Rosenthal: Yankees have yet to receive an offer for Phil Hughes

Scouting The Trade Market: Jeff Samardzija
Marcus: No Biogenesis suspensions expected today

Via Ken Rosenthal: The Yankees had not received any trade offers for right-hander Phil Hughes as of yesterday. The team has reportedly been “aggressively pushing” him on the market in hopes of landing a bat, though that was before the recent Alfonso Soriano trade.

Hughes, 27, has a 4.58 ERA (4.64 FIP) in 112 innings across 20 starts this year. To no one’s surprise, his home/road splits are rather drastic. The Yankees aren’t exactly blessed with a ton of pitching depth at the moment, and if they’re not going to get a decent bat in return, they should just hold onto Hughes for the second half. No point in making a move just to make a move.

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Scouting The Trade Market: Jeff Samardzija
Marcus: No Biogenesis suspensions expected today
  • Eddard

    You mean nobody wants a fly ball pitcher who gives up too many homers? They do have pitching depth, BGDP and Pineda. And I’d give one of those guys the job over Hughes right now. Between CC and Hughes we could have the 27 Yankees lineup and we’d still allow more HRs than we hit.

    • The Bastard

      Heh.

  • HateMclouth (formerly I’mVernon)

    I’m honestly very surprised about this. He’s a horror to watch at home, but I really would have thought a team with a big park would have taken a chance at him.

    I wonder if this will make him more inclined to take a QO, if offered.

    • LK

      Well, as a rental, he’s only useful to teams that are in contention this year and have a hole in their starting rotation. Not too many of those that also have large ballparks.

      • HateMclouth (formerly I’mVernon)

        That’s a good point. Giants, Padres, Mariners are likely not contending.

    • NYYROC

      I think PH would decline. JMO, but I think the last thing he wants is another year at YS, another year answering questions about the HRs and possibly losing his SP job.
      At TD there are only a handful of teams looking to add. In winter everyone is looking. Plus I don’t think teams want to make a trade for a 2 month rental..What if trade backfires. More likely to sign a guy to a FA deal.

      • jsbrendog

        problem is, at shit point he probably accepts cause who in their right mind gives up a draft pick for phil hughes? he isn’t as good a lohse and look how long it took someone to pony up for him,.

        • HateMclouth (formerly I’mVernon)

          My thoughts exactly.

        • LK

          Hughes definitely is at shit point right now.

          • jsbrendog

            hahaha whoa totally meant to write this hahaha. subconscious wins this time

        • Bo Knows

          He’s 27 and will be a free agent, he would want a multi year deal and will most likely get one, and even if he accepts the QO its not the worst thing for the Yankees.

          • jsbrendog

            why in the hell would a team give up a draft pick for a well below avg league pitcher and sign him to a long term deal? think abouit it. Kyle Lohse is a much better pitcher and was coming off a 134 era+ 4.3 bwar season and barely got signed by anyone. who the hell is gonna give up a pick for phil hughes?

            • Cool Lester Smooth

              Because Phil Hughes is 27, while Kyle Lohse was 34.

              Because Phil Hughes has pedigree as a former top prospect, while Lohse was a scrub before he met Dave Duncan.

              Because Hughes strikes people out, while Lohse never has.

              Because giving up a lot of homers as a righty pitching in Yankee Stadium is not the same thing as giving up a lot of homers in the NL West.

              Take your pick.

              • jsbrendog

                i highly doubt someone gives up a pick for hughes until the offseason is almost over and at that point almost begrdugingly. unless it is one of the teams with protected first rounders who would lose a 2nd or a team that already lost a first and would therefore lose a second. i didnt take those factors into account previously.

        • Former ACE MannyGeee

          Lemme lay this on you…. The QO wasn’t what did in Loshe last season. It was being a Boras client and a fringe good-to-very-good pitcher being marketed as a very very good pitcher. Everyone saw through the Boras bullshit and decided he wasn’t worth that kind of scratch AND the draft pick, so they all balked.

          I think there is no real comparison between Loshe and Hughes (should he get a QO), besides the actual QO and that Hughes might accept it, while Boras would never let that happen.

      • HateMclouth (formerly I’mVernon)

        Yeah, I think that fact kind of flew over my head, about there being more teams interested once the offseason occurs. So maybe he will get some limited interest come November.

        Although I will say it seems like a foregone conclusion Hughes is going to get the QO, meaning that any team that signs him loses their draft pick. So any team that does show interest is going to have to think its worth a draft pick to sign him. The fact that contenders aren’t interested currently, and rebuilding teams (most likely) do not want to give up their pick, doesn’t bode well for him.

