SI: A-Rod tested positive in ’03
ByAccording to a report in Sports Illustrated, four independent sources have confirmed to Selena Roberts and David Epstein that Alex Rodriguez tested positive for anabolic steroids in 2003 and was subsequently tipped off to a drug test the following year. Needless to say, this will create some media circus for the Yanks and A-Rod in the coming weeks.
Roberts, a former Times columnist, and Epstein, a long-time SI staff writer, got a hold of what should have been a sealed list. The government just hasn’t been very good at keeping a lid on confidential information during this largely unnecessary steroid investigation. But what’s done is done, and the news does not sound good for A-Rod’s image. The two write:
In 2003, when he won the American League home run title and the AL Most Valuable Player award as a shortstop for the Texas Rangers, Alex Rodriguez tested positive for two anabolic steroids, four sources have independently told Sports Illustrated.
Rodriguez’s name appears on a list of 104 players who tested positive for performance-enhancing drugs in Major League Baseball’s ‘03 survey testing, SI’s sources say. As part of a joint agreement with the MLB Players Association, the testing was conducted to determine if it was necessary to impose mandatory random drug testing across the major leagues in 2004.
When approached by an SI reporter on Thursday at a gym in Miami, Rodriguez declined to discuss his 2003 test results. “You’ll have to talk to the union,” said Rodriguez, the Yankees’ third baseman since his trade to New York in February 2004. When asked if there was an explanation for his positive test, he said, “I’m not saying anything.”
According to the report, A-Rod tested positive for increased testosterone levels and for Primobolan, a hard-to-detect designer steroid that minimizes what Roberts and Epstein termed “bulk development.” In other words, there’s no Jason Giambi/Barry Bonds effect in play with Primobolan.
At this point, I have to assume that A-Rod has passed numerous drug tests and has been clean, but this story will still be a P.R. disaster because of a subsequent development in 2004. After A-Rod’s failed test as a member of the Rangers in 2003, he may have been warned in 2004 when, as a Yankee, his name popped up on the testing rolls again. Reportedly, A-Rod is the unnamed player whom Gene Orza, COO of the players union, was accused of tipping off to an impending drug test in 2004. Si reports:
According to the 2007 Mitchell Report on steroid use in baseball, in September 2004, Gene Orza, the chief operating officer of the players’ union, violated an agreement with MLB by tipping off a player (not named in the report) about an upcoming, supposedly unannounced drug test. Three major league players who spoke to SI said that Rodriguez was also tipped by Orza in early September 2004 that he would be tested later that month. Rodriguez declined to respond on Thursday when asked about the warning Orza provided him.
Who knows what this will do to the Yankees? Who knows what this will do A-Rod and his reputation? People tolerated A-Rod because everyone always just assumed he was clean. At this point, it’s hard to believe that any player was truly off steroids. For the sake of the Yanks, I hope this blows over, but I, for one, am not too optimistic.
Its going to be a long spring training for Arod this year
Spring training? Its going to be a long SEASON now for ARod. This is going to be under his skin bigtime. Shit. This sucks.
Crikey.
This is, of course, exactly how I wanted to wake up.
Uh – oh.
uh oh
uh ohhhh. Another season of Steroid drama going into spring training.
i’m going to sleep now and hope that when i wake up it’ll be april 4th
Well, at least he wasn’t a Yankee in 2003.
Best. Take. Possible.
Don’t say that…
My friend’s telling me that he was tipped off before a test in 04, when he *was* a Yankee…
Your friend who read the Si article?
My friend who’s driving and listening to WFAN =P
BULL SHIT MIKE. Once you take them ONCE you are a cheater for life!
Ahhh this will just blow over…Who reads SI anyhow??
this leaves a bad taste my mouth
Who cares? This is a great example of why you should never talk to police or prosecutors. But for Barry Bonds’ giant ego and lying on the stand this would never be an issue. Why should I care what someone put in their body? Think I’ll cheer harder for ARod and Michael Phelps this year.
Lie about drugs=bad. Lie about war, bank bailouts, spending a trillion dollars, and everything else=good in the government’s eyes.
I think that you guys (Mike, Joe and Ben), should go on a quest to out the name of the 4 “sources”.
Any means necessary?
You should be vigilant against all law-breakers.
It’s like waking up and learning your favorite singer or actor just died. Ummm…how long til opening day?? That’s it, with this guys nerves. he’s done. So much for having a clean legit player take over as homerun king. Ayy. Still am amazed no Redson player has been named.
My dad is so dumb.
Me:Dad did you hear about Arod?
Him:Yeah I did, but here’s the thing. EVERYBODY took steroids back then, it was unrestrained.
Me:Dad, 5% tested positive for using PED’s.
Him:Like I said, Everybody.
i literally feel sick. not because i care whether he cheated or not (i don’t), but because i was hoping a baseball season where we can talk about, i don’t know, baseball.
This fucken sucks man.
This will never blow over. There goes the excitement of watching a “clean” Yankee break the all time home run record
damn it
Fuck.
And of course every single shot of him on SportsCenter just now was wearing a Yankee uniform…
This sucks.
Of course it is. Everyone identifies him as a Yankee.
Gonna be a looooong season.
Yeah. They were taking about David Justice the other day and every clip they showed of him was in a Yanks uni. I wonder if they realized he spot a lot more time in places like Cleveland and Atlanta.
If true, it definitely sucks. Although I rarely don’t care who took steroids in 2003, especially as MLB didn’t even care enough to explicitly ban them at that time, the media circus is going to be incredibly annoying. At least C.C. and Tex wont have to worry about being overexposed.
Regardless of the validity of this report, I really hope Arod takes legal action against the government for leaking this confidential information as well as SI for reporting it (it is legal to disseminate leaked confidential information). Also, when MLB sits down to negotiate with the owners and finds a complete lack of trust, I hope they wont be too surprised.
My guess is that ARod would have a ridiculously difficult time winning any kind of lawsuit over the leaks. The Federal Government has sovereign immunity, which is very difficult to overcome. I think to do so he would need to show that the leaks were motivated by actual malice. But if others know this area of law better I am happy to be corrected.
The government is not immune from following the law. If this information was obtained illegally, then Arod would definitely have recourse against all involved. The question is whether Arod wants to open a pandora’s box.
All I am saying is that while the leaking of sealed information is illegal, it is up to the DOJ to prosecute it. On the other hand, the sovereign immunity question comes in if ARod tries to bring any kind of civil action because government officials generally have qualified immunity and the government itself has sovereign immunity so that it is a tough road to hoe.
There is only one way to get this stench off the Yankee team.
Sign Manny now. Just kidding…..Or am I.
It would give the hounds something else to go after for a few and at least give them time to get the story straight.
A-Roid anybody
I was think Stei-rod
i read this on my blackberry while on the throne this morning and i literally crapped.
we don’t need this. he didnt need this. but the lynch mob/witch hunt has begun. our favorite mentally unbalanced third baseman is going to crumble.
the question is, while the bronx back him up?
i don’t know.
nooooooooooooooo!!
