Open Thread: Those clouds look ominous


Photo Credit: Paul Sancya, AP

Well, there was just too much rain in the Motor City, so tonight’s game was postponed. The Yanks and Tigers are going to play two tomorrow, the first at 1:05pm ET and the second at 7:05pm ET. Not sure what this means for the roster moves, but Javy Vazquez will get the ball in game one, Phil Hughes in game two.

For now, just sit back and enjoy this nice refreshing open thread. The Mets are playing the Nationals, plus there’s NBA and NHL playoff action. Also, ESPn is showing some E:60 thing about Mariano Rivera and where he grew up in Panama and stuff at 7pm ET, so don’t miss it. You know what to do .

Categories : Open Thread


  1. Dave says:

    Postponed! Just reported on YES

  2. JGS says:

    Are both games going to be on YES tomorrow or does My9 still have one?

  3. Poopy Pants says:

    Is this good or bad for the Yanks? Probably good?

  4. WIlliam says:


  5. bexarama says:

    E:60 segment on Mariano right now.

  6. pat says:

    Of course the games on free TV get fucked up by rain. Mother nature hates poor people.


  7. Total Domination (The Commenter Formerly Known as Ben) says:

    E:60 piece on Mo is amazing. So badass

  8. Drew says:

    Ugh.. It’s going to stop raining in a few minutes.. I don’t understand this move.

  9. Eirias says:

    Why is MLBTV showing a kid hitting a ball off a tee for the Mets game?

    There’s a myriad of jokes to be made there.

  10. Hangoverologist says:

    I’m watching the Mets game to ease my boredom. I wanted to see if Javy’s belated start was going to be any good.

  11. JobaWockeeZ says:

    On the Mo documentary some old lady was eating at his restaurant and asked “Who are you?” to Mo. I facepalmed.

  12. Total Domination (The Commenter Formerly Known as Ben) says:

    Mariano has known his wife since they were in Kindergarten. Thats adorable

  13. pat says:

    Dammit I’m legit pissed off. Everything was aligned perfectly for a night of viewing. The lady is out at a birthday party, I have 9 imported beers in the fridge, and I found and old bag of ummmm… oregano.

  14. JobaWockeeZ says:

    Did they just call Heyward’s first homer a historic swing? Really? Did they say the same thing when Marcus Thames hit one off Randy Johnson?

  15. Hangoverologist says:

    Lol Niese just gave up a three run jack to Adam Dunn. In the first inning.

  16. Hey ZZ says:


    If you want to continue the discussion over here, I responded to your Hughes/Joba response in the Vazquez thread.

    • TheLastClown says:

      For sure, let me go read it.

    • TheLastClown says:

      Ok. I see what you’re saying, but couldn’t the same things be said of Hughes as a starter before this year? Mechanical problems, confidence issues, a straight, hittable FB. Aside from his “flash in the pan” starts previous to this year, he was pretty mediocre as a MLB starter.

      Now I don’t mean this as any kind of indictment on Hughes, but I also don’t think that the same indictment should be made of Joba. The arguments have taken dead-horse beating to a new level, but it seems to me that the reasoning behind Hughes-as-starter *excepting his performance so far this year* is somehow the same reasoning behind Joba-as-reliever.

      Coming into the season, Hughes actually had better numbers as a reliever, and Joba as a starter. SSS obviously abound, but why not give Joba the same chance as Hughes?

      Hughes has had so much more time to develop than Joba that it’s no wonder he has a better grasp on his own abilities. I just think Joba, too, should get the same treatment. Don’t you think Joba 2008 had that “elite fastball?” Maybe a year of being in the pen will increase his confidence, and he’ll hone some more repeatable mechanics, just like Hughes. Maybe not, but why preclude the possibility?

      After all, wouldn’t you want two of this young studs in the rotation?

      • Hey ZZ says:

        I am all for the Yankees revisiting Joba to the rotation next year conditional of course on his performance this year.

