Mailbag: Posada, Nunez, Burnett, Martin, Wilson


Another Friday, another mailbag. This week our focus is on players currently with the team that may or may not be next season, plus some miscellaneous stuff about C.J. Wilson and prospects. Remember to use the Submit A Tip box in the sidebar if you want to send in some questions.

(AP Photo/Seth Wenig)

Ryan asks: Do you guys think that Posada makes it onto the playoff roster?

I do think he’ll make it, assuming the Yankees get to the postseason, of course. We don’t want to jinx anything. Jorge Posada still has some value as a veteran pinch-hitter against right-handed pitchers, plus it won’t be a real chore to carry him on the roster since they figure to drop down to an eleven man pitching staff. I try not too put too much stock into intangibles, but we know Posada won’t be overwhelmed in a big spot in October, which is comforting (if nothing else).

Chris asks: If Posada does not retire at the end of the season do you see him trying to get a catching job in the NL or as a DH in the AL? I think he has a chip on his shoulder and would be looking to prove the Yankees (and Girardi) wrong.

I think he’s going to retire, but if he doesn’t, I imagine he’ll go to an AL club to DH. Maybe he’s open to being a part-time first baseman and primary pinch-hitter for an NL club, but I think that’s a big if. I see two likely destinations if he sticks around after 2011: the Rays and Mets. Both are close to home for him and could use someone for those roles.

Tucker asks: What trade value does Eduardo Nunez hold? Ken Rosenthal recently wrote that he has a lot because he’s hitting well and can “play” premium positions. What’s your take?

You all know that I’m not Nunez’s biggest fan, but there’s no denying the dude has some serious trade value. He’s shown that he can hit in the limited at-bats he’s gotten this year, and his impressive contact rate is in line with his minor league track record and scouting report. His defense has improved as the season has gone on (likely because he’s getting more reps), and he’s a legitimate shortstop. That last part alone is hard to find.

Let’s be conservative and says he’s a .320 wOBA, 25+ stolen base, average defense guy going forward. That’s basically this year’s version of Erick Aybar, who’s already a two-win player with six weeks left in the season. Five years of that guy at a bargain price will have a ton of value on the trade market. I don’t think that it’s an accident the Mariners wanted him in a potential Cliff Lee trade last year, legit middle infielders that are more than zeroes with the bat are pretty rare these days.

Preston asks: What are the chances the Yankees would/could trade or cut Burnett at the end of the season?

Maybe they’ll try to trade him, but I’m positive the Yankees won’t just release A.J. Burnett this offseason. If they do that, they’re still on the hook for his entire contract, so why not just keep him to see if he can give you anything, even as a reliever? For better or for worse, the Yankees are stuck with A.J. for the next two seasons.

Jeff asks: What do the Yankees do with Russell Martin in the off season? He narrowly qualifies as a Type A player. Do the Yankees offer arbitration whether he is Type A or B? Are Montero or Romine ready to take the job as a catcher in the big leagues? Could the Yankees platoon those two guys with Montero getting some time at DH?

The Type-A stuff doesn’t matter because he doesn’t have six full years of service time yet. You can’t get compensation picks for players you non-tender, and Martin won’t get those six years of service time until after next season. He’d probably get something like $6-6.5M his final time through arbitration after the season, which is a steep price but not the end of the world. The Yankees could use him as a caddy with either Jesus Montero or Austin Romine, breaking those guys in gradually rather than just handing them the starting catcher’s job.

(AP Photo/Paul Sancya)

Mark asks: Do you see the Yankees and Rangers getting into another testy free agent battle for C.J. Wilson this offseason? If yes, do you think he’s worth the high cost and whose spot in the rotation he would take? Thanks!

I have a feeling that we’re going to spent a lot of time talking about Wilson in November and December, so I don’t want to get too deep into it now. He’s obviously worth inquiring about, but I can’t see how in the world he gets less than Burnett or John Lackey did. He’s straight up better than those guys were at the time of their free agency, he’s left-handed, and he doesn’t have the recent injury history either. I like Wilson but I don’t love him, especially at that price. But as the second best starter on the market, the Yankees are bound to show some interest.

As for the last part of your question, I’m guess that one of Freddy Garcia or Bartolo Colon will not be back next year. Even if they are, it won’t be too difficult to free up a rotation spot for a pitcher of Wilson’s caliber.

Chris asks: I read an article that said the Phillies haven’t depleted their farm system in spite of all the trades of the last few years. A) is this true and if so, B) how is it the Yankees are seemingly one deal away from depleting their own? Is the Phillies system that much better?

To answer (A) first, the Phillies have traded 13 prospects (not counting J.A. Happ, who technically wasn’t a prospect) for Roy Halladay, Cliff Lee, Roy Oswalt, and Hunter Pence over the last two years or so, and they’ve somehow managed to hold onto Domonic Brown. They started out with a very good farm system and have done a nice job of replenishing it by developing mid-round picks. That said, you can see the toll all those moves have taken on their farm system. They had to scrounge up a pair of Single-A kids to headline a package for Pence because they didn’t have the players in Triple or Double-A to get it done.

