A real budget means Wang will move on
ByOver the past two days it has become abundantly clear that the Yankees do have a budget, and that they’ve basically reached the threshold. Since acquiring Javy Vazquez in December, Brian Cashman has told agents and reporters alike that the team had about $2 million to spend. When they signed Randy Winn for that amount and publicly declared Johnny Damon a former Yankee, they proved that the budget was no bluff. Recent reports indicate that the Yankees will focus on non-roster invites, with Marcus Thames, Rocco Baldelli, and Jonny Gomes specifically mentioned. The team’s lack of financial wiggle room also affects another oft-mentioned free agent.
Now that we’re done discussing Johnny Damon, many of us will turn to the most prolific former Yankee on the market, Chien-Ming Wang. Last time we checked, Wang’s agent, Alan Nero, sounded curiously optimistic about his client’s prospects. Shoulder surgery is no small deal, especially for a pitcher who relied on a power sinker that radar guns clocked at 95 mph. Yet Nero claims interest is strong in Wang, and that he expects “a major-league offer with a substantial guarantee and a substantial upside,” adding that he and his client would be comfortable waiting until May, Wang’s target return date, if necessary.
ESPN’s Jayson Stark has the latest from Nero, who claims that a few teams are heavily in on Wang now, and could perhaps make an acceptable offer before spring training. Wang, according to Nero, is “two to four weeks behind” his normal winter schedule, though Stark notes that teams “sounded more skeptical about that prognosis.” Stark identifies the Mets, Dodgers, and Cardinals as the teams most connected to Wang.
The story hasn’t changed, really, since the last time we heard from Nero. Wang remains a considerable risk, and since he won’t return until early May at the earliest I can’t see any team offering him a deal, as Nero says, that they “can’t say no to.” What would that take, two, three million? Is there any team desperate enough for a pitcher that they’d pay two, three million for someone coming off shoulder surgery and who can’t pitch until May? Other than the Mets. Or maybe the Royals.
The Yankees appear not to have interest in retaining Wang at this point, at least on their terms. Maybe if they unloaded Gaudin’s salary they could fit Wang in the budget, but then why would you trade a healthy pitcher for one who had shoulder surgery six months ago? It’s sad to see him go, and I hope he makes a full recovery, but we’ve seen the last of Chien-Ming Wang in pinstripes.
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Ever since they got Vasquez it stopped really mattering to me. I mean shit, at this point they have one of chamberhughes, gaudin, aceves, and mitre available to start if anyone in the rotation can’t do it.
Yeah, the Yanks have plenty of depth. Plus, would Wang really want to come back anyway? It seems like he could find better opportunities to pitch pretty much anywhere else.
I mean shit, at this point they have one of chamberhughes, gaudin, aceves, and mitre available to start if anyone in the rotation can’t do it.
6. Chamberhughes
7. Gaudin
8. Aceves
9. Mitre
10. McAllister
11. Romulo
12. Hirsh
13. Nova
Tommie: very aroused
Hirsh? Who is that, the guy sitting next to you?
Cue the Taiwanese posters coming here to say how disrespected the Yankees’ treatment of Wang is.
Back to Wang, “a major-league offer with a substantial guarantee and a substantial upside,” is not going to happen. It’s one or the other. No team will offer a big guarantee and huge incentives. It would be crazy…
…which is exactly why the Mets would do it!
But seriously, it’s sad to his time come to an end here, but them’s the breaks. Smart move on Cashman’s part to have been cautious with Wang for so long.
“the Yankees will focus on non-roster invites, with Marcus Thames, Rocco Baldelli, and Jonny Gomes specifically mentioned.”
Damn, those are pretty good names for non-roster invitees
I think there are teams that could guarantee more than that to those 3.
Yea, definitely agree
r u the new guy who kept signing his posts “-JM” the other day?
Gomes or Thames would be good rightys off the bench and very necessary since Winn and Granderson can’t hit righthanded. Melvin Mora could also be a good bench player, plays a lot of positions and has experience.
