Nov
28

Yanks getting ready to up offer to Jeter

By

(AP Photo/Tony Gutierrez)

It’s been a messy few weeks of negotiations between the Yankees and Derek Jeter, as the two sides have taken to the press to state their cases and maximize their leverage. The Yanks offered their captain a more than fair three-year contract at $15M a season, but Jeter’s camp is looking for four or five years worth up to $24M a season. A large gap certainly, but not an unbridgeable one, and the team is prepared to up their initial offer. Take it away, Jon Heyman

The Yankees appear willing to enhance their latest $45 million, three-year offer to retain the iconic Yankee, but are said to be unwilling to match his previous salary on a deal of at least three years. Jeter just completed a 10-year, $189-million deal that paid him about $21 million in 2010.

The Yankees’ next offer is expected to be for a couple million more per year, so perhaps in the $50 million range for three years. Indications thus far are they have very little inclination to add a fourth year, though that can’t be entirely ruled out. The team would like to complete the Jeter negotiations so they can get to the rest of their offseason to-do list, bringing Jeter’s longtime friend and iconic closer Mariano Rivera back into the fold and pressing to sign superstar free agent pitcher Cliff Lee.

As expected, the money isn’t much of an issue, it’s the years. Just ten shortstops have posted a 90 OPS+ or better at age-36, and one of those was Jeter last season (exactly 90). Just three (Ozzie Smith, Omar Vizquel, and Jeter) have done it since 1970, and the first two had decided defensive advantages over the Yankee icon. As historically great as Jeter has been, paying him in hopes that he’ll evade Father Time for the life of the contract is a foolish bet.

Ben explained the leverage situation last week, and for all intents and purposes Jeter has none. No other teams are bidding on him at that price, so the only thing he and agent Casey Close can do is push his iconic status. The Yankees appear to be more than happy to make Jeter filthy stinkin’ rich all over again, but they don’t want to lock themselves into a declining player for the next half-decade just because he’s Derek Jeter. Hard to blame them. I suspect this will all get settled somewhere in the three-year, $60M neighborhood, but don’t hold your breath. This might drag on into January.

Categories : Hot Stove League

117 Comments»

  1. HEY! What happened to the ‘Jeter-free weekend’?

  2. Jerome S says:

    So, if Jeter winds up getting 22 million dollars… Cano gets like 35 right?

    right?

  3. EVH5150 says:

    I can’t take this until January.

  4. Plank says:

    Is it wrong that the only thing I want out of these negotiations is for it to become very bitter and personal? I wanna see bruised egos and tarnished reputations on both sides.

  5. Mike HC says:

    Has there ever been a negotiation where literally every offer and counter offer, plus what each side is thinking at any given moment, has been reported in the press? Maybe, but I can’t remember one quite like this.

  6. Ultimate Yankee Warrior (James) says:

    I see no reason why they should up their offer. It’s already generous and he already can’t play shortstop.

    Well, at least they’ll have no shortage of DHs in the coming years…

  7. GermanYankee says:

    I wouldn’t offer more than 3/54. If he accepts, fine. If not, he has to go. The Yankees are bigger than any player, Derek Jeter won’t change that. If he wants to play for 2/20 anywhere else instead of taking 3/54 from the Yankees: fine, I’ve seen bigger idiots. The Yankees would be dumb if they’d pay anything more than 3/54. Jeter will accept that either way unless he wants to be the biggest moron in NYY history.

    • Teh Comp Pick says:

      I’m not positive that he could fetch 2/20 with any other team

      • Sweet Dick Willie says:

        Fangraphs says Derek was worth $9.8 mil in 2010.

        Considering there is at least a possibility that he will have a better 2011, I would think that any team in need of a starting SS would offer Jeter 2/$20 mil.

    • Mr Moss says:

      Yankees are dumb for offering 3/45…Jeter aint worth that,why up it even more

      Jeter = Tony Womack

      • bexarama says:

        Tony Womack 2005: .249/.276/.280, 50 OPS+

        2010 Derek Jeter >>>>>> Tony Womack. Not that I think they should give whatever, but this is insanity the other way.

  8. dan l says:

    I could care less if Jeter comes back! It’s not like the Yankees can’t win the World Series with Nunez. All 5 of Jeter, Rizzuto, Crosetti, Kubek and Tresh were contributing rookies when the team won the World Series.

