Cashman on Pineda: “We’re talking June of next year”

What Went Right: Postseason Pitching
Open Thread: Ramiro Mendoza

Via ESPN NY: Brian Cashman provided a brief update on injured right-hander Michael Pineda during a recent radio appearance. “We have to keep him off our radar for now,” said the GM. “We’re talking June of next year … the second half of next year.”

Pineda, 23, had surgery to repair a torn labrum on May 1st of this year and his target return date was one year out of surgery. The last real update we’ve had on his rehab progress came in mid-June (other than the DUI), when we heard he was on target to start throwing in mid-September. Frankly, it’s not all that surprising that his return will take a little longer than expected — it’s a major surgery and they’ll obviously be conservative. Either way, the Yankees would be wise to proceed under the assumption that Pineda will contribute nothing next year. Anything they get out of him is a bonus.

What Went Right: Postseason Pitching
Open Thread: Ramiro Mendoza
  • Robinson Tilapia

    This should prove to be an even more cheerful thread than the “What Went Wrong: Hitting” thread, although there’s nothing here that’s really news. “Back by May” means “count on by June, at the earliest.”

  • tbord

    I’m all verclempt – Feel free to share.

    • Robinson Tilapia

      Here’s a topic…

    • Slugger27

      its a perfectly cromulent word.

      • David

        The Yankee’s playoff performance was anything But cromulent. They didn’t embiggen themselves in the least.

  • Mike HC

    How does all this all effect his years under team control? Since he was on the DL all of last year and probably to start next year, I’m assuming that doesn’t count against his years under control?

    • Ted Nelson

      I think it does. He was on the MLB DL.

      • thenamestsam

        Yeah, it counts unfortunately.

      • Mike HC

        Thanks. If that is accurate, that is even worse. Two lost years, last year, and most probably next season too.

        • Deep Thoughts

          Relax. There’ll be time to jump off that bridge when we get to it.

      • jjyank

        You’re right. I think they can get some control back if he’s in the minors (post-DL) for long enough, but I forget what that time frame is.

  • jlevs

    With out luck with young pitchers I’m sure the Yankees will figure out a way to screw this up. I can’t wait to hear something like how he’ll be more effective out of the pen.

    • Thunder Road Runner

      I know, you can practically hear it now!

  • JLC 776

    Just terrible luck on this one all-around.

    I really hope this kid gets to contribute someday and meets the potential he showed over the first half of his year in Seattle. Hopefully the DUI was just a dumb mistake.

    • jsbrendog

      nah it’s cool you can get 2 duis and still win a triple crown….and everyone forgets

      you can eve assault a jewish man while yelling bigotted slurs and be the alcs mvp.

  • Slugger27

    what exactly is the update? didnt we already know this?

    • Raul Ibanez AKA Tom Marvolo Riddle AKA True Yankee(TM)

      We “knew” it, but not it’s confirmed by Cashman…so yeah this is more of “nothing to see here” update.

      • Raul Ibanez AKA Tom Marvolo Riddle AKA True Yankee(TM)

        not now it’s confirmed by Cashman

    • jjyank

      If I recall, I thought most of us were under the assumption that he’d be back in May some time. June/Second Half 2013 is longer than we had thought before.

      At least, that’s what I had thought.

    • Mike HC

      I know you are more referring to Cashman, so this is really not anything to do with your comment, but this comment just reminds me that this is the time of year where everyone yells at Axisa for writing “pointless” articles that “wasting their time!”

      • Slugger27

        not at all what i meant to imply. i think mike does a great job.

        it really was jsut frustration at the lack of info cashman provided. we already knew itd be mid season next year. he couldve gone into more detail i thought. or ANY detail for that matter.

        • Mike HC

          I’m with you, and like I said, I knew you were referring to Cash and not Axisa. This just seems to me like Cashman keeping expectations realistic for Pineda next year so everyone doesn’t yell about “setbacks” and all that when Spring Training rolls around.

        • Mike HC

          Jonah Keri just wrote a couple of days ago on, “If you want an X factor for the Yankees rotation, and for the team’s 2013 season, it’s Michael Pineda.”

          He is a pretty prominent baseball writer, so Cash may have wanted to damp down expectations.

  • endlessjose

    He’s gonna be out longer than what Tommy John surgery requires.They must have found out more about he’s shoulder after they opened him up during surgery or he had a setback.

    With Manny’s Tommy John,Campos bad elbow and now Pineda we gonna have to hit the draft hard.

    • Mike HC

      I wouldn’t write guys entire careers off after having surgery. Sure it is better to be completely surgery free, but so many pitchers recover from surgery and pitch effectively that I think all three have a good shot at still fulfilling their potential.

    • thenamestsam

      Shoulder is always longer than Tommy John. The fact that he’s out this long is not unexpected.

