Jan
17

Open Thread: A one year ‘what if?’

By

Over at MLBTR, Alex Walsh has a Reds-related Bobby Abreu update. He writes:

The Reds won’t sign a veteran outfielder to a multi-year contract. If the Reds do sign such an outfielder, like Bobby Abreu, the deal will be for one-year. With the economy the way it is, such a deal may become increasingly more favorable to a player like Abreu.

So let met toss out some idle thought. What if Bobby Abreu ends up settling for a one-year deal? Should the Yankees get involved?

There’s no doubt that Bobby Abreu is still a very good hitter, if a terrible fielder, but I’d believe, without analyzing the situation, that one year of Abreu would be better than one year of Nady or Swisher. if the Yanks sign Abreu to a one-year deal, they could easily move Nady while maintaining Swisher, who is under contract for a few more years.

Of course, there are some limitations here. With Swisher and Nady, the Yanks have the luxury of seeing what they have. They can go with one and trade the other. It gives them roster flexibility. As soon as they commit to Abreu, he would be the starting right fielder and whichever of Nady or Swisher remains with the Yanks would be either be relegated to the bench or left field with Damon in center. The outfield defense would suffer, but the bench could be stronger.

In the end, it’s just a though. Feel free to debate this or anything else tonight in your open thread. Just play nice.

Categories : Open Thread

152 Comments»

  1. Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

    Pass. We have enough DH types on this team with Damon, Posada and Matsui all likely to see some time there. Plus give the aging regulars a half day off here and there.

  2. Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

    This is what we need.

    “Like I said, like Theo said — I don’t see the money factor. I don’t see the dollar signs. I just see playing baseball and getting prepared for the season.”

    http://www.projo.com/redsox/co.....1147f.html

    TRUE GRIT!

  3. Jake H says:

    I’m torn because while I like Bobby, I don’t know if I would want to trade Nady.

  4. Paulie says:

    He was pretty consistent during his Yankee years…

  5. Ace says:

    I’d rather stick with Nady and Swisher and

    A. make a deal at the deadline

    or

    B. offer Nady arbitration, which he will decline as a Boras client, and get the draft pick for him.

    Damon is out of here next year and we might need Swisher in left.

    Next year’s offseason will be interesting.

    • That guy says:

      If Damon continues to play the way he is I dont see how he’s out of here at all.

      • Ace says:

        I think they will replace him because Cashman has said he is trying to make the team younger and more athletic.

        • That guy says:

          Doesnt matter. if he can perform like he has been he’ll be on. He’s pretty good in left and a great lead off man. I think he’ll be back if he stays level.

          • Peter Lacock says:

            Very possible. No obvious FA replacements. Holliday is a LF that might be available and worth looking at, (we’ll see how he does with Oakland). but he’s no leadoff hitter. Damon could take Zilla’s spot at DH. Gardner might show enough to take his place at the top of the lineup but there’s not much else in house. Maybe AJax. Damon could stick around awhile.

            • Peter Lacock says:

              Maybe Swish.

              • Peter Lacock says:

                Damon would actually be a pretty good DH upgrade over Zilla. Matsui may be able to play a little LF but Damon can play it better and he could also play some CF. We’d still be getting younger, faster and better defensively subbiing Zilla with Holliday. Much can happen between now and then.

          • dan l says:

            Dude you need to look at the facts before you say how great Damon is!

            Jeter is a better lead off hitter and always has been.

            Damon did not hit lefties well last year at all and hit right handers well above his career norms. He is more likely to be the 07 Damon then the 08!

            • Peter Lacock says:

              Jeter is a hacker. He’s no leadoff hitter. Why do you think he hasn’t been doing it all these years?

              • ryan says:

                maybe it’ll reduce those double plays he constantly hits into

              • Sweet Dick Willie says:

                Jeter is a hacker. He’s no leadoff hitter.

                Jeter’s career line as a lead-off hitter: 315/389/471

                Damon’s career line as a lead-off hitter: 289/355/438

                The internet makes it tougher to say shit that isn’t true.

                • JeffG says:

                  I think what Pete was thinking is the pitches he sees per plate appearance. I know we had Soriano lead-off but I agree that we are better served having to first guy up ready to get right into the job of wearing the starter out.
                  Also, helps the guys behind to see a few more.

    • Joe says:

      Since this is a ‘what if’ thread, why don’t the Yankees consider trading Matsui in favor of replacing him with Abreu? The fact that Matsui is going to be in a walk year should be somewhat appealing to other clubs regardless of his recent surgery.

