Update: Yankees and Cardinals unlikely to swing David Freese trade

What Went Right: Ivan Nova
Wednesday Night Open Thread

6:28pm: The Yankees and Cardinals don’t match up well and are unlikely to work out a trade involving Freese, reports Ken Rosenthal. He says New York simply doesn’t have much to offer.

5:00pm: Via Mark Feinsand: The Yankees and Cardinals are discussing a trade involving David Freese. No word on what other players would be involved or heading to St. Louis or anything like that. Matt Swartz projects Freese to earn $4.4M next year and he won’t be eligible for free agency until after 2015.

Freese, 30, hit .262/.340/.381 (106 wRC+) with nine homers in 521 plate appearances this season. Obviously any team that acquires him would be banking on a return to 2012 (133 wRC+) or 2011 (123 wRC+) form. Freese is a limited defender with poor range and a lengthy injury history, so his value is tied up entirely in his bat. His reputation far exceeds his production at this point, but Freese makes some sense for the Yankees as long as the cost is reasonable. I’m just not sure that’s the case.

What Went Right: Ivan Nova
Wednesday Night Open Thread
  • JakePeralta

    David Freese is not a bad idea. He can hit and at the very least stand in front of third base. That’s better than what we had last year.

    I know it would be an unpopular thought, but the Yankees should attempt to trade for Ryan Braun. He’s signed through 2021 at a very nice contract for a superduperstar.

    • Capo

      With Braun and A-Rod on the same team, I think the internet would explode.

    • King of Fruitless Hypotheticals

      we don’t have the chips.

      • Tisha

        and who is to blame for that ? Oppenhemier , Cashman and Newman , the 3 stooges

  • King of Fruitless Hypotheticals

    how does wRC= of 106 compare to what NY got out of its 3B, non-Arod division?

    • Preston

      Even counting A Rod as a team Yankee 3b had a wRC+ of 69,

  • UncleArgyle

    Anyone else starting to get the feeling that there’s a non zero chance the Yankee infield next year is Texeria, Kelly Johnson, Brendan Ryan, David Freese?

    • Havok9120

      It’s November 13. Any feelings any of us have are far more likely to reflect our own biases about ownership’s intentions and the abilities of the front office than any rational analysis of events.

      After all, there haven’t been any major events for anyone yet.

      • MannyGeee

        FALSE. The Phils got their man in Marlon Byrd. It’s October or bust for those boys..

      • cheddar

        Also, Felix Unger was asked to remove himself from his place of residence.

  • Jonathan

    We really need an offseason of something really close to: McCann/Beltran/Granderson/Drew or Peralta/Tanaka/Cano/Kuroda/late inning reliever.

    That leaves us with:

    C McCann
    1B Tex
    2B Cano
    SS Jeter/Drew or Peralta
    3B ARod?/Drew or Peralta
    LF Granderson
    CF Gardner
    RF Beltran
    DH Soriano

    SP Sabathia
    SP Kuroda
    SP Tanaka
    SP Nova
    SP Phelps/Warren/Pineda/Nuno

    RP Robertson
    RP late inning guy
    RP Kelley

    I love that team. Plenty of chances to rotate at DH to keep all those vets rested and help with platoon issues.

    • King of Fruitless Hypotheticals

      What’s the payroll for that lineup?

      • Joey Jo-Jo Junior Shabadoo

        The math checks out. $188 on the dot.

      • Jonathan

        Not as bad as you think. We’re losing a ton of payroll off last years team and if ARod is gone we’re losing even more. I’d guess that would be fairly close to last years payroll. Tanaka would probably make a little less than Andy last year. Whoever the late inning guy would make less than Rivera did and Peralta/Drew would be about Youkilis. Granderson probably doesn’t break the $15MM he was making last year. If ARod is gone Beltran/McCann fit into what he would have made. Nova is cheaper than Hughes. The bullpen would be made up of cheaper options than Logan/Chamberlain last year. I’d also get rid of Ichiro/Wells.

    • Guns

      That rotation is suspect at best. You need to hope Sabathia has a huge turn-around, assume Tanaka can be at least league average, and hope that one or more of Nova, Phelps, Warren, Pineda, Nuno (lol) have a big season well above their career norms.

      • Robinson Tilapia

        Hate to break it to you, but that’s about a best case scenario for a 2014 rotation.