        My original comment was to someone saying I they would rather have Joba in the rotation this year. I think at this point it is incredibly difficult to argue against the Yankee decision to go with Hughes.

        What the future holds for Joba, I have no idea. In 2008 he looked fantastic in the rotation. He had an arm every organization in baseball would die for especially since he was maintaining velocity on his fastball so consistently.

        2009 really was a huge step backwards for him and I think that is what is the biggest problem. Not just in the results but of who he was as a pitcher. His stuff was completely underwhelming, his mechanics/release point were awful, and he seemed to be laboring every inning barring a few good starts. A young starter hitting some bumps in the road likely played a role, but it was so much more than that.

        I think the Yankees looked at Hughes and Joba this offseason and spring training and picked out the guy they could rely on. They probably put the past stats in the background and just evaluated the guys as pitchers.

        Joba still had a long way to go back in ST to get back to someone you could reasonably predict could go out there and give you 6+ innings of quality baseball 30 times year. It was not until last night we even saw a glimpse of “old Joba.”

        Basically my point was that on May 11th, Phil is way ahead of Joba as a major league pitcher. It is up to Joba now to show the Yankees what he can do and change that in the future.

        • TheLastClown says:

          We’re mostly in agreement. I am in no way trying to argue against the decision they made with Hughes, just hoping they’ll make a similar decision for Joba next year.

          Final point: Many many top-shelf starters had rough beginnings that were even less indicative of future greatness than Joba.

          Halladay had 2+ seasons of bad performance before he figured it out & put it together, It took Randy Johnson about 6!

          I only took exception because you said “light years ahead.” Given a year of what Hughes had last year could set Joba up to close that gap next year. It’s hard to close gaps of light years.

      • chriskeo says:

        I’m with you and hope the Yankees take that path, but we will see, I think he future may already be sealed in the pen. It will be a sad day for all of us.

        If you remember the day they announced the 5th starter, everyone was up in arms about Joba having to go to the pen. (I think Matt Imbrogno felt strongly about this at the time as well.

        • TheLastClown says:

          And hey, it’s not like they released him. They may not be using him to his fullest potential if they keep him ‘penned, but we’ll have a dominant closer, and that’s not bad.

        • bexarama says:

          I think almost everyone here was annoyed. I mean, I still kinda am. You see still see comments about it and they are pretty well-deserved.

          That said, the “the organization doesn’t care about developing starting pitching” stuff was a little overblown to me. It’s not like Phil Hughes is chopped liver. For a while, people were so pessimistic it was hard to get excited about Hughes himself. Thankfully, with how he’s been pitching, it’s easy to be excited now. :D

          • TheLastClown says:

            Yeah, all types of this.

            Though had they sent Joba down to start in Scranton we’d be a little better equipped to handle the double barreled loveliness of Javy’s start & Andy’s injury, no?

            Ha, it’s just so hard not to gripe about, but Hughes performance has flipped the script to a gray lining on the silver cloud. Well done Philly-my-boy!

            • bexarama says:

              I agree with all of this.

              But when you have people genuinely wishing that AJ gets hurt and Andy completely loses it this year just so they can be all “I told you so” to the organization, well… (For the record, no one here did this, but I saw it in other places.)

      • MikeD says:

        I’m still in favor of Joba in the rotation. They spent a year building up his innings, screwed around with him the last two months, which is when he did his worst pitching, and then when he was set for a “Joba-free-rules” season, they throw him back in the pen. I’d rather have seen Joba and Hughes holding down the fourth and fifth slots in the rotation this year.

        When Joba was in the minors, he was rated a better prospect than Hughes, which is saying a lot, since Hughes was very highly regarded. As a starter in AA, Joba was averaging 96 with his fastball, and touching 98. Keith Law scouted him in AA and said he was still hitting 97 late in the games, meaning he held his velocity. We used to see that when Joba was starting in 2008 prior to the August arm issue. I was encouraged to see Joba hit 98 on the radar gun last night, since that’s the highest reading on him since 2008. I don’t know if the gun was juiced (seemed like everyone was throwing hard), but if Joba ever regains his elite fastball, then the Yankees should give him another shot.

