All we need is just a little patience

April 20, 2008 by Benjamin Kabak 58 Comments

What’s there to say about last night’s 6-0 shutout at the hands of the Orioles that Axl Rose hasn’t already said?

Ian Kennedy was, at the same time, getting squeezed and nibbling, but right now, he has to trust his stuff more. Like Phil Hughes had been doing before Friday, Kennedy is attacking hitters and is trying to finesse his way through his starts. Considering the type of pitcher he’s been before this year, that approach just flat-out will not work.

But at the same time, Joe Girardi has to keep the kid gloves on a bit. He went out to the mound in the third and let loose on Kennedy. IPK did not respond well to that at all, and a few batters later, he was gone from the game, replaced by a very effective Ross Ohlendorf who did not falter until his third inning of work.

The Yankees young guns are very good. Their Minor League track records are off the charts, and scouts across the board love their stuff and make-up. Right now, though, their approach just doesn’t seem to fly. Hughes and Kennedy are trying to paint corners when they shouldn’t be; they’re throwing breaking balls in fastball counts and their throwing fastballs in breaking ball counts. Somehow, the Yankees have to find a fix for this problem that doesn’t involve a trip for either of these two pitchers to AAA. It’s all about patience.

Meanwhile, the problems on the other side of the ball are worse. Tonight, the Orioles’ fourth starter shut out the Yankee offense. Brian Burres and Jim Johnson combined for nine innings of six-hit ball. The two combined threw just 129 pitches to a Yankee team that’s supposed to work the count and really push back-of-the-rotation starters. The Yanks have three regulars hitting below .200 and an otherwise anemic offense.

For all the trouble the pitchers have been through, if the offense won’t score any runs, the pitching doesn’t much matter. They need to score runs, but that goes without saying.

To tie everything together, overall tonight, I saw something I hadn’t seen from a Yankee manager in a while. Joe Girardi was impatient with his team. He was pissed at Kennedy for not putting the ball in the strike zone, and by the end of this frustrating night, he wasn’t too happy with his hitters either. Something’s going to give soon. Girardi has to be patient with his pitchers, and the offense has to come through for the Yanks to accomplish what they want and need to accomplish tonight.

Fat load of good Joba’s doing them pitching the 8th inning down 6-0, eh?

Grant

I agree with the patience part. But if he wants kid gloves, he shouldn’t be in the majors. And if recall correctly, IPK K’d the batter after the visit, then lost it again. I don’t think the kid is/was getting squeezed, if you can’t establish the strike zone, you won’t get the border line calls.
- http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.
  
  I mean kid gloves in that chewing out the starting pitcher on the mound may not be the best idea no matter how frustrated Girardi gets.
http://www.myspace.com/j_panama Jamal G.

I’m going to call in on M&MD on Monday and see what the idiots have to say about Joba, your best arm on the staff, not having the chance to impact more than 4 out of the last 14 games. Four fucking games for the best arm on your staff that has the potential to be a staff ace but is regulated to the bullpen in a specialty 8th inning role because of an innings cap and current need. So we can expect a maximum of eight innings in those games Joba did/could have impacted (2 he actually did and 2 others where he didn’t but should have been used or would have been used if he were with the team) because it’s pretty safe to assume that at this point he is only allowed to go a maximum of two innings an appearance. Now, if he were anything but our 5th starter in the rotation, Joba Chamberlain would have pitched in three games during that 14 game stretch and we could have reasonably expected him to pitch in 15 to 21 innings (about 5 to 7 innings a start).

So I ask you Joba-to-the-bullpen supporters, which would you rather have from the best arm on the New York Yankees? The 15 to 21 reasonably expectable innings or the max of just 8 innings over a 14 game period. Also before you start that “his innings as a set-up guy are more valuable than those early to middle innings as a starter” BS, ask yourself in the seven losses that the Yankees suffered over these 14 games, how many were as a result of horrid starting pitching?