        • LK

          Well, for a team in the top 10 they’d be giving up their 2nd round pick (after the supplemental round). Once a pick is in the 40s the success rate is low enough that it probably won’t be a huge concern.

          • HateMclouth (formerly I’mVernon)

            Ahh right I forgot about the protected picks.

            • LK

              Still would severely limit his suitors though. I’m thinking he might accept the QO if the Yanks extend one. A lot will depend on how he pitches over the next 2 months.

              • Cool Lester Smooth

                If I’m Hughes, I’d rather take a 1 year, $5 million deal from the Giants than accept the QO.

                • LK

                  I think you’re right that that could be the best move for him in the long run; I’d be extremely surprised if he made that decision though. It’s tough to give up what would essentially be 8 figures of guaranteed cash.

                  • Cool Lester Smooth

                    He’d be sacrificing future earnings in a big way, though.

                    The man’s already a multi-millionaire. He can afford to bet on himself for a year.

                    • LK

                      Well, he might look at taking the QO as “betting on himself” to pitch well in YSIII. Either way, $10M is a large bet.

                    • Preston

                      If I was an agent I’d advise every pitcher to think of their contracts as a lump sum for the rest of your career, how ever long it is. Injuries happen at all ages and can finish your career at any time. I’d tell them to forget about things like future earnings and AAV and just focus on the total guaranteed amount in the contract.

                    • Former ACE MannyGeee

                      Makes a lot of sense Preston. I am not an athlete and I think of career potential that way as well. Don’t think of the future opportunity if it sets you back today, because nothing guaranteed.

                • Mac

                  It’s easy to say that, but I doubt you would actually leave $9 mill on the table if you were in that situation. If he makes $14 mill next year he doubles his career earning.

                  You’re counting not only on staying healthy (far from a guarantee for any P, let alone a guy who mysteriously missed basically a season two seasons ago with what I think is still an unidentified arm injury), but also on actually P well in a new place. Hughes ERA was a point higher on the road in 2012. It was at 4.76 on the road. No guarantee at all he’s a beast in a bigger park.

    • KeithK

      I think it’s well known/suspected that the Yanks are likely to extend a QO to Hughes in the off season and thus expect something better than a first round pick in return. Add that to his performance lately and I’m not too surprised that the yanks are not getting offers. Who would be interested? The A’s play in a big park but already have solid pitching. The Giants seemed like a good fit but they’re in free fall now and won’t be buying. Not a lot of likely suspects out there who should be interested in an extreme fly ball pitcher going into free agency.

      • HateMclouth (formerly I’mVernon)

        Mhm. I doubt many teams are willing to part with a draft pick just to sign Hughes. Who knows. We’ll have to see.

        • http://twitter.com/Harris__Tweeter Harris

          Linecum for Hughes would be an interesting swap for both teams, with Linecum potentially taking over as closer next year, and Hughes going to a big park in SF. I believe that won’t be possible unless both players agree to extend in advance, because if they were traded now they wouldn’t be eligible for qualifying offers.

  • Robinson Tilapia

    We’re not counting the gag phone calls to Cashman from forensic?

    • Former ACE MannyGeee

      Hehehe

  • The Bastard

    So funny, the guy is terrible and yet his boosters never fail to flail. Let’s see how they contort themselves into saying a team will still give him $50M this winter…

    • Steve

      I think you mean more than Anibal Sanchez got which was what, $80 million?

      • Cool Lester Smooth

        No one, at any point, has said that he will get Sanchez money.

        People saying stupid shit like this is what makes us “boosters” come off as assholes or homers when we correct them, because it’s truly, truly hard not to descend into extreme snark when responding to a comment this asinine.

        • Steve
          • Cool Lester Smooth

            Did you miss the phrase “strong walk year” from the first article?

            I guess you got me on the second one, though. There were 21 whole people who thought giving him Sanchez money made sense. That’s almost 1.5% of responses!

            You totally have a well-reasoned, valid point, buddy! No matter what they say!

  • nycsportzfan

    Ya, Hughes and Samardzjia are so similar(sarcasm). THis is of course to the ones who seem to think a guy who no one wants is like a guy who has pitched to a sub 4ERA in back to back seasons as a starter with strikeout stuff, that i guranee teams will want.

    Hughes is a joke of a pitcher, along with Sloba.

    • Cool Lester Smooth

      Strikeout stuff? Like the guy who had a better K/BB than David Price last year?

