For two key Yanks, some looming decisions
By
CC delivers. Credit: AP Photo/Kathy Willens
When the Yankees signed CC Sabathia, most news outlets reported it as a seven-year, $161-million deal, but that’s not entirely true. As we know — and try to forget — the Sabathia deal is a three-year contract for $69 million with a player option for four years and $92 million. Sabathia’s opt-out looms nearly as large as the lefty himself, but speaking on the contract for the first time, CC said he’ll stay in New York.
According to The Post, CC said he “won’t even consider” exercising his opt-out clause after the 2011 season. “I’m here,” Sabathia said to Mark Hale. “Hundred percent. I think you know I’ve built a house here, right? My kids go to school here. We live here year round. So I’m not going anywhere.”
That’s music to my ears. As a Yankee, CC Sabathia is now 36-13 with a 3.21 ERA. He’s a horse, averaging just under 7 innings a start, and he’s pitched even better in the cozy confines of Yankee Stadium than we could have expected. At home, he is 17-2 with a 2.84 ERA. “You can give my wife credit for that, I guess,” Sabathia said. “Her cooking. And just being at home, being around my family and going out and being able to be relaxed. It’s just one of those things. I love being home. I love playing in The Bronx. I love being at Yankee Stadium. But just one of those things that worked out like that.”
When the Yankees signed CC, the opt-out was viewed as an incentive to come to New York. Most who covered baseball assumed that Sabathia wanted to pitch closer his home in California’s Bay Area, but the Yankees overwhelmed with him money. Unlike A-Rod‘s opt-out or J.D. Drew’s opt-out, the one in CC’s contract wasn’t necessarily about getting more money if the market rebounded; it was about allowing CC to adjust to the pressures of New York and decided if he wanted to stay. For now, it seems, he’ll stay.
Of course, I can’t believe right away that CC won’t take advantage of the opt-out in some shape or form. It gives the left-hander some leverage if the market appears strong after the 2011 season. He could ask the Yanks for another year in exchange for waiving the opt-out or he could renegotiate the final four years of his deal entirely. After all, when other high-profile opt outs have come due, the players have used that leverage to get richer. Love of New York aside, would CC be the exception to that rule?
But I’m certainly willing to take him at his word that he wants to stay in New York. He’s the king of the Yankees rotation and, after the World Series, the toast of the town (and it takes a while to tend to an organic garden in the bullpen). If he stays, the Yanks have at least one ace for the next few years, and their rotation is still that much stronger. They will still look to land Cliff Lee as a replacement for Andy Pettitte when he retires and have Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain and, for better or worse, A.J. Burnett under team control for the next three years. It could very well be a riches of pitches.
(AP Photo/Kathy Willens)
Before CC’s opt-out comes due, another Yankee free agent will have a decision to make. As the Bombers head to the Windy City this weekend and as the White Sox’s cross-town rivals see their managerial spot in flux, Joe Girardi‘s contract situation will sneak to the forefront. Our own Mike Axisa tackled the Cubs question a few weeks ago, but with Lou Piniella’s resignation this past weekend, the Chicago media will pepper the Yanks’ skipper with questions about the Cubs’ vacancy. As he must and as he did to ESPN, Joe will say that he loves New York. “I’m sure I’m gonna be asked that a lot now that he’s stepped down,” Girardi said. “My focus is here. I have a responsibility to the organization and to the guys in that clubhouse and that’s where my focus is. I’m very happy here, you know what? Great working relationship here with everyone involved and I’m very happy here. This organization has been great to me.”
Girardi, though, recognizes his close ties to Chicago, and as a native son of Illinois, might he be tempted to try to manage the Cubs to an elusive World Series? “I know I have a background there and I’m not gonna skirt around my background there,” he said. “I grew up a Cubs fan, I played for the Cubs, but I’m not worried about that now. Im worried about what we’re doing now. We’re in a fight.”
I don’t always agree with Joe Girardi’s moves. I find his bullpen management a bit too by-the-books at times, but he’s enjoyed great success with the Yankees in his three seasons so far. Unless the Yanks somehow fail to make the playoffs, he’ll have an offer on the table from the Steinbrenners as the Cubs try to fill their own managerial role. As with CC, Girardi, though, should return to the Bronx. It’s just the Yankee way.
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The Mason Williams Watch
The Cubbies are going to make it rain on Girardi, and I don’t think the Yankees will be willing to match.
I still don’t think Girardi will go to Chicago. It’s too much of a mess out there.
If the team were close to being competitive, I could see Girardi heading to Chicago, but the organization is in shambles.
It’s a mess in many ways, but there’s no pressure and they have deep pockets.
No pressure? They haven’t won a fricken World Series in the past 100 years. They haven’t even been to the World Series since 1945. There is a lot of pressure over there.
