Jan
13
Sunday Night Open Thread
ByI haven’t seen a good baseball movie in a while, so I’m hoping 42 will live up to the hype the trailer has created. I’m not a huge movie guy but I’m definitely intrigued, that’s for sure.
Anyway, here is tonight’s open thread. The Texans and Patriots are still playing (on CBS), plus the Nets are in action as well. Talk about either game or anything else here. Enjoy.
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The Eric Jagielo Watch
I’m a big Eli fan, but I have to admit, I die a little bit inside every time I hear that people would rather have Eli Manning than Dan Marino.
The majority of the people who post here are probably to young to have seen how unbelievably superb Marino was. The numbers he’d have put up in this era would have been just staggering.
He’s the perfect example why you cant define a players career solely by the number of championships won like that 14 year old was trying to say last night.
too young.
That discussion, in fact, is where the comment came from.
Don’t know where that guy came from but I bailed after reading the ridiculous juvenile crap he was writing.
He kept thinking he was insulting me or something? And he called me thick at one point, at which I left. I found out later that he said “sorry for insulting you”. Which wasn’t the reason I left. I left because I realized at that point that any argument I gave was totally futile.
If there’s anything I was not, it’s insulted.
He was like a child incapable of abstract thinking. Everyone was either black or white, nothing in between.
You either win championships or you’ve failed, you’re either clutch or you choke, context and circumstances surrounding the situation have no bearing.
And you guys are like old losers who dot understand the concept of competition. Keep coddleing one another though your therapsts will love that. Back in my day how suerb.. blah blah people remember and prefer he winner for a reason.
And yeah you do either win or fail. Thats why Peyton said that losing “hurt” because he failed.
Yeah, I’d agree. Marino had a better balanced supporting cast, but I’d still prefer him to Eli.
Living in Colorado, there are a lot of people right near the edge right now. Can’t blame it on Peyton though. Champ Bailey was owned and Fox made a terrible call not trying for the first down with 1:20 left in the game.
Not sure if I’d prefer Peyton or Eli. Eli is more athletic right now, but Peyton is certainly a smart QB.
Marino usually had better wide outs than Eli but he never had close to the defense or running game that Eli has had throughout most of his career.
I wouldn’t say Marino always had better wideouts. He certainly did with the Marks brothers. The 90′s brought some slim pickings.
Yes, though. The defenses were not good and we’re talking over a decade without any semblance of a running game.
A lot of loyalty there.
You can’t blame it SOLELY on Peyton, but whether they should have been at that point he threw that pick, and that’s all him.
The INT was all on Mannng but Decker cost them 7 points when he bobbled a ball right in his hands that became a pick 6 and it’s inexcusable for the safety to let Jacoby get behind him for a 70 yard TD with 40 seconds left.
Oh absolutely, but as tends to happen there’s this backlash growing that almost completely ignores Manning’s role in the loss, and that’s just as inaccurate as blaming him for everything.
What’s funny is with his brother, it’s the polar opposite. I think Eli is a very good clutch QB but the way he’s perceived could have very easily been very very different if a few plays in his career had turned out differently.
Eli is definitely clutch and he deserves eveything he’s accomplished but he’s gotten a few huge breaks to go his way in his career that it seems hasn’t happened with Peyton and its completely changed the perception of both of them.
.
You’re totally right.
I think when all is said and done Eli will have a shot at the HOF but face it-he never should have won that first SB MVP.
Did he have a great fourth quarter in general and orchestrate an ultra-clutch game-winning drive? Absolutely.
Was he the best player in that game? CLEARLY not. It should have gone to Tuck.
This is all true, but you could also say it’s inexcusable to have three turnovers or lose a game where your special teams scored 2 TDs.
You’re right. My point is its unfair to paint Mannng as the goat when there’s plenty of blame to go around just like he shouldn’t have gotten all the credit had they won.
as far as eli vs. marino goes, all I can say is that if you put a gun to my head, i’d have to say that I’d easily prefer layering fresh, thinly sliced deli meats on the nude, paisty white buttocks of dan marino over those of eli. them bitches is mad righteous, even modern day.
that’s nuts
who do you think you are? lando calrissian? go off and find yourself some rest maybe.
