the preceding?

  • dee

    no thanks to Cameron. i prefer DeJesus or Willingham.

    • Zack

      what are you willing to trade?

    • theyankeewarrior

      sign cameron for one year >>>>>>>>>>>>> give up prospects for players that Austin Jackson and Carl Crawford are going to play over in 2011

    • whozat

      Why? Dejesus is less of a defender and not really a better hitter. Cameron is certainly more consistent year-over-year with the bat. Willingham is a better hitter, but a poor defender. Cameron’s defense + offense roughly = Damon’s 2009 contribution. Either of those other dudes are worse, AND they cost prospects in trade.

      • Steve H

        +23

  • steve (different one)

    if Damon walks, there is also the trade market. perhaps Cashman is eyeing someone we haven’t even thought about yet.

    let’s not paint ourselves into the corner where losing Cameron means it’s Damon or no one.

    what if the Tigers were willing to eat $6M on Magglio? would the Yankees bite on $12M/1 for Ordonez, banking on his huge second half? they might. still saves $12M for the Tigers.

    • Zack

      No. Ordonez has a 15m vesting option for next year too.

      • Steve O.

        Yeah, that wouldn’t be a disaster.

        • Zack

          To have him for 2yrs/27m? Why not just resign Damon?

          • Steve O.

            Oh what was I thinking, I can never forget to remember:

            /Sarcasm.

            • Zack

              ah should have picked up on that

      • steve (different one)

        Ordonez has a 15m vesting option for next year too.

        for real? wow, screw that.

        • Steve O.

          Yeah, the Tigers made a mistake by letting his option vest for 2010.

          • OldYanksFan

            Are you kidding? Fatty Cabrera may be an asshole and I don’t like his work ethic at all… but with the bat, he’s a STUD! A .925 career OPS at 26… before his prime years? If Matsui and JD were worth $13m last year, you don’t think Cabby is worth $15m/yr????

            Frankly, if we got him as a DH, the rest of baseball might boycott the Yankees.

    • http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside

      That’s not enough for the Tigers.

      Taking back a non-prospect for Maggs (which is the only way it makes sense for us) is not worth it just to save 12M. They’re Detroit, not Florida.

      • steve (different one)

        i was too lazy to check Cot’s before running my mouth, so forget Ordonez.

        my larger point holds. there may be another player that is not on our radar yet.

        i would support a Cameron signing, but i’m not jumping off a bridge if the Cubs get him. thatsallimsaying.

  • theyankeewarrior

    I know the Yankees have a plan here, but I can’t imagine that letting all the available FA’s sign elsewhere and then working out a deal with Damon is their plan.

    I’ve said it a million times and I’ll say it again: It doesn’t matter who else we sign, Mike Cameron is perfect for the Yankees.

    He can play anywhere in the OF and provides depth. The same way Swisher did last season (except he’s an above average CF so it makes even more sense).

    Please let this rumor be false.

    • http://pinstripepalace.blogspot.com/ Brien Jackson

      That doesn’t mean we will or can make him the best offer though.

    • steve (different one)

      Cashman has said that the Yankees have “several plans”. they have a bunch of various strategies they will try to execute on, depending on where the market heads.

      i’d be shocked, if in a down market, the richest team is left out in the cold with NO ONE in their OF.

      it might not be Cameron in LF, but it won’t be Melky either.

  • http://www.secondavenuesagas.com Benjamin Kabak

    For what it’s worth, we’ve heard from other sources since then that the Cameron-to-the-Cubs rumor has little truth to it. We’ll see.

    • Steve H

      Worth a lot to me. Holding out hope on Cameron. CC needs to make a phone call.

      • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

        Yessir.

  • Pingback: Cameron No Longer an Option? | Bronx Baseball Daily

  • Free Mike Vick

    DIE Mike Cameron rumors…DIE!

    ::stuffs a RAB nerd in a locker::

    • Jack

      What don’t you like about Cameron?

      • Steve H

        Batting average/RBI I’d guess. Those ever important stats.

      • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

        One to three of the following:

        –Age
        –Strikeouts
        –Batting Average

        • Free Mike Vick

          well BAVG, RBI and K’s aren’t the big things for me. Although i don’t like him striking out 160 times. and I do have concerns with him being 37 years old.

          but more importantly the yankees won a championship with Melky and Gardy playing CF…with Melky getting some big hits for the team. and since they would be a cheaper options and likely come close to the production minus the HRs. i like those 2 over Cameron.

          • steve (different one)

            or not.

          • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

            Yeah, they won that championship in spite of two below average center fielders, not because of them. Just because they were able to skate by with it doesn’t mean they should look to do it again. I’m not very confident in Cabrera repeating 2009, either. He’s going to start getting too expensive for what he is soon. Cameron, even with a higher salary than Cabrera and Gardner combined, could likely bring back more value than both of them combined. In fact, he did that last year with a crappy second half.

      • steve (different one)

        before we jump on this guy, i thought he meant “Die (Cameron to the Cubs) Rumors!”

        • steve (different one)

          he was just saying “The Mike Cameron Rumors, The!” in German

          /Sideshow Bob

          • TheLastClown

            Niiiiice.

            Die Bart…die!

  • r.w.g.

    The Yankees should take the money they were going to spend on Mike Cameron and use it towards other, unnamed, down the road, potentially, maybe, by some chance, some day players.

  • steve (different one)

    Arguelles to the Royals. nice pickup by them.

    • whozat

      Keep it on topic

      • steve (different one)

        meant to reply to the post above mine, which i assumed was about Chapman. but i admit i may be assuming in the make-an-ass-of-u-and-me sense.

        • r.w.g.

          My post? I’m unclear if you’re talking about mine so if this is all wrong, forgive me.

          No I wasn’t talking about Chapman. I was making fun of, half seriously and half jokingly, of all the people who are against signing Matt Holliday or trading for Roy Halladay who constantly give the logic that the money needs to be saved for “other players”.

          I saw half seriously because Holliday and Halladay would make the current much better and are significant upgrades. I saw half jokingly because I do understand player value and the importance of payroll flexibility.

  • Steve H

    What do you Cameron haters think of Torii Hunter?

    • http://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-Melvin-To-America/193013541601?ref=nf Andy in Sunny Daytona

      Too many “i”‘s in his name. It’s kinda girly.

      • Tom Swift

        On the other other hand, there is no “i” in “team” (though there is a “me”). /Non sequitur

    • Joe B.

      Granted I’m not a Cameron hater, but the two players are pretty different. Hunter is a better all-around player both at the plate and, I’d say, on defense as well.

      • Steve H

        How?

        • Steve H

          Hmmm. Still waiting.

      • http://bronxbaseballdaily.com Matt ACTY/BBD

        Really? Is Hunter better at the plate? They have identical 107 OPS+ marks for their careers. Cameron’s got a .004 advantage in wOBA, .347-.343. As for the field, Hunter’s career UZR/150 in CF is -2.1. Cameron’s is 5.7.

        • Steve H

          OPS+
          Cameron 107
          Hunter 107

          162 Game Average
          Cameron 23 HR’s, 26 Steals, .340 OBP, .788 OPS, 107 OPS+
          Hunter 25 HR’s, 18 Steals .330 OBP, .801 OPS, 107 OPS+

          Defensively
          UZR last 3 years in CF
          Cameron -10.2, +11.3, +10.0
          Hunter -6.0, -11.5, -1.4

    • slappy white

      Hunter is far superior to cameron because he has played with the two most fundamentally sound teams in the AL, you know teams that play the game the “right way” and never make mistakes that cost themselves playoff wins

      • dkidd

        he also has a winning smile

      • Steve H

        You might be on to something with this.

  • Michael Kay

    The quest for Mike Cameron reminds me much of Eric Cartman’s wanting a “future telling” device very badly.

    • TheLastClown

      Think of the POWER!!!

  • Stephen Martell

    Guys its ok, Damon will come back and hold Left Field until Carl Crawford comes to town in 2011!!!!

  • http://rg22 B Germano

    Why would I want Mike Cameron and who really cares where he goes? There are so many options for Left Field should Damon go elsewhere…2 years max on him. Outfielders and offense are a dime a dozen (except for The Mets). Pitching, Pitching and more Pitching.

  • anonymous

    What about trading for Curtis Granderson and using melky in left?