Just one last note. Of those four games that Joba as a reliever did/could have impacted, the Yankees were 3-1. In the 3 wins the Yankees starters pitched a total of 22 out of a possible 27 innings. So what do you think was the real cause of those victories, great starting pitching or an effective back-end bullpen? Lastly, what I mean by did/could have impacted is that Joba pitched in one out of the four games, the 4/6 2-0 victory over Tampa where he came in relief of Chien-Ming Wang with runners on the corners and nobody out in the 7th. The other three games were games that he 1. did not pitch in but should have (4/12 game @ BOS where Yanks loss 4-3. Joba should have came in that 6th inning to face Youkilis instead of Brian Bruney) and 2. games that he would have pitched in if it weren’t for his Father’s sudden illness (4/14-4/15 games @ Tampa where Yanks won with go ahead HR by Robbie Cano after bullpen blew the lead and the latter game in which Kyle Farnsworth took Joba’s spot and pitched a perfect 8th).

So I sum it up with the same question, how can anybody justify keeping Joba Chamberlain in the bullpen when we have living proof that in the past 14 games he was rendered utterly useless in 10 out of those games. Remember, in the 4 total games he would have pitched in, he would have only thrown 8 innings while if he was a starter for that same stretch, he could have reasonably pitched anywhere from 15 to 21 innings.
- http://www.myspace.com/j_panama Jamal G.
  
  *I made an error in the first paragraph when I said “…So we can expect a maximum of eight innings in those games Joba did/could have impacted (2 he actually did and 2 others where he didn’t but should have been used or would have been used if he were with the team)…”, it should have been “(1 he actually did and 3 others where he didn’t…)”. Out of the four games in the last 14 where Joba, as a set-up guy, would have had an impact he only pitched in one of those games. That one being the 2-0 W over TB on 4/6.
r.w.g.

It’s real tough to watch. If these two are still pitching like this at the All-Star break, send them back to Scranton. I believe in both Hughes and Kennedy (though I see them as 3-5 starters) but if you don’t want to learn to throw strikes at the major league level, you can do it in the minors.

Honestly both of these guys should still be in the minors. But we don’t have that luxury since we got nothing from Johnson, Pavano, Vasquez, and every other bum pitcher who couldn’t give us good innings the last 3 or 4 years.

I think it’s going to be tough to watch this year. We’re going to have three spots in the rotation where we’re gonna have problems, and an ace we kinda sorta think can shut down anyone.
http://yanksfansoxfan.typepad.com/ysfs/ Nick-YF

Jamal, I agree with everything you just wrote.
GoYankees

The reason Joba was in the game was to give him an inning after the layoff, As far as Joba as a starter, there is the unproven assumption that he is going to be an ace from the getgo. Do you think that he does not need a learning transition from throwing 1+ inning every third day to throwing 6 innings every five days? Then why not make Mariano a starter too???
- r.w.g.
  
  Joba has major league stuff. Joba just doesn’t have a major league innings total.
  
  He had some injury issues in college here and there, and not every college pitcher throws the same innings as a guy like Lincecum. He only threw 88 innings or something last year.
  
  So you’ve got to build him up slow. In an ideal world, Joba would be in the minors right now and a whole list of guys we had signed to pitch for us would be doing his job.
  
  But those other guys were unreliable to terrible, and so Joba has to come in. I don’t think he can post an ERA under 1 in the rotation. But I do think he can post one under 3. Too many pitches to be a one inning guy.
  - http://knickerbockerchatter.blogspot.com/ Bruno
    
    JOBA threw 110inn in ’07
- http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.
  
  They did make Mariano a starter. And he failed. So he was moved to the bullpen.
GoYankees

Girardi chewed out IPK because IPK and Phil cannot be successful major league pitchers if they nibble and are constantly behind in the count. And it wasn’t the ump’s fault, unless he called those pitches strikes for the O’s, who had no trouble with him.

If only those bats were working, there wouldn’t be all this attention on pitching. When almost nobody is hitting, the pressure is on the pitchers to be perfect, which they aren’t. If the Yanks won 7-6 we’d all be happy with IPK, Phil, and Moose.
- r.w.g.
  