      Abreu would become the DH and occasional outfielder thus negating his terrible fielding but maintaining on-base mentality the Yankees want. He doesn’t “have” to be the starting right fielder at all in this case.

      • steve (different one) says:

        no one is going to trade for Matsui.

        • Joe says:

          The Seattle Mariners.

          • Peter Lacock says:

            No one is going to trade for Matsui.
            If anyone would even consider it, they aren’t giving up anything and the Yanks would still have to pay him.

            • Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

              Yeah, with what you’d get back you’re better off keeping him. You’d be a better team if you didn’t deal him.

              Speaking of which, how stupid does the Santana deal look in retrospect? They got shit in return, lost the draft picks, and missed the playoffs in Game 163 last year. Bill Smith got destroyed on that deal, and it looks even worse now with how things played out. He would have been FAR better off either taking the Hughes+ deal or not trading Johan at all.

      • Sweet Dick Willie says:

        why don’t the Yankees consider trading Matsui

        Because he is 34 years old, is coming off surgery on both knees, is owed $13 mil for ’09, and has a full NTC (which usually requires some type of compensation to waive).

        So, if you are GM, this is the type of player you are looking to add to your team?

  6. Tim says:

    Has anyone been to 5 Guys in Brooklyn. It is a pretty good burger place… if you do go I advise you 1 order of fries is good for two people at least.

  7. Matthew says:

    I was actually thinking about this the other day. With the short porch in RF, I don’t think he hurts you that much in the feild, and with his arm, he’s not a a total defensive liability.

    If it’s one year, then yes, with Swish as the incumbent, I like it. Plus, you can get value for Nady.

    • Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

      Can we get value for Nady?

      With the number of FAs OF still on the market (Abreu/Dunn/Manny/Garret Anderson) and their prices dropping every day that we get closer to ST, why would a team give us a good prospect or player when they can simply sign someone?

      • Matthew says:

        Good point. But he comes cheap…due arb, but no more than, say 6mil for a 1 year rental.

        I’d like a Nady/Swish platoon personally, but it’s an interesting thought on Abreu.

      • Joe says:

        The cost of signing someone plus a draft pick. Other teams are most likely unwilling to do that since they’re not named “Yankees”.

        On a side note, don’t Brian Cashman’s moves from last year’s trading deadline look more and more prescient, as if he’s out-GMing everyone?

        This draft’s picks are protected since last season’s draft didn’t pan out (but Bleich so far looks like a stud). Does anyone know who the Yankees might pick this year?

        • Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

          I would hope we would get more than one draft picks worth of value in return for Nady in a deal. In which case, it doesn’t make sense for the other team. They couldn’t even extend Nady, he’s a Boras client.

    • Let's Talk About TEX Baby says:

      In Abreu’s case I think the short porch makes his defense even worse. The fact that he won’t go near the wall decreases his already limited range.

  8. steve (different one) says:

    why wouldn’t the team that is willing to trade something for Nady just sign Abreu to that same one year deal?

    • That guy says:

      Nady will get you draft picks and somewhat better in the field? I didnt look at stats, im just guessing seeing as Bobby wasnt exactly good.

  9. Balls Deep says:

    If they trade Nady/misc. reliever for a starter… Abreu is a good option on a 1 year deal, add Yankee option on the 2nd.

  10. That guy says:

    Anyone know if there could be a match with the Phillies for Brett Myers? Or if we’d even want him. Seems like they might be listening via MLBTR

    • Matthew says:

      He’s got stuff, kinda….but he seems like too much of a liability. Although, I do like that he has experience, and success in both a starting role, and the ‘pen.

      He did have that incident in the middle of some Boston street with his wife…the same wife who slept with all the Philly minor leaguers, and he married her.

    • Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

      They WERE listening, thinking they could sign Lowe. That’s no longer the case.

  11. Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

    I think Bobby is somewhat risky even on a 1 year deal. Check this out

    BB/PA

    2006 1/5.5
    2007 1/8.32
    2008 1/9.36

    His walk rate has been cut almost in half over the past 3 years. That tells me his bat is slowing down, a lot. He cant afford to be as patient as he once was. At age 34, any further decline in his bat speed could cut seriously into his production. He has always had high SO numbers, and Bobby’s never exactly been known to be a gym rat. Guys like him can lose it pretty fast.

    • flipper says:

      Or it could have something to do with the fact that he has a guy named Alex Rodriguez hitting behind him. That’s a little different than batting in front of Burrell or Liebertahal

      • Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

        You misunderstood. His walk rate went DOWN, not up. Those are his walks per plate appearance.

