Philly, New York bullpens similar in construct

RAB Fantasy Football League Update II
Those stadiums aren't free

Ken Davidoff has been blogging up a storm this week, and most of what he’s posted has been fairly interesting. One thing that caught my eye this morning was his look at the Phillies bullpen. It was meant as a message to Mets fans. As in, don’t think that throwing money at K-Rod or Fuentes or Joe Biemel or Juan Cruz will solve your bullpen problems. The Yanks tried to accomplish this by signing Kyle Farnsworth after the 2005 season, and we saw the results.

Instead, the Phillies have pieced together a bullpen by finding underrated pitchers who get the job done. When I look at their guys, I can’t help but think of how the Yankees went about building the pen this year. Let’s hope they stick to a similar strategy going forward.

Philly Salary Yankee Salary
Brad Lidge $6.35MM Mariano Rivera $15MM
J.C. Romery $3.25MM Damaso Marte $2MM
Ryan Madson $1.4MM Brian Bruney $750K
J.A. Happ $390K Jose Veras $400K
Scot Eyre $950K Edwar Ramirez $400K
Chad Durbin $900K David Robertson $400K
Clay Condrey $420K Dan Giese $412K

Paying for proven closers is one thing. Paying for middle relievers is quite another. This is likely why the Yankees haven’t yet committed one way or another on the Damaso Marte option. However, other than a hiccup in August, he’s been pretty solid over the past seven seasons. Perhaps he’s an exception to the rule. His history sure makes it look like he is.

RAB Fantasy Football League Update II
Those stadiums aren't free
  • Kay Sturns

    when bruney took that spot start in KC in the poring rain for 2 innings, i knew he had turned a corner in his career, domination

  • jsbrendog

    yeah i really like bruney, i just wish he brought back the long creepshow hair haha

    this stuff is really interesting. although i think no matter what the mets do their bullpen will implode, call it the curse of armando benitez if youre into that sort of thing

  • Kay Sturns

    just thinking out loud… or on a keyboard; there isn’t much reminiscing of the current past seasons. even though it was not a successful ending to the last yr of the house, we still have a great team, and we should write some of the significant events of 08 and remember them together. that was my piece, peace

    • radnom

      Alright, I’ll start it off.

      Remember back when we signed Sexson and had him platoon with Giambi?

      Good times, man….good times……

      • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones
      • J.R.

        And remember when we signed Ensberg and had him platoon with Giambi. Good times…

        • steve (different one)

          to be fair, Giambi was coming off a poor season and was pretty brutal for the first 5 weeks of the season.

          the Sexson thing was ridiculous, but early in the season, platooning Giambi wasn’t a crazy idea.

  • Chip

    I think this also goes back to the Yankees draft strategy. They want to do to the starting rotation what they did with the bullpen. Sure, you might go out and sign a CC to be your ace but then you can have the rest of it filled out by Wang (for now), Hughes, IPK, Joba, ect who make very little money. Pitching is more overprice than hitting (most people feel anyway) on the open market and signing a free agent bat is more of a sure thing so this makes complete sense.

  • Ivan

    I think teams will come around that building a good BP is by throwing young arms and see if they can do the job. Draft young arms as relievers in the later rounds and see what he can do in the future alla Robertson and Melancon. Does Cashman gets credit for this? Nah.

  • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

    In reply to both Chip and Ivan, it’s not just about draft strategy. While that plays a part, identifying viable pieces on the scrapheap plays a role, too. Bruney, Veras, Edwar, Giese. All had been around with other teams, but Cash picked them up and now they’re part of the bullpen solution.

    Oh, but it was a terrible idea to sign Sergio Mitre, right LoHud commenters?

    • Ivan

      definitely that too as well Joe.

      • Mike Pop

        Signing Mitre is the worst idea the guy only gets groundballs 60% of the time

        • jsbrendog

          60% of the time he gets a groundball every time

          • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

            jsbrendog, I’m not gonna lie to you, that smells like pure gasoline.

            • Jack

              Smells like a baby’s diaper filled with Indian food.

              • Troy

                Sergio Mitre fucking sucks. Why sign him to such a non-burdensome contract?

              • Mike Pop

                some nasty ass curry

              • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

                Where’d you get your suit from, the… toilet… store?

                • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

                  Would you like to come to the pants party?

                • Andy In Sunny Daytona

                  Fuckin Catalina Wine Mixer.

                • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=15305165&ref=profile Doug

                  POW!!

              • steve (different one)

                it smells like Bigfoot’s dick!!

                • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

                  We have a saying in my country – the coyote of the desert likes to eat the heart of the young and the blood drips down to his children for breakfast, lunch and dinner and only the ribs will be broken.

    • steve (different one)

      even Abraham mocked his own readers for complaining about that. kindof funny.

    • Reggie C.

      Question Joe.

      Do you think we’re looking too much into Bruney’s 34 IP? Impressive as they were, its still a tiny sample size. Who do you think is the best right-handed RP on the Yanks 40-man? Lets include minor leaguers.

      • steve (different one)

        i’m going to go with Mariano Rivera ;)

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

        You know how a lot of people say stats don’t tell the whole story? I feel that way with Bruney. The dude just looked so much better this year. So while it’s a small sample, I’m encouraged by what I saw this season. We know he has talent, and it appears he’s beginning to harness it.