Yes, Mora “plays” alot of positions.
He plays them horribly.
granderson and winn could hit righties. get your facts straight.
nvm, my reading fail. sorry.
I said Winn and Granderson can’t hit right handed. Grandson was 181 last yr and Winn was 158.
Well you are half right. Granderson does not hit right handed but Winn is a switch-hitter.
Wow, are you clueless or what, both are switch hitters and both bat poorly from the right side, get it, it’s not that hard.
Curtis Granderson Bats: L.
Not a switch hitter.
K-Long already taught C-Grand how to switch hit? Dayummmm
Probably should get all your facts straight before you throw clueless out there haha.
says the guy that thought his original comment was off topic.
And if you read a little further I apologized for that mistake.
I don’t think it’s right of you to laugh at someone for not having their “facts straight”, after just apologizing for not having your “facts straight.”
Consider the disparities in tone between pete luciano’s comments and Big Juan’s comments.
Big Juan’s comments were much more benign from start to finish. When he said something incorrect someone called him out on it and he immediately apologized.
When pete said something wrong, he responded with vitriol and condescension and retreated even further into his error, and never apologized.
My comment was not intended to be degrading in the first place. I did not call anyone clueless, I was simply making an observation. When I realized I was wrong and I said so.
Then, Pete calls you clueless with no basis for such an insult, I make a post, in essence coming to your defense for being unnecessarily insulted, and you chastise me over the semantics of an earlier post. Doesn’t make a ton of sense to me.
Trust me, if I’m wrong about something when I post on here, I’ll be more than willing to admit it and apologize. I have no reservations about admitting such failures.
And thanks TSJC, for realizing all of that.
5 Our Fathers and 5 Hail Marys,now,get outta here you knucklehead.
I am obviously not clueless, thanks for the support Ben.
Not only is Granderson a crappy switch hitter because he only bats lefthanded, his career is also defined by a large sample.
/peteluciano’d
Ouch, Pete. You might want to take a couple of days off.
Considering this is a thread about Wang, I’m thinking your comment is a bit off topic.
Well, JoPaw did touch on Gomes and Thames in the post.
Yeah, it’s fair game.
My apologies pete. Guess I didn’t read very well.
I wonder if Beane will be in on the Wangman. He probably won’t get a huge contract and if he pitches well early, that’s a heck of an asset to have. This is assuming that Wang will take a one year deal.
i think the A’s rotation is set. I see the Mets and Dodgers as better fits.
Yeah most likely. It was probably more plausible before they signed Sheets.
I think a crappy team could have a lot of value in Wang. Sign him to a one year deal, if he does well, you trade him for some serious talent. If not, you’re out a few mil.
The mets — at this point — should sign a beagle with a bell around its neck if it can be trained to eat innings.
i mean with how far weve come in the world i can guarantee someone could train a monkey to lob balls over the plate… you could just put a livan hernandez jersey on him and nobody could tell the difference
low base 1 yr deal with banana incentives probably gets it done
The mets — at this point — should sign a beagle with a bell around its neck if it can be trained to eat innings.
The Mets should sign one of those St. Bernard rescue dogs with barrels of brandy tied around their neck to come and save them, because the Mets are fucked.
And when the St. Bernard dog arrives, they should drink all the brandy and then kill and eat the dog, because the Mets are hopelessly fucked.
I see the Mets and Dodgers as better fits.
Especially since Wang could use the haven of the NL & those two teams pitcher-friendly parks to get back on track.
Well, maybe for this year. If he has a strong season, he’s on a one-year deal…?
I think what you are aiming at, and correct me if im wrong, is for Wang to return in 2011. It’s a long time from now but for arguments sake, I’d say it’s possible, depending on a couple of things.
