Tarnished forever

Disappointment
The Selena Roberts question

Buster Olney opines on the A-Rod fiasco and feels that the Yanks’ third baseman is tarnished forever. Kiss the Hall good bye. Kiss the MVP awards good bye. From here on in, he’s simply A-Roid until death do us part. It’s not fair; it might not even be accurate; but now that the media has decided to pass judgment on a scandal it collectively ignored for the better part of a decade, that’s the way things are in the wonderful world of baseball.

Disappointment
The Selena Roberts question
  • tripp

    Were any of the other 100 names on the list leaked?

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      (For the zillionth time) The reporter was doing a story on Alex. The other names will come out as part of the Bonds perjury trial.

      What kind of defense is that anyway? Is that the “Everyone else was speeding” defense? Try that on a Cop or a Judge and see how you do.

      • Tripp

        Steve, thank you for your informed response. I’ve only been able to put bits and pieces of this story together simply because I’ve been busy. I haven’t been glued to the major news networks or your site trying to get down to exactly what Alex Rodriquez does with his life.

        How do you pull a single defense of Arod out of my simple question? Relax, its like you’re about to explode.

        • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

          Sorry for the tone, you didn’t deserve that. Its the zillionth time for me, I’ve been following this since about 10:30 AM on Sat, when it broke.

      • Zack

        the government only had the right to take 5 names on the list, not 104. so why are all the names coming out in court? There will be more leaks (hopefully) but i cant imagine that list is going to read in the middle of court or a press conference or something.

  • Zack

    although i agreed that the media turned an eye to steroids, they are also the major reason (mcgwire’s andro, book of shadows, etc) why MLB has tests and everything now

  • Yankees=warriors

    Can’t say I blame them.

    • Reggie C.

      I wonder if this calls into question Mark Teixeira’s Rangers career… Seems like PEDs saturated that clubhouse.

      • Rich

        To do so n the absence of evidence that establishes that Teixeira has taken PEDs would be a return to the days of Sen. Joe McCarthy’s red baiting.

        I mean, facts still matter, right?

      • Mike Pop

        If Tex is in the report, I think I will cry lol.

  • AMS223

    heres a question….arod plays out his contract and still puts up his numbers gets us a ring etc does #13 still get retired in monument park, or is that out? The Yanks could defend with the bs “it was in 2003” but what do you all think?

    • Mike W.

      I don’t think there is any question that if all that happens the number will still get retired.

      • Mike Pop

        What about HOF? If he really gets left out because of this I will be very dissapointed.

        • Zack

          he wont be eligible for the HoF for probably 14 years from now. who knows what happens, what if more names are released, what if cal ripken, tony gwynn, or ricky henderson took grennies or something? or smoltz or maddux or randy johnson took something? HoF is so far down the road its no telling whats going to happen

  • Rich

    Rightly or wrongly, Olney is expressing the viewpoint of a lot people, in particular, the media types who will vote on awards and HoF inductions.

    Ironically, this steroid revelation can provide A-Rod with an opportunity to change the way he presents himself to the media and the public. Instead of acting aloof and self-consumed (at least according to reports, since I have never met the guy), he needs to present himself as an ordinary person, who like everyone else makes mistakes, but who also has the courage to admit it.

    In order to do that, he has to be open and honest (or a very close approximation thereof) about his past PED usage. If A-Rod has any chance at redemption (I don’t think it’s totally impossible over time), it will be because he shows contrition, and promises that he will demonstrate a unprecedented level of transparency in drug testing going forward (even if the MLPA objects).

    Obviously, there will always be the haters, but reasonable people may be willing to give him a second chance if comes across as genuine, rather than insulting people’s intelligence by lying or by lawyering up.

    If freedom is just another word for nothing left to lose, having lost everything but his money, A-Rod now has the freedom to be himself, while understanding that if people don’t forgive him, it’s on them.

    • Stryker

      i know that jason giambi is no alex rodriguez – but when he seemingly “came clean” about everything in ’05 (is that right? seems later than that..) it kind of put him on the right side of things. i think, like you, Rich, that a-rod just needs to let it all out. fess up to what he did, etc. then go on with the game. he’s a phenomenal player with or without the use of PEDs.

      let’s just get back to the game we all love.

  • Ray

    Here’s what I don’t get.

    The leak regarding A-rod’s steroid usage was from 2003. At that time, by allowing players to use steroids indiscriminately, baseball essentially approved player usage of the substances (as did the government. I don’t remember any Congerssional hearing about bodybuilders.). We have no further evidence that A-rod used steroids after 2003, so how can we judge him with the standards of 2009?

    • r.w.g.

      All the players that still want to use PEDs are probably using HGH now. I don’t know how the stuff works or if it even works, but MLB doesn’t test for it because the test is easy to beat. The stuff isn’t detectable unless the test comes within several days of use.

