Open Thread: Winter Meetings Day Three


Mo, Mo Jr., and some school official. (Photo Credit: Lenny Neslin,

We’re now three-fourths of the way through the 2010 edition of the winter meetings, but it wasn’t until a little while ago that the Yankees did anything noteworthy. After meeting with some agents and a bunch of behind the scenes stuff, they made a formal offer to free agent Cliff Lee. The ball is in their court now. There was also some noteworthy stuff in Joe Girardi’s press conference, but perhaps the biggest news of the day came from back home, as Mariano Rivera Jr. visited in Quinnipiac. Exciting stuff.

Anyways, here is your open thread for the evening. You’re on your own as far as entertaining goes, none of the NBA or NHL locals are in action tonight. Ain’t that a drag. Enjoy.

Categories : Open Thread


  1. The next great closer?

    Of course, he won’t get a chance until his dad retires in another twenty or twenty-five years.

  2. “Source said the Yankees’ offer to Cliff Lee was six years and $140 million, an average of $23.3 million per season.”

  3. Esteban says:

    Wait, the Knicks are playing the Raptors, right?

  4. DAMN IT.

    I would be going to Quinnipiac, if it wasn’t hella expensive.

  5. ultimate913 says:

    Over/Under on Amare’s points today against the Raptors: 30

    I say barely under. Like 28.

  6. Sheepmeister says:

    I wish that the winter meetings this year didn’t revolve around Cliff Lee, it was nice last year when there wasn’t a giant target and the Yanks could make other deals. It sounds like the odds that the Yanks make ANY move is like 1/100.

  7. vin says:

    My buddy went to Quinnipiac.

    What’s ironic is that he is a very knowledgeable baseball fan – lives in AZ, and follows all the minor leaguers that pass through there, as well as the big leagues. Unfortunately for him, he’s a staunch Mets fan.

    Last time I visited him to check out some spring training games, he told me Rivera was “so overrated.”

    I asked him if he meant that the closer position itself was overrated.

    He said, “no, Rivera is overrated.”

    I then asked him who was better. He then gave a half-chuckle and said John Franco.

    I took that to mean despite his very respectable baseball knowledge, he has a hard time overcoming his Yankee-envy. John Franco. Please.

    Long story short – Quinnipiac may or may not promote Yankee hate.

  8. YankeesJunkie says:

    So according to Mark Feinsand via Twitter the Yankees have offered 6/140 the same deal they initially offered CC back in 2008.

  9. Kit says:

    My mom (Mets fan) asked me to write down what I wanted for Christmas. I wrote down “Cliff Lee and Andy Pettitte,” handed it to her and she just came back, like six hours later and informed me to “dream on.” If there was a Spanish word for “hater” that didn’t get me smacked, I would use it.


  10. Accent Shallow says:

    Poor Mo Jr. I’m sure he’s a hell of a talented athlete. Unfortunately, what are the chances he’s as good as his father? That he pitches in MLB?

    • mbonzo says:

      Theyre better than mine.

    • radnom says:

      I feel worse for the third Manning brother.

      How did that guy even show up to Thanksgiving dinner the year after BOTH he brothers won the last two superbowls?

      • Kit says:

        There’s a third Manning brother?

        • radnom says:

          (from Wikipedia)

          Cooper Manning, Archie’s oldest son, was born in 1974. At 6’4″, he was once an All-State High School wide receiver, and he was considered a hot prospect for the University of Mississippi. He is also the joker of the family, once convincing Peyton to join him in wearing brown paper bags on their heads at one of their father’s Saints games.[12] Diagnosed with spinal stenosis (a narrowing of the spinal canal) after extensive testing, his football career was ended.[13] He guest starred in The Simpsons episode “Oh Brother, Where Bart Thou?” with his brothers. He is now a partner in a New Orleans energy investment firm.[14]

          That sucks about the spinal stenosis, I didn’t know that.