The Phillies are in the middle of the best stretch in franchise history and are rightfully in win now mode, because guys like Jimmy Rollins, Ryan Howard, Chase Utley, and even Lee and Halladay are on the wrong side of 30 and will see their skills decline over the next few years. Their window isn’t infinite, and at some point the well will dry up. It’s kinda like what happened to the Yankees in 2005 or so, but they obviously had a much higher margin of error given their payroll.

As for (B), it’s just a matter of perception. The Yankees could deal two of Jesus Montero, Manny Banuelos, and Dellin Betances and still boast a very strong farm system with two legitimate number one type prospects (whichever one of those three is left plus Gary Sanchez), one super-toolsy guy with some major helium (Mason Williams), and a cast of rock solid prospects close to big leagues (Austin Romine, Adam Warren, David Phelps, Corban Joseph, etc.). Yeah, the farm system would take a big hit dealing two of those three, but it would still be in much better shape than half the farm system’s out there.

Categories : Mailbag


  1. A.D. says:

    I feel like the Phils get the whole “they have depleted the farm” because they didn’t give up Brown & because Worley has had a solid season, and thus people ignore the rest.

  2. Foghorn Leghorn says:

    Cash was on with Francesser last week and he made a very interesting comment about trades that the Yanks almost made.

    In the past few years he’d look at the eventual trade that was made for a guy like Lee, Halladay, Santana, etc and look at was finally given up and then compare it to what the Yanks were being asked to give up and he was in compelte shock. It just seems that teams are willing to ask the Yanks for these ridiculous packages and when they don’t bite they’ll settle for much less with other teams.

    I wonder if this is a result of the history of the yanks tendency under George to give away prospects for big name free agents. Or, is there something else going on here?

    It amazes me sometimes what other teams end up giving up for top notch players.

    I don’t get flummoxed often…but I’m still amazed at how little the Red Sox gave up for AGonz… If that were the Yanks they would’ve had to include top prospects AND at least 1-2 starters on the major league club. The only explanation for this deal is that Jed Hoyer drafted those kids and knew their value/potential. I think Hoyer will be back to working for Theo in few years.

    I’m not a conspiracy theorist (or maybe I am and I don’t know it) but the whole thing just seems so weird..

    • jon says:

      do you think the package the yankees offered for cliff lee was really that much better than what they got from texas?

      • Foghorn Leghorn says:

        that one is similar…but others aren’t…

        and its also deals the yanks aren’t in on. Like the phillies deals. If the yanks make that deal no way are they able to hang on to a guy similar to Brown.

        maybe i’m nuts

        • Crime Dog says:

          We’re closer to Yankee prospects than any other prospects, so we might overvalue these guys a bit more than we realize

          • Foghorn Leghorn says:

            right…and I get that. but its also the numerous prospect lists that the players show up on.

            • Ted Nelson says:

              Even looking at those prospect lists I feel that we, as Yankee fans, tend to overvalue Yankees prospects and undervalue the prospects of other teams.

              In the Santana deal the Twins brought back 3 Top 100 prospects and an Adam Warren-type fast rising NCAA pitcher who reached AAA his 2nd pro-season.

              In the Greinke deal the Royals got a SS who had been the #12 prospect the year before, a Dellin level pitching prospect, a promising young relief prospect, and a MLB ready OFer.

              Yet people act like these teams are crazy for taking these packages over the ones we’re not even sure whether the Yankees offered, since mostly the rumors are that the Yankees aren’t offering.

              • Yeah… Look at the reaction among Yankees fans to the hype Lavarnway’s getting this season. If Austin Romine were doing what Lavarnway’s doing (or if he does next year what Lavarnway has done this year, since Lavarnway is a year older), Yankees fans would all be losing their shit.

          • JT says:

            Overvalue??? Look at all prospects that the Yankees have traded away lately that have actually become contributing members of major league teams.

            Then look at what the Phillies gave up for all the players they acquired… utterly crap.

            Also, it really gets me when people say the Yankees overhype their prospects (like which organization doesn’t) but fail to acknowledge all the successful players we have traded away recently.

            • Ted Nelson says:

              I don’t think that the Yankees overhype their own prospects… because every team has every incentive to overhype their prospects… so no one listens to much about how an org. projects it’s players. That’s why people turn to third party rankings like Baseball America.

              I wouldn’t act like the Phillies didn’t give up quality prospects.

              Kyle Drabek was and still is a stud pitching prospect, Taylor was a Top 30 prospect at the time, and d’Arnaud is one of the top catching prospects in baseball as we speak… Only bust there was Taylor, who the Blue Jays turned around and traded pretty much right away.

              I think the Astros are as poorly run as any team, but Gose is a guy a lot of people like who is having a decent season in AA at only 20… he’s a CF who could make up for the Astros gift wrapping Bourn to the Braves.