      • nycsportzfan

        Hows he doing when compared to David Price this yr? How was he compared to David Price the yr before last? So, another words you just found a pitcher whos good but had a down season last yr(to his standards), to make your point?

        Hughes is as mediocre as it gets. Its not just the HR’s, but the fact he can’t put guys away when getting 2strikes on em. Hes as AVG as it gets, with less then zero upside. Samardzija still has a bit of upside(feels as though his best is still ahead of him), and can retire guys with 2strikes on em, and has a solid ERA 3yrs running(albeit one yr was in pen).

        • Cool Lester Smooth

          David Price won the Cy Young last year. You know that, right?

          • Robinson Tilapia

            Well how did Cy Young do last year?

            • Former ACE MannyGeee

              Extreme fly bawl pitchah!

          • nycsportzfan

            Ya, my point was its not the norm for Hughes to do anything better then David Price. Another words, i don’t care about that. Hes not David Price and never will be a qter as good as David Price.

  • Kosmo

    This makes sense. The teams that might have shown interest in Hughes as 2 month rental have either faded or have dealt for another SP. Teams who are firmly in the playoff hunt don´t have an overwhelming need to add another SP. Of all the currently known available SP Hughes would rank behind Peavy and 1 or 2 others.

  • jsbrendog

    love to say i told you so

    • The Bastard

      Weren’t you one who was arguing he’d take a 4 year/$50M deal over the qualifying offer?

      • jsbrendog

        that is irrelevant to this conversation. I have been the #1 hil Hughes isn’t worth shit in a trade and is untradeable drum beater since day 1. That is what this article says.

        Now that you’ve grasped that (I hope although probably not)

        Yes, I did believe he would get something like that but that was before he continued to suck/got worse/i realized that if he turns down a QO people won’t want to give up a pick.

        DO I think hughes still gets avg 10-14 mil a year for at least 3 years? Yes. Does that mean it will happen? No. I am just a dude.

  • trr

    LOL.
    Maybe the Mets will sign him this winter

  • The Bastard

    The frustrating thing for me is that Hughes would clearly be better as a reliever. He *is* a failed starter. As a reliever he could be worth 2-3 bWAR a year, like he was in 2009. In the four years since, of getting hurt and sucking, he won’t even end up averaging 1 bWAR a year. The Yankees kept trying to jam this square peg into the pitching role and he’s never, ever rewarded their faith.

    Awful.

    • Cool Lester Smooth

      Yup, they’ve definitely been jamming him into a round hole by expecting a guy who gives up a lot of 350 foot flyballs to right field to succeed in Yankee Stadium.

      Of course, it’s not like someone with his profile could be more successful in a different stadium. Just look at that bust Jered Weaver, who has the exact same peripherals.

      • LK

        I don’t really think that comparison is fair. Weaver has consistently had his FIP outperform his xFIP and his ERA outperform his FIP. Hughes’ results and his peripherals have always been in line. Yes, his ERA would get better in a bigger ballpark – that’s true of every pitcher. I don’t think Hughes would all of a sudden become a guy who outpitches his underlying stats by switching parks though.

        • Cool Lester Smooth

          Weaver has also consistently pitched over half his games in Angel Stadium. His road ERA is worse than Hughes’ over their careers, that says something.

          My point isn’t that Hughes is a great pitcher, because Weaver isn’t one, either. My point is that the right ballpark can make a flyball prone righty who gets his share of strikeouts and doesn’t walk people look like a stud, while the same pitcher in Yankee Stadium would be a scrub.

          • LK

            I get your point, but I still don’t think it’s a valid comparison. Hughes in Angel Stadium would get better because his peripherals would get better, due to the fewer home runs. Would he start to outperform those peripherals? I don’t see any reason to think so – and that’s the main source of Weaver’s value.

    • Josh from CT

      HMMMMMMM…..Failed starter, who excelled as a reliever, who also has a high strikeout rate. Won’t we have that position available next season? Sign him to a 3 year, 18 to 21 million dollar deal to take over for Mo…

      • Former ACE MannyGeee

        Nope. He is of more value to this or any team as a backline starter than as a potential heir to MO. If he is as bad as I have spent this past 29 minutes reading, then he would never get through the 9th. Let Robertson have first and second crack at the closer role before we start overpaying for Hughes as an experiment.

  • Kosmo

    in fairness to Hughes I wonder what kind of toll pitching every 5th day with the notion that the team you signed with has publicly stated that they would be open to moving him in a trade. How could that not be on his mind ?

