Cashman: We want Montero to play everyday

Open Thread: The Old Timers' Day Roster
Heredia dominant again in Tampa win

Brian Cashman told reporters today that the reason Jesus Montero has not been called up is because he wants him to play everyday rather than serve as Russell Martin‘s backup and get occasional at-bats at DH. “Is Montero better than [Francisco Cervelli]? Yes he is,” said Cashman, continuing his theme of brutal honesty. I can certainly see why they would prefer to do this, but … I mean …  how long are they willing to wait for a full-time spot to open up? What if one doesn’t until next season?

Open Thread: The Old Timers' Day Roster
Heredia dominant again in Tampa win
  • billbybob

    I hope Cashman extends this theme of brutal honesty to Girardi and tells him that he’s a moron for sitting Brett Gardner against left handers

    • CP

      He’s trying to get Jones going. One aspect of a good manager is being able to balance playing time so players don’t gather rust sitting on the bench.

      • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

        One aspect of a good manager is being able to balance playing time so players don’t gather rust sitting on the bench.

        That. Getting value out of Jones >>>>>>> cutting Jones.

        • Crime Dog

          Agreed. However playing Jones back to back days and sitting Gardner back to back days is a bit much for me. I’d rather see Jones DH or Jones in LF to give Granderson a half-day off (Gardner in CF)

          • CP

            Didn’t Gardner get 4 ABs in those two games?

          • Bobtaco

            Gardner did get into the game late, and was 2 for 2, and instrumental in the win, it’s not like he didn’t play at all…

  • Nuke Ladoosh

    Love the brutal honesty.

    • steven

      YOU STOLE MY COMMENT!!!! but yes cashmans brutal honest is amazing

  • Icebird753

    He’ll at the very least get a cup of coffee in September…but I could easily imagine the Yanks trading him for someone like Chris Carpenter (which would def be a mistake)

    • The Big City of Dreams

      Yanks trading him for someone like Chris Carpenter (which would def be a mistake)


      It’s the Yankees that’s what they do

      *haters attacking in 3…2…1

  • vin

    Everything was so simple before they signed Martin. I’m happy they signed him and all, but still…

    If Montero uses the rest of this season to show he is ready for the big leagues, then what happens to Russell? They’re not going to non-tender him. Or does Jesus become the everyday DH with some catching mixed in? They would probably still need to carry Cervelli as a precaution. Creates a bit of a funky roster.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      Martin: Primary catcher
      Montero: Primary DH, backup catcher
      Cervelli: 4th man on the 4 man bench, backup-backup catcher (basically the same role as now, just smaller)
      Posada: Assistant team physician/head urologist

      • vin

        Shouldn’t it be hand urologist?

        • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

          I was being nice.

      • Mike


  • mike c

    “how long are they willing to wait for a full-time spot to open up?”

    martin’s signed for one year, so I’m guessing a year

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      He’s under team control for 2012, as long as they don’t choose to non-tender him. One last arbitration year.

    • JonS

      They will offer him arbitration. They won’t let him walk.

    • Gonzo

      Jorge’s contract is up after the year.

      • jim p

        Voila! Montero bats every day as DH or backup catcher.

  • zzzzz

    wow cash. lolz. maybe that’ll light a little fire under cervelli’s ass. love the guy, but he has to play at least a bit better, especially defensively.

  • Tut

    A. Jones is brutal, and serves no function to this team right now.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      Jones v. LHP, 2011:
      .255/.321/.529 (56 PA)

      Gardner v. LHP, 2011:
      .241/.353/.276 (35 PA)

      That’s a function. SSS, obviously, but Jones is far from useless or brutal.

      • Gerald Williams

        Chicks Dig Small Sample Sizes!

        • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

          Preach on, Iceman.

      • JU

        …conveniently leaving out the fact that Jones costs u runs in the OF and is a non-factor on the bases.

