Nov
23

A ‘messy’ negotiation takes a turn for the worse

By

Derek Jeter and the Yanks are swinging at air right now. (AP Photo, Kathy Willens)

When the Hot Stove League officially kicked off on November 2, Hal Steinbrenner took to the AM airwaves to discuss the Yanks’ off-season plans. In doing so, he warned that the upcoming negotiations between Derek Jeter and his long-time employer would not be for the faint of heart. “There’s always the possibility that things could get messy,” he said to Michael Kay.

Three weeks later, the relationship between the Yankees and their captain has gotten very, very messy indeed. Since the start, the Yankees have toed the line. “I want to get a deal done that he’s happy with but also that I’m happy with,” Hal Steinbrenner said in early November.

Since then, the Yankees have extended Jeter at least one contract offer. The team hasn’t confirmed the dollar amount, but the club is reported to have given Jeter’s camp a three-year, $45-million offer. Things took a turn for the worse when Jeter’s agent Casey Close took exception to the offer and the subsequent reports of an emerging hard line.

“Derek Jeter is a great Yankee and he’s a great player. With that said and done, now is a different negotiation than 10 years ago,” Randy Levine said last week. “He’s a baseball player, and this is a player negotiation. Everything he is and who he is gets factored in. But this isn’t a licensing deal or a commercial rights deal, he’s a baseball player. With that said, you can’t take away from who he is. He brings a lot to the organization. And we bring a lot to him.”

Close called the Yanks’ stance “baffling” as anonymous sources said that Jeter wanted a five- or six-year deal. Jeter wants to keep pace with A-Rod, but the Yanks don’t want to make the same contract mistake twice. Close expressed dismay the Yanks would be so public in their comments, and Jeter confidantes later said the two sides are “not even in the same ballpark.”

Today, the Yankees swung back and hard. George A. King III spoke to Yanks’ GM Brian Cashman. “There is nothing baffling about our position,” Cashman said. “We have been very honest and direct with them, not through the press. We feel our offer is appropriate and fair. We appreciate the contributions Derek has made to our organization and we have made it clear to them. Our primary focus is his on-the-field performance the last couple of years in conjunction with his age, and we have some concerns in that area that need to be addressed in a multiyear deal going forward.”

To quell doubts, the Yanks, Cashman said, still want Jeter around: “I restate Derek Jeter is the best shortstop for this franchise as we move forward. The difficulty is finding out what is fair between both sides.”

Later in the day, Cashman elaborated in an interview with Wallace Matthews. The team, he says, has made a “fair and appropriate” offer to Jeter. “We understand his contributions to the franchise and our offer has taken them into account,” the GM said. “We’ve encouraged him to test the market and see if there’s something he would prefer other than this. If he can, fine. That’s the way it works.” He later added, “We want to be treated fairly. We’re not just going to write a blank check.”

Matthews, who says that Jeter wants 4-6 years at $20 million per, had more:

“We believe that Derek Jeter is the best person to play shortstop for this franchise moving forward,” Cashman said. “Do we want to lose Derek Jeter? No. Do we want to treat Derek Jeter fair? Absolutely. Do we want to be treated fair at the same time? No question about it.”

“We’re going to do everything we possibly can to put the best winning team on the field,” Cashman added. “We feel Derek Jeter gives us the best chance to win. But we’re not dealing with Derek alone. We’re dealing with our closer, we’re trying to add to our club, and if putting all out eggs into one basket takes away from our ability to add to our club, I ain’t gonna do it.”

Asked if there was any chance the negotiation could fall apart and Jeter could somehow wind up in a different uniform next year, Cashman said, “Not from us. We would like Derek Jeter to be a Yankee and we’re making our best efforts to keep that in play. But it takes two.”

The Yankees are pressing and hard right now on Jeter. They know his leverage is at an all-time low, and they know what they want to pay Jeter. Derek has spent his Yankee career being the opposite of controversial. He never says anything; he never finds himself in a scandal; and he is exceptional at toeing the Steinbrenner party line. He has been the model employee, but at age 36 and coming off of his worst offensive season, being steadfast in your devotion only earns you so many dollars above market value.

Soon though he’ll have to respond with something more than the word “baffling” because the Yanks, as Tyler Kepner wrote today, certainly don’t think these negotiations are baffling. If anything, the club has a plan and they are, in spite of mounting public criticism, sticking with it. Right now, the onus is on Jeter to work this out, and all indications are that the Yanks aren’t through negotiation. The club, Jon Heyman said earlier before rescinding his statement, may bump up the three-year, $45-million, if they haven’t done so already, but if that isn’t enough, he can indeed try the open market.

“He should be nothing but a New York Yankee,” Cashman said, “if he chooses to be.”

Categories : Hot Stove League
  • Will

    I don’t see anything wrong with Cashman playing “bad cop”, considering the standing offer is more than reasonable.

    • http://riverave.blues darryl lang

      HEY DEREK WE STILL WANT YOU TO BE A YANKEE EVEN IF THE YANKEE BRASS (CASHMAN,HAL,HANK,RANDY AND LONN) DON’t WANT YOU!!! TELL YOUR AGENT TO CHECK WITH THE RED SOCKS I BET THEY’LL GIVE YOU WHAT YOU WANT LIKE 4 OR 5 YEARS 17 TO 18 MIL A YEAR. THEY WILL TAKE MO WITH YOU AS A PACKAGE DEAL EVEN GIVE HIM A 2 OR 3 YEAR DEAL TO GO WITH IT!! THAT HAPPENS I MIGHT CHOOSE TO LIKE THE RED SOCKS!!! AND SIGNAL THE END OF THE YANKEES AS WE ALL KNOW AND LOVE. NIW IT’S A BUSINESS AND THE BRASS WANTS TO PAD THEIR POCKETS FIRST AND IF THEY GET ENOUGH THAN MAYBE THE FANS GET WHAT THEY WANT LIKE ANOTHER WS CHAMPIONSHIP. LONG LIVE THE BOSS!!! THE KIDS SHOULD’VE LISTENED AND LEARN MORE INSTEAD OF GOING ON VACATION!

      • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

        This is amazing.

        • king of fruitless hypotheticals

          Ok you win.

          what does NIW mean?

          • http://lifeopinstripes.wordpress.com Duncan

            He meant to write “NOW”

      • JerseyDutch

        Trying tapping that little button on the left side of the keyboard that says Caps Lock. Just once. There you go.

        HTH

        • Jonathan

          once again, i ask for people to sign a petition for people to have to ass a common sense/yankee/baseball test to be able to comment. that is all.

          • Corporate Scum (Formerly Joe West’s Music Career)

            all the trolls would “ass” a common sense test…

      • UWS

        *blink blink*

      • T-Dubs

        I love you? I love you.

      • http://twitter.com/dpatrickg Dirty Pena

        The best part? The URL: riverave.blues

        • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

          It must be Ben. All of those posts posing as a bright, reasonable fellow are just a ruse. This is the REAL Ben.

      • http://twitter.com/kschmidt2 Kiersten

        IETC

      • http://twitter.com/stophamm3rtime Dela G

        this is too epic

        top 10 comment of the year

      • pete

        brick killed a guy.

      • nathan

        Well, I have seen a lot of this in Yankee forums and ESPN chats, I genuinely believe some trolls are posting as Yanks fans to mess with us.

        I just hope you dont take urself seriously.

      • Thomas Tu

        I hope you’re not Chinese. You would give us a bad name

        • Accent Shallow

          You know who else isn’t Chinese?

          Phil Hughes. Sayin’!

          • Thomas Tu

            His eyes tell a different story.

            He has a very mild epicanthic fold.

      • http://twitter.com/Carlosological Carlosologist

        Afuckingmazing.

      • SullyLV

        @ darryl lang-Please do yourself a favor and get off the drugs as it is affecting your judgement.So,the Red Sox’s are going to give Jeter who is going to be 37 4 years@17 mil = 68 mil dollars
        and then give Mo 2-3 years @15 mil= 30to45 mil.Wow,it sounds like you are delusional.

        • andypettitteisastartingpitcher

          Not the Red Sox, the Red Socks. Whoever they are.

      • Ed M

        Are you insane? The offer to Jeter is more then fair. He wouldn’t get close to what the Yankees are willing to pay on the open market. 3/45 is going over and beyond to message Jeter’s ego. I am a Jeter fan, but the guy is coming off career lows & is 36. Say the Yankees give in. What are they going to do with a guy who refuses to play any position but SS and is too old to do so? Add that to what Jeter want to be paid and that is horrible business decision. That is not including all the Yankee fans screaming for the Yankees to get someone else.

      • jsbrendog (returns)

        so happy i clicked on this thread. this is great, even tho he is serious

      • darryl

        jeter has won his second gold glove in a row and had the highest feilding percentage in his career. and they say he losing ground? maybe it’s a-rod that’s losing ground! he doesn’t cover much ground so jeter has to suffer the rant from all! the yankee brass tell the managers to help a-rod fit in! how about a-rod runs out all his hits instead of skipping to first or whatever he calls his trot.

        • Brian

          You do realize AROD practically lines up in the SS hole and gives up the 3rd base line on most plays defensively right? I wonder why that is?

      • Brian

        If that happens the Red Sox won’t make the playoffs again since Jeter isn’t going to get better at 37 yrs old.

        Jeter isn’t the same player he was in 2000 so why are Yankee fans all up in arms over whether he signs or not, Babe Ruth didn’t finish his career as a Yankee, neither did Reggie, Winfield, Henderson, Maris, and the list goes on. Derek needs to understand his value is in winning and if he gives up a little money to allow the Yanks to sign Lee and keep Mo and the team can stay within their budget of $200 million than Jeter will add to his legacy by getting a couple more titles before he retires.

      • Klemy

        Please don’t ever post again with caps lock on.

  • kenthadley

    Derek needs to wake up. He’s been offered about 50% more than any other shortstop. If he wants to play for Baltimore, then the Yanks will have to struggle to fill shortstop with the 21 mil he earned last year. Sort of reminds me of Joe Torre’s exit, insulted by the highest salary of any manager.

    • mbonzo

      Torre wasn’t insulted by the money, he was insulted by the incentives. He was trying to win the World Series every year, not just for the money. I never agreed with that move only because there was a possibility that Torre would be back, they should have let him walk and avoided his bs.

      • nathan

        Pls dont say you believed Torre’s BS

  • Avi

    I really like the way the Yankees are handling this. You can’t let Jeter hold you over a barrel and demand an Arod type contract.

    • The Big City of Dreams

      They let other players hold them over the barrel yr after yr and they have no problem with it as long as they get the player signed.

      • jsbrendog (returns)

        but those other players have the option to sing somewhere else becaus eothe rpeople want them at the price the yankees are opffering. this is not the case with jeter

  • mbonzo

    Jeter’s guys brought this upon themselves. If you want to negotiate with someone, you don’t humiliate one side by saying their offers are “baffling” to the media.

    • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

      While I don’t think either side’s been too professional taking this to the media, let’s not act like that’s the most outrageous thing that’s ever been said by an agent.

      • mbonzo

        Haha no Scott Boras’ comparisons always win the award for most ridiculous quotes from an agent. From what I’ve read so far his comparison of Beltre to Mike Schmidt, Paul Molitor and George Brett.

