Yankees place Pineda on DL with shoulder inflammation tendinitis

Yankees announce Opening Day rotation
Update: Cesar Cabral has stress fracture in elbow

Update (12:59pm): Via Marc Carig, Brian Cashman said Pineda will be shut down for 10-15 days. That’s pretty much the only thing they can do. Cashman also said the MRI revealed no structural damage; Pineda’s labrum and rotator cuff are fine.

11:18am: Via Marc Carig and Dan Barbarisi, the Yankees are sending Michael Pineda to the 15-day DL with shoulder inflammation tendinitis. They’re obviously relieved that it isn’t anything more serious, and you should be too.

I don’t like that Pineda kept the soreness from the coaching staff and trainers, but I guess that’s what happens when you’re told you’re in a competition for a rotation spot. The Yankees plan to be very conservative according to David Waldstein, which isn’t surprising at all. Hopefully he heals up after some rest and comes out throwing darts sooner rather than later.

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Yankees announce Opening Day rotation
Update: Cesar Cabral has stress fracture in elbow
  • 42isNotMortal

    Hughes loss in velocity/DL stint last year was loosely described as right shoulder inflammation as well. It’s beginning to seem like this diagnosis is reserved for puzzled MDs and frustrated baseball people.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

      Or it could just be regular old shoulder inflammation without the conspiracy.

      • Plank

        Or maybe you’re part of the conspiracy…

        *cue organ music*

        • Ace

          Ha

      • 42isNotMortal

        Where’s the fun in that? Irrelevant comparisons help distract from the urge to overreact and strip Cash of his ninja title.

    • DM

      I’m more suspicious of Hughes, but the Pineda thing makes sense if he didn’t throw all winter. Ramiro Mendoza had the same issue b/c he wouldn’t do his prescribed work in the off-season. He’d end ST with tendonitis and thus be held back.

      Also, I can’t imagine Pineda hitting 93-94mph with a shoulder tear.

  • Greg

    This doesn’t help concerns that we got hoodwinked by the Mariners again.

    • DM

      He had a clean MRI with his physical. This is from ST work — after not pitching all winter.

      • Greg

        To be clear, I am fine with the move, but I’m talking about the oterh panic button people

    • FamousAmazingGuy

      still sore about Jay Buhner eh?

  • AC

    Better than hearing a tear or out for the year. Just get him right is the main thing. Send him to minors and let Nardi (the pitching guru) straighten this kid out. It’s either his grip on ball or not getting ontop of the FB like Cone was saying during game last night. He needs to get his fastball back. You don’t lose a 97 mhp fastball in the offseason. I’m sure it’s a little bit of both the inflammation and his mechanics. We got time.

  • Gonzo

    Can we have a truce between the “sky is falling” people and the “nothing to see here” people?

    • Plank

      When you’re a Jet you’re a Jet all the way. From your first cigarette to your last dying day.

      • Gonzo

        There’s gonna be a rumble!

      • I am not the droids you’re looking for…

        Hey officer Krupke, krup you.

  • teddy

    joba had the same injury and never recover.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

      Except he did. You just never bothered to notice because you were looking for 100 and nothing else.

      • Jamey

        Sometimes I feel like I’m the only one that remembers Joba pitching as inconsistently as a lot of young starters do while they develop before being yanked from the rotation because he wasn’t throwing 100 mph anymore & everyone was convinced pitching out of the pen would bring it back.

      • Yardisiak

        I guess it depends on your definition of recovered. He did return to pitching regularly but he clearly had diminished stuff after that day in Texas(as both a starter and reliever).

        Every pitcher is different but the joba story does give Yankee fans a bit of justified nervousness on Pineda.

      • teddy

        look at his 2010 number as a starter . compare to his 2009 numbers as a starter.

        i know 65 inning doesn’t prove much. he wasn’t the same guy in 2009 as a starter.

        he been good as a reliever though. he pitcched better than 4.40 era in 2010.

        he has not been the same guy since the injury

        • Robinson Tilapia

          Which has to do what with what?

          Two pitchers suffer shoulder inflammation and go on the DL. Even if both wound with exactly the same career arc afterwards, how would that indicative of any pattern whatsoever?

          What is a pattern is you ever having a single positive thought to say about this team.

      • Yankees N More

        Even Brian Cashman admitted, FINALLY, the JOba Chamberlain has never been the same since his injury.

        His velocity varies radically from night to night and anybody who believes he’s throwing the same slider now that he had before the injury is kidding themselves.

      • Ted Nelson

        Totally unnecessary.

  • Nick

    this sucks but people need to chill

  • Yankees N More

    “I don’t like that Pineda kept the soreness from the coaching staff and trainers.”
    ==================================
    REALLY??? This kid lost 6-8mph off his fastball overnight and DROPPED HIS ARM SLOT! And Cashman and Co. are defending their actions with, “Hey, we asked him if he was okay and he said, ‘yes.'” …

    REALLY???!!!

    • Steve (different one)

      He didn’t “lose it overnight”. This is SPRING TRAINING. It’s perfectly normal for a healthy pitcher to show up and not be at maximum velocity. The Mariners told him not to do anything all winter. So he didn’t.

      • Ted Nelson

        You know what the Mariners told him how?

    • Needed Pitching

      “This kid lost 6-8mph off his fastball ”

      going from averaging 94.2 and topping out about 97 to averaging about 91 and topping out at 94 is losing 6-8 mph???

      must be this new math I keep hearing about

  • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

    Pineda, Pettitte, Joba, Aardsma as mid-season acquisitions?

    NICE!

    • Sweet Dick Willie

      Pineda & Pettitte better be well before mid-season, or something will have gone terribly awry.

      On the other hand, Joba & Aardsma will probably well past mid-season, if at all. Anything the Yanks get out of those two in 2012 will be icing on the cake.

    • Total Dominication

      Pineda won’t be midseason, it seems hell be back pretty soon.

    • Kevin G.

      Don’t forget the DH that we’ll most likely acquire at the deadline, too.

    • Jesse

      I’m not expecting anything from Joba this year, though I hope I’ll be pleasantly surprised.

  • Jamey

    What you said about it possibly being the effect of knowing he was competing for a rotation spot, I felt when Girardi initially spoke up about Pineda not being guaranteed a spot (well before Pettitte’s return or Pineda had even thrown a pitch) that it was a ridiculous statement. Not that Pineda deserved it, but because I felt like immediately Girardi took a situation where Pineda was already facing backlash for being the return in the deal that sent a practically deified prospect in Montero out of town & made it significantly harder on him. It already created this “Oh great they traded Montero for a guy that MIGHT NOT EVEN MAKE THE TEAM!” which I think could fairly threw gasoline on the whole velocity nonsense, I mean the kid was being torn apart when he wasn’t even pitching bad.

