Dec
13

Football open thread

By

The Kellen Clemens led Jets are in Tampa at 1pm ET, but the Giants don’t play until a little later tonight. Use this thread for all your gridiron talk.

Categories : Asides, Not Baseball

202 Comments»

  1. Teix is the Man says:

    It’s times like these I wonder why I’m a Bills fan.

  2. Ace says:

    Can someone explain to me why baseball radio broadcasters are expected to be non-partial to their team, but football announcers are blatant “homers” and no one cares?

  3. Evil Empire says:

    This from Buster Olney’s blog today (emphasis mine):

    “Heard this: There are a handful of teams willing to give veteran outfielder Brian Giles a deal for 2010, and the Reds and Yankees might be among those. The primary question about Giles’s future employment is whether he’ll get a major league contract before spring training, or a minor league deal.”

    Where would we rate this on the bullshit meter? 11 out of 10?

    • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

      I don’t how much he has left plus he is a douche, but he is a career 136 OPS+ player. Wouldn’t hurt to check him out as a DH. Maybe a low base deal with some incentives?

      • Evil Empire says:

        Brian Giles the awesome masher is long gone. I guess if we need some AAA depth then maybe, but its hard to see him being good enough at this stage in his career to ever actually play in YSIII

        • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

          What kind of injury did he have last year? He had good stats as recently as 2008, so maybe there is something left. You’re right, though, there’s probably not much. Is till could see some team to try to get something out of him.

          • Evil Empire says:

            Agreed, could definitely see the guy getting the job in the NL like the Reds as Olney reports, or maybe some non-contender in the AL who needs a part time fielder/DH.

            But not the Yankees.

            • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

              There are definately worse options out there, some team will bring him in. Not sure if he could play the field anymore, so DH for a team in AL would make sense.

    • Andy in Sunny Daytona says:

      This would be awesome………if it was 2001.

    • Drew says:

      Wow I never realized how many good years he’s had.

      I guess that’s what playing your career in Pitt and SD will do to you.

    • Evil Empire says:

      I mean, if the Yankees wanted Brian Giles, why wouldn’t they want Johnny Gomes or even Eric Hinske instead?

      Even if he does have gas in the tank, there are much better, significantly younger options that could be had for a comparable salary (maybe $1M or $2M more since Giles might be willing to play for the minimum salary)

      • scooter says:

        Gomes seemed to make sense – then I looked at his fielding numbers vs Hinske’s

        This article was a revelation:
        http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs.....rket-again

        Had no idea Hinske had above-average range in the OF.

        Gomes on the other hand? Here’s his UZR over the last 3 seasons in the OF:
        -23.8
        -57.4 (!)
        -23.4

        Gomes sure looks like a platoon-DH only – makes Jack Cust look like a Gold Glove outfielder

        Giles was beyond awful in 2009 – including an awful UZR. I’d assume it was at least partly due to injuries, but at his age, I don’t see much bounce-back potential

        For a bench role, I’d pick Hinske

  4. Andy in Sunny Daytona says:

    Turner Gill takes the head coaching job at Kansas. Awesome move by Kansas IMHO.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/.....id=4737280

    • Evil Empire says:

      Agreed. Turner Gill is a really good coach, he turned Buffalo into a not-horrendous program, and that’s saying something.

      • Andy in Sunny Daytona says:

        I never knew that Buffalo was a D1 school until last year, so yeah, what he did was impressive.

        • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

          And Upstate New York is such a recruiting hotbed for football. All kinds of guys are dying to go to Buffalo.

          He must be thrilled to get out of there (not that Kansas is awesome or anything).

          • He must be thrilled to get out of there (not that Kansas is awesome or anything).

            Mangino put that program back on the map, though, making Gill’s job a buttload easier, because elite prospects do actually consider going there now.

            Think of it this way: Aqib Talib was a first rounder two years ago. Dezmon Briscoe has a good shot to be a first rounder this draft. That would be two first round picks in the past 5 years.

            Kansas had one first rounder in the FIFTEEN years before that (Dana Stubblefield).

            • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

              Yeah, definitely. His job is infinitely easier now. It’s not Middle Tennessee State or anything—it’s a well-known program. He’s a smart guy with charisma and a good scheme at a place with high expectations. I think players will gravitate toward that.

              Still, personally, you wouldn’t catch me in the Midwest if I had offers to play on either coast. Just sayin’.

        • scooter says:

          The only time I had seen Buffalo play was back in the 90s – they got crushed by Boston University at Nickerson Field (which was part of what used to be Braves Field – where the the Boston Braves used to play).

