Torre’s new book starting an uproar


All the rave on this Sunday morning relates to Joe Torre’s new book, The Yankee Years, which is due in stores on February 3. Tabloid reports focus on two main aspects: Alex Rodriguez and Brian Cashman. You can check out the report on NJ.com if you want to check out the tabloids, but I’m not linking them here. I know we’ve basically broken the tabloid ban, but these headlines are perfect examples of what we don’t like about those two outlets.

First, Mr. Cashman. The complaint levied in the book, or at least how the media portrays it, is that Cash didn’t stand up for Torre at the end of the 2007 season. I guess Torre’s ire stems from Cashman’s public stance that he supported Torre. Yet both can be true. Cashman might have favored the one-year deal the Yankees were willing to offer, but not the two-year deal Torre sought. In any event, I can’t see the reason for any harsh feelings between the two. Cashman did stand up for Torre and had him brought back after the 2004 season.

Regarding A-Rod, is this anything we didn’t know before? It’s not like any of us think he’s a model citizen. He’s an insecure bastard who happens to hit baseball really well. This isn’t some shocking revelation. It will continue to fuel the fire of those who dislike Alex for his personality, and will ignite a spark in those who defend him for his baseball skills. I hope we can avoid this discussion in the ensuing comment thread. The important point, I think, (and as ‘The’ Steve pointed out) I wonder how his current players feel about him publicly slamming a former player?

These are just two points in a 400-plus-page book. They’re the juiciest details, so that’s what the tabloids will pick up. What will make someone buy a paper: a headline which includes the term “A-Fraud” and “betrayal”, or a headline that says “Torre speaks mostly well of time with Yankees”? So please, let’s reserve judgment until we all actually read it. If we do at all, that is.

* Another revelation was that the Yankees team doctors told George Steinbrenner that Torre had prostate cancer before they told Torre himself. I have no idea what to say about this charge. If true, that’s a pretty deep violation of ethics and the law.

Categories : News
  • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

    I made a witty, insightful and breathtakingly awesome comment in Mike’s post that was taken down… you bastards!1!!1

  • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

    * Another revelation was that the Yankees team doctors told George Steinbrenner that Torre had prostate cancer before they told Torre himself. I have no idea what to say about this charge. If true, that’s a pretty deep violation of ethics and the law.

    Wouldn’t that be pretty impossible to prove? I mean, just because George Steinbrenner knew of Joe Torre’s diagnosis before Torre told Steinbrenner does not necessarily mean that Steinbrenner knew of the diagnosis before Torre did; it could just be that the doctors told Torre and did not waste any time in telling Steinbrenner.

    In fact, I’d say it’s so questionable that it’s downright irresponsible for anyone to imply that those doctors told Steinbrenner before they told Torre.

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      Given the high profile nature of the Yankees and their staff, I would imagine they would always want advance notice on any medical issues. Yankee players get injured all the time, don’t people think that they would want to have that info before it has a chance to get leaked to the press?

    • http://www.puristbleedspinstripes.com Rebecca-Optimist Prime

      There’s still a serious breach of ethics on some side. Either the doctors DID tell Stienbrenner, in which case there’s a medical breach of ethics, or Torre and co. are lying through their teeth, in which case it’s journalism ethics (oxymoron, I know).

      • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

        Does the doctor-patient confidentially law work outside the umbrella of an employer having the right to know if his employees have medical issues that could directly effect their job? What if Joe Torre never told George Steinbrenner? What if Torre had not told Steinbrenner but signed a five-year contract extension? What if during that extension, the prostate cancer caused Torre to retire? Should the Yankees still be on the hook for the full amount? Isn’t it possible that contract could be voided if Torre knowingly signed this multi-year deal with knowledge of his current medical situation, and did not tell the Yankees because he had a presumption that certain language could have been added or altered in said contract to protect the Yankees against Torre being unable to fulfill the duties he’s being compensated for?

        My point is that is it unethical (if the answer to the topic question is no) that the medical staff relayed their findings to the Yankees before Joe Torre did – seeing as how the possibility existed that Torre could have withheld this vital information?

        • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

          Good points, I would guess these questions would be answered in his contract with the club.