1st, the never ending will or wont Andy retire after the season. 2nd, does Javy Vasquez return for 2011. I don’t see CC(given), AJ, Joba, or Hughes being traded, and right now i would pencil them into the rotation for the 2011 season. So i think the only way he would is if both Andy and Javy leave after the 2010 season and Cashman doesn’t sign Cliff Lee, Brandon Webb, Josh Beckeet, Matt Cain, or Ben Sheets.
Again I think this has a lot less to do with the budget more to do with:
A-acquiring Javy Vazquez
B-shoulder surgery six months ago
Budget thing with the Yankees….too far
Do you really think there aren’t fans out there who are whining “but…but…Wang’s UPSIDE! Mitre and Gaudin are TERRIBLE! The Yanks have money JUST PAY WANG and put Joba back in the 8th if Wang is healthy!”
The budget argument nullifies even this. Would 2008 Wang be a good pitcher to have? Yes. Is there money to give him an MLB deal that’d compete with those that he’ll probably get elsewhere so that the Yanks can see if he’ll reach that upside? No.
I agree that this has more to do with Javy and Wang’s injury but the budget plays a big part too. Just because they’re the Yankees doesn’t mean they don’t have a budget (I though the Winn signing proved that? Guess not to some people).
Anyway, Wang, for what he would want and supposedly already has on the table (if it’s true that many teams are interested in him), would be too costly.
I agree with the both of you I just think that budget is not the main thing like the heading of this thread would have one believe. I thinking a lot is being made of the Yankees holding the budget line on what some might consider luxuries on an otherwise strong team.
2006-2008 CMW:
GOOD
sub-4.0 FIP in all 3 years
K rate went up all 3 years
HR rate declined all 3 years
BAD
walk rate went up all 3 years
LD% went up all 3 years
GB% declined all 3 years
hes a peculiar pitcher, tough to figure out
“why would you trade a healthy pitcher for one who had shoulder surgery six months ago?”
(1)because they have the pitching depth to take the risk
(2)because Andy Pettitte will be retiring some day soon
(3)because Javy Vazquez is already talking retirement
(4)because Wang returning to close to his past upside is better than the best upside for Gaudin
(5)remember Jon Lieber.
Makes sense if it is basically a swap of Gaudin’s contract for signing Wang.
Joe, as of this moment I’d agree that they’re out on Wang. But according to most reports, Wang won’t be ready to sign until April or May. One major injury to the rotation and that could change.
That’s not very likely, though. CC, AJ, Vasquez and Pettitte have all been workhorses in recent years, and if one of Joba/Hughes got hurt, the other would simply step in. So it does appear that Wang is gone.
We’ve got so much depth, there’s just no room to fit Wang in.
(3… 2… 1…)
But if you even give Wang a small opening, he will take advantage of that opening and use it for all it’s worth.
Unless said Wang belongs to Greg Oden.
“But according to most reports, Wang won’t be ready to sign until April or May.”
But the whole point of this post centered on the idea that Wang could sign earlier, based on the Stark report.
it has nothing to do with budget. it has to do with the fact that they dont think he is good.
They also don’t think Mitre is good.
They think both Wang and Mitre are not good, but they wanted pitching depth and they chose to bring back Mitre and not Wang because… Mitre is easier to fit in a budget.
I’m sure if the Yankees thought Wang wasn’t good but Wang only cost 850k, Wang would still be in pinstripes and Mitre would be out on the street. They chose the smaller upside depth pitcher for budgetary reasons.
One guy is healthy and the other isn’t. Now was that so hard to understand?
Yankee fans have to realize that Wang is basically done. He was a one pitch pitcher. He survived due to a 95 mph sinker like Kevin Brown. But unlike Brown, he never developed any secondary pitches. He fooled around with a slider but never trusted it. Now thanks to his shoulder his sinker is more in the high 80s as we saw last year. That’s why he was getting creamed.
I don’t think the budget comes into play here, I think the Yanks are willing to spend X amount on Wang regardless of the rest of the contracts, but with what Nero has been saying, what Wang will receive > X