              The two guys they gave up for Pence are highly regarded, just somewhat far away.

    • mike says:

      I want to agree with Cash, and i believe other GM’s will ask for the moon from the Yanks because of the media/win now attitude in NY, but its a stretch to find Yankee prospects over the last few years which, had they been traded, would have bit the yanks – even if they gave up the extra “vig” required.

      For instance, while I like Nunez, the Yankee world would have been just as happy with a likely with Lee and a WS appearance last year/maybe Lee or a few draft picks this year as they would without him.

      like every other year, IMO the back-up IF situation would have been resolved already ( Harriston Jr redux etc) for little or no additional cost.

      Its easy for cash to hype the value ( or allow the hype/encourage the hype) of the minor leagues, as i believe he thinks his GM cred flows from an ability to have a farm system, but is disingenuous for him to compalin about the vig the Yanks are asked to pay when history shows when they did pay the vig – or kept the prospect – there was apparently more smoke than fire with many of these trade chips

      • pat says:

        Concerning Nunez/Lee. I think it came down to principle. From what I understand Seattle agreed to a deal then changed their mind and asked for more in the 11th hour. If Cashman acquiesces with that it sets a bad precedent for other teams when it comes to negotiations. Same thing happened with the Michael Ynoa negotiations. There is no question they could have out bid the Athletics’ but after he reneged on the deal he was about to sign with the Yanks, Cash couldn’t appear weak for the long run and let him walk.

    • Gonzo says:

      I don’t think Hoyer did that bad for AGonz. He needed a team that A) needed a 1b, and B) had the money to extend AGonz.

      The pool of potential suitors wasn’t exactly large. The normal big money teams had either no money or were set at 1b.

      He still got two top 50 prospects and a top 100 (I think Fuentes was on ssomeone’s list) guy too. If he had gotten Iglesias, he might be pissed.

      • Foghorn Leghorn says:

        it was odd that no mlb player was included…and then Corey Patterson? was a throw in?

        • Gonzo says:

          I didn’t think it was odd at all. Eric Patterson is a utility guy fringe MLB player. I’d rather have another prospect to tell you the truth.

          Why does it matter if they didn’t get an MLB player?

          • Foghorn Leghorn says:

            it just seemed like a weak package for a guy that is as good as AGonz..that’s all.

            it just also seemed that the deal was pre ordained for the past few years and no other team was involved.

            • Gonzo says:

              I don’t think there were a lot of teams in on AGonz.

              A team would basically be trading for one year of AGonz + exclusive negotiation rights.

              What team had the money, had the need at 1b, and was willing to trade their two top prospects + one in their top 5?

              That’s probably why it seemed preordained. Because it’s almost like the Red Sox were the only landing spot for AGonz.

  3. David, Jr. says:

    Nuney has lots of value. Middle infielders aren’t that easy to find. I was watching the Sux game the other day, and Minnesota had this guy named Nishioka, who they invested $15M in, plus maybe a posting fee, not sure. He is hitting .217, with get this, five extra base hits all year! I can see why Cashman didn’t want to give him up.

    • amr5026 says:

      Nishioka was also out for a couple months at the beginning of the season with a broken leg courtesy of Swisher. I don’t think he’s adapting to MLB very well.

      • David, Jr. says:

        Agree. Just mean that decent infielders aren’t that easy to come by. Other infielders that they used in that game included something called a Plouffe, at .202, and something called a Tolbert, at .213.

  4. JohnC says:

    I can’t see the Yanks getting into a bidding war for CJ Wilson if he is looking for i excess of 15 mill per. He’s a good pitcher but not wortht that kind of money. Especially when they will have to ante up to keep CC when he opts out after this season.

    • BK2ATL says:

      I agree. Plus, we’re already on the hook for $16.5 mil per for AJ for the next 2 seasons. No further comment.

      Just pay CC his money. If we can enter into talks for a high-end trade for a cost-controlled, young starter, I’d certainly listen, if only costs us Brackman/Betances, Laird/Joseph, and maybe Warren/Noesi plus another piece.

      I’d rather see the Yanks give Hughes, Nova, and Banuelos a fair shot in 2012, even if they might not be 100% ready. Our offense and bullpen can handle it. If it doesn’t work out, then there’s a strong FA market for young starters after the 2012.

  5. Bum Rushed says:

    I don’t care what the Yankees say. They clearly wanted to minimize Posada even before the season when they decided he couldn’t catch any longer. The problem is the Posada of 2010 >>>>>>>>>>> Cervelli of 2011 in every respect. At the very least Posada should be the backup catcher, and with how awful Martin has been, he could even be a half-time catcher.

    I really hope Jorge continues on for another year or two with another team. Unlike Bernie, I have little doubt he has something left, especially if used properly in a Victor Martinez role.

    • David, Jr. says:

      I disagree with all of this.

