Open Thread: Jon Lieber


(AP Photo/Ed Betz)

Given the current state of the Yankees rotation, I guess it’s only fitting that today is the eight year anniversary of the John Lieber signing, a move similar to the recent scrap heap signings of Freddy Garcia and Bartolo Colon. Just a season removed from 21 wins and a 4.23 FIP with the Cubs, Lieber was in the process of rehabbing from Tommy John surgery when the Yankees inked him to a two-year contract knowing he’d miss the entire 2003 season. He was worth the wait though, because Lieber provided 176.2 quality innings in 2004, pitching to a 3.71 FIP with just 16 unintentional walks (0.82 uIBB/9). He also gave the team some strong starts in the postseason before signing a big fat deal with the Phillies and eventually hurting his arm again. Every once in a while one of these reclamation guys will work out, hopefully one of them does in 2011.

Here’s tonight’s open thread. The Devils, Knicks, and Nets are all in action, but you should go out, it is Friday night.

Categories : Open Thread
  • squishy jello person
    • rbizzler

      Hmmmm, no idea.

      • squishy jello person

        Tim Lincecum

        • rbizzler

          Really? Wow. The whiskers are not a good look for him.

          • icebird753

            typical pothead lol

  • http://kierstenschmidt.com Kiersten

    I’m so bored that I actually wish I was working tonight.

    Anybody have any ideas?

    • NJYankeeFan

      Knicks just started.

    • squishy jello person


  • Pat D

    After all the pitching debacles in 2004, and the fact that Lieber was pretty near the most reliable starter that year, I remember being pretty upset when they let him go to the Phillies.

    But it was all just as well since he got hurt again.

  • long time listener

    I’ll admit it. I had Lieber Fever.

  • NJYankeeFan

    I really liked Lieber. He was a real bulldog out there and had some big starts that season.

    • http://bomberbanter.com jamie

      I really thought they were going to resign Lieber – like it was a no brainer… what happened? I don’t think I ever found out.

  • Bulldozer

    Anyone else surprised Vlad got $8mm?
    Manny got $2mm!

    I swear, the Rays are going to make that Kyle Farnsworth deal look good.

    • NJYankeeFan

      That sounds just insane but it goes to show you if your a total prick you whole life like Manny, it costs you in the end.

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

        I’m pretty sure Manny’s attitude didn’t cost him anything. His salary this year was a drop in the bucket compared to his career earnings, whether he signed for $2M or $20M.

        • NJYankeeFan

          Hey don’t burst my bubble. I’d like to think that karma will bite Manny on the ass for the louse that he’s been over the years.

          • http://www.twitter.com/deanezag Zack

            Besides pushing the clubhouse guy down, what exactly has Manny done to be a prick?

            • NJYankeeFan

              He was played left field like a lazy beer league softball player, frequently dogged it running out ground balls, faked a knee injury and quit on his team against the yankees in a pennant race, slapped Youlilis in the dugout of a game once. He was kind of like the anti-Jeter when it came to the way he played the game.

              • http://www.twitter.com/deanezag Zack

                1. There are many bad defenders who are not pricks
                2. Ok, he didn’t run through the bag, that stops once guys get out of little league
                3. He hit .347/.473/.587 in July on 2008 before he was traded
                4. Everyone wants to slap Youk

                • NJYankeeFan

                  How about in 2008 in Seattle, Manny was pissed he was taken out of the game for a pinch runner so he walked out of the stadium, didn’t get on the bus and started walking back to the hotel disobeying a traffic cop in the process who almost gave him a summons for jaywalking.

                  • http://www.twitter.com/deanezag Zack

                    Disobeyed a traffic cop…wow the horror

                • NJYankeeFan

                  Or 1994 he was arrested in washington heights for drunk driving.

                  • http://www.twitter.com/deanezag Zack


                    It was actully Driving while impaired since he wasn’t over 0.10; so he he got arrested for that and pushed down a clubhouse down 14 years later = prick all of life.

                    • Teh Comp Pick

                      Ticketed for a .07!!! Gayest thing ever? Yup, gayest thing ever.

          • The Real JobaWockeeZ

            He’s been a huge ass prick to the Red Sox. I can forgive that.

      • http://www.twitter.com/deanezag Zack

        Sounds like Vlad is the one getting punished, having to play for the O’s.

        • Accent Shallow


        • NJYankeeFan

          I’ll sign up for $8 million and all the crab cakes and Boog’s BBQ you can eat.