        • http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21

          Boras would have already shown his binder demonstrating similarities between Jeter and Honus Wagner to every media outlet.

          • mbonzo

            Boras is now comparing Close’s ability to screw up contract negotiations against the Yankees with his own.

            • Ed

              Boras is counting his screwups as we speak. The last batch added up to 275 million, with maybe 30m more to come from that over the next 7 years or so.

          • Accent Shallow

            Jeter is arguably the third best hitting SS ever, after Wagner and Arky Vaughan.

            • ChrisS

              Yeah, and he already was paid for that.

            • LetHimWalk

              You forgot Hanley and Arod.

        • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

          Haha that was exactly what I was thinking of when I wrote that.

      • ND Mike

        Next question.

  • Mark

    Heyman tweeted this a little while ago:

    SI_JonHeyman

    getting mixed messages now. doesnt sound like the #yankees are intending to bump their offer to jeter from 45 for 3

    • Avi

      I hope they don’t. Their offer is already over market value.

      • Avi

        There are all kinds of free agents currently talking to other teams. If Jeter isn’t gonna sign with the Yanks they need to know that now. I would put a time limit on the offer if I were the yanks.

        • http://www.twitter.com/jordansmed JGS

          I would put a time limit on the offer if I were the yanks.

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JzKfP_yFudk

          • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

            haha, sadly, I could easily see this as the showdown between Cashman and Boras during the ARod negotiations.

          • Avi

            Biggest mistake of Jeter’s life:
            Not hiring Boras as his agent.

            • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

              Boras would have had Jeter a new deal last off season, and/or would have had an opt out clause in that 10 year deal. Jeter choose the make no waves, team friendly agent, and that is what he got. With Boras, you do have to sell a bit of your soul to the devil, so there is a trade off.

              • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

                Boras would have probably written a 50 page analysis on why Jeter’s only comparables are Ruth, DiMaggio, and Mantle coming from the grave to play 5 more seasons at top 5 value in the league for their position.

                • Ed

                  Probably? You underestimate Boras. Those giant binders marketing the players as amazing are standard practice for all of his clients. He even did one for Maddux’s retirement announcement.

                • Avi

                  Yeah, the opt out clause he put in Arod’s contract is the reason why Arod has seven years and about 210M and Jeter would be lucky to get three years and 60M.
                  I think that opt out clause was a stroke of genius. Remember, this was when he was signing the BIGGEST contract in the history of sports. To have the foresight to put in that clause and be able to renegotiate a new contract at the age 33 instead of 36 – genius.

                  • Brian

                    excellent point.

          • FIPster Doofus

            Brilliant AD reference. Great job.

            • http://www.twitter.com/jordansmed JGS

              Thanks. I’ve been waiting for an opportunity to use that ever since I found it a while back.

        • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

          I would hope Jeter’s agent had a good idea what other teams were willing to offer before going into negotiations with the Yanks. As does Cashman, which is why there is not much Jeter is going to be able to do except pout.

          • Ed

            Considering his agent was able to get him $189m/10 without being able to drag other teams into the bidding, I think he knows what he’s doing.

            And let’s not forget A-Rod’s last negotiation. His previous deal was so big that the Yankees wouldn’t take it on without someone else paying 1/3 of it during his prime years. Despite that, he still managed to get the team to give him a raise for his decline years.

    • kenthadley

      why should they? who are they bidding against? Francesca said the Mets should jump at him. Dumbest statement in years. Some team is going to pay DJ more than 45/3 to watch his decline? Move his 10 hr bat to a corner position? That would be comparable to signing George Foster for his declining years, or Mo Vaughn. Yanks winning = success, regardless of the players.

      • mbonzo

        George Foster or Mo Vaugn? So you’re saying he’s gonna be a Met?

        • kenthadley

          nah, just what he’d become as a Met. Fill the seats for the first month, then watch as the team struggles to 75 wins and a half filled stadium.

    • mbonzo

      I’m sure thats not the max they will spend. If they were making a public offer like 3/$45 mil they will definitely have some room to play with. That room won’t be public though since they need to save some juice for the actual negotiation.

  • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

    Very nice summary of the situation.

    You know Cashman is serious when he breaks out the slang, “… takes away from our ability to add to our club, I ain’t gonna do it.” He might go all Clint Eastwood by the time this thing is over.

    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

      “…. a shortstop’s got to know his limitations…..”

      • kenthadley

        “go ahead, make that play”

        • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

          “You’ve got to ask yourself one question: ‘Do I feel lucky when my BABIP hits .375?’ Well, do ya punk?”

          • kenthadley

            upon entering City Field for opening day next year, “Who owns this shithole?”…

            • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

              “Deserve’s got nothin to do with it. You’re still out. “

              • Scout

                Spits tobacco juice.

                • king of fruitless hypotheticals

                  GET OFF MY LAWN!

                  #doinitwrong

      • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

        haha

    • RustyJohn

      “Be advised. I’m mean, nasty and tired. I eat concertina wire and piss napalm and I can put a round up a flea’s ass at 200 meters. So why don’t you go hump someone else’s leg, mutt face, before I push yours in.”

  • bonestock94

    I’m beginning to think Jeter in pinstripes is not a guarantee.

    • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

      Yea, I have already come to terms with that fact. Deep down, I still think they will figure it out.

    • Teh Comp Pick

      Retirement? Doesn’t want that.

      Leave 45 Mil on the table? Doesn’t want that either.

      Play for less money on a different team and recoup a small fraction of the 45 Mil? Pretty sure he doesn’t want to do that one either.

      Jeter will be in pinstripes next season. If he can still play in three years, he’ll be offered another salary, still probably in the eight figure range. If he can’t really play, but wants to, he’ll be offered a spot on the roster for significantly less.

      • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

        Jeter is rich enough where it is quite possible he would rather move on, than begrudgingly accept a deal he feels slighted by from the Yanks. I’m not saying I would bet on that, I would bet that he ends up accepting a deal with the Yanks, just that there is the definite possibility of it playing out like that.

        • Jonathan

          he doesn’t want to be Barry Bonds and one season away from 3000. of course, the commish probably blacklisted Barry but that’s a different story. he’s coming back.

          • Ed

            If Bonds was going to be blacklisted, it would’ve been before he broke the home run record. Why let him break one of the most famous records in sports, then blacklist him before he can become the 28th person to reach a milestone?

            • camilo Gerardo

              don’t underestimate selig, haha

        • Poopy Pants

          Good. I hope he does move on. He’s behaving like an ass.

          • The Big City of Dreams

            And what are the Yankees acting like?

            • Brian

              They are acting like business owners who realize they have all the leverage and don’t need to pay someone $15 to $20 million more than they have to…it’s a very smart position to hold and a good precedent for the Yanks to set as opposed to sign guys like AROD and Posada to longer than necessary contracts.

  • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

    “We’ve encouraged him to test the market and see if there’s something he would prefer other than this. If he can, fine. That’s the way it works.”

    Cash has said similar things with every free agent the Yanks have had, I remember something very similar when Mo was a FA a few years back, and I believe Posada as well. Yet somehow this was painted as a swipe against Jeter. Why? This is a baseball negotiation, they’re not hiring him to be ‘an icon’ they’re hiring him to play SS. A position that most advanced metrics say he plays more poorly than any other everyday player.

    Fans say “just pay him” as if they haven’t paid him already. He just finished a 189 mil contract. He’s 36, can’t hit the fastball like he used to, hasn’t fielded his position well for most of the past 5 years. If his name wasn’t Derek Jeter, the guy on the Ford/Gilette/Visa commercials, and you were just looking at him as a Baseball player you’d have to conclude Cashman is nuts to be offering him any more than 10 mil, tops. Yet 15 is “baffling”. Sorry, this one’s on Jetes and his agent.

    • Ed

      He’s 36, can’t hit the fastball like he used to

      Yes, he’s 36. While his age 36 season was the worst of his career, it’s still better than at least 90% of shortstops will do in their best season.

      There’s two ways to look at him at this point: either you think he’s done and just going to get worse, or you think this year was an off year and he’ll bounce back at least somewhat. If you think he’s done, you offer him 1 year so he can get his 3,000th hit and end his career as a Yankee. If you’re starting at $45m/3, then clearly you’re expecting him to remain productive.

      hasn’t fielded his position well for most of the past 5 years.

      Jeter was never a good defensive shortstop. He’s actually improved as he’s gotten older. His defense is only an issue now because advanced defensive stats have only becoming commonly available over the past few years.

      If you go by UZR, the past 3 years were by far the best 3 year stretch of his career. If you go by TZ, he’s been slightly below average for his entire career without any huge swings.

      If his name wasn’t Derek Jeter, the guy on the Ford/Gilette/Visa commercials, and you were just looking at him as a Baseball player you’d have to conclude Cashman is nuts to be offering him any more than 10 mil, tops.

      On the contrary, I think if his name was anything but Derek Jeter, people would be laughing really hard at the suggestion of $10m. That’s what you pay for a SS who gives you Jeter’s 2010 in a good year.

      • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

        All fair points, and I was trying to be generous on his defense and salary demands.

      • Owen

        “His defense is only an issue now because advanced defensive stats have only becoming commonly available over the past few years.”

        Disagree – it’s an issue now because his offensive skills no longer vastly outweigh his defensive limitations. Better metrics just make it easier to prove/articulate.

  • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

    Basically, my thoughts are that Jeter should be happy with 3/$45 and that’s in no way an insulting offer. I’m also definitely not in the “we should let Jeter walk” group because I think he’s still really valuable. I won’t lie, I care way more about the years than the money with him; we overpay almost everyone, that’s kind of the business model we have.

    That said, the negotiations through the media are really unprofessional on both sides and kind of gross, but I’m also sure they’re getting way overblown.

    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

      Personally, I think he’s over the hill and I think they’re nuts to offer him 3 years. Why do you think he’s “really valuable” going forward? I take that as being among the best at his position, and I just don’t see that when you look at his whole game.

      • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

        I take that as being among the best at his position, and I just don’t see that when you look at his whole game.

        Even in a year like 2010 Jeter’s one of the best shortstops in baseball (yes, even factoring in his defense). What do you do in 2011 and 2012 if you let him walk? I hear a lot of “well they can upgrade at other positions” but they already have plus bats at 2B, C, and CF. I am pretty low on Nunez and I wouldn’t want to trade for Bartlett. Guys like Tulo and Hanley are not available. I guess you could sign Uribe or something, Hardy if they let him go, but eh.

        • Accent Shallow

          I hear a lot of “well they can upgrade at other positions” but they already have plus bats at 2B, C, and CF.

          Who else on the free agent market is worth paying? Crawford or Werth? I’ll pass.

          Now, if it comes down to choosing Jeter or Cliff Lee, well, I think a lot of people would be quite conflicted.

          • Accent Shallow

            I should have noted that I was agreeing with you, that it’s tough to upgrade the other positions in such a valuable way.

        • UWS

          Yes, Jeter was one of the best shortstops in baseball this year. But that’s not necessarily because of his awesomeness, more like everyone else utterly stunk up the joint. Jeter is still a fairly valuable contributer, but fair’s fair.

          • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

            True, but everyone else stinking up the joint is a fair point to bring up. SS is not a traditional offensive position, so much so that even hitting like Jeter in 2010 makes you valuable. If he was, like, a DH, he’d obviously be damn near useless.

          • Chris

            Isn’t it somewhat telling that everyone else at SS also struggled this year (plus the other positions to some extent)?

            Which is more likely, Jeter having a (somewhat) bounceback year or the whole SS position having a bounceback year?

            • Ed

              Which is more likely, Jeter having a (somewhat) bounceback year or the whole SS position having a bounceback year?

              I’m going to say Jeter bouncing back is more likely.

              Having shortstops like Jeter/Nomar/A-Rod/Tejada is incredibly rare in baseball. We’ve gotten spoiled by having a batch like that, and from what we know now, steroids had a big part in that.

              What we saw from shortstops this year was the norm before the steroid era.

          • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

            I like that phrase “a fairly valuable contributor”. That pretty much sums it up.

        • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

          Even in a year like 2010 Jeter’s one of the best shortstops in baseball (yes, even factoring in his defense).

          http://www.fangraphs.com/leade.....38;month=0

          Of the 21 SS who posted a positive WAR, he ranks 9th. That’s middling, not elite. HIs 2.5 WAR was nowhere near Tulo, Drew or Hanley.

          As to you 2nd point/question, I agree completely. We really don’t have a viable alternative. I’ve always felt both sides need each other and this thing will get settled. But I still think 3 years is nuts for him.

          • Chris

            Over the last 2 years he was third, and over the last 3 years (including bad a 2008 and a bad 2010) he was second.

            If you honestly believe that his 2010 is better than he’ll do for the next 3 seasons, then you have a reasonable point. However, it’s at least equally likely that he’ll have some sort of bounceback.

            • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

              That’s the thing, I really think he’s lost bat speed. Look at his pitch type values for 2010.

              http://www.fangraphs.com/stats.....itchvalues

              Didn’t hit the fastball, or much of anything else. First time in his career he’s been bad across the board like that. That’s what players look like when they’re getting old.

              • Chris

                That’s what a player looks like when he has a bad year. It could be age, it could be injury, it could be something else.

                Look at Cano’s 2008. Looks pretty bad across the board – particularly against fastballs, which could indicate poor bat speed.

                http://www.fangraphs.com/stats.....itchvalues

                Obviously, Cano’s 2008 wasn’t related to getting old, but we’ll probably never know exactly why his 2008 was so bad. It’s similar with Jeter. Maybe he’ll continue his decline, or maybe he’ll rededicate himself this offseason to proving everyone wrong next year. He did this with his defense a couple of years ago. He doesn’t have to improve much to become an elite hitting SS again – adding just 10 points to his wOBA would make him the 4th best hitting SS in baseball (behind Tulo, Hanley and Drew).

                • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

                  No, in Cano’s 2008 he was bad against the fastball but good against the slider, which signals a change in approach. In Jeter’s 04 season, he was bad against the fastball but killed the slider and change, and had a career 2nd best 24 HRs. Again, change in approach.

                  But in 2010, Jeter was bad across the board. Betwixt and between, as they say. The only thing he hit a little was the curveball, and anyone can hit a hanging meatball.

                  • Chris

                    anyone can hit a hanging meatball.

                    Except, apparently, Jeter before 2010.

                    I don’t agree that Cano’s 2008 was a change in approach. He sucked. It happens. Just because he happened to be slightly better against sliders doesn’t necessarily mean he had a different approach. The difference against sliders in 2008 and 2009 is roughly 6 singles in the whole season. That doesn’t seem to be a large enough sample size to prove anything.

                    The same idea with Jeter. It could have been many things – including age. I just find it hard to believe that a player will drop off so steeply from a (nearly) career best year to being so bad. Maybe it happened to Jeter, but the more likely case is that he’ll bounce back somewhat and put up a few more seasons slightly better than his 2010, but worse than his career norms.

                    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

                      If you find it hard to believe, look through Derek’s player comps.

                      http://www.baseball-reference......de01.shtml

                      Alomar, Larkin, Frisch, Gehringer, Trammel, Morgan and Simmons all had a dip in their production in their mid 30s, then one big year before being finished. Sound familiar?

                    • Chris

                      Alomar – he was (reportedly) diagnosed with full blown aids a few years after leaving baseball, so he’s probably not a good comp.

                      Larkin – He missed a lot of time with injuries, which finally caught up to him. Even in his prime, he was never as durable as Jeter.

                      Frisch and Gehringer are reasonable comps, but we’re talking about the ’30s and ’40s with them.

                      Trammel and Simmons both started to show declines at about age 31. They hung on and remained somewhat productive for 6-8 years after that decline really started.

                      Morgan started to show his decline in his mid 30′s (similar to Jeter) and still managed to put up 3.8 WAR per season from age 37-39.

                      So, I don’t think it’s clear that just because he had one bad year he’s done as a valuable player.

          • bennyprofane

            But “viable alternative” I think is predicated on the player that Derek Jeter was. Meaning, as Yankee fans we have been spoiled with Hall of Fame caliber play, particularly offense, from SS for 15 years. Meanwhile, over those 15 years, tow teams have won the world series with Jaun Uribe. One with David Eckstein. Also, up until 2005, we had been accustomed to consistent, but not dynamic play from another premium defensive postiion, 2B, and been successful. The point? Perhaps SS becomes a defense first position, where offensive production is welcome, but lack thereof is supplemented by thunder elsewhere? This diminished production could still come from Jeter, but at a rate beyond 3 yrs and 45-60mil… why?

            • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

              Well, I’d argue that except for a few blips here and there, SS has been a defense-first position full of weak bats. Jeter’s been a very good hitter throughout his career but he’s hardly a slugger like, say, A-Rod or something. If he couldn’t play a position and was stuck at 1B or DH or something, he wouldn’t be the surefire HOF he is. Also, the teams that won with Eckstein and the like were different than the Yankees. I mean, look at the offenses of the Yankees in any one given year, and then compare it to the offenses of, say, the 2005 Astros/White Sox, the two World Series teams. Both of those offenses were awful… but the Yankees didn’t have even close to their pitching.

              Also, up until 2005, we had been accustomed to consistent, but not dynamic play from another premium defensive postiion, 2B, and been successful.

              Kinda funny you say that considering we had Soriano there from 2001-2003, who was pretty darn good offensively and horrible defensively.

            • Klemy

              But to be fair, one team won 5 with a shortstop named Jeter, who was putting up the better offensive numbers. It stands to reason that providing offense from that spot is better than not.

              • Klemy

                Bah, cite fail. Was in response to: “Meanwhile, over those 15 years, tow teams have won the world series with Jaun Uribe. One with David Eckstein.”

      • Matt

        If over the hill is having more hits that approximately 285 out of 300 everyday position players, I will take over the hill each and every day.

    • Brian

      Years are the most important part of the contract, I think some of the reports that say the Yanks may add money to the 3 yr offer lines up with that thinking and even the reports saying the Yanks aren’t inclined to go past 1 yr for Mo lines up with the Yanks wanting to keep the years down and move to getting younger as quickly as possible.

  • http://www.twitter.com/ngoral Jake LaMotta’s Left Hook

    I do not like the last sentence to this post, but was that quote not taken out of context?

  • Ultimate Yankee Warrior (James)

    Uh-oh. Now this:

    “Hank Steinbrenner has a message as the New York Yankees negotiate to re-sign Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera.

    “As much as we want to keep everybody, we’ve already made these guys very, very rich, and I don’t feel we owe anybody anything monetarily,” the Yankees co-chairman said Tuesday. “Some of these players are wealthier than their bosses.”

    http://www.nytimes.com/aponlin.....er.html?hp

    • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

      You know what, I’m starting to like it. This is highly entertaining. Where is Hal when you need him?

      • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

        This thing is moving so fast, Ben’s article is outdated like 20 minutes after is was posted.

    • candyforstalin

      thank god jeter is a free agent this year.

    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

      Go Hank go!

    • RustyJohn

      Love it- they should get rid of Trump and hire Hank for The Apprentice.

  • http://yanksdraftsandprospects.blogspot.com/ Jake H

    Jeter is a 10 million a year player right now. They are over paying him by 50%. If they want to add some milestone bonus do that.

    • Chris

      He was a $10M player in 2010. That doesn’t necessarily mean he’ll be worth $10M going forward. He was worth $32M in 2009 and $16.5M in 2008.

  • http://twitter.com/dpatrickg Dirty Pena

    If it’s in any way true that the A-Rod contract is affecting Jeter’s negotiations, there’s a simple solution: Offer 10M when he passes 500 HR, 600, 660, 714, 755, and 762. That’s 60M right there!

    • Mike Myers

      Ha,awesome.

      This is just a case of an agent not realizing the market. Jeter should be very happy with 15 mil. They owe jeter what they gave him…almost 200 mil.

      • Ed

        This is just a case of an agent not realizing the market.

        This is a case of an agent doing his jobs, and fans complaining because players who make more money in a year than they ever will have the nerve to actually try to negotiate their salaries.

    • forensic

      ietc

    • http://www.twitter.com/ngoral Jake LaMotta’s Left Hook

      Offer another 20 million for Jeter if he wins the MVP, Cy Young, Silver Slugger, and Rookie of the Year awards.

    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

      COTD

  • kenthadley

    How did the greed card work for Johnny Damon?

  • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

    It turns out that “he chooses not to be” quote was actually totally wrongly quoted by @Ledger_Yankees. It’s “He should be nothing but a New York Yankee, if he chooses to be.” Much less harsh. Much.

    http://twitter.com/#!/Ledger_Y.....5407882240

    • bonestock94

      lol, thats very very different

    • http://www.twitter.com/ngoral Jake LaMotta’s Left Hook

      WAY TO GO MEDIA!

  • forensic

    Wow, go Cashman!!! Didn’t realize he said all that, just saw the cliff-notes version on the ESPN ticker.

    The comments in this thread certainly have the potential to be very entertaining (and contentious).

  • Avi

    So if Jeter doesn’t sign with the Yanks I would instead sign Soriano to set up Mo and still have money to bring in a second player.
    What would you do?

    • mbonzo

      Oh please, Jeter will be a Yankee. Who’s gonna offer him 3/$45?

      • bonestock94

        Do we suddenly think bad contracts will stop happening if Jeter hits the market? I wouldn’t be surprised if some bad front office beat 3/45.

        • Corporate Scum (Formerly Joe West’s Music Career)

          *cough*marlins*cough*

        • vinny-b

          sorry. Not going to happen. This is 2010.

          • bonestock94

            There have been plenty of bad deals in recent history.

          • Ed

            Have you seen the signings so far this offseason?

            John Buck, $18m/3 years
            Joaquin Benoit, $16.5m/3 years
            Ted Lilly, $33m/3 years

            Vazquez is rumored to have teams talking about a multi-year deal.

            A few weeks ago you would’ve laughed if someone predicted any of that.

            • Corporate Scum (formerly Joe West’s Music Career)

              The Lilly deal doesn’t belong with the others IMHO. It’s a little rich, given a down year plus aging, but it falls well short of the outrageous nature of the other two… (not to mention Aubrey Huff)

    • http://www.twitter.com/ngoral Jake LaMotta’s Left Hook

      Not sign Soriano.