          But I wouldn’t expect Joe to know what was in his contract, he apparently didn’t know about all the incentive clauses since he was “insulted” when then Yanks informed him of the ones in his 07 offer, which were the same types of incentives as prior contracts.

        • JC in NC

          Well look at it this way, does a cab driver owe it to his cab company to disclose that he has prostate cancer…absolutely not. Unless the Yankees asked for a physical before signing a coach to an extension or a contract than it is his right to disclose a medical condition. There is no excuse for a doctor to share a patients information with a patients employer, they should have their license revoked.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      …it could just be that the doctors told Torre and did not waste any time in telling Steinbrenner.

      Doctor-patient confidentiality, dude.

      • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

        Does that apply to players?

        • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

          I would think it does. I would also think it part of the uniform player contract that they’re obligated to disclose injuries to the club.

          • Mike

            I remember hearing something about that awhile back. I think they in a way waive their rights because they are under contract and an injury needs to be known by the team.

          • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

            It must be, players obviously get injured all the time and teams need to know about it. So these things seem to get worked out in the contracts.

          • toad

            It may be part of the player contract, but how does that affect Torre? It’s not like he can’t manage if he gets a sore arm or sprains his ankle.

            Without explicit authorization from Torre (possibly provided in his contract) the doctor has no business discussing his medical condition with anyone.

            Of course that applies to players too, but I assume their contract does provide such authorization.

        • Mike R.

          Two words…Carl Pavano

    • toad

      The doctors have no business telling Steinbrenner without Torre’s permission. Period. Not before they tell Torre, not after. No matter if it’s a team doctor or not.

      If Torre is required by contract to disclose medical problems then it’s up to him to do that, not up to the doctors.

  • http://www.puristbleedspinstripes.com Rebecca-Optimist Prime

    “* Another revelation was that the Yankees team doctors told George Steinbrenner that Torre had prostate cancer before they told Torre himself. I have no idea what to say about this charge. If true, that’s a pretty deep violation of ethics and the law.”


    That’s…I can’t put that into words. That is an incredible breach of ethics that, no matter how good a doctor might be, I simply could not overlook, proving it’s true, of course.

    • BJ

      The question is why is Torre being examined by team doctors in the first place. It makes sense for players, whose ability to perform physically is important to the team and their health could be affected by the decision to rest them or play them. But why the coaches? It would seem thatthey are signing some medical dislosure, making this both legal and ethical.

  • deadrody

    Considering that the TEAM doctors probably called Big Stein, then hung up and called Torre, I wouldn’t consider that quite the alarming revelation.

  • deadrody

    Let alone a “deep violation of ethics and the law”. Being that he used the TEAM doctors, I seriously doubt there is ANY violation of the law.

    As far as ethics go, questionable ? – maybe. Deep violation ? Hardly.

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      Medical info is supposed to be confidential, and employers don’t have a right to the info without the person’s consent.

      That being said, the Yanks are a VERY high profile, unique case. They deal with player’s medical reports all the time, so they have to have access.

      • Zack

        It’s not just the Yankees, you dont think every team is informed by team doctors of every player/coach/manager?

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

      A doctor is a doctor is a doctor. Doctor-patient confidentiality isn’t negated because of the doctors’ employer.

      • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

        No, but the Yanks obviously have access to the medical reports of players, or they wouldn’t be able to run their ballclub.

        Sounds like the kind of thing that gets addressed in a contract, and Torre obviously was a contract employee, not a regular hire.

        • RustyJohn

          Unless someone is completely and intimately aware of both HIPPA laws and the content of Torre’s contract I would recommend refraining from making assumptions on whether this is a breach of confidentiality or not.

  • http://www.mlbnotebook.com Zach Sanders

    What a surprise. A manager/coach writing about players and management he didn’t get along with.

    Never seen that before.

  • BillyBall

    If Cash had his way he would have never signed A-Fraud! Trade A-Fraud to the Mets for Wright and that minor league OF! Rid us of this albatross once and for all. If not just tell him to shut and play and see a head shrink daily.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      He does shut up and play. The guy doesn’t say a thing, is in the lineup every single day and hustles his ass off, and he’s been the team’s best player for the last five years. The media goes out looking for dirt on him.

