Sunday Night Open Thread
By
Raise some hell, Prince. (Matt Slocum / AP)
The Rangers clinched their second straight trip to the World Series with a blowout win last night, and the Cardinals have a chance to claim their third NL pennant in the last eight years with a win tonight. Shaun Marcum, who hasn’t made it out of the fifth inning in any of his last three starts (two in the playoffs, one in the regular season), is charged with saving the Brewers season. He’s allowed fewer than five runs in exactly one of his last six starts. So yeah, the odds are stacked against my adopted Brew Crew.
Anywho, here is tonight’s open thread. Like I said, the Cards have a chance to advance to the World Series with a win tonight (8pm ET on TBS, Marcum vs. Edwin Jackson), and the late football game is the awful Vikings at the slightly less awful Bears (8:20pm on NBC). And hey, there’s also the Walking Dead season premiere at 9pm (on AMC), so hooray for that. Talk about whatever you like here, anything goes.
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I’m stuck between a rock and a hard place. Do I root for the Cardinals because they’re the extreme underdogs and because Albert Pujols deserves more than one measly ring? Or do I root for the Brewers because they have a much better shot at beating the Rangers?
Don’t underestimate the Cardinals. They knocked the best team in baseball out of the postseason in an elimination game on the road.
The Cardinals have a better offense than the Brewers and Carpenter-Garcia-Jackson is legit.
If Wilson leaves Texas I could see them making a run at Fielder. That would be pretty interesting.
Apparently Texas isn’t a fan of those 100 million contracts. Not that I blame them but it’s tough to imagine them going hard for Fielder especially with a top 5 MLB offense.
But if Wilson leaves, Neftali will start.
Anyone else gotten into Breaking bad? I’ve been addicted to the show.
IMO best show on TV. The Wire might be the best ever but BB has the title currently. I’m a big Mad Men fan too.
Breaking Bad is just one small notch below being mentioned with The Sopranos and The Wire. Next best thing after those two shows. Haven’t seen Mad Men yet, but its on my list.
After watching a 5 day marathon of the first four seasons of BBad, I’m gonna give Mad Men a chance now, thanks.
Breaking Bad > The Wire.
This is the textbook definition of a false statement.
Whatever happens in the WS Texas deserves a lot of credit for back to back AL pennants, something the Yankees haven’t done since the glory years of 98-01. I hope Cashman studies what Texas has done and emulates some of the things that they’ve done well. We’ve gotten away from how we built that Yankee dynasty of the late 90s and continue to flush money down the toilet on guys that constantly fail in the postseason- Swisher, Teixera, Sabathia, Arod. I’d love to have Nelson Cruz instead of Swisher.
Do you know what you’re saying?
Yeah A-Rod and Sabathia have never came through in the postseason. 2009 never happened.
Yankees: 27 championships, 40 pennants
Rangers: 0 championships, 2 pennants
Yeah, I think I’ll take the Yankees.
Since the Rangers were established in 1961:
Yankees: 9 championships, 15 pennants
Rangers: 0 championships, 2 pennants
In the last 15 years:
Yankees: 5 championships, 7 pennants
Rangers: 0 championships, 2 pennants
I don’t know where Supernova is going with this.
I don’t know why I’m bothering to respond because it’s a clearly derpy comment, but the Rangers do a lot right. Good farm system, smart trades, etc etc etc. But then you have crazy things like WE NEED PLAYERS WHO ARE GOOD IN THE POSTSEASON!! like this is something inherent that you can tell.
Also, the Yankees have a championship thanks to those four guys Supernova mentioned. Can’t say that about the Rangers, at least not yet.
The Yankees wouldn’t be in the postseason without some of the guys who struggle there. And you could say that the Rangers wouldn’t be where they are right now if the MLB didn’t bail them out in 2010 after they went bankrupt.
Swisher and Teixeira didn’t do shit in 2009.
What about Tex’s walk off? Does that count?
That’s still under review.
I’m probably gonna sound overly defend-y here but for a guy who didn’t hit a whole lot in the 2009 postseason, Tex did have a bunch of big hits. Kinda like Tino in that way. Swisher, fine, whatever.
Teix’s hits aren’t close to what Tino has done even though they were both horrible in the postseason. Tino had his two run homer off Kim in the World Series to tie it. Also has his grand slam in 98. Teix has nothing comparable. Sure it’s great he barely got a walkoff HR in the ALDS when it was a tie game but Tino even with his sucky triple slash did more than Teix.
Sure it’s great he barely got a walkoff HR in the ALDS when it was a tie game
Barely? What does this even matter? Did the Yankees actually just win the ALDS because a bunch of the Tigers’ HRs were wall-scrapers to RF?
Epic nitpicking skills right there.