    • Accent Shallow

      And who plays short? Nunez? I’m not Mike Axisa, but I’m not exactly high on Nunez. Pena? Pena is freakin’ terrible, I barely want him as the utility infielder.

      • vinny-b

        I will settle for Nunez. Thank you

        • Accent Shallow

          Yeah?

          He hit .280/.321/.360 last year in the majors. Ok, that’s only 53 PAs, so who cares?

          2010 minors: .289/.340/.381
          2009 minors: .322/.349/.433

          And he’s not a great defender. Pass. He’s ok if Jeter were to get hurt, but I don’t want that as the starter going into ST.

      • Avi

        You know Reyes is a free agent at the end of the year. I’m not a huge Reyes guy but at this point you have to take his 2012 and 2013 over Jeter’s.
        I’d be fine with Nunez at SS with the 15M per invested wisely elsewhere.

        • Accent Shallow

          Unless that 15M has to go to Lee, where is it going to be spent? I’d say it has to go to paying a trade acquisition, because there’s not much of interest/use on the FA market. You don’t just get to bank that 15M for a rainy day, you know.

          • Avi

            If you don’t love the free agent class that’s fine. Hold onto the money. Things happen quickly in baseball.
            Before last season no one foresaw Oswalt being dealt. Prince and Adrian Gonzo could easily be available. Who knows which teams fall out of the race and their players become available etc.

            • Accent Shallow

              But there’s one big problem with your plan — Nunez does not appear to be a viable major league starter. If you need to go cheap at one or more positions to afford someone else, that’s baseball. But that doesn’t mean you should field someone who looks replacement level-ish to save some money.

              • Avi

                I don’t think the difference between Jeter and replacement level equals $15M. He’s already over market value.

              • Brian

                How do you know Nunez doesn’t appear to be a viable Major League starter? The position he is going to play possibly for the Yanks is SS so he doesn’t need to bat .330 w/25 HR’s and 100 RBI’s. He will bat 9th and provide a non automatic out in the position. I have no idea how his defense will play since he barely played last year.

                I saw him in quite a few AAA games last year and he hits the ball hard, makes contact more often than not and if he can get on base more than 33% of the time he would be an improvement offensively from Jeter last year.

    • candyforstalin

      i’m with you. and wood for the 7th.

    • JerseyDutch

      You know, I’m not a big Nunez fan but I’d go with the kid until the trade deadline and see if we can get a cheap upgrade. Use the extra money to sweeten the Lee deal if you need to.

      • vinny-b

        agree.

        you know, NYY fans in general are very shortsighted. Things happen. Players who weren’t available become available (even SS’s). It wouldn’t suprise me if Hanley Ramirez is the next player Florida trys to trade in the next year. And if it’s not him, another shortstop will hit the market. Not concerned. In the meantime, i will be satisfied with Nunez

        • Accent Shallow

          And if it’s not him, another shortstop will hit the market.

          If Ramirez is traded, Loria should have the franchise taken away. Who else is a worthwhile SS in MLB? Tulo? Not going anywhere. Stephen Drew? Who knows, but I don’t know if I want a Drew brother on the team. After that, it’s slim pickings.

          • Avi

            You know Jeter ain’t too hefty anymore.

            • Accent Shallow

              From 2008-2010, he averaged an OBP of .369. That’s not exactly weak.

              Now, his defense? Yikes.

              • Avi

                I think 2010 is the much more relevant year than 2008 and 2009, considering that as time goes humans get older.

                • Accent Shallow

                  No shit.

                  But when projecting players going forward, you have to look at what they’ve done in the past. Even if Jeter is done, I’d bet his 2011 is better than his 2010. You can’t just look at the most recent season and say “Ok, that’s it,” otherwise we would only use projection systems for players under 30.

                  • Avi

                    What do you want the Yankees to do with Jeter?

                  • Brian

                    Well there it is you should call the Yanks and let them know that they have to take the 3 yr sample size in rating Jeter so they can give him a 4 yr deal for $100 million since “your bet” is he will be better than last year.

  • Sheepmeister

    Does anyone think that Jeter doesn’t sign to the Yankees cut contract as a matter of “principle” a la damon and torre.

    • kenthadley

      if that happens then Derek Jeter has been masking his complete idiocy all these years….

  • Jake Barnes

    It would certainly be a shame to see Jeter reach 3,000 hits in another uniform. Then again his hits with the Nippon Fighting Ham wouldn’t count, cause no MLB team is giving Jeter more than 15 mil a year even to torment the Yankees.

    • kenthadley

      we’ve seen Wade Boggs get his 3000th hit in Tampa…big deal. I watched Warren Spahn and Yogi Berra struggle to play in Mets uniforms at the end. If the player wants to direct his career in that way so be it; heck even Willie Mays ended up a tripping fool because he didn’t know how to end it.

      • Accent Shallow

        All those guys were in their 40s, then. And Boggs, actually had a useful OBP — .360 over two seasons.

        • kenthadley

          not for 15 mil a year

      • Guest

        Co-sign. Babe Ruth finished as a Boston Brave.

        There’s nothing new under the sun.

        I want Captain Jetes to go wire to wire as a Yankee. I grew up with him as the center of a constellation of stars. It feels right.

        But the Yanks should not write him a blank check to make it happen. Just because we gave A-Rod a trave-sha-mockery of a contract in 2007 doesn’t mean we should make the same mistake now. Two wrongs don’t make a right.

        In the end, I think Jeter will realize that the Yankees (1) are willing to pay him much more money than anyone else on the market, and (2) his brand will take a hit (that might be felt in his future income potential) if he finishes his career in another uniform.

        After he accepts this, he will suck it up, take the contract that vastly overpays him for what his likely future production will be, and lead the Yankees out of the dugout on opening day 2011.

        • Chris

          Co-sign. Babe Ruth finished as a Boston Brave.

          Damn right. He should have just taken the money, shut up and stayed with the Red Sox to finish his career.

      • Eric Young

        I watched Warren Spahn and Yogi Berra struggle to play in Mets uniforms at the end.

        Yogi’s “career” with the Mets consisted of 18 innings…couldn’t have been that painful to watch.

    • JerseyDutch

      I’m completely indifferent to the whole 3,000 hits milestone. It’s great for Jeter but doesn’t do a lot for me. I want to see #28.

    • Pasqua

      A couple of days of fanfare (re: 3,000) is not worth any more than what they’re offering him.

  • http://twitter.com/cephster Ross in Jersey

    I appreciate all that Jeter has done as a Yankee but it comes down to the fact that he was paid 200 million dollars for his services. The Yankees don’t owe him a god damn thing. And cold hard fact is the Yankees, as a team, probably are better off without Jeter locked into shortstop for the next 3-4 years at far more dollars than he’s worth. If he wants a huge deal than the Yankees and Cashman are 100% right about the stance they’re taking.

    Last point, Jeter’s record is not clean. He was a shitty teammate to Alex Rodriguez as soon as he got there, despite Alex changing positions to accommodate him. Throughout all of A-rod’s struggles in the postseason, Torre batting him 8th, etc… not once did Jeter stand up for Alex and say it’s only a matter of time before someone of his talent level gets big hits.

    • http://twitter.com/SteveH_MandAura Steve H

      This.

    • UWS

      A thousand times this.

    • vinny-b

      don’t forget the game in Seattle, a few years back:

      Both benches empty, there is a brawl taking place on the field. Where is Jeter? Protecting another teamamte? Not exactly. Derek Jeter is off to the side apart from the rest of his teamates, laughing and engaged in light horseplay with Alex Rodriguez of the Seattle Mariners.

      • Chris

        Why would his teammates require protection?

        • vinny-b

          there was a fight taking place on the field. That’s why. In baseball (or any team sport) you have your teammates back

      • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

        You’re Chad Curtis, aren’t you? Well this makes a lot of sense now.

        • vinny-b

          I sided with Chad Curtis at the time. And i still do

          • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

            You really hate Jeter and always have, we get it. Not sure why, but we get it.

            • vinny-b

              and you’re pro-Jeter, and can do no wrong in your eyes. We get it, Rebecca.

              • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

                No, not really.

              • Poopy Pants

                Aww snap! Someone got out-snarked!

                • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

                  darn, me and my cheerleading numbnuts ponytail got out-… I wouldn’t even say snarked, more like condescended, but sure.

          • Accent Shallow

            You have to abide by the unwritten rules — unless you’re a star.

            • Klemy

              Then you just jog over their mound like it’s your own.

    • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

      Out of all the reasons to give him shit, his character should not be one of them.

    • Brian

      Good point. Jeter got his money prior to the 2001 season and the Yanks have won only one time since. Not Jeter’s fault at all but I think his legacy as a Yankee is tied to championships and team play not individual performance (record setting regular season stats) so if he decides to walk then we are seeing his true colors and he is no different than a guy like AROD who likes being overpaid.

  • http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21

    Give Jeter a 3 year $66 million contract and take away $250,000 every time Kay says “Past a diving Jeter”.

    • Corporate Scum (Formerly Joe West’s Music Career)

      Jeter would give so much back he would end up averaging league minimum for his entire career.

    • http://twitter.com/SteveH_MandAura Steve H

      They’re not allowed to pay him less than the minimum.

    • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

      So Jeter would end up paying the Yankees money?

    • Corporate Scum (Formerly Joe West’s Music Career)

      Problem with this is it would make sense for Jeter to pay someone to kill Kay.

      (….actually…..hmmmm….)

      • Evan3457

        Win-win.

        That was uncalled for.

        I apologize.

    • larryf

      He won’t be able to dive anymore-he was never good at it anyway.

  • YankFanDave

    Yanks are handling it well, go read the FanGraphs piece “Jeter is the New manny” at http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs.....new-manny/

    It’s not about his behavior, attitude or play but his negotiation strategy.

    One question, is this true?, “the club has a plan and they are, in spite of mounting public criticism, sticking with it.” I’ve actually seen very little criticism for the way the Yanks are proceeding.

    • UWS

      Agree on your last point. So far, the only people criticizing the way Yanks have negotiated are the likes of Francesa, which doesn’t really count.

      • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

        I think it’s pretty unprofessional for the Yankees (and Jeter’s agent, too) to negotiate in the press. The Yankees have like 99% of the leverage, what’s the point of that? But I think it’s probably getting blown out of proportion, or quotes are just plain wrong, IE the “he chooses not to be” quote that wasn’t.

        • Pasqua

          Unprofessional, but a sign of the times. Public sentiment carries a lot of weight, what with talk radio and the blogosphere. They both want those “markets” speaking on their behalf.

      • Chris

        That does count, because he still represents a significant portion of the Yankee fan base.

    • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

      I’m sure the thought of allowing Jeter to sign with another team is good for a Cashman death threat or two. Or at least a flaming bag of poop or two through his window.

    • Pasqua

      Even talk radio is pretty pro-organization thus far. When that crowd is being rational, you KNOW Jeter is screwed in terms of public perception.