I have to admit, I just can’t get worked up about steroids. I can get worked up about people lying about whether they took steroids, especially under oath, but it just doesn’t bother me. Especially back then since the 5% likely a small fraction of those who were really using (given that many used undectable substances). Additionally, where do we want to draw the line with regard to people getting by on talent and training? I mean if the objection to steroids is a level playing field than it is a silly objection because it was never a level playing field. To get that we would have to restrict the number of hours guys could train so that some players couldn’t get an unfair advantage. We would have to ban any kind of performance enhancing substance for omega-3 fatty acids to creatine to virtually anything with the word supplement in it. It just doesn’t make sense to me.
I guess the long and short of it is that stopping at steroids, amphetamines, coffee, or anything else is largely an arbitrary line in the sand. If people are honest about that but have very strong and compelling reasons why steroids are the line we should draw than I am very happy to hear them and be convinced. But thus far, I have not been.
Guess what story is the lead story on CNN.com ?
At least he’s wearing a Rangers uniform in that picture. Silver lining, right?
Exactly.
ben is right this isnt a bulking agent…heres the summary from steroid.com
“Although nobody would ever suggest to use Primobolan as a bulking agent, it´s been studied as an agent to halt wasting and possibly reverse many of the adverse effects of anemia. It is a shocking failure in both areas, according to some of the case studies I´ve read, (5)(6) and this should come to no surprise to anyone. Anadrol reigns supreme in this area, and nobody in the athletic community would ever compare those two drugs. However, Michael Mooney and many other respected doctors who work with AIDS patients have found sufficient evidence to claim that Primobolan is an immune enhancer and as such is very useful for AIDS patients (not that the FDA cares…Primobolan is still not approved for sale in the United States). AIDS patients aren´t really in need of Bulking Drugs, so an immune enhancer like Primo which will add small, quality gains in muscle is perfect for them. And since we aren´t even going to vaguely consider the use of Primobolan as a bulking agent, clearly this leaves us with considering it primarily for use in gaining and maintaining lean tissue. It´s a great choice for this purpose, and many competitors have used it very successfully to retain muscle while on a calorie reduced diet. The reason Primo is so useful for this purpose is that one of its primary functions is to help your body retain nitrogen (7) at a greatly enhanced rate. The greater your nitrogen retention is, the more muscle you will build. In the case of using primo as a pre-contest drug, this nitrogen retention will help you retain muscle and ensure that your dieting preferentially favors fat loss over muscle loss.”
Great, let the A-Rod aids rumors start now too.
I can’ believe his. My heart is broken…my favorite player of all time.
Everything ruined. I could cry.
Yeah. This totally ruins my day.
Seconded.
At least now there is another baseball story divert attention from Torre’s book…
Yea, replace a problem with arod with another problem with arod
Why does anyone care about this stuff!!!!!!
Does anyone really think that only 5% of the players took PED’s…it was more like 5% did not take them. Manimal your father is right.
It’s not like no one in any other sport took PED’s either.
Because he could go down as the best player ever. This is the last thing the Yankees need.
Open your eyes. EVERY pro athlete is on something. And why shouldn’t they be? You really think 330lb football players can run 5 sec 40’s? You think every NBA player isn’t looking to get in better condition and get quicker and jump higher?
This fucking sucks I just want to watch somw goddamn baseball now we have to deal with this shit everywhere we go. Fuck all those cocksuckers at SI nobody cares about steroids anymore.
Agreed.
I didn’t care when it was Bonds, Giambi, whoever, and I still don’t care.
I want baseball not drama. If I wanted drama I’d fucking watch TNT.
I have a big problem with this.
They should demand who Epstein received this information from that was suppose to be sealed.
If Epstein does not give up the source he should go to jail like Bonds trainer had to.
There cant be two set of rules just because he is a reporter and if it was government source they should that person on trial.
Baseball has a union for a reason.
the test was done before there were any adjustments made on the agreement they had with the owners.
when he breaks the record, no one will care about this anymore… rite??
when he breaks the record,
no oneeveryone will care about this.anymore… rite??Hope I did this right.
Almost.
Is this Epstein character related to Theo?
I’m going to go with no. I don’t think every single Epstein in the U.S. are related. It’s a rather common last name.
I was hoping a miracle.
A-Rod, I still love you.
I’m glad to know that I’m not alone.
But this report just gave Jose Canseco a boatload of credibility.
I disagree. Canseco will CLAIM it gives him credibility, but he never claimed to actually know A-Rod was on steroids, he just suspected.
Well, I sorta agree. It gives him credibility in the public eye, but it doesn’t make him objectively credible.
If A-Rod does not own up to it, does he get the McGwire treatment and have people start questioning the HOF?
This is going to be ugly….
No way, A-Rod is probably going to be the Home Run King. That said, Is Barry Bonds going to get snubbed for the HOF? No chance in hell. Mcgwire obviously was taking steroids thoughout his career. His HR to AB ratio was ridiculous, especially later in his career. 32 HRs in 236 ABs, nuff’ said.
Does anyone else find it strange that this story emerges right at the start of Spring Training and on the heels of Torres backstabbing book? SI is ‘fixing’ the Yankees for Selig and Co. for their wild spending of their own money to improve their club.Unheard of.
Are people seriously defending this douchebag? Despicable.
Nick, who are your favorite players, and show me proof that they are clean. Nobody is above suspicion (and I would have said that before today). There is evidence of steroid use in sports going back almost 50 years. Nobody can be assumed clean and “clean” tests don’t prove anything either.
When their names come out, you can say that.
And PLEASE don’t act like this is the first offense from this nutjob. I don’t know what I will do with myself if this fanbase sticks their heads up their asses like the Giants fans did.
Giants fans SHOULD root for Barry Bonds, unless they object to him being a total asshole. Baseball players use steroids. If Bonds hit an HR off a a juiced Eric Gagne, should they not cheer? The playing field was level.
Why is he a douche bag? Becuase he 1) tried to make himself better? or 2) tried to keep up with everyone else who was doing it?
or 3) becuase you Nick morally have a problem with it?
Nick, I agree.
A Rod has been nothing but a me-first, divisive distraction since he has been here. It’s always about him. I just don’t believe it’s a coincidence that teams do better when he leaves.
I get killed on this board whenever I say something negative about A Rod. But I just can’t stand having to root for him.
I’ve been a Yankee fan since pretty much birth (thanks to my dad, who was a huge fan), and I live and die with the team, so I’m never happy when anything happens that negatively affects their chances to win. But I would be lying if I didn’t say that I got some enjoyment when I saw this story. I’m so sick of Yankee fans giving A Rod a pass.
Can we all just agree that A Rod is a fabulously talented, immensely productive player who also is a selfish, self-righteous, fails-when-it-counts prima donna? Both sides of the coin can be true.
Edited by RAB. Attack someone personally on this thread and you WILL get banned.