Says the dude who complained about a walk-off home run in the postseason
Epic wrongness skills there.
You forgot the “right.”
His OBP was near .200 in 2009. He blows.
Tino Martinez’s career in the postseason: .233/.321/.351 (At least he had those two HUGE home runs in the 1998 and the 2001 World Series)
Mark Teixeira’s career in the postseason: .207/.315/.322
Nick Swisher’s career in the postseason: you don’t want to know (it’s that bad)
It’s one of the classic A-Rod bashing things, the only postseasons of his career that matter are the last 4 games of the 2004 ALCS, the 2006 & 2011 ADLS. Next year he could hit .900 with 17 HR’s & 50 RBI’s all the way to the World Series but if in 2013 the Yankees lose in the ALDS & he hits .250 “he can’t hit in the playoffs” & 2013 would join the seasons that “define” his playoff career.
Whatever happens in the WS Texas deserves a lot of credit for back to back AL pennants, something the Yankees haven’t done since the glory years of 98-01.
You talk about this like it’s sooooo easy.
Also Nelson Cruz went 4 for 20 in the 2010 WS and 1 for 15 in the 2011 ALDS. He’s craaaazy streaky and if you breathe on his hamstrings they pop. And I say this as someone who loves him.
If people think Eric Chavez is made of glass, they need to look twice at Nellie Cruz, like you said. Dude is FRAGILE. A great player but if he can’t stay healthy…
I like the Yankees healthy outfielders far more than the breakable (and if I’m being honest, DUMB) Texas OF. Hamilton and Cruz are perpetual injury risks.
It’s easy for him to write.
Nelson Cruz at 31? Much prefer Montero at 21. I truly feel he would have put up excellent #’s had we not had Jorge under 13M contract this year. He would then have played in every post season game as Cruz has. Oh well. I know Jorge was good in the post season but not Cruz-good. Montero has that capability.
Jesus Montero has a 1.000/1.000/1.000 line in his postseason career.
Legendary
The only one who can stop him is Girardi and his binder.
People forget, how can they forget this(OH my!)
A-rod deserves a lot of credit for opt-out the contract and give Texas free(21M) extra money.BIG reason.
Pretty sure I remember hearing that Texas still had to pay that subsidy regardless of ARod’s opt-out clause.
When A-rod opt-out,Texas already save 21M no matter what.
You didn’t read news when he opt-out?
This “Texas still had to pay..” is 04~07′s, not 08~10′.
When player opt-out, that’s meant his current contract ineffective already, why his team still have to pay him?
We still have to pay CC’s salary regardless he go other team next year or not?
…And some even said that, Texas knew A-rod take steroid Is part of the reason why he opt-out.
So now it’s time to give Walking Dead a chance. AMC has been doing it right.
First (short) season was great, a lot of turmoil with the show though with fired writers & issues coming from budget restraints from AMC’s deal with Mad Men. All that said, I’m excited & if they kill that blonde chick tonight I’ll be even more excited for the season.
Anyone interested the 1st season is streaming on Netflix.
Tonight’s Sunday Night Football game is unwatchable. Well, unless you’re a Viking or Bear fan of course…
Watch 6 time Pro Bowler Donovan McNabb!
God he’s awful these days.
Being so familiar with Philly’s offense really masked how badly his skills have eroded in the past few seasons. Despite being an Eagle for so long I always liked McNabb, shame to see him end his career on such a bad note.
Boardwalk empire is where its at
gotta root for the brewers
I’m rooting for the Brew Crew tonight. I just want to see a Game 7. In Game 7, I’d have to say I’d be rooting for the Cardinals.
He’s Lance Berkman he’s really good and all.
I can’t believe the Brewers allowed Pujols AND Berkman to take an extra base. That’s just terrible.
David Freese, the St. Louis kid.
He is the NLCS MVP if the Cards win.
I was discussing CJ Wilson v. Cole Hamels with a friend of mine, I take Wilson all the way. Over the last three years he’s outwared Hamels 12.5 to 12.2 despite only starting for two and pitching in aAs tougher division (and league for that matter)
Wilson’s stats as a stater (including 21 innings as a starter in 2005):
K/9 7.76
BB/9 3.51
FIP 3.51
xFIP 3.77
ERA 3.57
GB% 49.3
The K-rate isn’t the best, and there’s a bit too many walks, but he’s shown a lot of improvement from last season, and besides in 2010 and 2011 Wilson was better than Hamels in both years.
Hamels is 3 years younger with a longer track record (even if in the NL). I’d go with him. Wilson just led the AL in walks in 2010. No thanks.
I’m in the camp of passing on Wilson, although that’s based on what I expect his price to be. I don’t see how he goes for less years and money than AJ and Lackey, and I don’t want that type of contract attached to Wilson if he’s on my team.