        And did his damage in about a 4 day span. The guy has 15 0-fers this year and has only gotten more than one hit in a game 3 times. And he’s not exactly an on-base machine. He’s garbage

      • 36nj36

        …conveniently leaving out the fact that Jones costs you runs in the OF and is non-factor on the bases. Also, that he’s hitting .100 lower with RISP than Gardner.

        The guy has had 15 0-fers this year, and has only gotten more than one hit in a game 3 times. And he’s not exactly an on-base machine. Serving a function is one thing, but claiming he is a better option than Gardner is another…

        • 36nj36

          Sorry bout the double post…the first guy was my evil twin

  • Avi

    With all the At bats available Between backing up for a banged up Russell martin and DHing against lefties and such, I don’t see how montero is better off in triple A.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      All the at bats you described is still fewer at bats than what he’d get in AAA.

      Far fewer innings behind the plate, as well. Like, a third as much, if not less.

      • Avi

        True. However he’s repeating triple A after handling it well till now. If he’s not ready to catch after four and a half years of doing so he probably never will be, and will another 25 games or so really make that much of a difference? At some point he needs to start getting MLB experience. Very few catchers are full time starter immediately after graduating from the minors.
        I was cool with them keeping him in the minors till now because they gained the extra year of contractual control, but at this point it seems excessive. I mean Cervelli isn’t a major league caliber player.

        • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

          There’s 60 catcher jobs in Major League Baseball. Francisco Cervelli is not worse than the 61st best catcher in organized baseball.

          He’s a major league caliber player. Just like Drew Butera, Dioner Navarro, Jeff Mathis, Rob Johnson, Jake Fox, Josh Thole, Brian Schnieder, J.R. Towles, and the oodles of other eminently shitty backup catchers in baseball.

          Most backup catchers suck (both offensively and defensively). It is what it is.

          • Avi

            “Francisco Cervelli is not worse than the 61st best catcher in organized baseball.”

            I think he probably is. But even if he isn’t none of thoset eams have Jesus Montero in Triple A.

            • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

              If one of those teams did have Jesus Montero, they also might choose to not promote him until they feel he’s ready. Especially if that team is 10 games over .500 with a 28-year old starting catcher putting up a 1.6 fWAR/0.8 bWAR so far.

              Montero’s long-term development path is way more important than upgrading a backup bench player who plays like 10-15% of the innings at his position, max. Cervelli’s abysmal play isn’t costing the team games, he’s a relative blip on the radar.

              If the MLB catching tandem was Cervelli and Rod Barajas, Montero would probably be up. Martin’s presence means C isn’t a position in dire need of a drastic fix.

        • SDM

          it takes years to develop as a catcher, there is a reason most catchers are 24, 25 or even 26 before getting that first call to the show. It takes a long time to learn the nuances of the position. When Montero is promoted either this year or next year he will still be very, very young for a catcher in the bigs.

  • lenNY’s Yankees

    “What if one doesn’t until next season?”

    Then Montero will start next season.

  • bonestock94

    It would be pretty nuts to see Martin as a centerpiece in a trade for a good starter and Montero get called up. That would be an exciting deadline.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      Don’t hold your breath.

      • Ivan

        If anything, it would be the reverse.

        • Louis

          Monteros value is higher than that of any pitcher on the market right now. His bat is as close to a sure thing as any minor league prospect. I’d be extremely dissapointed if he was traded for anything less than a young successfull #1 or 2 starter with years of team control left.

      • bonestock94


        If free agent compensation goes away, how would the Yankees extract value from Martin’s last year of team control without keeping him? Agree to a deal early and trade him? This of course assuming they want Montero to be the starting catcher next year.

        • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder


          They could extract value from Martin by just keeping him. And Montero.

          There’s that. The 2010 Martin-Posada-Cervelli trioka will just be replaced by a 2011 Martin-Montero-Cervelli trioka. Nothing changes, other than the fact that our 2012 DH can actually provide defensive value and roster flexibility by catching the lion’s share of Martin’s days off (and with two guys capable of giving Martin a breather, Martin will stay healthier).