Classy. You kiss your mothers with these mouths?
If this is true, not really sure what to think.
I’d assume he’s been clean for the past several seasons.. but if he’s getting tipped off to drug testing once, he could have been tipped off more than once. I’d assume though that he hasn’t been using recently, at least during the season, because a lot of those steroids stay in your system for several months so even with a heads up it would be tough to beat a test.
Jose Canseco named Alex and everybody said he was lying and just out for money. Only half true, it seems. Makes me believe Canseco about Magglio, too.
why weren’t the other 103 names leaked too?
I can just hear curt schilling typing furiously and unforgivingly into his blog about how the game should be played cleanly and he played the ws with a bloody ankle blah blah blah.
This story really sucks. You guys should do a poll of who stands behind A-Rod in this and who doesn’t
Yeah, 104 names and one gets leaked. I’m sure the rest were all small time players too, no other HOF’s and All-Stars…..
I still can’t believe the Red Sox have never, ever, had a player use steroids.
Given Paxton Crawford’s comments, it’s a virtual certainty that Sox players have used PEDs.
Oh, I was being sarcastic. In fact, Big Papi fits the steroid profile to a T. 20 HR’s in his first 800 ab’s, then he becomes a beast at 27 and his body is breaking down at 32.
Ya, I really think Papi was/is a roider. No way he could improve that much because of Manny and Fenway alone.
I’d be shocked to hear that any Sox wasn’t using. I’d be shocked to hear any pro athlete wasn’t doing something.
If using was the difference between a 50 mill contract and the minors wouldn’t you use?
It’s obvious. Bet Selig will fight to keep that cat in the bag though.
They has Gagne and Donnelly (who has cheated in multiple ways), that has got to count for something.
The other 103 names weren’t leaked because they weren’t A-Rod.
Does this give more credence to the “everyone was doing it” crowd?
Yes, led by Canseco (and Caminiti)
I swear when the ESPN lead came on and said ARod had tested positive for….. there was a pause and the first thing that came to mind was HIV. I was ready to scream. When they said roids in 2003, I was actually relieved.
It sounds like Primo is more of vanity type drug, to get cut without the bulk. I can definitely see Alex caring more about appearance than performance.
Fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuck.
I think the developers of MLB’10 The Show should put in a feature where your player gets to choose whether to take drugs or not. If you test positive the story gets leaked and you’re screwed for life. Yay real life
I would so buy that game…
Why stop there, there can be acne, shrinking testies, roid rage. And for ‘11 there can be illigitemate babies, unpaid taxes, dating celebreties, etc.
Make Elijah Dukes the coverboy.
Tell me your version wouldn’t outsell the real one!
Please see:
Blitz: The League
everyone is quoting this story as the gospel, when they dont know 1) if its true 2) why wasnt the other 103 names revealed.
Things to remember when debating steroids:
1) Some people just don’t care about who used steroids, because we’ll never be able to find out all of the players who did it. It doesn’t mean that they’re not bad for the sport. It means that MLB is on top of the drug issue right now (or at least they appear to be), and we’re going to leave this in the past.
2) Some people are morally outraged at this, and think that everything a fingered player does is now irrelevant.
I swear, I do not want to see any name-calling or flame wars between these two groups. You each have your positions, and no one’s is likely to change.
Are you telling me I only have one of two sides to take! Them’s fightin’ words
Why do you think its ok for you to tell everyone what to think? I don’t care if you own the site or not, the readers are the ones that keep it going. Stop trying to censor peoples opinions!
Go ahead and ban me if you like there are 100000 other sites just like this one.
Get off your high horse!
I am officially done with steroids….I don’t want to know who took them…I no longer care…I am disgusted…and I am starting to look down on people reporting it…I don’t want to know of anyone else who took them….unless they were on the red sox…This is BS b/c those should have been sealed and I’m sorry who ever is leaking the information needs to be penalized.I bet theres only a small group of people w/ access so start with them. Thats how done I am with this I would much rather see the reporters rather than bonds/clemens or other players go to jail
Giants fans SHOULD root for Barry Bonds, unless they object to him being a total asshole. Baseball players use steroids. If Bonds hit an HR off a a juiced Eric Gagne, should they not cheer. The playing field was level.
Damn new reply button!
We can never catch a break.
I don’t see the big deal about players using Steroids. These guys are already so huge, because they work out all day their entire lives. All this does is add a small amount of extra muscle to a game where its all mental and mechanics.
Steroids is the most over-blown crock of sh** ever.
Long live Bonds and A-Rod.
I might cry.
About the only thing I want to read now is that David Ortiz’ name is on the list too. This totally sucks. I’m crushed, not even that I care about steroids, just that it’s now impossible for me to defend my favorite player to the hoardes of dumbass Yankee fans now.
I feel exactly the same way. I usually wouldn’t wish harm on anyone, but if there is a Red Sox player that cheated, PLEASE let that story come out!
No matter what though, this ruins Arod forever. His legacy is destroyed. His records will be looked at as false.
I hope Alex finds a way to handle this. A guy as sensitive as everyone says he is, this could be dangerous territory for him. I’m literally worried about the guy.
OK, this is a bummer. But Arod shouldn’t be held out to take the abuse to come all by himself. The entire list or 103 names needs to be published now so that baseball fans can see all the names involved.
We gotta burn down that lab in Cali.
i don’t care a rod is still my boy. still love the yanks and still have a man crush on A-Rod
Amen!
I’m just hoping there is some way he could prove this story to be false. I know it’s not gonna happen, but maybe, just maybe this is a false accusation.
He told Katie Couric he didn’t do it.
Ben,
I love your work man, your an amazing writer, but I almost fell out of my chair when you opined the possibility that this might “blow over.” Dude, we’re gonna have to deal with this shit for the next 9 years of his contract!!!
No matter where he goes, or what he does, people will ALWAYS bring up the steroids issue…always. And this is WORSE than Barry Bonds because Bonds was never hated the way A Rod is – this sitauation is liking throwing kerosine onto an already burning fire.
Oh yea, and lets see how Arods “head” handles this. The guy is a certified head-case and cant even handle playing baseball once the calendar reaches October, WHO THE FUCK IS HE GOING TO BE ABLE TO HANDLE BEING CONSTANTLY ABUSED, 24/7. FOR THE DURATION OF THE ENTIRE SEASON….FOR THE NEXT 9 YEARS!
JESUS CHRIST!!!!! AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
P.S. you can kiss the Hall of Fame goodbye
I used to think that A-Rod would get into the hall of fame unanimously. I used to think that some people would knock him for his “unclutchness” or the way he was such a headcase. But i thought that in the end, every writer in the BBWAA (if there still is a BBWAA in 14 years) would vote for him because of what he brought to teams talent-wise.
Now, his record before 2003 is that much more tarnished and who knows if it will affect voters. I think it will, but he’ll still get into the HOF
Lets just hope manny, ortiz shilling or some other prominent redsock made the list. This is such bullshit, they get their hands on a list of players and oly reveal one of them. This just makes me so unbelievably anrgy.