      Who gives a shit who he dates? He’s a grown man, he can do whatever the fuck he wants.

      • http://actyankee.blogspot.com Matt

        “Who gives a shit who he dates? He’s a grown man, he can do whatever the fuck he wants.”

        Except eat sweets in the clubhouse.

        • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

          Yeah, I love Girardi but that’s going a bit too far by Joe.

          • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

            As if grown men can’t control their intake of sweets.

            • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

              As if grown men can’t do their jobs and be happy without having sweets in the clubhouse.

        • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

          You got me there.

      • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

        I agree for the most part, but Alex has been dreadful in the biggest spots (playoffs) outside of the 04 Twins series. So he deserves his knocks there.

        • http://actyankee.blogspot.com Matt

          How about the .894 OPS in the ALCS in 04 or the .820 OPS in the ’07 DS when NO ONE was hitting? He’s had some crappy series–05 and 06 weren’t good–but his other playoff appearances have been just fine.

          • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

            Fine, how about the 1 RBI he’s had in 13 post season games since the 04 collapse? How about the 2005 and 2006 playoffs, where he was horrendous?


            I gave him credit for the Twins series, but if you have blinders on to what he’s done recently then you’re hopelessly biased.

            • http://actyankee.blogspot.com Matt

              I said:

              “He’s had some crappy series–05 and 06 weren’t good–but his other playoff appearances have been just fine.”

              • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve


                BTW-Nick Swisher stinks! Pfffft!

                • http://actyankee.blogspot.com Matt


                • Mike R.

                  Hey! Take that crap to Lohud! ;)

              • Nady Nation

                Citing his OPS in the 04 ALCS is ridiculously misleading. A-Rod had a great first 3 games of the series, and an absoutely atrocious final 4 games, where he came up in countless big spots that could’ve altered the series and never delivered. I don’t think anyone who watched all 7 games thinks A-Rod had a great series there. He started off hot as hell, but then fell off a cliff. Stats like that with such a small sample size of a 7 game series aren’t reliable, as A-Rod’s high OPS was heavily weighted from the first 3 games of that series.

                • ArchStanton

                  Did you miss his big go-ahead homer in game 4?

                • usty

                  Really? Small sample sizes don’t matter when they’re good for A-Rod., but we’ll talk about his last 14 at bats in the playoffs when they start…After he carried the team there.

                • Nady Nation

                  Did I not acknowledge that he was GREAT in the first 3 games? My point was that merely citing his high OPS gives off the impression that he was consistently good throughout the 7 game series, which he was not.

                • steve (different one)

                  right, but you still missed game 4, when he literally hit a ball out of Fenway.

                • http://photos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc1/v621/134/99/513321182/n513321182_2118948_7574.jpg Nady Nation

                  That’s true. But my original point still stands. He was insanely streaky during that series.

    • http://actyankee.blogspot.com Matt

      People who talk like this make me fucking sick.

      I’d love to have David Wright on the Yankees. But I also love having SOMEONE WHO WILL GO DOWN AS ONE OF THE FIVE BEST PLAYERS IN BASEBALL HISTORY, too.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

      “It will continue to fuel the fire of those who dislike Alex for his personality, and will ignite a spark in those who defend him for his baseball skills.”

      Thank you, BillyBall, for proving me right 10 comments into this.

      • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

        Something tells me your pleasantly surprised it took that long. Heh, we all know that in some places (you all know where I’m referring to, there’s no need to name the place) it would have taken place in the author’s post itself.

    • Phil McCracken

      Yeah David Wright has been huge in the big pressure situation….

  • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

    You know what sucks? This is going to be the topic de jour in ST.

    “Alex, what do you have to say about Torre’s book?”

    It’s probably a good thing that he’s leaving for the WBC.

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      Beats talking about wind sprints.

      • Sweet Dick Willie

        Or Madonna.

        • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

          Actually, he’s dating Kate Hudson now and that’s not an awful subject.

