Source: Greinke says he ‘likes New York’
ByHere’s one from Yahoo! Sports’ Jeff Passan that’s just designed to send Yankee fans into a tizzy: A source close to Zack Greinke says the mercurial ace would consider pitching in New York. “I wouldn’t put it past him to go to New York,” Passan’s source said. “I don’t think he’d rule out anybody. He says he likes New York. Especially because they’re winners. He wants to go to a team that wins. He’s got a list, but in the process, a lot of people have lists.”
This development essentially flies in the face of everything we’ve heard about Greinke so far. The right-hander, who has struggled with social anxiety disorder and depression, has reportedly been adverse to joining the Yankees, and his no-trade clause requires him to consent to a deal to the Bronx. Still, Passan reports that the Yanks and Royals have discussed Greinke and that the no-trade clause ” isn’t the impediment it’s been made out to be.” If Cliff Lee slips through their fingers or Andy Pettitte retires, the Yanks could very well begin to explore packaging some young talent for Greinke.
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I’d rather keep Montero and sign Cliff Lee to be honest.
I don’t think Montero would be in this deal unless it were a straight-up kind of thing (or something similar – aka Montero + 3 C+/B- prospects). I’m not sure either side would be super excited about that, though, as KC would have to bank on Montero sticking at catcher, since they’ve already got Butler at DH, and the Yankees would be forced to play the same Jorge/Frankie tandem in 2011.
In terms of sheer value, Montero would be the kind of player a team would need to give up if they didn’t want to give up too much else, but I don’t see either side really making a play there. The Yanks could theoretically afford to trade Gardner and a pitching prospect or three, and the Royals need pitching and outfield (and defensive) help more than they need a nothing-but-bat (aka Butler) kind of player.
royals would demand montero. regardless of need when you trade a player like greinke you get the other team’s top prospect back.
I’m gonna wait till the off-season is over and check back then to see how all these things play out. No reason to speculate on what might occur. I’ll be reading Second Ave Saga till then ….
I’ll be reading Second Ave Saga till then ….
Good man. Well done! Thanks.
I can’t handle the speculation on changing the turnstiles to contact-less payment!!!!!
In all seriousness Ben love that blog.
Clearly he can’t pitch in New York
great day, my 21st and arod’s 500th
This might be another empty quote from an underinformed source, but it also might show that “everything we’ve heard about Greinke so far” has been pretty loosely-sourced stuff. Other than the Yankees being on his no-trade list, is there anything real?
Well, being on his no-trade list is as real as it gets. Hard to just ignore that.
Yeah, but there are a multitude of reasons why he would have large markets on his no-trade. At the very least, it gives him some leverage in the proceedings.
That. There’s not much need to put teams like the Pirates or Nationals on your no-trade list, those teams aren’t going to trade for you anyway (and if they do, it doesn’t change your long-term financial planning).
You want to put teams on your no-trade list that would be big-money teams interested in trading for you and extending you, so that you can use the leverage to your advantage.
“If Cliff Lee slips through their fingers or Andy Pettitte retires, the Yanks could very well begin to explore packaging some young talent for Greinke.”
That’s exactly what I expect to happen if the Lee pursuit goes awry. However, it’s going to cost a ton to get Greinke, and I don’t want to see the Yankees surrender the key pieces it would take to acquire him.
My hope is that they only make an attempt for Greinke if they somehow can’t get Cliff Lee or resign Andy Pettitte. But I don’t want to send Montero for a guy who potentially may not be able to handle NY.
Fortunately the chances of us missing on both Lee and Pettitte are minimal.
is there any chance the Royals don’t trade Grienke this off-season ?
I only ask, because the Royals are my 2nd favorite team. And i hope Grienke isn’t traded this off-season.
You have incredible range…
the best team and the worst team in baseball (excluding Pittsburgh; as they don’t spend a dime to improve).
it dates back to the 1980′s (Brett, W Wilson, F White, Saberhagen, Bo Jackson) etc
How can you not list UL Washington?
HA! IETCVM
My three favorite non-Yankee teams are the Royals, Nationals, and Pirates.
The Yankees played the Royals in the first baseball game I ever saw live, it went extra innings and I became a fan instantly. I was Yankees’ biased at the time because my Dad was a Yankees fan, and despite being a hardcore Yankees fan now, I still love the Royals.