  • Pasqua

    Jeter’s not going to hurt anybody but himself if this keeps going on. Turn down the money, ruin your reputation and play for half of the cash somewhere else. That’s a lose / lose. I would think a guy as savvy as him would see the writing on the wall here…a majority of the fanbase will turn on him. The spin on this has quickly transformed into one that portrays the Yankees as realistic and Jeter as greedy.

  • Teh Comp Pick

    It’s really about time Jason Varitek weighs in on all this. Dudes caught 4 no hitters.

    • http://twitter.com/cephster Ross in Jersey

      He’s too busy preparing to be the Red Sox main catcher next year.

  • http://captnsblog.wordpress.com/ Captain’s Blog

    For the life of me, I can’t figure out why Jeter is drawing so much negative sentiment. He hasn’t officially rejected anything yet, nor has he made any inflammatory comments. Can we at least wait until he does something provocative before we criticize him. I’d like to think that after 15 great years he at least deserves that.

    • Pasqua

      I see what you’re saying, but in this day and age, I think the feeling is that the agent speak on behalf of the player. If his camp is “baffled,” it’s logical to infer that Jeter is.

      The only way this is proven to be untrue is if Jeter pulls an A-Rod after this contract is negotiated and throws his agent under the bus for speaking out of turn.

      • vinny-b

        yup.

    • Hughesus Christo

      Bad economy = common man turning to plutocracy. Always.

    • JerseyDutch

      It’s more to criticize before you have all the facts.

      • JerseyDutch

        “more fun”

  • Hughesus Christo

    Annnnnnnd hand is overplayed. Allowing this (consciously putting this) into the media was asinine. Unless this all happened with the intention of upping the offer to make “everyone happy” at the end they created a terrible situation for this offseason. And reminder to everyone that Rivera and Andy haven’t signed anything yet.

    Shit meeting fan countdown…

    • Pasqua

      Eh. It’s not nuclear weapon treaties we’re talking about here. It’s baseball. Shit gets weird, then it ends, then we play.

      • Chris

        Jeter’s feelings will be hurt right up to the point he signs a guaranteed contract for $50M+.

        • Klemy

          When he’ll say to the media, “I’m very happy to say we got a deal done that made everyone happy. I knew we’d get this deal done all the long.”

    • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

      I’m sure this is all Girardi’s fault in some way.

      • JerseyDutch

        Fire Gerardi!

        Man, I haven’t said that in ages. Feels good… feels good.

        • JerseyDutch

          Jeez, “Girardi”… can’t believe I typo’ed that.

      • Corporate Scum (Formerly Joe West’s Music Career)

        Binder-based negotiating strategy FTW

    • steve (different one)

      i’d agree with you except the EXACT same thing happened 3 years ago with Posada, Andy, and Mo.

      everyone was up in arms that the free agents were going to leave b/c papa Joe went to LA.

      then they all signed.

  • All Star Carl

    Casey Close shouldn’t have came to the media saying what the Yankees are doing is baffling.

    Jeter hasn’t said much. He’s getting his client smashed. He should know its nothing personal though, it’s just business.

  • UWS

    Well, at the very least it’s been a very entertaining offseason thus far.

    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

      Better than the Texas series, that’s for sure.

      • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

        Then again, I’ve been to funerals that were better than the Texas series.

  • V

    If Jeter can get more than 3x$15 from another club, let them have him.

    • billbybob

      I’ll pay him 45 bucks to be the shortstop on my fantasy whiffelball team.

  • http://twitter.com/kschmidt2 Kiersten

    You know something, this is making me lose so much respect for Jeter. I understand trying to get the most money you can – and he’s not wrong for that. But he has to understand that the Yankees are trying to sign Cliff Lee right now, to make his team better and give him a better chance to win a few more World Series during his last major contract. All his career he’s supposedly been all about the team and winning, yeah well I’m calling bullshit on that.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

      All his career he’s supposedly been all about the team and winning, yeah well I’m calling bullshit on that.

      He was all about winning when he was taking to the Yankees to arbitration for record-setting salary awards back in the late-90′s. It was clearly what was best for the team.

    • Accent Shallow

      I’m not too upset with Jeter, but I’m not thrilled with Casey Close’s negotiating through the media.

      I’m not thrilled with Cashman/the Steinbros responding in kind, either, but you have to think they’d get killed in the media if they didn’t.

      • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

        If they didn’t respond, Casey Close would be setting the debate. They have to get their side of the story out and make their case to the fans and public. Can’t be all one-sided.

    • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

      Except, if you are the guy that accepts less money than you think you are worth so the Steinbrenners make that much more profit at the end of the day, then you are sucker. And I can surely understand why Jeter thinks a contract offer of three years at a considerable pay cut, followed by some harsh words in the press, is a bit insulting. Is that offer probably his cold, hard value? Yes. Do I understand why Jeter feels like he is worth more to the Yanks regardless of what other teams are willing to offer? Yes to that too.

      • Teh Comp Pick

        They’ve already lined his pockets with something around two hundred million dollars. I would suspect that the A-rod deal has a lot to do with his ridiculous expectations.

        • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

          Or the fact that the Yanks are all but telling him they think he is old and possibly washed up. Players love to hear that. They take that just fine. Especially Jeter.

          • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

            I’m not really sure what they’ve said along those lines that was objectionable. He is old for a shortstop, his 2010 was pretty bad and his 2008 was mediocre (and, to be fair, his 2009 was excellent). In interviews, of course Cashman and etc. is going to express concern. I don’t really have a problem with that when asked about it. Gotta agree with what YankeesJunkie said.

        • YankeesJunkie

          Jeter should realize that A-Rod was coming off a 9.2 WAR season and while that contract was ridiculous in length the salary especially the first few years was probably only a few million over what he would have gotten elsewhere. Jeter on the other hand is coming off his worst season ever (1995 not included) and expects to get a deal similar to A-Rod he is delusional.

    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

      He’s all about the team, winning, and driving around in his new Ford Edge with the cool vista roof.

      • larryf

        Doesn’t drive one. He drives a 200K Mercedes (Florida plates) and a ferrari.

    • Matt

      Because Cliff Lee was great in the World Series

  • Yazman

    3/$45 million is well above market for a player with Jeter’s projected value — and as it should be for a player of his stature.

    I really hope he signs.

  • ND Mike

    I think we know how to settle all of this. Call the players union, get them to pull 5 mil a year for the next 4 years from A-Rod’s contract and add it to the Yankees offer sheet. A-Rod can consider it a charitable donation and Jeter can stay where he belongs.

  • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

    Anyone have any idea why the Yanks didn’t offer Derek (and Mo) arb? As Type As, if they were to leave thenyou would get draft pick compensation, which also affects their market value to a prospective team.

    • http://theyankeeu.com Matt Imbrogno

      Yeah, offering arbitration would’ve strengthened the Yankees’ leverage in both negotiations.

      • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

        We all thought those two were slam dunks, and then they did neither.

        • Avi

          No, Offering arbitration would’ve HURT the yankees leverage with Jeter. Jeter would make about $23M in arbitration. If you’re Jeter you take that contract and you’d need to get just a two year deal @ 11M per year to equal the yankee’s current offer (3 years 45M).

          • http://theyankeeu.com Matt Imbrogno

            Jeter for one overpaid year is better than Jeter for two-four overpaid years.

            • Chris

              Unless he comes back and has a 2011 that’s better than his 2010. Then he demands at least 3/$45 a year from now on top of being over paid in 2011.

              • http://theyankeeu.com Matt Imbrogno

                If he has a good year in ’11, the Yankees aren’t obligated to bring him back.

                • Brian

                  Yanks aren’t obligated to bring him back this year and by offering arb they would be obligated to bring him back at a rate higher than they are willing to pay. I agree that 1 year isn’t that big of a deal but if your trying to sign Cliff Lee and looking to get Mo in as well then you might be well over the $200 million they like to remain at before the season starts.

            • Avi

              “Jeter for one overpaid year is better than Jeter for two-four overpaid years.”

              It’s a good point, I agree but to what extent? If they offer him arbitration they’re overpaying him by $8M which is more than 50% of what his total 2012 salary would be.
              I think two years @ 30M is clearly better than one year 23M.

          • http://theyankeeu.com Matt Imbrogno

            And, attaching draft pick compensation to Jeter makes him less attractive to other teams. He’s already an older player at a premium position who’s entering his decline phase (age based, obviously; he could rebound in ’11); that player isn’t very attractive WITHOUT compensation and is even less so WITH compensation.

            • Klemy

              Exactly this.

  • Chris R

    I wonder what Cliff Lee’s wife thinks about this.

    • nathan

      she is still wiping off imaginary spits.

    • JerseyDutch

      The thought of $25 million a year is doing good things in her heart.

    • RustyJohn

      I don’t know, let me ask her…

      “Kristen, what do you think about this?”

      “Mmmmpff…gag…slurp….”

      • http://twitter.com/dpatrickg Dirty Pena

        Are you suggesting Kristen Lee has oral sex with her husband? What a ponytail wearing, cheerleading whore!!!

        • Klemy

          I think he’s more suggesting she has oral sex with….him.

  • http://twitter.com/kschmidt2 Kiersten

    On the bright side, if Jeter walks, he won’t be leading off.

    • http://www.theyankeeu.com/author/steve-s/ Nostra-Artist

      If Jeter walks, he wouldn’t hit into all those double plays.

      • JobaWockeeZ

        IETC.

    • steve (different one)

      if Jeter still walked, it wouldn’t be problem that he leads off

    • http://theyankeeu.com Matt Imbrogno

      I don’t think we have to worry about Jeter walking; he seemingly forgot how to do that this year. HIYO!

      • Accent Shallow

        Disagree. His BB% was more or less in line with his career rate. The issue is that he hit .270 instead of >.305, which resulted in the OBP being .340, rather than >.375

        • http://theyankeeu.com Matt Imbrogno

          Your facts are ruining my joke. I do not appreciate that and nether does my joke. Apologize!

          • Accent Shallow

            Sorry. Jeter has taken so much (deserved) crap, that we should blame him for what he does poorly, not what he still does well.

    • Hughesus Christo

      Right, enjoy Juan Uribe–or one of the dozens of imaginary mid-90s free agent shortstops you guys keep referring to.

      • Corporate Scum (Formerly Joe West’s Music Career)

        A-rod to short, Scotty Bro back to third. 28 baby!

      • http://theyankeeu.com Matt Imbrogno

        Jeter is, no doubt, the best SS option for the Yankees. But, there’s got to be a limit on the price (and that limit is already extremely high, given the market and the “demand” for Jeter’s services).

        • Hughesus Christo

          Dude, Derek Jeter SUCKED this year. Don’t come at me with your “comparisons to his peers” garbage. I know what I see… with my eyes.

          • http://twitter.com/dpatrickg Dirty Pena

            Do you understand the concept that your eyes don’t see any of the other SSs in the majors for more than a handful of games?

            • Klemy

              I think he was mocking other posters there.

      • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

        Just out of curiosity, would you be willing to pay Jeter 5-6 more years at his current aav? Which is what Jeter is looking for by all indications

        • Hughesus Christo

          There are no “indications” beyond what the Yankees have been overtly leaking to the media.

          • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

            So what do you think should be the Yanks “final offer?” For me, personally, it is a tough one. I love Jeter and want to see him back on the team. On the otherhand, 3 for 15 per does sound relatively fair. I would not exactly call that offer “playing hardball.”