    • mbonzo says:

      You think the team would be better without signing Jeter and having Nunez play SS? You do realize thats what you’re saying?

      • I Voted 4 Kodos says:

        He didn’t say they’d be better, he said they could still win the World Series.

        • mbonzo says:

          So he’s voluntarily making the team worse? He wouldn’t be making this suggestion if he didn’t think it would help the team.

          • I Voted 4 Kodos says:

            In a vacuum, the team is worse without Jeter. I have no faith in Nunez or Pena to even approach average offensive production for a SS. However, the team is probably better off without Derek in the long run if his demands remain ridiculous.

            • mbonzo says:

              Negotiations work by two sides starting with their most extreme offers. The Yankees responded to Jeter’s offer by publicly stating an offer above his market value to pressure him. It makes his camp look bad when they do it publicly, which is why I think Close was angry and called the tactics baffling, since Jeter’s marketing value is in his image. Jeter is just being patient with the club, its more likely they raise what they’ll offer instead of lower it in a market with no other shortstop competition.

              When people say, screw Jeter, forget negotiations, let Nunez play shortstop, I can’t believe people would want to make the team worse because of their emotions.

              • Teh Comp Pick says:

                3/45 was not extreme. Extreme would be a lowball offer below market value b/c Cashman knew he wants to stick around. Cashman offered well over market value.

                • mbonzo says:

                  I’m assuming 3/45 wasn’t their initial offer. They went public with 3/45 because it was a number that was above his market value, and well below what Jeter wanted. This puts pressure on Jeter since fans are getting angry and calling him greedy. Now that he’s endured some of backlash the Yankees will offer something a little higher and hope he’s worried about his image enough to accept.

                • ryan says:

                  this was not very well known or reported but the initial offer was actually well below 3/45. it was more like 3/28. so yes it was an actual extreme low blow to jeter. The Yankees very quickly upped the offer to 3/45 when they realized that, their new offer would make Jeter look bad for declining even though they know he would never accept that

              • Tim says:

                Yankees with Nunez at SS and another SP with $15 MM.yr salary >>> Yankees with Jeter at SS and no additional SP.

                The argument isn’t just Jeter vs. Nunez. It’s Jeter vs. Nunez and what the Yankees could do with that money.

                The thing that is baffling to me is why the team would think that losing Jeter was such a horrific and terrible thing. Contrary to popular opinion, you can win the WS without an all-star or future hall of famer at each position. In fact, you are probably more likely to do so, if you look at recent history.

                • Jerome S says:

                  2010 Giants – One of their pitcher is a HOFer (at least). Buster Posey is ROTY.
                  2009 Yankees – Rodriguez, Teixeira, Jeter, Cano, Sabathia, Andy Pettitte, Posada, Mo all profile as at least borderline HOFers in the future.
                  2008 Phillies – Ryan Howard?, Cole Hamels?. Brad Lidge was a tank that year.
                  2007 Red Sox – Manny, Ortiz, Papelbon (I know…)
                  2006 Cards – Pujols, Carpenter.
                  2005 White Sox – Buehrle, Konerko, Frank Thomas damnit!
                  2004 Red Sox – Manny, Ortiz, Schilling, Damon, Pedro fucking Martinez
                  2003 Marlins – Ivan Rodriguez, Miguel Cabrera, Juan Pierre
                  2002 Angels – Bengie Molina, K-Rod… you might have a point here.
                  2001 D-Backs – Johnson, Schilling, Luis Gonzales killed that year.
                  2000 Yankees – I don’t think I need to go into detail.

                  In conlusion, yes you do need all stars/HOFers to win. However, the Yankees have a surplus of those.

                  • Tim says:

                    And thank you for making my point. I said an all-star or hall-of-famer AT EVERY POSITION. Each of those teams had at least one replacement level player (with the exception of the two Yankee iterations) in their starting line-up.

                    And not to split hairs, but let’s not crown Lincecum as a hall-of-famer just yet.