        • Tim says:

          Yes, his name is Cooper. He was actually a very good WR, but was diagnosed with a spinal condition so he couldn’t play anymore.

        • ChrisR says:

          I was just about to ask that question

      • mbonzo says:

        He was a huge football prospect… but he had spinal stenosis.

      • pat says:

        Cooper has the grandchildren. That makes him the favorite.

    • bexarama says:

      I can’t feel too bad for him, kid’s set for freakin’ life and his dad is like the coolest human being (yeah yeah yeah, Mo isn’t human) on the planet.

    • Monteroisdinero says:

      Mo always finishes the chalupa.

  11. Granderslam says:

    Did Lee’s agent go directly to Lee and his wife after the Yankee offer, or are they meeting tomorrow to discuss?

  12. bonestock94 says:

    So Lee’s agent leaving is 100x more reasonable now that we know he has legit offers.

  13. Yankeefan91 Arod Fan says:

    The Yankees are on of 7 teams interested in Octovio Dotel.

  14. bexarama says:

    So this has been the Winter Meetings in a nutshell so far, right?

    (mildly NSFW but it’s just a written word)

  15. Avi says:

    Carl Crawford for $20M+ a year will be more like the Pavano, Vazquez, Jaret Wright, Burnett acquisitions than the CC, Arod, Mussina ones. The guys is way overrated . He doesn’t get on base often enough or hit for enough power to validate that kind of salary (.350 OBP and .453 slugging over the last four seasons).
    I think with Crawford we get so impressed with his 60 steal/20 homer ability that we lose sight of the fact that he isn’t a premier run producer.
    If Crawford didn’t steal 60 bags and had say average speed, he’d be looking at a $6-8M a year contract, as the rest of his numbers are merely pedestrian for a corner outfielder. Are 60 steals THAT valuble? I’d like to analyze a steal’s true value more but I highly doubt it.
    Also as Crawford ages his OBP is likely to decline faster than most players, as a larger percentage of his hits are infield hits. If he loses just a little speed he won’t beat out as many of those and might steal say 30 bases instead of 60. In which case you’ll have a very expensive version of Johnny Damon on your hands.

    If the Yankees sign Crawford it’ll be a sad day in their history.

    • mike c says:

      no way crawford’s rate is 20MM

    • bonestock94 says:

      I hope the Angels sign him…after Lee is signed though, I think the Yanks lose some leverage with Lee if he goes before.

      I agree that he’s overrated offensively, mid-120′s wRC+(a reasonable expectation) isn’t worth that kinda contract imo. And that’s not even considering aging.

      • YankeesJunkie says:


        Gardner and Swisher both produced at the same 120s wRC as Crawford did and at a much cheaper price.

        • Avi says:

          Yeah, I’m not that familiar with the advanced stats but it seems Swish and Crawford are about the same production-wise. At least offensively..

    • Monteroisdinero says:

      Gee-he is entering his 29 year old season and has had 6 pretty good years already. Werth didn’t have his first good year UNTIL he was 29. I would hardly call it a sad day to get a guy with his ability and his #’s on a team/offense that has mostly sucked during his time with them.

  16. mustang says:

    “I feel like Hannibal Lecter in a straight jacket,’’ Cashman said of his obsession with Lee.

    If this thing doesn’t workout I suggest only eating salad at the Cashman’s dinner table.

  17. Jimmy says:

    Small potatoes but worth noting that P.J. Pilittere was given a contract by the D’backs last week sometime. Lifetime Yankee farmhand had some promise once. Good luck to him.

    D’backs also signed Cody “more valuable than ARod” Ransom last week.

  18. T-Long says: has a source that say that its a less than 50% chance that Lee ends up in NY.

  19. Esteban says:

    Why do the Knicks play poorly at home. Kinda bizarre.