        To answer your question: Mo. But since you probably meant “best right-handed RP not named Mo on the Yanks 40-man,” I’m not sure. Plenty of talent there. I’m encouraged by Veras, despite his poor end of the season. He, Bruney, and Humberto probably have the most talent.

        • AndrewYF

          No Melancon? Dude was one of, if not the top college closer in the 2006 draft class who only fell to the 9th round due to well-founded injury concerns.

          • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

            Not on the 40-man.

  • Mike Pop

    Reggie C — Joba because he is the 8th inning guy

    • Reggie C.

      Joba is a starter entering 2009. Drop him from any BP consideration. Lets stick to the righties who are expected to compose the pen. I’d like to see a couple poster’s top 5 if its not too much trouble.

      • Mike Pop

        I know lol it was a joke.. And like Steve said its Mo

        • jsbrendog

          in the times yesterday there was an article saying want to win? put joba in the pen…and even tho it wasnt the guy’s fault who was reading it i wanted to punch him in his mouth

          • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

            Urge to kill… rising…

            • jsbrendog

              joba to pen and shoudlve made santana trade articles make homer something something

              • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

                … go crazy?

      • Chip

        Mo
        Joba
        Veras
        Brackman
        Hughes

        In terms of pure stuff that is. Those last three all have curveballs to die for

        • Mike Pop

          Your telling me Veras has better stuff than Hughes ? Im not arguing or calling you an idiot cuz idk but really ?

  • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

    Paying for proven closers is one thing. Paying for middle relievers is quite another. This is likely why the Yankees haven’t yet committed one way or another on the Damaso Marte option.

    But, there’s a big difference between paying Kyle Farnsworth 15M over three years and paying Damaso Marte 6M over one year, no?

    Is a one-year contract really “paying” all that much? Bad multi-year contracts become albatrosses. Bad one-year contracts are easily shed.

    • Reggie C.

      Which is why the Mets should just suck it up and pay Brian Fuentes. Not that he’s the sole solution to that club’s ‘pen woes, but 1 sure guy sure helps.

    • radnom

      And apparently the word is that the only reason they wouldn’t pick up the option is to sign him to a multi-year deal……

      • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

        That would be sad.

        Marte on a 1yr 6M deal >>> Marte on a 2yr 12M deal

        • radnom

          Agreed.
          I really don’t understand these rumors. Hopefully they are just rumors.

        • steve (different one)

          perhaps it’s a 2 year, $9M deal?

          i kindof doubt it, but they are obviously talking about something.

          • Reggie C.

            Fuentes is likely to make 30 million over 3. If not 10ML a year, Fuentes is going to make darn close to it. Not optioning Marte is only going to cost us more dollars (AAS) than the Yanks think. I wonder if they are not under-estimating the market on top reliever.

            • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

              Exactly. Marte’s not negotiating to come down off that 6M to a lower 2009 salary…

              And, even if he is:
              Marte on a 1yr 6M deal >>> Marte on a 2yr 9M deal

  • Mike Pop

    If I were running the Mets I’d sign Fuentes and guys like Beimel, Correia, and try to trade Jonathan Niese to the Yankees for Edwar

    • C.Panella

      And we will do what with Niese lol no room for a young unproven pitcher in the rotation we already have hughes waiting in the wings

      • Mike Pop

        Package him with Kennedy for Holliday or another trade target. And yes I do know this wont happen I was just responding

      • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

        Why would you receive a player like Jon Niese and look to trade him immediately? He’s barely a week past his 22nd birthday, it’s not like it’s rotation or bust for him.

        • Chip

          If it got me Peavy, I’d do it. Of course, that’s definitely NOT happening

          • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

            I’m not arguing that. I’m arguing C. Panella’s notion that read, “And we will do what with Niese lol no room for a young unproven pitcher in the rotation we already have hughes waiting in the wings”. Just because we might not have a room for him on the Opening Day staff does not mean we should be deterred in attempting to acquire him.

  • Larry

    Francesa says this afternoon that he “heard” that the Yankees are talking with the ChiSox about a Damon deal. Anybody know what that is about. Hayman says also the Yankees have more than a casual interest in Manny.

  • christopher

    maybe swapping him for one of their bopper sin the OF. sure they wouldd play him in CF, played griffey their last year.

    but its francesa so forget i wrote anything

    • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

      Mike Francesa = Massive Headwound Harry

  • http://salarydump.wordpress.com Joltin’ Joe

    I don’t understand these rumors saying Swisher is on the block. They traded the farm for the guy and he had a terrible year. So they’re going to trade him for the IPK/Melky special… yeah I bet.

    • Kay Sturns

      what i don’t understand is that i read some people wouldn’t trade damon straight up for swisher

      • http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/CRsmithT1.jpg tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Mr. Snarky Irrelevant Non Sequitur Jones

        I’d ask “Who said that dumb shit???”, but I don’t care, since it’s a total moot point as the Sox would never do that ridiculous shit in the first place.

  • RollingWave

    For the Mets though, with Wagner probably out for awhile in 09 too, they probably do need a closer signing. but just one. Funetes would probably make the most sense. but they sure seem likely to K-rod.