      First, they gave Posada the fulltime DH job. Switch hitter, both sides of the plate. He miserably failed at it. Believe me, they would love it if he had produced numbers like David Ortiz.

      Second, Martin has not been awful. He has been excellent defensively, the best that they have had there for several years.

      • Bum Rushed says:

        He was always worse as a DH than as a Catcher. Last year, the split was 90 points in OPS. They were setting him up to fail. Worse, they’ve given 33 starts to a far inferior catcher in Cervelli.

        • David, Jr. says:

          I disagree. You aren’t being objective. He was a 40 year old catcher who couldn’t catch at all anymore. They handed the DH job to him. He failed miserably at that. What are they supposed to do, make him the starting first baseman? Time to get over Jorge. The team will turn over, get younger, and prosper.

          • Bum Rushed says:

            He catches better than Cervelli. And you “disagreeing” isn’t objectivity.

            Posada is a catcher. Given how much Martin and Cervelli have sucked, Jorge has a role on this team and especially given his career splits.

            • Klemy says:

              I’m not sure I’d agree with him catching better than Cervelli.

              • Alibaba says:

                Neither do I. Even in his prime, Posada was not a very good catcher. Now he is not even MLB level in catching. The biggest mistake by the Yankees was to give him a 4-year contract.

            • Laura Posada says:

              you really think jorge can still catch?? he was horrible last year and it was evident he was in decline prior to that.

      • BK2ATL says:

        Posada is done after this contract. He and we fans need to come to grips with that. He’s reminding me of Bernie Williams last years in pinstripes. A sad thing for a once great Yankee. he needs to retire in pinstripes, then we can champion his case vs. other HOF catchers.

        Martin, awful??? Maybe I imagined him being an All-Star catcher just last month. I guess the rest of the AL has better catchers??? I missed the memo on that.

        Sure, his BA is low, but he has produced for us offensively in spurts. Plus, defensively, it appears that you quickly forgot how truly “awful” we were behind the plate the last 2 years between Posada and Cervelli. And, Martin is currently catching and managing one of the best AL staffs.

        That “awful” that you’re referring to, gotta be sarcasm.

    • I Voted 4 Kodos says:

      Posada proved last year that his defensive skills had eroded to the point that he has no business catching anymore. He also took a memory test last year and performed extremely poorly on it, indicating potential brain damage from too many shots to the facemask. For his own good, it’s probably better he’s not catching anymore.

      • Bum Rushed says:

        Please, what are Cervelli’s “defensive skills”? He can’t throw out runners and he catches for a guy that would excel with anyone behind the plate.

        I really hope that Jorge continues his career and posts a .800 OPS as a C/DH/1B. The Yankees have treated him horribly, especially in the context of the rest of their roster.

        • Foghorn Leghorn says:

          right…the Yanks have treated Posada like crap paying him $105MM in his career.

        • breich315 says:

          No. No. No. Just No.

        • I Voted 4 Kodos says:

          Did I say anything about Cervelli? Anything at all?

          That said, I still prefer Cervelli defensively to Posada.

          Did you watch the games last year? Posada did basically nothing well behind the dish. Nothing.

          I also like how you ignored the piece about how he may have brain damage from too many shots to the head. Please address that. It may help to know that he suffered from headaches coming into the year, and that they’ve lingered into the year:

          The guy should not be behind the plate.

          • Bum Rushed says:

            I’m glad you “prefer” Cervelli. He’s thrown out 8% of runners this year and “catches” the best pitcher on the team. He has no role on this ballclub. Posada, at his absolute worse, is still vastly better than Cervelli in every respect.

            That brain damage B.S. played exactly into the organization’s plan. You know, cause the NY Post is THE standard for accurate reporting. Let the player decide whether he can play. If he can’t you force him to retire. This in-between shit helps no one.

            • Mike Axisa says:

              Let the player decide whether he can play.

              Disagree 100%. No player will tell you they can’t play. If they ran the team like this, Bernie would still be in CF.

              • Bum Rushed says:

                They extended Bernie when they shouldn’t have. Posada clearly had something left last year when he was still a catcher. To make the decision unilaterally is to ignore the evidence.

                • I Voted 4 Kodos says:

                  The evidence shows he has some brain damage. To decide otherwise is to ignore the evidence.

                  • Bum Rushed says:

                    Oh yeah? What evidence? Headaches? Yeah, that’s “solid” evidence.

                    • Mike Axisa says:

                      Still, if Posada is honest with himself, he’ll realize DH’ing is neither a promotion nor or demotion, but a gift from the Yankees. They’re worried about Posada’s health after suffering two possible concussions from foul tips last year.

                      Tough talk aside, the 39-year-old admits he’s concerned, too.

                      “I have to think about my kids. I want to enjoy growing old,” he said. “I don’t want to be sick.”

                      As the sports world’s awareness of concussions grows, the Yankees’ medical staff is keeping closer tabs on Posada. Scouts say his reaction time, particularly on defense, has slowed in the last two to three seasons, although that may be due, in part, to his advancing age. But Posada was almost knocked out by a foul tip in a Sept. 7 game against the Orioles, returning to the dugout feeling disoriented and dizzy.