  20. Pat D says:

    I’m not sure what to think about this…

    A trade sending shortstop Jason Bartlett of the Tampa Bay Rays to the San Diego Padres is off, at least for now, because the teams couldn’t finalize the deal, sources tell

    The Rays’ trade for a pair of young pitchers is in limbo, but it’s not dead, sources said.

    The Boston Red Sox ran into a problem yesterday with the trade that was to have brought them Spike Owen and Dave Henderson from Seattle.

    Cesar Ramos and Adam Russell, a pair of right-handed pitchers, would go to the Rays.

    Bartlett, 31, hit .254 with a .675 OPS in 135 games for the Rays last season. He became expendable with the arrival of top shortstop prospect Reid Brignac in Tampa Bay.

    The Rays, who lost closer Rafael Soriano, top setup man Joaquin Benoit and several other relievers to free agency this offseason, had been dangling Bartlett in the quest to rebuild their bullpen with young, affordable arms. baseball writers Jayson Stark and Jerry Crasnick contributed to this report.

  21. Esteban says:

    CC’s at the Knick game!

  22. ultimate913 says:

    Sabathia is at the Knicks game. Cool.

  23. ultimate913 says:

    Damn. Who would have thought that Felton would thrive like this in D’Antoni’s system?

  24. mike c says:

    wtf is the deal with felton? he looks like the new starks out there. actually between him/stoudemire/turaif the team kind of has that starks/ewing/oakley feel

  25. Esteban says:

    Landry Fields is a BEAST.

    • mike c says:

      yeah for real, that dude rocks. sucks to lose a kid like that if you want to make a trade and get melo, the knicks might have a little dilemma on their hands soon, who knew?

  26. ultimate913 says:

    59 – 57, Knicks, after being down by 13 earlier in the quarter. Awesome.

  27. ColoYank says:

    A little Christmas season diversion, for those of you inclined.

    Suppose you were at a food court, and someone started singing …

    • ColoYank says:

      I hope this plays okay. I just tested it, and it’s kind of balky. It’s really worth checking out, whether or not you appreciate choral singing.

  28. Xstar7 says:

    CC just said he won’t opt put of his contract on MSG.

  29. mustang says:

    Is it me or did CC actually get fatter?

  30. Bubkus says:

    My best friend’s sister’s boyfriend’s brother’s girlfriend heard from this guy who knows this kid who’s going with the girl who saw Braunecker review some documents at 31 Flavors today. I guess it’s pretty serious.

    -Jon Heyman

  31. Jimmy McNulty says:

    JD said he’d return to Boston.

  32. Anthony Murillo says:

    I just don’t have a good feeling about Cliff Lee coming to the Yankees. This entire thing is bizarre

    • Pat D says:

      I find your lack of faith disturbing.

    • bonestock94 says:

      Yea I agree. I feel that they’d be totally screwed w/o him though. The rotation just doesn’t hold up without him or a different strong mid to frontline guy. If they don’t get him it either means settle for a team with pitching ?’s or gut the farm. And if we lose Jesus then we’re screwed at catcher for at least a season, I mean shit everyones talking about russell martin as an option in that case. Doom and gloom I know I know.

      • Anthony Murillo says:

        It’s not really a lack of faith, I just have a feeling he won’t sign with the Yankees. I hope I’m wrong, hell I pray I’m wrong, but something tells me he’s not coming here.

        Hopefully I’m wrong

    • Evilest Empire says:

      I am extremely confident that Lee signs with the Yankees. If anything, recent events have made me feel better about it than ever. They’re just going to have to pay a lot more than I figured.

      But if he doesn’t, the world is far from over. The Yankees need to trade for a solid #3 type guy ala Gavin Floyd. We have the mandatory ace any contender needs in CC. The way I see it, Lee could make this like the 1998 team. A Gavin Floyd type could make it like the 2009 version.

  33. Slappy White says:

    Did anyone else see Mitch Williams slur and stammer his way through all the reasons why Cliff Lee was going back to Texas ? I used to manage a bar, and he talks like a three day drunk . What is MLBN thinking hiring this idiot ?……God Bless Joe Carter

  34. candyforstalin says:

    where’s our candy, cashman?