  12. I love Bobby, but we don’t really need his defense.

  13. Matt says:

    Even if Nady were to be moved, I’d prefer Swisher over Abreu. He’s got a little less power than Bobby but his defense is much, much better. So, sorry Bobby, I love ya, but, your time in the Bronx is done.

    • Artist formerly known as 'The' Steve says:

      Actually, Swish has a bit more power but you’re right he’s both better and more flexible (1B/RF/LF) defensively.

      Also, from what I’ve heard Stick and Girardi are high on Swish as well. Stick likes his Yankee stadium swing from the left side and Joe likes his enthusiasm. Girardi likes rah-rah guys, he thinks the Yanks have been a bit dead in recent years, and he’s right. It’s a fine line between being business like and not giving a shit, and some of the final Torre teams looked and played like they didn’t care. Especially in the playoffs.

      • Matt says:

        I hope they’re high on Swisher because he should definitely be the starter over Nady. He’s the better hitter and a MUCH better fielder.

    • Peter Lacock says:

      Yes, Swish is better. Keeping everyone is a solid plan. Any trade has to be a good one and I doubt anyone will be desperate enough for Nady to make Cash bite. Manny would be better than Bobby to platoon with Zilla at DH. Think ManRam would be happy DH-ing against lefties only?

      • Sweet Dick Willie says:

        Manny would be better than Bobby to platoon with Zilla at DH

        Why would you platoon Manny w/ Matsui? Manny hits RHPs better than Matsui.

        Manny vs RHP = 306/398/582

        Matsui vs RHP = 294/376/494

  14. Januz says:

    Several weeks ago I mentioned the possibility of bringing back Abreu at a salary of $8-10m for one year. It is a move that makes a lot of sense, because Nady was not exactly Joe DiMaggio at the plate and in the field. I concede that he is slipping at the plate, but a 3-5 batting order of Texieria, Rodriguez, and Abreu, would be as good as it gets.

  15. Thomas says:

    If the Yankees are going to trade Nady or Swisher and replace him with an all hit, no field player, why would they add Abreu over Manny? I’d personally stay put, but would Manny be a better addition over Abreu?

    • Joe says:

      I agree that even if Cash doesn’t make any moves the Yankees will be “okay” but I’m still uncomfortable with the idea of Matsui, Posada, and Cano having a bounce-back year.

      There’s too much uncertainty in the lower half of the lineup and that’s the part that needs to be considered.

      Something needs to be done about the DH spot and although Manny would certainly be a better option over Abreu (and Matsui and Posada and whatever dreck the Yankees drag out), whomever is going to be moved should bring back at least a starting pitcher.

      There are a lot of non-contenders in the AL that could use a DH while they rebuild. Bedard never liked being considered the ace for the Mariners, and they still don’t have a middle-of-the-order batter — how about a contract for contract swap between both clubs?

    • Januz says:

      There are three reasons why Abreu over Manny. 1: 1 year vs multi-year contract. 2: More than double the dollar terms involved. 3: Manny in the Bronx could be like TO in Dallas, more trouble than he is worth (Arod is bad enough).

      • Thomas says:

        1. Abreu will probably get a multi-year deal like Ibanez and Burrell got.
        2. Manny will get more money and years but is much better.
        3. A-Rod is in no way bad/trouble for the Yankees, just like Manny problems in Boston were far outweighed by his performance. TO also is a plus for Dallas. He is easily the best offensive player on Dallas and without him they have no passing game.

        • Januz says:

          I would NOT take Abreu on a multi-year contract, one year or nothing. I agree with you about Manny’s performance, it speaks for itself. But sometimes these type of players drag down the chemistry of the entire team. Thats what TO does, that is what “Pacman” Jones does, thats what Clemens and his “Trainer” did, that is what Burress did.
          The goal is to have a well oiled machine of a team. As many professionals as possible: Jeter, CC, Rivera, Tex, Posada, and Damon to name a few. Those types win championships.

          • Thomas says:

            All those cancer players you mentioned none hurt their team by chemistry. Pacman (in Dallas) and Clemens (in 2007 NY) hurt their team, because they were not good. Plax and Pacman (in Tenn) hurt their teams because they couldn’t play.

            For example without Plax, teams could stack the line against the Giants killing their running game. This is applicable to TO as well.

            All those players are positives when playing and not negatives in the clubhouse. They help their teams win and thus improve chemistry. Winning makes a happy clubhouse, not vice versa. Good players are good teammates.

            Unless Manny actually is cancer and is the reason Lester got lymphoma, his bat and performance makes him a great asset.