    Like I said, not that he should have been guaranteed a spot but I just think it was moronic of Girardi to say anything about it all beyond “Obviously he has a world of talent & potential, I’m excited to see him throw” vague crap that managers usually specialize in. I think he gave birth to this idiotic panic that Montero may have been traded for a AAA starter, and I think then when Pettitte came back & Hughes started to show improvement Pineda decided to hide this soreness worrying he’d lose his rotation spot from it. Luckily it isn’t more serious, but what if he had only looked average last night? This could have turned into a very serious problem for no other reason than Girardi needlessly discussed rotation spots before spring training even started.

    • Voice of Reason

      I think it’s even more obvious than ever that the velocity concerns were not “nonsense.”

      • Jamey

        The shoulder inflammation doesn’t justify the panic that he wasn’t throwing 98 mph in March considering he was given a clean bill of health after he had already had his velocity diminish down the stretch last season.

        • Steve

          Yes, but that hasn’t been the narrative that Axisa and his sheep have been feeding. Shoulder inflamation is not the end of the world, but ganging up on people who dared question his diminished “v-lo” by saying “It’s just spring training!” clearly ended up being wrong. He isn’t throwing as hard because his shoulder isn’t right, not the nonsense that he’s ramping up his velocity or that it’s just spring, etc etc ad nauseum.

          • Needed Pitching

            except for all we know, his shoulder was fine until yesterday. The diminished velocity earlier in the spring may have had nothing to do with any shoulder injury (or he may have been hiding an injury this whole time, but that would be pure speculation at this point)

            • bpdelia

              Come on. Why cant people simply admit it was concerning. He was 5 starts in throwing 89 to 91. Something was clearly up. The sky isnt falling i think he will be fine but YHERE WAS REASON TO BE CONCERNED. as i said elsewhere even with his great slider and excellent command if he was throwing 89 to 93 coming up hes a top 40prospect but he is not the return for montero. It was the 94 topping at 97 WITH the command aWITH the size WITH the slider and peripherals that make him special. He will almost certainly be that again and the mariners didn’t know. By all accounts hes a great kid and works hard. But the refusal to admit something was up was as insane as the sky is falling crowd. An echo chamber of reaction against over reaction happens in here.

              Its important to admit when your wrong and apologize for shouting down reasonable people eith reasonable concerns.

              That is all

              • Needed Pitching

                his last few starts he was mostly sitting 90-92 and hitting 94, a drop of about 3-4 MPH from last season.
                Sure an injury could possibly explain the drop, but so could a mechanical issue (which may have led to the injury) or a lack of arm strength.

                If he was topping out at 91 in his past few starts, that would have been a major reason for concern. HE WASN’T. His fastball was topping out at 94. And we don’t even know that there was an injury problem prior to yesterday. Maybe there was, maybe there wasn’t. WE DON’T KNOW. There are other things besides injury that would reasonably explain a 3-4 mph drop in velocity. I never said there was 0 reason to think there might be an injury issue, but there was equal or more reason to suspect some other reason for the drop in velocity.

                • bpdelia

                  Im not talking about injury. Even a mechanical issue is cause for concern. Not being the pitcher he was this time last year was cause foe concern. I dont thino he is injured. I think he is going through what lots of hard throwers go through after their first go round. Little tired. Little sore. But its still concrrning. And yeah he topped out 94 but there were way too many 89 s to not at least raise eyebrows

                  • Needed Pitching

                    there’s a big difference between concern over a mechanical issue and/or tiredness, and concern over injury

                    Mechanical issues and tiredness are generally very temporary issues and not cause for anything more than minor, temporary concern.
                    Injuries are much more cause for concern since they can have a long term impact.

                    that said – of course lower velocity likely lowers his ceiling

                    • Plank

                      Mechanical issues and tiredness can cause injury, too.

          • Bo Knows

            This “narrative” of lower velocity that you so smugly call it, is a common thing for most if not all pitchers in spring training. CC averages 94 on his fb, he’s probably been sitting 91-92 while topping out at 94, hell it took him 4 regular season starts before he was sitting 94. Verlander in spring training this year was mostly in the low-mid nineties rather than his usual mid-triple digits on his fb. We even saw last night when papeldouche took the mound, he was basically around 92 mph when for his career he will average 95.

            • Sweet Dick Willie

              rather than his usual mid-triple digits on his fb

              Verlander throws 500 MPH? Call me skeptical.

              Even Sidd Finch only threw 160.

          • DM

            He didn’t have tendonitis before ST. If he’s throwing other pitches and/or has a mechanical issue, how could you be sure either? And from what I’ve read here, there were just as many people (more) freaking out prematurely — literally from his 1st inning — about the velocity issue. His MRI was clean when he got his physical. He wasn’t throwing as hard in his 1st ST start. Did you think he already had a shoulder issue back then? The only ganging up I saw was on Pineda himself from the his first sub-96 mph fastball in his first ST start.

      • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

        Are you a ‘truther’ as well?

    • Ted Nelson

      It’s semantics. He’s not guaranteed a rotation spot is vague manager speak.

  • Yankees N More

    And by the way, whatever happened to Pineda happened LAST YEAR!

    Go check out his PitchFX velocity chart throughout the year and note the complete nose dive in his final start of the 2011.

    Pineda’s velocity plummets and suddenly a guy who was completely untouchable before is available in the offseason… And Brian Cashman sends one of the single most valuable prospects in all of baseball to Seattle for their damaged goods.

    Wonderful. Just stack Pineda in the pile next to the $190 million in cancelled checks used to pay for Carl Pavano, Kei Igawa and AJ Burnett!

    • Greg

      Get him Axisa

      • Yankees N More

        There’s nothing to “get.”

        I said after Pineda’s second spring start not to be surprised when he gets shut down and/or sent for an MRI. There is NO WAY you can watch a guy dramatically lose velocity and drop his arm slot and NOT know why it’s happening. Not if you know ANYTHING about baseball.

    • Jamey

      “Pineda’s velocity plummets and suddenly a guy who was completely untouchable before is available in the offseason… And Brian Cashman sends one of the single most valuable prospects in all of baseball to Seattle for their damaged goods.”

      You do realize that Montero was also almost traded to the exact same team before an offer The M’s deemed better came along? If they were willing to deal Cliff Lee for him before he had ever taken an MLB at bat, why wouldn’t they trade their 2nd best starter for him after he had actually shown he could hit MLB pitching, no matter how small the sample size was? There’s also a huge difference between a player being “untouchable” & “not likely to be traded”, which is what I assume most teams assumed Pineda was.

      • Yankees N More

        You can’t be serious.

        You honestly don’t recognize the difference between the Mariners trading Cliff Lee when they knew he would walk at the end of a lost season and trading a young and controllable pitcher like Pineda???

        REALLY???

        • Jamey

          They were guaranteed a huge haul for Cliff Lee regardless, which means moving him for Montero means they obviously valued him very highly. Why do you think that wouldn’t put a SP that isn’t Felix in play for him when they so desperately need young hitters?