      • blee

        its not so much that it takes longer.. its that its harder to come back from as an effective pitcher..

  • ADam

    Not that its a huge deal, but I noticed Cashman said he had surgery in the first week of June. I thought he had Surgery on May 1. So he could theoretically be of by a month.. but again not a huge deal

  • RetroRob

    No surprise. He had the surgery in May, so I don’t think anyone expected him back on the mound in less than a year.

    As I said prior, the Yankees need to enter 2013 forgetting Pineda even exists, and to build their five-man rotation, really their six-man rotation, this offseason without Pineda. Let’s say he is finally able to pitch in actual games in May, then he should begin his 21-day rehab assignment, and then once that’s done the Yankees should option him to the minors where he can continue his rehab in a much controlled environment where the team doesn’t have to worry about him pitching more than three innings, or they can skip a start, etc.

    After reading up on this specific injury and the surgery, he probably has a 50-50 chance to regain his full velocity, much better than the 10% originally reported. One doctor even said 80%, although I’m not buying that. Even my 50-50 is pretty bluesky.

    If the Yankees are lucky, they might have a valuable arm show up sometime in August, and someone who they might be able to count on as one of the starting five in 2014, not 2013.

    • Robinson Tilapia

      Absolutely. I think about this guy when I think about 2013 as much as I think about a kid in AA. It’d be wonderful if contributed. I’m not even thinking about him at the moment.

      • G

        I wouldn’t personally go that far. I’m thinking of him like a new top prospect in AAA. Maybe he’ll be ready by June, and if he is we can see what he can provide. Like many top prospects, he may not initially be great, so we can’t just skate by with a crappy #5 and pray that he’s our saving grace.

      • RetroRob

        Exactly. That’s why I don’t want the Yankees planning on anything from him this year, even though I do believe he will be contributing something, even if it’s small, in the second half of the season. And if their big league rotation is doing great in July, and Pineda is doing great in the minors, then let him pitch there until there is a need. There will be. There always is. As a Yankee fan, what could be better than the main rotation healthy and pitching great, and reports of Pineda hitting 95mph in the minors, but no opening on the big league roster. Let him pitch down there until September rosters exapand, as far as I’m concerned.

        Another benefit is his arbitration and perhaps even his free agency clock will be pushed, allowing the Yankees to gain back some of the time lost already. A consideration with MLB’s salary cap. Let’s call it what it is.

  • Raul Ibanez AKA Tom Marvolo Riddle AKA True Yankee(TM)

    I’m curious though, when Cashman says “June” does he mean June as in he should be ready to join the Major League roster by June or he should be able to begin rehab games by June. That’s two completely different things, if he’s only ready for rehab games by June I’ll let any hope of him contributing in 2013 die tonight. However if they’re aiming at June as a possible return to the big leagues I will hold out just a glimmer of hope that Pineda pitches (and pitches effectively) in 2013.

    • Andy Pettitte’s Fibula (formerly Manny’s BanWagon)

      I think it means that they’ll re-examine him in June and probably find that he needs TJS.

      • Robinson Tilapia

        In December they’ll amputate his finger as the mystery illness travels downward. By Spring Training he’ll be Minnie Mantlez.

        • Andy Pettitte’s Fibula (formerly Manny’s BanWagon)

          I was thinking more like that movie “District 9.”

          Pineda will probably be expose to a mutagenic chemical sometime in spring training and grow an alien arm on his right side incapable of holding a baseball.

        • plouffe

          U roll R-tils

  • Andy Pettitte’s Fibula (formerly Manny’s BanWagon)

    The only positive aspect in this trade is that at least Montero pretty much sucked this year.

    • dan gen

      that will change…and pineada may never be the same..

      • Get Phelps Up

        Who is “pineada?”

    • Monterowasnotdinero

      “Pretty much sucked” on a crappy offensive team, batting cleanup at age 22. He caught well enough too for his level of experience with a new pitching staff and his supposedly horrible skill set. Translating his #’s to YS and our offense from Safeco and the Mariners I think he would have hit 25 HR’s and driven in 85-but I am admittedly biased.

      • Rocky Road Redemption

        That’s a pretty nutso transition.

        • RetroRob

          Totally. Many of the advanced stats actually factor in park adjustments, and even with that he still rated poorly. Plus, he’s still not a MLB catcher.

          That’s all the negative I want to say since I still believe in Montero. He should eventually figure out what MLB RH’d pitchers are doing to him. Yet the main difference is I used to be sure Montero would be a quality, high-end MLB hitter, where now I only think he will be. Can’t be as sure since at points last season it looked like I could have gotten him out (I’m righthanded) by throwing a breaking ball low and away.

      • Andy Pettitte’s Fibula (formerly Manny’s BanWagon)

        For catchers with at least 300 PAs, he ranked 25th out of 28 for ISO and 22nd out of 28 for wOBA and 28th out of 28 in WAR with a -0.2.