All that having been said, I would love to see the Yankees acquire Greinke as long as they don’t give up Montero. So naturally, I’m accepting we won’t.
YES!! This is the best news of the off season so far.
Brian Cashman and the the Yankees front office: PLEASE get creative and use the immense depth this farm system has to trade for Greinke WITHOUT giving up Montero.
Andy has already said this is his last year IF he comes back. There are no good free agent starters next year. Time to POUNCE on Grenkie AND Lee.
Go Yanks!
It’s impossible to land Greinke without giving up Jesus.
You’re speculating and I strongly disagree.
Dayton Moore strongly disagrees with your strong disagreement.
I completely disagree.
Gardner, Joba, Banuelos, Betances, Nova. That would be a tough package to give up, but I’m sure that that could get it done.
Two possible trades I saw for Greinke that I found interesting were Justin Upton and Colby Rasmus.
Before getting into the whole “your trade proposal sucks” thing that we love so much, a few guidelines:
1. The Royals will want players they can keep under their control for a long time.
2. They want a package similar to what the Rangers got when they traded Teixeira. That included Beau Jones, Elvis Andrus, Neftali Feliz, Matt Harrison and Jarrod Saltalamacchia.
So yeah. A lot.
KC hangs up first. That’s not happening.
Did you forsee Uggla for Omar Infante? Anything can happen. That made me stop believing your trade proposal sucks.
Dan Uggla: not Zack Grienke
That’s just because the Marlins owner is a half-wit.
I’m with you! Picking up Greinke this year is well worth it. Personally, I don’t think Montero is ready for major league catching on a regular basis or has the seasoning to deal with da Bronx full time just yet. We still have no real guarantees that he can handle NY and a pitching staff long term. Of course, this argument is premised on Greinke’s being able to handle NYC long term. I would argue that replacing what Montero could potentially bring is easier than finding a potential Cy Young award winner.
Grit Gardner and Joba to KC for Greinke?
A normal GM would laugh nonstop at that offer and hang up the phone, but Dayton Moore is an idiot. So, you never know.
After finishing his Richard Simmons DVDs, he just might agree.
Heard this: Dayton Moore had ramps at his school.
I doubt that gets it done.
We can specualte for weeks on what the package might be. The bottom line is the Yankees absolutely have enough talent to acquire Greinke without giving up Montero.
GET IT DONE.
I completely agree that they could. But they have to be responsible about it. Greinke’s not quite the kind of pitcher you bet the farm on at this point, even if you’re keeping your biggest prospect. He hasn’t yet shown the ability to be consistently elite.
put the pipe down, my son
my mistake, Avi
not directed at you.
put the pipe down, son
Compare the WAR and your in the zip code, throw in the following facts;
1)Grit & Joba are cost controlled going forward. KC needs this 8 days a week.
2)KC is said to be big on Grit BEFORE last season. Grit had an outstanding 2010.
3)Moore thought Farnsworth was good, has signed over aged catchers & Of’ers way above market as recently as last year.
4)Zach has called out the front office…his time is numbered.
5)You like KC, therefore your thoughts are tainted in regards to what is fair.
The crack pipe is in your corner.
Joba sucks. Therein lies the problem
Oh, another anti-Joba guy.
What gives?
his ERA
A career 18-13 record with a 3.77 ERA & a 9-plus per 9 K-rate sucks?
This, for a guy who just turned 25…he will never be a King Felix, but would make most teams as a 3rd or 4th starter with last years numbers to boot.
Beckett, AJ, Javy, Lackey and a whole bunch of other 30-plus year old guys failed at a much higher salary.
He is an under-developed asset, not a liability at this point of his career.
3.77 for a relief pitcher sucks. You know better
at this point, Joba is a project
_
I think you’re actually serious. What?
for a setup man. Who pitches 1 inning at a time, mostly. Yes, 3.77 sucks
and yes. In regards to being a starter, Joba is a project
Joba’s ERA as a setup man isn’t 3.77, it’s 3.08. Which is solid.
His ERA as a starter is 4.18. Which is also solid. Either of those marks from a 24 year old pitcher in the AL East should be considered quality young pitching and not someone who “sucks”.
