Yanks already asked about Santana

A fork in the road! Which way should we go?
Mazzone out in Baltimore

This one comes from Tuesday. Don’t know how we missed it. Peter Gammons reports that the Yanks have already had talks regarding Johan Santana (subscription required). The conversation was based around Chien-Ming Wang. Gammons reports no conclusions, but if I’m the Twins GM, the first letter of my response would have started with “F,” and the second word would have been “off.”

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A fork in the road! Which way should we go?
Mazzone out in Baltimore
  • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

    They are the Yankees, so two hours after their season turned to winter, there was a cellphone conversation about what could be packaged with Chien-Ming Wang to get Johan Santana

    That’s the quote. The cell phone conversation the completely unbiased Mr. Gammons speaks of could have been between, I dunno, Mark from the Bronx and Tony from Brooklyn. This is just Gammons talk, I doubt Cash got right on the phone and started working on a Wang for Santana deal.

    I think Gammons has gone senile, cause after Beckett’s CG in Game 1 of the ALDS, he glorious proclaimed “Not one Boston hitter swung at a pitch out of the strike zone from Lackey.” Yeah, sure.

  • The Scout

    Wang for Santana makes a good deal of sense from Minnesota’s perspective. He would be under their control for three seasons at an affordable price; he wins games and pitches a lot of innings; the Twins could point to him as evidence that they are serious about competing despite Santana’s departure; and Santana showed some signs of decline this year. Wang may not qualify as an ace, but no one will deal a young, top-five-in-the-league pitcher for Santana. It remains to be seen whether another team makes a more competitive offer, but the Twins GM won’t say “F—-off” to that offer (if it were actually made).

  • steve (different one)

    Cashman denied this report, for what that’s worth.

    • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      Cash denies everything. He’s no fun when it comes to rumors.

  • Dave

    While I have been a Wang-lover (snicker-snicker), I am okay with trading him as part of a package (I can’t stop myself) for Santana. But, given Wang’s road splits, especially on Turf (the Trop, SkyDome, etc.), wouldn’t the Twins be doing a big disservice to themselves to bank on such a ground ball-dependent pitcher?

  • zack

    Obviously Wang along won’t get it done, and I have been the voice of reason it seems on some sites where Yankee fans seem to be grossly over-valuing the prospects and throwing out things like “White, Abreu, and Horne should be enough” etc, but, that being said, a package of Wang, Melky, Marquez, and, say, Tabata I think would be more than enough, and scarily enough, would be an amazing trade for the Yankees too.

    Wang, Melky, Tabata/A-Jax, and another B prospect pitcher for Santana, would you honestly not make that trade in a heartbeat as a Yankees fan?

    • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      I still think your over-estimating Yankee players. You won’t be able to get Santana without giving up Hughes and/or Joba. I’d have to think the deal would be along the lines of Hughes, Horne, Cano, Melky for Santana and say, Rincon. That’d be realistic.

      Just look at what Boston had to give up for Beckett.

      • steve

        i’m sorry I would not give up hughes/joba and melky plus more for santana …. we wont know how good ajax is until he spends a full year in AA as of right now the only real deal young outfielder is melk man and probably tabata. IMO its not worth for it for a year rental … the only reason I would consider it is if boston is dangerously close to striking a deal for santana

  • zack

    And Dave. the Twinkies are moving in a year or two to a grass stadium…

  • Dave

    Ah, thanks for that. I knew it was outdoors, but I didn’t know they were going with the real stuff. That’s going to be interesting in the Minnesota climate.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

      The Twins are moving to a grass stadium without a dome. That is just stupid. Remember how cold it was in New York in April? Remember the games in Cleveland that got snowed out? Think about how it’ll feel in Minneapolis.

  • http://www.iwritesports.com Adam

    At this point I wouldn’t touch Santana unless he could be had for 10 cents on the dollar. Why? Because his next contract will be Zito-sized and I don’t care how good he is now, by the last few years he just won’t be worth it.