          • Yankees N More

            I think the Mariners DID value Montero highly… Everybody did. And I’m sure the Mariners haven’t stopped laughing from the moment they were able to get Montero for a broken down piece of crap like Pineda.

            • Travis L.

              So…are you even a Yankees fan or do you just troll the Yankees blogs to find ways to talk crap? Just wondering. Try to not be such a one sided, close minded turd…and just think of how great Pineda will be once this passes (just like I’m hoping Hughes will be this year). Good god man.

    • Bobby Montano

      Lol

    • STONE COLD Austin Romine

      Comments like that points to the reason why your website failed.

    • Voice of Reason

      why are the checks cancelled?

    • Jesse

      All this comment needed was a King Felix trade proposal and a “If George was here” line it would be complete.

    • Evan3457

      You mean, outside of the fact that the Mariners shut down Pineda to limit his innings, and then made his last start on, oh, 11 days rest, instead of the usual 4-5?

  • DM

    Good thing we didn’t trade Garcia 2 hours after Pettitte announced his comeback. The loogy and 5th starter competitions were settled without picking a winner. Ah, the perils of Spring Training.

    • Sweet Dick Willie

      Many people kept saying that things have a way of working themselves out.

      Guess they were right.

      While not hurting by any measure, the Yankees pitching depth isn’t what it was last week.

      • Yankees N More

        I guess… If you consider trading one of the most valuable prospects in all of baseball for somebody else’s broken down trash as “working out.”

        I have a slightly differing opinion.

        • Sweet Dick Willie

          So…. you’re saying Pineda’s career is over? That he’ll never be a top-notch starter for the Yankees?

          • Yankees N More

            I’m saying if we were going to trade Montero we should have been able to get something more than damaged goods with a ton of question marks hanging over his head.

            • Sweet Dick Willie

              You called him “somebody else’s broken down trash” and “damaged goods”.

              Sounds like you’re already casting judgment without him ever throwing a pitch in a regular season game.

              I’m guessing you didn’t read the Billy Eppler interview that Mike linked to earlier. The one about time and patience.

  • Bavarian Yankee

    I wonder if pitchers know when something is wrong with their arm/shoulder or if they can’t seperate usual soreness etc. from a real injury. I mean maybe Pineda thought everything is fine but then he realized that there’s something wrong.

    • Yankees N More

      The guy lost 6-8 mph off his fastball and dropped his arm slot. You’d have to be a complete moron not to know there was something wrong with him, which is why the Cashman nonsense about “we asked him and he said he was okay” doesn’t wash.

      • Bavarian Yankee

        yeah … that doesn’t answer my question at all. Why did you reply to me!?

      • Needed Pitching

        “The guy lost 6-8 mph off his fastball”

        somebody needs a refresher in remedial math

        • Bo Knows

          In Yankees N’ More’s world 95-91= 8!!!

    • Cdibs

      Yes and no. I was a pitcher in high school throwing mid-to-low 90s until I tore my labrum. Torn shoulders can be absolutely excruciating even when not on the mound. With my labrum tear, I was unable to cut my own food. If and when it gets to that point, you really know something is wrong. However, doctors kept saying it was tendonitis because nothing was showing up on the MRI and I was ‘too strong’ to have a tear. I knew there was something wrong, but it wasn’t diagnosed until they went in and operated.

      To shorten the story, you usually know your body best and know if something is seriously wrong or not.

  • steve s

    After reading the Pineda comments posted over several threads the past 2 days I think it’s ok for posters to express their disappointment with this guy and the Yankee decision makers and medical staff without being responded to in a way that characterizes them as trolls, or dumb or conspiracy theorists. Unless all he did was eat and not work out AFTER the Yanks gave him his physical in January the Yanks should have been all over him for being overweight before camp opened especially after the recent experiences with Joba and Hughes and not wait until camp started which is what they appeared to do. When he showed up without the velocity (a continuation of a half-year of velocity reduction) they again should have been all over him with medical tests rather than just relying on asking him “how do you feel kid” until he “confessed” his shoulder soreness last night. As to the trade itself when Seatle comes knocking on your door hot to trot for Montero the Yankee response simply should have been King Felix. So what if Seatle said no. Cashman was needlessly too quick on the trigger to make the Pineda deal as that deal would have been there even after the 2012 started and it would have given the Yankees the opportunity to have properly assessed whether there was a problem with Pineda’s second half performance before betting the house on him.

    • CW

      Disappointment is one thing, calling it the worst trade in history, asking for Cashman to be fired, and exaggerating his velocity drop are quite different.And we don’t know that Seattle would have still been willing to trade him later on or if they would have asked for more in return.

    • Needed Pitching

      ” as that deal would have been there even after the 2012 started”

      and you know this how???
      the mariners were looking for hitting (desperate for it in fact), it’s not unreasonable to think if the Yankees passed then, Seattle would have looked elsewhere to find the bat. Maybe the trade would still have been available, maybe not. It’s generally not prudent to wait until the end of spring training to figure out key spots on the roster, as the players you need may no longer be available.

      • steve s

        Seattle wanted Montero and their “desperation” is exactly why Cashman should have waited. There was not one peep about this being a case of Pineda being on the block and being shopped around the league but rather was a tremendous surprise. If Seattle had said we are going to trade Pineda elsewhere that would likely have been public knowledge by now. It’s not a great inferential leap to conclude that the Pineda would have still been on Seattle today if the January trade didn’t go down.

        • Needed Pitching

          Pineda may or may not have been traded. My point is Seattle would have looked elsewhere to find a bat. If they found that bat elsewhere (with or without trading Pineda), they likely don’t still make the trade.

          Bottom line: there is absolutely no way of knowing either way.

        • CW

          Even if, accepting a faulty premise, your inference is provably correct, the verdict on this trade can not be fairly assessed for a few years.

  • CJ

    Did Cashman make it clear to Pineda that he is not to jump on a trampoline, walk on stilts or ride a unicycle while rehabbing? He could still fall off a mechanical bull which was never explicitly prohibited.

  • Yankees N More

    By the way, for those (including the writer of this piece) who consider this to be good news… How soon we forget.

    This is the EXACT same diagnosis that Joba Chamberlain received when he tore up his shoulder in Texas. And if you’ve been following the Yankees since 2007, you know Joba has NEVER been the same from that moment on.

    http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/.....id=3522585

    • Yankees N More

      Remember how relieved we all were when we found out Joba “only” had tendinitis and was “only” going on the 15-day DL???

      Oh what good times those were.

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

        Ooo this is fun, I can cherry pick examples too. Roy Halladay had shoulder tendinitis early in his career and worked out just fine. Now your turn.

        • Yankees N More

          Mike, you’re assuming this is only shoulder tendinitis.

          Surely you recognize that the Yankees lie like crazy, especially when it comes to injuries.

          Do you REALLY believe tendinitis was the only thing wrong with Joba Chamberlain back then??? Do you REALLY believe the Yankees were “not concerned” about Phil Hughes non-existent fastball last spring???

          If your answer is no, then why should we believe them now?

