Damon thinks his defense ‘was a positive’ for the Yanks

December 8, 2009 by Joe Pawlikowski 164 Comments

By most accounts, Johnny Damon performed poorly in left field last season. A net positive in 2008, his defense seemingly fell off a cliff in 2009, as he went from a 6.7 UZR over 659.1 innings to a -9.2 UZR in 1,117.2 innings. I looked all over for evidence that UZR was wrong, but didn’t find much. Even the scouting view, courtesy of Keith Law, doesn’t favor Damon. He sees things differently, though. Speaking to Tyler Kepner of the Times, Damon thinks his defense helped the club. “I think early on last season my defense was a little bit erratic, but once I figured out the ballpark and figured a few things out, I got better and I actually was a positive for us.” While his defense probably got better as the season went along, I don’t think it was ever a positive. Then again, what else is the guy going to say?

Christos

What the hell Johnny?
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090810&content_id=6355462&vkey=news_nyy&fext=.jsp&c_id=nyy JobaWockeeZ

Well it won’t help him if he says he was absolutely atrocious.
- Teix is the Man
  
  ATROCIOUS!
  - http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d80/madamsteph/Sports/alg_melky.jpg Drew
    
    Bring me Porcello’s last five stahts!!!!
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
    
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zX4ox7aX_wc (safe)
    - http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist
      
      I need to invite him over to Christmas dinner. For entertainment purposes, if nothing else.
      
      So Jim, how’s the Turkey?
Joey D

Johnny your kidding me right??
You looked like you were on ice skates out there, and I’m personally sick of seeing him crash into the wall while the ball lands well within reach……(Bobby Abreu syndrome)
ultimate913

“Then again, what else is the guy going to say?”

That his arm is average. That would be the part where we recommend a doctor for his delusions.
http://www.facebook.com/pages/Bring-Melvin-To-America/193013541601?ref=nf Andy in Sunny Daytona

He saw it with his own eyes.
Mike Pop

Well this is the guy who said he could never play for the Yankees. I love Johnny, but not surprised.

He’s not going to play himself out.
Jobamania

this is why i don’t like damon, he’s a delusional idiot.
- Reggie C.
  
  too harsh.
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
    
    And, redundant.
http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist

2010 Granderson for 2010 Damon may (or may not) be a wash offensively, but either way it’s fairly close. But our OF defense gets measurably better with Melky/Gardner/Granderson/Swisher out there instead of with Damon in the mix, and that’s not even arguable.
- Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
  
  That’s a pretty sick OF.
  - Lanny
    
    Did Damons defense really kill us this yr in left? how many wins did the yankees have??
    - JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
      
      Not the point.
      - Lanny
        
        Whats the point then?
        
        He said the defense is better.
        
        So what? Didnt they win 100+ games and the WS with damons defense out in LF?
        
        how much did it really hurt the team?
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        Well look who’s showed up.
        
        May somebody else do the honors? I don’t have the heart.
        
        Lanny
        
        I’m dying to here you say how bad Damon was for this team last yr.
        
        Please enlighten us.
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        Right, because clearly by saying that this year’s OF defense is going to be sick I’m implying both:
        
        A) Damon hurt us last year
        
        and
        
        B) I don’t want Damon
        
        Right, that’s totally what I’m implying.
        
        (BTW, Damon as a whole didn’t hurt us last year, but the defensive aspect of his game did. So by getting a guy who’s worse offensively and better defensively, you’re compensating at least a little.)
        
        Lanny
        
        How did his defense hurt us last yr?
        
        So his great bat didnt help at all??
        
        and do u really need a gold glove winning lf to win 103?
        
        obviously not
        
        http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
        
        Ugh.
        
        How did his defense hurt us last yr?
        
        By being bad. Which is all that is being discussed here.
        
        So his great bat didnt help at all??
        