Grandy for Olt & whatever it takes for Upton.
YES/NO
No. I want Upton on the team but not at all costs
YES to the Grandy for Olt half?
Why would the Rangers do that?
I guess from the stand point of they have been trying to move olt in different deals during the winter and the Rangers lost out on Hamilton.
I’m ok with that part
Let’s see what this attracts.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eExiPjiOhc8
ietc
Oaktag.
17 interwebs are awarded to Pat D.
How does that convert to Schrute Bucks?
Can’t wait for this movie. I’ve always been a Jackie Robinson history ‘buff’ ever since I did a report on him in 8th grade.
This movie looks bad ass. Seems to have more of the edge that was really there back then. Annnnd, the guy looks exactly like JR.
I will puke if the Patriots once AGAIN find their way to the Super, and with the Giants not there to beat them once they get there.
Bostonians are annoying enough. They don’t need more ammunition for which they can piss off the rest of America.
I’m rooting for an Atlanta-Baltimore SB though I think it’s gonna be New England-SF in which case I’ll have no choice but to root for NE.
Who are you a fan of?
Because if it’s the Giants, they actually have a pretty stellar playoff record against the Niners.
There’s no chance of me rooting for the Patriots, even if they’re facing the Falcons. I’d rather avoid that scenario, but I have no control over it.
It does disappoint me that I’ve never been able to appreciate the greatness of Tom Brady from an objective POV, because all he’s done is bring happiness to Bostonians. And I think we’ve all grown to hate that hell hole over the years.
I’m a Dallas fan so I despise the 49ers. I don’t particularly like the Pats because of the whole Boston thing but I can’t say I really hate them either. I actually used to like them pre-Bellechik in the Steve Grogan/Tony Eason/ Andre Tippett/Irving Fryar days.
Yeah, that makes sense.
Being a Bucs fan, rooting for the Falcons is one of the last things I ever want to do. But that still beats the Patriots winning, as far as I’m concerned. Atlanta sports fans don’t annoy me.
Falcons have been around since 1966 and have never won a SB so I’ wouldn’t mind seeing them win one. That’s a long, long drought.
Also, fuck Colin Kaepernick
That trailer looks awesome. I’m a huge sucker for baseball movies. Hell, I still carry on my own tradition of watching Field Of Dreams whenever I’m sick. I’m not much of a movie-goer myself, but I’ll go alone if it’s as good as the trailer.
That movie almost makes me cry when I watch it
/daddyproblems
Movie looks amazing, possibly a classic in the making. Also that quote sends chills down my spine “I don’t remember him, you will remember me”
Trouble with the curve was excellent…not a true baseball movie but other than “61″, what else was?
Are you telling me “Major league” was made up? Willie Mays Hayes has always been one of my favorite players.
Is it heresy to admit I like Major League 2? Because I do. I honestly think Bob Uecker is funnier in that one. Maybe that’s why it’s not as good, because it has to rely on him for all the laughs?
I can’t say I enjoyed the sequel much but most of the memorable lines from those movies were definitely from Uecker. I always found him hilarious too.
Bob Uecker is the best ever.
My only (possible) issues with what I’ve seen in the 42 trailer:
1) The guy make look like, but makes no attempt to sound like Jackie Robinson. Jackie has a fairly high pitched voice and this guy sounds the complete opposite.
2) It still looks like they show Jackie pimping a HR that he hits off a guy that drilled him in the head. If Jackie had ever done that, he’d have been drilled in the head again. Or maybe he hits the HR first and then gets drilled? More plausible, but does anyone know if such a thing happened?
The things I like about the trailer:
1) Seems to evoke the right time period.