          If your answer is yes, please call me about some lovely beach-front property I have for sale.

          • Robinson Tilapia

            You are a special kind of troll, my friend.

          • Alkaline

            Um. What about all the injuries on the Yankees that they obviously didn’t lie about? It’s easy to point and say Joba was diagnosed with this injury and it turned out worse, so Pineda will go through the same hardships and the team will lie to us about it!

            But then other players go get injuries, the Yanks say what it is, no one cries conspiracy, said injured player comes back, we move on.

            • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

              Shhh, you’re ruining the narrative.

              • Jd

                That or may be we should be cautious instead of critical those who are cautious.

      • Voice of Reason

        Apples and oranges, Mike. If Pineda were on the Phillies or Blue Jays he’d be Hall of Fame bound, but this is the Yankees. Joba Chamberlain is the only appropriate comparison.

        • Tyrone Sharpton

          Pineda is also Latin American. He eats churros, while say Roy Halladay eats salad and exercises all day everyday. Joba eats doughnuts however, so he is the exception.

          • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

            Rice n beans? – Flash

  • JobaWockeeZ

    TNSTAAPP still applies.

  • Yardisiak

    I think it is time the velocity doesn’t matter camp admit that the velocity was a cause for concern. Any time a pitcher has diminished stuff we should be worried. Even if it is bad mechanics or being out of shape those things lead to injury.

  • mt

    I liked the trade although was concerned that Pineda had only done it for just a year. What I never got was that Cashman did not seem to make it clear to a lot of teams that Montero was available – they seemed so shocjked that Pineda was available that they seemed to just concentrate on that before the Pineda opportunity went away. I think they really liked Pineda becauise of 2014, 2015 and 2016 budget impacts as opposed to getting a more senior solid #2 or #3 pitcher with less upside potential than Pineda with less potential impact on 2014-2016 budgets. But the the problem with younger pitchers is not just that they get injured easier but maybe more importantly – they do not know their bodies and annual routine as well.

    I always felt that this whole Pineda thing has been somewhat mishandled – I heard cashman speculating to Ian O’Connor on radio several weeks ago about “20 pounds” overweight and “maybe he did not pick up a baseball all spring because Mariners told him so” – my question was why didn’t yanks figure out exactly what he did offseason?

    No excuse for Pineda being overweight but on January 12 this kid was # 2 starter to Felix on Seattle, a former All-Star with a position gauaranteed. Then all of a sudden the next day he is with yanks and then finds out when he wals into camp that he is in competition with four people at beginning of camp. Velocity is missing and then last night we had all this focus on just this one spring training start on March 30. (which I thought was ridiculous since they had basically had given Garcia a free pass as far as spring traininbg was concerned – which they could choose to use or not uise – that “Freddy never does well in spring training”. I think Freddy surprised yanks by pitching well.)

    Also Cashman did Pineda no favors with the “I just may have traded Miguel Cabrera” talk . Even if Montero hits 35 home runs this year and drives in 120, that does not mean he is Miguel Cabrera. Why say it? Even if Montero does turn out to be Miguel Cabrera, what purpose is served this year as far as Pineda’s transition is concerned by talking about it now (all it does is put pressure on Pineda or ratchet up the media backlash) – if he truly traded turns out to have traded the next Mig Cabrera, nothing Cashman says now will make it any bettter as far as him signalling he knew that risk before hand. I did not hear Seattle constantly saying they may have traded the next righthanded CC. What long-term purpose does that talk serve?

    Then in camp all we hear about ad nauseam is he must develop a change-up and develop it now in spring training 2012. Maybe they should have focused on making sure fastball/slider from last first half was still there since this was their first time with him – he has time to develop change-up. CC said it took him five years or so to really trust it but for Pineda there was this immediate focus on his change-up. Maybe Pineda did damage to his mechanics overly focusing on that.

    I may be grasping for straws but this whole thing has had a bad vibe since the beginning. (also shouldn’t have Yanks overpraised the veteran Kuroda to take the heat off the youngster Pineda as opposed to the other way around.)

    Yanks never seem to get a good performer in a trade for starting pitching (free agency with CC and Mussina is different.) I was thinking of people like Vazquez 1 and 2, and Jeff Weaver last night. There never just seems to be an easy, good-great first year performance for any pitcher for which we trade. If someone can think of good counter-examples, please tell me (Ed Figueroa?)

    • Bo Knows

      Just ignore the fact his strikeout rate was up, walk rate stayed the same, velocity was basically identical, and his groundball percentage went up significantly, and his flyball percentage fell; all of which happened after the All-star break. Actually the only to things that increased was his homer-rate and hit rate

    • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

      Edit. I’m not reading that.

  • J. Scott

    Going back, I dunno, maybe 25 years…a great Bill James quote: When they say “tendonitis” what they really mean is “Something hurts, and we don’t know what the hell the problem is.”

  • MMMMyyyKuroda

    If I had to guess, the bad mechanics were probably the cause of the shoulder tendinitis, not the other way around.

    Pineda will be fine, not every successful athletic career looks like a bell curve straight out of your highschool math textbook.

    Can we all agree to chill out and be happy that Hughes is looking really impressive this year? Maybe?

    • Jamey

      Judging from the “consensus” only if Pineda comes back throwing 98 mph heat, even if it’s all over the place & not for strikes. If he’s not hitting those numbers on the radar gun, the only hope is that the magic amulet in the bullpen can restore his velocity, or who knows maybe it will grant Pineda even MORE velocity and he’ll be throwing gas in the 105 range!

    • Betty Lizard

      And, on the bright side, I can concentrate on enjoying seeing Karoda pitch. Love him, and I’m so excited to see him in a real game.

      (most excellent handle by the way)

  • Jerry JRC

    You can not trust the Yankees coaches and GM when it comes to pitchers injuries. Joba, Hughes and now Pineda.

    It is not just a coincidence.

    How can we get Jesus back? This will go down as one of the worst trades in MLB history!

    • Yankees N More

      Nice to see common sense is not completely lost on this board.

      Of course, this site is owned by the Yankees, so how balanced can we expect them to be?

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

        This site isn’t owned by the Yankees. I know it’s hard, but don’t be stupid.

        • Sweet Dick Willie

          I know it’s hard, but don’t be stupid.

          Judging from his comments, I think that’s asking an awful lot.

        • Bo Knows

          Mike..MIKE…you can’t ask him to stop being stupid, that’s like telling a fish to stop swimming. Stupid and paranoid is who he is dammit!! Can’t you see that!?!?

      • Needed Pitching

        Declaring this will go down as one of the worst trades in MLB history before Pineda throws an inning for the Yankees and after Montero has played all of 2 games for the Mariners is “common sense”

        I guess math isn’t the only remedial help you need.

      • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

        It’s just sponsored by the YES Network, which is owned by the Yankees.

        Wait…wut?

        • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

          You should probably familiarize yourself with what the word “sponsor” means.