          No need to trade anyone.

          • bonestock94

            Seems unlikely given why he’s in AAA tofay. Unless they’re cool with him at DH a majority of the time.

            • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

              He’s in AAA today because there’s not an everyday job available in the big leagues. That’s the primary reason, as Cashman just explained.

              • bonestock94

                Seems like they want him to catch.

                • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

                  They want him to catch.
                  They want him to play everyday.
                  They want to promote him and get his big league development path started.
                  They want the everyday catcher to be good defensively, as Russell Martin has been this year.
                  They want an everyday DH who can hit well.
                  They want positional flexibility.
                  They want to avoid numerous long-term commitments and have future roster permutation flexibility.

                  There’s lots of overlapping wants. This year, with Posada occupying the DH slot, promoting Montero accomplished too few of their wants. Next year, the calculus will change.

                  2012 could be a year to give Montero an everyday job and see if he can take over for Martin in 2013. You don’t need to forfeit Martin’s last year of long-term risk-free team control to do that. Play them both, ease Montero into the C spot, and see if it works or if you need to get a new everyday catcher instead and leave him at DH.

                  • bonestock94

                    Your idea makes sense, I’m just not confident that it will happen.

                  • David, Jr.

                    What about The Coach’s Son? Stay where he is next year or reserving DH for him?

  • JobaWockeeZ

    I appreciate what Cash is saying but it doesn’t look like an opportunity will come up, like ever. They were so unwilling to DL Martin so that Montero can play everyday.

    Sigh it’s probably paranoia but I think he’s gone.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      They were so unwilling to DL Martin so that Montero can play everyday.

      They were unwilling to DL Martin because they believed his injury wasn’t severe enough that he needed to miss 15 full days of action. It looks like they were right.

      Montero never entered into the equation. They want Montero to play everyday, so they were only promoting him if a long-term injury to Martin, Posada, or Tex happened. None of those things have yet happened.

  • bonestock94

    Semi-OT: Dave Cameron hates Montero for some reason

    • Brian

      Yeah I don’t understand that. “I think he is overrated even though all major scouting publications think he is awesome.”

    • Avi

      Yeah, He thinks Montero is another Carlos Lee. If the low guy on a prospect is comparing him to carlos Lee you have a pretty dam good hitting prospect.

    • JohnnyC

      He’s a Mariners’ fan. Gotta back up Jack Z’s choice of Smoak over Montero in the Cliff Lee deal. If Smoak proceeds to have a less than stellar career while Montero hits according to the consensus scouting reports, the Mariners look like morons…again. The other 3 players in the Lee deal from Texas are less than a bag of shells.

      • bonestock94

        Smoak’s good, but its hard to believe that he’ll have a great career A. compared to the elite bats that play 1st and B. in that park.

        • JohnnyC

          Jack Z wanted the Brewers to select Smoak in the 2008 draft but Doug Melvin, the GM and his boss, felt Smoak was asking for too much (he ended up being picked 11th by Texas and signed for $3.5 million). Jack Z became Mariners GM that winter and made no secret of his unrequited love for Smoak. He got him in the Lee deal. Good for him. Ha ha. The last laugh will be on the Mariners and Dave Cameron.

    • bexarama

      He also hated Cano.

  • Mike

    All i can gather from Cashmans comments —- montero is going to be traded

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      You’re reading between the lines between the lines.

    • Bones

      I think so too.

  • true

    Obviously the organization is willing to rush pitchers and unwilling to even try advancing positional players. He has to see major league pitching, keeping Montero in AAA is just creating a more difficult learning curve farther down the road I think. Plus Romine is deserving of promotion and development shouldn’t be halted at any level. It’s as if they don’t want to risk hurting Montero’s value on the market on the slight chance he initially fails.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      He has to see major league pitching, keeping Montero in AAA is just creating a more difficult learning curve farther down the road I think.