  “If the Yanks won 7-6 we’d all be happy with IPK, Phil, and Moose.”
  
  No, we wouldn’t. A lot of people would probably be a little less vocal.. but you know what? For the past 5 years I’ve been watching this team beat Baltimore 7-6 all year and then doing nothing in the playoffs except for a few years when our manager got out of his own way long enough to later screw it up in a more important series.
  
  Got to have pitching and you’ve got to throw strikes. Giradi shouldn’t tolerate this crap and I’m glad he isn’t.
  - Mike P
    
    He’s got a point about the kids being ok with leads though. I think if Kennedy gets an early lead last night, he’s less reluctant to throw strikes. When you know you have to be perfect, you’re more likely to beat yourself.
    - r.w.g.
      
      You’re right. I don’t want to let the offense off the hook.
      
      I am behind these kids.. I want them to succeed. But I am going to be very honest.. I do not think they had enough time in the minor leagues.
      
      Kennedy and Joba spent what, one year? Phil Hughes is still just 21. Have any of these guys spent a whole year at a single level? Counting college, do any of them even have 500 lower-level innings? I know Kennedy flew threw the system and came from a big college program.. but when you keep jumping level to level, all the hitters you face are seeing you for the first time.
      
      I put this mess on Steinbrenner and Cashman. These kids (Joba aside.. and that’s purely stuff related, not taking into account the innings limit) were rushed through the system because everybody Cashman signed or Steinbrenner demanded be signed were absolute trash and forced them into the bigs. They are here now and I want them to stay because I think they are talented, but my opinion is they weren’t in the minor leagues enough.
      
      I hope Cashman gets fired and Oppenheimer gets the nod. Like someone said before, I really do not trust Cashman with all this money coming off. I do not want Adam Dunn for 5 years or Sabathia/Texeria for 8.
      - GoYankees
        
        They don’t have the stuff to blow away hitters, so need to work on the guile. Which means strike-one, followed by keeping them off stride pitching in and out, and ground ball pitches with men on base. Like Moose and Andy.
        
        r.w.g.
        
        Mike Mussina got hitters out with pure stuff for the vast majority of his career. The guy was throwing 92-93 with an absolutely stupid break on his knuckle curve. He could pile up the strikeouts with anybody in the league.
        
        Phil’s big problem is that he’s got one pitch he falls in love with, a fastball, and it’s kind of good but not great. He doesn’t seem to be of the opinion his secondary pitches can get major league hitters out, so why should I? If needs more more to be able to get his curveball and slider over for strikes, I’m fine with that. But it’s completely legitimate to blame Cashman for making Hughes learn how to do that up here.
        
        Mike P
        
        I think it’s clear that the kids don’t quite trust their stuff yet. And that could absolutely be because they haven’t had enough innings to be confortable with all their pitches. On top of that they’re put into big spots and sked to do the job of a veteran.
        
        I think their pitches are probably good enough, but they have to trust themselves. I think they’re maybe trying to be too good. Hughes hasn’t given up a homer yet has he?
        
        In those regards it’s clear the Yankees screwed up. Not that these kids shouldn’t be here, but not both at hte same time expected to produce. A lot of young pitchers are eased into the majors, these guys have been thrown in the deep end and expected to swim.
        
        Not sure it’s all Cashman’s fault though. Steinbrenner forced him into some stupid decisions TBH. I like what he’s done since he was finally “given full authority”. That Randy Johnson trade was awesome- Randy needs a Zimmer frame on the mound. So was the Abreu deal.
        
        r.w.g.
        
        I also like what he’s done since he’s gotten full authority. Especially how he stayed the hell out of Damon Oppenheimer’s way.
        
        He gets a lot of credit for the Johnson trade. He had one team he could realistically send Johnson, too, and he got a good haul of players for him. But at the same time, Arizona really did want to get RJ back and they don’t seem to have missed a beat since dealing Ohlie and AG. So because Arizona decided to trade us some useful role players for a guy they really wanted, Cash gets excused for all the other stuff he has ROYALLY fucked up?
        