            • Whitey14 says:

              Well, I’m not in their clubhouses like you are, but if you don’t believe that the prima donnas you mentioned have a negative effect on their teams, then you’ve probably never played on a team with a guy who thought he was all that and a bag of chips, deserving of all the focus and attention. Nobody doubts these guy’s value on the field, but just like all the new statistics today force us to look at different angles of a guy’s performance, you have to take the intangibles into account when judging a guy like Manny. You see the numbers and think he’s a “great asset” while not understanding that guys like him divide clubhouses, put their teammates in the awkward position of having to answer questions from the media about them and only play at their best when they feel like it.

              I’ll never forgive Manny for what he did to the Sox this past season. He was plain and simply another spoiled professional athlete refusing to live up to the terms of his contract. If you think his behavior and refusal to play at his best every day was valuable to the Red Sox, I would disagree wholeheartedly. For all we know, he may have cost the Red Sox the three wins they needed to overtake Tampa Bay, which would have completely changed the playoffs for all four teams.

              Winning solves a lot of problems in the clubhouse, but when your veteran teammates vote in agreement of trading you, it’s speaks to how negative an impact you were having. Brian Cashman is not dumb enough to add Manny Ramirez to his squad. He knows better.

  16. Brooklyn Ed says:

    Says Bowman: “Motivated by last week’s meeting and under the belief that the Phillies might attempt to create payroll space by trading Brett Myers, the Braves acted quickly and provided an offer that Lowe couldn’t refuse.”

    Myers may have been taken off the block after Lowe signed with the Braves. On the other hand, perhaps a bigger-than-expected deal for Ryan Howard could convince the Phillies to revisit the idea of trading Myers.

    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/.....onsid.html

    ————-

    at least he’s not worse than Jon Garland. He could be #4 starter, but who would take to land him?

    • Brooklyn Ed says:

      but what would take to land him?

    • Januz says:

      Ryan Howard is a guy who would be smart to sign long-term in Philadelphia. There are not exactly a lot of future landing spots for him (For example: The Yankees and Red Sox have their first basemen locked up for years, so those are not options for him), and teams have to be worried about his weight, and high strikeout totals.

    • I don’t think the Yankees go for the wife-beating types.

      • Brooklyn Ed says:

        oh crap, that’s right.

      • Matt says:

        One of the best moments of the year:

        It’s July, Moose is pitching against the Sox, my girlfriend and I are in the second to last row of the Stadium on the first base side. An entire section, us included, start chanting “JULIO LUGO BEATS HIS WIFE.” It was fun.

  17. adeel says:

    Forget CC, forget Tex, (no, really) I want Manny on this team. For more reasons that can possibly be articulated and read by a sane person on this forum. The reason is simple, Manny is clutch, he has more of Ruth in him than any other player in the game right now.

    The fact that he is still a free agent speaks volumes of how many gm’s would rather have teams that “are friends” than teams that would win. Will Manny make the clubhouse a living hell? Probably. Will he make A-rod cry? Maybe. Will we win? Definitely.

    Abreu was great for us, but everytime he got a hit a-rod would strike out. Everytime A-rod hit a home run, Abreu was not on base. It was the WORST, most OVERHYPED 3-4 combo that were never in sync.

    Abreu needs to move on. I really liked him, but there was no chemistry.

    Of course, all of you will pound me for saying “forget tex and cc”. You will tell me to forget manny because he’s “spoiled”…..

    Do they have any rings? Were they ever part of a team that broke an 86 year old curse? They got where they are today with hard work and determination; Manny got to where he is today DESPITE it. There can be no substitute for talent.

    • Joe says:

      That’s silly logic, considering the White Sox had a longer dry spell and they didn’t have any premiere superstars.

      The playoffs are luck, let’s just put it that way.

    • Look, I understand clubhouse chemistry can occasionally be overrated, but Manny fucking quit on the Red Sox.

      Is that really the type of person you want on the Yankees?

      If it is you should start rooting for the Mets.

      • Joe says:

        We can’t say he quit on the Red Sox considering we’re the audience here and any information we’re privy to is secondhand and then further distilled through whatever filter that follows.

        The Sox, on the other hand, already have a history of mistreating their players. Manny’s situation isn’t new at all. Just ask Johnny Damon, Wade Boggs, and Roger Clemens.

        • Januz says:

          Everyone knows what Boston is all about, there is no mystery. However, to be honest they Yankees have had wife beaters (Darryl Strawberry), and all kinds of other characters on this team, down through the years. However, it does not mean you have to like them. Or the juicers like Petitte or Clemens.