        Maybe that’s their plan. The pen seemed to help Hughes last year. Maybe it will help Joba this year. Watching Vazquez and Hughes and Joba, more than ever I’m coming to believe that confidence can add two to three miles to a fastball, and a lack of confidence can have the opposite effect.

  17. TheLastClown says:

    Tidbit for the open thread.

    My lovely lady (who, incidentally, coined the much-used term RABbis for our hosts) really liked Sheffield when he was mashing for us. Then he left, and starting running his mouth about Joe Torre’s anti-black sentiments or whatever, and he fell out of favor with her, so she took her seam-ripper and removed the name from the back of her Sheffield jersey.

    Sheffield, as you might remember, wore 11. As does out gravelly, intestine-y CFer. After his great start, she went out to the store & bought new letters, and is now sewing them onto her old jersey.

    I just love it.

    • pat says:

      Hahah, that’s awesome.

    • JGS says:

      Nice effort, but why bother with letters at all?

    • Hey ZZ says:

      Your GF should also probably become a big Cliff Lee fan now so he is our number 1 offseason target instead of Crawford lol.

      • TheLastClown says:

        Hopefully BG keeps it up & the FO doesn’t have to think about Crawford.

        • Hey ZZ says:

          That would be nice and it seems promising that he can.

          • JobaWockeeZ says:

            I still fail to see how it’s promising. It’s a SSS. It’s a goo start but he could fall apart anytime. Especially when his 2010 numbers aren’t close to career norms. Except for defense.

            • TheLastClown says:

              He hasn’t played in MLB long enough to establish “career norms.”

              We agree that he’s playing over his true talent level currently, but even when he regresses a bit, is it that crazy to think he can OBP .350? That’s a dropoff of .60+! Quite a regression considering he’s not going to get slower or stop legging out infield hits.

              And if he can OBP .350, IMO he’s a better *and cheaper* option than Crawford.

            • Hey ZZ says:

              Just on a personal basis for young players I don’t put a lot of stock in career norms. In general player’s don’t follow linear development plans and for young guys the jumps can be drastic and take them down very different paths.

              I have seen that to an extent with Gardner this year.

              I posted something about it earlier today, but Gardner really had an abysmal swing for his skillset. It was just an ugly hack and it made no sense for who he was. Him and Long this offseason really have retooled his swing and he now has a very level and compact swing that allows him to drive the ball on the ground.

              Last season Gardner popped the ball up in the infield 15% (!) of the time. That means his speed (his greatest tool by far) was completely wasted 15% of the time because all you can do there is just jog to the dugout. Michael Bourn a player with a very similar skillset popped it up in the IF 4.3% of the time last year. This year Gardner has cut it down to 4.8% like Bourn.

              Gardner walked 9.2% of the time last year and is up to 11.6% this year. He K’d 16% of the time last year (another waste of his speed). Down to 12.5% this year. GB% is also up from from 49% to 57.3% which is great for a guy that fast.

              He is swinging less overall, but it seems that instead of just swinging at everything he can get his bat on, he is waiting for the right pitch he can handle. He is very confident with 2 strikes which is very impressive for a young player.

              Biggest difference is his swing though which is leading to a lot of these changes. I am encouraged and I think he is going to end the season with good numbers.

    • Total Domination (The Commenter Formerly Known as Ben) says:

      you have a prize – I need to find a girl like that

  18. 28 this year says:

    So if anyone remembers the guy I talked about who said Jonathan Niese is far better than AJ Burnett and a bunch of other stupid comments about the Mets being better than the Yankees, I got a new one to bring up.

    Today he makes fun of the Yankees for having such a large payroll and not winning every year. I had several retorts which he completely disregarded. Going to last resort, I mentioned how the Mets have like the second or third largest payroll and can barely finish over .500. He goes, the Mets are perfectly average. I am like are you stupid, you make fun of the Yankees for spending and not winning every year and you’re content with the Mets being perfectly average. Like wtf man? It ended there.