*UCK! is the first word that came to mind when I saw this report. I suspect the trolls will be flooding Yankee sites for a long time. *Sighs*
whats really gonna rock the world is when people find out about tiger woods and roids.
nah he didnt take roids but ill bet money hes on some hgh now after that knee/leg surgery
What’s worse? Sleeping with Madonaa(ewwww) or taking steroids?
Steroids. He may have taken it in the butt with roids.
Dude, have you seen Madonna lately? Looks like he could have taken it in the butt from her too.
Excellent post.
I’d bang Madonna. Ya, I said it.
LOL. Great. How much more can I hate this guy. He has been an embarrassment since he became a Yankee. Get rid of this albatross now. No more excuses from you A-Fraud lovers. Your like those zombies that followed Obama around and believe he is the messiah. A-Rod is nothing but a self absorbed athlete. True Yankee fans, blue collared fans cannot stand this joke.
P.s. For all of you band wagon fans that attacked Jeter and defended A-Fraud. Grow up and smell the roses. You had to know this was coming. The guy is a walking roid. Amazingly, I think it was in the back of his head that one day it would come out.
So I’m not a true Yankee fan because I like A-Rod? What happens if Jeter’s name is on that list of 103 other guys who tested positive?
If Jeter’s name is on it, you know what will happen. The A-Rod bashers will still bash A-Rod, and say Jeter only juiced because of his love for the game, he just wanted to get better and win. A-Rod juiced for his stats, Jeter for the rings.
Were the 2 MVP’s embarrassing?
Or the fact that this ballclub doesn’t make it to the playoffs in ‘07 without him?
This is why this news sucks. Not because one of our players was outed. Because it’s only going to widen the gap between the guys who like A-Rod because he’s a good baseball player, and those who hate him because of all the psychological issues they attribute to him.
The only people’s whose opinions could change from this are those who loved A-Rod because he didn’t use PEDs. From what I’ve seen, most of the A-Rod fans, myself included, don’t criticize players for taking steroids.
Actually, yes.
I think real Yankee fans can like A Rod, and real Yankee fans should want him to succeed, because it’s good for the team.
But I consider myself a real fan and I am not afraid to say I don’t enjoy rooting for A Rod. I didn’t care that he won the MVPs. Personal awards. The early playoff exits, with A Rod sucking, were not really worthy of my pride.
I hope A Rod has a monster year. I just think it would be more fun to cheer for other guys.
This is the most reasonable anti-A-Rod position I’ve ever heard. Hats off, Sanchez.
Thanks. I just wish people weren’t so black and white with this guy.
agreed.
I agree with you and that’s how I feel. I want A-Rod to be amazing, and I root for him and wear an A-Rod t-shirt and all that… But I do those things because I want the Yankees to be amazing. It’s not because I like A-Rod. I wish I liked him more, but I just don’t. One reason I don’t “like” him that the A-Rod fans will understand: I’m just tired of the negative stories, the rip-jobs, all the shit that comes along with having A-Rod on the team. Whether it’s right for people (here I mean writers/players/baseball people) to dislike A-Rod or not, they do, and this shit is never going to end with him. I just wish I could enjoy a baseball season without all the A-Rod drama. But he’s here for the long-haul, so such is life.
I wholeheartedly endorse these points but would just say that I have moved from being in the root for him but don’t like him camp to the root for him and feel kind of sorry for him camp. It is a little sad that someone with that much skill, talent, work ethic, and achievement thinks so little of himself and is so uncomfortable in his own skin. I am sure we have all met people like this and while the first response in almost always to be annoyed by their ridiculously poor perspective no their own personality and achievements, for me that quickly moves to a sense of pity.
Yeah I hear you, I feel bad for him too. Ugh he’s so frustrating. I feel bad for him because he clearly has emotional issues, and I feel bad that he gets ripped all the time, but at the same time he brings a lot of it upon himself and I just want him to stop being such a chump. Whatever. Fucking A-Rod.
No doubt there is that dichotomy. Some days I feel bad for him, some days I want to smack him upside the head and tell him to pull his head out of his ass.
Ahhh, can i nominate this for the post of the year?
For the unintentional comedy division?
Exactly. That post has everything in it you could ask for.
As much as people want to sit here and bemoan how Alex gets singled out and has him name leaked when the other 100-something players did not (there will be more names, people.. if they release them all at once they won’t get as much web traffic), the bottom line is Alex did this to himself.
He wants the biggest contract, the best image, all the records. Well obviously we know just how badly he wants all that. Strikes me very similarly to Bonds, just without the blunt honesty. It’s all about Alex, period.
The guy is a cancer. He’s been one his whole career. Both teams he left improved after he was gone. Too bad the yanks wont be able to make it 3 for 3, he’s with them until he retires.
Stop it.
texas has improved how? they still cant pitch, and still finish last in the AL West…
I fucken hate that argument. Some guy was saying how Seattle won 115 games after he left but he fails to see how their pitching improved by a full run and you cannot blame that on A-Rod because he was amazing on defense back then.
And picked up Ichiro, the MVP (though undeserved)
It was definitely A-Rod’s leaving in the 2003 offseason that made Texas’s ERA drop from 5.67 in 2003 to 4.53 in 2004. All A-Rod leaving.
People will make all kinds of arguments (the pitching got better! etc.), but personally, I think it’s not a coincidence.
For whatever reason, Yankee fans have embraced this guy and refuse to see his faults.
I just hate rooting for him.
I still think it’s coincidence. Control subject: Buck Showalter
Left Yanks after ‘95 season. Yanks won WS in 96.
Left D’Backs after ‘00 season. D’Backs won WS in ‘01.
Left Rangers after ‘06 season. Rangers finish last, again, in West in ‘07.
Clearly, manager and star player are not equal. I think we tend to overblow these coincidences in our minds, though.
Baseball is too complicated for one factor to be the sole reason for anything. So I don’t disagree with you there. But I do think A Rod leaving was a factor. Like the team could breathe a sigh of relief.
Same thing with Showalter. Managers tend to wear out their welcomes. Managerial changes can give a jolt to a team. That can explain a boost. But if Texas was lousy (like in 2006), no new manager was going to suddenly make them good.
But if he’s been clean since, and been able to put up the same numbers do people start questioning if steroids we’re really that effective.
If you want to get technical.. his numbers have been largely similar. Although the only seasons since 1997 that Alex failed to hit at least 41 homers (2004, 2006, 2008) all came after testing began.
So they only test in even years? Or he only juices in odd years? He had 48 and 54 HR’s in the span of those non 41 hr years, so it’s not like he’s trended downwards. 2004 was his first year in NY, and 2008 he missed over 20 games.
He also went to a home park that kills righties after playing in 2 HR friendly parks.