      • Thomas says:

        Do you know who Manny Ramirez is? Because with the Sox he played 100 games and OPS+ 136. If that is a quitter, what does that make Jeter?

      • Count Zero says:

        I don’t know how many times this needs to be posted…

        Manny, July 2008: .347/.473/.587 — he missed two games.

        On June 30th his triple slash was: .279/.370/.500 and when he got traded it was up to .299/.398/.529, so contrary to the “legend” propagated by the Boston media he was actually picking it up in July.

        Give me nine “quitters” with that triple slash and we’ll see who’s getting a trophy with a lot of little flags on it at the end of the season.

      • Beamish says:

        The type of person I want on the Yankees puts up .332/.430 /.601 with a 164 OPS+, 37 HR and 121 RBI.

        If he put up those stats he could strangle kittens in his spare time and I wouldn’t really mind.

        If the Yankees were to sign a no-glove OF bat to a one-year deal I would much rather gamble on throwing an incentive laden contract at Manny (that paid him $25-30 million in exchange for MVP numbers) than spend anything on Abreu. Bobby was nice, but now he is gone and should stay there.

    • Old Ranger says:

      If any of you had been watching the game Mo struck Manny out in the 9th inning, you may have a different opinion of him. Manny never moved a muscle at all, he let the pitches go right on by, as though he was made of stone. Even Mo (I think it was) commented on it after the game. He Quit on his teammates, that is unacceptable behaviour for any man.

      • Whitey14 says:

        Thank You Ranger, you couldn’t be more right! Nice to see you by the way!
        It does not speak well of the portion of the fan base of any team that is ready to overlook these types of things, from any player, because they want to win. Although it does prove that the fan base is a microcosm of a society in which people constantly ignore the transgressions of their favorite singer, actor, politician, etc. I’m not sure what ever happened to principles but it seems a lot of people only have them when they’re convenient these days.
        Here’s a dumb example. In my hometown, there was a group of folks who really hated the war in Iraq and on several Fridays they got together and picketed the war and George Bush and made sure a lot of people noticed them. Yet you never saw them during inclement weather. They hated Bush and the War, but not enough to endure some rain or snow for their principles. Truly principles of convenience.

  18. Joseph M says:

    A great big no to Abreu.

    Manny is the ultimate rising tide he would lift the Yankee lineup to another level.

  19. So was I the only person that saw Manny not lift the bat against Mariano? Or decide not to play that one game?

    Look, I don’t argue that Manny’s a great hitter. He’s one of the best.

    But for the price and/or years he’d demand, his poor defense and the issues with his personality, I’d almost rather sign Ben Sheets.

    Almost.

    • Steve H says:

      It doesn’t matter anyway that he didn’t lift the bat, he’s a horrible pinch hitter, he’s never been comfortable, and knowing all of this, he was probably pissed at Theo. Manny hits lhp and rhp, he hits on the road, he hit as a LF, he hit as a RF and he hit as a DH. He does not hit as a pinch hitter, and never wants to be put in that situation.

      • Steve H says:

        Sorry, pissed at Tito, but my point still stands. Manny is a career .115/.294/.115 pinch hitter(not a typo). He needs to be in a zone, and clearly isn’t when pinch hitting.

      • Joe says:

        And what was he supposed to do against the Green Monster? He played at a park that turned any ball that flew against that wall into a base hit.

        No wonder he pissed on it so many times.

    • Thomas says:

      “So was I the only person that saw Manny not lift the bat against Mariano? Or decide not to play that one game?””

      If that was any other than Manny, would you think it was intentional? If Eckstein struck out on 3 pitches looking, would you assume Eckstein being lazy or Rivera being great? It is all just people assuming.

      Have you ever take a sick day off of work/school when you weren’t sick?

      Additionally, Manny’s UZR/150 was -6.9, which is bad but not awful.

    • Old Ranger says:

      No you are not, I posted above about just that fact. Good going!

  20. So I guess this is one of those pick-your-battles moments and I’m surrounded by Manny lovers here…

    So I’ll leave it at: I do not want the Yankees to sign Manny.

  21. Kevin G. says:

    If the Yankees do want to trade an outfielder and sign another one, why not Dunn?

  22. adeel says:

    All theo had to say to Manny was “look we will pick up your option”…. But Theo was thinking why should he pay manny $19 mil when he could get him for cheaper?

    You can spin this ANY way you like; but NAME one player the Red Sox actually gave a big fat contract to not based on the future, but on what they had meant to the frachise in the past.

