Open Thread: Moneyball

June 17, 2011 by Michael Axisa 102 Comments

So apparently they finally did go ahead and turn Michael Lewis’ Moneyball into a movie. I remember hearing that the idea got shelved a few times before I stopped caring (not that I did much in the first place), but apparently it got the green light at some point and there’s a trailer. I dunno, seems a little too dramatic for me. Slow motion bat flips after drawing a walk? Magic Scott Hatteberg homers? And is that David Justice playing himself? I don’t know about you guys, but I’ll stick this one in the Netflix queue rather than run out and go see in theatres. I suspect the book will be far better than film, which is usually the case.

Anyway, here is tonight’s open thread. The Mets are at home playing the Angels (Pineiro vs. Capuano) plus the MLB Network will carry a game (teams depend on where you live). It’s Friday night though, I suggest getting the hell out of the house. Use this thread to talk about whatever you want in the meantime.

bakekrukow412

I like the “Buy the best players” philosophy much better than Moneyball. Makes the offseason and trade deadline much more entertaining ;)
http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21

But Billy Beane invented sabrmetrics!!!

/Cowherd’d
Jeff in LA

I’m sure that the scouting community will love being portrayed as dotering old men who rate players by how hot their girlfriends are.
- Steve S.
  
  That’s often the problem with Hollywood. Its heavy on the narrative, white hats vs black hats, and light on nuance, or even just the facts. I bet they don’t even get the SABR stuff remotely correct.
  
  I’m with Mike, I’ll wait for Netflix.
http://www.youcantpredictbaseball.com bexarama

I think I’m the only one who really wants to see Moneyball. It’s dramatic in the trailer, sure, but most movie people aren’t baseball nerds like all of us ;P
- Operation Slade
  
  I want to see it, I loved the book and actually the book Theology is another good baseball read too. I know its about Epstein and all but actually I found it a good read.
- JCK
  
  I’ll see it because Aaron Sorkin can (usually) write really well.
  
  But the old-man scouts scene did seem like a bit much…
BigBlueAL

Im sure “Moneyball” wont top “Major League” as greatest baseball movie ever.
- Steve S.
  
  I doubt Susan Sarandon will be nailing Beane, Podesta and getting Ricchardi to bust out of his slump. If for no other reason, she must be pushing 65 and might break a hip.
http://kierstenschmidt.com Kiersten

Jonah Hill? That’s hilarious. Would not have called that one.
http://kierstenschmidt.com Kiersten

And no, this guy is playing David Justice. That’s raycess.

Here’s Jorge Posada.
- http://www.youcantpredictbaseball.com bexarama
  
  Why is Jorge Posada even in Moneyball?
  - http://kierstenschmidt.com Kiersten
    
    Tagging out Jeremy Giambi at the end of the movie?
    
    ZING!
    - Brooklyn Ed
      
      then whose gonna play Jeter? hmm…
      - http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21
        
        Himself of course. Derek Jeter is a biracial angel!!!!!
        
        Brooklyn Ed
        
        thought they might use the actual footage of the flip, now let’s see if they act it out right.
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder
    
    Laura Posada: Salma Hayek?
    - Esteban
      
      A friend’s neighbor is apparently friends with the Posadas and hangs out with them sometimes (and showed photos to prove it). I need to find a way to get myself invited to something with them.
      - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder
        
        I wonder if they have towels in their bathrooms.
    - LA Sean
      
      My uncle is actually in this movie. Hes a coach hitting fungos in the infield.
Berk

It looks good….I can’t wait for the part where Derek Jeter crushes their dreams with The Flip, and then we sign their best player, who is then later revealed to be a steroid user, and then they suck again. What…you don’t think they’ll show that part?
- JohnnyC
  
  Can’t think of another instance of a general manager who gets a piece of the team for not winning the World Series. Cashman should have his agent look into that.
- http://www.youcantpredictbaseball.com bexarama
  
  I know you’re kidding but I read what was supposedly the script, and the part about the Yankees signing Giambi is pretty huge actually.
- Esteban
  
  And then they can show how teams like the Red Sox adopted similar strategies and it worked and they won.
http://twitter.com/bryanl26 Bryan

Look’s kinda dramatic, but when are trailers not?