        And I like Abreu, but that was a salary dump by Philadelphia, plain and simple. They wanted Thome and Abreu out of there and the Yankees were willing to take all of his salary and so they got him. None of those guys sent to Philly were going to be anything, and everybody knew it at the time.. it was a chance to get 40 million off the books and Philly took it. And they haven’t really missed a beat either.
        
        And if Johnny Damon hits .250 again this year, I’m really gonna flip my lid.
        
        Mike P
        
        How about Gary Sheffield? Similar to Arizona where he had low leverage and got a decent haul for an oft injured player. I agree with Damon so far, though mainly from a defensive perspective. He’s a criminal with that arm. Offensively I think he’ll come around now he’s healthy. I think Cashman knows the organisation so well, seems to have gotten the owner’s trust and makes some pretty decent baseball decisions. Why change? If they fire him and the next GM has difficulties, we could see the return of the Tampa advisors. And we all agree that would suck.
        
        r.w.g.
        
        You do make a good argument. maybe Cash has turned a corner and he’s not going to waste golden opportunities to make us better anymore.
        
        I don’t know what to make of the Sheffield trade since I only remember two of the guys we got back — Sanchez and Claggett — and they haven’t done anything. Maybe Sanchez will be good. I don’t know.
        
        I just don’t trust Cashman to keep the right young players, deal the ones who maybe won’t be so good, and to sign the right free agents to reasonable contracts. I see Tex and Sabathia for 7 years a piece, then he’s gonna trade Brandon Laird/Kennedy for Joe Blanton or something.
        
        “This is a move I felt we need to make.”
        -B.C.
      - http://yetanotheryankeeblogger.blogspot.com/ Wolf Williams
        
        That’s the big fear….. a ton of payroll cash to play with, and another Pavano-type disaster.
        
        I can hear Hank Steinbrenner walking into Cashman’s office, like Michael Corleone walks in on Carlo after the baptism…. “You have to answer for Pavano, Brian…….” And Cashman hanging up the phone and saying….
        
        “Now tell me….. whose idea was it to sign Pavano, and don’t lie to me, it insults my intelligence, and it makes me very angry.”
        
        A long pause from Cashman….. then, “It was Torre.”
        
        Hank whips out a plane ticket to Tampa. “You’re out of New York, Brian, that’s your punishment.”
        
        I just hope Hank doesn’t have Cashman strangled in a limo on the way to the airport.
Steve S

Patience is one thing for us. But this is the New York Yankees, and Joe Girardi has every right to manage whatever way he wants. Just because Joe Torre coddled everyone doesnt necessarily mean that Joe Girardi needs to that. Ian Kennedy’s track record in the minors consists of 3 months. So I dont know how that is indicative of how he will necessarily make it in the majors. He needs to be have perfect control and he doesn’t seem to have it (right now). And after last night I guess we can let go of the weather excuse. As for Joba, I think there is no debate within the organization that Joba will be a starter. But his role right now is the best thing for the team and his future health. I agree that I would like that Santana Liriano type role where he can show us he can sustain it for three innings but its fine because if this kid surpasses 150 innings this year you put him in jeopardy. I cant believe people who read this blog actually take the time to listen to Mike and the Mad Dog, let alone call in to Mike and the Mad Dog. Its really beneath everyone that reads and posts on this blog.
- http://www.myspace.com/j_panama Jamal G.
  
  I listen to them because their ignorance and utter stupidity is entertaining. And it’s just really funny hearing Max Kellerman talk bout VORP for a couple hours then here Mike Francesa say “if you take Joba Chamberlain out of the bullpen, you will take away the aura of Joba”. Yes, he said that in a serious voice and was seriously trying to make that a point in keeping Joba in the pen for his career, his mother fucking aura.
http://yetanotheryankeeblogger.blogspot.com/ Wolf Williams

Is it me, or is there something to Michael Kay’s comparison of Girardi to Billy Martin, in the way they get pale in the face with a loss? Could Girardi be the reincarnation Billy?