    And remember, Santana may have been the best pitcher the past few years, but he’s never been Pedro in his peek good. He hasn’t been unstoppable. He’s been great, but not elite.

    I wouldn’t trade Hughes or Joba straight up for him. Do I think they are as good as Santana? Hell no! But I think they’ll be more valuable taking into account salary for the next five years than Santana, who’ll be making his $20 some million per season.

    The Yanks have the advantage of a huge payroll, but they key is to use it wisely. Part of using it wisely is to play as many of your cheap young talent as possible which will leave them with even more money to pay an A-Rod or a real first baseman or eventually a new right fielder or new catcher or whatever else we’ll need.

    The Yanks need to get back to the 96-00 type-teams. Have a home grown core and then surround them with well balanced talent.

  • ed campbell

    Am Imistaken or what ? But isn’t Sanata a free agent this year? If that is the case just out bid everyone and keep our future

    • steve (different one)

      you mean next year, right?

      i mean, i agree with you, i’m just saying there is the chance someone trades for him and signs him to a crazy extension before next year.

    • dan

      he’s under the twins control for the 2008 season

  • Count Zero

    You can’t do a deal for Johan unless it’s a sign and trade. If you don’t get an extension, he’ll be too costly as a rental. And it would definitely cost you either Joba or Hughes plus other lesser prospects.

    No way I trade either Joba or Hughes right now — their ceilings are too high and they are 21 vs. 28 that Johan is.

    Johan is special but he did decline this year…ummm…to a ummm…1.073 WHIP. I mean…that’s his first WHIP over 1 since 2003! Clearly he’s about to fall apart any minute now.

    Yeah…that’s my story and I’m sticking to it. ;-)

  • dan

    Mike, Boston gave up hanley and anibal sanchez. They didn;t give up the whole farm, they gave two top-shelf prospects. If the yankees give a cy young candidate (deservedly or not, he’s in the discussion), horne, and a-jax, I cant see the twins telling them to f- off

    • http://www.iwritesports.com Adam

      And remember also that Anibel Sanchez was not in the Hughes/Joba class of prospects and Hanley Ramirez was actually coming off a disappointing season in the minors and scouts were wondering if his production would match his raw talent. The Red Sox were also accepting Mike Lowell in the deal, which at the time was a complete salary dump.

      Of course Becket wasn’t in Santana’s class at the time either…

    • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      That’s not all, they also had to give up Jesus Delgado and Harvey Garcia (who reached the bigs this year), who are equivalent to guys like Zach McAllister and George Kontos. They also had to take on the $18M left on Lowell’s contract. Boston paid a steeper price than everyone thinks.

  • dan

    if it means trading hughes or joba (the starter version) then i’d have to say no. Anyone else is fair game for discussion IMO

  • E-ROC

    Didn’t Cashman say he didn’t want to pay twice? Who would u give up? The Twins would want AJax, Tabata, Wang, Melky or Horne. Any combo of those players would have the Twins nodding their heads. The Yankees might as well wait and Santana ain’t going to keep up what he’s doing right now for a long time. The decline will start and we wouldn’t know when.

  • Evil Fox News Shill

    Wang one-up for Santana, if he agreed to a contract extension. They’d be getting a two-time 19-game winner who still isn’t up for his big payday. Forget the two playoff starts this year. That should be enough for them.

  • Andrew

    Yeah, Boston definitely didn’t give up much, at the time, for Beckett. Of course, Beckett had a history of injury and as of yet had not pitched a full season. He wasn’t exactly the ‘best pitcher in baseball’ like Santana is. You’re going to have to give up more than just prospects for Santana, and unfortunately the Twins don’t have guys to salary-dump.

  • http://riveraveblues.com Mike A.

    Just some food for thought, but Santana’s BA/OBP/SLG against has gotten worse across the board for 4 years straight, and he gave up 30 homers this year in a division with rather mediocre lineups.

    I still think there’s no deal without Hughes or Joba. You just can’t give up the best starter in baseball and get an Alan Horne or a CM Wang back as a centerpiece.