May
26

Sunday Night Open Thread

By
The Yankees couldn't touch Alex Cobb. Again. (Al Messerschmidt/Getty)

The Yankees couldn’t touch Alex Cobb. Again. (Al Messerschmidt/Getty)

Three wins and three losses on a six-game trip through Baltimore and Tampa Bay isn’t terrible, but it ain’t all that great. Acceptable. Tolerable. Bare minimum, maybe. It would have been nice to finish off the sweep this afternoon especially given their recent problems at Tropicana Field, but alas. The Yankees are coming home for four games against the awful Mets, but the schedule gets a whole lot tougher after that.

Anyway, here is the open thread for the night. The ESPN Sunday Night Game is the Braves at the Mets (Teheran vs. Marcum), and you’ve also got NBA and NHL playoff action. Talk about any of that and more here. go bananas.

Categories : Open Thread
  • trr

    OK, 3-3 on the trip so far and next the Mets.
    Is there anybody here who thinks we CAN’T beat them?

    • Laz

      Harvey is very good. I’m hoping for at least 2/3, Harvey is very good, and Hughes has struggled recently.

      • forensic

        They play 4 games, not 3.

    • forensic

      Of course the Yankees can, and should, beat them. At least in 3 of 4. But, let’s not act like it’s a or a walkover.

      Niese has pitched pretty well against the Yankees in his career and it could be a toss-up against Hughes. Kuroda certainly should be better than his last time out, but he’s matched against Harvey, which certainly won’t be easy to win. Game 4 is somewhat similar to game 1, where Gee has pitched ok against the Yankees in his career, and Nuno could still be a question mark, though you can’t ask for much more out of him than he’s given so far.

      Regardless, yes, they should win at least 3, but that doesn’t mean they will. They were 3-3 on this trip, but that’s thanks to an unlikely comeback (arguably two of them, though they count all the same in the end).

  • trr

    In truth, there are no walkovers at this level. But the Mess are really reeling right now, and the Yanks should win 3/4. A sweep of all 4 games is not out of the question ….

    • nycsportzfan14@yahoo.com

      This offense could easily lose a game 2-1 or 3-2 at any point, and even if there pitching does what is supposed to do, could lose a game or 2 because of the bats. Sweeping 4games against anyone is gonna be tough. To be honest, this offense isn’t even playing as good as it was earlier, making it that much more difficult to sweep a 4game set, as we havent really been offensively driven all yr.

      • TomH

        Indeed, they’re not hitting as well as they were earlier–e.g., Wells and Cano in particular.

        • nycsportzfan

          Its almost as if the Wells from last yrs angels squad as finally arrived. We really gotta start getting some of our injured players back soon. I can’t wait to get Tex, Youk, Nunez, Jeter, and Cervelli back. Thats a big boost right there.

  • Deathstroke Heathcott

    I’d be moderately happy if the Yanks take 3 of 4, I’ll be slightly disappointed but understanding if they split it two games apiece. My true expectation for a 4 game series against the Mets is somewhere around 2.5 games won for every 1.5 games lost but that’s not possible. Anything less than a split is pretty awful against this team.

  • nycsportzfan14@yahoo.com

    Draft Chris Anderson, Jon Denney, and Ian Clarkin, and i’ll be a happy guy.

  • mustang (The Has Been & Wannabes Bunch 2013)

    Agree with Mike’s breakdown on the 3-3-road trip and I’m not looking pass the Mets, but I’m looking forward to the Red Sox at the end of the week.

    Have tickets for Friday’s game, which might be my last since I’m running the Spartan Race Saturday. Sometimes you do real dumb shit during your midlife crisis learn well my young commenter.

  • Improbable Island’s Dirty Midget Whores (formerly RRR)

    My reaction to the loss is, “Meh, at least we already had the series win or this would REALLY piss me off.”

    My reaction to CC’s game has moved me from the status of, “Not happy, but I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt” to “Officially worried, and I really hope he can pull this together.”

    • I’m not the droids you’re looking for…

      Right? It’ll be interesting to see whether CC’s or ARods contract proves worse when all is said and done. Not that each hasn’t provided some incredible performance thus far…

      • Need Pitching & Hitting (but mostly hitting)

        It would be extremely difficult for CC’s contract to end up worse than ARod’s. They have the same number of years left (possibly one fewer for CC) and CC, despite the down performance so far, is still at least useful. That’s a lot more than can be said for ARod right now.