  • Jonathan

    Listen, i’m sure Derek ends up a Yankee for life. He isn’t going to get within at least 15 million of the Yankees offer from anyone else. And unlike with most FA (where they actually prefer to take less from someone else than their original team because of pride) I believe if Jeter had a 3/50 million dollar offer from the Nationals or Royals or something he’d rather stay in NY where his brand is much higher and he has a chance to win and he’s made a baseball home. Not that that is going to happen. I seriously hope Close tries to shop that offer and gets laughed at. Maybe he can make up a mystery team like Sabean did to explain giving the Human Outlier Aubrey Huff $22MM in the year of the FA 1B.

    But for those of you acting like we can just wait until the trade deadline or a couple of years to get a new stud SS, why don’t you take a look at Boston. They traded Nomar (wisely, aka steroids/body failing) and have spent every year since then trying to replace him and have tried every avenue there is. They went with OCab for a year who was okay from a trade. Then they signed a big FA who tanked in Renteria. Then they went with another FA defense first stopgap with Agonz in 06. Then another big contract to Lugo that was a joke. Then they went with a combo of a home grown Jed Lowrie and Lugo. Then they signed the top FA SS again with Scutaro who sucked. 7 years, 2 trades for all defense no bat stop gaps, 3 times signing the top FA SS who all bombed, and another FA in Agonz. They’ve gone every route and it’s been impossible. Obviously, they won the WS 2 times with those SS so you can surely win without an elite SS but great SS just don’t hit the FA market anymore. We can survive without Derek but acting like the replacement will be anything close is whistling in the dark.

    • nathan

      Except you are going to be looking for a SS anyway.

      If you think in 2 years Jeter will still be a decent SS then I promise you in 2 years AJ will be a #2 and Javy will be a #3. // not bloody likely

      We are going to be searching for a SS anyway.

      • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?#!/profile.php?id=9370232 Mike HC

        I think Jeter will be at least a decent shortstop then. I personally don’t think he is done. He may never reach the level he was in his prime, but I think he can be better, or at least equal to, what he did last year for the next 3-4 years. Just my opinion and I could obviously be completely wrong. Time will tell.

      • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S

        We keep pointing is out, but Jeter was among the top in AL SS in terms of Offensive production.

        But really, doesn’t that say how shitty SS have become with the bat? Cesar Izturis?! Really?!

        • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

          SS have always been shitty with the bat, as someone else pointed out a lot of us probably grew up with the blip that was Ripken, A-Rod, Nomar, Jeter, Tejada, etc.

          • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S

            To an extent, that’s be me. So, yeah, sad face :(

        • Jonathan

          ya the SS pool is terrible. We all know that. Which is also a main reason to not let Jeter go. There isn’t a replacement. A top 5 SS is a top 5 SS regardless of what numbers the SS pool is putting up. It’s still just as hard to replace. Ever play fantasy baseball? SS is a joke.

          And I agree with the guys/gals below that we grew up in a steroid era where Arod/Tejada/Nomar were putting up video game numbers and now that it is starting to normalize we need to realize what SS’s usually hit like. I really don’t know what happened with Derek, but one thing is for sure, his approach COMPLETELY changed. I don’t know if that was from an injury or a loss of bat speed but I’d like to see what Klong can do with him and I hope they MAKE him work on lateral range like before 2009. I wonder if he didn’t do that work b4 2010. It seems strange you can go from bad range in 08, then do lateral agility training and have good-great range in 09, then suck again in 10.

      • Jonathan

        So a guy with one bad year can’t turn it around even a little bit? Remember in 2008 when he had a bad year and his defense was slipping and everyone said it was the end? Remember what happened the next year? I’m not saying he’s going to be a 7 win player next year but i expect a better season than 2010. Comparing Jeter’s situation to one of AJ Burnett and Javy is just ridiculous. Even if Jeter can’t play SS in the last year (3rd) of his deal, I’d rather have him play at an above average level for the first 2 years than rolling out Nunez for 2 years. Do you expect Cliff Lee to be a dominant ace in 6 years? If you don’t then according to your logic, we shouldn’t sign him. FA contracts don’t work like that. There will probably be a year that the guy doesn’t perform to an elite level. Teixeira had a down year this year, should we get rid of him and is the contract a bust or bad idea?

        I wan’t to hear your plan if not Jeter. Maybe the Marlins would take Gardner/Cano/Montero/Sanchez/Romine/Killer B’s/Hughes and $30 million for Hanley. You’d have to trade for someone who probably wouldn’t even equate to what Jeter would bring. Giving up prospects for an inferior player to one you can sign for just money AND IS THE MOST POPULAR SINCE MICKEY MANTLE and a HOFer isn’t the best idea in the world.

        • nathan

          I never claimed i had a plan B. I just pointed out that we will looking for one in 2 years.

          And please there are far more rational fans who know we wont have a HOF SS probably for some time, so I am not proposing crazy trades as well.

          I honestly dont know who will replace him, I just think 15 M per is already crazy money. And for most other players fans will be screaming walk away from negotiations right now.

          I like DJ;s inside out single as much as the next guy but not for a single day have i tuned into a Yankee game or refused to watch a Yankee game based on DJ’s availability. I think its the same with most fans, provide a winning product and we will watch.

          Well 2011 aint 2008, this late into his 30s he is not gonna get better, thats reality. FTR i am not one of the fans screaming for Lee, I have serious questions regarding his injuries and hope the Yanks dont get into a Santana-like situation.

          • Jonathan

            ok well you can’t just go around saying we shouldn’t sign anyone. We have rotation concerns and a big hole at SS. If not these guys than who? And i have no idea how you read my original post, all i said was i’m sure he’s going to resign and he doesn’t have any other options and if we don’t resign him the replacement won’t be near his caliber. What you just said about 2011 not being 2008 is what everyone said then. he’s too old to turn it around. He doesn’t have to have a career year to be a top SS. hitting .285/.350/.400 with 20 SB and the same defense as last year is a top SS.

            And Cliff Lee hasn’t had any major arm troubles. That’s a FAR cry from Johan who battled arm problems and was clearly losing velocity as a pitcher who lives off the disparity between his fb and change. Do you think we should go with Nova/Nunez over Jeter/Lee?

        • Brian

          2 bad years in the past 3 doesn’t exactly scream “pay the man his money”.

    • Dalelama

      And they won two WSs despite that…you just proved the point they should be prepared to let Jeter walk.

      • Jonathan

        out of all of that you took your own opinion and tried to tie it to something I said. the 2004 Red Sox won the WS with mientkiewicz and kevin millar at 1B. Should we get rid of Tex? They had Mark Bellhorn at 2B. Should we get rid of Cano?

        Just because it’s possible to win without a good player at a certain position, doesn’t mean you should try to. In fact, I’m pretty sure your job as a GM is to get as many good players to build the best team you can, not see how bad of a team it’s possible to win with. I’m glad I could introduce you to my friend logic.

  • nathan

    Cash$$ rocks !!

    Now unlike the ARod negotiations hold the damn line.

  • http://lifeopinstripes.wordpress.com Duncan

    If Jeter doesn’t resign I think we all should realize it’s true not much production will be lost but the captain and one of the top 5 Yankees (arguably) walk. What does this say about our organization?

    • UWS

      That they are trying to improve the product on the field and are unwilling to grossly overpay for past-their-prime players simply because said player is “Teh Captain!!!”? Especially when it is possible that overpaying for such players might come at the expense of other moves, such as signing a premier SP.

      At least that’s what it tells me. YMMV, of course.

    • Griffey’s Grotesquely Swollen Jaw

      that they don’t let one player hold them hostage for the good of the team.

    • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S

      Yeah and Ruth (The greatest Yankee ever, no contest) played his last year in Boston. Shit happens, the fans get over it and eventually they only remember the good stuff.

      And I will have a debate about Jeter being a top-5 Yankee, because there’s no way he is.

      Bring it. I dare you.

      • UWS

        Well, by B-Ref WAR he is #5 all time, as it happens.

        Interestingly, he’s also #1 all time in GIDPing.

        http://www.baseball-reference......_bat.shtml

        • Ed

          That’s because he’s also #1 in AB.

          AB per GIDP for the players with the most GIDP:
          Jeter – 45
          Williams – 41
          Mattingly – 40
          O’Neill – 31
          Randolph – 44
          Posada – 40
          Munson – 37
          Winfield – 32
          Howard – 37
          Berra – 57

          So out of the top 10 players in GIDP, Jeter hit into them less often than everyone but Berra.

          • UWS

            Oh, I know. It just amused me because Jeter GIDPed pretty much every time he came to bat with a runner at 1B and less than 2 out this year*

            *may or may not be hyperbole

          • http://www.twitter.com/jordansmed JGS

            Those guys were also generally middle of the order bats, who come up with guys on base more often.

            • Hughesus Christo

              I appreciated your robust analysis of the numbers before you made that unsubstantiated claim.

          • Plank

            That list doesn’t take batting order into account. Jeter led off most of his career. Did any of those other players?

            • Chris

              Jeter batted #2 for almost his entire career.

      • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

        While I agree with UWS and GGSJ all the way, saying Derek Jeter isn’t a top five Yankee of all time isn’t so much a knock on Derek Jeter as it is a “holy shit the Yankees have had some really fucking good players” assertion.

    • JerseyDutch

      That we won’t overpay for a player who is on the decline.

      • Matt

        So Arod, Vasquez and Burnett are what?

    • Brian

      It says they are willing to do anything to help the team continue to be the most competitive every single year and won’t make decisions based on 2 yrs, 5 yrs, or 10 yrs ago.

  • Avi

    Heyman’s Latest Tweet is that the Yanks are going to up their offer.
    I hope he’s wrong.
    http://twitter.com/SI_JonHeyma.....5383148544

  • jiffy

    If he wants more than that we can just replace his production by signing Crawford for LF and a mediocre SS.

    Jeter WAR – 2.5
    Brett Gardner WAR – 5.4
    Total WAR – 7.9

    Carl Crawford WAR – 6.9

    I don’t think anyone really expects Brett to be a 5 WAR player again, Jeter might go up some, but a doubt a whole lot. Crawford will probably go down a little to, but assuming we can get a SS with a WAR around .5-1 I think it would be fairly comparable. And, more importantly, it would more than likely give us a better chance to win 4-6yrs from now if thats what jeter is really demanding.

    But i figure this all just a show

    • Accent Shallow

      I don’t know if I buy “Brett Gardner, 5 WAR player”, but I don’t know if I want to be paying Crawford through his age 35 or 36 season. I can see him going Rickey Henderson, but it wouldn’t surprise me to see him peter out.

      As for SS . . . I’d be hesitant to let Jeter go, solely because the MiLB cupboard is so bare. Culver is a zillion years away, and everyone else sorta sucks. And who knows when/if any of the other viable SS on other teams are available.

      • jiffy

        I’m saying that Brett prob. won’t be a 5 WAR again, and the more he regresses the more value we would gain by signing Crawford (theoretically according to WAR at least).

        From what I’ve been reading, it doesn’t seem like it will take a super long contract to land Crawford. I think he’s only 28, so even with a 5 year deal were looking at a 33-34 yr season.