There’s no pressure on the Cubs. They have tourists/drunk bankers filling Wrigley, and they don’t expect anything good to happen.
Not really. Whereas the Yankees’ players and coaches have the pressure of winning, or at least being competitive, year after year, the Cubs can tank and their loyal fans will say, “Well, it’s the Cubs”.
Say the Yankees offer Girardi $5 Mil/year to be the manager (he gets $2.5 Mil/year now), that would make him (I believe) the highest paid manager in MLB. Would the Cubs really be willing to go well beyond that? Would the Cubs offer him something absurd like 8-10 million a year?
There is no effing way the Yankees are making Girardi the highest paid manager in baseball.
Why not? He’ll have won two rings in three years.
Who in baseball should be getting paid more than that guy?
Andy McPhail.
Touché.
Is it unrealistic though? The man has done a good job since he’s arrived. He has shown a willingness to learn and try new ideas. The front office loves him too. Girardi is Cashman’s boy.
Why not? They already pay one guy slightly less than what all of the Pirates will earn this year. And they have the highest paid pitcher in history, too. Let’s see some more milestones.
It’s good to hear CC will stick around. The big man will continue to be the Yanks ace for the next few seasons. And when he moves on, it’ll fall on the shoulders of Cliff Lee and Phil Hughes.
Cliff Lee is two years older than CC. I’m actually kind of wary of giving him a megadeal.
Define “megadeal”. He isn’t getting Zito-Johan-CC money
More money/years than Halladay. Guaranteed.
Halladay only got 3 years and 20M per.
I’ve got no problem giving Cliff Lee 4 years and 22M per. None.
What about 5/120
Huh?
HUH?
More like 5/110.
Which is also eminently reasonable. Lee is a Cy-Young-caliber command/control lefty who doesn’t have a lot of tread on his tires; the age-related decline concerns aren’t as serious as they would be with a guy like, say, AJ Burnett or Javier Vazquez.
Or Roy Halladay
This–he won’t get 7/126 (Zito) or 6/137.5 (Johan)
4/88 would be fine. 5/100 would be less fine but still ok
He’s two years older but has a lot less miles on his arm and has a more standard body type.
I like Girardi but if the Cubs are seriously going after him I don’t think it’s worth spending a ton of money trying to go after him too. He’s just a manager. There are a couple of DNW DNW DNW! managers out there but other than that, I don’t see it really being a big deal.
The next Cubs skipper will be Ryne Sandberg.
Book it.
I hope you’re right. I really like Girardi, especially his handling of the pen.
I completely agree.
If he stays, the Yanks have at least one ace for the next few years, and their rotation is still that much stronger. They will still look to land Cliff Lee as a replacement for Andy Pettitte when he retires and have Phil Hughes, Joba Chamberlain and, for better or worse, A.J. Burnett under team control for the next three years. It could very well be a riches of pitches.
I’M RIIIIIIIIIIIIICH, PIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITCH!!!
(honk honk)
Not to mention Brackman, Warren, Noesi, and company possibly being options in the next few years.
The price on Cliff Lee is going to be like the dot com bubble. He is really the only truly elite pitcher or hitter that is hitting the free agent market this offseason. I think it may take 30 million a year just because of supply and demand. Yankees can always do it but with Jeter and Rivera and Lee they would be over 200 million with a lot of holes remaining to be filled and an even older team than now.
I could see Grienke getting traded for Montero, Joba and Nova or something along those lines. He is cost controlled the next two years and is younger than Lee. If they were willing to do it for a rental, they will be willing to give up even more I think. If I were the Royals I would be looking at this licking my chops.
O:S
TSJC – Since I rarely comment and don’t have a chance to follow the memes consistently (I remember Oaktag though…), could you link me to the origination of this new O:S response I’m seeing these days? Much appreciated.
It’s from something Derek Bell said. I don’t think Derek Bell meant it this way, but here, people use it to mean the user is basically a troll and not worth responding to. (Though for a Bret comment, this isn’t THAT terrible. I guess.)
March 4th, 2010.
http://riveraveblues.com/2010/.....ent-792356
Much appreciated Bexy + TSJC
The original Operation Shutdown is from Derek Bell–from his wiki page:
“Nobody told me I was in competition. If there is competition, somebody better let me know. If there is competition, they better eliminate me out of the race and go ahead and do what they’re going to do with me. I ain’t never hit in spring training and I never will. If it ain’t settled with me out there, then they can trade me. I ain’t going out there to hurt myself in spring training battling for a job. If it is [a competition], then I’m going into ‘Operation Shutdown.’ Tell them exactly what I said. I haven’t competed for a job since 1991.”