        It did. Doesn’t change the fact that his defense is bad, which is all that is being discussed here.
        
        and do u really need a gold glove winning lf to win 103?
        
        No. Doesn’t change the fact that his defense is bad, which is all that is being discussed here.
        
        obviously not
        
        Agreed. Obviously, however, Johnny’s defense is bad, which is all that is being discussed here.
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        No, of course. I NEVER SAID YOU DID.
        
        Believe it or not, I want to resign Damon. But his DEFENSE hurt us. His offense, however, more than made up for it.
        
        However, sigining a player with worse offense and better defense is not necessarily a bad thing.
        
        Lanny
        
        So his really bad defense was sooooo bad we won 103 games and WS.
        
        WOW!
        
        Great call there Eric.
        
        Buty Im sure if we had Mike Cameron in LF we would have been just as good right????
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        You’re like a fish to a worm, TSJC. I knew you’d never be able to resist Lanny’s charms.
        
        Lanny
        
        Eric, like u rocky, likes to argue even when he agrees.
        
        http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
        
        Nah, I’m just going to ignore this one. Whatevs.
        
        Blah blah blah, Lanny doesn’t make sense, blah blah blah. He improves, then comes crashing back to earth. It’s his thing.
        
        http://theyankeeway.mlblogs.com/ Keanu Reeves
        
        Have Bo and Lanny ever commented on the same thread?
        
        http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
        
        I don’t think so.
        
        IIRC, he claimed once (when exposed as Sal, Bo, Grant, and Lanny) that he has different computers he uses (possibly work and home or something) and thus, “forgot” to switch from one to the other. Bo tends to comment in the day, Lanny at night.
        
        So, since the threads tend not to last all day, he tends not to comment in one with both names.
        
        Someone correct me if I’m wrong on that.
        
        Lanny
        
        eric dont u have a mike cameron post to say or something???
        
        http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
        
        No, I said them all in the previous post.
        
        Don’t change the subject, Robert Grant a/k/a Bo/Sal/Grant/Lanny. We’re busy deconstructing your fucked up mind.
        
        Lanny
        
        I’m just all ears on that Cameron post you make in every thread at least 15x, Eric.
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        Eric?
        
        JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
        
        This conversation gives me an erection.
    - http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist
      
      No, but it clearly cost us that game (Burnett pitched) in FLA. And he was signed to be our CF, not LF. The fact that he had to play LF meant we had to play Melky in CF, so factor that in as well. Matsui was supposed to be our LF and Johnny in CF, but neither one could perform defensively.
      
      It’s the same as my Matsui argument. He simply didn’t earn his last contract, what would make you think he’ll earn his next one when he’s 3 years older? Cashman’s approach is 100% correct. 1 year deal at money he can live with. If not, let them walk.
      - Lanny
        
        Check his offensive numbers over the 4 yrs. He more than earned his contract.
        
        Just because Melky was a better def CF doesnt mean he did anything wrong.
        
        You make it sound like he was a total bust. Someone may want to review those 2009 #’s again before they put the foot in the mouth.
        
        andrew
        
        Nobody said he didn’t earn his contract. Nobody said he was a bust. Only you, Lanny.
        
        andrew
        
        Sorry, I thought Nostra’s “didn’t earn his contract” was in reference to Matsui. Nothing to see here.
        
        Lanny
        
        glad u could admit it.
        
        i mean the guy says damon cost us 1 game in 4 yrs and thats why he “didnt earn it”
        
        i would counter that lame remark with his play in game of the ws won us the series.
        
        http://aol Rob
        
        There are some stats I read that explain that Damon’s defense give up approx 17 runs by itself. That was last in the American league. Obviously, he won’t get better either on D or offense. Infact, the last two years alone his offensive output was stagnant the last two months basically. He fades down the stretch.
        
        http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist
        
        Someone may want to check their reading skills. I clearly and obviously referred to the entire contract for both players, not just one year. Which coincidentally happened to be their walk year. Damon was garbage in 2007, and Matsui was banged up for most of his 3 year deal.
        