    Forget all the other teams… Just compare Jeter, Rivera, martinez, oneil, and Posada with Pedro, Varitek, clemens, and Schilling. If you were a human being, which team would you like to play for? Once a Yankee ALWAYS a Yankee. You are only a Red Sock until you hit free agency.

    Since I have been with the Yankees (1986), the ONLY player (imho) that we really mistreated was Bernie. Regardless, The yankkes are about loyalty.

    You may disagree with the WAY manny did what he did, but you CAN NOT dispute the fact that Boston will not hesitate to cut your heart out the second you are not at your “peak”; or do you seiously THINK any of bostons new young studs will be wearing red when they are 40?

    AS FOR CHEMISTRY! Could the chemistry be any WORSE than it was last year? We looked like a bunch of overpaid rejects who couldn’t buy a hit! HOW COULD WE POSSIBLY DO WORSE? There were stretches were we looked absolutely dead! Manny is the exact person we need to piss everyone in that clubhouse off; An angry clubhouse is a winning clubhouse.

    A desperate depressed clubhouse is what we were last year.

    • Old Ranger says:

      Since I have been with the Yankees (1986), the ONLY player (imho) that we really mistreated was Bernie. Regardless, The yankkes are about loyalty.
      =========================================
      Since when has Bernie been mistreated? The Yankees gave him a contract (after two down years) that he and the team knew was to be his last. His last year, he played much more then anyone had expected him to because of all the injuries…he preformed very well. So, the Yankees asked him to ST to see if he could make the team, at the age of 37…he never bothered to answer anyone that tried to contact him. I would say the problem was with Bernie, not the Yankees.

      • Tony says:

        I think he meant when Bernie hit free agency for the 1st time (I think it was in 99 or 2000) (when the yanks offered him a contract at the 11th hour & only after the red sox where on the verge of signing him)

        Tony

    • Whitey14 says:

      You clearly did not follow the Manny saga in Boston or you would know that Theo didn’t want him. He tried to outright release him at one point and everybody else agreed at the time, he wasn’t worth his contract, probably due to all the baggage he brought with him. Manny had a contract to play the 2008 season in Boston. Trying to hold the Sox hostage and force them to pick up options they weren’t contractually obligated to punched his ticket out of town. I love that he’s still waiting for the deal he and Boras were sure they could get.

      Perhaps the Red Sox learned from the example the Celtics had set for them when they kept Bird, Parrish and McHale past their primes and their contracts caused the very sinkhole their franchise fell into for a decade+. It’s a ridiculous argument to say teams should continue to pay players that are past their prime based on what they did in the past. We’ll see if you’re still advocating it when it comes time for Jeter to go. Hopefully you won’t be thinking they should continue to pay him 18-20 million per season because he used to be great. That wouldn’t exactly be bright. And the Yankees are no more about loyalty than any other team, despite what you want to believe.

      The players know the deal, no matter what team they play for. When you begin to think you’re more valuable than the team thinks you are, it’s time to part ways.

  23. Matt says:

    And after toying with them in the first half, UNC is now telling Miami to go home and get its fuckin’ shinebox.

    • Thomas says:

      I don’t know if it was toying. UNC just isn’t as good as people thought. Also Miami is pretty bad (top win against Maryland and at BC).

      • Matt says:

        At this point, I just want it to be March. Everything is so wide open; the tournament is going to be great.

        Hopefully, it’ll end with another banner in Storrs.

        • Thomas says:

          Hell yeah!! UConn civil engineering senior myself. Hoping for both men’s and women’s titles.

          • Matt says:

            Woah. I’m a senior English major. Moving back in tomorrow; Maya Moore and three other players live across from me. Sweet.

            Check this: I look online last night to figure out which books I’m gonna have to buy, right? I find out one of my classes is scheduled for fuckin’ TORRINGTON! Define: freaking out.

            • Thomas says:

              My sophomore year, I lived on the same floor as Dyson, Wiggins, Curtis Kelly, Thabeet, Ben Eaves, and the legend that is John Mandeldove. It was awesome.

              That sucks about Torrington. Good luck with that and everything else.

  24. Manimal says:

    First comment from my new laptop!

  25. Eirias says:

    Travis Zajac: Juggernaut or Irresistible Force? You decide.

  26. Matt says:

    Probably old news but apparently the O’s and Markakis are close to a 6 year, 64-66 mil extension.

  27. Manimal says:

    Hey Matt, Do you know David Teggart? He is the field goal kicker for uconn, his mom is a Spanish teacher at my school.