I believe this is the origin of the RAB meme:
http://riveraveblues.com/2010/.....ent-792356
Please stop with the thread-jacking off-topic comments. I’m not asking again. This isn’t an invitation for you to throw out trade proposals. It’s about CC and Joe Girardi. There’s a permanent off-topic forum for you right here.
Didn’t he already get one of those “This is your final warning!” warnings yesterday?
Yes, he did.
In fairness, Bo/Sal/Grant/Was there a 4th? got a lot of chances too. So did Rosaxavelli.
Lanny!
You can’t make lemonade with lemons.
What about Jimmy the Jew? He got banned in like 2 hours, which has to be like an RAB record.
2 hours? Probably closer to 1. That’s what happens when you say stuff like “The days in between [pitching] he [Burnett] throws pies at teammates and fists his wife.”
LOL wut I missed this guy.
I wonder how long the list of banned non-spammers is.
He wasn’t too outrageous in this thread but got banned in short order for this one. I think he was impersonating a Rabbi.
Holy shit. I wish I was a RABer last year.
Another gem there was when Bo and mryankee went at it (sort of). I think cold fusion was finally developed that day.
hahahaha
I know that the manager doesn’t have as much impact on the team as we think, but I really don’t think I can think of anyone else I’d rather have managing the Yankees (save for Earl Weaver). I won’t be devastated if Joe jets, but I definitely want him to stick around.
Agreed. We know Joe can at the very least manage a great team to a title without getting in the way and screwing it up (which is not what I believe). There are managers that wouldn’t have won with last years team so why take a chance switching it up?
Two further points.
1. You can bet rival teams will drive up the bidding big time on Lee. A team like the Orioles could publicly offer 5 years, 125 million and force the Yankees to outbid. If they don’t, the O’s still have a lower payroll than last year. Even if Lee wants to go to NY he will make them pay inflation.
2. How will CC react when a new pitcher is making much more money than he is? How will Jeter react when Lee is making 1.5 what he makes? I see this creating jealously and major issues. I think Grienke is a more likely scenario because he will only cost them prospects which they care litte about anyway.
We asked you before to quit it with the off-topic posts. This is about CC and Girardi. Lee may play a tangential part, but not to the degree you’re taking it.
http://images.google.com/imgre.....038;itbs=1
http://riveraveblues.com/wp-co.....utdown.jpg
I see this creating jealously and major issues. I think Grienke is a more likely scenario because he will only cost them prospects which they care litte about anyway.
Nobody gives a shit what you see or what you think, Bret. You’ve shown no ability to do either thing with any modicum of acumen or logic.
There’s no point in you sharing your thoughts on anything, ever, to anyone, because we all know those thoughts are horrendously stupid.
O:S
he will only cost them prospects which they care litte about anyway.
/Neyer’d?
1) Cliff Lee does not want to play in Baltimore. My Guess is that he signs pretty quickly for 5yrs/100mil with the Yanks.
2)CC and Lee are close friends. Also I think the 160 million dollars in his pocket will ease his concerns about being “The Man”.
I wouldn’t be mad at Girardi if he left for the Cubs. I’d be bummed for sure. But knowing his ties to Chicago, his ties to the Cubs, His being such a family man. I don’t think his going to Cubs should be completely dismissed and i think it’s something that makes sense for him.
Girardi can go. Nice guy-good heart. Nothing great as a manager.
I think you have him under-valued.
He hasn’t made some of the bone head mistakes (Torre & the ‘pen, Martin & the temper, etc) of the past Yankee managers, plays by the book (the overall smartess & safest way) and respects his players while mixing in youth and accountability. Plus he doesn’t tip his hand to the media while growing into a PR asset and has helped in the organization’s mission beyond baseball (charity).
What more could you possibility want out of a manager?
I agree with alot of what you say but I would like a little more fire in support of his players on the field and a bit more creativity in using the stolen base/squeeze/hit and run etc. These things can be easily rebutted statistically to suit your argument but I have been watching baseball for over 40 years and I just don’t think Joe is irreplaceable by any means…
This isn’t the union and you don’t get more credit for watching baseball for more years (BTW, put me down for <30).
I didn't say he was irreplaceable, I commented on you saying he "can go" and asked the question what more could you want from a manager. You replied;
1) "…a little more fire for his players on the field"
2) "…more creativity in SB/SQ/Hit-n-Run"
I'll reply with;
1) I think Joe gets kicked out of games at about league average or above.
2) Fair enough, but he has a aging team that is more power driven than "NL based" baseball (small ball). I like the Thames, Kearns, etc bench versus the low power speedsters.
Your thoughts would leave us to a Lou Pinella/Whitey Herzog hybred, which last I checked they don't make them that way anymore.
Is there a canidate that you have in mind?