2008 – he was hurt
2007- MVP
2006 – who knows
2005- MVP
2004 – First year adjusting to NY
2003- MVP
Pattern ends there
people should do some research before blasting arod….primobolan is a steroid that helps you get cut, not add mass or strength
We noted that in the post, but what’s your point? It’s still an illegal steroid.
not taking a shot at you, but the idiots on the radio….yea its illegal, but its not going to make you a better baseball player. Its the safest steroid out there, if thats true, if it really helped you become a better player, why didnt bonds, clemens, and the others use it?
That comment probably doesn’t deserve a reply. However, I feel the need to. How the hell do you know whether primobolan does or doesn’t make you a better player? And how do you know that Bonds and Clemens didn’t use it?
How do you know that a straight line has 180 degrees? How do you know that the sky is blue?
How do you know what to believe?
I think we should all start doing steroids to start to understand how they work.
If it doesn’t make you a better player, why is it on the banned list?
And since when do players get to pick and choose which rules they can follow?
“Methenolone (same name as primoloban) is also not overly suppressive of the HPTA axis, although how suppressive is debatable.[citation needed] For this reason, many bodybuilders use it in between steroid cycles during their “off-time” to help maintain their gains and strength.”
It rates a 4/10 on weight game 5/10 on strength gain, 7/10 on fat loss
“And since we aren´t even going to vaguely consider the use of Primobolan as a bulking agent, clearly this leaves us with considering it primarily for use in gaining and maintaining lean tissue. It´s a great choice for this purpose, and many competitors have used it very successfully to retain muscle while on a calorie reduced diet. The reason Primo is so useful for this purpose is that one of its primary functions is to help your body retain nitrogen (7) at a greatly enhanced rate. The greater your nitrogen retention is, the more muscle you will build. In the case of using primo as a pre-contest drug, this nitrogen retention will help you retain muscle and ensure that your dieting preferentially favors fat loss over muscle loss.””
As your scource clearly states, “[primoloban is used] to help maintain their gains and strength.” That would seem to give you a leg up on other “clean ” athletes. Who knows whether it actually makes you better? The point is, it’s a steroid that shouldn’t be used by professional athletes.
There are actually a lot of substances on the list that don’t improve performance, such as many of the ADHD drugs. Not defending the guy, just saying…
If you don’t think ADHD drugs positively affect performance, you’ve obviously never taken an amphetamine. They most certainly do improve performance.
When not hanging around RAB I picture you, like, on a Sir Arthur Conan Doyle board saying shit like: “If you don’t think morphine and cocaine positively affect detective skills, you’ve obviously never taken morphine and cocaine.” You’re like clockwork with that shit.
Joseph P., will you be my BFF?
Sure thing, Mondesi. I am afraid, though, that I’ve been positioned as the token drug user.
Someone’s got to do it. Just think you are the poster boy that lets all the judgmental non-users that you can be a successful blogger and a drug user just like Michael Phelps let people know that you can be a successful Olympic athlete and a drug user.
Do we really need someone to prove that, though? History is filled with drug addict authors. Not that this is high-level writing or anything.
But remember blogging isn’t real writing, it’s just guys in their underwear in their mom’s basement.
That cocaine crack reminded me of a time I was watching Sunday Night Baseball with captions on.
Announcer: “You can’t be an effective major league pitcher if you’re afraid of contact.”
Caption: “You can’t be an effective major league pitcher if you’re afraid of cocaine.”
BEST CAPTION EVER.
if you don’t think ADHD drugs positively affect performance, you’ve obviously never taken an amphetamine. They most certainly do improve performance.
so do corrective lenses.
So does lifting weights. So does practice.
Corrective lenses correct a physical deficiency. Taking an amphetamine is using a chemical to unnaturally boost your awareness and focus.
True but using hypnosis to help you focus is using a psychological process administered by others to help you unnaturally boost your awareness and focus. It seems like these are largely arbitrary distinctions. Some more or less arbitrary than others, still arbitrary nonetheless.
Also, where does one draw the line with what a physical deficiency is? Isn’t not being as strong as another guy a physical deficiency? I have to sound like such a relativist but I have yet to hear a compelling and consistent theory of where to draw the line in any of these areas.
btw, I meant to say “hate to sound like such a relativist”
using hypnosis to help you focus is using a psychological process administered by others to help you unnaturally boost your awareness and focus
How is hypnosis “unnatural”? It’s a lot more natural than caffeine.
And it doesn’t have to be administered by others, there’s such a thing as self hypnosis.
OK, how about laser eye surgery? I mean you can refute specific examples (and I think you are right about me being wrong with my hypnosis example) but I am sure if I think about it for long enough I can come up with “unnatural” ways of enhancing performance that people who are anti-steroid or anti-stimulant think are perfectly acceptable.
Good stuff by both sides. I look at this thing with eyes wide open. What the hell did we expect? MLB had no explicit rules or punishment in regard to the steroid issue when he tested positive. It’s basically a non-story, but the only way to generate any interest these days is to tear something or someone down. Shock value. That’s what’s keeping this thing afloat.
Lost in all will be the fact that the Feds can’t keep a f’n envelope sealed and the Union and MLB will have a very interesting bargaining session next time around. As far as A-Rod goes, c’mon guys, how many other other SS in the history of the game have put up numbers like that? If you didn’t somewhat suspect this than you’re pretty naive to the ways of the world. We got politicians who don’t pay their taxes, but god forbid if an athlete takes something illegal that will improve his performance.
Great day for Michael Phelps though. It’s gotta be.
I think people need to separate the two stories here, which are 1) A-Rod, along with 100 or so other players, tested positive in 2003 for steroids, and 2) A-Rod was tipped off to a drug test in 2004.
Story 1 is very likely true, as, at least according to the authors (And to be fair, Selena Roberts has a LONG history of attacking the Yankees), “two sources familiar with the evidence that the government has gathered in its investigation of steroid use in baseball and two other sources with knowledge of the testing results.” Now I have vowed never to trust stories that base really damning accusations off of “people familiar” with something or “with knowledge” of something, as about half the time they are dead wrong. BUT, 4 sources are a lot and you would think the authors would really trust these sources to run with it.
So A-Rod probably did steroids back in 2003.
BUT, story 2 strikes me as a load of crap. They write “Three major league players who spoke to SI said that Rodriguez was also tipped by Orza in early September 2004 that he would be tested later that month.” So basically their source for this is 3 baseball players. That doesn’t really strike me as all too trustworthy, especially since one of those players could very easily be Canseco.
But furthermore, the article states that he was tipped off for a test later in the month, and almost all steroids other than Andriol take AT LEAST 3-6 weeks to leave your system, which really makes me wonder…
But, in the end, A-Rod most likely did roids at one point. But the fact that it is just his name that was released is also highly questionable
the steroid arod took has a half life of 10.5 days, whatever that means
I assume this incident does not affect his contract, right?
Nope, MLBTR has it up.
no I don’t think there was anything in his contract about steroids. I don’t think he loses any money over this.
Absolutely not. This happened on the previous contract, while he was in Texas. The only way it would have bearing on his current deal is if he tested positive this year.