        Matsui’s value
        
        http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=1659&position=DH/OF#value
        
        http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist
        
        Damons
        
        http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx?playerid=185&position=OF
        
        They broke even on Johnny, and again I’d have no issue with bringing him back. But only on a 1 year deal.
http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi

I’m sure I’ll get snarky responses to this request, but do fangraphs or any other sites give UZR (or other defensive statistical) breakdowns by month? I haven’t seen that sort of breakdown before, maybe I’m just missing it. Just curious… The idea that his defense was worse early in the season and improved as the season progressed came up in a thread a while back, and Damon (and Joe) kinda echo the thought. Going purely off observation/memory, I remember him making some awful plays early in the season, but he did seem to settle down a bit as the season wore on. I’m not saying he settled down enough to wear he was a positive out there in the field or anything, but I’m curious what the metrics might say about how he played in the field at different points in the season.
- jim p
  
  iirc, he seemed to go goofy again the last 6 or 7 weeks of the season. It seemed he was never getting a good read on the ball.
  - Slu
    
    My observational opinion agrees with you, jim p.
    
    He general not horrible, but then every couple of games he would just take a really horrible route to a ball.
    
    And I seem to remember some bad plays not in Yankee Stadium.
    
    It’d also be nice to home/road UZR splits to see if his argument about learning the stadium holds any water.
    - Slu
      
      *In general not horrible…
      
      *…to see home/road UZR splits…
- Accent Shallow
  
  I don’t believe anyone has defensive splits by month, or even by half-season. I’d be glad to be wrong, however.
- http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist
  
  Month by month breakdowns?!?! WTF, man?!?!?
  
  Meh, I suck at snark.
  - http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
    
    Heh, I was actually expecting the ‘google.com’ type of response, but yours works, too.
- steve (different one)
  
  you could go back and check NoMaas. i believe they tracked UZR by week?
  
  that’s a lot of manual effort, but it could probably tell you the story.
  
  i think it is true that he improved as the season went on.
- 28 next year
  
  UZR needs a large sample to be effective. One year is barely big enough as things change from year to year. I think one month would have massive skews either way depending on a variety of factors. That would be like major SSS.
  - http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
    
    Yeah, I know that would be a problem, I was just wondering if the numbers are actually available anywhere. They’d probably show nothing, and even if they showed some sort of trend it’d be very unreliable due to the sample size and the nature of UZR. Just curious what they’d show, anyway.
JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor

Johnny Damon’s defense in Left was the opposite of pi. But check this out—I can also make straight-up bullshit.

Reporter: Hey Overshare, how many models and actresses have you nailed in the past 12 hours?

Overshare: Well, I started slowly since I was low and coke and XTC and just sort of touching myself while eating bacon and hanging out with the cat, but once I got a feel for it, I buried my entire body deep inside 14 models and actresses. Total net positive.
- Mike Pop
  
  Never ceases to amaze me.
- crapula
  
  That poor cat.
Mac

Damon is gone. I believe he will still get a 2 or 3 year deal with someone and the Yanks shouldn’t touch that.

Matsui Vlad or Dye on a 1 year deal. 100% DH.
- Mike Pop
  
  Matsui, Thome, or Delgado on a one year deal ;)
  - Mac
    
    Fine by me.
    
    Sign Pettitte and Mitre/Gaudin and the team is primed for a repeat. All while lowering their payroll to around 200mill.
    - Lanny
      
      who cares what the payroll is as long as the team is good?
      - Mike Pop
        
        Lanny’s keepin’ it real goes wrong.
        
        Lanny
        
        So you care what the payroll is when the team revenues are thru the roof?
        
        Why do you or anyone here care?
        
        So the owners can pocket more money???
        
        Its amazing how now we bash millionaire players for being greedy but want billionaire owners to make more.
        