  35. Reggie C. says:

    Anybody else think Carlos Pena is just glad to get out of the AL East?

    • Evilest Empire says:

      The Yankees ought to be glad he’s out of the Beast, even last year he OPS’d .986 vs them (.653 SLG, 6 of his 12 hits were HR)

  36. John says:

    “Cliff Lee, the biggest prize on this year’s free-agent market, will make his decision before the end of the weekend, according to a major-league source.”

  37. Jimmy McNulty says:

    Robothal says that Lee will sign by the end of the weekend…odd way this negotiation has played out.

    • Evilest Empire says:

      I agree that Braunecker has conducted his negotiations in an unusual way, but I do see a cohesive and logical strategy at the heart of it.

      With the Adrian Gonzales trade putting pressure on the Yankees competitively and the Werth contract obfuscating real market conditions and making it seem like teams were ready to burst open and go effing crazy, it put the Yankees on guard.

      Then by leaking all this BS about 7 years and mystery teams and making it clear that Lee is going to the highest bidder, no questions asked … but refusing to actually take their bids until today? Well that riled up the Yankees. Now they want this guy and they want him now. No more bullshit.

      So they offer him the 2nd biggest pitching contract in the history of the game. And now Braunecker is going to take a few more days to push the AAV to $25M and booya. Lee signs by Monday, presser TBA.

  38. Esteban says:

    Knicks are killing it right now. Nasty

  39. John Cerra says:

    Mo Jr: Fordham!

  40. Warrior86 says:

    6 in a row!! A’mare(34Points, 18 in the 4th Q ) for MVP!!

    Damn, I can’t believe how great it feels to watch Knicks basketball again!! The Knicks are actually good again!

    The rebirth has begun this season with our nice six deep core- A’Mare, Raymond “Ray-Ray ” Felton, Landry Fields, Wilson Chandler, Danillo “the Rooster” Gallineri, Toney “TD” Douglas. Now who will join this rising spower, Melo, CP3!

  41. yankees1717 says:

    another chat tomorrow?

  42. Griffey's Grotesquely Swollen Jaw says:

    “Source: The Red Sox have a seven-year, $142 million deal done with Carl Crawford.” Pete-Abe via Twitter

  43. Damn, I should have never opened MLBTR.

  44. Rey22 says:

    Carl Crawford the…Red Sox?

  45. Jimmy McNulty says:

    There’s a new AL East favorite…looks like it’ll take Greinke in addition to Lee and Pettitte returning. Fuck this shit.

    • bonestock94 says:

      Lee + Pettitte + lefty reliever and healthy bounceback for some key pieces. If that happens we’re good. Big if though.

      • Jimmy McNulty says:

        That’s like an “if my aunt had balls” type of thing.

        • bonestock94 says:

          Not really. Lee is the biggest if. Pettitte’s production can likely be recovered in a trade in a worst case scenario. I don’t think we’re asking too much of Tex, Arod, and Jeter to do a little better. A lefty reliever, that’s cake.

  46. bonestock94 says:

    Woohooo, can’t wait for Carl Crawfords epic decline and regression to normal offensive production!!

    That said, Boston’s lineup is pretty fucking epic right now. Also, Yanks just lost leverage for Lee negotiations.

  47. I don’t get it, he only got 16m more over 7 years than Werth. I figured he would at least get double that…

  48. mike o says:

    What do you guys think about signing Ordonez and trading an outfielder for pitching?

Leave a Reply

You may use <a href="" title=""> <abbr title=""> <acronym title=""> <b> <blockquote cite=""> <cite> <code> <del datetime=""> <em> <i> <q cite=""> <strike> <strong> in your comment.

If this is your first time commenting on River Ave. Blues, please review the RAB Commenter Guidelines. Login for commenting features. Register for RAB.