          • OldYanksFan says:

            The question is NOT:
            Is Jeter >>> Nunez?
            I think we all know the answer is Yes.
            However, the question is:
            Is Jeter >>> Nunez + $18m? -OR-
            Is Jeter >>> Nunez + Crawford? -OR-
            Is Jeter >>> Nunez + Elite RP + Ellite DH?

            • bexarama says:

              Is Jeter >>> Nunez + $18m?

              Yes. This is pretty much the same as the other questions you ask here. I’ve said it other places but Jeter really fits the Yankees’ needs really well. With all the FAs currently available, that money would… well, it’s silly to say it’d go to waste, I’m sure they’d find somewhere to use it. But it’s better spent on Jeter than having a really crappy SS, plus someone else who doesn’t particularly fit the Yankees’ needs well but hey, they had this money around.

              Is Jeter >>> Nunez + Crawford?

              In a vacuum, no. Considering the Yankees’ needs and Crawford’s likely contract, yes.

              Is Jeter >>> Nunez + Elite RP + Ellite DH?

              Yes. Posada/Montero’s likely the DH next year. In a vacuum Dunn is great. In reality, the 2011 Yankees don’t really need to be spending money on Adam Dunn, who’s the only elite DH out there on the market. And supposedly he doesn’t even want to DH. Outside of Mo, who’s an elite RP in the FA group? Soriano? I’d still rather have Jeter than Soriano pitching teh eighhthth!!! next year.

      • The Big City of Dreams says:

        ppl need to stop drinking the Nunez Kool-Aid. Let’s not forget how many supporters Pena had last yr around the same time.

    • whozat says:

      And nunez isn’t even close to as good as those players, so I dont see how the comparison holds up.

      • dan l says:

        How can you say what Nunez can or can’t do? Are you a scout?

        • I’ve heard from enough scouts and seen enough of Nuñez to know that you’re vastly overrating him. He’s a utility infielder at best who doesn’t hit for any power and doesn’t have a discerning enough eye to get on base often enough. He’s not a better option than Derek Jeter.

          • dan l says:

            I have watched Nunez play many times and he looks good to me.

            Gene Michael seems to think very highly of Nunez.

            • mbonzo says:

              Gene Michael is trying to build up the trade value of his own player. He’s not gonna say the guy sucks like we all know.

              You might not know this, but before the 50 ABs you’ve seen Nunez play, he had 2557 in the minors. http://www.baseball-reference......nez-002edu He has no power, he’s too aggressive at the plate, and though I’ve heard some say his defense is good, I’ve heard many others call it terrible. So what do you do with a guy with a .318 OBP, no power, and questionable defense, you trade him.

              • Tim says:

                Or, apparently, you give him a three year contract worth over $15MM per.

                • The Big City of Dreams says:

                  Nunez is a first ballot HOF SS for the NY Yankees? I must have missed that.

                  • Tim says:

                    Oh, I’m sorry. I didn’t realize that well run sports franchises were in the business of paying employees for past efforts.

                    I’m not saying that Nunez is great, or even good. I AM saying that the difference in prodiction between Jeter and Nunez isn’t as stark as you might expect. I would be bad business to given Nunez a contract of any magnitude, and it is bad business to give Jeter one, too.

                    • The Big City of Dreams says:

                      “I didn’t realize that well run sports franchises were in the business of paying employees for past efforts.”

                      They have done these things in the past. I’m not one that thinks Jeter should get whatever he wants but at the same thing they can’t act as if paying Jeter means no Lee.

              • dan l says:

                You don’t know anything about Nunez…

                Gene Michael was not trying to build up trade value when he gushed about Nunez.

            • Pasqua says:

              Joe Morgan? Is that you?

          • SodaPopinski says:

            What’s Nuñez’ salary?

    • Seriously, why is everybody fellating Nunez? He’s absolutely horrible as a player. Sure he may pass for a league average SS, but why do we want a steaming pile of crap too?

      • OldYanksFan says:

        How about a steaming pile of crap + $54m?