  28. Dave says:

    Can someone explain to me how we have a far below average defensive club? I dont pretend to know a lot about the defensive prowess of most players because the stats dont seem readily available like offensive stats are to me. But i would like to assume that damon in left is at least league avg and swisher in right is above league average. If garden is not league average at the least in center why exactly is he playing because he provides little offensively. Infield, we have possibly the best defensive first baseman in the league.

    Cano and Posada are probably below league average to average in their respective positions but arod is above league average at third i would assume. Jeter is still around average to slioghtly below in short … So for the entire team, we have average to above average at every position except second and possibly short. Catcher is iffy depending on how well posada comes back from surgery but even assuming he does not come back the way he played in 2007, we still have avg or better defensive players at every position but two or three.

    Jeter is not yet horrendous at short and cano could certainly improve at second potentially making the team at least league average at every position. As I said I dont know a lot about defensive metrics and how the yanks measure up across the league but to say the team is well below average defensively next year seems incorrect to me. Next to mention Giambi and Abreu were both replaced by guys who were above average defensively. Will someone let me know what you think that knows more about defensive stats so i can get a solid idea about this? Thanks!

    • Yankees defensively:

      Johnny Damon: Fast, but very very weak arm.
      Brett Garnder/Melky Cabrera: Fine defensively
      Xavier Nady: Adequate defensively
      Alex Rodriguez: Occasionally forgets how to throw to first and doesn’t know how to catch a pop-up without yelling “Ha!”
      Derek Jeter: Limited range to one side and clearly on a decline.
      Robinson Canò: Good when he’s not being lazy
      Mark Teixiera: Stud.
      Jorge Posada: ? coming off of surgery
      Josè Molina: stud.

      Others:

      Bobby Abreu: Horrible defender-afraid of the wall, poor routes, lets balls play him.
      Jason Giambi: HATED throwing to second base

      The yankees are better now than they were last year, but that does not make them good.

    • A.D. says:

      Well now they aren’t at bad defensive team.

      This Year
      Tex: Well above avg
      Cano: ’08 Cano: bad defensive 2B ’07 Cano: very good defensive 2B
      Jeter: Just below avg
      A-Rod: avg
      Posada: below avg
      Damon: one of the better LF
      Gardner: well above avg
      Swisher: Avg to above avg

      Alternate:
      Melky: Avg
      Nady: Avg

      But think about replacing Tex great defense with Giambi’s below avg and Swisher’s avg to above with Abreu, worst RF in the AL. And all of a sudden its a pretty bad defensive team

  29. Dave says:

    It all depends on how much abreu would want but think about this … Nady in left, damon in center and abreu in right? Wouldnt that be a pretty horrific outfield defense. The lineup however would be pretty incredible:

    Damon CF LEFT
    Jeter SS RIGHT
    Abreu RF LEFT
    Arod 3B RIGHT
    Teixeira 1B SWITCH
    Matsui DH LEFT
    Posada C SWITCH
    Nady/Swisher LF RIGHT/SWITCH
    Cano 2B LEFT

    wOW! Talk about no holes. And it gives us insurance in case matsui or posada go down with an injury again. But as I said above the outfield defense may be one of the lesser in the league. We would certainly make up some of that with the lineup though. aND probably most importantly, we should use whatever extra money the yanks have left to spend on a fifth starter not an aging right fielder but the lineup does look exciting. Easily 1000 runs right there if everyone stays relatively healthy.

  30. Dave says:

    If we sign manny instead of abreu, we might as well put a folding chair out in left. If you want him to play dh, we have to trade matsui for a bag of balls and he has to agree to it. Manny cant play the outfield and we cant trade matsui. Thus, we cant sign manny.

  31. John C says:

    The whole “Joba should be the 8th inning guy” thing won’t seem to die. Even Sabathia is talking about how he is looking forward to “Joba and Rivera” closing games out for him and “has even talked to Chamberlain about it.”

    Unless this story today on Cbssports (I still type Sportsline.com) is completely wrong/misquoted, which wouldn’t surprise me.

  32. Dave says:

    if joba is relieving, who exactly is starting? We have all of three starters with actual major league experience greater than one season. Joba at this point is our fourth starter. I guess aceves is our fifth. we have no depth outside of hughes, kennedy and i guess coke none of which should be considered depth at this point until they pitch effectively for a couple of months in triple A. this is a very shakey way of going into the season. Putting joba into the pen makes zero sense at this point. eITHER cc has no idea what he is talking about or was misquoted. I hope the latter because the former would mean he doesnt even know who the five starters are going to be out of ST. I wonder who he would say .. it wil be me, wang, AJ and uhhhhh.