      Montero’s 21, not 27. Spending two full years in AAA (if that’s what it ends up being) isn’t going to ruin his learning curve. He’s still a baby.

    • nick

      I dont think its quite obvious anymore. I believe they learned a valuable lesson by rushing guys like Joba and Hughes, we really haven’t seen it recently. They want to make sure this new wave of guys finish off their developments in the minors, not in front of the media crazed and fan rabid Bronx where every outing/start is manipulated. Wise IMO, of course its frustrating as a fan because its fun to me to watch young guys, even if they dont have such good debuts. However thinking about it, its also understandable that they want to throttle back and wait for guys like Phelps, Mitchell, Warren to get the final touches on their development before promotion. It also could be that they want to keep them off the 40-man, in case of a trade.

      Montero will be up soon (within the next month), just a hunch. And I dont think his trade value will be hindered if he fails immediately, at least not for smart organizations.

  • CP

    “Is Montero better than [Francisco Cervelli]? Yes he is,”

    Apparently, today is Obvious Day.

  • Avi

    I still think Montero is a catcher in the same way carlos delgado was a catcher when he came up. They should just ditch the whole catching thing and let him start raking. It’s almost like they’re keeping him at catcher just to keep his trade value up.

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      Carlos Delgado’s first big league appearance came on the last two days of his age 21 season (i.e., October). He made the jump straight from AA.

      He then spent the next two years splitting time between the majors and AAA. Wasn’t a fulltime regular until age 24, didn’t give up catching until 23.

      Montero’s still way ahead of schedule, on everything. No need to hurry him.

    • JohnnyC

      Not almost like. Very like. Part of any prospect’s value is his trade value. Catchers who can hit have value among all 30 major league teams. Hitters without a defensive position have value only in the American League. No matter how well they hit.

      • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

        Hitters without a defensive position have value only in the American League. No matter how well they hit.

        Nitpick: Montero is not yet a “hitter without a position”. He’s struggled as a catcher, but the Yankees haven’t tried him at first base (probably because that position is occupied at the big league level for the next half-decade).

        I’m sure most NL teams who don’t already have in-house long term answers at 1B would look at Montero. If he can’t catch, he can at least play 1B, even badly, and provide oodles of value.

        • Jericho Spade

          See also, Lance Berkman OF- STL

        • JohnnyC

          They said Mike Piazza could play 1B too. He couldn’t.

  • X-62

    What about the playoff roster? He would need to be called before September to be added but to be called up that early they would need to call him up before there is an everyday spot available. I think there is a good chance we would be better off with him as bench player in the playoffs as oppose to Cervelli just for possible pinch hit purposes (WS NL parks).

    • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

      There’s 8 guys on the 60-day DL, two of whom are position players. We’ve got plenty of loopholes to get Montero on the postseason roster with.

      • Gerald Williams

        I just hope if Montero gets traded it’s for someone like King Felix instead of Carpenter. I would kind of like to see what the kid can do at the pro level though before we ship him off.

        • tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

          I keep scouring the rosters of the teams who will be selling, looking for pitchers good enough that Cash would be willing to part with Montero to acquire.

          I keep coming up empty. The pitchers Montero is worth aren’t on the market. The ones who are on the market aren’t worth Montero.

          I don’t see a trade as likely.

          • Kostas

            Would you trade Montero for Mike Adams of the Padres?

            • JohnnyC

              That’s like asking if the Orioles would trade Manny Machado for David Robertson. No.

            • Brian

              What? No. Relief pitchers fungible and have a low impact on the game. Montero is OUR prospect and I want to see him play for US.

            • JobaWockeeZ

              I would kill myself in order to prevent that form happening.

              • Clay Bellinger

                Hahaha amazing response.

              • bonestock94


          • Bobtaco

            Kershaw, and someone else with a huge contract on the Dodgers to give them salary relief… Very unlikely though…

            • Ro

              Kershaw is probably the only other realistic name that could be brought up in a Montero trade. As the elder guy said above, there just isn’t a single pitcher worth his value. Are the Marlins sellers? Nolascco or Sanchez aren’t worth that.