    • LGY

      Vlad had a much better season though

  • Greg

    And just when you thought the AL East couldn’t get more crowded, The Orioles have just signed Vlad to a one year $8m deal.

    • Rey22

      Impressed he actually got the $8M his agent said someone else had offered. No way that was true.

  • NJYankeeFan

    Mike, you should do an open thread on Melido Perez. In 2002, he pitched 247 innings including 10 complete games with an ERA of 2.87, a FIP of 3.05 and a WAR of 5.9. He was never the same again, though probably because he pitched 112 innings more than the previous year and 50 more than his career high to that point. He was sure great that year, though.

  • Rivera Venue Blues

    I’m dunno why, but I’m starting to build some optimism for this season, despite Pettitte retiring. I can’t wait till we trade Bartolo Colon at the deadline for a Smoak-type bat. Who’s with me?!

  • bonestock94

    So, does Chavez break camp?

    • http://kierstenschmidt.com Kiersten

      If I had to guess, I’d say Chavez is going to break something, but it won’t be camp.

      • http://twitter.com/Paddock9652 Stratman9652

        Damn, beat me by a minute.

    • http://twitter.com/Paddock9652 Stratman9652

      I’m sure he’ll break something…

    • http://danielslifka.wordpress.com Jerome S.

      dude, that was way, way too easy.

    • bonestock94

      Haha, didn’t even occur to me.

  • nsalem

    Never understood why the Yankees would sign Lieber before his TJS but not resign hm after a successful 2004. He was quite good in 2005 and didn’t get hurt until two months into 2006. The Yankees passed on Lieber to pursue Jaret Wright possibly because Wright was coming off a
    career year in Atlanta (just like Javy!!!) and was 3 years younger then Lieber. While Lieber remained his average self Wright reverted to his injury plagued and sub par ways. They both signed identical 3 year 21 million dollar contracts. Lieber started 74 games and threw 464 innings to Wright’s 46 starts and 213 innings over the 3 years. In hindsight a poor decision.

    • Gonzo

      IIRC, they were going to sign Lieber, but Lieber surprised them and signed with the Phils. I think they had an option, and they had unwritten agreement too sign him after they turned down the option. However, the Phils came in and offered him more than what the Yanks had informally agreed to with him. He took the money and they Yanks had to go fishing.

      Not sure if that’s entrely true because this all based on my memory after two glasses of wine. What the heck.

      • nsalem

        The Yankees didn’t want to give the 3 years that Lieber was seeking and probably deserved after his 2004 performance.

        • Gonzo

          Giving a 35 year old a three year deal off of one good year. I don’t blame them.

          • nsalem

            He had many good years behind him at that point in his career and he pitched 140 more quality innings over a 3 year period than Pavano and Wright combined who were both age 29 at the time of their signings. Hindsight is 20/20 though.

            • Gonzo

              I guess. A 35 year old with fairly recent TJS surgery isn’t a hot commodity, for me at least.

    • http://kierstenschmidt.com Kiersten

      Jaret Wright? I have no knowledge of this Jaret Wright of which you speak.

      (god damn the mid-00s were ugly)

      • nsalem

        As a 21 year old Cleveland Indian Jaret Wright beat us twice in games 2 and 5 of the ALDS. He was one of the key reasons that we didn’t win 4 rings in a row. He was dreadful or injured from 1998-2003. Had a good year in 2004 and the Yankees foolishly signed him on the basis of that good year. He quickly returned to being injured and dreadful. We traded him to the Orioles (i think) early in 2007. Wright started the final playoff game of 2006 vs the Tigers and didn’t make it through the 3rd inning. It was a sad and long night for The Yankees. I too wish I had no knowledge of Jaret Wright.

        • nsalem

          also as a 21 year old he was obnoxious and arrogant. He his attitud as his suckiness kicked in.

  • Xstar7

    Is anyone else as sick of all this Blake Griffin hype as I am?

    • Sean C

      I am a little. He’s definitely ESPN’s hype-machine target these days. However, that doesn’t change his hell-beast status.

    • Teh Comp Pick

      He looks like he is poised for a hell of a career. All time great probably not, but a hell of a player. Real quick off of the top of my head. MLB player he is comparable too….Evan Longoria!!!!11

  • MikeD

    Great timing for naming tonight’s open thread “Jon Leiber.” Just read that the Yankees have also invited Leiber to camp.

    • http://kierstenschmidt.com Kiersten


    • MikeD

      Okay, go ahead and admit it. Some of you went ahead and checked to see Lieber really was invited to camp.

      I guess I also should spell his name correctly. That whole, “I Before E, except after an L in the last name of Yankee pitcher” rule always confused me.

