Sunday Night Open Thread



At long last, that ugly road trip is finally over. The Yankees went just 4-6 on a trip that took them to Baltimore, Anaheim, Seattle, and Toronto in the span of 11 days, yet they still managed to increase their lead in the AL East from 2.5 games to 4.5 games because the Red Sox are playing that poorly right now. They lost to the Rays again this afternoon, and are now just two games up on the wildcard. When September started, they were nine up. The Yankees haven’t been playing well at all, but it could be worse. A lot worse.

Anyway, here is your open thread for the night. The ESPN Sunday Night game is the Cardinals at the Phillies (Carpenter vs. Hamels), and the Sunday Night Football game is the Eagles at the Falcons. You can talk about that more here, anything goes. Go nuts.

Categories : Open Thread


  1. MannyB ace2be says:

    Now that we are closer to postseason and hopefully in the yanks case a run to the world series, I was wondering what everyone thought about the make up of yanks starting rotation for next season and who cash may try to pick up/bring back from the current roster for next season. Hey mike on a side note now that carpenter is locked up longterm what do you see as the best plan for acquiring starting pitching

    • Brian S. says:

      2012 rotation if I was GM:
      CC Sabathia
      Yu Darvish (innings limit)
      Ivan Nova
      Phil Hughes
      AJ Burnett

      Let Freddy and Bartolo walk, I wouldn’t bet on them repeating their 2011 performances. Once Darvish gets near his inning limit late in the summer call up Banuelos or Betances and have pitch in the last month. Hope that AJ’s HR/FB rate normalizes and his stats are more like his xFIP and hope that Phil Huse can develop into a mid rotation starter.

    • JobaWockeeZ says:

      No Wilson or Darvish. No killer b’s. Bring back one of Colon and Freddy and scout the trade market like hell.

      • Rey22 says:

        They tried that this year. Worked out better than expected cause Freddy and Colon greatly exceeded expectations. Wouldn’t count on a repeat next year.

        • Brian S. says:

          Yeah if the Yankees don’t acquire a legit starting pitcher for next season I will be seriously disappointed.

          • JobaWockeeZ says:

            Same with me but I do not trust CJ Wilson at all. I’d like Edwin Jackson though but I prefer going the trade route.

            • Brian S. says:

              I wouldn’t mind Jackson either but he may want a long and expensive deal because he’s the third best pitcher on the market and Boras is his agent. I would not be upset with Edwin on a three year deal if the Yankees could get him to agree to such terms.

              • MannyB ace2be says:

                I don’t think Jackson is the answer he is too much like an AJ light great one day bad the next 3 I am intrigued by darvish but like was stated above it’s like playing the lottery. I think the answer may honestly be to wait until 2012 FA class to sign a #2

                • JobaWockeeZ says:

                  Banking on that is also risky considering the trend of extending pitchers. I hope Cash does anything in a trade except trade Jesus for another ace.

  2. The Lazzeri Scooter says:

    Some thoughts…

    With the Jays ascension into serious competitor in the immediate future, anyone else a tad worried they have a confirmed illegal advantage? A confirmed stealing signs ability is too unfair considering they already play on astroturf.

    Have a feeling if A.J. Blows away his competition in his final two starts, he will pitch game 4. Just a feeling. Right now, Freddie looks more vulnerable than Bart. Too bad for either, considering the team would be fighting for third without the Chief & Big Bad Bart’s stellar seasons.

    And your response, RAB community…

    • Brian S. says:

      I could see AJ being the game 4 starter. Freddy has not been pitching well lately, and perhaps it would be wise to go with the hot hand. Burnett needs to pitch some really good games on his last two starts for this to happen though.

      • The Lazzeri Scooter says:

        And Allen James has the right opportunity coming up to impress the skipper… the hapless Twins tommorrow and Red Sux (albeit still a dangerous opponent, but their offense is sputtering).

        Hate to be the lone A.J. supporter, but if he can harness what he’s showing lately then it be foolish not to seriously consider it.

