Joel Piniero would fit nicely at Yankee Stadium

Prospect Profile: Hector Noesi
The RAB Radio Show: January 5, 2011
(Mark J. Terrill/AP)

On yesterday’s RAB Radio Show Mike and I discussed the Angels as they relate to the Yankees. It was just a year ago when the two teams faced off in the ALCS, but since then the Angels have taken a bit of a hit. They finished 80-82 last year, and now, after failing to sign any impact bats this off-season, they find themselves as also-rans in the AL West, where the Rangers and the A’s looking like the top contenders. While that likely won’t prompt the Angels to make a move now, it could make some of their players available during the season. One guy Mike and I discussed yesterday was Joel Pineiro.

At some point in the mid-00s Pineiro became an afterthought. A 12th round draft pick in 1997, Pineiro never really produced spectacular numbers in the minors. It wasn’t until 2000 that he really made a splash, when he produced a 2.80 ERA in 61 Pacific Coast League innings. That earned him the No. 80 spot on Baseball America’s Top 100 Prospects. He continued to pitch well by PCL standards in 2001, eventually earning a call-up to the bigs. After absolutely dominating — a 2.03 ERA in 75.1 innings — he was in the show to stay.

After two excellent seasons, Pineiro dropped off. In 2004 he pitched poorly before missing the final two months with an elbow injury. A shoulder strain caused him to miss the beginning of the 2005 season, and when he came back he was pretty terrible. In 2006 it was more of the same, and Pineiro actually shifted to the bullpen at one point. There were talks around the deadline of the Yankees swapping Shawn Chacon for Pineiro, but that didn’t pan out. After the season the Red Sox signed him to be the closer, and we all know how that worked out. They traded him to the Cardinals, which is where the real story begins.

Pineiro had always been a decent ground ball pitcher. From 2002 through 2004 he was in the top third of the league in ground ball rate. That gave him hope with Cardinals’ pitching coach Dave Duncan. In 2008 the experiment didn’t go so well, as Pineiro posted a 5.15 ERA and 4.71 FIP in 148.2 innings. But the next year everything seemed to click. His ground ball rate jumped from the mid- to high-40s all the way to 60.5 percent. That caused his home run rate to dip. Combined with a pristine walk rate, 1.14 per nine, he put together a very good season: 3.49 ERA, 3.27 FIP, 3.68 xFIP. It was lucky, too, because he was headed for free agency.

There was a faction of fans, I’m not sure how large, who wanted the Yankees to sign Pineiro last off-season. The team needed a fourth starter, and even if we boosted Pineiro’s 2009 ERA to reflect the realities of the American League, he still would have been one of the best fourth starters in the league. I took the case against him. This was a guy who had exactly one good season in the last six. There wasn’t even a season where his peripherals made his results look better. It screamed of fluke. How would he fare without Duncan’s tutelage?

As it turns out, Pineiro would have greatly helped the Yankees in 2009, even if he had suffered the same oblique injury that limited him to 23 starts. Again he kept his ERA below 4.00, 3.84, and had a FIP and xFIP to match. He kept the ball on the ground, 54.9 percent, and had a walk rate that ranked eighth in the majors among pitchers with at least 150 IP. That’s not to say the Yankees made a mistake by trading for Vazquez rather than signing Pineiro; the warning signs were considerable. But now that he has experienced a second straight year of success, and by using the same arsenal, I think he’d make for a decent trade candidate.

The main factor for Pineiro is the ground balls. While Yankee Stadium might not be an overall hitters’ haven, it is favorable to left-handed batters, particularly when it comes to home runs. Right-handed pitchers can have problems, then, as Phil Hughes realized in 2010. But the ability to keep the ball on the ground can help mitigate that issue. The Yankees might not have the best infield defense, but then again they had pretty terrible infield defense when Chien-Ming Wang pitched, and he did pretty well for himself. Pineiro’s ground ball tendencies make him a good fit for the rotation.

The Angels won’t let him go cheaply, of course. Pineiro is attractive not only because he has just one year left on his contract, but also because he will earn just $8 million in that one year. Another quality season will likely earn him Type A status, so the Angels aren’t just going to give him away. Since they’re so far below their normal payroll level as it is, they have no incentive to sell off anything now. That could mean a high asking price, which is why the Yankees should consider Pineiro with an eye towards the deadline. He won’t be a cheap acquisition then, but he’ll be cheaper than now.

Of course, Pineiro isn’t the best pitchers with whom the Angels could part. There’s Dan Haren and Jered Weaver, plus the always promising Ervin Santana. But I think that considering their situations — they’re under contract for the next few seasons — Pineiro will be the easiest to pry from the Angels if they fall out of the race. In fact, given his contract and his impending free agency, he might be one of the more attractive mid-season trade targets. The Yanks would probably love to add him now and get a full season, but that just doesn’t appear likely. Instead, Pineiro is a guy we should keep an eye on in the first half. He could very well be wearing pinstripes by July.