        Mike Pop
        
        I care about payroll for the team in the future. That’s why. If the payroll is too high, it could stop the team from pursuing a better option in the future.
        
        Lanny
        
        Really?
        
        What move has it ever impacted for them?
        
        They can sit on so much dead weight money and it doesnt matter.
        
        What team can have a 5 mill starter sitting at triple A who cant show his face in the majors?
        
        the only thing they dont want is long term contracts which hampers their flexibility in signing and trading.
        
        per yr avg shouldnt mean a thing to anyone here.
        
        28 next year
        
        you do realize we haven’t really seen the problem our commitments have. We are already commitment to payrolls of like 130 million to just like five or six players. Doesn’t that kinda scare you as Hughes and Chamberlain are nearing arb years and stuff. While we got money, I don’t think the FO wants the payroll to be a lot greater than 200 mil anytime soon.
        
        28 next year
        
        the 130 million is like 2013.
        
        28 next year
        
        and add in new contracts for Jeter and Mo
- JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
  
  No one is foolish enough to give him 3 years. Not even the Mets. Besides, he can’t be a backup catcher.
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
    
    No one is foolish enough to give him 3 years. Not even the Mets.
    
    That sounds like a challenge. ARE YOU FUCKING CHALLENGING ME?!?!?
    (rips off shirt)
    
    Sincerely,
    Tony Bernazard
    - Joey D
      
      Well played!
  - Mac
    
    Probably not. But the fact is, the Yanks shouldn’t re-sign him for anything more than 1 year at 7 million.
    - Lanny
      
      Why do you care if Johnny gets 13 mil or 7 mil? Will it affect anything they do this off season? will price of tix go down???
      
      Fans that agonize over salaries amaze me.
      - Mac
        
        Whether it is the Yankees or the Marlins. Money is still a major factor in every decision a baseball team makes. There is a number at which the Yanks will not considering re-signing him and that is the number I would not go over.
        
        And I think I care more than some might because I went to school for business and it is a major part of my day to day work activities.
        
        I am glad I could amaze you this evening.
        
        Lanny
        
        Please dont compare the Yankees to the Florida Marlins.
        
        That is ridiculous.
        
        The Yankee revenues are thru the moon. They could probably have a payroll of 300 mil if they wanted without blinking an eye.
        
        And why would it matter to u or anyone here if they did? Its not like if they went down to 185 they’d lower prices would they?
        
        Mike Pop
        
        Fact – Signing Lackey, Holliday or trading for Halladay now and giving him an extension would most likely have implications on the Yankees pursuing Joe Mauer, Felix Hernandez, or other FA’s of that nature.
        Fact!
        
        NYTraveller
        
        Perhaps they don’t want to pay the equivalent of last month’s national debt in luxury tax so the Pirates and Royals can suck ass into the next millenium.
      - Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        You amaze me, Lanny. You really do.
Jobamania

i’ll be glad when i no longer have to listen to the caveman’s pre/postgame interviews
- crapula
  
  I like Johnny but he is so not the brightest bulb.
  - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
    
    It’s probably the stuttering.
    
    Lots of smart people appear not so smart because of their speech impediments.
    - JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
      
      Yep. Speech impediments have no correlation with intelligence.
- http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
  
  I’m going to go out on a limb and say that you never liked like Johnny Damon very much.
- Lanny
  
  I bet you cheered your brains out during the 9th inning of Game 5 in the WS.
  - Mike Pop
    
    Lanny keepin’ it real.
    - Lanny
      
      You too Pop? Going to make fun of a guy with a speech impediment? I expect more from you.
      - Mike Pop
        
        Where did I ever imply that?
        
        I’m with you, making fun of somebody for a speech impediment is stupid.
        