I’ll probably go see it in theaters. Feels like it’s worth it.
Crime Dog

Why is DePodesta’s name not in the movie?
- http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21
  
  He did not agree with the hollywood interpretation of his character and did not allow them to use his name.
  - Crime Dog
    
    “hollywood interpretation” meaning Jonah Hill was too fat for him? #Maybetrue
    - http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21
      
      http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ne.....ball080510
http://www.twitter.com/ngoral Jake LaMotta’s Left Hook

My former high school was in the news today, the class of 2011 did their senior prank, then all hell brook loose. Students through bottles out of windows and fights broke out in the cafeteria. 20 or so students received citations, can’t walk at graduation, and have to take finals in September. Ouch.
- http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21
  
  What was the prank?
  - pat
    
    Real life reenactment of the fight from Anchomran. Jake LaMotta’s Left Hook killed a guy.
    - http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21
      
      Boy, that escalated quickly. I mean, that really got out of hand fast!
      - Foghorn Leghorn
        
        I’m proud of you fellas. You all kept your head on a swivel, and that’s what you gotta do when you find yourself in a vicious cock fight.
- It’sATarp
  
  What was the prank?
- Esteban
  
  I hate to do this, but I will because this is this 3rd time I’ve seen it today on various intertube sites. “Students *threw* (not *through*) bottles out of windows”.
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder
    
    No, he’s saying that students went through windows while inside of bottles.
    - Esteban
      
      “Honey I Shrank the Kids: High School Edition”
- JMK
  
  Threwout this story I wondered how strong the English program was.
vinny-b

and they still didn’t win a Championship.

sabrametics, like anything else in life can be taken too far.

_
- Esteban
  
  But the Red Sox did, the Yankees have, and the A’s won between 87 and 103 games from 2000-2006. Sabermetrics doesn’t guarantee anything, but neither does ‘traditional’ methods.
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder
    
    Only one thing guarantees success: heart.
    
    Sincerely,
    Nomar Garciaparra
- Steve S.
  
  Selma Hayek’s sabrametrics is 44-C cup.
  - Mister Delaware
    
    Not especially hot in person. Swear. And her kid’s poops smell worse than normal kid poops.
http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder

Royce Clayton is playing Miguel Tejada.

Something is hilarious about that, and I’m not sure what it is.
- Brooklyn Ed
  
  a former big leaguer fulfilling a role that he wish he had the type of season? hmm..
- http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa
  
  Wait, seriously?
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder
    
    He’s listed in the IMDB credits, and it’s not an actor also named Royce Clayton. It’s the genuine article.
    
    http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1227198/
    
    Note his other listed credits: “1997 MLB AllStar Game, playing himself”.
  - http://facebook.com/andrewjcalagna Drew
    
    yeah according to IMDB Clayton is Miguel Tejada.
- JMK
  
  This is from Royce Clayton’s website (http://royceclayton.com/):
  
  Royce Clayton is one of the premier baseball players of our time and a role model for athletes around the world. He played 2,103 games as shortstop for 11 pro ball teams, culminating with the 2007 World Series championship Boston Red Sox. His prowess and commitment has extended from the ball field to community and charity events — for which he has raised hundreds of thousands of dollars – to the business and entertainment worlds. Welcome to his world!
  
  Wait, what?
Brooklyn Ed

soo hmm, Jeff Keppinger is back out in the trade market. Last season, he was close to being traded to the Yanks. I wonder if Cashman will go after him again, or fine with Nunez/Pena?
Bones

Mitchell out after 2 IP. Anyone know why?
- http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa
  
  Got hit around, threw a lot of pitches.
- boogie down
  
  His line: 2.0 IP, 4 H, 3 R, 3 ER, 3 BB, 3 K.
  
  I’m willing to bet his performance led to him throwing a bunch of pitches, and the combination of the two, especially at this early juncture, forced the manager’s hand.
http://facebook.com/andrewjcalagna Drew

I have never seen Billy Beane before in my life, but I can assure everyone that he does not look like Brad Pitt.
- http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder
  
  http://media.giantbomb.com/upl....._large.jpg
  
  He’s not Pitt, but he’s not an ugly man, either.
  