                      “I remember telling [former pitching coach] Dave Eiland, ‘Something’s wrong with me, I just don’t feel right,’” Posada said. “I felt like I was about to throw up, I was dizzy, everything felt weird. The next day I was still having headaches. It was scary, I have to admit.”

                      Although a CAT scan revealed no bleeding in the brain, the Yankees nevertheless had Posada undergo a comprehensive memory test. The computerized program, called ImPACT, was designed at the University of Pittsburgh concussion center. It runs for 15-18 minutes, measuring attention, memory, processing speed and reaction time.

                      Some NHL and NFL football teams use ImPACT, but it’s universally employed in the big leagues, including umpires. Players are tested in spring training for baseline readings, then tested again after any incident that might involve a head injury – a collision at home plate, for instance, or crashing into an outfield wall, or in Posada’s case, a direct hit from a foul tip.

                      Posada said the test results were “not good” after the September incident. In fact, his results were subpar in two of the three tests he took in 2010. Does this mean Posada is at risk for brain damage? No one knows for sure, but the data is troubling.

                      Solid enough?


                • JT says:

                  He clearly had something left as a hitter, but there was nothing that would make the Yankees believe that he still had the ability to catch.

                  Defensively, Martin is worlds better than Posada. Cervilli is a scrub and doesn’t deserve to catch either, but since he is younger with grit, they can take a chance on him, hoping that he can improve. Posada on the other hand is getting old, and fast, and there is no empirical evidence to show that he can improve on his catching from last year.

                  The Yankees make a proactive decision based on their evidence and decide that Posada will not be a catcher on this team anymore. That’s much better than waiting for Posada to blow several games because of his misplays behind the plate, then switch him out for another catcher (by which time we might not have a catcher to replace him with).

                  • Bum Rushed says:

                    Cervelli has never improved. Posada’s catching is good enough because he hits when he plays there.

                    • Dan says:

                      Posada will give up more runs with his defense then he could possibly help produce with his bat. Last year his fielding percentace and caught stealing rate were at career lows. He allowed 72 stolen bases in 78 games, he is done as a catcher there is no debate.

              • David, Jr. says:

                “That brain damage B.S. played exactly into the organization’s plan. You know, cause the NY Post is THE standard for accurate reporting. Let the player decide whether he can play. If he can’t you force him to retire. This in-between shit helps no one.”

                Mike – This is an impressive new candidate for dumbest RAB post of all time. It should be properly acknowledged.

            • Crime Dog says:

              Letting players decide if they’re ok to play is how the NFL has had a huge mess on their hands with concussions. If the thing about him having possible brain damage is true (we have no reason to believe otherwise), then the Yankees have done the right thing.

            • I Voted 4 Kodos says:

              Did you read the article I gave you? It was reporting something Cashman said on WFAN. It was something that the Post dug up from unnamed sources, it was straight from Cashman’s mouth. This article discusses the issue at length, including Posada’s poor results on a memory test given to help discern brain function:

              I’m sure that the whole thing did play into what the organization wanted to do, and they may not give a shit about his long term health at all. I’m not claiming that they care about that. Whether they’re doing it for the right or wrong reasons, he still has no business putting himself at further risk.

              Again, I don’t like Cervelli all that much and I’ve wanted him gone for most of the year. Thinking he’s better defensively than Posada right now isn’t high praise, it just means I think he’s better than a guy who I thought looked comically bad last year.

              • Bum Rushed says:

                If he’s failing those tests then he shouldn’t be playing and they should be collecting insurance money. That he is playing says it wasn’t a major problem.

                • Jorge says:

                  As an objective observer, I see everyone else trying to calmly explain to you an alternate viewpoint, while you fire back with your own self-proven absolutes and making connections where there aren’t any (example: wrongly connecting someone saying they disagree and saying you weren’t being objective.) If you are so convinced already, why bother having the argument?

    • Foghorn Leghorn says:

      i’m glad you’re not a GM…Posada is done. sure its sad, but get over it.

      His defense has always been below average but he masked it with very good offensive play. But he’s been declining for years and you are seeing right now the tremendous value that a good defensive catcher like Martin can provide.

      This year does not diminish Jorge’s career. He’s been a great, consistent player. But he turns 40 next week and its just time to hang it up.

      • Bum Rushed says:

        Like he was “done” last year? Or the year before that?

        C – .279/.380/.487 = .868
        DH – .221/.317/.354 = .672
        PH – .215/.331/.370 = .702

        Jeter is closer to “done” than Posada. He’s been steadily declining. Jorge, by contrast, has been asked to perform a role he’s never excelled at. They ignored all evidence of this and still insist on playing the awfulness that is Cervelli. There’s exactly no reason Jorge couldn’t catch two or three times a week. At least we know now Burnett’s suckfest wasn’t his fault.