        Spin it however you like, he sucked this year.

        • The Big City of Dreams

          At least he’s not injured

          • Andy Pettitte’s Fibula

            Pineda didn’t pitch a single inning for the Yankees and still had a higher WAR than Montero.

            • mustang


              See the trade out for the Yankees after all.

              • mustang

                See the trade workout for the Yankees after all.

                • Lew

                  I didn’t have a negative WAR either – I’m better than Montero – woo!

                  • mustang

                    Yes you are be proud.

      • mustang


        “on a crappy offensive team” which he helps be crappy.

        ” He caught well enough too for his level of experience with a new pitching staff and his supposedly horrible skill set. ”
        Did you see his catching numbers? He live right up to his horrible skill set.

        “Translating his #’s to YS and our offense from Safeco and the Mariners I think he would have hit 25 HR’s and driven in 85-”

        Ok can you tell me next week lottery numbers please?

        The only truth in this comment is “I am admittedly biased.”

        • JobaWockeeZ

          As if you’re a voice of reason. You’ve hated Montero since day one.

          • mustang

            Never hate or hated Montero. Do hate the ridiculous hype that some people here put on prospects and Montero is kind of the test subject for me to prove the point that there no bigger jump in sport then going from the minors to MLB so treated as such.

            Tell me would you now trade the 2 B’s and Montero for Gio Gonzalez?

            Don’t worry dude Montero is 22 he has lots of time to live up to the hype.

            • mustang

              Although the next Miguel Cabrera might be a bit of reach.


              • Get Phelps Up

                “The next Miguel Cabrera” is a title reserved for Avisail Garcia…

                Love, TBS

      • mustang

        Seriously dude love your loyalty and maybe someday Montero will live up to what you hope for, but this year is not the year to use to support your cause.

  • Grover

    I still expect Cashman to make the obligatory run at some top pitching with King Felix at the top of the list. Maybe taking on Figgins makes something possible. Maybe he rolls the dice on Beckett or Lincicum if he can successfully jettison Soriano and Swisher.

    • Preston

      I expect you and your ilk to expect that year in and year out for eternity.

      • MannyGeee Machete

        what do you mean?? We’re the Yankees, we can pretty much trade for anyone, whether they want to get rid of them or not, right? I mean, 28 other teams are just kinda sitting out there waiting to help us out, arent they?

    • dan gen

      189 rules everything…yanks win at all long as they stay under that number..which means no deals more than 1 year for free agents .

  • Nathan

    Worst trade ever?

    The Yankees biggest trading bullet in a while and they trade him for a guy who, potentially, won’t pitch for the Yankees in two full seasons.

    • RetroRob

      Study up.

    • dan gen

      you have it right…that guy is done

  • TinoBambino24

    Guys, we can always trade Pineda for Montero…

  • Rocky Road Redemption

    Yeesh, what a disaster this ended up being.

    • MannyGeee Machete

      yup… first pitcher to ever get traded and then get hurt. What an abortion, Cashman.

    • RetroRob

      An injured pitcher for a negative WAR player.

      Not the definition of disaster.

      Apologies if that was sarcasm on your part. If not, let’s check back in five years.

  • Laz

    This might be in their plans. If they can keep him in the minors and bring him up in June then then can push back his free agency.

  • Lew

    So, starting 5 next year: CC, Kuroda, Hughes, Nova, Phelps and maybe also Pettitte? Is that so bad?

    • Cement Mixer

      Not bad at all. But your assuming Kuroda will come back, I hope he will, he was awesome this year.

  • Grover

    Cashman will likely not count on Phelps as part of the rotation but as a replacement starter competing for the long man role. There are several back of the rotation innings eaters and I would expect him to sign one of the leftovers to a one year deal if he doesn’t make a deal for a stud.

  • Wayne

    They are going to have to make a change to Pineda’ s mechanics cause his delivery is obviously what caused the injury if he ever comes back.

  • Wayne

    Next year would be the last year I would count on Hughes and Nova. Hopefully somebody is ready to step in for those guys in 2014. We have plenty of guys in aa that could be ready by 2014. let’s not trade any of them or any of our pitching prospects now unless it’s Marshall or o’brien and we get something young and ready to play for us. Wouldn’t trade them for veterans. We need young position players that can defend and are situational hitters. We are not getting anybody like Miguel Cabrera back I tell you that much but young position players who hit in the clutch hopefully and can play defense at their position prefer centerfielder and second baseman and shortstop since jeter is getting old.

  • Reggie C.

    Should’ve traded Montero for Shelby Miller.

  • MikeD

    If he ever throws a pitch for the yanks ill be surprised.

  • Pete

    What an F’N bust. We traded our top prospect for a bum with a dead arm.