Joba and Gardner wouldn’t get us Butler, let alone Greinke
Joba is not cost-controlled going forward. He’s eligible for arb this year and thus is going to pull in 7 figures for likely the rest of his career, only 3 years of which are under team control. Joba doesn’t suck, but he + Gardner is not nearly enough.
I would be shocked to the point of speechless if this package actually got Grienke.
Long-term I may like Greinke better than Lee. It would depend 402838383% on the package we sent, though. But I’d be willing to part with, be the Yanks driven to the point where they need Greinke because they’ve failed on FAs, something like the following:
Gardner/Banuelos/Betances/Nova
Nova would likely be at least a candidate for their 2011 rotation, and Gardner would probably become their most productive offensive player. They’d get a great all-around SP prospect in Banuelos and a long-shot with potentially big payoff in Betances.
Again, this is only if we can’t get Lee AND Pettitte doesn’t come back, and it would be my limit in that scenario. If Lee signs, I’d replace Gardner and Banuelos with lesser prospects (not going to get it done); if Pettitte signs but Lee doesn’t, I’d replace Banuelos with a lesser prospect (probably would not get it done).
If the Yankees are put in a scenario where making a realistic trade for Greinke becomes even particularly attractive, let alone necessary, however, I probably won’t be a very happy camper to begin with.
Grit Gardner and Joba to KC for Greinke?
Throw Melky and IPK in there and we got a deal!
/not really
Add Venditte and Nunez, and baby, you’ve got a stew going.
/Carl Weathers
#whythefuckdidthatshowgetcancelled
Gardner, Joba, Kevin Russo, Phil Coke, Eric Duncan, and cash?
/soundsgoodtome’d
Gardner and Joba to the Royals
Grienke and Peavy to the Cubs
Zambrano and Samardzija to the White Sox
Alexei Ramirez, Mark Teahen, and Scott Linebrink to the Yankees
/PhilRogers’d
I just want Cliff Lee. Just get it done, Cashninja
I’m greedy. I want Cliff Lee AND Zack Greinke. We have enough pieces to get Greinke without giving up Phil Hughes, Manny Banuelos, Gary Sanchez or Jesus Montero.
Sure, we could just give up Robinson Cano instead.
Wait what
What pieces are left to get it done exactly?
Pat Venditte for Greinke
Cano
Cano? No.
REALLY no. why the hell would you wanna plug the SP hole by creating an even bigger 2B hole
Just give Lee the cash goddammit.
We have to at least entertain the possibility that the “no New York” reports were true and the Royals are just trying to get the Yankees (and other big market teams) involved in the bidding here.
Greinke for AJ + $200MM.
Get it done Ninja!!
I think we’ll need to throw in a bit more money.
I’d have no problem trading for Greinke even if we get Lee and Petttitte comes back.
We have a logjam for a year (and inevitably someone is going to get hurt) and then a solid 5 for 2012 (well, as solid as it can be with AJ anyway). Not to mention, insurance in case CC opts out.
Drool.
In 2011, AJ would be a nice marginal upgrade over Mitre.
Drool.
For some reason I never liked Greinke. I have no way of explaining it so don’t give me a lecture on his stats because I know what they look like. Theres just something about Greinke thats AJ Burnett like to me. From the games I’ve seen, he’s either good Greinke, or he’s bad Greinke.
I forgot to mention I hope the Yankees get him in a good deal. His numbers are too good to pass up. I just get a bad feeling about the guy.
You should get your gut checked out because there is something seriously wrong with it if it doesn’t get all warm and fuzzy about Greinke.
I’ve got no problem with you not liking Grienke for whatever reason you choose, but please don’t say that Greinke is like A.J. Burnett.
Greinke is MILES better of a pitcher than Burnett.
Burnett’s peaks are equal to Grienke’s peaks; Burnett’s valleys make Greinke’s valleys look like flatlands.
Who gives a damn? I like Florida, as well as Albuquerque. I’d like them even more if they offered me a 140 million dollar deal, too
Pena, Nunez, Golson, AJ, and Steinbrenner’s excessive monument for Greinke, Moustakas, Montgomery, Lamb, and Soria. If they balk, throw in a few million.
BOOM!