          Here’s the history of the program:
          http://ubspectrum.com/article/34331

          Had no idea former Jet great Gerry Philbin played there.

          Gill’s done a tremendous job there – and he deserves a shot at a big-time program. A class act – and a stark contrast to Mangino

    • Seconded. Gill knows how to scheme and coach. Now, he’ll have a power-conference school’s cache to use in recruiting.

      Nebraska’s solid but far from all the way back; Colorado’s still a mess, Missouri is solid but still Mizzou, K-State’s subpar; Iowa State’s irrelevant. Gill could turn KU into a power again and run that division.

      • Evil Empire says:

        I also think the fact that Gill is African American will significantly help his recruitment. You’d have to think that will have a certain appeal to other top prospects who are black.

        I hope that doesn’t come off as at all racist, its just that there is such a ridiculous drought of black coaches in NCAA football.

  5. Evil Empire says:

    How ridiculous would it be if the Jets ended up somehow tied for first place at the end of the day?

    C’mon Carolina and Jacksonville!

    • I think we should probably be rooting for Miami and not Jacksonville.

      Having the Dolphins also at 7-6 making it a three-way tie instead of a two-way tie isn’t great, but dropping the Jags to 7-6 instead of 8-5 is worth it overall. The wildcard is a more realistic goal than the division at the moment anyway, because we don’t own any of the tiebreakers with the Pats/Fish.

      • Evil Empire says:

        Hmm. I don’t know. You may be right but its very difficult for me to start rooting for the Dolphins in week 14 when we still have a valid shot to win the AFC East if a couple things go our way. At least as long as the Jets win, they’re very much in the discussion. That’s good enough for me at this point.

  6. Drew says:

    Dang Salty, the Bronco’s are getting worked early.

  7. Evil Empire says:

    CHONE’s projections for pitchers were put up recently, and they seem to be as negative and pessimistic as one would expect.

    http://www.baseballprojection.com/

    • Drew says:

      Ugh. I guess they think Al will have a “down” year. That makes a ton of sense.

      • Evil Empire says:

        I ask this in all seriousness, is there any player CHONE projects to have a notably better year in 2010 than 2009? I can’t find any, not that I’ve liked all that hard besides reviewing the Yankees’ pitchers.

        • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

          Most of our pitchers should go for a 6.50 ERA. Sounds about right?

          (FWIW, they predict Wieters to be markedly better in 2010 than he was in 2009.)

          • Evil Empire says:

            Heh, Matt Wieters … that’s the type of player it takes. The system would be officially broke if he projected to be replacement level-ish, no one would ever give it any credit.

            I could almost believe that the guys that run that system manually overwrote whatever it said Wieters would do, just to save face.

            • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

              Only one player on the A’s even projects to hit over .270—Kurt Suzuki. I’m not saying they’ll be world-beaters, but c’mon, one guy hitting over .270? Really?

              And they didn’t even predict Strasburgh!

              • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

                Not a single player on the Angels hits .300, either.

                These ratings are ridiculous. Who takes these seriously?

                • Evil Empire says:

                  CHONE is filled with hate and loathing. It is vindictive, negative, and sees nothing good in mankind.

                  It’s like the bitter, lesser sibling of Bill James’ predictions, doing everything it can to make life miserable for all those around it.

                • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

                  True. It’s like they look at Bill James and go for the inverse.

    • Steve H says:

      Mo with an era over 3?

    • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

      George Kontos making 18 starts? Considering the TJ surgery, I’ll take the under.

    • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

      Meh, Bill James predicts 75 guys to have Cy Young-caliber seasons (exaggeration, but you get the point).

  8. ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

    Drew Brees is just a beauty to watch when he is on. Hope he loses his mojo in time for next Sunday’s game.

    • Mike Pop says:

      +1

      I’m worried bout the season though. Whatev happens happens but let’s hope Philly does indeed win tonight.

      • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

        The loss against the Giants stings. I don’t see us winning at New Orleans, honestly. We just have to win the other three games which will be hard enough. The Chargers are hot, that will be a pretty tough game today. I’m guite concerned about the season, too.

        • Mike Pop says:

          3-1 would be ideal, but like you said – it’s a huge task. That’s what kills about the 2nd Gmen loss(which I was at). They played a great game, just pwned the ‘boys.

          2-2 is more likely, but does 10 games get them in the playoffs?