        As if, Joe Girardi is certainly not a man who has a hard time with weighted decisions ;-)

        Should only take before the end of game 3 of the ALCS that we know whose pitching game 4, or 5 with CC pitching 1,4,& 7.

    • MannyGeee says:

      With the Jays ascension into serious competitor in the immediate future…

      originally written in 2002

  3. Brian S. says:

    Too bad Baltimore decided to use Britton and Simon against the Angels. Their only half decent pitcher they are having start this week is Jeremy Guthrie, who is lined up to start against Josh Beckett. Oh well. It looks like I am going to win this week in fantasy football, but it came as the result of having to make a panic move which will likely cost me down the stretch.

  4. Jesse says:

    Is it just me, or do the Patriots get away with holding more than any other team in the league?

  5. Karl Krawfid says:

    The Tiger love fest is almost as bad as the Twins love fest last year.

    • Jerome S. says:

      The Tigers are no slouch to be sure (the reaction to the Tiger-love has been as extreme), but they’re not that great. They have Verlander, who apparently is the best pitcher ever, and Fister makes a great number two, but pitching Scherzer for game three is, well… Scherzer. The offense is above-average and Miguel Cabrera doesn’t get that much attention considering his at-the-plate awesomeness. But Jose Valverde is grossly overrated, and kind of gross, too.

      And let’s not forget, they’ve achieved this while playing in the AL Central.

  6. D-Rob's Great Escape says:

    One thing I don’t understand in regards to the postseason rotation is why everyone talks about 4 starters in the first round. The last 2 years the Yanks have only planned on using 3 (I know they swept but they were going back to CC in G4 and Andy in G5 if they had to last year it was already planned).

    This year is no different G1 is on the 30th and G4 is on the 4th, G2 is on the 1st and G5 is on the 6th so that would lead me to believe whoever the Yanks think are their best 2 starters are will definetly pitch 4 of the 5 and whoever is their 3rd guy will only be used in G3.

    • Brian S. says:

      I don’t know if they will have CC pitch on 3 games rest unless they are down in the series.

      • D-Rob's Great Escape says:

        They were going to do it the last 2 years and this year they have less reliable pitching, I’d be really surprised if they change the philosphy they’ve had 2 staright years.

        • Brian S. says:

          They don’t have less reliable pitching this year than the last years. In 2009 AJ-Pettitte had ERA/FIP’s near four and a half so they were forced to have CC start on three games rest. Last year CC and Pettitte were the only two pitchers with quality stat lines because Hughes had a mid 4 ERA/FIP and Burnett was in the mid 5′s. This year they have CC who has been ridiculous and Bartolo, Freddy, and Nova with ERA/FIP splits lower than four. This year’s rotation is better than the last two years.

          • D-Rob's Great Escape says:

            I agree they’ve perfomed better overall this year because they’ve been deeper but depth doesn’t matter as much in the postseason and in the past they knew who their top guns were. 09 it was CC,Burnett,Andy in 10 it was CC,Andy,Hughes my point is it seemed the Yanks were more convinced who their best were and they were going to avoid a 4th starter till the 2nd round because of it.

            This year it seems like their unsure who the best guys are after CC so why wouldn’t they maximize his starts more this year? I’m just saying I would be really surprised if CC ain’t starting G4 considering it’s what they were going to do the last 2 years. I think if they are behind 1-2 they shold use CC to try and hold off elimination as long as possible and if their up 2-1 they should try to kill the opponent as quick as possible to avoid a anything can happen elimination game.

          • JobaWockeeZ says:

            In 2009 AJ and Pettitte faced better offenses than what Colon and Garcia do now. Plus both are them are limping to the finish line where Pettitte and AJ finished out strong.

        • Rainbow Connection says:

          “this year they have less reliable pitching”

          Sept 2011 Nova >>>>>>>>>> Sept 2010 Hughes

          The 2010 team had one pitcher for the post-season (and even he fell casualty to obesity). Everyone else completely blew.

  7. Jimmy McNulty says:

    This stretch is going to be pretty brutal, I’d like to see Boston lose the WC to Tampa and the Yanks get HFA and face Texas in the DS.