Can we all agree that A-Rod got the 10 year contract he got so that he could break the HR record in a Yankee uniform as a “clean” player. If A-Rod was a know steroid user last year, like Giambi, do you think the Yanks give him that contract? This is where the thinking of Randy Levine pisses me off. He puts the marketing opportunities for the team over the baseball of the team. This year he got shot down on Manny, thankfully. But, now with this debacle, who knows. Manny might be in pinstripes just to get the attention off of this. Overall, it just sucks. I am pissed at the whole thing. The people who give up just one name out of 104 people. The government employee that leaked the list, A-Rod for taking it, and the Yanks upper management for giving him 10 years so we get to hear about this for almost a decade. Ugh, not a great way to open the new stadium.
Well put.
Even if the release was selective, A Rod had to be on the list to make that opportunity possible.
It sucks that this news is breaking but oh well, it is what it is.
I am just pissed. He knew when he signed that new contract that he tested positive. He knew that he was being looked at as the man to break the HR record clean and that this could come out at any time. Who knows what the Yankees knew. I am trying to get behind the guy. I have never booed him at the Stadium, not during the regular season, not during the playoffs. It would drive me nuts when fans would do that. But, this. It is too much.
Agree with ya man but I still love him.
I am trying, Mike. I really am. But, this was a deliberate fraud. That contract was based on him breaking the HR record clean. He knew that. He doesn;t get that contract if he was a publicly known user at the time. He took all those incentives for the plateaus knowing that he tested positive and he crossed his fingers hoping it wouldn’t come out. I am trying to get behind him but I am finding it very difficult. It is really, really ugly.
I have the “Just found out there’s no Santa” feeling.
Sorry to hear about this. I loved A-Rod when he was here in Seattle, but have disliked him since he took the money and ran.
I ran the numbers for his career (you can view them here), and they show some clear signs of use.
“clear signs of use”
Hogwash. 11 HR change is a difference, but don’t you think that his first season in NY had something to do with it? Most players struggle their first year with the Yankees, and A-Rod is not as headstrong as many. So when he inclined again (or got back to the norm) in 2005, was he juicing again.
Not saying he didn’t use, but the stats say nothing about it. Does he only juice in odd years? Come on.
I actually don’t see how your graphs show anything clear at all. what they show, if anything, is that A-Rod, in coming into his prime exactly around 2002-2003, did what you would expect one of the greatest hitters to do, that is, remain pretty darn consistent. Yes, there are fluctuations from year to year, but its not like he suddenly started doing anything all that out of line with his history. If anything, the fluctuations would disprove the use, as he has done both better since then, and worse.
Numbers cannot prove steroid use, but these support it. The way his numbers ran were similar to the way I’ve seen other guys numbers go. The SLG and ISO do the job of supporting it, even though the HR don’t.
We cannot look at a player every year and claim he did roids, but we can look back and say “OK, that makes sense now”.
Ya but except umm the numbers don’t prove it. He as far as we know wasn’t on roids in 07 but he had probably his best season ever.
Yes, ‘07 was great. But his pattern from ‘05 to the present has been a fluctuating one. And unless he takes a year off from roids, then goes back on, we have to assume it is some kind of natural pattern.
Every player has swings in performance (except Adam Dunn). There are reasons for this, you can’t in hindsight cherry pick some numbers that don’t support your argument anyway and said, yup, he used. Unless all players in baseball (other than Adam Dunn) are using, because they all have performance swings. Of course, Adam Dunn could be using all along, explaining his consistency. These guys aren’t robots, performance will change year to year. Run a graph on Pujols, and you’ll conclude that he used. He spike from 34 to 43, then went 46, 41, 49 before losing 17 HR’s to 32 (in more at-bats BTW) and hitting 37 this year. That’s a much bigger inconsistency than A-Rod.
Pujols=Juicer, case closed.
Ya but he ain’t a Yank. No bigs.
Yes players have swings. So I will say it again:
” We cannot look at a player every year and claim he did roids, but we can look back and say “OK, that makes sense now”. “
The swings are such a common occurrence, you can’t say it makes sense now, because it would match the swings in performance whether or not the person is juicing.
If it came out later that this report is false, and A-Rod is clean, what would explain his swings? The swings in performance happen on and off juice.
Lance Berkman too. Huge swings in performance.
I don’t really see the stats backing up any possible usage. A-Rod peaks in 2002 before testing positive in 2003. Even if you say that he may have been taking steroid previous to testing positive, there are possibly other factors at play. His numbers spike in 2000 after leaving Seattle, some of these can be attributed to switching from a pitcher’s park in Seattle to a hitter’s haven at Texas. Also important, once reaching Texas A-Rod hits age 25 and he starts to mature physically as he starts to enter his prime. After Texas, his number on average have been slightly lower in NY (again park change), but have been up and down showing at times being equal or better than at Texas (during his alleged steroid usage).
He may very well have taken steroid, but the numbers do not really back it up.
To put it another way, if you looked at his numbers, before knowing he took steroids, would you have assumed he did?
No. Hence, me saying:
” We cannot look at a player every year and claim he did roids, but we can look back and say “OK, that makes sense now”. ”
Players that go from extremely low to high, we can tell, yes. Brady Anderson, Brian Roberts, and Barry Bonds. It becomes more difficult when the numbers are already high. That’s why the HR numbers don’t look like it, but the SLG and ISO do.
” We cannot look at a player every year and claim he did roids, but we can look back and say “OK, that makes sense now”. ” I can agree with that thought process, but I never saw that post since I was writing mine at the same time.
However, even looking at just SLG and ISO, though, the numbers don’t back up steroid usage, all that well. Since leaving Texas, A-Rod has played 5 seasons, 1 (2007) superior to the Texas years, 1 (2005) about equal to Texas, and 3 worse than Texas (2004, 2006, 2008). The three worse years, 2004 was his first in NY and 2008 he was hurt part of the year, which could contribute to his subpar performance or they could just be bad years (like 2006). He had 2 out of 5 equal years and 3 worse years of which 2 have had outside extenuating circumstances.
I am just saying I don’t think the data backs it up that well.
It doesn’t explain it well. Unless every single major leaguer is using, the swings explain nothing. Players will have swings whether they are juicing or not.
I understand where everyone is coming from. I looked at the graphs, and decided (based on your comments) that it didn’t do a good enough job explaining it.
So, I sat down and ran the numbers through some more sophisticated shit, and I think it makes sense now. You can view it here.
There’s a good, very recent documentary on steroids called “Bigger, Faster, Stronger” if your interested in ann unbiased approach to steroids check it out.
Did you see it?
Dude in the beginning is disgusting.
How about the dude with the biggest bi-ceps?
“Where has the $15m gone?
Um, we dont know”
amazing
Okay , maybe people have already mentioned this in the comments but… why is it that Arod’s name didnt show up at all during the Mitchell Reports? Also, if these sleaze balls from SI optained this info, along w/ info that 103 other players failed tests in 2003, why is it that Arod’s name is the only one being mentioned?? I mean, okay… I’m sure his name is probably the biggest name on this supposed list (at this point) but why JUST his name? Sounds like a bit of your typical Yankees witch hunt to me.