If Moore plays hardball we can cave in and throw Igawa in there too.
Whoa, whoa, let’s keep the trade based in reality. If we parted with Igawa, then the Royals would have to throw in their mascot to even things out.
What use would we have for Dayton Moore?
IETCVM
Thinking about it doesn’t it make more sense to put teams on your list that might actually trade for you, so then you, the player have leverage in the negotiation. If you’re Grienke you know Pittsburgh probably isn’t going to trade for you at this point, and a team like the Astros doesn’t have the farm to trade for anyone, so might leave them off the list. Whereas as team like the Yanks or Sox might be more likely to go after you.
This.
Also, it’s a 15 team no trade list. So, the Yankees would be a 51.7% chance to be on it if he picked the teams out of a hat.
If it can be done w/o giving up Montero, the Yankees should do it. If it can’t be done w/o giving up Montero, the Yankees should still at least consider it.
Depends on what a Montero-less package would be.
That.
I disagree. I mean obviously don’t give up the entire farm, but I’d say, you can have Gardner, Joba, then pick any two/three guys from our farm not named Jesus.
But don’t you think the Royals will ask for Hughes if they’re giving up Greinke? Hughes and Montero should be untouchable in any Greinke deal IMO.
Just imagine; CC, Lee, Pettitte, Greinke, Hughes.
Ok, that’s enough, back to reality.
where does AJ go?
To KC, obviously.
Teh 8th.
Pen/6th starter till someone gets hurt.
If that is ever a reality, who cares!? Most expensive middle reliever/long man/6th pitcher ever? Probably not worth the amount of money that must be eaten to send him to KC.
Barry Zito says hi.
Hell, even if they sign Lee, I say go get Greinke anyway. No such thing as too much pitching, especially when you’re talking about guys of this caliber.
That would leave Andy Pettitte as the odd man out, right?
They’re looking for a second lefty in the bullpen, right?
Andy to the pen!
(cue Francesa rant)
Umm…. if Andy was the odd man out, and AJ had a spot in the rotation, I would…. I would….. stop being a Yankee fan.
No. Wait. That’s not it. Don’t think I’m capable of that.
I’d shoot my TV.
To me if the Yanks have $15M to spend on one player for 2011 (after getting Lee and bringing back Pettitte) I’d much rather have Greinke and Nunez (or another REPLACEMENT SS) than Jeter. Even considering the prospects they’d have to give up.
Burnett is the odd man out, thank Mo.
Burnett is the odd man out, thank Mo.
Burnett has a contract, Andy does not.
Is the upgrade at 5th starter from AJ -> Andy worth whatever Andy Pettite will make this year? No. Pettitte is the odd man out in this scenario.
Burnett has a contract, Andy does not.
Repeated for emphasis.
“Is the upgrade at 5th starter from AJ -> Andy worth whatever Andy Pettite will make this year? No. Pettitte is the odd man out in this scenario.”
Are you asking if paying Pettitte about 12M is worth it if he’s REPLACING Burnett in the rotation? The answer to that is ABSOLUTELY!
Burnett was replacement level or worse this past year. That’s a huge upgrade.
That. Pettite is a better pitcher than AJ. Especially now when AJ could be anywhere from a replacement player to a number 2. However it’s much more likely it’s somewhere in the middle but still not anywhere near Andy’s level.
I’d take Andy instead of the 10 million you save. Stick AJ in the pen ro dump him for all I care if the above scenario comes to reality.
Chances of the Yankees signing Andy Pettitte for 10-13M to be the fifth starter (behind CC/Lee/Greinke/Hughes, who will be making about 65M per year, mind you) just to gain a marginal upgrade and push A.J. Burnett and the 49.5M left on the books into a bullpen role:
-1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000%
Absopostivelutely! I would consider Mike Mussina over AJ Burnett after last season. 1/2 season of Andy would be better than a full season of AJ.
AJ has good stuff in the pen. The only starter I would consider ‘TO T3H 8TH’
Can you imagine good AJ/bad AJ in teh 8thgh!!! though? Eek
It would help to limit Mo’s innings.
Still not getting on board with this. As someone who has suffered from depression, I know what it’s like to be depressed. Mainly in that it never really goes away. It lingers.