    • Alkaline

      How do you know that? What happens if Pineda comes back healed and has a wonderful Yankee career?

      And at the same token, in his first catching opportunity, Montero takes a hard hit that gives him a TBI, prematurely ending his career?

      Crazy? yes. Impossible? No. Time takes time, my friend.

    • Sweet Dick Willie

      This will go down as one of the worst trades in MLB history!

      Notwithstanding the fact that Pinenda hasn’t thrown a pitch for the Yankees and Montero has all of 7 ABs for the Mariners, I’m guessing you’re too young to remember Buhner for Phelps, Nolan Ryan for Jim Fregosi, Amos Otis for Joe Foy, Lou Brock for Ernie Broglio.

      I could go on, but if you don’t get the message from those examples, what’s the use?

  • Bj

    Hey mike, I was just wondering if this will yield another year of service time, my current understanding is that it will not b/c he still accrues credit on the d/l

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

      He’ll still accrue service time while on the DL, he has to be optioned to the minors for at least 20 days to delay his free agency a year. A rehab assignment won’t count, that’s part of a DL trip.

      • Bj

        Ok cool was looking for silver lining… Insert truism re: pitching depth yada yada

    • RetroRob

      If he’s on the DL he still gets service time, but as I noted below, they can assign to AAA once he comes off the DL if that’s what they want to do. Probably will depend on a number of things, but right now my bet will be he gets sent to the minors for some time, if for no other reason than to send him a message. He wasn’t in top shape when he came to camp, and he withheld information about his shoulder.

  • RetroRob

    Hmmm, tendinitis is a word I haven’t heard used in a long time. Twenty-five/thirty years ago it was used all the time with pitchers, and it was code for “something is wrong, but we’re not sure what it is, but we hope rest will make it go away.”

    Shut this kid down like they did with Hughes, have him rest his shoulder while continuing with his conditioning program, then when he’s healthy assign him to the minors for a month or so to build back his arm (and get the benefit of pushing back his arbitration clock), and call him back up in June or July when he’s back in form. Someone else will be injured by then, or just not performing. Suddenly, having seven starters isn’t such a bad thing.

  • http://twitter.com/matt__harris Matt :: Sec110

    Soooo, CC, Kuroda, Hughes, Nova, Garcia…ok, let’s strap in and get to work boys.

  • pat

    To me this is more reminiscent of Wang than anybody else. After his foot injury the Yanks basically told him no running and no leg workouts. As a result he came into camp out of shape and behind everyone else. Because he didn’t have his legs under him he tried to overthrow everything and ended up hurting his shoulder. Unfortunately for him, he tried to gut it out until June and did some pretty bad damage to his shoulder. Thankfully we caught it early enough with MP.

  • mike

    I dont understand how the Yanks cannot get the message across to otherwise athletic people to stay in shape during the offseason….especially if they are under contract and basically at the Yanks disposal.

    its not too great an assumprion that someone weighing 10% heavier than normal, feeling the pressure to catch up once he gets to ST, will rush himself / injure himself / lie about an injury.

    IMO, i’d feel alot better about the org and its handling of young players as a whole if Joba, Hughes and now Pineda all showed up in shape and ready-to-roll

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

      They acquired Pineda three weeks before camp started. It’s not like they’ve had him since November.

    • DM

      Ask Seattle. He was on their off-season conditioning plan, not the Yankee plan.

    • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

      Everyone thought it was great to get another big, fat black pitcher.
      “He’s just like CC!!?!?!!” ” I hope he eats a lot of cap’n crunch!!&%!”

      Bunch of cuckolds here.

      • Manny’s BanWagon

        This is either a bad joke or you deserve to be banned.

  • Mike HC

    Too bad his inevitable “growing pains” didn’t happen later rather than sooner.

    It is a good thing we traded for the next 5+ years of Pineda and not just the first month of this season.

  • Teddy 2 Shoes

    The old adage proves true once again “You can never have enough pitching!”

  • Chen Meng Wang

    I was really excited to see Pineda in pinstripes…I want to be optimistic, but after the Hughes debacle last season starting the same was as this one, I can’t help but be concerned…

    • Robinson Tilapia

      Phil Hughes: Your #3 starter this year.

      • Chen Meng Wang

        And I’m super excited about that, don’t get me wrong…but at the same time you still have to be slightly weary about him. Idk, I try to be optimistic because we have a very good baseball team to root for, but I’m a pessimist and a worrier by nature, so there’s that.

        • Sweet Dick Willie

          I’m a pessimist and a worrier by nature,

          Like “fat, drunk, and stupid”, that’s no way to go through life.

          deanwormer’d

  • Fin

    There is certainly along time before the final decisions can be made on this trade. Its certainly starting off on a very bad foot for the Yankees though. Pineda is on the DL with the mysterious tendonitis, while the M’s have a major league middle of the lineup bat and a number 3 starter.
    I think it will be awhile before we see Pineda in NY. Not only does he now have 5 pitchers ahead of him, but Andy Petite should be ready about the time Pineda is. He could need a couple of injuries before he gets his shot, as I can see all of the Yankees pitchers being too effective for Pineda to just replace one. Maybe the Yankees end up trading a pitcher to get him a spot in the end.

  • vin

    “I don’t like that Pineda kept the soreness from the coaching staff and trainers, but I guess that’s what happens when you’re told you’re in a competition for a rotation spot. ”

    Exactly. As people have been saying, if a healthy Pineda doesn’t break camp as a starter, then somebody should be fired.

  • JameyJasta

    I’m personally upset with how the Yankees evaluate their young pitchers; from Wang to Hughes to Pineda. These players showed (sometimes significant) drops in velocity, coupled with flat, ineffective secondary pitches throughout the spring and yet were allowed to continue to work and pitch while injured. Thankfully, Pineda was sent for an MRI before before the season began, but it was only after HE fessed up to the Yankees that he was feeling “soreness” in his shoulder.

    In Wang and Hughes’ case, they were only properly diagnosed after getting absolutely annihilated for a few starts after the season began, even though they had shown diminished stuff during the entire spring. Please correct me if I’m wrong… but this is how I remember these situations developing.

    It’s completely obvious to the entire world that something is wrong – or may be wrong – with Pineda, Hughes and Wang, and yet they were allowed to continue pitching through the spring and into the season. I can’t help but think how long (and how badly) Pineda would have been allowed to pitch had he not spoken up, because the Yankees sure don’t seem to be proactive AT ALL about the health of their pitchers.

    Mysterious drops in velocity mean something. And even if it’s nothing… why not get an MRI just in case? Truly, what is the harm in taking precaution? What are the Yankees waiting for? At what point do you admit to yourself (if you’re Girardi and Co.) that something might be wrong? Especially after what they experienced with Hughes just last season, you would think they would be a little less in denial this time.

