Jun
25
Olney: Non-Cliff Lee pieces are a good fit for the Yankees
ByThe trade rumor circuit is starting to pick up the pace, but as much as we might want to see Cliff Lee in pinstripes, Buster Olney says the Yankees just aren’t focusing on him right now. Despite Javy Vazquez‘s early season suckiness and A.J. Burnett‘s more recent suckiness, the Yanks’ starters have still pitched to a 4.22 xFIP this season, the third best mark in the league. Their ERA is even shinier at 3.82. At this point, Lee is nothing more than a luxury. Another bullpen arm and some bench help should be higher up on the priority list.
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Buster’s really breaking some big news. Where does he get this fantastic info? The worst part is, Buster will probably, 2x a week mention that the Yankees aren’t in on Lee. We get it, we expected it, and until something changes, Olney should focus on actual news.
This. Oddly similar to how the Yankees weren’t in on Roy Halladay last year either…when they had a championship rotation. Huge news.
Actually, last year they had a spot for Halladay with really only 3 set starter plus Joba as a 4th with an inning limit. The 5th spot was pretty open with Wang/Mitre/Gaudin pitching.
This year the Yankees have 5 legitimate pitchers, so there is even less of a need to add Lee.
They may have had a spot for him, but the point was they didn’t have a need for him. It was obvious that the Yankees weren’t about to trade prospects AND sign him to a long-term extension; just as it is this year with Cliff Lee. Even more so as you said.
The Yankees don’t trade top prospects for the opportunity to sign players to $100 + million contracts just for the hell of it.
Except the offered prospects for him after the season and would have given an extension. But besides that, you’re right.
they really need a good righty reliever
i say bring up ivan nova again and let him play more often. i’m sure many would disagree, but he could easily be better than CHoP, and really impressed me when he pitched earlier in the season
RHP Relievers
Joba
Robertson
Aceves(injured)Park
Mitre
Gaudin
Albaladejo
Melancon
Romulo
Nova
Hirsh
Brackman (h/t Nostra-Artist)
another dark-horse candidate I’ll unveil in a second*
I think we can find 4 good righty relievers out of that group of 12 (not counting Aceves). And 4 is all we need; Mo + 4 RHP + 2 LHP = one solid bullpen. I’m more concerned with finding two good lefty relievers out of the following group of five:
LHP Relievers
Marte
Logan
Ring
Igawa
De La Rosa
I think we need to be examining the lefty reliever trade market, not the righty one. JMHO.
—————
The co-dark horse candidate, along with Brackman, to get fast tracked into the 2010 Yankee bullpen if he continues to maintain his excellent K/9 rate? Tim Norton.
Yeah, that’s right.
He’s already 27, he’s always had great stuff but only been delayed due to injuries, but he’s now healthy and throwing gas again. Across Tampa and Trenton, he’s got a 41/5 K/BB, a 1.32 ERA, and a 0.841 WHIP this year in 27.1 innings. I’d love to see him bumped up to Scranton in the next month to see if he can do what he’s doing to AAA vets. Joining the pen in September and making a cameo wouldn’t be the craziest thing in the world.
You really want to see Brackman bumped up into the Yankees’ pen? Seems a bit of a waste a la Jobber.
Let me be clear: I have no problem whatsoever with the Yankees, or any other team for that matter, maximizing the value of their young pitching prospects AND getting their prospects feet wet by debuting them in the big league bullpen.
It’s a sound and time-tested strategy.
I only have a problem with the Yankees (or other teams) KEEPING those prospects in the bullpen. The fact that I think Andrew Brackman could be a great addition to the 2010 Yankee bullpen does not mean I want him to be a reliever for the rest of his life. On Opening Day 2011, I fully expect him to be in the Scranton rotation.
What the Yankees did with Joba in 2007 was perfectly fine. It’s what they did with him in 2009 and 2010 that was stupid.
True. But with Brackman, it seems like it would stunt his development. He’s having a brilliant rennaissance season. I wouldn’t want to waste time in his development by having him languish in the Yankees’ pen.
Also, the Yankees have made me rather paranoid with regards to starters in the bullpen.
You have a point.
I was really only talking about September for Brackmeezy. He’d probably be close to getting shut down at that point anyway (plus, his minor league season would end).
true. if he hasn’t been shut down once his MiL season ends why not bring him up when rosters expand? dude’s already on the 40 man and if he has innings to spare why let him go home and do nothing til he starts his offseason regiment when he can get some experience in low leverage situations ion the bigs
dude’s already on the 40 man and if he has innings to spare why let him go home and do nothing til he starts his offseason regiment when he can get some experience in low leverage situations ion the bigs
This guy knows what I’m talking about.