    Did anyone read my defensive post? Can you guys tell me what you think of the team’s current defense?

  33. Dave says:

    oh i just saw that you guys did respond to my defensive post – that is why i dont like the reply to comment button. I keep looking at the bottom and forget to look below the comment. Thanks guys! Im going to read them now.

  34. Dave says:

    Your guys sentiment was pretty much the picture i had in my head. Outside of jeter who is declining, posada who is iffy and probably below avg no matter what and cano who depends on whether he brings the 2007 or the 2008 game, the team is pretty much avg to above all around the field.

    Hope jeter has one good year left in him at least and that robbie turns around his game and goes back to the 2007 version and the team seems far above avg by both of your accounts as Tex, Damon, Gardner, Swisher all are above avg. If cano jumps in there, that is five of eight above average and arod. Im surprise to hear that arod is only an average fielder because i thought that it was more about the arod bashers saying he was not good than an actual reality. Six of eight aint bad though and posada and jeter can certainly perform to only slightly below average next year if they bring their A game.

    To me, after the assessments it seems the team could certainly perform in the top half of the league defensively without too much effort. Lets hope posada’s surgically repaired shoulder is stronger than ever and jeter’s decline comes on very slowly. I dont like the abreu signing because that not only weakens right field but switching damon to center weakens the entire outfield significantly. Its good to hear damon is one of the better left fielders in the game currently. I guess range and speed makes up for a bad arm in that position which certainly works to our advantage. I think I can throw farther than damon at this point ha!

  35. Dave says:

    Rebecca, wasnt the ha when he was running around the bases trying to make the infielder on the other team drop the ball rather than him yelling it while trying to catch the ball? I could swear he was the baserunner and not the fielder? Not like it matters though.

    • A.D. says:

      Use reply to comment, it makes everyone happy + makes the thread better

    • Beamish says:

      Yeah. He did it in Toronto on a potential 3rd Out Infield Pop. Since there were two outs the infield fly rule was not in effect and the SS(?) dropped the ball.

      What some people forget is that A-Rod scored that inning and though they still trailed, the “HA” rally proved to be the deciding margin allowing the Yankees to win. The Blue Jays could have pitched better and it would have been moot, they didn’t and they lost.

  36. A.D. says:

    Per MLBTR

    The Red Sox had not been returning Scott Boras’ phone calls, but now they’ll reopen negotiations. Watney notes that Varitek was not aware when he turned down arbitration that any signing team would have to give up a draft pick. Tek does not blame Boras for this.

    Whats with all these players that don’t know the rules of their own game. How can he not blame Boras, this shit is his job

    • Ryan S. says:

      After seeing Tek decline a $10M paycheck through arb. and now reading that Tek didn’t know he’d cost a draft pick since he’s Type A, I’m starting to think he’s not the sharpest tool in the shed when it comes to the business side of baseball. Him declining arbitration was a head-scratcher even when it happened, but now its starting to look like Veritek won’t make $10 throughout the remainder of his entire professional career. This certainly is an interesting time for baseball. Thankfully no matter what Boston does, it looks like their catching position is going to be a major liability offensively.

  37. ortforshort says:

    Abreu is clearly the best hitter from among Matsui, Damon, Nady and Swisher and his presence in the three hole will be missed more than most fans realize. However, you can’t consider bringing him back unless someone goes. Matsui would be my first choice because he has a bad wrist and two bad knees which have robbed him of his mobility and his power, most likely. If you can’t do that, then I’d get rid of Swisher. Being relatively young doesn’t automatically mean that you’re any good. I’d keep Damon, he’s an outstanding leadoff hitter, and I’d keep Nady – he looked like a pretty decent player to me last year.

  38. Brian M says:

    I think it might come down to how confident we are that Posada can catch this year.

    I wouldn’t mind seeing Bobby back for 1 yr. his defense is bad, no question, but his production is solid.

    If we can get a good prospect in return for Nady, or get a 5th starter in return for a package built around Nady, and bring Bobby back at a reasonable price, then great.

    I don’t have much faith in Matsui to stay healthy all yr. If Posada can catch then we can have Abreu DH some games and play Swisher in RF. Likewise if Damon has any injury problems we could slot Swisher into left and be slotting another solid bat into place.

    I wouldn’t move Swisher though, only Nady. Swisher is a great guy to have because he can play so many positions. If Texiera/ Nady/ Damon or Matsui gets hurt, we need him to step in and play. Even with everyone healthy we should be able to find our 4 outfielders plenty of at-bats.

  39. Chuck says:

    Andruw Jones for 1yr/400k? Any takers?

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