Getting more or less what the Yanks paid for
ByOne of the common narratives around the baseball world involves the Yankees and their dollars. The Yankees overspend without regard for value, and while the team has the best record in baseball, they bought it. Or so they say. Today, J. Walter Fulbright at the recently-revived Gritty and Clutch examines whether or not the Yanks have gotten their money’s worth out of the team this year. Using salary performance numbers from Fangraphs and projected 2009 numbers, Fulbright determines that the Yankees’ 2009 value over contract will fall within the $20-$40 million, depending upon the team’s final payroll numbers. In other words, the Yankees aren’t paying their players enough.
On an individual level, A-Rod is the Yanks’ worst investment this year. He is getting paid a whopping $32 million and is projected to turn in just $16.1 million in value. Robinson Cano, with a value over contract of $13.52 million, has so far provided the team with the most bang for their buck.
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So, what you are trying to say is that ARod owes Cano some serious money for picking up the slack? Does Kangaroo court handle that?
ietc
Who else could have given the Yankees 16+mill in production at 3b? Lowell? Crede? Doubtful.
or, you could have said:
i never projected Cano that high…what a great surprise!
All I know is, if the Yankees win #27 this year after spending $400 million on 3 players, opening a $1 billion dollar stadium, and A-Rod’s steroid-gate, it will be the end of baseball as we know it.
Just kidding. But I’m sure Jayson Stark will write something like that if they win #27 this year…
Jayson Stark is dead to me. I don’t read ANYTHING he writes anymore, I don’t want him to get the page views.
mmm…dont know this guy. was he the one that shot his driver with a shotgun?
There isnt another 3B in the AL that i’d want other than Alex Rodriguez. Longoria hits into so many DPs he makes jopo look like a DP virgin at times. He also doesn’t hit for average as well as alex does. Since the days off in florida, he’s been at a .291/.410/.525. He’s been pretty damn good. I’ll take that production with the 33-15 record that he’s brought with him any day of the week.
Gordon? kungfu pandA?
kidding
off to the game! I love how the skydome has wifi in certain areas. The city of toronto needs to support this team more
works great by first base field level side for the even innings.
good luck!
At this stage in their respective careers, I’d take Evan Longoria over A-Rod. I think most GMs would.
Not most, every. Every GM would take Longo over A-Rod.
Maybe not Minaya. A-Rod’s got the hispanic thing going for him.
I think even Omar would take Longoria over A-Rod.
At this stage, yea you would have to be dumb not to take Longo only because of the age. If only we had a 24 year-old A-rod clone…I’d sign up for a career like that. Longo isn’t going to come close to A-rod’s career (well obviously not many will).
If this measure determined that the Yankees are being underpaid, the measure is a piece of Mitre.
It’s not saying they are being underpaid. It is saying that they are getting more value out of most of their players then what they paid for.
Who is to say these arbitrary values are correct? If there is any way in hell it determined that the Yankees are being underpaid it need to be re-calibrated.
Why? Because you say so? Do you have anything other than opinion to back that up?
Generally, the dollar figure is Wins Above Replacement converted to a dollar scale based upon what similarly performing players earn on the free agent market. The fact is that some Yankees are actually outperforming their contracts while others aren’t, and the net monetary gain for the Yanks in an ideal world is positive.
Plus, not only are the Yankees getting a positive value on the field, off the field, this year’s team is doing more for the community plus merchandise sales are probably up with big names like CC, Tex, and AJ. Overall, this team might be the most marketable team the Yanks have had in some time. Big names, young guns, new stadium and a great season really add up everywhere.
all good points
Because it makes no sense that you would have the highest payroll in baseball by far, yet be up only 1.5 on the second highest paid team. It is then safe to assume that almost every good team in baseball is being “underpaid,” and from there it’s safe to say that the WAR-$ model they’re using is off.
a) is all the payroll evenly split between every league, conference, division? are the games played perfectly split by payroll value? are all other teams giving and getting exactly the right values giving us a scientifically sterile environment in which we can evaluate our specific inflation-adjusted, geographically cost-of-living adjusted “value” of our players’ performance? did they account for merchandising? the glory of setting records? future merchandising based on a hall of pretty good algorithm?
2)or, george pays lots of money, and he’s winning, and that makes all of us a very happy byproduct?
i’ll take number two cause I SEE THAT WITH MY OWN EYES.
If A-rod had a typical A-rod year, I think he’d probably break even with his salary, right?
Close to it probably.
In ’05 he played ball worth $32.1MM and in ’07 he played $39.2MM (Fan Graphs numbers). This year he’s making $32MM so it’s doubtful that he’d play over it. He’s getting paid so much that I don’t think he’ll ever again outplay his salary.
i know burnett makes 16M, which is a pretty nice salary… but how is he in the red? hes had a great season in my opinion, and i think the numbers (not just my eyes) back that up… for him to be 5 mill in the red, that mathematically makes him less valuable than brett gardner right now (since hes 12 mill over his min contract)
am i reading this right?
The walks are killing him.
well ya he walks a lot of guys, so i guess that screws up his FIP or whatever… but still, this implies brett gardner is just as valuable to the yanks as burnett, which we all know is ridiculous
im firmly on the new-school side when it comes to player evaluation… i dig OPS, WAR, ERA over Wins and all that stuff, but i can see why doubters look at things like this chart and roll their eyes
but… it is pretty cool that jeter makes like 21 mill or so and is still outplaying it by no small margin
this implies brett gardner is just as valuable to the yanks as burnett, which we all know is ridiculous
It doesn’t imply that Gardner is more valuable as a baseball player to the Yanks than Burnett is. It implies that Gardner is providing a better return on the investment than Burnett is right now based on their respective salaries and contributions. Money aside, Burnett has been more valuable to the Yanks this year than Gardner.
But this illuminates the divide between one pitcher and one position player. Guys who bat 500 times a year and are good at it will be more valuable than pitchers who throw 6-7 innings once every five days.
It doesn’t imply that Gardner is more valuable as a baseball player to the Yanks than Burnett is
i guess im just not understanding the chart then… burnett is making 16.5M this year, and the chart has him around 4M under that… which would imply hes worth 12.5M
the chart has gardner worth 12M more than his 500,000 contract… which would imply hes worth 12.5M
if the chart says both are playing at a level thats worth 12.5M to the yankees, how is the chart saying theyre not equal in value to the yankees?
cause the Yanks arent paying them equally…its a measure of VALUE to the TEAM. (i’m shouting those words cause its loud here, and i hope you can hear them)
If the Ynaks were paying Centerfielder A $12M and he was producing what Grit Gritner were producing, the Ynaks would only be getting what they were owed…no more, no less. A good signing? Sure. Amazing? No.
You can also infer that the Ynaks could have paid some other pitcher (Smoltz, Sheets, Durschererrer) $12M and if he performed exactly like Allen James, they would only be getting exactly their money’s worth. Since AJ is paid more, he’s underperforming his contract.
Each time you move one step away from its primary use (comparing a player’s value to his salary from the team’s perspective) it is a little less exact and useful tool. Comparing a greatly overperforming position player and a marginally underperforming superstar pitcher is pretty difficult here.
Can we go compare 2 pitchers of AJ’s quality and 2 OF of BG’s quality and see how they do?
Burnett’s K/9 is off last year’s pace, and his walk rate is up. It’s hurting is WAR. He’s pitching right now as a $10.6M pitcher and earning about $6M more than that.
Heh. When I got to “J. Walter Fulbright,” I thought you had written “J. William Fulbright”