        • Robinson Tilapia

          This is the FIFTH season of his contract, with three more left. C’s already earned his victory lap, even if it started tomorrow.

          • Need Pitching & Hitting (but mostly hitting)

            Technically, he started a new contract before last season. And he has 4+ years left, unless he has shoulder problems in 2016.
            I’d say it’s still too early for the victory lap to start.

    • Bobby Two Knives

      Maybe going back on his diet of Cap’n Crunch is all that is needed!

      • thurdonpaul

        i second this opinion.

  • Eddard

    Bare minimum if the team was fully healthy you mean. These aren’t the 27 Yankees. Kuroda and CC both took losses. They had their 6th starter and an AAA call up pitching on the road against good teams. Nix, Romine and Ichiro are 1/3rd of the lineup for christ sake. That doesn’t even mention all the reclamation projects playing above their heads. Jesus, you can’t please anybody around here.

    • Improbable Island’s Dirty Midget Whores (formerly RRR)

      Oh my gosh, Eddard. Yeah, they’re injured, but they also played worse than they have generally this season by splitting the road trip. It’s a bare minimum result, not a bad one.

      You and Greg are two of a kind. Having any sorts of expectations for this team at all is sacrilege. We must either assume they’ll fail or we’re irrational optimists. Well, you can think that way but don’t jump on other fans for being optimistic.

      • Deathstroke Heathcott

        Well, we’ve played above our heads for most of the season, a small stretch where we’re playing at or slightly below our heads won’t ruin my weekend any. When the reinforcements get here, I’ll raise my expectations to match the talent we have out on the field but let’s not act like splitting a road series with two decent teams is the lowest of all lows for the team we have out there.

        • Improbable Island’s Dirty Midget Whores (formerly RRR)

          But we didn’t. Nobody did. We said it was a bare minimum, which is a perfectly reasonable reaction.

          • Deathstroke Heathcott

            I’m not disagreeing with you really, just don’t agree with the term “bare minimum” in this instance. It’s not like Baltimore or Tampa Bay are teams that can’t play; sure, you would like to win every series but I wouldn’t have panicked if we only won 2 of 6 on the road with the team we have out on the field. 6 game homestand against the same teams with more of our bats healthy, I might be inclined to agree.

            • Deathstroke Heathcott

              Sorry got cut off for some reason, but both Baltimore and Tampa Bay are over .500 teams and teams generally have better records at home.

  • The Thumb

    I read Chris Bootcheck is doing pretty well at AAA. I know it’s Bootcheck but with the June opt-out you could figure they’d give him a shot.

  • pat

    Ill take a starter going 7 every time out. If you’re going to suck at least have the decency to go deep into the game and save the bullpen. 7 runs in 7 innings is fine, whatever. . 7 runs in 2 and a 3rd is the killer.

    • Rolling Doughnut

      7 runs in 7 innings is not fine. It’s shitty, and at about a mil a start, it’s making me puke the hot dog I have to sell a kidney to pay for at YS. CC needs to figure out how to pitch now that his velo is hovering around 90, or maybe the elbow is still in recovery mode.Whatever it is, it’s not fine.

      • I’m not the droids you’re looking for…

        Paging Mike Mussina.

      • jjyank

        Meh. He still has a sub 4 ERA, and we’re still not even 1/3 of the way through the season. He’s not pitching like we want him to, but this game aside, he hasn’t been as bad as the comment sections here would lead one to believe. If the diminished velocity is for good, he’s doing a hell of a lot better figuring it out than Moose did when it happened to him. CC knows how to pitch. I still believe he’ll be fine.

        Also, I personally find that the jabs at ticket prices make a comment seem overly bitter-old-man-ish than thoughtful blog comment, but that’s just me.

        • forensic

          So, you’re basically saying you think he’s fine because he got 2 extra outs today and/or because it’s not 5 days from now?

          That is the difference between not having a sub-4 ERA anymore and being 1/3 of the way through the season.

          And based on expectations, salary, and stature, he has certainly been as bad as many are saying and has been an extreme disappointment, and many times, a drag on the team.

          At least he can admit it even if many here can’t:

          “I’m hurting the team. I’m not helping the team out. I just need to get better.

          • jjyank

            I never said he was fine right now. I said, and I quote, “I still believe he’ll be fine.” As in, future tense. I don’t think he’s cooked, and I don’t think we need to start comparing his contract to A-Rods, as someone already did.