2) Harrison Ford looks like he’s actually, ya know, acting for a change. Too bad this movie comes out in April, because if it came out later in the year, someone might start whispering about an Oscar nomination. After all, the guy has only been nominated ONE FREAKING TIME in his career and he’s now 70 years old. Meaning time is running out. Maybe they’ll cave and give him an honorary award one of these years? Who knows. But again: one freaking nomination. That’s the same number of nominations that Jonah Hill, Eddie Murphy, Matt Dillon, Kate Hudson, and Sylvester Stallone have. Yeesh.
3) Love how Leo Durocher basically tells the team to shut the fuck up and deal with Jackie’s presence.
4) Looks like they get some other detail correct. The scene with the guy in the Philadelphia uniform hurling insults at Jackie has to be then-Phillies manager (and former Yankees All-Star outfielder) Ben Chapman. Chapman made no bones about his distaste for Jackie. Wonder if they’ll show Dixie Walker apologizing to him come season’s end?
5) This isn’t shown in the trailer, but hopefully they do the right thing and end the movie accurately, showing the Yankees beating the Dodgers in the World Series. Because as we all know, that’s really all that matters. “Jackie, you tried to beat the Yankees and failed. The lesson is, never try.”
Ford is also Colonel Graff in the Ender’s Game movie that’s coming out in November. I’m pretty pumped to see what they do with that movie.
Loved the book.
On a related note, fucking NEVER talk smack about Han Solo and Indiana Jones. Fucking. Never.
Who shot first? Han or Indy?
Han Solo is a scruffy looking nerf herder.
Naturally, I try to post another YouTube clip and it doesn’t show up.
They should have gone with their first choice for Robinson — Daniel Day Lewis.
I feel certain he could have pulled it off brilliantly.
I just read through some of the (newest) Justin Upton thread. 2 things:
1. If 3/38 for Justin Upton is what the Yankees are balking at, I’m officially moving from what I felt was near the center to the “screw Hal” group. Seriously, this guy has the tools to be an MVP caliber player, and even if he stays at his current production level is still an elite player in the MLB. I said a couple weeks ago that some people were making him out to be the next Griffey Jr., and that’s an overblown evaluation of him, and I stand by that. However 12 and change a year for him is an outstanding value, and if it’s that and not the prospect cost of getting him this ownership needs to take a long hard look in the mirror and think about were their priorities are.
2. Who drugged Elton Cod?
It must be noted that that article was awful. The only way writing that could be justified is if he got all that information in off the record conversations but still wanted to write about it. He provides NO evidence regarding what the package is, let alone about the Yankees being willing to pay it.
It was a bunch of speculation. Sure, it could very well be true (and would certainly be in line with that’s being painted of Hal), but there doesn’t seem to be any actual evidence that it is.
Of course the article was awful. You read over that thread and either, 1) there are people who comment on here who completely lack the ability to critically look at what’s being reported to them, 2) there’s just a shit-ton of actual trolling going on.
I would found that article fishy when I was fourteen and reading it in, say, The National or something.
I think those posts by Elton Cod were just a poor attempt at irony/sarcasm.
Also, I think the budget thing is just a negotiating ploy or it Morosi speculating seeing how he says “the Yankees apparently don’t have the appetite for the three years and $38.5 million left on Upton’s contract”
I can’t believe of all things that Upton’s modest contract would be the hold up in a potential deal. I mean could the Yankees seriously ask the D backs to eat some of Upton’s contract or have to dump some salary somewhere to fit him in? Seems ludicrous.
That’s one of the main reasons I don’t buy a word of that article.
Marino versus Eli:
I saw Dan Marino front and center for the majority of his career in Miami. The crap that was run out there, year in year out, as a “running game” was some of the worst you’ll ever imagine. Other than the Marks brothers, the receiving corps was never up to par. Marino carried that team on his back year after year, both under Shula and the ridiculousness that was the Jimmy Johnson era.
I think Eli Manning is a very good QB. I think Dan Marino is one of the top three QB’s of all time.