The way he lit into Kennedy. The lower jaw that gets tighter every day…. Remember when Torre tore into the team after a pathetic loss in St. Louis a few seasons back? How long before Mount Girardi erupts? The guy looked positively steamed from the beginning of that game last night.

I say another loss today and that flight to Chicago might be with the lights turned off and everyone’s head down for a time out. This is getting interesting.

And as for Kennedy not responding to the tongue-lashing…. Welcome to the NFL, rookie! You’re not getting paid to learn anymore, and there are no medals for trying. Losses, we can all live with. Tossing 50 pitches in two innings because you go 3-2 on every hitter….. sorry, but that doesn’t fly up here.

You wanna be a Scranton pitcher, go be one.
Rich

If only the offense could score enough runs to enable Hughes and IPK to pitch with a lead. It would allow them to relax and pitch with more confidence.
- r.w.g.
  
  Sometimes you gotta keep your team in the game. Kennedy has a better defense behind him than a lot of other Yankee pitchers have had since 2001. He cannot be 3-2 on every single hitter.
  
  I am the biggest opponent of pitch counts you’ll find. I consider myself old school.. I hate the bullpen. Just a bunch of guys who aren’t good enough to pitch for 9 innings. But Kennedy hung the bullpen out to dry last night and Ohlendorf picked his ass up as best he could.
  
  If you’re gonna get shelled, get shelled. But I cannot accept walking the ballpark. I don’t care how young a guy is, he has to know right then that that isn’t NYY baseball.
Mike P

The offense has been a joke. Talk about throwing strike one… Talk about getting a hit with men on!
YES

Kennedy and Hughes weren’t rushed. Kennedy pitched well at every level he was at and he deserved a promotion. He’s a college pitcher he doesn’t need to be in the minors for a long period of time anyway.
Now Hughes spend the whole 06 season at AA.(I had to laugh when I heard Gene Micheal say Hughes was major league ready back in 06 and should have been called up. He’s barley major league ready now….)
Yes I do think Hughes could have used some more time at AAA but there was a need with the big club (Igawa stunk) and as a result he was called up.
All in all I wouldn’t say either of them where really rushed.
If anyone was rushed it would be Joba.
- r.w.g.
  
  I never like the idea that just because a guy played in college he should automatically be up after a year or so. Yeah Kennedy dominated. But like I pointed before, he kept jumping level to level, nobody’s seen him. He isn’t staying in one place long enough for a league to see him a bit. And in the minors, a lot of hitters get themselves out.
  
  Aubrey Huff and Ramon Hernandez are two guys that used to be above average players for several seasons and have had a couple very good offensive years. Right now you wouldn’t consider them great hitters, but they sure showed Kennedy how big league hitters are a different beast. They hit him hard (remember that ball Huff hit that Melky had to run to Annapolis to catch?) all night. They were just waiting for it.
http://sw-balcony.blogspot.com Back Bay Yankee

The real problem with the team is both the young pitching and the lethargic offense. I’m more excited when Melky or Molina come up to bat than I am when Jeter or A-Rod do.

I’m concerned that we’re fighting the last war and thinking that we can play .600 baseball down the stretch. I’m not convinced that’s true. We need a team where the pitching staff does their job and the offense pulls its share of the weight. Yes, the offense can’t be expected to score 15 runs in every game, but it would sure be nice if they could score 3-4 a game. And yes, less against aces and more against crappy pitching.

But ask yourself, did the offense look better against Beckett or Burres? The Sox can rely on Man-Ram (heh) to put them ahead in the late parts of a game. We can’t. Our old men jog into DPs, miss balls, or, in Giambi’s case, struggle to hit above .100.

Don’t pin this on the youngsters. I think it’s total BS to say they should know better when there’s an entire team behind them that has years of MLB experience and really ought to “know better.”
- r.w.g.
  
  This is a good comment, and you’re probably more right than anyone else.
  