    • Logical inconsistency is logically inconsistent.

    • Hangoverologist says:

      I have the same types of arguments with my friend. One time, he tells me that the Mets have a better offense than the Yanks. I tell him that’s wrong, and he retorts that the Yanks don’t have the offensive power of the Babe or Gehrig. I acknowledge the fact that there will never be another Ruth, then I tell him that Alex is the closest to Gehrig we have.

      Gehrig’s career WAR: 118.3
      A-Rod’s career WAR: 99.1

      Gehrig’s career wOBA: .474(HFS)
      A-Rod’s career wOBA: .411

      Gehrig’s career wRC+: 182
      A-Rod’s career wRC+: 153

      • poster says:

        Gehrig was fucking amazing.

        As good as A-Rod is Gehrig is better in every category. Incredible.

        • Hangoverologist says:

          I think that by the end of A-Rod’s career he will have surpassed Gehrig in every one of the stats I put up.

          • bexarama says:

            WAR, maybe, just because A-Rod will have a loooong career, but doubtful. The others… I just can’t see it. Lou Gehrig was really freaking good at baseball.

    • Sleepykarl says:

      Over the last decade the Mets paid the most per win of any team in baseball…

    • CS Yankee says:

      At first glance:
      NYY pay about 2M$ per win and always compete
      NYM also pay about 2M$ per win and seldom compete
      Marlins pay about 300K per win and sometimes compete

      The reality:
      NYY payroll as a % of their revenue is about average
      NYM payroll as a % of their revenue is above average
      Marlins payroll is paid for by the NYY, NYM & another dozen clubs.

      The conclusion:
      NYY are great for baseball (revenue sharing, sellouts everywhere).
      NYM are good for baseball (revenue sharing) and great for rehab doctors/staff (medical profession)
      The Marlins are great businessmen (low overhead, extremely high Return-On-Investment).

    • MikeD says:

      Just remind him that the Mets have had the highest payroll in the NL for a number of years. What the Yankees pay in the AL has nothing to do with the Mets, who by his reasoning should be in the World Series every year. When were they last there? Oh, yeah…2000, a loss to the Yanks.

  19. Hey ZZ says:

    Soooo, are there any other Randy Winn supporters left among Yankee fans?

    I am still holding onto he will get better with regular at bats.

    • I wrote about it today, saying he needs to improve. His BABIP is well below (about .100 points I think) below his career norm so the correction could come quickly. However, if it doesn’t, I’ve no problem with the Yankees replacing him ASAP.

      • Drew says:

        What scares me is that last year his babip was 308 and he ops’d 670.

      • Brad Toughy says:

        Replacing him with whom? Someone from the farm system, or someone from outside? If it’s from within the system, who replaces him? Golson? Weber or Huffman? And are they really that much better of an option than Winn?

        • Inside. I posited Golson (who could at least provide defense), Huffman (who’s at least got some power and got good reviews from PDP), Winfree (hitting very well in AAA and has some MiL power), or Curtis (who may’ve turned a corner).

          Going outside with a trade doesn’t make much sense unless it turns out that Granderson is going to be out the entire year or Gardner starts to tumble.

    • MikeD says:

      Winn’s been a regular throughout his career and up until the past week or so hasn’t had many ABs, so I’m willing to give him some time to hopefully find his stroke. Yet there is also the possibility that last year’s down season was age related, and now he’s another year older.

      I asked yesterday if there was any chance the Yankees would bring up Weber, since he’s a lefty OF bat and was impressive in spring training, and was close to finally making his MLB appearance last year with Tampa. Had a very strong year in AAA last year. Unfortunately, I then went and checked his AAA stats this year and see that he has slumpled badly the last couple of weeks. Seemingly not the right time to give the journeyman his first shot at the bigs. It would be a nice story, though, if it happens.

      Considering Thames’ problems with the glove, and Winn’s problem with the bat, I’d stil think they’d want to be on the lookout for an OFer who can actually field and might hit. Any other likely candidates in AAA?