  • Marcus

    How could anyone ever bash A-Rod? Especially Yankee fans. The guy shows up every year and probably got us into the playoffs by himself 2 seasons ago.

    Plus, how do you blame ‘one’ batter out of 9 for not advancing in the playoffs? That falls more on horrible pitching performances than just one single batter.

    I just lost a lot of respect for Torre. No class.

    On a happier note, our stance on pitching has changed and so will our playoff droughts.

    Cheers to the new starting 5 and a happy 2009.

  • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

    Per Amazon.com: http://tinyurl.com/b7mhkb

    Here, for the first time, Joe Torre and Tom Verducci take us inside the dugout, the
    clubhouse, and the front office in a revelatory narrative that shows what it really took to keep the Yankees on top of the baseball world. The high-priced ace who broke down in tears and refused to go back to the mound in the middle of a game. Constant meddling from Yankee executives, many of whom were jealous of Torre’s popularity. The tension that developed between the old guard and the free agents brought in by management. The impact of revenue-sharing and new scouting techniques, which allowed other teams to challenge the Yankees’ dominance. The players who couldn’t resist the after-hours temptations of the Big Apple. The joys of managing Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera, and the challenges of managing Alex Rodriguez and Jason Giambi. Torre’s last year, when constant ultimatums from the front office, devastating injuries, and a freak cloud of bugs on a warm September night in Cleveland forced him from a job he loved.

    Heh, dudes really know how to write a preview, eh?

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      Wow, I wonder how the Dodgers he manages now feel about this.

      • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

        Seriously, a poster at SoSH brought up that same point, and I agree with it wholeheartedly. How do you think both the younger guys and grizzled veterans feel about Joe Torre writing a tell-all book about his former clubhouse? He was brought in for the sole purpose of bringing peace and serenity to that fractured clubhouse, if any damage has been done to his image in the eyes of those players, I wonder who sees him worse: the vets or the younger dudes?

        • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

          If you’re in that dugout, would you trust him with anything personal or that might come back to haunt you in some way? I wouldn’t.

          Torre always talked about “Having the trust of his players”. I guess this is how he repays that trust.

          • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

            Heh, it is kind of ironic that he mentions this “A-Fraud” stuff, when he was the guy the team was paying to dispel this kind of stuff from the clubhouse.

            • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

              In LA, exactly.

              Really on both teams, since his supporters always talked about how his calm presence was needed in the Bronx Zoo.

              • blee

                Can’t ignore all the accomplishments that Joe Torre had with the Yankees, but I thought his motto was handling in-house stuff in the clubhouse.. what happens there stay there?

                Selling out your old team for a couple bucks? How about if you wait until you’ve retired.. If my respect and admiration for Torre was a 100 yesterday, it is but a 95 today.. I still have respect for the guy, but acts like this do damage his reputation among Yankee fans..

                Again, I’ll withhold full judgment till I see what’s written in the book, but these reports dont sound promising..

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      The high-priced ace who broke down in tears and refused to go back to the mound in the middle of a game.

      It was probably David Cone in his first start back from his aneurysm, or something like that.

      • http://www.new.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/profile.php?id=594331910&ref=name Jamal G.

        Hmm, I was thinking Kevin Brown. Then again, that man punched a fucking wall so hard he broke bones in his hand, he might no be the type of man that cries in public.

        • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

          There’s also zero chance David Cone is the kind of guy that cries in public as well.

          • AndrewYF

            It was probably Weaver.

            • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

              oooooh good one.

              But he wasn’t a “highly paid ace”. He was a trade, not a free agent, and he was never an ace. But I bet he had his moments as well.

        • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

          Yeah, that was my guess.

      • http://liberalmusings.wordpress.com Pablo Zevallos

        Roger Clemens in the World Series, anyone?

        • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

          He was crying because the needle broke off in his butt.

          • http://liberalmusings.wordpress.com Pablo Zevallos

            Do you realize that it’s lunch time? ;)

            • Mike Pop

              Pablo, go make me a sangwich!

            • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve


              Sorry, Bro.

              • http://liberalmusings.wordpress.com Pablo Zevallos

                Haha np.