            I acknowledged he’s not pitching like he’s supposed to. I just don’t think it’s been as bad as some other do, and I have more faith that he’ll be fine in the long run than others do. Please don’t put words in my mouth (or on my keyboard, as the case may be).

            • Deathstroke Heathcott

              Every year of CC’s career you can find a few start stretch where he’s gotten lit up and his ERA for the year overall so far isn’t terrible so it’s not like he’s been getting hitting around all year. I’m not super worried yet that he’s cooked or anything.

            • forensic

              Doughnut said it’s shitty and not fine. You replied with your reasons against his opinion being that he has a sub 4 ERA and they’re not 1/3 through the season.

              Sorry, that sure looked to me like you’re trying to say he’s fine and you’re not really concerned for those reasons.

              • jjyank

                Just because I replied to him doesn’t mean my comment was the polar opposite of what he was saying.

        • Rolling Doughnut

          Maybe so. I withdraw the jab. As for my comment, it was on his last two starts if you actually read the post. Yes, they haven’t given him run support this year, and yeah his numbers are similar to last year’s (his ERA+ is actually identical: 123) but his last two starts have been bad –and everyone knows about the velo issue. For the record, I hope he goes gangbusters the rest of the way.

          • jjyank

            Fair enough. The velocity does concern me a bit, but just not as much as some other people. I think CC is the kind of guy who can make that adjustment. I’m going to wait awhile longer before I make a judgement on whether or not it’s a real problem going forward. I was at work today, so I didn’t see his start, but I won’t argue his line. It’s ugly. I just won’t react too much one way or the other on one start.

    • Robinson Tilapia

      Agreed.

    • forensic

      7 runs in any number of innings is far from fine.

      • pat

        It’s a loss guaranteed. I’m not upset by that. Shit happens, but if you’re going to suck at least don’t kill the bullpen along the way.

  • Kramerica Industries

    Are the Indians fucking serious?

    Nice choke, assholes.

    • Rolling Doughnut

      I saw it unfold. Yeah they were serious. About as serious as the Rays were yesterday.

    • Get Phelps Up

      At least the same thing happened to the Os.

  • CONservative governMENt

    Is Wang going to opt out? Seems like Nuno has made it tough for him in terms of finding a role.

    • JohnnyC

      I asked Donnie Collins who covers Scranton if he’d heard anything about teams sniffing around either Wang or Bootcheck and he said no, nothing. Looks like Wang will not have an alternative this week. Bootcheck apparently isn’t convincing any major league teams yet either.

  • nycsportzfan

    Did anyone notice how bad some of the pitches were the yanks were swinging at today? It got to the point where the announcers said something about it, calling it “brutal”.

    They made Cobb’s job way to easy by swinging at those balls in the dirt and way outta the zone.

    • JohnnyC

      Both Cobb’s FB and his changeup go down and away from lefties. But the difference between his FB and change is only about 6 miles an hour. Theoretically that shouldn’t make his change of speed effective but…Yankees batters never solved him. That’s like 22 innings of shutout ball before Gardner’s 9th inning HR. Unbelievable. Shouldn’t happen to good major league hitters. But, as we know, this is barely a ML lineup right now.

  • nycsportzfan

    Vernon Wells is looking completely horrendus lately. Talk about a jeckyl and hyde season. THis guys swinging at balls way outta the zone and popping out on pitches right down the middle.

    His timing is way off.

    • JohnnyC

      Granderson’s return and the rotation concept might have thrown Wells’ timing off. Riding the hot hand is better than trying to evenly distribute playing time. With Granderson out again, it’s a moot point.

      • Need Pitching & Hitting (but mostly hitting)

        There was only one game that Wells didn’t start since Grandy returned (and he ended up getting 2 PAs that game anyways).
        I don’t think that was the problem.

  • Kevin

    I would have felt better taking two out of three in both series. Boston isn’t going to go away this year and Baltimore will still be hanging around.
    Sad to say but we do need some of the bigger bats back or we’ll be hurting at some point.

    • The Real Greg

      It’s ironic that Boston was projected by a lot of people to be worse than the Yankees this year, and yet people are saying now that they aren’t going to go away.

      • Kevin

        The pitching for both teams has done wonders for them.

      • Deathstroke Heathcott

        Didn’t know we’d be dealing with this version of Clay Buchholz. I’m hoping he comes down to Earth but if he’s legit, so is Boston.