  I mean, he’s not from Boston or anything.
  - mbonzo
    
    He looks like Kevin Costner.
  - Rey22
    
    He kinda looks like Seth Macfarlane
    - JMK
      
      Looks like Jonah Hill…
  - http://twitter.com/buckfunts buckfunts
    
    Hmmm… Norm MacDonald as Billy Beane? Totally different movie.
    
    Whoa– Norm MacDonald as Sam Quint as Billy Beane– MAKE. IT. SO.
    - steven
      
      i was thinking the same thing!
http://www.retire21.org Mike R. – Retire 21

Looks like you can take the pitcher out of Toronto, but you can’t take the Toronto out of the pitcher. Marcum got slapped around.
jay h

crawford leaves game with strained hamstring.
- JMK
  
  Isn’t Youk out too?
  - Freddy Garcia’s 86 mph Heat
    
    The Sox just think Drew Sutton is a better #4 hitter than Youk.
  - jay h
    
    yea both of them. waiting for the peter gammons theory, “Yankees and other teams tamper with crawford and youk and cause injuries”
    - Foghorn Leghorn
      
      Youk left due to a stomach illnes…he went in the club house after the third to take a dump…looked in the mirror and got sick b/c he realized how ugly he was.
Monteroisdinero

So Freddy G. gave us 7 decent innings today. Other than his Boston start when he was taken out early I think he has given us 6 or more innings in every start (I could be wrong on that). Not as good as Bartolo but we should be happy with what he has given us in 2011.
- http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Ridiculous Upside the Elder
  
  http://www.baseball-reference......;year=2011
  
  He’s now made 12 starts, and he’s pitched at least six full innings in 9 of them. He’s allowed 3 runs or fewer in 8 of those 9 starts.
  
  Do I want Freddy Garcia starting a postseason game? No. Does Freddy Garcia need to be assassinated immediately, like several commenters suggest? No, he’s been eminently useful.
  - Freddy Garcia’s 86 mph Heat
    
    Favorite Freddy Garcia comment:
    
    http://riveraveblues.com/2010/.....nt-1423636
  - mbonzo
    
    I’ve been surprised how well he’s pitched, especially over the last month. I’m waiting for his LOB% to return to earth, or for his ERA to close in on his FIP, but his run won’t stop. I know to expect quality starts from the guy, but the Yankees still need to scout a replacement, because his stats are saying he’s gonna hit a brick wall soon and just fall off the horse. Thats not something I want to happen when the race tightens up in August.
  - Monteroisdinero
    
    3.63 era is pretty good regardless of what you think of his stuff.
    
    He also executed 2 sac bunts in one game (today). This is impressive too for a guy with very few abs all these years. Of course Davis has got to be one of the easiest pitchers to bunt on.
    
    I do think it is a better play to have him square and pull the bat back at the last second and let Gardy attempt a steal and then bunt him to third but Joe played it station to station early in the game. I have little faith in Nick (2-27risp) Swisher getting a hit to drive Gardy in in that situation but a grounder or sac fly is not unreasonable to expect.
    - JohnnyC
      
      That would work but Gardner very rarely runs on the first pitch. You end up just wasting a strike on the bunter. Then the opposing team can pitch out at least twice.
      - Monteroisdinero
        
        This must be fixed. If Gardner is on his own, we need to take that option away. Same goes for when Jeter bats second behind him. Have to at least have a hit and run on to stay out of the gidp with the Captain.
        
        Come on Joe-think outside the Chalupa!
        
        JohnnyC
        
        For better or worse, Joe’s pretty tolerant as a manager and gives his players free rein. He even tried to defend Gardner bunting that third strike on Monday. Said he’s 1 for 2 trying that and he’d take 50% success rate. He’s not Billy Martin for sure.
        
        Steve S.
        
        I’m old enough to remember Martin, and people would probably view him differently if they saw him in action. He made Ozzie Guillen look like a timid wallflower. He fell in love with certain relievers and doghouse that was almost impossible to break out of. He wore out his best pitchers, might have ended Catfish’s career. I loved Billy, but he was a short term fix that always ended badly, on and off the field.
        
        Pat D
        
        Always gotta look at what happened to the guys he had in Oakland.
        