  • LiveFromNewYork

    Torre was completely phoning it in at the end. He was practically sleeping in the dugout. He let Joba battle those bugs. He had the glory of the “ring” years and then after the 2001 World Series, never really got it together again. The deal the Yankees offered him was good considering how he had been doing. He was insulted rather than own up to the fact that he made bad decisions, including moving Arod down in the order and moving Sheffield to first in the playoffs. Tinkering like that was ridiculous.

    Alex Rodriguez will go down as one of the best players to ever play the game. He’s a head case and has the emotional maturity of a 14 year old and is plagued with insecurity. But he’s good at what he does and public picking at him just feeds his insecurities/inability to behave in a mature manner. Sure Alex needs therapy but a compassionate coach would see him as the fragile dope he is and not call him out in a book. Joe Torre certainly didn’t help Arod a lot. I hope Girardi steps in and defends him.

    They both had problems when together but Arod isn’t out there moaning to the world about Torre. I think it’s classless of Joe to pick on Arod like that. But I suppose it will sell books.

  • Zack

    ” Another revelation was that the Yankees team doctors told George Steinbrenner that Torre had prostate cancer before they told Torre himself. I have no idea what to say about this charge. If true, that’s a pretty deep violation of ethics and the law.”

    The team always receives the medical report after the physical before the player does.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

      Except that Torre wasn’t a player.

      • Zack

        Does it matter? He still got a physical, why wouldnt they follow the same steps/policy?

        • http://www.riveraveblues.com Mike A.

          I think it would since it’s not an injury that was sustained “on the job.” A-Rod dives for a ball and breaks his wrist, sure. But Joe Torre getting prostate cancer?

          • Zack

            again, that’s not the point. he had his physical, like every player/coach does, his results were sent to management and then sent to Joe, if that’s the policy then that’s the policy.

      • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

        No, but he wasn’t a regular employee either. He had a contract with the team, and unless we know the details of his contract we can’t say if the law was violated or not.

        But I think its reasonable to assume his contract would address these things. I can’t imagine the Yanks would hire him and not have language about this in his deal. The last thing they need is the bad press of team officials breaking the law. Its not like Joe is the first guy to leave the Yanks on bad terms.

  • emac2@msn.com

    Screw little joe!

    He overstayed his welcome at least 5 years and after the team built by others was used up he was helpless to develop another group of winners.

  • E-ROC

    I thought what happens in the locker room or clubhouse, stays there, unless there is illegal activity. I’ll probably learn more about this in my next class. Players probably won’t trust Torre, or at least watch what they say around him.

  • ortforshort

    How quickly people forget. I don’t find it a coincidence that the first year the Yankees don’t make the playoffs after a twelve year run is the year that Torre is no longer around. Apparently, Torre “phoning it in” is better than anyone else’s being there in person. Also, we may want to change the name of this blog from “River Avenue Blues” to “The Universal Constant – Cashman can do no Wrong” Blog.

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      Has Cashman wrote a book that I’m unaware of?

      Talk about changing the subject.

    • http://www.YouTube.com/kevyyankees Kevin G.

      Torre could’ve magically cured the injuries to Wang, Posada, A-Rod, fixed Jeter’s hand, and make Cano play better?

      • pete


    • steve (different one)

      I don’t find it a coincidence that the first year the Yankees don’t make the playoffs after a twelve year run is the year that Torre is no longer around.

      that is b/c you have no idea what you are talking about and use every single post to remind everyone of that.

  • John

    I feel sorry for A-Rod, he’s keeps getting from controversy to another, some his fault (the divorce) and some not his (this book, canseco allegations, etc.)

  • John

    I’ll admit that I’ve lost some respect for Torre in the past few minutes…

  • Nolan

    Let’s trade Arod to the dodgers and sign manny!

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      If you thought A-Rod was controversial . . . . .

  • Lanny

    Maybe Torre should have published this after he was done managing.

    Seems real tacky and his image will take a monster hit.

    • steve (different one)

      Maybe Torre should have published this after he was done managing.

      DING DING DING. we have a winner.

      can’t believe it took this long for someone to point this out.

      it is RIDICULOUSLY unprofessional to take shots at players when you are still managing.