The fact that Dan Marino’s only Super Bowl was in his first season is one of the saddest facts of pro sports. He deserved better.
Johnny U didn’t have the most sterling postseason numbers either.
You gotta be careful looking at the numbers of QBs from the 60s and 70s compared to todays QBs. The DBs were allowed to mug WRs and it was much more of a running and defensive game than the wide open passing game you have today.
Mark Sanchez for example sucks and numbers are putrid compared to the rest of the league but they’d actually look pretty decent compared to a 70s era QB.
I know, but Johnny U still had some really, really awful games, statistically speaking.
Absolutely.
Eli has had a far far better supporting cast than Marino ever had. The only QBs since 1980 in the conversation with Marino were Montana, Elway, Brady and Manning IMO.
We were asked to get excited over the likes of Mark Hicks, Sammie “Fumbleitis” Smith, and Alonzo Highsmith at RB. We actually DID get excited over the very average Karim Abdul-Jabbar and Cecil “The Diesel” Collins, who last all of about five games before he got caught sneaking in through some woman’s window for god-knows-what reason and was never seen again (actually, Collins is the football version of Chuck Cary to me – I tend to bring him up way too often in conversation.)
Ricky Williams was manna from the fucking heavens to that franchise.
Yeah, I remember Tony Nathan, Andra Franklin , David Overstreet and the rest of the scrub squad they had at RB.
I can’t imagine how unstoppable Marino,would have been with a running game that allowed him to go action and actually have the defense have to respect the run.
Cecil Collins is STILL in prison from entering that woman’s house in 1999. Holy shit.
Jimmy Fucking Johnson.
By the time JJ went to Miami, he just wanted to hang out on his boat, lay in the sun and bang that Rhonda chick.
I think he was burnt out by that point.
I think it was more complicated than that.
He couldn’t do what he did in Dallas. There was no Herschel Walker to trade, and the marriage with Marino was going to be a rough one, especially since Marino’s peak had passed.
He still drafted well. Jason Taylor and Zach Thomas were not first-round picks and were the first two dominant Dolphin defenders in…….Jesus.
He got cutesy, though, and tried to go for steals, both in the draft and through the waiver wire, with some real low-character guys….even worse than what he would pick up in Dallas and with UM. Collins is a perfect example. There was a DB the Vikings, I believe, cut for mental health reasons after he tried to slash his own throat. Weeks later, he was a Dolphin. Shit like that.
At the end of the day, though, Marino was aging, Johnson couldn’t adjust his own gameplan, and the last we saw of either was a 62-7 murder at the hands of the Jaguars. As they both walked off the field, everyone knew that was the last we’d see of either.
I’ll also never forget the delirious laugh Hank Goldberg had on the radio as we all figured out the next era would be Dave Wannstedt and Jay Fiedler.
Most coaches are never able to duplicate their success after they move on. How many Super Bowl champion coaches even make another Super Bowl with another team? Off the top of my head Don Shula, Parcells, Dick Vermeil…
….and those three will always be held in higher regard than Jimmy.
Since Marino, there’s been about a zillion QBs, a zillion coaches, and a zillion stadium name changes. What the hell is it even called now?
Shula definitely. Parcells probably. Not Vermeil. The team JJ built in Dallas won 3 Superbowls and likely would have won more if he had stayed. Also don’t forget JJ had to,contend with his roster being poached after the 1st title with free agency and the salary cap beginning.
I think he belongs in the HOF. He at least belongs in the Cowboys ring of honor
Yeah….you’re right.
Of course, I just saw RRR (or whatever that impossibly long new name is) say “you’re right” above as well. Don’t get too big a head now.
For your information RT, my name is “Improbable Island’s Dirty Midget Whores”. If you want to use an acronym try “IIDMW”.
RRR died when Nick Swisher left
.
Shula and Vermeil won Super Bowls with their second teams. Parcells and Mike Holmgren are the only guys to win a Super Bowl with one team, and then make it back to the Super Bowl with a different team (and they both lost).