The walks don’t bother me. He only walked 74 in 220 innings this year, and even in 2010 when he did lead the league, it wasn’t anything crazy, leading with 93 in more than 200 innings. I don’t view him as a walk machine, and indeed I would see him getting even better on that front, as he showed this year.
The contract length/money and his rapid increase in innings over the past two years are of greater concern.
Well he was a reliever until 2010 so that explains the rapid increase of innings, and for the record I’m not saying sign CJ Wilson, I’m in the Darvish camp. However, I am saying that there’s no reason to not try to get Wilson so that they can make a run at Hamels next year, Wilson’s just as good, if not better.
I agree with you about the track record, but I mean…over the last three years Wilson’s been better despite being a reliever in 2009. At a certain point you have to strongly consider CJ Wilson being the better pitcher.
The youth isn’t that big of a deal, IMO. I mean it’s something, but Wilson was a reliever for quite a while and he doesn’t have the wear on his arm that a typical starter his age does. As far as leading the AL in walks in 2010, he still put up a 4.6 fWAR, Cole Hamels’ career high fWAR is 4.4. CJ has improved his control quite a bit since last year, and I’m confident in him being a better pitcher over the next two or three years.
Err…I didn’t see that Hamels put up a 4.9 fWAR this year. But still were talking a difference of .3 fWAR despite Wilson pitching in the AL and Hamels facing a pitcher for about a tenth of the batters he faces.
The Cardinals starters just can’t seem to throw shutdown innings in this series. It hasn’t effected them though, yet.
That’s what you get for sliding headfirst into first base, Jerry.
I love how absolutely shitty starting pitching has been pretty much this entire postseason.
Last postseason the narrative was “good pitching beats goods hitting”. In reality, it goes both ways.
…and how the team with the greatest rotation ever assembled got knocked out in the DS for the second year in a row. Makes you kind of think the entire thing is pretty random, no?
Edwin Jackson. #nope
Another long night for the Cards bullpen…
The Machine goes boom
What’s the record for HRs in an MLB CS game?
7 i believe
7. They mentioned that earlier in the game. This one has 6 so far.
That’s gotta fall tonight the way the ball if flying off both the bats of both teams.
David Freese just missed tying the record by a couple of feet.
I’m rooting for the Cardinals for the same reason I rooted against the Rangers last year. Beast mode, antler claws, you would never see a professional organization like the New York Yankees do anything that ridiculous. St Louis is a classy organization and it certainly shows on the field.
As per what Ron Darling just said, clearly the re-emergence of pitching dominance in baseball has taken a back seat in the last eight days.
*for the last eight days.
Before anyone thinks I view the last eight days as a definite long-term trend in the direction of offense.
Phew! I was about to rip on you for starting a narrative based on a small sample size!
Noesi on an innings limit for next season?
I thought all that innings limit stuff was for guys UNDER 25 years of age? At least that is what Tom “I changed pitching forever” Verducci has stated in his annual piece on limits.
Noesi will be 25 in January.
Let him be in the starting rotation and let him have 30+ starts, with no innings limits.
He will be so much better in 2013 because of it.
Did someone say he was on an innings limit for next year? Based on his age and the fact he has already logged 160 innings in a season in 2010, I see no reason he couldn’t give the yankees 180 innings next year, not that I think he’ll be given the chance to pitch 180 innings.
I have a feeling he will be an Alfredo Aceves type next year. Putting him in the rotation next year would require (assuming they get a #2) putting Hughes or Burnett in the pen, which I’d love to see, but doubt they do.
What’s the status of the Brewer bullpen? This game is a pitch away from getting nasty and their starter has been bad all game. Get him out.
Wow, didn’t realize he was the second pitcher! I joined late.
They’re already in their pen, Marcum only went 1 inning.
Narveson didn’t even start tonight, Marcum did. Both were terrible.
This year’s World Series is going to feature a bunch of bullpen arms, some of whom will be experiencing Phil Hughes syndrome next year after being worked to death in the post-season.
I can’t believe LaTroy Hawkins is still on baseball. I remember reading that he is one of the nicest guys in the game so god for him, but damn, fees like he was terrible for us like 5 years ago.
*in, **feels.
He was pretty awful in the half-season he was here.
Though I only remember the O’Neill fiasco involved with him.
That’s a ball that Cano gets an out on.
You have to hand it to the Cardinals, their offense is relentless.
They score early and often. If only the Yankees could have done that….
They can. They just didn’t. : -)
I don’t know who I’ll be rooting for in a Texas-St. Louis World Series.
St. Louis obviously.
I absolutely cannot stand the Claw and Antlers. They must be stopped dead in their tracks, stomped out, eliminated. If the Rangers win the World Series it will only encourage this revolting phenomena to spread. Tony LaRussa be damned.