      • The Big City of Dreams says:

        I understand where you’re coming from because those same thoughts run through my mind as well. I think it’s the back up QB theory. You know ppl always love the back up QB. In Nunez ppl see a young athletic player that would be playing a position built on defense. They don’t mind if he doesn’t put up elite or even good offensive numbers because in the Yankee line-up “he wouldn’t have too.” As long as he plays well defensively if his offense is decent or average than it’s a bonus. The thing is though ppl have to remember he’d be replacing Jeter at SS. Yes Jeter is a 36 yr old SS that took a step back this season but what he has done over his career can not be ignored. How brutal will fans and the media be when he doesn’t get hits in a handful of clutch situations? How long will it be until the same fans campaigning for Nunez turn on him because he’s not living up to their expectations?

    • Kiersten says:

      This shouldn’t need to be said, but apparently it does – Jeter was a top-10 prospect in all of baseball when he was called up. Nunez doesn’t even crack the Yankees top 10.

  9. JobaWockeeZ says:

    Keep your stance Cash. No team will even dream of oferring 20 mil.

  10. lincoln says:

    Derek Jeter is one of the most arrogant, unappreciative human beings that I have ever seen. Imagine, he honest belives he is worth more than 15 milion per year when NO other team in the major leagues would pay him 12 million per year for three years. If the Yankees don’t win the World Series in 2011, they will have no place to look but in the mirror for having been so stupud to pay an aging 36 year old shotstop on the decline with what is tantmount to 30 percent of the entire team payroll of the Tampa Bay Rays for the 2011 season. In the words of Jack Lalane in his show 45 years ago,” Jeter, its time to leave you and say good-bye.” Have a great life and good luck.

    • mbonzo says:

      Bye Jeter. We’ve got someone to replace you. He’s posted a .314 OBP in his minor league career but you should see what he did in 50 major league at bats… .321 OBP!

    • eckss says:

      But he is the epitome of all that is good in Yankeeland, unlike that stat-padding, money hungry, only-thinks-of-himself, horrible excuse for a human being, Alex Rodriguez!!!!!!!!

    • bexarama says:

      If the Yankees don’t win the World Series in 2011, they will have no place to look but in the mirror for having been so stupud to pay an aging 36 year old shotstop on the decline… In the words of Jack Lalane in his show 45 years ago,” Jeter, its time to leave you and say good-bye.”

      Yeah, no, there’s no one better available that we know of. I’m not in the “give him whatever he wants!!!!” camp because that camp is stupid, but the Yankees will still have as good a chance as anyone winning with Jeter in 2011. Replacing Jeter with Nunez puts a kibosh in those odds.

      • mbonzo says:

        Damn right voice of reason. I feel like I’m taking crazy pills today. Jeter will 100% be a Yankee, he’s just holding out for as much money as he can get. The media is making a lot more of this story than it really is… “Jeter waiting out market for a bigger paycheck” gets a lot less views than “Jeter to the Mets?” Patience isn’t a popular characteristics with Yankees fans though.

  11. eckss says:

    Why are they upping their offer? Cash already told Jeter to see if the market will offer him anything better (which it won’t); this just makes them appear weak and possibly signal to Jeter and his agent that they can get more money out of the Yankees.

    It’s also 3 am here, so there might be something I’m not taking into account…

    • mike c says:

      because that’s how this sort of thing works

      • JobaWockeeZ says:

        Which doesn’t make it automatically smart.

      • eckss says:

        And why is that, exactly? I simply posited that to me, it makes no sense, and admittedly that I may have overlooked something due to the lateness of the hour.

        • mike c says:

          It’s business, the yankees want jeter and jeter wants the best deal he can get. jeter would be smart to wait as long as possible to get any last minute concessions too, especially if cash wants to keep negotiating through the media

          • mbonzo says:

            Yuo, cash is negotiating through the media to pressure Jete to take an offer. Fans are responding just like Cashman wanted, they’re accusing Jeter of being greedy. Close called it baffling because Jeter’s image is being destroyed in the process, which is half his value to the Yankees.

            • mike c says:

              the yankees look just as bad here as jeter does. why are they penny-pinching when it comes to making jeter’s deal when they’ve thrown obscene money at burnett, igawa, posada, a-rod, etc. it’s not going to help cash’s cause and the disrespect might be the reason why jeter walks away

              • bexarama says:

                Giving Derek Jeter more money than he’d get from anyone else is neither penny-pinching nor disrespecting him. He isn’t gonna get better anywhere else, I don’t think. If he leaves and takes less money from somewhere else, he’ll look awful.