    You would also think (or hope) that the Yankees don’t take a player’s word for it. How many times has a player lied or held back the truth when talking about their health? My point is that I would like to see the Yankees be more proactive. These things worry me. What also worries me are quotes from Cashman saying they are “still gathering information” about Pineda and his workout routine. Did that bother anyone else? Did they not inquire about Pineda’s offseason schedule, and how he likes to prepare for the season, before they made the trade? It seems like something you’d like to know beforehand.

    PLEASE don’t respond with sarcasm just because I may disagree with your point of view. I’d like to have an intelligent discussion about it and I’m more than open to corrections to my point of view.

    • Chen Meng Wang

      I agree with you to an extent, but you have to realize sometimes soreness is just old fashion soreness and if pitchers got an MRI everytime the complained of being “sore” they’d never leave the doctors office. Obviously that’s hyperbole, but you get my point, you should be proactive in making sure your young pitchers are healthy yes but there can be a thing as being over protective. Also, it’s not like Pineda was getting bombed this spring the same way Hughes and Wang did. Though he did have a noticeable drop in velocity, he was still pitching relatively well, and to me that’s why the Yankees weren’t immediately concerned. When Hughes lost his velocity, he was getting rocked, and when Wang’s sinker flattened out he was also getting destroyed. Pineda on the other hand was still getting outs, so maybe they thought the arm strength would come with reps. Who knows, obviously we have to trust that the front office of a baseball team knows a little bit more about it’s players than it’s fans…otherwise said team would be doomed.

    • http://www.yankeeanalysts.com Eric

      “Mysterious drops in velocity mean something. And even if it’s nothing… why not get an MRI just in case? ”

      Getting a pre-emptive MRI is necessarily the best idea if Pineda wasn’t having any pain before yesterday (granted, we don’t know if that’s the case). An MRI is a highly sensitive test (will find most abnormalities) but also not very specific (ie, will have a high false positive rate). It has a very good chance of picking up asymptomatic abnormalities that aren’t affecting the pitcher, and potentially lead to unnecessary surgery/treatment to fix it. James Andrews once gave MRI’s to 31 healthy pitchers (described in the article below), and the vast majority of them (over 90%) had shoulder abnormalities. Ultimately, it is really up to the players to be honest about when they are feeling pain.

      http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10.....gewanted=1

      • JameyJasta

        Thanks. Great info.

        I guess an MRI isn’t really a precautionary tool. You just have to wait until a player has some pain and try to diagnose it then.

    • nsalem

      Very good points. However somebody who is pitching as a profession is ultimately responsible for reporting his injuries. I believe Hughes has done this several times over the past few years which is why I have my doubts he will ever live up to his potential There are plenty of players who often start slowly although they are perfectly healthy such as out first baseman. You can’t watch these guys 24/7/365 and this kind of stuff always happen.
      If you are looking to avoid sarcasm, try St. Louis. If you’re looking for intelligent conversation, no comment.

      • JameyJasta

        I’m not talking about starting slowly.

        Did you not notice that something was (or could be) very wrong with Wang in ’09 and Hughes in ’11? We’re not talking about poor performance, but reduced velocity coupled with “flat” pitches. Meaning no “life” on the fastball, no sharp break in the curveball, etc. Also reports of Pineda’s mechanics suffering possibly as a result of his injury. I’m no scout but these are things I’ve been reading.

        I’ll admit that Pineda has looked much better compared to Wang and Hughes in the past… until last night. Which is why I’m personally more confident that this was an injury that occurred very recently. Pineda looked rather sharp at times even though his velocity was down. I hope that it was diagnosed quickly and he can benefit from the rest instead of pitching through it into the season before they decide to shut him down.

        • nsalem

          This is tricky, because reduced velocity etc. usually result in poor performances. I would like to think that management is closely monitoring (especially) the pitchers. I know that Hughes has more than once, refused to report injuries and repeatedly lied about his health and he probably is not the only one. If someone keeps on insisting there is nothing wrong you eventually have to take the person at his word. I would imagine it would be something very difficult to disprove. Someone (maybe it was this post) insightfully mentioned that maybe the problem is having young pitchers compete for jobs in March is a very dangerous action. Pitching is a very fragile business and asking a young pitcher to do more than he may be capable of so early in the season is a recipe for disaster. I don’t know what the answer is but maybe this practice should be looked into. I thought people were being a little crazy in worrying so much about Pineda and I thought he was “rounding into shape”. This is good food for thought and indeed much more intellectually stimulating then listening to certain posters refer to Pineda as a bust after 4 or 5 poor March performances.

    • Fin

      I agree there was something clearly wrong with Phil last year, and dont think people were comfortable at all with him going into the season, I know I wasnt. Wang was coming back from another injury so, it was hard for outsiders to tell what was wrong with him, if anything. Pineda I think is a different story.

      Pindea was missing a couple Mph’s on his fastball, but his secondary stuff was nasty so it wasnt like he had diminished stuff across the board. He also was increasing his velocity each time out. He had pretty good results and was striking out a ton.

      It seems to me the Yankees who should have been helping deflect and ease Pineda into the pressures of NY, instead compounded the problem. First by saying he didnt have a spot in the rotation as well as all the change up stuff, over wieght, trading the next Cabrera for him ect, then by putting such a huge emphasis on yesterdays game. It seems to me Pineda felt he had to win a spot in the rotation yesterday and went out there and overthrew. He lost his mechanics and hurt his shoulder in the process.

      I think its entirely possible that he comes back a very effective pitcher in a month from now, becasue thats what he was before he overthrew yesterday. He may not get the FB back for a while but hes still good enough to be very effective.

      I’ve said all along the Yankees have handled Pineda horrendously since he got here. I could very well be wrong about how he hurt his shoulder, only Pineda knows. But the Yankees have done absolutely nothing to allow this guy to ease into NY and its gone almost as badly as possible so far.

  • your mom

    I bet Sweaty Freddy is happy to be a starter. Good for him. Thank God for our pitching depth. No sense rushing Pineda back.

  • Fin

    Hal must be having a fit. Pineda seems to be the lynch pin in that 2014 budget plan. I know there is a long time to go before then but…The Yankees probably dont have the 2013 season to see how everything plays out. They will need to make decisions next off season because of the quality of starting pitcher in FA.
    If Pineda struggles this season and never gets his velocity back, can the Yankees risk not signing a Hammels or Grienke, in hopes he turns it around like Hughes seems to have? I realize there is a long way to go and everything could turn out just fine, and hope it does, but Hal has be pretty upset right about now.

    • Manny’s BanWagon

      Pineda is certainly a big part of the 2014 plans but so too are Hughes, Nova, ManBan, Betances, Warren, Phelps and Brett Marshall all of whom could figure into the major league rotation along side CC at that time.

      • Fin

        While some of those players will contribute to the goal of 2014 payroll none are the answer that Pineda is. It is unlikely by the end of this year the yankees will know enough about Manban or Bentances to pass up on Hammels and Grienke. Phil Hughes will be a FA at the end of 2013 making him either trade bait or an expensive free agent option if he reaches top of the rotation status.
        Nova, Warren and Phelps can all be solid starting major league pitchers but I dont think many would bet they have careers at the top of a contenders rotation. As I see it, Pineda was the key to avoiding very expesnive FA top of the rotation pitching and was the main reason Montero was traded.