          Arg, all they had to do was beat the g-men ;(

          • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

            We should have won both games againts the Giants. 10 wins might be enough if Philly wins today, but there is not one sure game left on our schedule, so winning two more will be hard enough.

            • Mike Pop says:

              Week 2, definitely. Threw that game away, there’s no question bout it. Kind of threw the Broncos game away too because of Jason Garret being an idiot. This past game, they just outplayed Dallas. Sucked, but what could you do. There was some bad calls on both sides, but Gmen played well.

              Didn’t understand why the Cowboys kept running the ball so much, Romo was dominating, give him more chances. I know you have to keep it somewhat balanced but Romo was tearing them up! I’m glad him and Roy worked well(even though there was probably a roy Will offensive interference one or two times) but they looked good until that last play where he just overthrew Roy.

              I had my RW jersey on so I was having a good ol’ time.

              The Skins/Eagles are probably the most winnable games left. I’m real excited for the Chargers today though. Should be fun. New Orleans is tough obviously, but they can’t sleep on the ‘boys. Almost lost to the Skins last week.

              • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

                You can argue we could have won all the games we lost. Green Bay game was winnable, too.

                Romo threw 55 times last week, how many more passes should he have had?

                Skins and Eagels are definately the most winnable games left, but I could see us losing those games. We almost lost at home to the Skins and as you said, they were close against the Saints. Hopefully we can win today to make this stupid “Cowboys can’t win in December” talk stop. Kinda reminds me of A-Rod and the playoffs.

                • Mike Pop says:

                  He should have thrown like 75 man!!! Hah. After MB3 fumbled, I was so pissed. Just felt like they couldn’t get anything going with the run, so screw it. Just keep passing. I guess the play calling was fine.

                  Definitely though. The Cowboys could go 3-1, or lose all 4. That’s just the way they are.

                  I also get tired of the December talk. It’s true that they’ve played well, but that doesn’t mean they can’t. Whole new season, previous years don’t matter. It’s also funny how Gmen fans get at you about it too when the Giants are 12-13 in December under Eli(got that from a friend, trusting it’s correct).

                • Mike Pop says:

                  ‘true that they have not played well’ in that last paragraph

                  fixed

                • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

                  You were there and not me, so I take your word for it. Just thougt 55 passes is a lot and maybe some rushing would have helped.

                  The inconsistency sucks, but it has been like this for years now.

                  I don’t care what the Giants fans say, I fear it’s in the player’s head already. At least Romo had a very good game last week, so he doesn’t get the blame this time.

  9. Kellen Clemens is costing himself an assload of money today.

    Goodbye, “Let’s give this guy a shot and see if he can be a diamond in the rough starting QB”, hello career backup.

  10. Mike Pop says:

    Heh. Schaub has thrown for 336 yards… in the 1st half.

  11. Evil Empire says:

    Haha oh man, fuckin’ NoMaas. They just can’t help themselves when it comes to some people:

    http://nomaas.org/blog/wp-cont.....philly.jpg

    • ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

      Just saw that myself. I read his name before seeing the picture and immediately knew what the picture would be about.

  12. Salty Buggah says:

    Colts’ fans are so fuckin boring! That stadium is super quiet. You can hear every single thing the players are doing. And the Colts are winning too.

  13. Ugh.

    Shonn Greene: yes yes yes yes YES YES YES YES OH NO OH NO OH SHIT

  14. Salty Buggah says:

    Damnit Knowshon! Stop.Stutter.Stepping!

    He’s struggling today. The Indy D is good and he’s kinda hurt (and tired with Buckhalter hurt again) but he is definitely not playing well. Falling down and stopping for no reason all over.

    Ugh sloppy game today. Orton goes down so fuckin easily.

  15. Josh Freeman has a bright future, IMO, but he needs to develop a better mental clock. His line is getting shredded, but he’s getting pulled down from behind way too much. You gotta throw those balls away.

    • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

      He had the same problems at K-State. Great arm, questionable pocket awareness, difficulty reading coverages. If he can figure out some of the mental parts (and hopefully he does), that dude can be a star.

    • Andy in Sunny Daytona says:

      I agree. I look forward to watching him in the future. But now? Watching Tampa play football is like sea urchin, it’s even worse than it looks.

  16. Salty Buggah says:

    Uh, what the fuck? Orton fell down trying to handoff the ball to the RB. Dude’s weak. He reminds of Brian Griese. Just walks out of bounds everytime he’s near the sidelines. Also, he just falls down when touched by a defensive players.

    Aaaaand he just threw a pick in the endzone. Great.