        • Foghorn Leghorn says:

          the yanks staff this year has been better than it has in years…across the board and across the staff. IMO the two biggest reasons are Kerrigan and much better defensive catching.

          Even basics like framing pitches and blocking balls…oh..and throwing runners out. Martin may not be hitting that well, but he adds tremendous value to this team. And he’s not an automatic DP if he does get on base.

          • Bum Rushed says:

            Oh yeah? Like Burnett? Or Hughes?

            As for Cervelli, he’s not a defensive catcher just because he can’t hit.

            • Foghorn Leghorn says:

              Burnett? I’m not sure anyone can help him. And Hughes problem of a lack of velocity certainly wasn’t something that could be helped by a catcher.

              Cervelli is a backup catcher, nothing more, nothing less. And I can’t wait for Montero to be called up so they can send him down or trade him.

              Posada has been a great Yankee, but for years he has shown that he has no business catching.

              And if they Yanks weren’t older then they could think about carrying him as a full time DH. But they need that DH spot to give these older players days off.

              I know its hard for an athlete to accept that the end is near, but Jorge should try to embrace the role that he has. At the end of this year i don’t care where he goes, but it would be a terrible decision by the Yanks to bring him back even for $1.

              • Bum Rushed says:

                Posada was great last year. He can easily be a backup catcher in this game. I hope next year he is while the Yankees are still trying to force Martin into a full-time role and while they have no f’in clue with their prospects.

            • Klemy says:

              And Cervelli is not a worse defensive catcher than Posada, just because you keep saying it.

              • Bum Rushed says:

                Back up that opinion with some stats, please…

                • Thomas says:

                  From 2008-10, DRS has Posada the worst defensive catcher in the game by 4 runs. Napoli and Buck are tied for second worse and have played in 200 and 550 more inning, respectively (Also Napoli was so bad, he now rarely catches).

                  From 2009-2010 (no 2008 data), FRS has Posada as the second worst catcher (-13) behind only Rob Johnson (-15) and tied with Kendall and Doumit. Kendall has played in over 500 more innings and Doumit, whose played in about the same amount of innings as Posada, doesn’t catch anymore.

                  Posada is bad defensively.

                  In 2010, Posada’s DRS and FRS were -8 and -9 in 678 innings. Thus, he is not just one of the poorest defensive catchers, he is also getting worse at it.

                  From 2010-2011, Cervelli is -5 in DRS and 0 in FRS in almost 1000 innings. He sucks to be sure, but he is still better than Posada on defense.

                  • Dan says:

                    Also, factor in that many of Cervelli’s starts came with AJ on the mound and with how wild he can be, it would be hard for any catcher to have great defensive stats.

          • David, Jr. says:

            This. Very well said, and I would add Rothschild.

          • Foghorn Leghorn says:

            i’m sorry…I meant rothschild and said kerrigan…i’m multitasking…

        • Colombo says:

          Concussions are nothing to play around with. If he has lingering headaches (which he said he does), there is no way you can put him back behind the plate, the chance of doing more damage is too great. By taking him out of that position, the team has actually done him a favor.

          • Bum Rushed says:

            A fastball to the head is just as dangerous. If he’s not medically capable of playing, then they should cut him.

            • I Voted 4 Kodos says:

              It’s also much less likely. How often do players get hit in the head while batting? While catching?

              Big difference.

              • Bum Rushed says:

                Oh yeah? How often do catchers get hit in the head? Or is that your opinion?

                • CP says:

                  Almost every game there is a foul tip that hits the catcher in the head.

                • gc says:

                  In a full season, how many times does a single everyday player get hit in the head with a pitched ball? Once at most? I can’t actually think of it happening twice to one player in a single season. Most times, a single player NEVER gets hit in the head in a single season. Some players have played for ten years and never gotten hit in the head.

                  In a full season, how many times does a catcher get hit in the head with a foul ball or swung bat? A lot more than once or twice. If you can’t acknowledge that, then maybe you’re the one who needs to be checked out for possible concussions.

        • Mike Axisa says:

          Not for nothing, but before this season the DH sample was ~350 PA spread out over his entire career. The most games he’s ever played at DH in a season before this year was 28. It’s not like he ever spent a significant and extended period of time at the position.

          And then there’s the whole headaches concussion thing.

          • Bum Rushed says:

            And his PH sample?

            The plain fact is they given him a role for which he has never done well. Now we’re surprised when he doesn’t? Puh-leeeze.

            The concussion stuff is a distraction. Either he can play or he can’t. Don’t use BS excuses when he was clearly better than Cervelli last year in every respect. This year he’s still better.

        • gc says:

          No, they asked Jorge to perform a role he has excelled at quite well throughout his career actually, HITTING. He no longer had to worry about calling a game, or crouching a hundred times in a night, or getting smacked on the hands or facemask with foul balls or bats. All he had to do is show up and hit the ball. To imply that this was too much to ask from a professional hitter with his kind of experience is ludicrous.