        Still doesn’t change the fact that he won everywhere he went. He’s also probably better than a few managers in the HOF currently *cough*WhiteyHerzog*cough*
  - FIPster Doofus
    
    Do I want Freddy Garcia starting a postseason game? No. Does Freddy Garcia need to be assassinated immediately, like several commenters suggest? No, he’s been eminently useful.
    
    Bingo.
  - JohnnyC
    
    So we wait until the post-season and then assassinate him? Sounds like a plan.
Jake H

Only book I could never get thru and I read 60 books a year.
- Esteban
  
  I’m very important. I have many leather-bound books and my apartment smells of rich mahogany.
  - Foghorn Leghorn
    
    Oh, Baxter, you are my little gentleman. I’ll take you to foggy London town ’cause you are my little gentleman. Wow, this burrito is delicious, but it is filling.
  - themgmt
    
    10/10
- JohnnyC
  
  You can get the audio book. I believe they hired Lady Gaga to read it. I know, Michael Lewis doesn’t sound anything like her but, hey we’re trying to sell books here.
Tom Swift

Mason Williams is 2 for 2. HR and double.
- boogie down
  
  Saw that. He got $1MM+, right?
  - http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa
    
    Mason Williams is the golden child. Baseball America ranked him as the 145th best prospect in the draft. The Yankees selected him with the 145th overall pick. Signing bonus? $1.45M.
    
    Dude’s going into the Hall of Fame with 145 WAR.
    - mbonzo
      
      The new Peter Gammons of the Yankees.
    - boogie down
      
      Heh, that would be 5th all time, ahead of Cy Young (143.2), and behind Mays (154.7). Holy crap.
      - Mister Delaware
        
        Fuck that. He’s better than Mays.
Shocking Meat

The Curious Case of Billy Beane?
Pants Lendleton

i visted Nomaas for the first time since the end of 2009 season , that place is not as funny as it used to be (when they actually had phb.bb forums).

Seems like those guys are butthurt over this blog surpassing that one.
- Pat D
  
  Their content has regressed severely since about that time. The only thing they’ve been able to do of any significance is land some interviews with prospects and f.o. types, but that’s about it.
  
  And their comment section is just the very definition of the cesspool of the internet. People pretending to be tsjc and bex, people pretending to be Mike, Ben and Joe. The newest thing I noticed is a healthy amount of anti-semitism directed at Ben. It’s disgusting.
Bpdelia

Very few movies better than the book.

some huge exceptions?

Jaws
2001
Goodfellas
The godfather
Fighy club (the final scene with the pixies song where is my mind clinches this one.)
The shining.
- JohnnyC
  
  The Bible (dir: John Huston) I found the dialogue much more realistic in the movie version.
Reggie C.

Well , Cashman apparently spoke: http://www.fannation.com/truth.....ref=fromSI

Not sure if anything was taken out of context or if there was more to what he said, but Cashman appears to be ready to deal. Can’t help but feel that there’s ONLY a 50/50 shot Montero debuts in pinstripes. I mean, we know Cash has put Montero on the line for Cliff Lee.

Since names like Jered Weaver are only suspected to be available, there’s no point in getting too excited over the statement.
Greg

Just saw this name up for discussion:

Michael Cuddyer?
- http://www.yankeeanalysts.com/ Matt Imbrogno
  
  If only very, very, very cheap to DH vs. LHP.
IRF

So Cito Culver wears number 2. I hope he doesn’t plan on keeping that his whole career.
Mister Delaware

JH: “Hey, Billy, let’s fill up these empty laundry detergent bottles with beer.”

BP: “No, I’d rather go scout guys who like to take walks.”

JH: “Ok.”
Pat D

Saw this trailer today when I saw Green Lantern. Actually thought it looked interesting enough to go see it in a theater, but it really depends on when it’s released more than anything else.

What I find interesting is that looking at the IMDB page for the movie, I don’t see anyone credited as Jason Giambi, so this must just focus on the 2002 season, when they had the big winning streak. I’m disappointed because I thought Nick Swisher would figure into this at some point. Can’t understand why someone is playing Jorge, but like someone else said I can only figure that they’re going to show the tag at home plate in non-archive footage or something.
- Skye
  
  I was curious about that, too. The A’s scouting Swisher is a pretty big deal in the book, and that whole scene where they’re waiting to see if he falls to them in the draft seemed pretty important.

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