  20. Zimmerman could end this game right now.

  21. Hangoverologist says:

    Ouch. Olsen’s ankle got smacked by a ball. Mets disease seems to be spreading.

  22. Salty Buggah says:

    I’m here at DU, waiting to see if the Rockies & Phllies game, to which Ive got free awesome 3B side tickets to, will be played. It’s supposed to rain or snow. It will suck if the game is called since there’s no Yanks baseball tonight. I’m wearing my Yanks jersey (over a suit because I had an I had a meeting with the chancellor today, which got cancelled too) to the game. Is that rude? I’ve had people tell me that’s disrespectful but I say whatever.

  23. Dunn fielding fail.

  24. FIPster Doofus says:

    I wonder if the Yankees will be kicking the Cliff Lee tires come deadline time. Obviously punchless Seattle isn’t winning anything with him, and he probably won’t re-sign.

    • Why trade for him now when he can be had for just money later?

      • FIPster Doofus says:

        I wasn’t suggesting to trade for him. I was just wondering aloud whether NYY would try in July. It’s doubtful w/ four quality starters and Vazquez, who could find his way eventually.

      • CS Yankee says:

        True, as we have four great starters (so far) and just maybe, just maybe…Javy finds himself (which would include a fastball and throwing anything to any count with success).

  25. TheLastClown says:

    Text poll on NESN:

    Which AL East team has been the biggest surprise?

    A: Toronto
    B: Tampa Bay
    C: New York


    D: THE RED SOX </b.

  26. Teix is the Man says:

    Why not have Nova start tomorrow’s afternoon game, then Javy the night? That would give Hughes an extra day.

    • CS Yankee says:

      Too much pressure on the bullpen.

      I hope that they do give the kid an extra day off when Pettitte comes back though as I don’t want to see his cap (of IP) reached.

  27. Andy_C_23 says:

    Anyone watching this Raiders 30-for-30?

  28. TheLastClown says:

    BOOOO Jays.

  29. T.J. says:

    So I think I’m gonna finally introduce my dad to sabermetrics. Watching the game with him last night was almost painful.

    I figure I’ll just give him Baseball Between The Numbers since that’s what got me into it.

    • bexarama says:

      haha what’d he say?

      • T.J. says:

        Nothing specific I can remember but he was spitting venom after Damon hit the HR and started complaining about “that bum” Nick Johnson.

        He’s been pretty much against every move we made in the offseason and the SSS we’ve seen thus far has made him think he’s right.

        • bexarama says:

          My mom really liked the Nick Johnson signing (we were at the game that I believe was his first big league HR a a few days before 9/11 so we have a bit of a soft spot for him)… until he went on the DL. Then she was like “WHY DID THEY BRING HIM BACK???? HE’S SO USELESS!!!!”

          She’s very what-have-you-done-for-me-lately with nearly every player. It’s rather annoying. Tonight, she suggested Jorge – who she LOVES – should go on the DL because “he makes everyone play badly and the team actually WANTS to play when Cervelli is on the team.” What?

          • T.J. says:

            My dad is the same way. Unless the new guy is ripping the cover off the ball he’s a bum. My dad would never admit it but he was totally down on Tex and CC when they got off to a rocky start.

            • bexarama says:

              My mom absolutely KILLED Teixeira early last year too. She won’t admit it, though. She was better this year; I think winning a WS does that ;)

    • My dad’s odd with baseball. He definitely gets the sabermetric concepts I spit out and seems to agree with some of them, yet he still thinks relievers are just as valuable as starters and thinks the Yankees need to play more “small ball”.

  30. pat says:

    Anybody is looking for something to put on Netflix, I highly recommend Waltz with Bashir. It’s an animated film about the 1982 invasion of Lebanon, and the massacre at Sabra and Shatila. It was awesome.

    • pat says:

      The film was great, not the massacre. That kind of came out weird.