Just FYI if you’re desperate for your favorite team to hire someone like Jon Gruden or Bill Cowher down the line.
Vermeil never won with the Eagles so Shula is the only one to win a SB with 2 different teams then.
On the other hand, Bellichik’s tenure in Cleveland wasn’t anything great and now look what he’s become. Sometimes a retread coach does work out.
No, Shula only won with Miami. Don McCafferty was the Colts coach in Super Bowl V. Shula was the guy who fucked up Super Bowl III.
Yes, and obviously “retread” coaches have worked. Shula, Vermeil, Belichick, Gruden, Tom Coughlin, Mike Shanahan and Tony Dungy all won Super Bowls with their second teams.
But in addition to Parcells and Holmgren, Vince Lombardi, Tom Flores, Mike Ditka, George Seifert, Jimmy Johnson and, ironically, Vermeil and (so far) Shanahan couldn’t win a Super Bowl with their next team.
Play action
Marino QBing with either Ricky and/or Ronnie Brown would have been fun.
That Tannehill probably is the best Dolphin QB since Marino, and a year’s worth of Chad Pennington, says a lot about what team has endured since.
Since the early 70s, it’s been Griese, Marino and a bunch of crap at QB.
My senior year HS girlfriend lived next to the Grieses and wouldn’t shut her yap about her crush on Brian. This is why I’ve always hated the fucker.
Only kid in Miami-Dade County high school football who could throw. I swear.
That family had to be like royalty in Miami.
Marino or Eli is Bench or Munson
I don’t know about that. It depends on how good a career Munson would have had if not for the plane crash-and we we’ll, sadly, never know.
What do you think would get higher ratings: Yankeeography – Pat Kelly or Yankeeography – Dion James?
Yankeeography – Mel Hall, of course.
Yankeeography – Luis Polonia
Yankeeography Double Feature – Ed Whitson and Steve Trout
I’d actually watch the Steve Trout one.
“Coming up after the commercial break, he swears she was 19. For Yankeeography, I’m John Sterling.”
I would like to see a YES special on Mel Hall, which would have to include Bernie Williams visiting Hall in prison and making fun of him.
Hmmm, maybe Bernie can do a concert at Hall’s prison as part of the special, or just sing outside of Hall’s prison cell. Bernie serenades Hall with his new work, Mr. Zero Has One-Hundred-Million-Dollars.
And speaking of music and prison, today is the 45th anniversary of Johnny Cash recording At Folsom Prison.
I’d say I’d puke at a jazz guitar version of “Folson Prison Blues,” but I already own a children’s lullaby version of it.
Sung by David Bowie?
Could be worse. There was Dev2.0, something that Devo has yet to explain.
Yankeeography – Chuck Cary.
So, while most people are watching the Golden Globes, I’m watching MLB Countdown: Best Players From A-Z. I may be desperate for baseball, and at the same time, if I could go back in time for any moment in history it would either be Willy Mays’ catch, Lou Gehrig’s speech, or Hank Aaron’s 715.
The Golden Globes have been rendered meaningless.
I’ve never really watched/enjoyed award shows, period. I’m not saying that they don’t mean anything, to win “Best Picture.” “Best Director,” “Leading Actor/Actress, or “Best Screenplay” is cool, and means a lot, I just think the pompous circumstance is ridiculous.
The Golden Globes are meaningless for two reasons. First of all, now that the Oscar nominations have already come out, they should have little to no influence on how the Academy Awards turn out.
Secondly, more importantly, it’s because of who votes for the Golden Globes. The Hollywood Foreign Press Association. You can go to this link for some of their critiques: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G.....#Criticism. Also, there’s always been the little fact that nobody quite knows exactly who is in the HFPA. Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Science members are known. HFPA members are not.
I just saw the list of winners, 3 complaints: Lincoln should’ve won best drama, and Cumberbatch and Lange got robbed in Mini Series. Sherlock and American Horror Story are two of the best shows on television right now, and both owe that to the incredible acting by those two respectively.