          • Jim S says:


            I never understood the excuse, especially from Posada, about not wanting to DH.

            If hitting is all you have to worry about now, and you’ve been great at it before while having to spread your focus around, you should not be substantially worse unless other factors are at play, like AGE.

            He ain’t young anymore.

          • Bum Rushed says:

            Nope, DH isn’t the same role. Some players can’t adjust. He never has.

        • JT says:

          They Yankees can’t make Posada the everyday catcher just because he hits better when catching than when he is a DH. Additionally, those numbers are skewed in favor of catching because of his # of plate appearances. Either way, the Yankees are a better team with Martin behind the dish than with Posada catching everyday…

          Do you disagree with that?

          • Bum Rushed says:

            I’m not arguing Posada should be playing everyday…

            Reading is FUNdamental!

            • JT says:

              So let me get this straight. Your argument is completely based off Posada’s offensive abilities as a catcher, claiming he doesn’t hit well as a DH/PH, but then aren’t even arguing that he should be the full time catcher???

              If all you are arguing for is to have Posada be the backup catcher, then a majority of his ABs are still going to come from DH/PH, and the stats you bring up are pretty inconsequential in the grand scheme of the whole baseball season.

              Reading is Fundamental, but so is logic… something that is lacking in the totality of your posts.

              PS. It seemed like you switched your stance midway from wanting Posada as full time catcher to part time catcher as more and more people kept owning you with evidence of how bad a catcher Posada is… just sayin

            • CountZero says:

              I’m not sure what you’re arguing then? That Posada should be playing 1 out of 5 days as the backup C instead of Cervelli, but not DH? How does that make the Yankees’ “treatment” of him better?

              You’re arguing he will always suck at DH, and he shouldn’t be the starting C. So if that’s true, then you don’t want him to catch 1 out of 5 and then DH the other 4, right? The only option left to you is that he is strictly the backup C 1 of 5 days. I think the Yankees intention to play him as the everyday DH was a better offer than that.

              So what exactly is your point? No objective test that I can come up with shows any reason why Posada should be in any role other than the one he’s currently in. If someone chooses to sign him for next season, good for him. As long as it isn’t the Yankees.

              • JT says:

                =) Sorry for stealing your thunda.

                I try to remain civil when posting, since I don’t like when people start calling names and insulting others, but he pushed my buttons with that inappropriate “reading is fundamental” statement.

    • JU says:

      Cervelli is overrated defensively. But Jorge Posada is an atrocity behind the plate. He’s always been bad, but he’s reached a point where it is irresponsible to play him back there. The usual blind Yankees fans will cry blasphemy about that, but people who know baseball know that is true.

  6. Dan says:

    How bad did it hurt to say something nice about Nunez?
    Nunez is more valuable to the Yanks as a part-time and eventual replacment for Jeter than he is as a trade piece unless a true star is involved on the other side.
    Posada as a pinch hitter,(who can he really hit better than) or having gas in the tank and being better than Cervelli is laughable. Jorge was done last year. Now Jorge 2010=jeter 2012. jeter already is the worst shortstop in the majors and probably AAA. He has zero range. Cano makes more plays on the shortstop side of second than Jeter does. He can throw better than Nunez, but it may be Nunez needing more experience at a single position rather than getting time at all three IF spots. Nunez should start at least three games/week at short with jeter DHing or simply sucking oxygen on the bench.

  7. Johnny Nitro says:

    Did anyone read Stephen A. Smith’s column on how the Yankees have treated Posada in a “classless” way over the years? The article makes me want to go to his house and kick him in the nuts. Then maybe finish off with a golden shower on his face. How does that hack still have a job?

    • Crime Dog says:

      Here’s the link for everybody. Wow, that’s something.

    • Foghorn Leghorn says:

      what’s amazing is the Sox are the media favorite but they have plenty of examples of treating their veteran players and major contributors like crap.

      their fans and writers make fun of guys like Manny, Pedro, Nomar and Damon (and others) who were very responsible for the teams success.

      They start it off with a smear campaign and then just pile on and continue with the hatred after the player leaves. It never ends…its already begun with the next waive with Ellsbury and Papelbon…and even Drew, who has actually played pretty well for them.

  8. Bum Rushed says:

    What makes you think Martin will “caddy” for anyone? If they haven’t recognized this year that he’s no better than a backup catcher, you think they’ll figure that out going forward? Worse, because they can’t figure out what the hell to do with Montero, they’ve wasted a development year for Romine.

    No, Martin is the starter next year. And if he shows any signs of life, I wouldn’t be surprised to see them sign him to a Brosius-like extension.