      • Maybe this will be blasphemous, but here goes:

        I don’t get the Bobba Fett love. Yes, he looks cool and badass and all, but what does he actually do in The Trilogy? Catching Solo the way he did was pretty cool, but he dies like a punk. As cool as he looks, he’s one of the most overrated film characters ever. If I had to compare him to a ball player, I guess it’d be Torii Hunter: he’s not bad, per se, but the reputation is much bigger than what’s actually there.

  31. Eirias says:

    I get it. My research is in oncology, so I have to catch myself before I say cancer is cool. Not always successful.

  32. pat says:

    Ugh, Dallas Braden is doing the Letterman top 10. Just go away.

  33. I love how the only remaining pitcher in the majors at 6 wins, 0 losses is Tyler Clippard.

  34. Cecala says:

    During the NBA halftimes on TNT, they have a section called ask Charles. As the name says, a person asks Charles Barkley a question so tonight the person asked, “What is your secret to gaining weight.” Charles got pissed and it was worth a good laugh.

  35. Jack II says:

    For whatever reason, I feel obliged to give credit to Mike for plucking the photo in the post. That photo is from 9/28 of last year, when the first game of a critical 4 game Twins/Tigers series was rained out. They played a doubleheader the next day (split), Tigers won on Wednesday, and were up 3 with 4 to go.

    Then they did something that has never happened in baseball history, and blew that lead. They didn’t even need all 4 games. They lost on Thursday, Minny won their Friday and Saturday games vs. KC, and the Tigers lost their games on those nights against Chicago (the 2nd Chicago game was a night game, the 2nd Minny game was a day game; Detroit knew they had to win to retain sole possession of 1st place).

    Both won on Sunday, and thanks to MNF, the one game playoff wasn’t played ’till Tuesday. We all know what happened in that game. Quite frankly, I’m much happier Minny won that game than Detroit. Verlander gave me chills in a short series, especially since he wasn’t matched up against C.C., but rather Burnett. That means Detroit probably wins Game 2, putting the pressure on the Yankees to take both games in Detroit…otherwise, it’s Verlander/Burnett Game 5 back in New York. I would be quite concerned about the 103 win Yankees losing that game, and seeing another great season go by the boards in the ALDS (kinda like 2006…..against Detroit).

    Luckily, that never happened.

    • bexarama says:

      I remember being terrified of the Tigers because of Verlander, and terrified of the Twins because of the whole MOMENTUM TEAM OF DESTINY!!!! thing. I don’t really believe in momentum but teams that come in hot scare me a little bit. Eh, whatever, worked out pretty good ;)

      • Jack II says:

        I didn’t fear the Twins for a number of reasons, primarily because

        a) their front-end pitching couldn’t touch Verlander and possibly Jackson (if 1st half Jackson showed up for Game 1/Game 4).

        b) the Yankees weren’t exactly a team that struggled to beat the Twins during the season.

        Now, the Twins proved to be a worthy foe. Games 2 and 3 could’ve very easily gone to the Twins (they actually scored first in all three games of the series). That said, even with their hellacious 17-4 spurt to reach the playoffs, they were a much better draw than facing Verlander’s 97 mph heat in the cold October weather. That would’ve been a nightmare.

        It did prove to help the Yankees for at least the first game that the Twins had to go from playing 12 innings at home one night to playing at 6 in New York the next night. Brian Duensing was way in over his head for that game. Nick Blackburn and Asshole Pavano? They did admirable jobs.

  36. bexarama says:

    T-Clip implosion.

    • sleepykarl says:

      Clip and Bruney combine for 0.1 innings 6 runs (5 earned).

    • JGS says:

      Blown save #5

      Yay for deceptive ERA!

    • Hangoverologist says:

      How about Nats pen explosion? The umps are currently reviewing an Ike Davis foul ball that could end up being a grand slam.

    • TheLastClown says:

      I used to like the Angels, but then I moved to L.A.

      Now I genuinely dis-like the Angels. I know the Rays are our division rival & all, but I really like their team. I think the Yanks’ll stomp them into the WC, but they play exciting baseball…

      …B.J. Upton getting picked off as I type notwithstanding….