        And I didn’t realize how bare the SS market was

        In all actuality I wouldn’t let jeter walk either, this was more just looking at the other options

        • Brian

          So Gardner won’t be able to steal 49 bases w/an OBP over .390 and play gold glove level D again next year despite only being 27? I think it is actually likely that a player at his age with his tools will continue to put similar numbers over the next couple of years.

    • Hughesus Christo

      This is not what WAR is intended to do, thanks.

    • candyforstalin

      getting rid of brett gardner is the single most obtuse idea in yankeeland right now. keeping kerry wood is a distant second.

  • http://www.twitter.com/tomzig Tom Zig

    WFAN callers have been pretty upset about this.

    like 5 callers called in during the 10 mins I was listening to today and were all mad that the Yanks were playing hardball. Saying stuff that he is a living legend, he never embarrassed the yanks, etc. It was a little ridiculous. And to cap it all off, one fan even said he was done with the Yankees because of this, he was no longer going to root for the team.

    I laughed.

    • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S

      You had me at, “WFAN callers have been pretty upset”

    • JerseyDutch

      And to cap it all off, one fan even said he was done with the Yankees because of this, he was no longer going to root for the team.

      Sounds like he’d be happier being a Mets fan anyway. They like whiners.

    • Esteban

      If you stop rooting for the Yankees because of the way negotiations with Derek Jeter have gone so far, you were never really a Yankees fan in the first place.

      • Hughesus Christo

        What exactly does it mean to be a Yankees fan? I’d argue the complete opposite to what you imply here.

        • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

          Well, if you’re a Yankees fan, supposedly you’d root for the laundry. But I’m not gonna argue anyone’s fandom or whatever.

          • Esteban

            Yea I suppose this is what I trying to say. I just don’t think you can be that serious of a Yankees fan if the last week or so has made you stop rooting for the team. But yea, whatever, people are free to choose whatever they want.

            Hughesus:
            But do you really think the way the Yankees have handled Derek Jeter should cause people to stop being fans?

            • Hughesus Christo

              Strictly rooting for laundry is a pretty shitty was to spend years of your life.

              I wouldn’t have a problem with an amicable divorce between Jeter and the Yankees, but that possibility went out the window when the Yankees opened the dealings by negotiating through the media. I’d have a hard time following this franchise if things continued down this path. I don’t feel obligated to spend time and money on a group of disrespectful assholes simply because they inherited their father’s property.

  • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S

    Get ready for “Alex Rodriguez: Yankees Captain 2011″.

    /That’llbetheday

  • EndlessMike

    Why does everybody think if Jeter walks he won’t come back later on.Torre,Randolph,Yogi,Bernie…they all came back because where else are they gonna go.

    $20 million for a mascot is allot.The deal will get done but Jeter finally understood he’s not that special.

    • Matt

      I bet every team wish they had a mascot that had more hits than 285 of 300 everyday position players last year. Damn, they should sign more mascots.

  • http://www.thesubwayconnection.com Newbie

    If Jeter does not resign, might the Yankees look into Stephen Drew? I know he would take a lot in terms of prospects, but the Diamondbacks are obviously willing to dangle some of their stars. This is pure random speculation, but I cannot seem to think of any other options other than Eduardo Nunez.

    • Hughesus Christo
    • http://twitter.com/Carlosological Carlosologist

      Towers would ask for the firstborn son of Cashman along with half the farm. He texted me last night, no joke.

    • Avi

      I don’t love Stephen Drew. He’ll be 28 by opening day and hasn’t come close on delivering on his promise. He’s starting to remind me of his bro. He’s def better than league average but I’m not convinced he’ll ever take the next step forward.
      Replacing Jeter is going to be VERY difficult. But I think we need to realize we already lost the Jeter we all loved. His days .870 OPS days are over.

      • http://twitter.com/Carlosological Carlosologist

        He produced 5.1 fWAR in the beginning of his prime years. Yeah, I’m pretty sure he can do ~.280/.350/.460 (.355) for the next two to three years.

      • Hughesus Christo

        You’ve been bashing Jeter for weeks. You’ve been positing reasonable contingency plans for zero of those weeks. Shocking.

  • Matt M.

    Just be happy that Torre isnt the Dodgers’ manager anymore, otherwise every journalist would be fanning the flames with that story angle

    • Esteban

      Wow you’re right. Praise be to Jesus (Montero) for that.

  • YankeesEVO

    The most disappointing thing to me is the fact that it sounds as if a big part of Jeter’s stubbornness still has to do with A-Rod. Jeter is without a doubt my favorite Yankee of all time, but enough is enough with his feud with A-Rod. Why does everything he signs have to parallel A-Rod? Again, I love Jeter, but his ego and jealousy of A-Rod is really starting to grow old. A-Rod’s contract was a mistake, no one will argue against that, but why must our captain, the face of the franchise, constantly try and overshadow him

    • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S

      Hey Derek:

      A-Rod is better than you.

      somewhere, a captain weeps…

      • Matt

        And who, exactly, do you think the fans like more? And which player, exactly, used steriods? And which player, exactly, is a douche bag?

  • YankeesEVO

    for someone who is so aware of his legacy and public image, I just don’t understand how he can be so petty and risk all that he has worked hard for and deserved

    • vin

      All will be forgotten once summer rolls around. Derek is all about getting the best deal possible – always has been. He took the Yanks to arbitration when he was young and beat them.

      He’s earned every right to get as much as possible. It’s just up to him and his agent to determine if the Yanks are being fair. Kind of like the Damon situation last year. He wants a raise, and that’s just not happening.

  • stuart a

    baffling… the only thing baffling is paying a 36 yr old no power shortstop $3 mill more a year then hanley ramirez and many millions more then he is worth after already paying him $225 mill for a career.

    yanks have been more then generous…..

  • stuart a

    3 yrs 45 mill is about $21 mill more then he can get any where…..

    if he can get more elsewhere adios amigo.

    btw jeter is my favorite player as well as my kids, and I have only seen on TV about 1200 of his games…..

    when is enough $$$$$$$$$$enough. this is not like giving baeb ruth a pay cut or the same for mickey mantle etc.

    jeter has been treated like royalty, he needs to get a clue…….

  • Avi

    The Twins declined arbitration on Jon Rauch, Fuentes and Matt Guerrier. Guerrier was a type A, the others type B’s. I wouldn’t mind seeing any of those in pinstripes next year, assuming the contract is reasonable of course.

    • http://youcantpredictbaseball.wordpress.com bexarama

      http://riveraveblues.com/off-topic-8/

      (No Type A relievers kthanx)

      • Chris

        If they’re not offered arbitration, then there’s no downside.

    • Avi

      Ooh, I’m sorry. I thought I was posting in the open thread here.
      Go Cash! Jeet, take the offer and avoid the drama.

  • virginia yankee

    DERERK — hard to imagine the Yankees without you; but before you there was Bernie, Paulie, Coney, Mantle, Berra, Kubek, Richardson, Rizzutto, DiMaggio –

    all players age – some precipitously – they stop contributing to the wins even as they appear “right” in the uniform and at their position — the right move was to go to 3B when the team signed ARod maybe then the golve side gap wouldn’t be such a killer; who knows; you don’t put up 3B numbers — noone fixed your swing when you were younger to take full advantage of your strength. Commentators still marvel at your weak inside out swing as if it were something to emulate — maybe for a 5″6″ slap songles high walk guy but not for a 6″3″ stud. Really too bad — you appear to have had the capacity for startling offensive numbers — on any team other than the Yankees maybe we’re not even talking HOF.

    Take the 15mil, 3 yrs let the team have 2 opt years; maybe you can get 20mil a year on that deal. There is no disrespect — 2011-2016 is just different than 2004-2010 — heck I can’t afford the NY trips and games much anymore; have to watch on TV. You actually look more capable on TV these days than in person. Maybe that is why the average fan still sees the “young Jeet”.

    Take the money – stay awhile – make the memory last. Cano, Tex, Swish can carry you a bit. I’m afraid if you don’t the team will struggle, catch as catch can with SS — but will demonstrate that not much was lost in the end. There is a season for all things Derek — finish gracefully.

  • gargoyle

    Can’t really see the downside in offering arb. Stupid move.

  • Another Bronx Dynasty

    NOTE TO JETER- FIRE CLOSE & HIRE SCOTT BORAS!
    NOTE TO CASH & S&S BOYS – STOP ACTING LIKE CHILDREN BY SAYING “JETER’S WENT TO THE PRESS FIRST”

    I can’t complain about the hard stand thhe Yankees are taking with Jeter in terms of yrs. But wasn’t it Hal that said to Cash initially that these negotiations needed to be handled delicatley?

    The Yankees can stand on their 3 yr deal, but what cheapens them is having their negotiations & statements all going to the press. They should take a No Comment till he is signed positioned as Jeter is our modern day icon.
    An agent is supposed to go to the press.Let Close but do not respond because in the end the agent is gone & the team & the player need to live together.
    It’s not that the Yankees

  • Another Bronx Dynasty

    NOTE TO HANK – PUT A GAG ORDER ON IT & STOP TALKING TO PRESS. IT WAS YOU THAT GAVE A-ROD A RIDICULOUS CONTRACT & BIDDED AGAINST YOURSELF.

  • Another Bronx Dynasty

    NOTE TO YANKEES MGT & S&S BOYS – MAYBE THE FANS SHOULD TAKE THE AVERAGE MLB TICKET PRICE IN & REQUIRE THE YANKEES TO LOWER THEIR TIX PRICES TO THE “MARKET VALUE”

    • Matt M.

      despite the caps lock…that’s actually an interesting ‘burn’ ya got there.

      why dont we click the button again and join the conversation so everyone will look at it

    • Brian

      The Yanks aren’t an average baseball team or organization so if your going to go a game live then pay the money. 3.5 million fans don’t seem to be to concerned with the ticket prices this past season.

  • larryf

    Let Jeter walk. Use the money for Crawford and have Swish DH. Posada backup catcher/DH/bench. Have Gardy play right-he can do it better than Swish.

    Nunez will be fine in that lineup.

    Warning: I am overly sensitive to criticism :-)

  • Brian in NH

    We can make some comparisons to the Red Sox and trading away Nomar, who was the face of their franchise, but its not quite the same. Nomar hadn’t been enshrined in the pantheon of greatest red sox of all time while still on the team. When they moved him, he wasn’t likely a first or second ballot hall of famer (probably never gonna make the hall).

    I would hate to see the captain go, but sometimes difficult business decisions have to be made. Sometimes you have to do the unpopular for the good of the business.

    • Hughesus Christo

      Not sure what business where publically embarrassing employees and alienating your customer is good, but please let me know so I can avoid it.

      Derek Jeter may not be bigger than the Yankees, but he sure as he’ll is bigger than Randy Levine and Hal Steinbrenner.

      • steve s

        I don’t know if anyone is still reading this thread but I agree 100% with your comment. The Yanks stepped over the line with publically telling Jeter to go seek other offers. The stupidity of this coordinated management strategy is that it will now cost the Yanks more $$$ to eventually sign him as Jeter will get a better offer (it only takes one!) and Yanks will not let him walk. If Yanks played this close to the vest and kept their responses out of the media Jeter could have finessed this negotiation into a positive. Now he will only look foolish if he continues to maintain his “gee whiz, its great to be a Yankee legend persona Mr. Torre and Mr. Steinbrenner” that he’s developed over the years.