  I want to make it clear I don’t want to pin this all on the kids. I want all three of them to make it and help us. I want those kids in the minors like Horne, Montero, and Laird to come up and help the team, too.
  
  But it’s not okay to walk the ballpark and Giradi has to let him know that in no uncertain terms.
  
  As for the offense.. I don’t know what to do. The way Cano is taking strikes on the inside part of the plate it looks like he isn’t seeing the ball. Don’t get me started on Damon.. if he can’t be at least around .270 consistently for us, he can’t help us. Giambi at least is hitting the ball hard, but it seems he doesn’t have enough strength to muscle it over the outfielder’s heads and into those gaps anymore.
  
  Jorge looks hurt and if he can’t play catcher, he makes us worse by taking ABs away from Matsui (and lost among everything so far this season is how stupid and ridiculous all that BS about trading Matsui in the offseason was. Noah Lowry, Brad hennesey? please.)
David

I think the big worry here is that Damon, Giambi and Matsui just got real old all of a sudden. If that’s the case, it’s real bad news.
- http://knickerbockerchatter.blogspot.com/ Bruno
  
  All of a sudden? Damon looked old last year and even considered retiring in the offseason. Giambi hasn’t looked good in a while. Matsui looks fine as a DH, not so much in LF but at least he’s hitting. Honestly, their best line-up right now would be
  
  CF-Melky
  LF-Jeter
  RF-Abreu
  3B-A-Rod
  DH-Matsui
  1B-Posada
  2B-Cano
  C-Molina
  SS-AG
zack

Hey, if the team continues to play as it is, come Sept. when they don’t make the playoffs, it will be by the hands of the offense, not the pitching. Look at it this way, if when Shelly comes back he doesn’t get significant playing time over Giambi and if Damon continues to suck and someone like Gardner doesn’t steal a lot of his ABs, then you can blame Girardi and Cashman. Just as in years past, if the offense hasn’t come around soon, they need to shake it up, benching some of the dead weight for better/as good internal options. It worked temporarily with Melky and Cano, and we know what Shelley can provide on the positive end, so it needs to happen
YES

The offense is a big problem. If you look pass the names and actually look at the production and age of some players there is some reason to worry.
Everyone says that they’re going to hit. Sure they’re going to hit but how constantly?
Do we really think Damon is going to be 315 20 420? OR is reality going to set in and he’ll be more like 260 10 350?
This guy was on the verge of retiring. Make you wonder how much he’s really into it.
Giambi is 38 y/o, really how much do you expect out of him?
Same with Mussina.
This team has too many either declining players or useless ones.
Pedro

Today we face Trachsel right? It’s a good opportunity to put up some runs.. I think we’ll score at least 8 today. But unfortunately this game is gonna be at least 4 hours long lol.
http://www.myspace.com/j_panama Jamal G.

I can’t believe you guys are talking about demotions to the minor leagues, dead weight players and Cashman fuck ups on April 20, after the Yankees just completed one-ninth of their God Damn schedule.
- r.w.g.
  
  Maybe it’s because it’s the same fuck ups we’ve been talking about and having to put up with for every year after 2004?
  
  Guess we should talk about how it will great to miss the playoffs this year so we can get a higher draft pick?
  
  I’m realistic. If the teams makes, just misses, or bombs this year, I can deal with it. I grew up with Randy Velarde.. I know sometimes you just have what you have and you gotta make do. But I mean.. we went into the 2003 season believing we addressed the starting pitching, and we’ve learned every year since then that we haven’t done anything of the sort. Just a bunch of fucking lateral moves.
  
  I don’t care about Santana, I’m not going to bring him up. I didn’t want the Jason Giambi contract on the mound. But I am very worried that more Yankee fans aren’t concerned about what Cashman will do with all this money. He has a year or two where he let somebody else draft all these great players and a few salary dumps where he made out okay.
  
  But I mean, besides David Justice and A-Rod (and whether anybody wants to admit it or not.. the jury is still out on whether A-Rod is Babe Ruth or Dave Winfield) what has Cash really done except win with Stick Michael’s teams and let Oppenheimer run the draft?
  - http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.
    