It’s the Tony LaRussa factor that prevents me from rooting for the Cardinals, yet the things that annoy me about the Rangers right now are higher, so it looks like it will be the Cardinals.
Neither of these starting rotations has been very good. Detroit was better in the DS (not in the LCS tho).
Hence the danger of a five-game series.
Too bad the Yankees couldn’t have made it to the next round. They were a puff of wind short on Jeter’s ball of advancing. With the Phillies removed, I would have moved the Yankees to the front of the class.
Yeah. Stupid 5 game series.
Stupid Bud Selig.
Another reason why I’m rooting for the Cards.
Just wondering, what kind of contract may Matt Kemp receive on the open market? And who thinks the Dodgers will actually re-sign Kemp?
He’s going to get Carl Crawford money, at least.
With the Dodgers or another team?
The Dodgers won’t be able to sign Kemp to a contract upwards of 140 million dollars in their current state. And they probably won’t be able to when his contract expires after the 2012 season unless they’re purchased by some rich tycoon willing to invest in his team (Mark Cuban anyone?). My gut says he’ll sign with another team. And we all know that gut >>> fact.
The current state of the Dodgers is going to change and change fast once the team is sold. The new owners (whoever they might be) will be keen to keep the faces of the franchise, is my guess.
It’s hard to guess how fast the Dodgers situation will go on. Could it last another year? If not and a new owner is on board, I can see them going in heavy on Kemp.
Anyone know anything about the relationship between Martin and Kemp? A few good words from Russell could help sway Kemp if he’s on the bubble and the Yankees are looking to sign him, as I suspect they will try.
Kemp gets along with Martin as well as Hideki Matsui gets along and wants to be teammates with his fellow Japanese ballplayers (like Ichiro)!
/Kay’d
He’s going to get Carl Crawford money and then another sixty million unless he sucks next year.
This is gonna be the worst World Series, evah.
Worse, I live in Texas. Do not want to deal with a Rangers as WS Champions experience.
The Rally Squirrel will crush the Claws and Anthers.
God willing.
Yes. I find nothing appealing about Cardinals-Rangers. Don’t even want to watch it, in fact.
Yeah I’m thinking the baseball watching ends tonight.
Time to return to regular scripted tv.
Won’t be as bad as 2006. Any World Series that has David Eckstein win the MVP is automatically the worst series ever.
And Scott Rolen was the rightful MVP, IMO.
2 hours in and this game isn’t even in the fifth inning yet.
Are we sure this isn’t a Yankees-Red Sox game?
The baseball gods hate me, I have decided.
At least I’ve got Boardwalk Empire when I get home.
You’re not alone.
No. The baseball gods would have made you a Mets fan if they really hated you.
Amended statement: The baseball gods hate me at this particular moment.
And the Brewers too.
Ratings-wise they hate FOX even more.
Suck it, Fox.
really? What they do to you, pat d?
Good Luck, Fox!
I despise Rupert Murdoch.
Wow the Brewers defense is atrocious.
We knew it was bad, but wow, so much worse than ever before.
So…the Cards are going to the WS the same year that they lose one of the best pitchers in the NL. Nuts.
This entire season has been the epitome of John Sterling’s time-tested motto, YCPB.
And the Rangers went back after losing one of the best pitchers in the AL.
They at least added Beltre.
Oh, and the awesome Mike Napoli.
Just as it appears the Brewers will make the game interesting, the Cardinals come back and tack on several more runs. Bad pitching all around this game.
The MSM is creaming it’s pants over the Rangers offense, Nelson Cruz in particular (and rightfully so), but damn. This Cardinals offense is firing on all-cylinders.
David Freese has had a NLCS as good as Cruz’s ALCS.
Pujols is hurt?
The Rangers are so going to win if Pujols can’t play.
There is no D in Brewers but there are a bunch of Es. /obligatory bad joke
I’m not trying to jinx the Cardinals or anything, but World Series title would mean a lot to St. Louis. And I mean A LOT.
Here’s what I mean: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....ata_player
Impressive how baseball fans still believe Milwaukee will win NLCS after St. Louis lead 3-2.It’s a shame people didn’t give Pujols enough credit not fires back Morgan. Really happy for him right now.
Hey, a Red State World Series. Yippee!
And?
And what?
I’ll be blunt, I hate the five game series and wild card format more than ever now.
You can’t tell me the two best teams are playing in the World Series right now.
Not when they both have starting rotions with ERA’s of over five and have to count on the offense and bullpen to bail them out in almost every game.
It sickens me…I know what happened in the ALDS but the Yanks are far superior to virtually all the teams still playing. Yet because of a lack of a couple clutch hits and Jeter’s almost home run missing..we’re home while a team that had to get in via a collapse is going to the World Series.