Considering Greinke’s depression was so recent, who’s to say what happens if he starts getting shelled and booed at the Stadium? Ed Whitson all over again? Or does he work his way through it.
Put me in the camp of not believing he could succeed under those circumstances. I like Greinke and certainly root for him, but I just don’t think the risk is worth the cost.
Girardi a better fit for a fragile psyche than Billy Martin was for Whitson’s.
Would he be AJ part deux?
As if ‘depressed’ = one narrow specific thing.
Maybe he’s partly depressed because he’s on a shitty team with no hope of improving?
Being depressed and having social anxiety doesn’t necessarily mean he can’t stand on a mound once a week and throw 100 pitches while (probably) getting good run support and being surrounded by future HOF’ers for the first time in his MLB career.
Playing in NYC doesn’t mean he has to socialize with 50,000 fans every day.
I’m sure many players have all sorts of mental issues that they deal with.
Okay, steering clear of being preachy here (I hope), but clinical depression is a certain condition that can be diagnosed and, if left untreated, leads in an alarming number of cases to suicide. That said, treatments today are very successful.
I suffered a bout of it a long time ago, and it’s no joke. If Greinke had it, it’s hard to believe he actually went out to the mound with any success while suffering it. It means, too, that he could/should be fine pitching for the Yanks, if he’s managed properly (and I don’t mean by Joe G).
Plenty of us have been diagnosed with a depressive disorder. Plenty of us get over it and deal with it. I can’t imagine that Greinke hasn’t taken steps to deal with it. If he is interested in pitching for NY, he should be encouraged.
Two possible trades I saw for Greinke that I found interesting were Justin Upton and Colby Rasmus.
I suspect that the dealing Upton is at least slightly financially motivated, So Greinke wouldn’t make a lot of sense for the D-Backs. Rasmus however, makes a ton of sense. The Royals aren’t getting a better player back better than Rasmus and the fact he plays center field makes him fit their future perfectly. Two of their best prospects, Eric Hosmer and Mike Moustakas (most likely top ten overall in the game) are corner infielders and Will Myers, another one of their top prospects is a Catcher now but could easily end up elsewhere. Throw Billy Bultler into the mix and you can easily see how nicely Rasmus fits in.
Romine, Betences, Gardner, Noesi, Nunez?
Cervelli, Stoneburner, Golson, Pena, and Casey Kelly?
and Casey Kelly
How dare you sir!?!?!? Trading Casey Kelly for Grienke would be like trading a $100 bill for three twenties.
Trading Casey Kelly for Grienke would be like trading a
$100$100,000 bill for three twenties.Fixed. It’s all about the Wilsons, baby.
Trade Phil
Greinke is young enough (and good enough) that I personally would have no qualms with trading any of the non-Jesus prospects for. I’d even think long and hard about a Greinke-Jesus straight up, but I’d doubt Moore (even in his immense stupidity) would do it seeing as they have Wil Myers at C and Hosmer at 1B for the next 10 years.
My biggest concern with Greinke is his bout with MDD and social phobia. Recurrence for social phobia is around 35% over 10 years. Comorbid MDD has around a 70% recurrence over 10 years. Too much risk in my opinion when you have him move from Kansas City to a place like New York.
source?
http://ajp.psychiatryonline.or.....162/6/1179
It says recurrence for social phobia is 39% over 12 years from intake and 75% for comorbid MDD over 12 years from intake. They also have graphs that are in agreement with my above statements.
At the same time this article says roughly 44% of those diagnosed actually get treatment. That is something Greinke does so his chances of recurrence may be significantly lower than that.
http://ajp.psychiatryonline.or.....type=HWCIT
Honestly though its crazy that people think the man is a leper because of SAD. He has gone something far more stressful than a game, and came out all the better. Considering half the damn nation is on anti-depressants and/or anxiety the chances are very high that more than a few players and superstars are battling the same issues but aren’t saying anything unlike Greinke.
No one says a single thing about addicts like Miguel Cabrera or Hamilton not being able to handle the spotlight. (an addict is always an addict, hence why no one is ever cured from an addiction) You don’t turn to drugs or booze because your happy, no people turn to those poisons because they are suffering from those same demons as Greinke is yet they weren’t strong enough to seek help.