        Lanny
        
        Good. Didnt figure you for someone like that.
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        Yes you did. You accused him of making fun of a guy with a speech impediment when he didn’t do anything remotely close to that.
        
        http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
        
        No, he actually didn’t. He expressed surprise with the idea that Pop would be making fun of a guy with a speech impediment, meaning he actually didn’t figure Pop for someone like that. If he was figuring Pop for someone like that, he wouldn’t have been surprised by his interpretation of Pop’s statement (which was a reasonable mistake… he figured Pop was making fun of him since everyone makes fun of him), he would have been like ‘well that’s typical from someone like you, Pop.’
        
        Mike Pop
        
        i love when Mondesi joins the conversation.
        
        This dude always keeps it real.
        
        JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
        
        Part of him joining here, I suspect, is because he and RRR have a weird e-relationship. Like a love/hate thing.
        
        The other part is because he’s right.
        
        http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
        
        You too, Pop? I expect more from you.
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        So what’s he (Lanny) trying to say? That he has a speech impediment and Pop was making fun of him? for it? Because that’s still wrong.
        
        http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
        
        Whether Lanny was right or wrong is irrelevant to the comments you’re replying to. The point of the comment(s) you’re replying to is that what you said, that Lanny thought Pop was the type of person to make fun of someone with a speech impediment, was wrong.
        
        http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
        
        Let’s recap:
        
        Jobamania: I’ll be happy when I don’t have to hear Johnny’s interviews anymore.
        Lanny: I bet you were happy when Damon made that great play in the World Series.
        Mike: That doesn’t make sense.
        Lanny: Mike, you’re a jerk for making fun of a guy with a speech impediment.
        
        … aaaaaaaaaaaaaaand, SCENE!
        
        Lanny, you do not make any sense. Ever.
        
        http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist
        
        Right, we only make fun of fans with GM impediments, and that’s it.
        
        Lanny
        
        Hilarious.
    - http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d80/madamsteph/Sports/alg_melky.jpg Drew
      
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vascCWIu6g
      
      SIT THE FUCK DOWN FRANK!
      - Mike Pop
        
        That’s why you’re my boy Drew. Haha.
        
        Mike Pop
        
        Wu Tang!
Lanny

When has a bad LF cost a team over a season? Damon didnt seem to hurt this yr. manny never hurts. Bay didnt kill Boston this yr.

Name the Yankee LF’s during the 90 title yrs. Didnt cost anything.

LF defense is highly overrated. Damons bat more than makes up for any def short comings. It’s not CF.
- http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d80/madamsteph/Sports/alg_melky.jpg Drew
  
  No defense is overrated.
  
  However, bad defense can be overcome.
- Crazy Eyes Killa
  
  You can’t compare the Boston guys, they play half as many games with an actual field in left.
- Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
  
  Well look who’s showed up.
- NYTraveller
  
  Did I miss something? Did anyone actually say Damon cost the Yanks the season in ayear when they took home #27? Don’t think anyone said that, but then the voices in my head don’t argue with each other. :)
Crazy Eyes Killa

Nobody wants this guy patrolling LF for them. Him and Scotty B need to wake up. Johnny literally limped to the finish line by getting taken out of that last WS game. He may have been a terribly durable guy for a long time, but he’s just not anymore, nobody especially with the current state of the nat’l economy is giving him anything near what he wants. Damon will probably come crawling back, but I hope Cashman has already signed Mike Cameron at that point.

I think I heard they told Damon to tell them what he’s looking for rather than making any some sort of offer? Pretty ideal strategy I’d say.
- Lanny
  
  Well be fair. You dont know what he wants. And the industry is flush with money. Dont compare it to the national economy.
  