              There are a lot of pitchers really sucking it this year. 2010 was the year of the pitcher. Not sure 2011 is following that lead.

              Only two big bounty names Cashman should be following – Gio Gonzalez and Kershaw. Everyone else would be for scraps imo. Every move Cashman has made so far has been brilliant. I think he should just stay his course and keep his prospects. B & B are around the corner. Montero and Heathcott could both be up in 2012 and 2013 respectively. I would just sit back and wait until someone comes available via free agency.

              It’s a shame because every single person knows that the Mariners will continue to suck. Regardless that they are 1 game above .500. I willing to bet the Mariners never set foot into an ALDS game while on Felix’s clock. Never.

  • X-62

    I think Montero will be in the minor’s longer then some people think because I personally think the Yanks don’t want to halt his catching development. I don’t think this year or next they want Montero to be BUC/DH, they want him to be first string catcher in the majors or minors. Since Montero is so young and he is considered a work in progress on defense it seems to me they don’t really want him relegated to catching a couple times a week.

    That’s why I think anyone saying once the DH spot opens up they would call up Montero may be wrong, when Cashmans says I want Montero getting regular playing time it seems to me he means he wants Montero getting regular playing time behind the plate, because the Yankees believe he can stick there if given the proper reps.

    • OldYanksFan

      I have to disagree. Between his size and noted lack of athleticism, he has a limited future as a full time starting C. And looking at Mauer, it might not be the best idea. As a BUC, he has great value for us. No black hole in the lineup 35-40 games a year. Plus, 35 games at BUC and 115 games as DH still maintains his trade value as a C (provided he is not too terrible handling his defense).

      Piazza was the greatest hitting C in MLB history. However, even he averaged about 105 GP over a 17 year career (I didn’t even count his last year). Maybe you are better off with a good defensive C, and having your big bat in 155 GP, with a longer career.

      • JobaWockeeZ

        Even if his time is limited he’s gonna get all the chances he can get. The catching position sucks so much that any shred of talent on that position can let you stick. Montero’s case is his bat. Even if he catches 3 times a week and is a DH for 3 games that has value.

        The dude is 21. He can catch and DH for a few years and when he hits his prime he can convert to 1B.

  • Crime Dog

    As much as we were all pretty angry about the Martin-nonDL, I think it worked out. I guess they do know better than we do, afterall

  • infernoscurse

    you want montero to start at catcher everyday in AAA even if their plans is to use him as a part time backup catcher next year because he needs to progress and play better, i dont get whats the rusgh with people wanting him to rot in the bench and play 2 to 3 times a week, we are winning even with our team injured so theres no need now, let him keep working and getting experience everyday then next year hes up and replaces posada

  • CMP

    I think Cashman must have had a stroke or brain injury sometime after the end of last season because he now just says whatever he thinks without any type of internal censor. Obviously Montero is better than Cervelli but as GM of the team, he shouldn’t be saying that to reporters.

    As little as everyone seems to think of Cervelli, he’s still a prideful professional athlete and it’s pretty demeaning and dismissive of him to say something like that so matter of factly.

    • Crime Dog

      Plus, he’s a backup catcher. We must not have too much to complain about as fans if we’re vilifying a backup catcher

    • Mike HC

      Maybe part of the intent was also to light a flame under Cervelli. With ownership being pretty quiet these days, and Girardi doing his best Torre impression to the media, Cashman is the only one left to maybe let players know they need to pick it up. Just bullshitting, throwing out ideas …

  • Mike HC

    I’m not so sure this is brutal honestly. It might be, but it could also be Cashman feeding a line to Montero and to the fans and media. A lot of people were curious, probably including Montero, why he didn’t get the call up. Whatever the real reason may be, it seems like this excuse is the most palatable for everyone, especially for Montero. Of course, it might also be the truth, but I”m skeptical.