All of you Yankees hating sports reporters can do everything in your power to tarnish the Yankees players, past and present.. but there’s one thing you sports nerds cant tarnish.. (which, in my opinion is why you hate them anyhow) 26 rings!!!!
Yanks=27 rings in ‘09!
When does this CBA end? Because when the next one comes aorund, you can bet that the union won’t allow testing to be leaked
It’s already not allowed to be leaked.
The Union is going to dig in its heels and MLB is going to have to bend over backwards in order to get it to agree with anything.
“you can bet that the union won’t allow testing to be leaked”
do you know why people leak info? because its not legal to come out and say it straight, thats why they hide behind reporters so they dont lose their job and goto jail.
time to sign Manny, as the fragile ego of our cleanup-hitter is shattered
Why does this just get released now?
Because Selena Roberts has a book coming out this summer on….You guessed it, A-Rod
It’s an allegation made by un-named sources.
When those allegations turn into fact…then let’s talk. Until then, it’s just another rumor.
Canseco has more credibility that Obama, W and all of D.C. put together – and he fought Bonaducci as well.
Im starting to like this guy alot
His claim that 85% of players used is the next thing to be proven right.
This is going to suck. I’m glad I was able to wake up to this.
Hey Macphisto, just in case you have any misconceptions on Manny. He also did steroids without question he used as well and it will come out one day. I have a good source. He used frequently as a member of the Indians, in public, in the middle of the club house. So there goes the notion of bringing in Manny.
I don’t want to bloat but I said this over the last few seasons. Trade A-Rod NOW! But the brains of this operation shot me down as being anti-Yankee when in fact I was being pro Yankee. He’s a clown, hes arrogant, and he has no class. What a mess this has created for the new season. Shame on you all for supporting this ass while attacking our Captain. Your all phonies!
Listen to the Katie Couric interview in 2007. Theres the revelation on this clown.
difference is manny is a flake – there is no pressure or situation where he doesn’t rake the ball. If Manny did steroids and was confronted, he would chuckle and move on.
Arod has issues if he and Jeter wear different jeans, and if nobody wants to play nice with him.
You call anyone a phony on this board one more time and it will be your last post.
I think he’s the phony saying he has a “good source”.
BillyBall—
http://tinyurl.com/5foza3
You have a “good source” eh?
I take back my earlier comment, I nominate THIS ONE for post of the year
My point, BillyBall, if you read my post, was that it is the thinking of Randy Levine that prompted the Yanks to do this marketing driven contract. It was Randy Levine who was pushing for Manny because of the marketing opportunities. He had visions of selling t-shirts of Manny vs Boston the day he left for LA. But, neither the A-Rod contract or bringing Manny over are good baseball decisions. But, now Levine might get his way with Manny because bringin him in now would defuse this going into spring training. Maybe Boras was the leak. It all just sucks so badly.
Hey Billy – you gotta pump the brakes – Jeter is not “our “Captain, and we are not together going to storm San Juan Hill behind him.
Everyone of these guys has all of their laundry eventually exposed – how about Jeter getting caught for trying to evade NY income tax?? think the 23,000 people the mayor will lay off for a tax short-fall will appreciate that?
Keep it in perspective – rich young athletes acting like rich young athletes
Seriously, you couldn’t use the new giant reply button? Instead, you just write the person’s handle.
Also it is you’re, a contraction for you are, not “your”, which is the possessive form of you.
I don’t like to bloat either! You just gotta be careful with, like, Chinese food and stuff like that, BillyBall.
Why didn’t Mo stop this.
he has been a failure since 2000 – didn’t you hear Moose? Just add this to the list
Joseph P. Sorry for the insult. I thought this was free speech here as long as we aren’t cursing at each other or being derogatory to each other. I guess I struck a nerve and I do not wish to be banished but my feelings as a Yankee fan are truly hurt and I have always said the team comes first. Numerous people on here have attacked me for defending Jeter and putting the team concept first over the A-Rod nonsense. And not once did you threaten to expel them. So all I can say is you deserve this guy. Lets hope we can win regardless of the nonsense he brings to the table
In my mind there’s no difference between cursing at someone and calling them a phony.
So we’re not allowed to argue with others on this board? Calling someone a phony is not the end of the world…go ahead and call me one, I don’t care because I know it’s not true.
I take it Joseph P owns this website? If so, do you really want to start banning your users because you disagree with their choice of words? I’m sure that won’t be good for business.
Go ahead and ban someone, see how long you can keep them out. I’ve seen people banned from websites before, and they’re back in 2 minutes after creating a new user account.
I’m not disagreeing with any word choice. I’m disagreeing with petty name calling. Make your point, but do it without disparaging others. This goes especially on this issue, which is polarizing.
We will not let this degenerate into flame wars. If you want to go call someone an idiot or a phony for their opinion, go here:
http://yankees.lhblogs.com
If you banned me, I’d come back as Pop Mike. Noone would ever know.
http://riveraveblues.com/river.....uidelines/
#2
http://i435.photobucket.com/al.....tton-1.jpg
Nice Jack!
“I thought this was free speech here as long as we aren’t cursing at each other or being derogatory to each other.”
Just read what you wrote and you’ll see where you went wrong.
Arod needs to just retire and move to a secluded island somewhere…..
Take me with him.
http://www.impawards.com/1996/fan_ver2.html
he got them from Madonna http://www.newstoob.com/media/.....uff-01.jpg
Hottest. Woman. Ever.
This systematically targeting the Yankees is ridiculous. The Mitchell report was a heavily slanted attempt to attack the Yankees. Now on the day pitchers and catchers show up, the only name out of 104 players to be leaked happens to be a Yankee.
These assholes are shooting themselves in the foot for not protecting the one team that drives the engine that is MLB. Whether or not you like A-Rod matters not, this is bad news for a Yankee team that needs to stay focused against the best devision in baseball. The only thing we can hope for is that the players rally around A-Rod the way they did for Giambi, and then take it out on the rest of the sport. They need to use this as an us against the world thing and kick some ass. One can only hope…with all the other bullshit happening in the world right now, I was really looking forward to a huge year from a revamped Yankee team. Now, not so much…
While many of the players were Yankees, I don’t know if they were really targeted. The thing is most of the sources found were Yankee related. McNamee was Pettitte’s and Clemens’ trainer. BALCO had Sheffield and Giambi among others. Grimsley was a Yankee, so he would probably know many of the Yankees who used. Radomski was a trainer in NY, so it would be expected he distribute to local people. If a steroid deal in KC was found, I’d suspect you’d see mostly KC players on the list.
Also, the Yankees have a lot of stars and players you associate with the Yankees. Thus, when a list of 15 people comes out, if David Justice is the biggest name in the list, they are going to talk about Justice over Joe Schmoe. Also, many players like Justice, Sheffield, and Giambi probably used before the were Yankees, but now they are most associated with the Yankees (especially by Yankee fans).