  Most teams could use offense and there arent much better than Damon out there.
  - Crazy Eyes Killa
    
    True we don’t know anything about what he’s actually searching for although we’ve heard ridiculous things out of his agent. Personally, If I were a GM of a team with money to spend and a need which he filled, I wouldn’t give him anything more than 7-8 mill and a vesting option for a second yr
    - Lanny
      
      His agent is not the best in the business for nothing.
BigBlueAL

Damon has been drinking the Scott Boras kool-aid.
Michael Kay

I would like to think I am worthy of hooking up with Christina Aguilera.
- Mike Pop
  
  Hahaha.
- BigBlueAL
  
  Is it wrong for me to think that she is and always has been overrated??
- Crazy Eyes Killa
  
  I feel that, I happen to be worthy of Jessica Alba.
  - JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
    
    More than worthy. Isn’t she having babies? Pass on that.
- http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist
  
  I thought you were a Jennifer Aniston man.
  - JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
    
    She’s seriously overrated. No figure with a cute girl-next-door face, but nothing special. I run into hundreds of better looking women during the day.
    - JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
      
      And by “run into” I mean pass by on the street (though I occasionally pretend to trip and grab one every now and then).
Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)

I’d love to sign Damon. A Lineup would then be:

Jeter SS
Damon DH
Tex 1b
A-Rod 3b
Posada C
Cano 2b
Granderson CF
Swisher RF
Cabrera LF

SICK. I don’t care if it’s a leftie or rightie.
- Crazy Eyes Killa
  
  Nah, you gotta sign Cameron over him, I thought you already knew that……THINK ABOUT TEH D!!11!!
  - Lanny
    
    Dont get the Cameron thing at all. Would add a nice 140 k’s to the lineup.
    
    Damons the way to go. You can let him DH 70-90 times and let Melky play LF most days if need be.
    - Mike Pop
      
      Lanny, can you try to not be so naive. Please.
      
      Cameron has been discussed on here hundreds of times on why he is a potential fit. A good one at that.
      - Mike Pop
        
        Honestly. I don’t even mind you like many other regulars on here do. But sometimes, the shit is unbearable.
      - Lanny
        
        Not a Cameron fan. He’d be good in the clubhouse but hes an aging CF who cant really hit. Hes not in Damons league when it comes to offense and his defense doesnt outweigh his offensive shortcomings.
        
        Hes a feast or famine guy who doesnt feast on good/elite pitching.
        
        Damon is perfect for this lineup.
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        Can you explain the ERic thing with TSJC? I really don’t get it.
        
        (As for Cameron, he is above average offensively and plays much better defense, so he is not that less valuable than Damon.)
        
        http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
        
        Eric is TSJC’s name. Lanny just uses it in his comments to try to annoy TSJC or something.
        
        Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        Ah, gotcha.
        
        http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
        
        Because he gets pissed at me for calling him out on his bullshit.
        
        http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
        
        Look, I’m not as big a Cameron fan as other people around here, but there’s one important part of your argument you have to explain further. According to the more commonly used metrics, Cameron’s offense and defense together yield a net positive. In fact, they yield such a net positive that he was one of the 5 most valuable center fielders, according to WAR, in MLB in 2009. He probably won’t rank that high moving forward, but the fact remains that the metrics like the guy and put him, generally, in the top 5-10 center fielders in the game, year in and year out.
        
        I get that Cameron’s bat isn’t so great, and I don’t think even the biggest Cameron proponent would try to tell you he’s some amazing offensive force or anything. But are you relying on anything other than your gut when you say Cameron’s “defense doesn’t outweigh his offensive shortcomings?”
        
        http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
        
        Lanny, I tried to engage you in a reasoned conversation here. I’m sure it’s no fun for you to have the RAB mob instantly mock you every time you post a comment, but when you don’t even bother to respond when someone responds to you calmly and tries to have a normal conversation with you, you can’t be too surprised when people don’t take anything you say seriously.
    - Crazy Eyes Killa
      
      Or you can sign Cameron because he gives you great flexibility that Damon doesnt, and has just aged significantly better as well. This strategy allows you to address the DH situation from within if need be, or at any point in the future; which is nice since it’s the easiest thing to find
  - Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
    
    I would love to sign Cameron.
    