      So I think it is really naive to assume he’s been clean since 2003. Maybe he’s just cycling and stacking differently in the off-season, like I’m sure tons of other players are doing.

      • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

        I read an IOC report that stated there’s no conclusive evidence that HGH does anything for performance enhancement.

        You can still argue that its cheating, because the player involved is attempting to get an unfair edge. Just like corked bats have been tested an found to be no different than using a lighter bat, yet corked bats are still illegal.

        • Zack

          HGH doesnt help a player? ok maybe it doesnt make you stronger, but if it heals an elbow or hamstring – that’s not a performance enhancer? enchances the performance of his body

    • The Scout

      Many of the substances were illegal then without a physician’s prescription, whether or not baseball looked the other way or Congress disregarded the issue. The player’s union strongly resisted the first efforts to police usage, too.

      • Ray

        I know it was illegal. My point is that people are all up in arms about the disrespect for the game and fans. If at the time everyone was doing it and nobody was being prosecuted for it, maybe it shouldn’t be viewed as insidiously as Olney and others are making it out to be. If we knew that he was using something today, after the circus that this has become, then yeah, he thumbing his nose at the history of the game. However, I don’t know that we can say that about someone who used in 2003.

      • Chris

        Cocaine is illegal and no one seems to be concerned about how it may (or may not) have tarnished Paul Molitor’s legacy.

        • Stryker

          because cocaine didn’t give him a positive edge over other ball players.

  • http://baseballbeat.wordpress.com/ Baseball Beat

    I hope he comes out and comes clean, so we can focus a little bit on baseball during spring training.

  • VOIII

    You know I was thinking about this…Is it possible that A-Rod becomes a victim in all of this? Is it possible that he is viewed as being targeted just because of who he is. There were 104 names on a list that was supposed to be confidential and a list that was supposed to be destroyed. Where are any of the other names? Who are the sources? why did they come out now?
    A-Rod is not a perfect human being and he has some issues with all of the pressure that is being the games best player… Does this mean he deserves this? Hell no…Yes he makes ridiculous money for playing a game, and he has all this God given talent. However, that does not by itself give everyone who does not have these gifts the right to paste a giant bullseye on A-Rods back.
    Even if all this is true, there were 104 names on the list and I suspect that many more were using. This is an attempt to get better at what they do by taking short cuts, nothing more. It does not cheat the sport, it does not cheat the fans… If a guy who is taking steriods hits a 500 foot homerun off a pitcher taking steriod who throws 100 mph, Who benefits from taking the steriods? If you were playing today and you knew that your competition was using PEDs and your paycheck was dependant on performing against the guys who you knew or suspected were using, would you use too? be honest….

    • Mike W.

      I think that the reason that it doesn’t matter who the other names on the list are is that they are not considered the best all around player in the game of baseball today, and quite possibly all time. People think that at the end of his career, AROD was going to be considered the greatest player to ever play the game. There is a serious problem when the greatest player to ever play your game used illegal drugs to gain an advantage over other players….

      • VOIII

        How do we know that Manny, Pulholz, Texierra, Pedro, Smoltz etc… are not on that list? If they are/were using why shouldn’t A-Rod use? Why should he let them enjoy a competitive advantage? Why should he be the only one singled out on a 104 name list?

        • Mike Pop

          Cause it’s Arod’s fault.

  • http://carlosechevarria.blogspot.com Carlos Echevarria

    Buster Olney is a Red Sox loving hack of a “reporter”, just like the entire ESPN network.

    Yes, A-Rod needs to come out and clean the slate.

    But he is a Yankee, we are a FAMILY, we clean our own Laundry….

    • The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

      You’re not a Yankee.

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      You couldn’t be more wrong. Buster is a 1st rate reporter who always give the Yankee side of the story a fair representation. He’s also a fave around here.

      • http://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/group.php?gid=43434432275 Ace

        I agree. The Last Night of the Yankee Dynasty is one of the best baseball books I have ever read. I read it every spring to get me pumped for the season.

    • Jay CT

      This is a terrible post.

      1. You aren’t a Yankee. You do not wash anyone’s laundry except your own.

      2. Olney is a great reporter. He may not draft a good under 40 million dollar team, but he is a great reporter.

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

        Dude, John Baker in the 16th round! Nevermind that Chris Iannetta and Miguel Montero and MAtt Wieters were still on the board.

        • Mike Pop

          Iannetta over Montero, yes or no?

          • Jay CT

            In fantasy baseball, yes. In that league where hitters are hitting in Petco, I would still say yes.

        • Jay CT

          I believe Gallardo went undrafted and I would take him over Lee, which he passed up some great hitters for. Shin Soo Choo? Really?

  • http://myspace.com/lincolnsworld Link

    Yeah, Buster is good. I think its safe to say that if Alex doesn’t show contrition for this, if you thought he got booed before….