  • Rolling Doughnut

    I still think this team is far more fun and exciting to watch than last year’s. They already have more 8th, 8th and extra inning comebacks than all of last year. Maybe that’s why CC is so disappointing this year. He reminds me of those frustrating give it away early and try to claw back in the 7th games of 2012.

  • The Real Greg

    You know who I blame CC’s deterioration on? The Milwaukee Brewers and their overuse of CC in that half season of 2008 accelerated his arm deterioration to what we see today. This guy is in his early 30s and this shouldn’t be happening to him.

    As for the road trip, at the beginning of it 3-3 looks like a bare minimum. But after going 1-2 in Baltimore, you take a series in a building in which you have not won a series since 2010. You’re over the moon at that prospect.

    • jjyank

      The Brewers rode CC pretty hard, but that was for like, 2 months out of entire career. He’s a workhorse who pitches a ton of innings. You can’t blame the mileage on his arm on the team that had him for ~2 months of his entire career.

      • The Real Greg

        From 2000 to 2007, CC averaged about 201 innings a year, with his high being at 241 in 2007.

        How many innings did he pitch in 2008? 253 innings,

        In 17 starts for Milwaukee, he pitched 130.2 innings including 7 complete games. That is insane.

        That had to take some mileage off his arm.

        • Rolling Doughnut

          Maybe so but the sudden velo drop from last year to this feels more like the elbow problem not having resolved itself.

          • The Real Greg

            For his sake and the Yankees, that had better be the reason.

          • nycsportzfan

            I don’t think its anything more then the guys pitching how hes done alot during his career. People act like this guys been winning 20 a yr his entire career with a sub 3 ERA or something.

            This is a guy who started hius career with ERA’s of 4.37,4.39,3.60,4.12,4.03, before having a couple low 3′s ERA before finally having his first sub 3 ERA in 08, which is why Milwaukee rode em, becuase he was having the best yr in his career and was finally pitching as one of the top couple pitchers in baseball.

            My point is, this guys had a ton of solid, but not fantastic seasons in his career, so its not overly crazy to see him fall back to that as he enters his mid 30′s and start to wind down some.

            Not everyone that is really good pitches like a top 2-5 ace well into there 30′s.

        • jjyank

          But then he pitched 230, 237.2, and 237.1 innings in 2009, 2010, and 2011 with the Yankees. And we’re blaming the Brewers?

          Here’s a though, Greg. Let’s not blame anyone.

          • Get Phelps Up

            If you include playoffs, he surpassed his 2008 total in 2009 and matched it in 2010.

  • TomH

    I agree that it’s a “bare minimum,” but I’m beginning to worry about this team. It’s been a very exciting two months, but somebody, above, used the word “overachieve.” Maybe so, and if so, a correction may be coming.

    Maybe Wells is merely in a normal slump. Maybe CC is too. There are other “maybe’s” also.

    The sooner Teixeira (fingers crossed) gets back, and Youk with him, the better. Yeah, this team has hit a lot of HRs, but I don’t really think of it as an offensive juggernaut.

    It will also be useful to have Youk’s batting eye in the lineup with Hafner’s. Last time I looked the Yankees’ team obp was down near the bottom,far away from serious teams. They need more “role models” of plate patience.

    • The Real Greg

      And that’s why fans are not watching this team and aren’t really taking them seriously. As I have said, they are waiting for the other shoe to drop/the correction to come.

      • jjyank

        Who is “they”? I take them seriously. Speak for yourself, Greg.

        • TomH

          I thought he meant that attendance at the Stadium is down, along with YES tv ratings.

          • jjyank

            People said the same thing regarding attendance last year too. The Yankees are in first place. Don’t generalize the fan base by saying we’re not taking them seriously. I sure am.

            • Pat D

              Depends on your level of fandom, I suppose.

              My mother is a fan, somewhat more than a casual fan, but not really a fanatic like I think most of us on here are. She still watches the games, but she doesn’t find the team very fun to watch since so many of “our players,” meaning Jeter, Teix and ARod, are injured. I had to educate her on a lot of the new faces and she still thinks they’re second rate.

              So if there are others who think along similar lines, I could see why some of the fanbase may not be totally embracing this team.

              • Need Pitching & Hitting (but mostly hitting)

                The funny part of it all is that I think there’s a large portion of the fanbase that would prefer some of the players (Teix, ARod, and Youk) not return and would rather see the replacements play (Overbay and Adams).

                • Pat D

                  Those people are fools.

                  Clearly those guys aren’t in their primes, but to think that their replacements will continue to potentially out-perform the injured guys is dumb.