    I’d be happy with either one. Or both.
- http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d80/madamsteph/Sports/alg_melky.jpg Drew
  
  I think C-Grand will be behind Swish’s nice obp.
- Jacob
  
  you have to break up Cano and Grandy. Two leftys in a row and espicially Grandy not being able to touch them at all is not a good idea
- Reggie C.
  
  I think you have to drop Posada from the 5th spot. Power remains Granderson’s consistent calling card as a hitter.
  
  Behind Arod:
  5. Granderson
  6. Posada
  7. Cano
  8. Swisher
  9. Melk
- Crazy Eyes Killa
  
  I really think someone needs to hold that five hole down, it hurt the Yanks a little bit right after Alex came back last year, and thats the biggest issue with letting Matsui walk. I think I prefer having Matsui to Damon, because I think Granderson could possibly man that 2hole in place of Damon. You gotta think Granderson will become at least a little more professional of a hitter as a Yankee….or he’ll think short porch every time….Not that I’d want to bat Cameron (my preference of who the Yanks sign)5th I wouldnt, but he’d play the field and do it well, allowing Jorge to settle more comfortably into the DH spot/5 hole than would be the case if Johnny is around clogging that up, and with strong bats at all three OF positions, Jorge’s replacement at catcher is the only possible hole in that lineup.
  - Crazy Eyes Killa
    
    Jeter SS- R
    Granderson CF- L
    Teix 1B-S
    A-Rod 3B-R
    Jorge DH-S
    Cano 2B-L
    Swisher RF-S
    Cameron LF- R
    Cervelli/??? C
    
    Thats how it should look on days Jorge doesnt catch, so depending on who you DH, thats presumably the Yanks B lineup? Get Cameron, Not Damon
Jacob

Its not necesarily his ability to catch flies (well he does make me clinch every time a fly ball is hit his way), its his ladies arm.
- Lanny
  
  When did his crappy arm really hurt?
  
  Did you see the Angels running wild on it? The Phillies?
  
  I didnt see it. I’m not saying hes a GG out there but don’t make it seem like hes a stiff. They can survive his glove out there 100x.
  - JMK THE OVERSHARE’s Milton Bradley Fat Park Factor
    
    They can survive with Chad Gaudin and Sergio Mitre as the 5th starter. Doesn’t mean they should.
    - Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
      
      + 1
  - Alex S
    
    Damon is a great hitter and Mike Cameron’s stats aren’t a huge dropoff. The rest of the offense can make up for it two-fold. so it comes down to $ and years. Damon wants more money and multiple years, Cameron does not. Therefore Cameron is a better investment
steve (different one)

Mariano Rivera is good at baseball.

/sit back and waits for Lanny to disagree
- Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
  
  P’shaw. He only works one aspect of the game, and he’s not even the best at that. Trevor Hoffman has more saves.
  
  /Lanny’d
  
  Waits for inevitable response from a pissed off Lanny wondering why I villainize him like this. Because he does nothing to deserve it.
- http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
  
  Did Mariano Rivera hit any HRs this year? He’s good at pitching, not at baseball. What’s the point of talking about him as a baseball player when he only performs one task!?
  
  /Lanny’d
  - Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
    
    That’s almost exactly what I said, phrased differently.
    
    Refresh button fail?
    - http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
      
      Per the time-stamps, clearly I was writing my comment while you posted yours. That’s not a refresh-button fail, that’s just something that’s unavoidable from time to time.
      
      I’ll stand by my comment, I covered more of the Lanny-ness than you did. You missed the ‘choose an irrelevant and unmentioned aspect of the game and then pound the straw-man’ and the ‘question why the comment/conversation you’re participating in even exists’ parts of Lannypalooza.
      - Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        You just do this to piss me off, don’t you?
        
        http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
        
        No, your feelings really don’t factor into my intent/goals. Your reactions are an unintended by-product.
      - Rocky Road Redemption (formerly RAB poster)
        
        BTW, I got the ‘choose an irrelevant and unmentioned aspect of the game’ down, just not in quite as much detail.
        