    I will never understand why some Yankee fans have this undying hatred for A-Rod. Dave Winfield wishes he was as good as A-Rod, and if you can’t appreciate having one of the best players of all time on the team, then perhaps you are looking for the wrong thing in the game of baseball.
    - r.w.g.
      
      I DON’T HATE A-ROD.
      
      Ben, you are one of the guys that run this blog.. so I kind of want to like you. But I cannot tolerate people putting words in my mouth. I even credited Cashman with making the A-Rod move as one of his good ones.
      
      Alex knows he needs a title to validate his time here. That’s why he re-upped, remember? And of course Alex is better than Dave Winfield.. because he has more homers and MVP awards, not because he’s a champion.
      
      I want him to do it. I want him to kill the Red Sox and leave no doubt. I’m just going to stop talking now.. because all I was trying to do was point out that Cashman has just kept spinning his wheels over and over and makes bad signings that kill our ability to just show somebody the door, and now it’s become all about A-Rod (which is music to Alex’s ears I’m sure.. okay, that was a cheap shot.)
      - http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.
        
        Didn’t mean to put words into your mouth. Sorry.
        
        I don’t think it’s fair though to say that A-Rod hasn’t won a Championship. Because while A-Rod hasn’t always come through in the playoffs, during the last few seasons, no one’s come through in the playoffs, and the burden is definitely on the shoulders of the pitchers.
        
        We remember the slap incident in 2004 because it was rather memorable. But A-Rod wasn’t on the mound in game 7 to give up a grand slam to Johnny Damon. A-Rod didn’t allow Tom Gordon to face David Ortiz again with the game on the line.
        
        You don’t hate A-Rod. That was just my tangential opinion, and I didn’t mean to put words in your mouth. I do think that you’re being a bit unfair to A-Rod though. Nearly everyone else on the Yanks had a worse ALDS last year than A-Rod.
        
        r.w.g.
        
        I agree. I was actually typing up a whole thing about how I thought 2004 was in no way Alex’s fault, but I didn’t want to bring that up.
        
        If you want my honest opinion, I think Alex’s best seasons were 2004 and 2007. I know his numbers were down in 04, but he made like 6 friggin’ errors all year at a brand new position, totally deferred to his teammates, and pretty much eliminated a damn good Twins team by himself (with a little help from Ruben Sierra).
        
        2004 was basically Mariano couldn’t close the door and everybody started pressing. It’s old hat, anyway.
        
        I’m pissed about the Pavano signing, the Jaret Wright signings, the Giambi signing, the Vasquez/Damon grand salami, the Damon signing that was two years too many, letting Jeff Weaver pitch to Cabrera, not bunting on Schilling… fucking Christ.. so many totally shit ideas emanating from the greatest team ever. My head is going to explode.
  - http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.
    
    the jury is still out on whether A-Rod is Babe Ruth or Dave Winfield
    
    No offense, but that may have been the stupidest thing ever written on this site, and that’s saying something.
    - r.w.g.
      
      I like A-Rod. I like the way he swings the bat and throws the ball. he’s a great ballplayer and will take the home run record.
      
      But I don’t give a shit about the home run record. I want Alex to win a WS and Alex wants that too. So far he hasn’t. And Dave Winfield was a poor choice to compare too.
      
      I was trying to compare him to a great Yankee slugger who never won a title and used Winfield. I shouldn’t have because Winfield has the whole Mr. may rep and I’m really not trying to say Alex can’t hit in the clutch (he can). I’m just trying to say, fat load of good the 300 million bucks will do if we don’t have a ring, right?
mustang

Wow… Is the only word to describe this thread today.
“getting squeezed” It seems like the kids have the worst luck in the world because very umpire for the last three week has a small strike zone. Or the weather condition are bad or the offensive is not scoring enough runs. Now, this a new one, its Girardi.
This is the same Girardi who manage Florida Marlins and how many rookies and young players were on that team.
I have a new reason how about right now these guys suck.
Maybe they will get better but can we a least take off the blinders for one minute.
mustang