        • Guns

          Oh I’m aware haha

          • Robinson Tilapia

            I agree you have to have someone reliable with not really knowing what to expect of anyone not named “Hideki Kuroda” in that scenario.

    • Robinson Tilapia

      I’d be just fine with that.

    • Dan

      I have no interest in giving up a draft pick for Drew. Peralta is probably a slightly better hitter and has no draft pick attachment.

  • Blake

    Just sign Peralta…he can play SS too and you don’t have to trade for him. I don’t really see a match between the Yanks and Cards anyway…..the yanks don’t have anything they need

    • the tenth inning stretch

      Freese’s salary is reasonable enough that I’d be fine with acquiring both and letting Peralta and Jeter rotate through SS/DH.

      • Blake

        Yea…..still don’t see what the yanks woukd trade for address though…..

        • Blake

          Freese….damn you autocorrect

          • Robinson Tilapia

            I want them to stay in the Bronx as well. :)

          • MannyGeee

            Breaking news, the Yankees and Rays have just completed a trade, in which they have swapped cities and fanbases.

            the Internet proceeded to explodes as they were forced to consider a Yankees manager a genius and all of the sudden New York had ‘ALL TEH PROSPECTZ’

  • http://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

    I talked about this before, but even I’m not 100% sure his stuff would translate to the AL. Too small sample size (2011 & 3 WS and interleague play) to say yes immediately.

    • Guns

      What stuff? His fastball & curveball? He’s a third baseman. Hitting the ball is hitting the ball no matter what league you’re in. They don’t throw quad-A pitchers in the NL. If anything, you would think hitting in the smaller ballparks of the AL East should help him.

      • CashmanNinja

        Exactly. Hitting is hitting. In 3 of his last 4 years he’s been a .290+ hitter with an OBP of .350 or better. I just flat out like what he brings to the table. He’s a very solid, albeit unspectacular player. He’s also cheaper and more reliable than going after the Kevin Youkilis’ of this market.

        • Mac

          Ironically a lot of people are comparing him specifically to Youkilis because he is not very reliable. In the last four seasons he’s missed about 1/2 the season twice and really fallen off in one of the two healthy seasons.

  • CashmanNinja

    I’m all for getting Freese if the price is reasonable. He had a down year last season, but overall he’s been pretty productive and also a clutch guy in the post season. If we could get him for the right price then it helps give us some much needed depth whether A-Rod gets suspended or not.

  • dkidd

    freese is youk part deux

    bad back = singles hitter

  • Bobby d

    This would be a terrible move!! The tremendous drop off in production is very suspicious especially if anyone saw the 2011 series. You could not stop this guy, he was Ortiz Like. Terrible defense and if anyone saw this World Series he is a shell of the guy who played in 2011 and 2012. I am very suspicious.

    • the tenth inning stretch

      He got hot during that 2011 postseason. That is far above his career norms, obviously.

  • Robinson Tilapia

    I’m curious as to what the price tag is. Somewhat wary here.

  • jjyank

    “His reputation far exceeds his production at this point, but Freese makes some sense for the Yankees as long as the cost is reasonable. I’m just not sure that’s the case.”

    Exactly my sentiments on Freese. Nice player and a guy I wouldn’t mind having, but I feel like he’s pretty overrated and the trade cost would be prohibitive.

    • Preston

      I don’t think the Cardinals or other teams are going to pay him for his playoff reputation

  • Dan

    Great buy-low candidate. He was an above average hitter last year and it was on a down year!

  • AC

    Cashman is trying everybody. We can’t get guys who make 20 a yr u know. U need the teg guys who can just get a base hit. Trying to get under 189 as well if poss. Just go get Tanaka I say. No problem on Beltran. No more than 2 years though. Sign guys on your terms. If Cano wants 7-8 yeas let him go to. Don’t wanna here we gave him 8 year deal and the last 5 are like Arod. You have to put people around Cano. Otherwise just watch 1st half of season again did he carry us? No he didbt. He’s not that kinda player. Cano like Ellsbury are going for the biggest check out there.

    • jjyank

      This comment makes me head hurt.

  • dasani

    Didn’t the front office learn their lesson with Youk. To stay away from these players with long lists of stints on the DL.This team needs to get more athletic,not pathetic.

    • RetroRob

      Nunez is young and athletic.

      Mo and Andy were old.

      Baseball is strange.

