• zack

    I’d put it on par with the rehabbing for a hammy. Assuming a slight tear is around a grade 2, and since its his throwing arm, I’d say 4-6 weeks…

  • zack

    And too add to that, all in all, hardly a big deal. Sets him back a bit, but he probably wouldn’t have been called up until August anyways, so I wouldn’t be worried.

  • TurnTwo

    agreed. right now, i would like to see them take their time with his rehab, and not rush him… the target for Horne isnt his Sept callup, but to try and get him back and full strength and ready to go to help the rotation in April 2009.

  • DocClem

    Horne’s prognosis is very good. A slight biceps tear is probably the best possible outcome from the symptoms he reported. A biceps tear is not that different from tearing any other muscle slightly – hamstring, quad, etc. For comparison, Jeter has a type 1 or “slight tear” to his quad. The biceps is a smaller muscle and does not have to bear any weight so that’s a plus for recovery. The complicating factor is that Horne’s a pitcher and it’s his arm. His timetable will be complicated primarily by the need for the muscle to be sound enough to put up with the repetitive stress of throwing. The biceps isn’t the primary power generating muscle in a deliver, however, so that’s also a positive for his recovery. I’d guess no more than a couple of weeks if it’s an uncomplicated tear. He’ll probably be able to start throwing again and start his rehab in a week or so. Perhaps less if the tear really is very small.

    The big thing here is that there is nothing that should be a long term concern. This is much better than what Matt Garza has right now. There is no ligament, tendon or nerve damage with Horne. Muscle repairs very well in most cases. In certain ways this is an easier injury to deal with than even biceps tendonitis, which can be recurrent and bothersome over time.

    Based on what Horne told Chad Jennings I’d guess this is what happened. Horne felt a slight abnormality in his arm and thought it was nothing much after one pitch. I’d guess that’s when the tear started. Then he threw the second pitch and immediately had a lot of pain that spread down his arm into his hand. That’s probably when the muscle truly tore.

    The frightening pain Horne was complaining about that went all the way down his arm into his had was not due to the tear itself. That really severe pain after the second pitch was probably due to inflammation that resulted from the tear – that swelling probably surrounded one of the large nerves that run along the biceps. There are two large nerves that pass close along the biceps all the way into the hand. The swelling from the muscle most likely surrounded and pressed on one of those nerves. Then the severe pain traveled all the way down that nerve into his had because the nerve was being compressed by the swelling from the muscle. That’s why his symptoms resembled “nerve damage” as some people have speculated had happened. But that swelling is only time limited and it sounds like it got better not too long after. That severe pain in his hand and lower arm will not be an issue in the future as long as he doesn’t retear the muscle.

    The main question that is left over is this – why did the muscle tear in the first place. Biceps tears aren’t that common, even with pitchers. Is there something in Horne’s mechanics that lead to this? Or was he not warmed up enough in the cold weather? Was his increase in innings pitched last year more of a stress than it would otherwise appear to be?

    In all probability he will make a full recovery and it won’t take that long before he’s back on the mound.

  • Alan

    Well…that about covers everything for this thread, eh? Haha.

  • zack

    Yup, nothing else to see here folks, move along…

  • Felixfella

    Yeah DocClem pretty much shut this thread down with that post.

  • Ricochet

    Not enough info to know what they are talking about. I hear a slight biceps tear and almost everyone in the medical field think the bicep tendon. One of them attaches to the shoulder and the other to the elbow and that would take months to come back from.

    But because this is an area where players, coaches, announcers and reporters get it wrong all the time I’m not sure if thats what they are talking about.

    Hopefully thats not the case and it’s actually a slight tear of the muscle, that he should be able to come back from anywhere from 10 days to a month, some people heal faster than others but as long as it’s taken care of there should be no long term problems from this injury.

  • DocClem

    Jennings spoke with Mark Newman and clarified Horne’s injury. While Horne called it a “tear” Newman said that it’s actually just a “strain.” This is again very good news.

    The term “strain” isn’t a very precise medical term. All “strains” and “muscle pulls” are actually tears in the muscle. So right now Jeter is said to have a quad strain – what it actually is, is a type 1 tear of the quad. Type 1 tears are the most minimal type. Athletes rarely use the word “tear” like Horne did – they almost always say “strain” so that was the confusion that Newman was trying to clear up.

    So in everyday terms it sounds like Horne has a “pulled” or “strained” biceps muscle. The pain was so severe and went to his hands because the inflammation from the “strain” probably surrounded a nerve and irritated it.

    Again great news. It definitely isn’t his biceps tendon. As Ricochet pointed out “biceps tears” often refer to the biceps tendon as the biceps muscle itself rarely outright “tears.” But both Horne and Newman were explicit in saying that the tendon is not involved. A biceps muscle strain isn’t that unusual and absolutely nothing to worry about.


    • RobertGKramer

      Thank you for all of your valuable information!

  • dan

    I’m still a little worried, even after reading webmd… i mean DocClem. The Yankees downplayed Ohlendorf’s back injury last year (I believe calling it a strain) and he missed like 2 months IIRC.

  • rbizzler

    PeteAbe is saying that Cash told the media that Horne would likely only miss one start. Not sure if I believe that he misses just one start, but it is good news none the less.

  • RobertGKramer

    Thank you for your insight as well!

  • http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=56352514 Jamal G.

    LoL, DocClem as just become our go-to guy here at RAB when it comes to injuries. Hopefully you can have some type of analysis, whatever the depth, if you see it live and gather some info from the announcers. That was amazing man, thanks.

  • RobertGKramer

    Meant to thank Richocet.

  • DanElmaleh

    New segment on RAB: Paging DocClem

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