Prospect Profile: Hector Noesi
The RAB Radio Show: January 5, 2011
  • king of fruitless hypotheticals

    why would be cheaper at the deadline when they would only owe him $4MM, and they would be that much closer to losing the Type-A comp pick?

    • derek

      because they’d be getting him for less time, DUH

      • king of fruitless hypotheticals

        that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever, ‘duh’

        from your response i’m pretty sure you didn’t understand my question. the right answer should have sounded something like ‘$4MM worth of salary<15 starts on a team that is 9 games out plus the $X value of a typical type-A pick.'

        but thanks for playing though :)

  • shawn

    I know it’s slow news wise but why are talking about guys who eventually we determine won’t be traded due to favorable contracts. RAB would be laughing if angels blogs starting speculating we would trade a guy like Piniero. This harkens back to the trade matsui for another teams player type posts. You gave mo good reason why angels would trade him so why even post?

    • YankeesJunkie

      Because they probably won’t be competing in the playoffs so they might as well get some prospects. This probably means the Angels wouldn’t consider trading him at least until they are out of the race.

      • mike c

        The angels have a good team, I could see them getting in the playoffs over TX

        • YankeesJunkie

          They were 80-82 last year and have not made any significant improvements except in the pen and the Rangers looked poised for another 90 win season. I don’t think the Angels have done nearly enough to catch the Rangers.

          • FIPster Doofus

            Full seasons from Morales and Haren will help.

            • YankeesJunkie

              True, however both added in there replacement has to be what 5-6 wins which still makes them short especially now that Beltre will be a Ranger.

              • Xstar7

                “Especially Now that Beltre will be a Ranger.”

                Made me laugh

  • nick blasioli

    i am sick and tired of the yankees not doing anything to help the team get better…all the bull shit is really getting to me…they dont have to wait for pettite,,they still have needs and holes to fill…just do it, before there is no one left to sign but some retreads…get it mr cashman…just do it…

    • FIPster Doofus

      Do what? There’s nothing out there.

      • Zack

        Yeah, but do it!

      • YankeesJunkie

        The Yankees should have signed Manny and Hideki to platoon at DH dammit!!!

        • Mattchu12

          Lets not forget sign Soriano and trade Gardner for Soria, shorten them games!

    • Jorge

      The Yankees just released Nick Blasioli, instantly making the team better.

    • Sean C

      You get my vote for Yankees GM. Just do it!

  • David

    And WHY hasn’t Cashman Perfected Cloning Technology so we can have a YOUNG MO, A-Rod, Jeter, etc… Damn it!!!
    Hypothetical question: If our type A player signs with another team, but we keep the clone, do we still get the draft pick?

    • Mattchu12

      True dat. I mean, if we at Coke Zero can give the world real Coke taste with zero calories, why can’t [Cashman] give us an infinite supply of [one in a generation players].

      • David

        Thank God someone understands what I’m saying!!!!!

        /Cashmansucks meme’d

        • Mattchu12

          Yeah, he hasn’t own a World Series in what? A year? What a joke of a GM.

  • Slim

    why the hell not, there is nothing else of value to spend money on.
    The rest available is crap, Yankees have money to spend and have been the laughing stock of the off season.
    They have no quality setup man.
    I don’t trust Joba anymore or Robertson they are fine as a 3-4-5 type guy but not a 1 or 2. They lost Wood who was great for them.
    The met guy they signed is fine but he is a LOOGY
    MO is amazing but why not shorten the game, have a replacement for MO after his deal is done, security for him getting injured, etc..

    This is an area of need, what the hell is wrong with Cashman this year

    • Carlosologist

      “why the hell not” = Horrible business conduct. Cash and Hal are running a business here. D-Rob proved last season that he could be the eighth inning guy and Joba figures to bounceback (I hope, at least). I don’t disagree with the idea of signing Soriano, but that would be making a move for the sake of making a move.

  • Slim

    regarding above before someone posts “Soriano wants a closer job”
    look at who his agent is, Boras
    He is going to take the biggest contract and the Yankees can offer him saves near the end of his contract.

    Time to open up the wallet and pay the last remaining talent.
    It will be a large amount to pay a setup man but pitching is pitching.

    • Craig

      Another obstacle is the fact that they’d have to give up their 1st round draft pick. Granted, draft picks are a few years off if they even make it, but I still don’t want to see the Yanks lose the pick to sign a RP.

  • cranky

    Joel Piniero?

    Huh? What?

    PLEASE….why would he be better than Noesi? Phelps? Warren?

    • Mattchu12

      Name suits you.