    • squishy jello person


  • Joltin’ Joe

    John Lieber is from my town and just about the nicest guy you could meet. My friend (a phillies fan) bought a bar two years ago and this past Summer John came back for an appearance. We sat with him at a table and had a few beers. Close to the end of the night John asked us who is the Phillies fan. I thought to myself oh here we go I’m in for 30 mins of Phillie love. My friend cockily said “I am”, John replied “I’m sorry everything about that town sucks” and proceeded to berate the team the the town the stadium and the food. Then looked at me and said “the Yankees now that’s a quality organization”

    • MikeD

      HA. I wish he had had a conversation with Cliff Lee.

      • Joltin’ Joe

        that might have helped

    • Joltin’ Joe

      My friend and I bought a bar

      /unnecessarily explaining’d

  • http://riveraveblues.com/2010/02/2010-preseason-top-30-prospects-21281/#comment-779224 LET SBGL BACK ON BRACKMAN’S DEBUT

    Couple random points

    a few baffling questions in the chat today. Like, A-rod for d brown and hamels? really? Philly might not do that if the yankees ate 20MM per year. Another one was the Joba and Dellin for Blanton? REALLY? we would laugh in the Phils’ faces (I hope) if they offered Blanton for ONE of those two, and then ask them for the drug that they are on, even if they ate money.
    And also the one about Joba and Brien Taylor. NOT EVERY PROSPECT CAN REACH THEIR POTENTIAL.

    which brings me to my next point: If you are disappointed that the Big 3 turned into a #3 starter with potential for more, a great CF, and a solid reliever, you are insane. The whole POINT of prospects is that they DON’T ALWAYS REACH THEIR CEILING. Like, take Phil Hughes. Turned into a solid #3 starter with potential to be a great #2. At age 24. If you are disappointed by that, you might as well stop following the minors. Take Stephen Strasburg. Given CY guy, right? Goes out and gets hurt. THAT’S WHAT HAPPENS TO PROSPECTS. IT’S LIFE. If you are disappointed that ANY prospect turns into a #3 or #2, you’re crazy. And I am going to predict, right here and now, that Bryce Harper does not make a single all-star game. Yeah, I said it.

    People say “the Yanks have tons more money therefore money doesn’t matter.” THIS IS FALSE. Well, we do have a lot of money, not gonna deny that, but that doesn’t mean you can just blow a ton of money. Sure, you can just say it’s not your money, and it isn’t, but if we went out and, say, traded for Barry Zito, IT WOULD PREVENT US FROM SIGNING PLAYERS IN THE FUTURE. We as fans don’t pay for these guys, but the contracts do make us pay by watching a poorer product in the future.

    So there’s my baseball rant for the day.

    • Anthony Murillo

      While I’m 100% with you on not blowing their money away, the Yankees can afford to take a hit in their payroll because it likely won’t prevent them from acquiring whatever player they may need. We all hear that their payroll is roughl $200 million but they could easily stretch that if need be. So while the Yankees shouldn’t go out their and acquire a guy with a terrible contract (like Zito) just because they can afford his contract, they sure as hell won’t be shy in shelling out that money for a talent that they deem to be worth it (Soriano).

      As for the prospects, I’ve always felt that most prospects serve as trade chips. Am I saying that the Yankees should trade Montero, Man-Ban, Brackman, Betances, etc… for moderate talent? No. But if an elite talent becomes availble (like a Felix Hernandez) and the only thing stopping you from making the trade is one of your top prospects…you give up that top prospect.

  • Sandman42

    Not having Andy hurts for sure, I think this team is still good enough to win the world series. The problem is i’m not sure if they’re good enough to make the playoffs. On paper they are solid at 3 of the 4 aspects of the game:

    Defense- 3 good to great defensive OFs, 2 GG infielders, upgrade at catcher defensively

    Problem is of course starters. IF the yankees were to start off as 1 of the 8 teams in the playoffs, they’d be fine in short series with CC, Hughes, and unknown with their pen, offense and defense. So in this case, they’re good enough to win the WS. Issue will be making the playoffs through the grind of the season and that’s what they need to figure out between now and the trade deadline.

    Make something happen. If they can make the playoffs without their guys getting hurt or too taxed, they have as good of a shot to win as any. For now its still a big IF, but that’s why they play the games.

  • http://bosesurroundsound.net irin

    Not big on yankees fan but they have a good team and they are looking forward to a great season. I think that they can be preety good this year, hope they win although it’s pretty good for the city.