CC Sabathia is a nice innings eater i suppose, but anyone with half a brain realizes that he’s CLEARLY in steep decline, and frankly isn’t an elite pitcher anymore. Just look at his SO/BB ratio. Its much worse than when he was with the Brewers those 3 months, ergo, he sort of sucks. CC saying he won’t opt out of his deal has to be devastating news for the Yankees as his contract is an albatross of ARod Proportions.
/Rob Neyer’d
This is why the Yankees decision to not care about defense will be one they regret.
/Neyer’d
:::Cut-n-paste:::
Add a little thought about what was copied and devote the comments to one of the following;
1) credit to Bill James
2) praise Theo, Beane or Z
3) How Yankee richness is based upon money
4) Describe how a Royal victory is sweeter than anything else
Finish the post with a point that isn’t about the main point of the topic…finish & send.
/Neyer’d
You forgot the Old Yankee Stadium was a total dump with no character, but Fenway Park is the greatest sporting venue ever concieved by man, and should be the model for all other stadiums.
/Neyer’d
Just like the first generation of teams were distinguished by the color of their stockings, the next generation will be by the color of their monster.
P.S. Nice sweater.
if Girardi goes to the Cubs, do the Yankees try for Mattingly ?
I really don’t want to see Mattingly manage. From what I’ve heard, I don’t think he’d be a great fit for a New York team, and I think he has a legacy in the Bronx that would be best served if he didn’t manage here.
yeah, Donnies image/legacy would have nowhere to go but down.
Agreed 100%.
Remember when Magic Johnson tried coaching the Lakers? Yeah, no thanks.
Just curious, what makes you say that?
I always got the impression the Yankees were grooming him to replace Torre when they gave him the bench coach job. Then when Torre actually left Girardi jumped into the lead. I have no idea what Mattingly did to fall out of favor.
Probably didn’t give a good interview.
Moot point anyway isn’t it? Seems like he’s the manager-in-waiting when Torre leaves.
I hope not. It would be nice if he had some managerial experience first.
thats true too. im really torn as to whether id like to see Donnie manage for us. on one hand, it would be awesome if he managed us to a couple of world series titles, but if he didnt do good and they ended up firing him that would be horrible. even if he gets experience and managed us say 10 years from now its still a dicey situation.
True, Mike, but it’s not as if he’d be the first former player to never manage in the minors before managing in the majors. Joe Girardi being just one recent example.
I don’t think Donnie has any intention of doing time in the minors.
They might, but Mattingly is one of the DNWs for me. Like others here have said – I want someone with at least managerial experience, and Mattingly has a legacy that probably won’t hold up if he manages, especially if he manages in NEW YORK!!!!!.
That’s not to say Mattingly might not be a perfectly fine manager, just, let’s face it, many, many fans enjoy tearing their managers apart for doing, um, anything.
you have very valid points there, i cant argue any of them.
i just think that somewhere down the road it could work. then when i think about it again i think it doesnt make sense.
ehh , i guess at least for now it doesnt make sense.
you can book this. the yankee starting rotation in 2011 will be sabathia/greinke/lee/hughes/nova
/sarcasm?
I guess Burnett rides the pine, huh?
Clearly, he’s going to Kansas City for Greinke.
Nope we trade him for Grineke, Butler, and Soria…Straight up.
Don’t be ridiculous. We’ll give up Kei Igawa as well.
He closes once Mariano retires after this year. Obviously.
::imagines AJ as a closer::
::whimpers in a corner::
Apparently WFAN closers call in whining about this all the time. I’ve seen people on LoHud suggesting it. Yeah… it’s terrifying.
The Yankees really dropped the ball. They should have invested in perfecting cloning technology and we’d never have to talk about a post-Mariano era.
Maybe they tried and it didn’t work. Maybe the clones were far from perfect….explains Edwar Ramirez….
…or maybe they did, and the guy now pitching for the Yankees is actually Mariano 2.0.
Hallelujah.
Carsten Charles Sabathia: worth every penny.
+52
Hypothetically, if the Cubs throw enough money at Girardi to make him take their job, what about Derek Jeter the player/manager?
It could be a solution to the ‘let’s phase out Jeter’s playing time without diminishing his role on the team’ problem.
This is not anything more than random conjecture made by a man who just got home from a week in Vegas with a fuzzy head
I think its more likely the CUBS offer Jeter a player/manager spot….
I’m pretty sure player-managers are now banned.
Just like Bret.
Because of Pete “I only place bets when I think my team will win so its not wrong” Rose?
It certainly didn’t help.
If Girardi leaves, which he won’t, I’d honestly just promote Tony Pena.
I’d hire Pat Riley.
He assembled Dwyane Wade’s South Beach Heat. That’s impressive.
To leave the Yankees and go to the Cubs would be almost as bad as leaving the Yankees and going to the Cubs.