    • D-Rob's Great Escape says:

      Me too I want HFA and would prefer TX to DET round 1. I think our lineup would rather face those TX LH’s lead by Wilson then the Tigers RH’s lead by Verlander.

  8. Jesus Freak says:

    There’s an odd anomaly about Toronto and Brandon Morrow.

    Over the past two seasons Morrow has started 8 games vs the Yankees, 4 at the Rogers Centrr and 4 at Yankee Stadium.

    At Yankee Stadium Morrow’s line is:

    20.1 Inn, 18 ER, for a 7.97 ERA and a 1.72 WHIP

    But at the Rogers Centre Morrow is:

    27.2 Inn, 4 ER, for a 1.30 ERA and a 0.76 WHIP

    What do you think accounts for the dramatic and drastic difference in performance by Morrow vs the Yankees at home???

    • Tom Zig says:

      sign stealing

    • The Lazzeri Scooter says:

      Well, as I posted above, the Rogers Center has confirmed illegal advantage for the home Candians.

      They tip off pitches for their hitters, so why not tip off hitters weakness as well. Just my opinion.

      It is a puzzler for sure. As both the Stadium & Rogers Centre are both offensive slanted parks, so you can’t figure he’s pitching in the Colissium or the Trop.

      • JohnnyC says:

        Why and how would you “tip off hitters’ weaknesses” in-game? I get the sign-stealing to help your offense but…helping the pitcher?

        • The Lazzeri Scooter says:

          Hey, just thinking if they have a proven method in stealing signs, then perhaps they figured out opposing hitter’s vulnerabilities:
          -Perhaps, how they differ in different counts.
          -Maybe when the other team is trying to read signs or figuring pitching tendencies (comprehending pitch types);they alert the pitcher to change up.

          Sounds a little weird, but they have worked hard on stealing signs into a proven weapon to help the offense. Why not figure a way to use it to help their pitchers somehow. Hey, they do use the supior metric system up there ya’know ;-)

    • Jon Targaryen says:

      A 35% groundball rate in YSIII does that to you

    • JohnnyC says:

      Seems kind of random. His home/away splits were substantially in favor of home in 2010, but exactly the opposite this year. Not having Granderson & Teixiera (and Posada)in the lineup might account for some of his success today though.

  9. Craig says:

    what’s the rotation look like for Texas in the ALDS?

  10. stuart a says:

    yanks have not even made the playoffs yet….

    maybe girardi can go over baserunning with this team. cano, nunez, and posada absolutely have no clue……

    way to give it the old college try today. girardi not pinch hitting for pena in the bottom of the 8th with 1 on, inexcusable.

    girardi is a jerk…….his routine is getting old fast…..

    the yanks should have minimum 5 more wins………

  11. Tyrion Lannister says:

    We need to go all out to win tomorrow and get that magic # down to 4. Then you play scoreboard as much as you can. If the Sox look to be on their way to winning, we lay down for the Rays. Sox lose, we can afford to win one vs the Rays.

    • Brian S. says:

      We can afford to win one? We’ll be lucky to win a game against Tampa the way our team is playing.

      • Tyrion Lannister says:

        We had a bunch of AAA players in today’s game. Against the Rays the regulars will play most of the time. We do have a DH and CC is starting one of those games. We’ll win one. If we win 2 and beat the Twins that will clinch our playoff spot. If we win 3/4 that could knock the Rays out.

        • Brian S. says:

          I hope that on Thursday we don’t play a single regular. Rest everybody for the weekend Sox series, since they conveniently have a day off right before we face them.

  12. Mister Delaware says:

    This is a fun time to live in Boston and wear a Yankees hat. Even the nice 50-something lady at Williams-Sonoma register is getting nervous about her Sox.

  13. JobaWockeeZ says:

    Vick has killed dogs and shit but I hate Floyd Mayweather a million times more than Vick.

    • Brian S. says:

      What exactly did he say?