So while it seems that the Yankees are being discriminated against, I don’t think they are. However, I could be wrong.
I’m not any less excited about the season, I’m just annoyed about the barrage of press I’ll have to wade through on shit I don’t care about.
My brother, die hard Sox fan just called me laughing. What he was laughing about though, was how stupid this is, admitting that most players in baseball were/have used at some point. He still takes pleasure in the distraction that it will cause, but basically could give a shit less that A-Rod juiced, knowing that the players he roots for also juice/have juiced.
You come from a good family Steve.
Lol. I have to say I didn’t expect it, but he knows I would have blasted him about the Sox. We all know they used, and as the years go by, I’m sure more and more names will come out, making fans of teams everywhere relax on the attacks.
You know what sickens me? It’s that these reporters must have looked to damage A-Rod. They could have sought to get the whole list, or a few players. But no, they thought, let’s damage A-Rod, let’s harass a man who goes through enough shit in his life, and let’s screw the Yankees while we’re at it! Insensitivity FTL.
Unless they got more names, and will leak as time goes on. I wonder if people from SI will now write books about other players (knowing they are on the list), only to leak their names before the book comes out.
World Series odds just went down. Lol
Looking for a silver lining now, but maybe, hopefully this has been eating at A-Rod for years, and now he can just relax and play baseball. I doubt it, but maybe the weight he carries on his shoulders relates more to inside his head than what is said by the media, fans, Torre, etc. Maybe he just breathes a sigh of relief and moves on.
You know, I really, really hope that you’re right.
Maybe he never used and since his name will always be tarnished he is going to use now and just mash beyond belief. Give a huge middle finger to the MLB world.
(Sarcasm)
If he is guilty, he needs to admit it so we can all move on and deal with it. He’ll instantly separate himself from guys like Bonds or Clemens in at least some ways then.
Definitely; he needs to do what Giambi did in ST in 2005.
Or Pettitte last year, he has some good models, and even a team mate to council…plus he’s seen what happened to Clemens & Bonds.
The best approach is to be as candid as possible, when he used, why he used, etc
I don’t believe Pettitte, and a lot of people don’t; everyone (pretty much) believes Giambi.
I don’t get your comparison. Pettitte admitted to specific instances of PED use. I agree that a lot of people don’t think he was completely honest, etc. But what do you mean, “everyone (pretty much) believes Giambi?” Giambi never really admitted anything, he just said he was sorry for some undisclosed transgression that he couldn’t talk about for “legal reasons.” I’m not slamming Giambi, I just don’t know what you’re talking about.
Ok. But the point I was trying to make is that everyone has absolved Giambi without forgetting that he did something wrong (steroids). The cloud hangs more prominently on the head of Pettitte because many believe that he hasn’t been completely honest.
But Giambi hasn’t been completely honest either. Whatevs.
This is a good point, its not like A-Rod didn’t know that he tested positive/was using designer ‘roids in ‘03, so maybe this doesn’t effect him.
It was in a milkshake.
Tainted supplement….JC Romero style
who fricken cares what he did in 03…i theink every one has a skeleton in their closet…lets get on to the present and play ball..leave arod alone….
is that your opinion on Bonds, McGwire, Canseco, Giambi, Clemens, etc?
That’s what we want to do but not what everyone else wants to do. That is the problem.
It is really hard, Nick, to just move on. He signed that contract knowing this was out there. Knowing that if it came out it would cause all of us, the fans, heart ache. He knew that he was the guy who was supposed to break the HR record “clean”. This was a contract for someone who was supposed to make baseball history and go the HOF. He knew he used, he knew he failed a test, and he still went ahead and signed that contract with those expectations. It is really hard to just let it go.
I’m still in shock about this. My faith in baseball has just sunk to new lows.
And to everyone who calls ARod a “me first” player, what does that even mean? In baseball, no one can do anything w/o the help of teammates. This isn’t like basketball where one guy can chuck up 30 shots a game or football where the QB can audible at the line or when an RB or WR can bitch to the coordinator to get him more plays.
I agree. What people forget is that no one can get anywhere without being selfish (to varying degrees)
it means whent there is a guy on 2nd with no one out in a tight game, Arod would likely not change his approach , and instead of trying to poke a ball to the right side, would still try to hit a rope to left field.
Making a productive out and sacrificing an opportunity for a hit or RBI while putting your next teammate in a better position for that same RBI – thats what people who watch the game notice about players like A Rod and Sheffield, and thats why Jeter – for all his puny stats and silly bunts – will always be looked at as a team player
So because Alex Rodriguez is a better hitter than Derek Jeter, he’s a “me first” player? Yeah, he’s really “me first” with his 616 RBI in his 5 seasons with the Yankees (123.2 a year). I guess all those guys A-Rod drove in were clones or ghost runners?
That situation you listed is semi-ridiculous because A-Rod and Sheff are two of the better RBI guys of the last decade. Why should they sacrifice themselves or change their approaches when they’re fully capable of bringing in the run with a hit or a homer? Alex Rodriguez will go down as one of the best hitters in baseball history. Why should he change his approach? In your situation, would you rather he ground out to second while trying to get the runner to third or get a base hit that would most likely score the guy? Hmm…
Jeter doesn’t have puny stats. A case could be made that he’s one of the best hitting shortstops ever.
Thanks for eloquently shredding that post so that I didn’t even have to attempt to.
Jeter is in the conversation after A-Rod and Wagner.
But what’s better: hitting that homer with a guy on, or wasting ability to bunt for the chance that a run scores?
He definately opted-out last year knowing he had to sign a new, long-term contract before this surfaced. If he finished out his last contract, then went shopping for a new one, and these charges surfaced, he would have never got that deal. What a complete jackass
Yes ARod KNEW that confidential, private information that no one should have talked about would be leaked to the public?
Maybe he can tell me what lottos number will come up so i can get some money
It had to be gnawing at him, Zach. When that kind of informations is out there you have to think eventually it will come out. You think he gets the contract he got if this was public knowledge. Not a chance. That is the ugliness of this whole thing.
I mean he didn’t end up shopping for any contract. But thats a bit much knowing that confidential info would leak, and it wouldn’t be during last offseason
The next New York Post headline: A-ROIDS.
Every aspect of the New York Post shows that it has the mental ability of a second grader.
Na. NY Post- Alex Roidriguez.
New Sterling home run call where he goes “A ‘Roid Rocket from A-Rod”?
Lets be honest – the Yanks must have suspected something would come out about ARod and others all this time, as they are the biggest part of a multi-Billion dollar, collusional industry.
Remember the Dodgers quotes about LoDuca in 2005 from their org meetings? To think similar Arod gossip was not shared by the Yanks during their meetings, especially concerning allegations by Canseco, the Rangers team itself, his physical appearance etc. would be naive.
Business as usual