                • mike c says:

                  of course the deal itself is not disrespectful… but publically telling him to “go test the market” is basically saying “FU you’re washed up and lucky to get anything”. it shows a lack of class, and that is not the yankee way to negotiate.. stuff like that should be kept in private and probably will end up costing the yankees in the end

                  • bexarama says:

                    I agree they shouldn’t have told him that in public but I think you’re interpreting that statement a little too strongly.

                  • Pasqua says:

                    Disagree. Telling him to test the market is telling him to test the market, as in, “If you think you can do better, go do it. But, you won’t.” Now, the keeping it out of the public part? That I agree with.

                • Hughesus Christo says:

                  I think the Yankees would end up looking awful. They didn’t “win” the Damon/Matsui negotiations. This is actually a replay of last offseason and we probably should have anticipated how The Steinbros and Levine would play this. Media leaks, public intimidation, etc.

                  • bexarama says:

                    There were Matsui negotiations? He just left.

                    If the Yankees have a known 3/$45+ deal, and Jeter takes 2/$24 from some other team, how do the Yankees end up looking bad? Look, I don’t think the Yankees need to go running to the media either but I fail to see how that would be their fault.

                    • Pasqua says:

                      Agreed, Bex. In any simulation / situation you throw at this, Jeter comes off looking like the bad guy.

  12. Crawford in 2011 says:

    YYYYYYYYY?????!!!!!!! NOT ONE CENT MORE!!!!!!

  13. Kiersten says:

    All Cashman should do during these negotiations is play YES clips of Michael Kay saying “past a diving Jeter” and “Jeter grounds into an inning-ending 6-4-3 double play” over and over.

    • Sweet Dick Willie says:

      Um, no.

      The Yankees want Jeter, and Jeter wants to play for the Yankees. They are just going through a typical negotiation, where each party is trying to secure the best deal.

      It makes absolutely no sense to deliberately piss off the other party in a negotiation, especially when it is extremely likely that parties will be working together for the next several years.

  14. SodaPopinski says:

    Are there any young free agent Shortstops on the market next year, or the year after? If we save money now, there may be a great player available to sign in the future who we would have had to pass on if Jeter was signed.

    • bexarama says:

      Not really, unless you’re counting Reyes and he’ll probably get an extension.

    • mbonzo says:

      Reyes is a free agent in 2012, though I think he’ll be resigned.

      Hanley Ramirez will be a free agent in 2015, but he starts to be expensive this year. I bet he’ll becomes available in trades in 2012.

      Tulowitzki also becomes expensive, but in 2013. He’s a free agent at the end of 2014 so he’ll probably be available for trade in 2013.

      Stephen Drew is a free agent in 2013, but he may be extended if the Diamondbacks can’t find a trade partner willing to give up their farm system for him.

      • Reggie C. says:

        Reyes re-signs without much fanfare only if has another season in which he misses 40 games. A healthier Reyes who plays 145 games can put up numbers that will make him a very coveted young man.

        IF Dj signs, Cashman cannot under any circumstance guarantee DJ that he’ll be a starting player through the life of this next contract. Reyes aside, if Tulo hits the trade market Cashman would have to be freed of personal promises to pursue.

        • Hughesus Christo says:

          You know Reyes plays for the Mets, right? He’s not in Kansas City or something. If Reyes is worth re-signing he will be re-signed.

    • mike c says:

      no and no

  15. LunaticFringe says:

    “The Yankees appear willing…” Gee, I dunno. Does that even hint at a source?

  16. bonestock94 says:

    Jon Heyman tomorrow: Friends of someone familiar with the though process of Jeter’s camp have reason to believe that Casey Close will counter the Yankee’s potential increased offer.

  17. Monteroisdinero says:

    Texas 2010 TEAM payroll: $55M

    Jeter $19M

    Wow

    • mike c says:

      what does arod get this year?