  17. JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

    Anyone in New York/New Jersey —how are the roads? I have some errands to run but I’m borrowing a friend’s car and their breaks are bad, the tires bald and the check engine light comes on all the time.

    Not sure I want to risk it for some groceries…

  18. Salty Buggah says:

    We all know pitcher wins are overrated. Do you guys feel the same way for QB wins? Orton is one of the winningest QBs in history for the number of games he’s started but he really does stink.

  19. Evil Empire says:

    I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, the 2nd Romeo Crennel Coors Light commercial is one of the greatest cinematic achievements in the history of mankind.

  20. Mike Pop says:

    One of my favorite Reno 911 moments:

    http://www.beaned.com/videoshow.php?id=1032

  21. Salty Buggah says:

    Whoever had B-Marsh in fantasy today must be very very very happy. This guys is a beast and really hard to bring down. He has 15 catches with 2 mins still to go in the 3rd quarter.

  22. Salty Buggah says:

    Broncos – first team to intercept Peyton Manning three times since Nov. 11, 2007 (San Diego, 6).

  23. Evil Empire says:

    This from ESPN Rumors:

    “If the market were for Holliday were to remain relatively stalled, could the deep-pocketed Yankees get in the mix, just as they did with Mark Teixeira last season? Phil Rogers of the Chicago Tribune wonders if the Yankees are flying under the radar regarding Holliday and adds “a lot of rival executives are suspicious of the Yankees’ leaked plans to cut payroll.”"

    I honestly do not see the Yankees signing Matt Holliday (not that I’d complain if they did), but I do love just how much Cashman & Co. is inside the heads of everyone else in baseball. No one is ever willing to count them out of any bidding race until the player inks a deal. No agent ever wants one of their premiere players to sign until a thorough sit down with the Yankees’ FO is had. Its awesome. Everyone in baseball – GMs, agents, players – knows exactly who their Daddy is. Its good to be The King.

  24. My Bears fan friend just texted me this:

    “Jay Cutler has now thrown more interceptions in a single season than any Bears QB since 1949. And he still has three more games left this season.”

    • Salty Buggah says:

      A lot is his fault but the guy has no help whatsoever on offense. Bad receivers and a bad O-line.

      • I believe KC Joyner of thefootballscientist.com developed some stat roughly called “Bad QB Decisions” and Cutler has lead the league in bad decision percentage, by a wide margin, every single year he’s been in the league.

        • Salty Buggah says:

          Yea, thats true. He gets frustrating at times. The main reason I wanted to keep him was because I though McD could help him fix those bad decision.

          • Steve H says:

            It’s not too often that a QB who makes bad decisions turns it around though. Dude has thrown thousands of passes in the NFL and still doesn’t get it.

        • Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster) says:

          Cutler was never good. Eerybody thought he would make the Bears’ shitty rceivers get better, but it was always the other way around. Cutler had a bomb for an arm but was a terribly innaccurate QB and a bad decision maker. His good receivers would just catch enough of his passes to inflate his numbers. Now he has shitty receivers and all the good stats he had are down and the picks are still up.

  25. Salty Buggah says:

    Gotta give props to McD and Nolan. They always have good adjustments. The D was sucking to begin with but now the Broncos have totally killed the Colts offense.

  26. Mike Pop says:

    Darelle Revis.

  27. Evil Empire says:

    Hello, my name is Darrelle Revis. I intercept footballs.

  28. Dela G says:

    darrelle revis = good at football

  29. ClayBuchholzLovesLaptops says:

    Wow, Saints. Faking a FG right there?

  30. Salty Buggah says:

    TD MARSHALL!!! Ties the NFL record with 20 catches. He dropped a couple too so hopefully he breaks the record.

  31. Riddering says:

    Cardiac Colts strike again.

  32. Riddering says:

    Collie, you beautiful bastard, it’s about time you did something right.

  33. Salty Buggah says:

    Damnit. Manning was 2 of his last 15 on throws until that completion. Cmon Broncos, one more TD and they get the lead. Gotta keep stopping them.

  34. Josh Freeman: You had no idea what you were doing there, did you?

  35. Salty Buggah says:

    FUCK! Broncos stopped the RB in the backfield but missed the tackle. They did that 3 times this drive.

  36. Riddering says:

    Roughest performance of the season so far from Peyton and he still gets it done.

  37. Salty Buggah says:

    Ugh, TD Colts. That should do it.