    • JohnC says:

      What everyone has to realize is that this is also a business. No matter what a guy like Posada has done over the years, there comes a time when age takes over and the skills just aren’t there anymore. Yanks have to get younger whether the fans/media like it or not. It will be the same with Mo and Jeter over the next 2 years. Seems like Yanks just can’t win no matter what. If they continue to stick with these guys and they don’t get it done, media writes how Yanks need to put bench them. When they do, they turn around and write how they are now disrespecting these guys who have done so mucn for the organization. Can’t have it both ways

    • Rich in NJ says:

      The Brosisus-extension caused them to trade Mike Lowell, which turned out to be a mistake. You don’t stockpile high-ceiling catching prospects and then let them be blocked by solid, but offensively-challenge, veteran without paying the price at some point.

      • Bum Rushed says:

        I’ll believe it when I see it. Montero has a role on this team right now. Romine is stuck in AA. If they were going to do the right thing, this year was a clear opportunity.

        Instead, they still think Martin is a full-time guy…

  9. Slugger27 says:

    Cj’s workload scares me. Id be concerned he may break down or pull a hughes and have months of dead arm. Jumped from regularly used reliever to a 200 inning guy outta nowhere. And he’s not exactly a huge dude

  10. Soam says:

    “But as the second best starter on the market, the Yankees are bound to show some interest.” Who’s better than CJ Wilson on the market?

  11. Soam says:

    It just occurred to me that you may have meant CC. I agree he’ll likely opt out but I don’t think of him as a FA, I don’t see any way he doesn’t come back here.

  12. Bartolo's Colon says:

    austin kearns was just dfa’d, we should pick him up, worked out great for us last year

  13. jon says:

    my brain just exploded

    cano has a better obp than teix

  14. Jose M. Vazquez.. says:

    In a recent opinion which I submitted a few days ago, I referred to the author of Mrs. Robinson as Neil Simon when I meant of course Paul Simon who is a great Yankee fan. For this you have my apologies Mr. Paul Simon. As for trading Montero, Banuelos or Betances I opine that they should not do it for I believe they aqre going to be very good major league players. I hope Yankees for life.

  15. Ted Nelson says:

    Good stuff, Mike

  16. The Big Stein says:

    Bum Rushed = Matt?

  17. vin says:

    Your response begs the question – why were you so down on Nunez in the first place? Good contact skills, capable middle IF glove, strong (but erratic) arm, very good wheels. Did you think he would only be a singles hitter? Or did you expect him to hack at everything? I’ve always wondered why you were so down on him… I understand now (as I did then) that he wouldn’t be the next Jeter or Cano, but he was on the path of becoming a major leaguer.

    • Mike Axisa says:

      Never walked, never hit for much power, always had trouble on defense. Plus he had 2-3 brutal years in A-ball. His real breakout came in AA in 2009.

      • vin says:

        Fair enough. I suppose once a young player has a breakout year (after lackluster seasons) he can either go in one of two directions – continue up, or slide back down.

        At least he made his first SI cover this week. So he’s got that going for him, which is nice.

      • Crime Dog says:

        I had the same problems with Nunez, but is there a chance with his recent change to not switch hitting (’09 correct? Or am I totally off base), that he might still develop some power vs RHP?

    • JMK says:

      I won’t answer for Mike but will attest that I was suspicious, likely for the same reasons. He struck me as a guy with talent but a lack of discipline. That often leads to big struggles in the majors.

      The walk rate was very low, the power minimal and the defense was shaky at best.

      I’d seen him in a few games in AA and AAA and each time he seemed unfocused. Baserunning errors, botched throws, trouble reading hops off ground balls, swinging madly at obvious balls. Not that unusual for a young player but there was little consistency.

      You could tell though that he certainly had talent. He’d hit strong line drives, had very good speed and looked quite smooth getting to some balls. His range always looked solid and he’d make some really great looking catches but then airmail the throw (his arm angle changed between AA and AAA from my amateur analysis). You just didn’t know what you’d get from him day-in, day-out.

      I guess at the end of the day, I was not sold that his lack of consistency would translate. I figured there would be awful defense and a shit ton of strikeouts. But he’s been very good, much better than I thought he’d be. So props to him.

  18. Jorge says:

    On Nunez, I’m still not sold on the defensive lapses although, yes, they appear to be less the more he plays. I think he can be a solid MLB starting SS, but I think that opportunity with the Yankees is still two years away. To me, he’s the biggest piece of tradebait the team has, and the guy who might actually save the team from giving up a Montero, Banuelos, or Betances in obtaining something of real value.

    On Posada: I love him. The team has treated with with respect. This should be his final season. That’s it.

    • BK2ATL says:

      I agree with just about all of this, except the tradebait part.

      I truly believe that they believe that Nunez will be Jeter’s heir. There is no one else on the horizon in the farm system, and I don’t think they’ll reunite Hanley with Girardi.

      Great take on Posada as well. I completely agree.

  19. Kevin says:

    Jorge’s spirit is willing but his body isn’t and if he was on most other teams, he would have been cut by now.
    JOrge will always be part of the 90′s championships but the cold hard truth is he can’t play the game well anymore. If he wasn’t Jorge Posada he would have been DFA right now so the idea that he’s being “disrespected” is a joke to me.

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