Nostra is gonna be so pumped to see us on the Brackman to the Pen (TEMPORARILY) Bangwagon™.
This situation I could see. Why not?
exactly. it’s science. you can’t fight science.
I’m a man who built the Eiffel Tower out of metal, and brawn. That’s the kind of man I am.
Also, the Yankees have made me rather paranoid with regards to starters in the bullpen.
the thing about this, though, is that while they effed up jobber they def did right by hughes with this approach…so i can’t really say that i have lost faith completely…i’m kinda confused just what to think currently
“maximizing the value of their young pitching prospects AND getting their prospects feet wet by debuting them in the big league bullpen.”
Ditto,and real old school….and effective.
wait a second, brackman is already 27??? holy shit!
yeah that makes sense. wouldn’t be a bad idea
Heh… no.
Tim Norton is 27. Andrew Brackman is 24, he turns 25 in December.
ha ok good, you had me scared there for a second
this is what i get for reading this while drinking a red balls
“this is what i get for reading this while drinking a red balls”
… nah, too easy.
red is not a color i would want my balls to be….
haha thats one of my favorite chappelle skits ever
It gives you wings!!!!!!
Go for it…you’ll hate yourself if you don’t.
No. Brackman is 24. Tim Norton is 27.
no norton
You failed to mention one more r.h.p.in Dustin Moseley(29).yanks got til thurs.to make up there mind whether to Promote him & or release him.I say,promote him,turn Chan-Ho-Park loose.
Giving up prospects for half a season of Lee would be nothing short of retarded, especially with a top rotation like the Yankees. Free agency is a different story.
I’d like to see the bullpen addressed internally and a good bench slugger or DH type traded for with low level prospects, a la 2009.
That depends entirely on which prospects, doesn’t it? Mediocre prospects and an entension window? Sign me up. Lee is awesome. That’s not going to happen, but trading for an awesome player is usually not “retarded”
That’s not going to happen
And you admit it as well. So your argument is:
“In scenarios which are totally impossible and never happen, it’s not retarded to trade prospects you have for an awesome player you don’t need and can sign for nothing but money in the next offseason.”
So you agree with his first sentence, as written? There are many, many scenarios where trading for Cliff Lee would not be “retarded”. They are probably unlikely, but I wasn’t the one making the emphatic blanket statement. I didn’t really see this as controversial and I was really just objecting to the absolutism.
sounds good to me.
Maybe not today, but if 1 month from today AJ and Vazquez continue to pitch erratically and considering Hughes is on an innings limit (and may ultimately go to the BP), Lee may well become a target.
I think it would require 1 or 2 pitchers going down with a season ending injury. Not just AJ and/or Vazquez pitching erratically.
That.
AJ and Vazquez pitching erratically is not a reason to trade for Lee. AJ and Vazquez not pitching at all because they’re out for the year with an injury, THAT’S a reason to trade for a pitcher… but not Cliff Lee.
It’s more like a reason to trade for Ted Lilly or Ian Snell or Edwin Jackson or Jake Westbrook or some cheap(er), innings eater kind of guy. CC/Pettitte/Hughes gives us the luxury of not needing to add an ace, just a reliable back end guy.
I think the bigger problem is that someone else is going to offer more for Lee than the Yankees. It’s not so much that the Yankees don’t want him, couldn’t use him, or don’t have enough to offer. The bigger issue is that there are teams that want him more and would give up a lot more to get him.
Exactly. Our need for Lee is so much lower that we’d only trade for him at steal prices, and some other team that needs Lee more will be more willing to trade for him at market rate prices.
the only way Lee would fit. the yankees would have to move Hughes to the pen &I don’t see that happening.
if we want lee next we can buy him……………tell me who can outspend us………..ill wait for that answer………..
No one can, but conceivably someone might offer him more than we feel he is worth to us. Say we offer him 19-20M a year, and someone counters with 24M a year. Could we offer 25? Sure. Would we? Probably not.
Would someone offer a pitcher $24MM a year though? Roy Halladay didn’t get that much, and even though Cliff Lee is a year younger, I don’t see a team locking a guy with some injury history up for huge money and huge years.
He’ll probably end up with more than a Burnett/Lackey deal but less than Sabathia.
He’ll probably end up with more than a Burnett/Lackey deal but less than Sabathia.
yeah i kind of figure this as well
Dear dan genovese:
Thank you for not capitalizing every letter of your post. We appreciate very much your willingness to speak civilly.
(I could ask you to knock off the ellipses, but I guess it’s baby steps, huh?)
don’t… get… carried …. away.