I am shocked this is leaking out right before the Lee bidding begins
lol nice
I personally think Grienke would probably be fine if he came to NY mentally, but I just would not want to give that much up for him. No Hughes, no Montero, and if that Lefty B pitcher is as good as everyone is making him out to be, I don’t really want to give him up either. I guess if we don’t sign Lee and have to panic, maybe, but even then, I would not give up a huge amount for him.
That “Lefty B pitcher” is Manny Banuelos.
Haha, that reminded me of my dad.
At least we possibly maybe have a backup if the Lee deal falls through. Maybe. Or something.
I wonder if the Yankees expressed interest in Greinke, giving the Royals cause to ask Greinke in the first place. I mean, I understand the Yankees must do their due diligence, just curious if they are serious about a possible pursuit.
Likely not. Lee’s there for money and the Yankees like their trading chips.
Well, if Cashman didn’t ask about him, you’d have to wonder why. The whole scenario of Greinke not wanting to rule out pitching for the Yanks seems entirely plausible.
Isn’t this great fodder? Hot Stove League, early-season highlight, that’s what this post is.
And my congratulations on the “serious” trade proposals. They serve a great purpose, namely, keeping me and all other Yankee afficionadoes (“Yankionadoes”? – Oh! That hurt.) thoroughly amused.
I’d do a Gardner, Joba, Betances, Romine, Warren, Nunez deal. That would give them two solid pitching prospects, a starting shortstop, a reliever/starter and a future catcher with great potential. 4 of our top 10 prospects and a young outfielder that is very cheap.
that’s a bit much. Take out Romine or Betances and we’re talking.
Take out Gardner, and replace Betances and Warren with Noesi and Nova and you got yourself a damn fine deal.
so, joba romine nunez nova noesi is enough to get greinke?? hahaha
Why would the Royals want quantity over quality?
someone is probably trying to trade for him and bringing NY into the mix will drive up the price…No way a guy with Social Anxiety can pitch in NY…just look at Javy.
Social Anxiety Disorder? Depression?
Woody Allen is as New York as they get.
So Zack, we got the most and the best shrinks, how bout it?
They could go for broke and trade the farm for Greinke and Upton and have a rotation of Lee, CC, Greinke, Hughes and whoever….but seriously no..i dont want another head case.
No to Greinke. Pissing away good trading chips on a guy who could jump off of a bridge at any time seems drastic.
Ah, the nuanced and erudite vox populi weighs in with its cogent and thoughtful opinion!
First, I believe the S.A.D. would be a self-fulfilling prophecy when it comes to NY fans / media and how tough they can be if you don’t produce 100% of the time.
That being said, I would think the Royals would have to jump at Joba, Adams, Nova, and either Heathcott or Gardner. Joba would be close to home and a starter, Adams is blocked at second and this was a trouble spot for KC, Nova is a wildcard who happens to be ML-ready, and both Slade and Gardner play the Royals kind of ball (put it in play and run / + defense).
I hate to lose Gardner but, it’s definitely selling high.
i don’t like this. i don’t like this at all. while i love greinke as a player, i’m realllly scared not of his social abilities, but of the return he would command. like, they would want montero, two kiler b’s, joba, and gardner in all likelihood.
Try to trade for Greinke no matter what. What you give up depends all on your internal scouting. Obviously, their internal scouting is not public knowledge, so we can’t really know what they think fair value is. However, it will hurt and it might be worth it.
Social anxiety disorder…nothing a lot of run support and post-season hardware can’t cure!!!
Don’t think they’d want Joba. He’s not too far from free agency at this point.
Same with Gardner… soon to be arbitration player… not gonna help a basement-dwelling team like KC.
They want Montero, who I want to see stick around. That means they’d probably want Romine and Banuelos, along with some other decent pieces (Adams?) and that still may not be enough.
I think we’ll see Cliff pitching for us next year, but Greinke doesn’t seem too likely. Texas looks like the best bet.
Haven’t we seen this movie before i.e: Javy Vazquez, Randy Johnson, Kevin Brown etc.. Enough! This kid will crumble in a big market. Come on Cashman don’t let me down on this one. Grienke was born for a small market team like the Brewers or some other nothing franchise. He will mentally implode on that mound in any high leverage situation.