      I find it kind of difficult to root for the Angels against them.


      • TheLastClown says:

        Not supposed to be a reply to anything in any-way.

      • bexarama says:

        the Rays would totally be a pet team of mine if they weren’t in our division. Don’t like Matt Garza (though thanks for the 2008 ALCS) or BJ Upton much, but other than that, I like them quite a bit.

        • Brad Toughy says:

          Same, although I do like Garza. He’s really come into his own this year. He’s a little cocky, but not in a punkish type of way.

          • Total Domination (The Commenter Formerly Known as Ben) says:

            *He’s a little cocky, but not in a Dallas Braden type of way

  37. Hangoverologist says:

    So I took a look at the upcoming starting pitching FA class, and should the Yanks not be able to acquire Cliff Lee, they could take a look at Brad Penny:

    Brad Penny

    Penny signed with the Cardinals, so he’s now a part of the Dave Duncan Experience. A recent graduate of the sinkerball master, Joel Pineiro, got a deal with the Angels this past offseason and Duncan’s teachings have not deserted him (48.5% GB in 08, 60.5% GB last year). Penny is experiencing a renaissance in the same vein of Piniero’s. Since there is only a five week sample, Penny’s groundball rate is around his career average, but as the season progresses, the worm burning rate will go up. The Yanks should acquire him if they want to have a back-end sinker specialist a la Chien Ming Wang.

    I’ll do another post like this in the off topic thread tomorrow.

    • JGS says:

      Brad Penny, Boston–5.61 ERA, 1.534 WHIP


    • Jack II says:

      And St. Louis would be shopping him because….

      • TheLastClown says:

        At the end of the season, he’s a free agent…

      • radnom says:

        It helps to actually read the comment before you make a sarcastic reply.

        He signed a one year deal – he will be a FA.

        That being said, I don’t want any part of Penny next season. I would rather have Andy or Joba or lots of other people actually.

        • bexarama says:

          Provided he doesn’t retire, which I thought was pretty much an impossibility at the start of 2010 but seems like it’s actually getting more and more likely for whatever reason, I would take Andy a thousand billion times over Penny (yeah, yeah, yeah). I’d definitely rather live through Joba’s pains as a starting pitcher than go with someone who’d only be here for one year and who would probably struggle, too.

          Piniero hasn’t been doing great with the Angels, either. I really don’t think they’re cheating over in St. Louis or whatever, but I dunno.

          Penny has issues with Girardi from last year, too, if I remember. Not that it really matters, just saying.

    • pat says:

      I don’t know if Dave Duncan is that good of a coach.

    • Mike Axisa says:

      I think St. Louis pitchers are the new Braves’ pitchers. Just stay away once they hit FA, Dave Duncan’s mojo doesn’t work outside of that city. Look at Piniero, Weaver, Suppan, Looper…

      • This.

        And I’m sorry but nobody’s THAT smart or good at teaching MLB pitchers how to pitch. There must be something illegal going on, like they target sinkerballers and then teach them how to scuff/cut the ball without getting caught. Guys show up in St Louis and start seeing results almost immediately, so its not like he’s working on their conditioning or mechanics or something.

        • Total Domination (The Commenter Formerly Known as Ben) says:

          Or maybe the NL is just that bad, and the only good hitting team is the Cardinals… so the slightest improvement in mechanics, grip, etc show immediate dividends

        • radnom says:

          like they target sinkerballers and then teach them how to scuff/cut the ball without getting caught

          Assuming this conspiracy theory is correct – wouldn’t this be a skill that transfers to other teams?

          I think its partly the NL central, partly good coaching, partly luck.

  38. Jay says:

    Does anyone think that Frank Catalanotto would be a good pickup for the Yankees? I always felt that he was a good professional, situational hitter.

  39. Just watched the most recent episode of ’24′ on and I have just one thing to say.

    “You swallowed it you bastard.”

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