Maybe Maris’s 61st?
I’d probably go to Gehrig’s speech though.
Now it’s Top 25 Comebacks. 9 was Game 162 in 2011. Still probably the most exciting day of baseball that I have ever, or will ever see. Between the Saint Louis/Atlanta game and the Orioles/Sox with the Yankees Rays then the Angels/Rangers right after…So much fun.
What was number 1?
The worst series of my life.
Well that’s not surprising, but I guess they could have also picked 2001.
Out of curiosity, were game 7 of the ALCS in 2003 and game 4 of the WS in 1996 on the list?
Game 7 was in the mid teens, I think like 13 and I don’t remember if 1996 was on it. 1976 was, but it was criminally far from the top, I think it was like 6 when IMO it should’ve been 2nd behind 2004.
As much as I like those Countdown shows, I tend to find that they rank moments that go against the Yankees higher than moments that go for the Yankees.
I tend to agree, but I understand why. Fans of 29 other teams loathe the Yankees, and enjoy seeing them fail almost as much as seeing their teams win.
Well that’s not really an objective ranking then, is it?
Where was the entire 1978 season?
Still the record for most games back.
I meant 1978 when I said 1976 above, The Boston Massacre followed by the Dent homer.
I think it probably should have been three. One should have been 04′, two should have been the Rays in September 2011, and three should have been 78′.
How ridiculous that Boston and NY are closely involved in all three of the top three comebacks ever.
I agree, with #4 being game 6 of the 2011 WS and #5 being game 7 of either the 1997 or 2001 WS.
The Yankees are involved in like half of these. It’s hilarious.
From IMDB it looks like the movie won’t have Robinson’s touching scene with Hank Greenberg. Too bad.
So, insomnia is a bitch and I’m watching “Top 10 Second Baseman Right Now” Howard Renyolds is hosting along side Brian Kenny, and he is/has become the human incarnation of the No Donkey. Brendan Phillips was listed as number 5 according to “The Shredder”, and Renyolds was beside himself, saying Phillips could hit anywhere in the order. Kenny explained that he only had a .318 OBP last season and was ranked sixth in wOBA among second baseman, Renyolds just started speaking louder “NO NO, He CAN HIT IN THE MIDDLE OF THE LINE UP, TOP OF THE LINEUP, WHEREEVER!! AS A SECOND BASEMAN BLAH BLAH BLAH”
Well you knew this was coming.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqs9DYisSsg
OK so its worth mentioning:
Yankees trade for Curtis Granderson because he is what they would expect Austin Jackson to “top of” at career wise (for the record, I bought into Granderson as an upgrade to Austin Jackson but I was convinced they could not be any different as ball players besides their position and the color of their skin). It took all of 6 strikeouts before “they were calling for Cashman’s head for trading a prospect we hugged for too too long…
Now, three years later no one loves Granderson and his 41 home runs (too many homerz?) and its time to trade him for prospects…. PROSPECTS!
And the new shiny toy, Justin Upton, comes along. And we should buy into people being happy with the Yankees trading Heathcott, Sanchez, or Austin for him and not expect for us to hear how the trade was the worst idea ever?
I am indifferent. I can see the value of trading for a Justin Upton who is cost controlled for three seasons (although, in three seasons we’ll have the same goddam conversation when Heathcott is starting in Arizona… And also, 3 seasons is NOT a long time, which is why we always believe that Stanton would make more sense to mortgage the farm for). But I can also see rolling the dice on another 1 year solution to see if anyone can make the leap for US instead of THEM.
My two cents
I read that Baseball Prospectus article about Mark Reynolds being blind.
I know it’s tongue in cheek, but I actually think the writer made a stronger case than he realized. It actually makes perfect sense that Reynolds has some sort of vision problem – obviously not complete blindness, but an impairment.
Disclaimer: This is not an attempt by me to deflect from the embarrassing fact that I took the whole thing seriously. Nope, no Sir. Not at all.