    • The Big City of Dreams says:


    • The Lazzeri Scooter says:

      No, actually he profited and reveled in the dog fighting underground crime syndicate then when the animals served their purpose, or cease to serve one, they were hanged, electuted, drowned or shot.

      And then their body is thrown into a mass grave with other rotting bodies of tormented souls. And Vick did this for a prolong period of years even against the pleadings of his familiy, friends, business & football peers and local law authorities to stop this evil act.

      He didn’t and then he got put away for a couple years only because the Feds got involved. The bastard had no intention of ever seeing the light and leave this evil industry. Vick loved the dog fighting world and had no trouble profiting, and enjoying, inspite the suffering dogs.

      Karma, God, or some angry destined pitbull will eventuall get Vick and all the scum that participate in this evil crime.

      Yeah, I’m a dog owner and big F.U. to the eagles in every aspect until he no longer plays for them.

      Sorry had to get out some frustration. And please no hating… I understand their are worse criminals in the NFL and society: i.e. Big Ben sucks, Ray Lewis and Leonard Little (2 time DWI) are just as disgusting.

      • Brian S. says:

        You consider driving while intoxicated a wrose crime than dog-fighting?

      • Pat D says:

        Well said, sir.

      • FIPster Doofus says:

        Nice. Someone is as anti-Vick as I am. Good on you, sir.

        • The Lazzeri Scooter says:

          Thanks, FIPster & Pat D. Nice to know there are some people who have some love for the pooches & common decency. Vick’s a bad man and I’m not a fan, as you can clearly tell.

          P.S. Brian, I didn’t say DWI is worse than dogfighting, (not like we can judge DWI as not a heinous crime) but as equal evil offender. Especially, a guy like Little who was repeat offender.

          Personally, it frightens me to think anyone could go associate themselves in dogfighting let alone inmerse oneslef like Mike Vick did. Scary,imo.

      • Jesus Freak says:

        Who let the dogs out?!

        Woof! Woof!

  14. Sheepmeister says:

    So Manual playing his regulars against cards tonight. Says he owes it to ATL and STL as they are in a pennant race. La Russa says its the right way and they want it no other way.

    So if Utley goes down with a season ending injury, at least we know it was done the right way.

  15. bullshit girardi says:


  16. Jerome S. says:

    What happens when an ace gets lucky? You get Verlander 2011.

    I haven’t heard it said yet, but Justin Verlander is not the best pitcher in baseball this year. This isn’t even his best season. To be sure, it’s a great season, no matter how you look at it; any guy who throws 100 with pin-point control is great. But I believe that his greatness, at least this year, is a bit overstated.

    Verlander’s FIP is an ace-ish 2.92. He strikes out about a batter an inning and walks about 2 per 9. His HR rate is at about 0.8, which is pretty high, but nothing to be laughed at. This, over 236 innings, has translated into 6.7 WAR. That’s great, even Cy worthy, but look at this:
    His BAbip is at .237, which makes no sense considering his 40% GB rate and the awful Detroit defense. His LOB is at about 80%, which is significantly above average. There is no denying Verlander has gotten quite lucky this season, lucky enough for 25 wins (maybe). The only reason he’s not grossly lucky is because he’s great to begin with; however, now he looks outlandish.

    CC Sabathia has pitched to FIP of 2.78 over 230 innings, which, while not vastly better than Verlander, should at least have him in the same conversation. However, CC has also has a high .320 BAbip, senseless when looking at his 47% GB rate and the above-average defense behind him. He has actually out-WAR’d Verlander, pitching to a 7.1 WAR. This is what happens when an ace gets unlucky.
    Perhaps more criminal is the under-coverage of Roy Halladay. His FIP is 2.09, which is Oh-my-God, worthy; he’s actually managed to out-do last year, striking out more and walking no one.

    Anyway, um, in conclusion, Justin Verlander is, well, overrated.

  17. mbonzo says:

    Red Sox have the excuse of the more challenging schedule for the Rays. My question is, who is a tougher team, The Orioles trying to play spoiler v. Red Sox, or the Yankees throwing out their B-lineup everyday?

    • The Lazzeri Scooter says:

      IMO, the Orioles.