  • RetroRob

    Now the deal is “off” says Rosenthal.

    That means it will happen.

  • entonces

    The Yanks “don’t have much to offer?” They have plenty to offer but they’re not going to give up what the Cardinals would like. Move on. Trades (other than salary dumps) are generally bad news for NYY anyway. I’d go for Peralta.

  • Frank

    He’s due to make about 4M and he’ll be 31 on Opening Day with a history of injuries. How much can Cards want?

    • nycsportzfan

      I agree. He looks terrible at the plate these days also. The cards are trying to rob someone. I woulden’t go near this guy.

      • Chris Widger

        How terrible can a guy with a 106 OPS+ possibly look? That’s THIRTY SEVEN points better than we got out of third last year, including A-Rod.

        If the Cardinals are asking for Sanchez, than no. But if they ask for Mason Williams, I’d listen.

    • Mac

      I know that post-PEDs aging has accelerated, but when did 30 years old become the kiss of death in fan’s minds?

  • Leg-End

    This one will probably run and run all winter.

  • Chris Widger

    I’d keep an eye on this one regardless of what Rosenthal says. It’s a good fit and exactly the kind of low-cost above-average solution the team needs if its going to reel in Cano, Tanaka, and maybe Beltran.

    That said, I am intrigued by a Kelly Johnson/David Adams platoon, with Johnson having the flexibility to back up at second, first, and the corner outfield spots.

  • CashmanNinja

    The Yankees don’t want to give up what the Cards would like to obtain. I’m sure the Cards were probably asking for someone like Mason Williams given their need for an OF. Shortstop and outfield are the real 2 positions of need for the Cardinals and it simply isn’t worth paying the premium for a good, but not spectacular player. I’d love him at the right price, but you simply don’t overpay for him. Now if Freese could play an above average defense at 3rd, THEN that makes him more valuable. But he’s basically a good bat and can fake a decent 3rd base. Nothing more, nothing less.

  • Robinson Tilapia

    I’m not willing to give up much for him anyway.

  • EndlessJose

    How don’t we match up.The Yankees don’t have high level prospects but they have talent and Freese is a average third baseman at best.

    I can’t see why a deal won’t go down unless Cashman is holding back prospects like he did in the Soriano trade.

  • Preston

    This is a trade that will take a while. The Cardinals don’t have very many needs other than SS. Obviously the Yankees can’t give them that and if they had a big league caliber SS they’d keep him rather than trade him for Freese. But Freese seems to be odd man out on the roster right now, so he is going to get moved and for less than the Cardinals are asking for now. The Cardinals will make a move for a SS, the assets they move will determine their needs. Maybe then they will match up better.

    • Mac

      Good point. If they solve the SS issue in another way, Freese might be easier for the Yankees to acquire. The Cards could just try to keep him and balance the depth (especially because Freese is coming off a down year so his value might be depressed relative to what they think of him), but if they have no real holes (if they get a SS elsewhere) would they look for relatively higher upside that’s a few years away?

  • Eselquetodolosabe

    “Don’t match up”, “Yankees have nothing to offer”. Did I miss something here ? Is this David Freese we’re talking about, or Miguel Cabrera ? Hilarious ! Give me a break. I’m sure St. Louis is asking for Gary Sanchez, Slade Heathcott, etc…, The old Yankee Tax hard at work. Later for that, just sign Peralta. Only cost money.

    • CashmanNinja

      Peralta apparently wants 3/$45 mil. I don’t want anything to do with him or any other guys linked to Biogenesis. I’d rather get Kelley Johnson than Peralta. I actually really like the guy. Freese would be good, but not for the price tag that St. Louis seeks.

  • Hornets686

    Nunez will be a Cardinal… We’ll get Freese for Nunez! Then sign Johnson and bring back Ryan…

    • Robinson Tilapia

      If you squint real hard, Nuney + Phelps has “New Melky + IPK” potential.

  • qwerty

    What a joke. If the yankees don’t even have the chips to get a David Freese you might as well throw in the towel now, lol.

  • Bob

    Can anyone tell me how Cashman still has a job being that the Yankees don’t have enough assets to swing a trade for David Freese?

    • qwerty

      Cashman is not at fault for anything that goes wrong.

  • Mike

    We might not have much to offer to land top tier players, but we should have more than enough to grab a mediocre David Freese.