        I was pointing out that, since Mo only pitches, he clearly is not as good as position players, making him bad at baseball. A ridiculous train of logic that seems to fit the Lanny bill.
        
        As for the ‘question why the comment/conversation you’re participating in even exists’ part of Lannypalooza, I decided to focus less on the actual diret comment and more on making fun of the fact that Lanny, were he still here, would inevitably respond to my comment, saying how I make fun of him and how my comments are just as illogical as his. Lanny reserves a special hatred for TSJC and I, I think.
      - http://twitter.com/tsjc68 tommiesmithjohncarlos a/k/a Archimedes Torquemada
        
        Also, not enough superfluous punctuation and complaining about being repetitive (even though you’re the most needlessly repetitive asstard on the page).
  - http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
    
    Little late on this one. Suppuku for me.
Crazy Eyes Killa

Damon = Clog standing between Jorge holding down the 5 hole and the DH role a lot
Cameron = Above average outfielder offensively and defensively who can play all 3 OF positions

Oversimplified, but thats pretty much how it is.
chriskeo

I am starting to think that Matsui may be the best option for the Yankees in the DH spot, they keep Melky to play LF. Matsui could use a break once a week or more, and they use that time to rest a “regular.” You just live with Cervelli or Pena’s bat for those 1 or 2 games a week.
- http://threequarters.cementhorizon.com/archives/kool%20aid%20man.bmp The Honorable Congressman Mondesi
  
  I think I’m with you. I really can’t decide what I think they should do, but the one thing I keep coming back to all offseason is what a good fit Matsui is in this lineup/roster. He’s a better hitter than Damon and Cameron, and unless you’re signing 2 more players, Belky Bartokomous is going to be in the lineup anyway so LF would be covered quite adequately, at least defensively.
  
  If Matsui can be had on a relatively cheap, 1-year deal, I still think I vote for that option.
- Crazy Eyes Killa
  
  Thats a good plan, but Posada needs more rest than that. You could have him bat fifth via the DH role when he’s not catching, but not if Damon is in it, so you sign Mike Cameron instead and move onto pitching and the bench
http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com/ Nostra-Artist

The Red Sox discussed a Curtis Granderson trade with the Tigers, according to Amalie Benjamin of the Boston Globe. Apparently, the Tigers wanted Clay Buchholz and Jacoby Ellsbury (Michael Silverman reporting).

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/twitter-rumors-1.html

Anytime the Yanks make a move, the Red Sox have to do damage control, and it usually looks something like this.
- Steve H
  
  I heard they asked for Theo’s 1st born, Casey Kelly, the 2008 Lars Anderson, and the Sox next 20 1st round picks (even though they are untradeable).
Reggie C.

Have you guys kicked this MLBTR blurb about already? http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2009/12/rangers-offered-smoak-feliz-for-johnson.html

Apparently, the Rangers offered BOTH neftali feliz & justin smoak to the Marlins for Josh Johnson. The ‘Fish turned them down!! The team wants to try to extend Johnson. WOW. If the extension doesn’t happen, heads will roll.
- http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d80/madamsteph/Sports/alg_melky.jpg Drew
  
  Eh, Smoak is still very much a prospect.
  As for Feliz, is he a starter or a reliever… I’m not sure if he was injured or if Texas just chose to put em in the pen in the MInors this year. Of 45 Appearances only 13 were starts.
  
  Josh Johnson is an Ace.
- Steve H
  
  Of course the Marlins turned it down, Smoak could be had for Brad Penny.
whitey

Pass on Mike C
TheLastClown

Couldn’t Johnny have been saying that his D was bad at the beginning of the year, got a bit better, but that he overall was a positive for the team?

Cause if that’s what he was getting at, he’s right.
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