      Torre looks bad here. i know everyone hates A-Rod, but the time and place for this is after you retire.

      this stinks of a cash grab on Torre’s part.

      i’m grateful for what he accomplished, but Cashman was in no way obligated to bring him back for 2 more years. so calling it a “betrayal” is petty and small. Cashman is your boss and it was a business decision.

  • Joseph M

    It’s hard to comment without reading the book but here are a few thoughts on what we’ve seen so far.

    If what we’ve seen so far are the leaders then there might not be much to this book at all.

    Torre claims Steinbenner was informed of Torre’s cancer diagnosis before Joe was, my question, what was the original intent of the exam? Was it related to fufilling a contract requirement, with the understanding being the club will receive the results as a matter of course, if that is the case, then what’s the issue.

    Torre rips AROD, big deal! We all know what AROD is and isn’t by this time, he did in fact win two MVP’s for Joe’s team.

    Torre feels Cashman betrayed him, funny, I feel Cashman is also guilty, guilty of betraying the fans. Torre should have been let go within days after the season ended. He was the highest paid manager in baseball by more than double, and what did we get out of it, early playoff exits three years running.

    Torre is what he is a phony pure and simple. Does Joe talk about the children from other marriages that he has no relation with whatsoever. Does Joe talk about dragging his family across country without even a thought, remember, I still have the fire in my belly to manage statement when he took the Dodger job. The key word in that statement was the word I. He is 67 years old and never spent one summer with his 12 year old daughter, great father. Joe should write a book about his own mistakes and failures as a human being before giving reading his opinions on the actions of others, now that’s a book I’d love to read.

  • Phil McCracken

    In regards to Cashman, it was obvious during the 2007 season that Cashman was getting tired of Torre.

    He didn’t like how Joe was above the Yankees organization in dealing with the media. Torre told everyone in the press about the “Joba Rules”. You could tell from Cashman’s response that he was furious over it. All along Cashman had Girardi in mind to be the next manager and knew after the Indians oust that he could finally put his plan into motion.

    I’ve always respected how Torre managed big personalities. He wasn’t the best baseball mind, but he was very good with keeping everyone at ease. I lost some respect for him for slamming A-Rod just to sell a few books. Just like I lost respect for him the day he put him in the 8 spot vs the Tigers.

  • John

    say buh-bye to monument park torre…

    • usty

      Haha. So who gets to wear number 6 now?

      • steve (different one)


  • jeremy

    Anyone think about the possibility that Torre is in Pettitte’s ear this off-season. Talking about the insult that the organization laid on Torre only offering him 5 million plus incentives (a deal that was apparently a slap in the face to Joe), and how the Yankees are doing the same thing to Pettitte this off-season. “Taking him for granted, assuming his loyalty, forgetting about prior success?” After reading these excerpts I wouldn’t put it past him. I have definitely lost a great deal of respect for Joe on this one. Just don’t understand what would compel him to write a book like this. I guess that’s what I get for thinking personal integrity means more to people than money.

    • Artist formerly known as ‘The’ Steve

      Nah, all of the core guys from the run have always made sure to squeeze every dollar they could out of the Yanks, with the exception of O’Niell. Posada went to the 11th hour with his contract last year, Mo went even further than that. Jeter has been grossly overpaid since he signed that extension, Bernie almost went to the Red Sox when he was a FA. Even Clemens got that insane pro-rated contract a year or two ago. They all have played hardball with their contracts.

      To be honest, Pettitte was overpaid the minute he came back. He was paid as a #2 and he’s really not a 2 starter, and there were no other bidders for his services. It was the Astros or the Yanks, and the Astros made it public they were out.

      • Sweet Dick Willie

        Jeter has been grossly overpaid since he signed that extension

        We talked about this in a previous thread.

        According to Fangraphs http://www.fangraphs.com/stats.....osition=SS Jeter was paid $132.2 mil and was worth $112.7 mil over the last 7 years. That’s $19.5 mil over a 7 year period, or less than $3 mil/year.

        Granted, he was overpaid, but to characterize that amount as “grossly overpaid” is just not accurate, not when the player is Derek Jeter. Not with the fannies he puts in the seats and the merchandise he sells.