    • jsbrendog

      then he should man up and pitch better so they change their mind or they do trade him. this stuff is bs imo (nothing to do with you, just saying the whole but zee trade rumorz weigh on his performance! you pitch when you pitch.)

  • gbyanks

    2 trades come to mind hughes to the dbacks for prado and hughes to the braves for chris johnson. the dbacks 2nd best prosect is a third baseman having a great year in aaa while prado is having a down year and signed for 3 more years at 10 mill per. the braves need a starter and johnson is a bench player for them whos career stats are underwhelming for a corner infielder, and its not like hes a young up and comer.

  • John C

    Could also be that there are better pitchers on the market like Peavy and Ervin Santanna. As the trade deadline approaches on Wednesday and those dominoes fall, its possible a team will come looking for Hughes

  • mike

    We need to give other teams credit as well – why would a team with a big park want him pitching there anyway?? he is just not that good, he pitches to the level of his competition, and has neither a put-away pitch, or a FB which can blow by the bottom-of-the-order. He consistently is in the middle of the plate with his fastball, and no one takes a weak hack against him….

    He has no heart…and is a laid back Cali guy….why didnt he make Meyers uncomfortable yesterday – he took a pimp stroll after hitting an HR in the 4th inning in his first weeks in the ML, and so Hughes really made a point by letting him hit another homer next-time up. How about brushing him back, moving his feet etc….naah, let a rookie dig in as you are pitching for your job!

    he is a back of the rotation guy ( hi Mr Pavano) and its unfortunate he has been derailed from what we all hoped would be a dominant future….but thats happening in Flushing with their top power-pitching pick

  • Leg-End

    Get Phelps back, Pineda maybe and put Hughes in the pen if you can’t shift him for anything. Let someone else pay him next year.

  • Greg

    As soon as Phelps is ready, move Hughes to the pen. See if he can do anything there.

  • jim p

    What I can’t understand is why he hasn’t developed a put-away pitch in all these years. A change-up. Something other than just the fastball and curve. He gets two strikes on people but then they just foul off everything after, until they connect with something. For years, now.

    • CashmanSUX

      Ya. That’s what crappy pitchers do. The MLB gutters are LITTERED with trash like Phil Hughes. If a “put-away pitch” we’re something that could just “be developed” by anybody, everybody would have one.

  • CashmanSUX

    REALLY??? NO offers??? … NONE???

    What about for a giant bag of sh*t??? Has anybody called the Yankees to express any interest in a giant bag of sh*t???

    #6of1…..

  • Robinson Tilapia

    We clearly saved all our smartest comments for this thread.

  • bkight13

    Would OAK be interested if they lose Colon? Maybe package Hughes and a prospect for Josh Donaldson-3B. He is 27 with a couple arbitration years left. He should be due for a big raise after his All Star year this year.

    • bkight13

      I didn’t realize that he is the only guy to play 3B for them this year, so he probably wouldn’t be available.

  • hey now

    Cash: “I’ll give you Phil Hughes for a vintage Star Wars action figure set. No takers? Come on guys, throw me a bone here!”

  • Andrew Brotherton

    The Giants, Padres, and Angels all have protected picks next year and all play in ballparks that favor flyball pitchers, I could see him going to one of those three teams.

  • your mom

    Best case scenario, considering no one wants to trade for him now, is for Phil Phucking Hughes to pitch well the rest of the season so he can: A)help us make the playoffs B)increase the interest of possible suitors this winter and C)make it easy for Cash to make the QO.

  • Dan in Athens

    You all really believe that the austerity Yankees are going to DOUBLE Hughes salary of 7.1 million this year? You believe they will pay him more than Mo has averaged over the last 3 years?

    This team refused to pay Russell Martin 8.5 million and he was a better player. No way anyone gives him remotely that close.

    If you take the ten pitchers with the highest similarity scores to Hughes through 26 (which doesn’t even factor in this crappy year), here are your average performance over the next five years from age 28-32:

    5 year 4.7 Total WAR 35-36 .492 4.65 ERA.

    Since free agent WAR is considered 4.9 million per WAR, any AAV deal over 5 million would seem to be a limit.

    No one averaged 2 WAR per year. The only one to cash in was John Lackey, and he signed at 30 – not 27 – coming off averaging 200 innings per year for 8 years and the contract was a disaster.

  • http://www.twitter.com/mattpat11 Matt DiBari

    No one else wants Phil either. That’s great.

  • http://www.penuel-law.com/ Cuso

    I don’t think “aggressively pushing” is an accurate description of that link.