As much as we might not need Lee for ourselves (I’m not sure that is true for a playoff rotation that looks much better with CC, Lee, Hughes and Pettitte) I would be worried about a few teams in the playoffs if he was added to their roster.
If we could trade for him now AND have him accept a CC deal I would consider it pretty strongly.
I would also love to figure out how we could trade Vasquez and AJ to NL teams for prospects we could then send to Seattle for Lee. The return from those guys plus a Laird and Nunez should be plenty.
I would also love to figure out how we could trade Vasquez and AJ to NL teams for prospects we could then send to Seattle for Lee.
This isn’t Playstation.
I once managed to get a team, through the trading of backup players only, that consisted entirely of HOFers and that won 135 games. The Red Sox won 100 games and finished 35 games back.
If I can do it, I’m sure professional GM Brian Cashman should be able to. Unless he’s an idiot.
Solution: sign Jermaine Dye and Jarrod Washburn off the FA list, then trade them to the Royals for Grienke and Soria.
BOOM, THAT JUST HAPPENED.
why not trade brackman??? he is a bust. do you really think he will keep this up eric????? where’s your movie quote???
(not gonna lie, i kinda miss the guy)
(sips glass of lemonless lemonade)
What would lemonless lemonade taste like?
I have no idea.
SHUT UP WOMAN GET ON MY HORSE
my horse is amazing!
tastes just like raisins
http://riveraveblues.com/2010/.....ent-938681
mmmmmmmm sugarwater
this is nowhere near reality
Related: I decided to go through the postseason with the Tampa Bay Rays. My game is from 2003, so the Rays sucked.
I won the World Series with a 6.75 ERA.
I fell behind 2 games the none to the Angels in the first round. I won game 3 in extra innings and then the next two games easily.
I fell behind 3 games to 1 to the Yankees. I threw out Nick Johnson goig for a triple down by one with 2 outs in the bottom of the ninth in game 5, then one game 7 on a blown save by Mo.
I won the WS against the Cardinals in 6 games with a comeback from being down 6-0 in game 6. Oh, and I was down 1 game to none in that series.
/Totally realistic’d
GET DEWAYNE BRAZELTON ON THE PHONE RIGHT NOW!!!
Deal.
My favorite part (emphasis mine):
(counts)
Who’s the fifth starter in our rotation in that scenario?
Chad Gaudin?
HEY, SERGIO, LET”S GET THE HELL OUTTA HERE
SAID HEY, SERGIO!
Catch 22 reference. nice.
Roy Halladay!
:: head explodes ::
Step A: Trade AJ Burnett and Javier Vazquez to the Phillies for Kyle Kendrick, Domonic Brown, Antonio Bastardo, and John Mayberry Jr.
Step B: Trade Kendrick, Brown, Bastardo, Mayberry, Laird, and Nuñez to Seattle for Cliff Lee
Step C: Trade Jesus Montero and Slade Heathcott to the Phillies for Roy Halladay
Step D: Trade Nick Johnson, Curtis Granderson, Nick Swisher, Brett Gardner, Andrew Brackman, and Cito Culver to Detroit for Johnny Damon, Austin Jackson, Phil Coke, Hideki Matsui, and Bobby Abreu (just trust me, this will work somehow)
Step A: Trade AJ Burnett and Javier Vazquez to the Phillies for Kyle Kendrick, Domonic Brown, Antonio Bastardo, and John Mayberry Jr.
Step B: ????
Step C: Profit!
forget”Lee”for now.we need to concentrate on bench&pen
You can’t trade culver, he hasn’t been in the organization.
What are you smokin anyway????? You can’t be 4-real.hahahahahahaha.your a trip or on one…
What kind of loser worries about a 5th starter when trading for Cliff Lee?
please remove your internet tough guy hat.
Spot on response. You’re already divorced from reality; no point reconciling with it now.
We’ll make your InsanityLand trade, then petition the league to just give us an automatic win every fifth day because our front four is so awesome, we’ve earned it. Fantastic.
that squirrel sure can waterski
Mmmmm… burned my tongue.
Yeah,& im willing to bet he thinks he could walk on water.
http://www.milb.com
Check it out!
You’ll love it!
Your trade proposal sucks
fact
Joe TweetMocked it.
http://twitter.com/joepawl/status/17046011895
Not only does it suck,it sucks big time..Buster O.would luv to run with this one.
And while your at it,throw in Marcus Thames.
lol at AJ Burnett not being on the playoff rotation
You might be right if he does’nt get his act together & real soon.
The Orioles of the 1970′s were famous for bringing up minor league starters and introducing them to the majors via the bullpen. That tactic broke in some good pitchers.
Trade Romine, Nunez, and McAllister for Lee.
Just no.
Just rumors…