        In fact, IMO, you could go as far to say that the “overpayment” was a helluva investment on the Yankees part.

        • emac2@msn.com

          Jeter is indeed grossly overpaid at 20 million a year.

          You’ll need more than some clown with a website saying otherwise if you want to dispute that one.

  • Bonos

    I thought Torre was a dumbass from 04 on and Cashman saved his butt out of loyalty.

    I was adamant about it after he used an already overworked Gordon in Game 3 of the 2004 ALCS with a 9 run lead

    What about using a fresh Rivera in game 4 for a 2 inning save? Rivera ran out of gas in the second inning and that turned out to be the pivotal point in the series because Torre continued to panic in the following games.

    Torre believed his own PR and still does. When he owns up to 04 I’ll cut him some slack.

  • Thomas A Anderson

    Joe was pissed off at Cashman for not fighting harder for him after the 2007 season?

    Let’s look at his playoff performace since Aaron Boone’s homerun:

    2003 – Keeping Mariano Rivera in the pen may have cost the Yankees the World Series they SHOULD have won

    2004 – Greatest Collapse in Baseball History to the BoSox

    2005 – First round loss to the Angels – again

    2006 – Inexcusable first-round loss to the Detroit Tigers

    2007 – First round loss to the Cleveland Indians

    Cashman got Joe Torre off the hook 4 different times. How Torre survived blowing the 2004 ALCS is beyond me. Torre harboring any sort of disappointment toward BC for not supporting him getting another multi year deal after ANOTHER first-round exit only proves that for all of Joe’s accomplishments, he forgot how valuable a manager really is in the grand scheme of a baseball team. His ego got the best of him.

    Now, did the Yankees handle the situation terribly? Yes, overwhelmingly yes. But, considering the resources and the advantage he enjoyed as Yankees manager, losing in the first round 3 straight years coming off of the Great Collapse is grounds to get fired.

    If Joe gets a large portion of credit for the late 90s Yankees, then he HAS to take his share of the blame for the way the Yankees’ seasons have ended the last 5-7 years. Is that fair to him? I’d say so.

    When you are being paid the yearly salary of a decent middle infielder as a manager, and you work for the New York Yankees, your regular season achievements mean nothing. You take that paycheck and take the adulation and take the advantages over other managers in the sport for the pressure and B.S. that comes with having to win the World Series every year and put up with the NY media and the Steinbrenners to boot.

    Another poster put it best: Manager of the Yankees is not a Professor Emeritus position. You are judged on your results. And the fact is, his results the last 5 years were not worthy of him being brought back.

    I’m not even expecting Torre’s book to be overwhelmingiy negative or bitter. But for this portion of it that he willingly put in there, it deserves the criticism it gets.

  • Rob S.

    Uuuummmm….you and Joe Torre’s and the New York tabloids opinions are your own. YOU may have come to the conclusion that A-Rod is less than a model citizen or an insecure bastard. So, yeah don’t presume to speak for every Yankee fan. I have zero issues with Alex Rodriguez. I’m not saying he’s Mr. Perfect but I also don’t believe that his baseball skills are his only redeeming qualities. I never apologize for being a Yankee fan and I’ll never apologize for being an A-Rod fan.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

      I think it’s pretty well documented that he’s insecure. In fact, he’d probably admit to it, so that’s not really an opinion. It’s an observation. I think my writing here shows that I’m an unabashed A-Rod fan. Doesn’t mean he doesn’t have his own flaws.

      And regarding his baseball skills being his only redeeming quality: that’s really the only redeeming quality for any player, in my eyes. It’s all about what you do on the field. What you do in your private life is whatever. Unless it affects your play on the field.

    • http://www.riveraveblues.com Ben K.

      If only RAB had a “reply to this comment” function so we had some idea to whom this comment was directed.

      Oh wait.

      • http://www.riveraveblues.com Joseph P.

        I think that’s directed at me, so no reply needed.

  • LiveFromNewYork

    Torre is working out his resentments with this book.

    • steve (different one)

      Torre is cashing in on the name that sells things, Alex Rodriguez.