“Their Minor League track records are off the charts, and scouts across the board love their stuff and make-up.”
And what does this mean on the major league level. ZERO if they don’t win.
mustang

This is the same Girardi that after last nights game got pounded by the media over the kids and he defended them to the point of anger.
These kids have been treated like the second coming without doing anything yet. ” Joe Girardi has to keep the kid gloves on a bit.”…. NO.. He
has to take them off. This is the time when you show what your made of or go crying back to AAA. There is been enough accolades thrown at these kids its time they prove it on the field.
- http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.
  
  I’m glad you’re willing to give the future all of four starts to prove their worth. See how that worked out with Mariano Rivera’s first four appearances? Or how about Andy Pettitte’s first few games?
  
  Yankee fans are simply too focused on winning every single game, and that’s just not the way it works to develop a solid core of a baseball team.
mustang

Wait a minute 2 weeks ago you said something like ” the fans will be patient is the media and the guys on the FAN who wouldn’t be”. Now “Yankee fans are simply too focused on winning every single game” Which one is it ?
We should be focused on winning every single game because that how you win championships.
Thats what you come to expect from a $209 million dollar payroll is a winner not a test project. Test projects are what the minors are for.
- ceciguante
  
  i think you make good points, mustang. there is too much apologizing for the young starters on this blog. *newsflash*….they suck right now.
  
  every bad outing to date by any yankee has been met with “well, it was cold.” ok, but it was cold for the other team, too. last i checked, not every guy on the yanks has lived his whole life in the bahamas. and guess what? october’s cold, too. if these cold-averse pitchers can’t pitch in the playoffs, then all i want are cold weather starters.
  
  but mustang, i think you put your finger on a critical aspect of this team: it’s a $200M payroll on a perennial championship contender, and it’s relying on only 2 proven starters, one starter who looks very much like he’s done, and two rookies who were moved to the majors very quickly.
  
  there is something to the notion that if they are going to rebuild, rebuild. if they are going to contend, and jack up tix prices every year, and enter every season saying “championship or bust,” then it’s asking a bit much to just sit back when 3/5 of the rotation stinks up the joint for their first 4 starts each. fans are apt to be frustrated in that case, for good reason. i’m not saying demote the kids, but i am demanding some results for all the hype. “almost” a good start (except for that one pitch to manny…) ISN’T a good start.
  
  another thing: if this team is so elite, then why do they sleepwalk every april? why do most other teams seem to bring more intensity, clutch play and resilience, and we bring a schizophrenia act to the ballpark?? sorry, i expect more for $200M when the team raises the field box tickets to $250 a seat.
  - mustang
    
    Thank you. Thank you so much.
  - mustang
    
    Totally agree.
mustang

“Yankee fans are simply too focused on winning every single game”
This reminds me of a quote by Ruben Sierra when he got trade from the Yanks ” all these guys care about is winning”
Ahhhh… Yeah..
- http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.
  
  My point was that you expect the Yanks to go 162-0. I hate to break it to you, but that’s just never going to happen. I’m done arguing this though. It’s clear you’re not listening to us.
mustang

” It’s clear you’re not listening to us.”
I can say the same of you.
Enjoy the game.
http://yankeesetc.blogspot.com/ Travis G.

i agree that reaming out Kennedy is not the best way to handle them. if that’s still happening in July, sure. these are kids still getting their feet wet in the Bigs. i’m of the opinion they need encouragement, not threats.
Malcard89

OMG i love guns n roses!!!!
Jorge Steinbrenner

i don’t like the lack of patience either, especially since our biggest problem seems to be our bats, not our arms.

these kids certainly need to pitch when behind in a game, but our hitters are doing them less than no favors here. i’m really getting sick and tired of watching these guys not show up in April.

i can also tolerate watching Hughes and Kennedy struggle a lot more than i can tolerate Damon or Gimabi not get a runner in scoring position home over and over.