              • jjyank

                I get that. My grandmother is 93 years old, still sharp as a tac, and a die hard Yankee fan. She’s had some trouble getting used to all the new faces on short term deals. I get that. I just resent the type of fan that doesn’t take a first place team seriously, especially one that has faced so much adversity so far. If anything, people should take the Yankees seriously. With an extreme amount of injuries, they have done more than stay afloat. Fuck, teams should be scared if/when the Yankees get back to full strength.

                • Get Phelps Up

                  “With an extreme amount of injuries, they have done more than stay afloat. Fuck, teams should be scared if/when the Yankees get back to full strength.”

                  THIS. I would understand the concern for regression if there weren’t 7 current/former all stars slated to be coming back from next week or so until the All Star Break. .

                  • forensic

                    It’s absolutely good/better that they have mostly all-star/really good/great players coming back, but those guys aren’t necessarily guarantees to play great upon their return, which is one of the main concerns for me.

                    I’d certainly take the returners over the current guys in the long-run, but there are reasons for concern. Tex is a slow starter anyway, how about with a somewhat lesser rehab/ST combined with a wrist injury? What’s Jeter going to be with a ankle that has been broken twice and barely used in 9 months? Will Youk’s back act like it’s 90 years old again? Will Pettitte’s back issues continue to linger like Youk’s have been? What will A-Rod be like?

                    Just getting these guys back doesn’t erase the concern of regression for some of the existing parts combined with struggles from these returning guys.

          • Get Phelps Up

            Attendance is down in lots of teams.

            • Get Phelps Up

              *for

              • TomH

                Is tv attendance down for them also?

                • Get Phelps Up

                  I really don’t know how to find that, but 22/30 teams, including several contenders have declined in attendance this year. Are those fans not taking the team seriously too?

          • forensic

            Attendance is down all across the majors, and horrible weather is a big part of it. I believe I saw that there have already been more games affected this season by weather (and that was a week or two ago) than all of last season.

            • The Real Greg

              AS mentioned by others in this statement, it’s not just attendance. TV ratings are down.

              • forensic

                TV ratings can also take a hit when games keep being affected by weather, either in delays during or before games or by postponements.

    • chris

      All of this is exactly right, but most yankee fans are too stupid to understand why a correction is coming..It’s been fun and I hope I’m wrong..you never know, they could luck out all season..but this team has way overperformed its talent level.

      • Need Pitching & Hitting (but mostly hitting)

        They’re this year’s Baltimore.
        Baltimore somehow managed to keep it going all year last season. Maybe the Yankees can this year, especially with reinforcements coming and hopefully helping the cause.

        • chris

          except what Baltimore did in close and extra inning games may never be repeated in my lifetime..and I’m not old…Holding out hope for that is probably barking up the wrong tree.

          • Need Pitching & Hitting (but mostly hitting)

            I agree. I don’t think the current roster can keep this up, though I don’t think they need to match Baltimore’s 2012 to contend this year. They should have enough legit pitching to contend with some luck, not necessarily extreme luck.

          • Get Phelps Up

            We don’t have to repeat what they did in close games. The Os didn’t have 6 all stars returning from the DL as a reinforcement.

        • Rolling Doughnut

          No way. Baltimore had the gods on their side last year statistically speaking. Those one run wins were otherworldly,

  • TomH

    Well, I’m not speaking for Greg, and I do take the team “seriously,” in this sense of the word: that I worry about it, watch every game, check the news concerning it regularly all day, etc., just as I did in 1957, 67, 77, 87, etc., am happy when it wins and gloomy when it loses. ETC.

    On the other hand, I don’t quite take the team “seriously” in another use the word may have: I think it has overachieved. In fact, apart from super-hard-core Yankee fans it’s hard to think anyone who follows the game closely doesn’t think they’ve overachieved. (Put Cashman on KGB truth serum and he might himself confess to being astounded.)

    This is not to sneer at them, condemn them as being unworthy, etc. It’s to make an analytical judgment about the talent on the team at the moment and the long-term prospects if that talent is not quickly reinforced.

    Now, that judgment may be wrong. It may be right. It’s too soon to know yet, one way or the other.

    But there is shakiness on this team, and it’s entirely reasonable to be concerned enough about it to want Teixeira et al back in the lineup as soon as safely possible.

    • The Real Greg

      I should have qualified my definition of “seriously”.

      I mean seriously in terms of being there at the end for the division.