      • http://twitter.com/cephster Ross in Jersey

        If you honestly think playing hardball with Jeter is “alienating your customer” and a bad business practice, you are truly lost. I’d rather win, thanks.

        • Hughesus Christo

          They can play whatever they want in a professional manner behind closed doors. Lobbing insults through the media is unacceptable.

  • Sal

    Problem with Jeter and Mo they’re already the highest paid at their respective positions so there’s no where to go. I for one disagree with giving Jeter a drop in pay, but until another team or 2 enters the scrum it is what it is. Enjoy your ticket price increase folks. And Hank saying they’ve already made these guys wealthy, it works both ways pard, these guys have helped make it so the Steiny brats never have to punch a clock and actually work for a living.

  • Sal

    @ Brian in NH… Nomar was a malcontent and a potential problem in the clubhouse, completely different ball of wax then Jeter. This is about having the stick and actually in a way dissing the face of their franchise. They actually shot themselves in the foot with this negotiating through the media move. It’s too bad NY decided that Jeter would be the guy they won’t bid against themselves for, it should have been Rodriguez who is now one of the most overrated and over paid players of all time. good job Hank

  • OldYanksFan

    One of my favorite Political talk shows is ‘Morning Joe’, with Joe Scarborough. So I’m watching now, and in their very brief ‘Sports Review’, the subject is Derek Jeter. The panel, which includes Yankees fan Willie Geist, are unanimous in thinking Jeter is crazy. It’s pretty weird listening to Pat Buchanan weigh in, who also thinks Jeter needs to take the 3/$45m and run.

    One said the offer already includes a $5m/yr bonus for ‘Being Derek’. Another said the offer is twice his onfield worth.

    Something that hasn’t been discussed that much is what Jeter is doing to HIS own ‘Brand’. As one of the panelist pointed out, Jeter has a Brand and career far past the extra year or 2 he wants as a Yankee, and that if he jumps to another team, he will seriously hurt his future.

    I spend an unhealthy amount of time on Yankee Blogs. Last year, quite a few, if not the majority, were in the ‘GIVE HIM WHATEVER HE WANTS!’ club. Now, one year later, the majority of comments I read feel that the Yankees offer is VERY fair, and that Jeter is screwing up. The number of ‘Let Jeter Walk’ opinions is growing daily. There is even blasphemous talk that the Yankees are BETTER letting Jeter walk and using the $45-$50m savings elsewhere.

    It’s quite stunning how fast things have turned around.

    I think the bottom line here is Jeter’s ego and his issues with ARod. I believe ‘ARod’s contract’ is driving Jeter’s boat, and that he is so consumed with it, that he is not seeing straight.

    When Jeter resigns (for 3/$50m) all of this will be forgotten. But in the meanwhile, Jeter is losing a lot of respect. And while I highly doubt it will happen, if for some bizarre reason he doesn’t re-up as a Yankee, he is going to destroy his legacy…. which whether he will admit it ir not, is built as much on the fact that he is a NEW YORK YANKEE, as he is Derek Jeter.

  • OldYanksFan

    Please weigh in:
    If Jeter re-signs for 3 years, what do you believe his cummulative WAR will be over the next 3 years?

    I say around 8.
    And at 2.67 WAR/yr, that would make him worth around $12m/yr?

  • OldYanksFan

    YankeesEVO
    “A-Rod’s contract was a mistake”
    ———————————————
    I agree with basically all of your post, but I have to ask:
    If ARod breaks the all-time HR record at the end of his 9th year, will you still think his contract was a mistake?

    I admit, I sometimes think it’s insane.
    But then I remember…
    There is a reason the contract is TEN years….
    There is a reason the contract has $30m of bonuses….
    There is a reason that financial analyses of the contract proclaimed ARod is worth the contract and more….

    The Yankees want the ALL-TIME HR RECORD to be held by a NEW YORK YANKEE.

    Just how many opportunities does a team get to try and do this?
    It’s a calculated risk, but there is logic behind the ‘insanity’.

    (P.S. I still think of ARod as a Mariner… but after 13 years of being a Yankee, people will forget that… especially, obviously, people who didn’t follow baseball until 2003.)

    • Hughesus Christo

      Wait… for real?

  • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S

    Note:

    While we may see it as a “not-my-money” issue, ultimately the fans will have to pay the price. The more money the club spends, the higher ticket prices go, the more the merchandise costs, and the ads on YES got longer and shittier – that’s right, a whole lot more of WB Mason. I’m not saying that Jeter would be the direct cause of this, but the fact remains that money adds up. And it’s our money.

  • RL

    Saw this post last night and didn’t comment. I largely agree with the Bexy comments and others that agree with her position. I’m a huge Jeter fan. I am thoroughly disappointed that his camp didn’t keep this out of the press. I don’t feel the info the Yankees have let out to the press is out of line. If Jeter’s camp does, they still could have taken the high road and kept negotiating quietly and expressed their disappointment in a different manner. “Baffled”? You’re kidding me, right? They must realize that Jeter will not get a 5-6 year agreement from anyone. If they didn’t at first, surely they do now. Trying to play the fans like this is not making Jeter look good. While I don’t want Jeter to leave (unless he retires, which I can’t see happening), I can understand the Yankees deciding to take a hard line soon.

    • Hughesus Christo

      The Yankees took negotiations to the media. The Yankees. The Yankees. The Yankees.

      And the Close quote is about the Yankees… taking negotiations to the media.

      • Hughesus Christo

        And the initial post is misleading on that point. I tshould be corrected in the future. He didn’t say “$15 million per is baffling” he said the posturing in the media is baffling.

        IT IS.

        • http://twitter.com/cephster Ross in Jersey

          It’s baffling that a player shouldn’t be granted a blank check for past accomplishments, when he was paid over 200 million dollars for his services? Right.

        • RL

          Not saying the Yankees were correct in bringing this to the media. I’m saying Jeter’s team could have taken the high road and negotiated while letting the Yankees look foolish by bringing the negotiations to the public. Take the high road. It looks better for you. Now, they are beginning to look foolish.

          • Hughesus Christo

            The only thing Jeter’s team has said is that the Yankees shouldn’t be negotiating publically.

      • http://twitter.com/cephster Ross in Jersey

        Really, it was the Yankees who fired the first shot by saying the process was “baffling” was it?

        • Hughesus Christo

          It not that hard to go find the actual quote. He objected to negotiating through the media. That’s a factually correct position. It’s low class and diminishing to the franchise and the player to go on with these public potshots back and forth. That was initiated by the Yankees–and even worse, I might add, by doing it with anonymous leaks.

          Separate the terms from the process. I don’t think I or anyone else outside of the organization and Jeter’s team has any place to nit-pick exact contract terms. We rarely if ever know about compensation, perks, team revenues, etc. to the letter. I don’t care about the details of that part.

          The Yankees are absolutely in the wrong on how this has seeped into the media. That is solely their doing and it is a black mark on the organization.

          • Brian

            Who are the anonymous leaks? Cashman, Hal and Hank, Randy Levine have all stated their positions and haven’t hidden behind the cloak of anonymous. Casey Close made his comments and Jeter isn’t going to say anything since he literally pays someone to do his talking for him. The only anonymous sources come “an MLB executive of another team” or some writer just throwing out some ideas on paper.

            The Yanks have stated their position publicly because they know not signing Jeter will cause a PR stir and they are getting out in front of it which actually is the most professional thing they can do. They made a fair offer according to them and they are defending their position, which is what you are supposed to do.

            • Hughesus Christo

              Anonymmous leaks: Years, dollar figures.

              And there is nothing professional about negotiating through the media. If their position is so untenable as to require a childish media blitz they need to be rethinking the position.

              And there is no line of work, public or otherwise, where someone’s contract is publically debated, justified/attacked by involved parties, and dissected for weeks at a time. That is plainly unprofessional and unacceptable.

  • Chris

    Am I the only one that cannot stand Randy Levine. Every time he speaks I cringe. He has zero tact or media skills.

  • TLVP

    The Yankees are in the entertainment industry and their job is to create interest in the product. Jeter chasing hit no 3000 will draw a lot more eyes on TV and will increase the value of advertsing. No substitute SS will generate as much interest. As opposed to the ficticious Matsui ad revenues Jeter will in the next couple of years have an advertsing value that eventhe Yankees can’t replace that easily.

    Take off $10-15m for this value and the company is offering $10-12m/y for a player that was at 2.5 WAR in the worst year of his carrer. This is far from unreasonable. Will Jeter be 7.5 WAR accumulated over then next 3 years quite possibly.

    The Yankees can afford to increase but what they can’t afford is adding more years. My guess is that they either end up at 54/3 or maybe with a club option for year 4 and a buy out of $6m

    • Matt

      I dont know what all this WAR talk is, or why any of these made up stats matter to anyone other than fantasy nerds, but I do know that 179 hits last year, which they tell me was a bad year, was more than 285 of approximately 300 everyday position players in MLB.

      • TLVP

        lol

  • armandito torres

    I have been a Yankee fan for 60 years..every year I make a sacrifice so I can see them play home and away…I have been not been happy in the past with all decisions the top brand has made..but honestly I think they are offering Jeter a great deal…he is only 74 hits away to achieve the 3000 plateau all as a Yankee…it is true that he is a symbol like Gehrig and Dimaggio but 45 million is a lot of money taking into consideration everything…if he does not sign he will be considered just another player and not the iconic symbol he actually is..we all want him back…but also he has to show the same loyalty given to him…agents do not understand sports values…

  • Mr. Jones

    Can you people please stop referring to the Gold Glove like it is a an actual representation of real defensive ability. Everyone knows Jeter had no business winning that award this year. Players and coaches just mail in candidates for the Gold Glove without putting any real analysis in their decision. I mean seriously just use your eyes to confirm that Jete can move no more than 3 feet to his left or right anymore which is why he doesn’t make errors. Because he doesn’t get to any balls hit in the hole!
    Matt the reason why he has so many hits(90% singles) is because he doesn’t walk. I’d rather have a player with 150 hits and a .400 OBP.

    • MikeD

      Not sure what you’re trying to say here. Jeter’s lifetime OBP is .385. He’s been one of the best in the game over the past fifteen years at getting on base.

  • MikeD

    I thought Casey Close’s “baffled” comment was unnessary when he first said it, but I’m now officially in his camp. I am now baffled by how the Yankees have opted to negotiate in public, down to releasing contract details, and then having Cashman give what amounts to a take-it-or-leave-it statement.

    On Jeter’s side, we have the “baffled” comment. On the Yankees side, there is a laundry list of comments from the front office, including the leaked initial contract offer.

    The Yankees want Jeter back. Jeter is clearly prideful and works extra hard to control his media image. During negotiations, it’s always good to keep in mind the personality of the client. Ignore that and that’s when negotiations start to fall apart. There not there yet, but the Yankees are going down the wrong path here.

  • http://yesnetwork.com solamon

    Dereck Jeter should say screw you redsox they suck and jeter has always been a yankee so he should sign with them