    • Ro

      You’re blowing it out of proportion. True there will be decisions made after the 2012 season is complete, but I’m willing to bet $1000.00 that Cashman does not present an offer to Hamels, Cain or Grienke. All for their various reasons. Pineda is allowed to struggle this season, and trust me, the Yanks have hedged themselves well for this possibility. Stop with the velocity talk. Dude was out of shape. He hit 94 a few times already. He’s fine. He needs to mature a little more, plain and simple. With that mental adjustment will come the health and physical benefits.

      As for the Yanks going forward, even if Garcia has a terrific season again, my guess is that he will have maximize his time with the Yanks and would not be resigned. I do believe they would offer Kuroda another 1 year contract, of course provided he adjust well to the AL and has a solid season. My feeling is Kuroda will really enjoy NY with all the Japanese fans around.

      I could see 2013 looking something like this
      CC
      Kuroda
      Hughes – I’m very bullish on him and my money is that he has 2 or 3 consecutive + .500 sub 4.00 ERA seasons at this point.
      Pineda
      Nova – Provided he gets through 2012
      Banuelos

      • Fin

        I’m not blowing anything out proportion. I think Pineda will be fine, just having some fun speculating that Hal is probably not real enthused right now. As far as the rest of your points go, how does Kuroda and Hughes fit into the 2014 plan? Which was my point why Hal is probably pretty worried.

  • Captain Gift Basket

    Worst…trade…ever. I still don’t understand why they rushed into this Montero-Pineda trade if Pettitte was expressing some interest in returning before it went down and they Yanks “supposedly” have young/cheap arms on the way – not too mention they still had Noesi.

    What was the rush to make this trade before spring training or the trading deadline?

  • AC

    Talk about Bard. He was throwing 98-100 1st week of spring training. Something’s ip with Pineda. Let’s get rid of the tendinitis and fix his arm slot and release point with Nardi and whomever else can help. I roukdbt bring him up until velocity comes up. Throwing 91 still shows me there’s an issue.

  • Manny’s BanWagon

    Hopefully Pineda will learn the hard way like Phil Hughes did to come to camp in shape next year. Buster Olney today said the Yankees were putting him through extra work this spring training that one official called “fat camp” which Hughes and Joba have been through before.

    I wonder if the Yankees are allowed under the CBA to have an off season conditioning program like they do in the NFL because this issue seems to be a problem with someone nearly every year.

    All we can hope for is that this season won’t be a complete loss. I do think after his rehab is done, the Yankees send him to AAA long enough to gain the extra year of control. Maybe the lost millions of dollars will serve to motivate Pineda in the future.

    • Fin

      If they leave him down there that long, I dont think it will be becasue of the extra year of control but because the 5 pitchers he is now behind are pitching too well to be replaced and/or Petite is also ready to take the place of a non performer. I’m hoping they keep him in extended ST and a couple rehab starts. I dont think the way you want him to start his career is with all of this rediculas pressure on him, followed by demoting him to AAA to travel the country non stop in a bus. The only sure thing that will accomplish is Pineda wishing he had never been traded and wanting to get as far away from NY as possible. This has been a complete mess up to this point, I hope the Yankees handle the rest of this alot better.

  • the big dumbo

    shouldve traded montero for ipk!

    • Robinson Tilapia

      Then traded IPK and Melky for Michael Pineda!

  • Zack

    An MRI would have picked up something with Pineda so stop with the damaged goods argument.

  • Ro

    Probably been said by other commenters, perhaps not, but I see this a blessing in disguise. The Yanks were in a favorable, however difficult position to fill out their starting five. Truth be told, and as much as I would love Pineda to be tossing 94 all season, he DID NEED a little maturation time in the minors. While I have no idea of him in person, just based on what I’ve read and seen (most of which has actually been good about his character) that he needs to adapt the Yankees formula. Coming into camp slightly out of shape is a perfect example of a rookie mistake, certainly fixable, he just needs a little instruction. He’ll get some of that for a few months at AAA. It gives the Yanks time to really evaluate what they’ve got in Nova (year 2) and Garcia and if he’ll be effective. Pineada and Pettitte around May 15th – June 1 is money!

    And no, if I could go back, I wouldn’t do this trade over. For as much as I wanted to see the Yanks put another superstar on the field and Montero likely will be a big player down the road, he was of absolutely zero use to the Yanks. Having Montero on the Yanks roster come opening day would have effected his value. Girardi’s formula caters better to the revolving DH. Montero would have gotten maybe 250-300 ab’s this season perhaps not playing for a week at a time depending on schedule (NL). Cashman received maximum value for Montero. Frankly, to this day the Yanks still got the better end I feel. Pineda will be important for well, I don’t know, 2013-2014-2015 when it really matters.

    • Fin

      What leads you to the conclusion that he needed time in the minors for maturation, other than he was overwieght and lost just about all of it already? Was it the fact that even with diminished velocity he was still very effective? Was that even with the yankees not doing anything to mitagate his pressure but instead piling it on, yet he was still effective? It must be that the Yankees are so good at developing top of the rotation starters that their system could work miracles for him like it did Joba and Hughes and IPK before he was traded. Really, it reads like he wasnt a Yankee last year, when he was one of the better pitchers in baseball at the age of 22, so it didnt count. I’ve never seen so much clamoring for such a talented young pitcher to be sent to the minors before, it really is amazing.
      He is going to the minors now becasue he lost his spot in the rotation through injury, and will probably have a difficult time getting back barring injury. So, you may get your wish to see the talented young pitcher who pitched a full season of MLB last year, alot of the time dominating, riding the boss across the NE, and wishing to god Seattle didnt trade him, and wanting to be as far away from the yankees org as he can get.

  • mt

    I know I had a long rant above but can anyone help me out with this:

    when was the last time Yanks traded for an above average starting pitcher and that said pitcher performed good to great in their first year with Yanks – as well or better than their last year with their old team (I say Vazquez I was a failure because of second half, Vazquez 2 of course was bad, Jeff Weaver was bad).

    Randy Johnson’s first year? Ed Figueroa?

    (I’m looking for traded pitchers, not free agent signings)

  • Manimal

    I hope they aren’t tinkering with his delivery and fucking him up like they did with AJ

  • Jimmy McNulty

    Fucking stupid trade. Took away one of the best young hitters in baseball and traded him for and injury prone piece of shit.

    • Fin

      Took away one of the best young hitters in minor league baseball with no position for one of the best young pitchers in major league baseball. There you go, now it makes sense.

      • Captain Gift Basket

        He sure wasn’t the best young pitcher in the 2nd half of last season.

    • martin is a pos

      remember martin in the playoffs? what a stud. good thing we traded montero to keep piece of shit martin.