  • MattG

    When I first heard a journalist or radio host call steroid use cheating, I thought, “It’s not cheating. Its going too far, but its not cheating.” Still to this day, I can’t think of steriod use pre-2004 as cheating.

    In my mind, for it to be cheating, it needs to be formally stipulated as against the rules.

    But that’s just a technicality. The real reason I cannot think of steroids as cheating is that steroids are a (un)natural evolution of training. It is the next logical thing to do, once you have maxed out your training regiment. These being professional athletes, they put it their 40 hours a week on their body. Much like I am always learning new technologies so I can do my job better, they are always looking to get a little leaner, quicker, sharper, but whatever means.

    A human mind can rationalize anything. For example, a huge percentage of people exceed the speed limit, and we all think its okay for whatever reason. Professional athletes will rationalize steroid use, especially pre-2004, because its what people DO.

    I do not care one bit for any steroid use that occurred pre-2004. I do not fault any player for making the mistake of using steroids. Baseball players are generally not smart people, and even smart people lack the perspective to avoid rationalizing mistakes in their own lives. Add to this the fact that probably some enormous percentage of players were doing it at every level, and it seems to be just part of the job preparation. I have greater respect for those that did not use steroids (like I could know who they are), but my opinion of those that did is unchanged. This includes McGwire, Palmeiro, Bonds, and so forth.

    What’s more, it is hard for me to understand how their accomplishments are erased. The list from the Mitchell report included players of all skill levels–much like the current makeup of the player pool. Alex Rodriguez was the best player in the country coming out of high school. Barry Bonds was a great player when he weighed 180 lbs. McGwire was phenomenal as a rookie. It just doesn’t appear that steroids do very much for a player, there is no evidence to support this conclusion.

    These writers and hosts that lambaste the players that are caught are too righteous, too pompous, and all too super-human. I hope someone will one day develop a drug (opium?) that makes you a better writer/host. Let’s see how many of Olney, Lupica, Franscesa et al. end up using it.

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      In your world, everyone would have to use steroids and risk their long term health in order to compete. The new level playing field would be one where everyone uses drugs that harm their long term health. That’s a little too Roman Gladiator-esque in a civilized society, and too high of a price for us fans to expect from our performers for us to be entertained.

      • Todd

        I think he is referring to the judgement of others, not the actual act itself. Also, there is ZERO evidence linking steroids in adult men to long term health issues (please do your homework before you refute this). Another commonly accepted lie perpetuated by mainstream media.

    • Jay CT

      I just got a speeding ticket. Those people are not doing the wrong things, as cars have evolved more then the speed limit has!!! I have to go to court for going 64 in a 40. How fucked up is that!!!!

      • Chris

        That’s a different situation, because there are defined rules and punishments. Pre-2003, there was not a list of banned substances and there was no testing (and obviously no penalties). There was only a vague statement about taking illegal PEDs was against the rules in baseball.

        That would be sort of like a speed limit “Don’t go too fast”. And if we catch you going too fast, we won’t do anything about it.

    • Todd

      “These writers and hosts that lambaste the players that are caught are too righteous, too pompous, and all too super-human. I hope someone will one day develop a drug (opium?) that makes you a better writer/host. Let’s see how many of Olney, Lupica, Franscesa et al. end up using it.”

      Amen brother. Especially when you consider the money at stake. Given the opportunity to make your family rich for generations, how many of us would make the “RIGHT” decision. I would HOPE that I would…

      Also, there is a “drug” for journalists. It is called “unnamed sources;” using each other’s reports or quotes with out checking the veracity (which at times only perpetuates lies);, choosing to not cover a story out of fear of upsetting stakeholders and sponsors; etc.

  • Mike Pop
  • Jay CT

    I think ARod needs to come out and throw himself to the mercy of the fans. He needs to cop to it all, saying that he only wanted to help his team win in 2003 and that he was stuck in a losing situation and that he was only trying to help his team. I think he just needs to say that he was wrong, and that he will try for the rest of his career to make this right, and is willing to take a test at any point at any time (which of course he won’t, as the union won’t allow it).

    I think Ben said it right and best though; I have a two year old son and I think the only person in baseball I would like him to “admire” is Pujols as ARod is now not only an adulterer, but a cheater as well.

    • Stryker

      ABSOLUTELY agree with you.

  • Paulie

    In the end Alex will still be playing baseball for the New York Yankees, he will still be my favorite player and I will still be rooting for him.

    • Mike Pop

      I’m right there with you.

    • Jay CT

      I have said this before. They can all inject themselves with lighter fluid and light themselves on fire for all I care. As long as they win, thats all that matters.

    • Zack

      we have 9 more years of him so we better not boo him for 9yrs

  • http://asportsaddictneedsdivineintervention.blogspot.com/ E-ROC

    A-Rod should sue whom ever leaked his name!

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