  • AL

    If A-Rod has any self-esteem left, he would learn from this and prove his critics wrong, but I highly doubt that will happen. I don’t think he has the balls for that. He will keep piling number when it dosn’t matter…and keep wetting his pants when the team really need him. My only frustration is, I have to live this for 9 more years.

    As far as Jor Torre is concerned, I have no respect for the man, he has lost his mind. I wish someone insulted me by offering 5 million dollars. Now he throws everyone under the bus, especially, Cashman. This is business, I don’t know where he gets this sense of entitlement from. He made bone headed mistakes in the play-offs, one after another begining 2004 (ALCS). I can’t wait to hear from Michael Kay tomorrow..he’ll probably go nuts.

    • steve (different one)

      If A-Rod has any self-esteem left, he would learn from this and prove his critics wrong, but I highly doubt that will happen

      me too, he’s accomplished so little in baseball.

      • Thomas A Anderson

        Please, for all that is good and righteous about this game, tell us you aren’t serious.

        • Sweet Dick Willie

          Is your sarcasm detector on the blink today Thomas?

  • matt k

    I had ALOT of respect for Torre during and after his tenure in New York but if this book has alot of this type of stuff in it I will have lost some respect for joe.

  • BigBlueAL

    The book is over 400 pages long. I have read a couple of articles stating that the headlines being made by the Daily News and Post are big-time exaggerated (shocking). Before you talk shit, read the book. Im sure 95% of you guys wont bother doing so, but I will and am sure Mike and/or Ben will and probably post a thread about it after they have read the book. At that time then it would be fine to rip the book all you want, but until then lets be serious and chill out with the Torre bashing which I have noticed ever since Ive been reading this site for about a year now that for some reason Torre bashing is a big thing here.

    When the “genius” Joe Girardi wins 4 WS then come talk to me…..

    • AL

      Alright..then, Lets all burn incense at Saint Torre’s alter…or shall I refer to him as HIS HOLINESS. I have no problem giving him credit for winning 4 WS, but he also deserves all the blame starting 2004 play off blunders (Blowing 3-0 lead to the Sox, leaving Joba in @ Cleavland, no hit and runs/bunts…to name a few).

      Please…. No need to read the “Holy Book” … the man is all about money. Tom Verdicci was kicked off the YES Network, so I can definitely understand his beef.

    • emac2@msn.com

      Why in the heck would anyone support Torre by buying his book in the hopes he isn’t quite as big a jerk as he appears to be?

  • emac2@msn.com

    Why is Torres statement about the other players calling a team mate names an indictment of Arod?

    It seems to me he threw the whole team under the bus as he made the players look petty and small for calling a teammate names.

  • BillyBall

    “If A-Rod has any self-esteem left, he would learn from this and prove his critics wrong, but I highly doubt that will happen. I don’t think he has the balls for that. He will keep piling number when it dosn’t matter…and keep wetting his pants when the team really need him. My only frustration is, I have to live this for 9 more years.”

    Couldn’t have said it better myself. For all you A-Rod sympathizers understand one thing. The A-Fraud bashers aren’t debating whether A-Fraud is putting up hall of fame numbers. We are just stating the obvious.
    Ever since this albatross has come to the Yankees his mental anguishes on the field WITH THE BAT are beyond obvious and therefore his lack of clutch hitter ability if there was such a term has left most Yankee fans intensely frustrated each season. If it’s not the post season it’s in the big spots against a hated rival. And if you don’t for one second think that most of the players in that locker room cannot stand A-Fraud than I guess Torre, Giambi, the Moose, Jeter’s unwillingness to stick up for this head case, even Donny Baseball has acknowledged a flaw with A-Fraud without getting into details during an interview. He even went further this last season and stated that Manny is the best right handed hitter in baseball. When the media asked about A-Rod, Mattingly replied that A-Rod seems to have allot going on during his at bat where as Manny gets up there and just makes it look easy with no stress. No one is stating that A-Rod is not world talented, I’m just stating let him go break every record in baseball on another team. I would trade his mega numbers for more championships. The Yankees always come first and than the individual. Jeter has always seen that, A-Fraud has yet to.

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