      • Evan3457

        As Girardi was never going to allow Montero to be the regular catcher, the connection to Martin is irrelevant.

  • martin is a pos

    i cant wait till martin gets hurt and our catchers are cervelli and romine! stud hitters

    • Betty Lizard

      He went away and you hung around
      And bothered me, every night
      And when I wouldn’t go out with you
      You said things that weren’t very nice

      My boyfriend’s back and you’re gonna be in trouble
      (Hey-la-day-la my boyfriend’s back)
      You see him comin’ better cut out on the double
      (Hey-la-day-la my boyfriend’s back)
      You been spreading lies that are untrue
      (Hey-la-day-la my boyfriend’s back)
      So look out now cause he’s comin’ after you

      * * *
      You’re gonna be sorry you were ever born
      (Hey-la-day-la my boyfriend’s back)
      Cause he’s kinda big and he’s awful strong
      (Hey-la-day-la my boyfriend’s back)

      * * *
      (You’re a big man now but he’ll cut you down to size
      (Wah-ooo, wait and see)
      My boyfriend’s back he’s gonna save his reputation
      (Hey-la-day-la my boyfriend’s back)
      If I were you I’d take a permanent vacation
      (Hey-la, hey-la, my boyfriend’s back)

  • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

    “The Yankees plan to be very conservative”

    No shit. I bet they vote for Santorum or somethin’. Tss. Tss.

  • mustang

    I just can’t not after the last thread about Pineda.

    Good luck logical comments even if you don’t stand a chance.

    • Justin Maxwell’s Silver Hammer (formerly Rainbow Connection)

      English much?

      • mustang

        not enough i guess.

        lol

      • Plank

        ? ??? ????.

        • Plank

          Well, that doesn’t work. I wrote “I don’t speak English” in Hangul.

  • Moboy

    Nobody should be too mad at Pineda for not taking he’s soreness more seriously.Remeber Phil Hughes and Carl Pavano lied about there rib cage not to long ago which ended up being worse.

    Pineda is a better pitcher than Phil Hughes and he’s injury doesn’t sound as bad as people thought.So I hope Pineda comes back strong and thank goodness we kept Grcia.

    • Bavarian Yankee

      +1

      I did some research yesterday and most pitchers that had shoulder tendinitis never had major shoulder problems afterwards. The Yankees even have a pitcher in their rotation that had shoulder tendinitis in 08 and it never bothered him again: Kuroda.

      The thing is that it can take up to 3 months to pitch again. We’ll just have to wait and see.

  • Commander McBragg

    Here’s the reality: Brian Cashman and his cadre of flunkies are simply incompetent when it comes to evaluating pitchers and trading for them.

    Sure, like any mope with a billion dollars Cashman can overpay can’t miss free agents like CC. But look at the track record…

    Kevin Brown… Jeff Weaver… Jaret Wright… Javier Vazquez (twice!!)… Kei Igawa… Carl Pavano… Jose Contreras… countless releivers from Gabe White to Kyle Farnsworth and LaTroy Hawkins… first round busts like Andrew Brackman… trading Gary Sheffield straight-up for Humberto Sanchez… absolutely ruining Joba… the inability to develop Phil Hughes… trading away Ian
    Kennedy… and now trading the next Edgar Martinez for a Humberto Sanchez-Jose Contreras hybrid — a big, fat Latino who had a 97-MPH fastball at some point but arrives in Tampa out of shape, indifferent, with a 92-MPH fastball, an immediate trip to the DL and arm/shoulder issues. Seen this movie before Yankee fans?

    God put Brian Cashman on this Earth for a one reason: to maintain the competitive balance in MLB via his utter incomptence.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike Axisa

      Compelling.

    • Plank

      Mike Mussina, CC Sabathia, CMW, Randy Johnson (He was actually good, look it up), Jon Lieber, David Wells, Freddy Garcia, Bartolo Colon, and Andy Pettitte all say Hi.

      Your point is valid. Cashman has a spotty record with SP, it’s probably his weakest skill, but it’s not universally bad like you are making it out to be.

      • Chen Meng Wang

        Fuck, I cannot believe I forgot Mussina, Leiber, and Wells 2.0 in mine. I like the way your mind works though sir.

    • Chen Meng Wang

      Ivan Nova, Freddy Garcia, Bartolo Colon, Chen Ming Wang(I still blame the NL for him), David Robertson, the Resigned Andy Pettitte(the first time), year one of Randy Johnson, Cory Wade, Manny Banuelos, Adam Warren, David Phelps, Betances, and the proper use of commas all say hi. Seriously though, the next Edgar Martinez? After what? 50 MLB at bats you’re telling me that Jesus Montero is going to be a border line Hall of Famer? By that logic Buster Posey should be inducted any day now, I mean he had a full season before he got hurt, and the Cy Young award should be renamed the Hector Noiesi award because of how great he was in his time up.

    • Sweet Dick Willie

      Name one GM whose team has won more division titles in the last ten years than Cashman.

      Go ahead, I’ll wait.

      • Louise Meanwell

        I think if every GM had Cashman’s payroll you could name quite a few.

    • Avi

      I TOTALLY agree with Commander Mcbrag. If Pineda has something wrong with his shoulder, Loiuse Neathway isn’t the only one Cashman is going to need a restraining order against. And Fuck all of you that liked the Montero deal.

      • TinoBambino24

        As much as we despise the Montero trade, it made sense. Pitching wins titles. And right now, losing Pineda isn’t an “End of the World” experience. Cashman has a loaded stockpile of MLB ready pitchers in Triple A. However, Pineda needs to learn to be honest and whenever he is experiencing arm troubles, he needs to open up and say something.

        • murakami

          Right. But the stockpile of pitching at AAA is a valid reason you don’t give up a barrel-the-baseball-power-bat-to-all-fields 22 year-old for pitching.

          I’m just not sure some realize how good the bat sent packing was (is). There’s a disconnect somewhere, when people shrug about that.

          • Fin

            It doesnt matter how good the bat is if the guy is playing DH. He will have to be Cabrera good to just match Pineda as a decent number 2 starter. If Pineda becomes an ace there is no way Montero matches his production. If the both disappoint and Montero becomes a Billy Butler type and Pineda becomes a Marcum type, Pineda is still much more valuable. In almost all scenarios the Yankees come out ahead. I seriously doubt either of them are complete busts. The love for a DH is a little much on this website. Thats not even mentioning that the Yankees have a huge amount of money wrapped up in their future DH, Alex Rodriquez and no place to play Montero.

            • Ted Nelson

              Haha… What a joke. “it doesn’t matter how good his bat is!” that’s rich.

              You realize that “all scenarios” don’t only include those where they both reach the same level relative to their potential and Noesi/Campos are a wash, right?

    • Ro

      Mommy, what’s wrong with him?

  • http://riveraveblues panos

    many red flags on this guy. i told you dude was fat. but the yanks were determined to trade Jesus. man that bat would have looked great after Cano.