      • Monteroisdinero says:

        I wasn’t saying he is worth it necessarily either. He is/was paid half of the Rangers’ entire payroll. It was sweet for them to have Arod strike out looking to end the series. I am in the minority here that thinks we can win without Derek and with Nunez as long as other moves are made to strenghten the team with the Jeter money. I know he is coming back but we would do fine without him.

        • BigLou says:

          Nunez…Nunez…Nunez….the guy is a stiff. No hit, no field…I don’t know why he’s even in pin stripes…He can’t even carry Pena’s glove. Jeter is the man…yesterdays News asked six fans on the street how they feel about Jeter and the Yankees and five were on Jeter’s side. I’ve never seen such a group of negative Yankee fans maybe you guys eat too much statistics. Like Wow!!!

          • The Big City of Dreams says:

            The love fest with Nunez will end the minute he goes through some adversity. When that happens watch how quick the fans turn.

  18. billy's bartender says:

    OK-tough question posed to me earlier. Cliff Lee, Derek Jeter, Mariano Rivera. If you could only pick two, who gets left out?? I said sorry Derek…

    • bexarama says:

      This has been asked before, but easily Lee + Jeter. Mo is the GOAT and all but he is a reliever who hasn’t pitched even 80 innings in a while. But it doesn’t matter because the nice thing about being the Yankees is they can have all three mwahahaha >:D

  19. Monteroisdinero says:

    Lee for sure. Tough on the other two but just to make it interesting, I’ll say Mo.

    Nunez is 23 and I feel he cannot be written off by his stats yet-for what we need. He would bat 9th, runs well and will field as well, if not better, than Jeter in the FUTURE which is all that matters.

    Mo’s first good year with the Yanks-he was 26.
    Posada’s first good year-he was 26

    Why is Nunez “finished” at 23 with only 50 major league AB’s?

    • Total Dominication says:

      You know we have these things called scouts, and the minor leagues.

    • mbonzo says:

      No one said he’s finished. He could be incredible but his numbers are pretty bad. He’s very similar to Cano without the power, who had an incredible rebound. The problem with that comparison is that Cano was a miracle, things like that are so rare. Its more likely for a player with those numbers to fail than succeed, especially the way Cano did. Nunez has shown signs that he could be picking things up, but he’s still 155lbs and 6 feet tall, so he’s not gonna make much progress hitting for power. The best you could hope for Nunez in 2011 is a .340 OBP like he put up in AAA, which is what Jeter did in his worst year.

      • Total Dominication says:

        Umm, Cano was a highly touted hitting prospect. @nd in the Yankee system. Not a star, but predicted to be a good hitter. Nunez isn;t close to the top prospect in the system. Montero, Romine, Sanchez, Heathcott, Brackman, Betances, Banuelos, Noesi, Warren, Adams and Murphy are just some of the better prospects than him.

  20. JerseyDutch says:

    More money, yes. More years, no. Please, just no.

  21. We says:

    They better raise it. The last thing they need is to lose him. They need to let Joba and Burnett go if they want to win #28.

  22. Matatac says:

    Jeter should get 20per

  23. Pasqua says:

    Okay, I guess. I don’t see any scenario where Jeter doesn’t eventually sign that 3 yr. / $45 mil deal, seeing as he won’t sniff anything close to it anywhere else, but if it works into the Yanks budget / plans…whatever. Personally, I hate when they bid against themselves.

  24. MamaMurph says:

    The sad part is that Jeter will be tarnished as arrogent & greedy. If he has as bad or (God forbid) worse year in 2011, he can expect to hear boos when he hits those weak ground balls to end rallies. When you are overpaid for your performance, the fans will boo. They booed Mo, they booed Mickey, they even booed Babe (and BTW, Jeter is no Babe Ruth).

  25. felixE says:

    Fay Vincent writing in todays Wall Street Journal speaks to the Albert Pujols negotiations and the idea of shares of team equity to reward players like Jeter and Pujols.

    I thought this was part of the plan all along and have been surprised the two sides hadn’t advanced something along these lines. Pay Jete for when he plays but throw in some ownership shares for all the extra stuff he does and you will want him to do.

    The squabbling in public has to stop. This has been badly mishandled by management.

  26. borirican70 says:

    lets get all these deals done jeter rivera and lee

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