    Tough loss for the Broncos. They played pretty well after starting off poorly. They just needed a bit more to overcome the Colts. Moreno had a tough game and couldn’t get anything going. They didn’t convert about 4 3rd and 1′s and got a lot of crippling penalties (most on 3rd down). The offense missed a lot of opportunities. So close but you have to play mistake-free to beat the Colts.

    • Salty Buggah says:

      They also had some bad playcalling at times. They just didn’t convert the short-yardage 3rd downs while the Colts did for the most part.

  38. Salty Buggah says:

    Looks like B-Marsh wont break the receptions record. Orton sacked but B-Marsh was open.

  39. Salty Buggah says:

    And B-Marsh has broken the NFL receptions record with 21 in the game

  40. JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

    Late on this but why do teams bother throwing near Revis?

  41. JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

    The Raiders have returned to their regularly scheduled futility.

  42. Sammy Morris: 6 car, 35 yards, 0 receptions, 0 TD.

    Looks like the first half of my “Start Devin Thomas and bench Sammy Morris” advice to Pablo Zevallos was sound…

  43. Salty Buggah says:

    Let’s go Cowboys. Beat the Chargers

  44. Evil Empire says:

    LT!

    My man.

  45. Jets day recap:
    beat TB: good
    MIA beats JAX: good (still tied with MIA, but now also tied with JAX)
    NE beats CAR: doesn’t help (but expecting otherwise was a pipedream)
    BAL beats DET: see above
    IND beats DEN: helps (only one game back of Broncos now)
    MIN beats CIN: helps (still two back of Bengals, but they may be sliding)
    PIT, HOU, TEN: all fairly irrelevant since we’ve got a game on them already and need to win out anyway, but a Titans loss would be nice too.

    I’m now rooting for the Cowboys now (every loss of an AFC team in front of us is a good thing). The interesting game will be the Thursday nighter next week: Colts at Jaguars.

    I’d love the Jags to lose another game so we can move fully in front of them with a win over the Falcons next week, but I wonder if the Jags beating the Colts and ending their quest for perfection would nudge them towards resting their guys and giving us a layup victory in Week 16… in that case, we could be 9-6 going into a final game against the Bengals at the Meadowlands. And they’ve looked soft recently.

    In any event, by the end of Week 14, Jets will be 7-6, effectively two games back of the division but more importantly, in a 4 way tie for the final wildcard spot.

    Still in play.

    • Evil Empire says:

      Damn you and your logic, TSJC. God damn you.

      I might actually have to root for the Cowboys. Fucking motherfucker. You’re right. Grr that really bothers me but my loyalty to the Jets > my hatred for the Cowboys.

  46. Riddering says:

    http://lifestyle.msn.com/relat.....;GT1=32023

    I never knew JMK and Kerry Rhodes had so much in common.

    • Cosmo: What is something that women don’t know about men?
      Tony: “When we act like we aren’t listening, we really are. We hear everything you have said, but most likely just don’t want to address it or answer your questions. But ladies, we do hear you. We hear everything.”

      … nah, we’re not really listening. Seriously, I have no idea what the fuck you were just babbling about.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pB-4avmAR0 (NSFW)

    • JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

      For the last time, you guys have the wrong idea about me. I don’t actively seek fat girls. I just don’t turn them down (or more accurately, virtually anything human with a pulse and a vagina). I think that’s a notable difference. I like anorexics just as much as the next guy (but not bulimics; I hate wasting money).

  47. JMK THE OVERSHARE's Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor says:

    Epic red zone fail for the Cowboys.

    • Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster) says:

      And then the interception and Nick Folk misses the FG.

      Could be a great day for the G-men if they beat Philly. As much as I want NO to lose, Atlanta losing helps the Giants much more.

  48. Evil Empire says:

    Oh man, poor Damarcus Ware.

    I really help that guy is ok, that was a vicious hit. I hate his team but he is an awesome football player. No one deserves to get fucked up like that.

    • Evil Empire says:

      All right, he gave a thumbs up!

      /sigh of relief

      Hopefully he’s 100% ok.

      • Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster) says:

        Conversation w/my cousin:

        Cousin: O man, Ware’s really hurt. That’s huge! That’ll really hurt Dallas later on.
        RRR: Forget that. He’s really hurt. I really hope he’s not paralyzed. That’s happened before, man. I really hope he’s all right.
        Cousin: O, that too.

        • Evil Empire says:

          Yeah, there comes a point where your humanity needs beats out your fandom. The standings in a game that I have zero vested interest in (besides emotionally) are not above the well being of a human being.

  49. slappy white says:

    anyone know (or care) why Gradkowski out of Raider game?

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