      Never underestimate the voodoo of a scornful dick, er, I mean, skipper.

      Buck will make sure to motivate his team to ruin other deserving teams of their joy- it’s what Buck is born to do!! Plus, as you can see their pitching of late has not been bottom five awful.

      Seriously, this team has legitmately elevating their game…

      …….AND it helps the contending teams are running on fumes down the stretch after playing a grueling five months of .570 baseball. So, the Orioles are well rested to bring their spoiler “A game” to their opponents.

      In the end, I do believe Buck could pull a miracle, of Florida Marlin proportion, and win 2-3 of the final seven. Thus, leaving it up to us to determine who goes home in October.

  18. Monteroisdinero says:

    The Yanks go with CC in game 1, Nova in 2 and they have 4 other starters to get through game 3 before they go back to CC for game 4 whether he has pitched lights out for 8 innings in game one or he was knocked out early.

    Also would like Martin to get as much rest as possible now and Montero as much playing time as possible before the post season.

    • Brian S. says:

      I don’t know if I would have Nova start in game 2, he’s a road warrior.

    • mbonzo says:

      How do we see the playoff lineup?
      1. Derek Jeter
      2. Curtis Granderson
      3. Mark Teixeira
      4. Alex Rodriguez
      5. Robinson Cano
      6. Nick Swisher
      7. Russell Martin
      8. Jesus Montero
      9. Brett Gardner

      • Jerome S. says:

        I might switch Montero and Martin, but yeah, why not.

        • The Lazzeri Scooter says:

          Dreaming, but my lineup would be…

          1. Derek “Alive” Jeter
          2. Curtis “Packer” Granderson
          3. Alex “Thumbs Up” Rodriguez
          4. Robbie “Prime” Cano
          5. Mark “BABIP’s a Bitch” Texiera
          6. Nick “Ice” Swisher
          7. Jesus “Deniro” Montero
          8. Russell “I’m Candian” Marin
          9. Brett “UZR Rocks” Gardner

          Bench- Eric “Billy Beane Sucks” Chavez
          - Andrew “Mom’s Alright” Jones
          - Jorge “Sado” Posada
          - Eduardo “E! Noonie!” Nunez
          -Austin “Backup Spot’s All” Romine
          -Chris “Nick’s Elbow” Dickerson

  19. Foghorn Leghorn says:

    just for shits and giggles…

  20. Rey22 says:

    Did Derek Jeter get hazed as a rookie? What did they make him wear?

  21. Nuke LaDoosh says:

    Looks like Cashman was touting Prospect LHP Jose Quintana (Class A Tampa) in an interview on BA website. I may have missed it but I haven’t seen much mention of him this year. Anyone know anything about him?

  22. Reggie C. says:

    Vick is so g-d careless. I LOVE IT!

  23. Craig says:

    If I’m the Phillies, I’m concerned about their sudden offensive sputter (yesterday aside), MIL might give them a solid run. Atlanta is clearly worn down and has holes and I honestly don’t know what to make of Arizona.

    • Freddy Garcia's 86 mph Heat says:

      Not counting yesterday, they’ve scored only 16 runs in their last 10 games. Even with their great pitching, that’s not gonna get it done.

  24. Karl Krawfid says:

    So in 6 of the last 9 years, the AL CY Young award winner will come from the AL Central.

  25. Mister Delaware says:

    Hmmm … I guess I was wrong when I said “all concussions are bad concussions”.

  26. Jesse says:

    Michael Vick iz da best quartaback in da league cuz he can run AND pass!!11!!!1!!111!!!

    Vick 4 da MVP11!!!!1!!!

  27. Avi says:

    So if the Red Sox don;t make the playoffs and last year was the “bridge year”, what does that make this year?

  28. JT says:

    Frankly, I’m shocked at the troubles Boston is having. I thought the only problem was going to be figuring which of the 3 “bona fide MVP candidates” would actually win, and which would be 2nd or 3rd. Seriously, how can the team with 1-2-3 in MVP EVER have a losing streak?

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