2014 Winter Meetings Open Thread: Tuesday

Aaron Judge tops Baseball Prospectus' top ten Yankees prospects list
Tuesday Night Open Thread

2014 Winter Meetings-002The first day of the 2014 Winter Meetings came and went with some rumors but no real action, at least for the Yankees. They did lose closer David Robertson to the White Sox, but I got the sense he was a goner as soon as they added Andrew Miller last week. New York’s top priority remains rotation help, and they need multiple starters to protect against all the injury concerns currently in the rotation.

On Monday we learned the Yankees may or may not be in on Jon Lester, are still after Chase Headley, and have spoken to the Braves (Craig Kimbrel), Marlins (Steve Cishek), and Royals (Greg Holland and Wade Davis) about trading for bullpen help. That’s about it. The Yankees tend to keep things very close to the vest. We’ll again keep track of all the day’s Yankees-related rumors right here, so make sure you check back often. All timestamps are ET.

  • 9:53pm: Just in case you were holding out any hope for Jon Lester, he is currently deciding between the Red Sox and Cubs after telling the Giants they are out of the running. I suppose San Francisco could turn around and use that money for Chase Headley now. (Joel Sherman & Alex Pavlovic)
  • 6:24pm: Are the Yankees in on Max Scherzer and/or Jon Lester? “It’s not in my best interests to say,” said Brian Cashman. Boring. [Dan Barbarisi]
  • 6:21pm: Brian Cashman confirmed the Yankees never had interest in signing both David Robertson and Miller. Once they signed Miller, they said they were still on Robertson only drive up the price for others. Cashman also said he spoke to the Athletics about Jeff Samardzija, but there was no match. [Marly Rivera & Dan Barbarisi]
  • 3:25pm: The Yankees continue to insist they will not get involved in the Max Scherzer bidding. Things can always change later in the offseason, but that’s the plan right now. [Mark Feinsand]
  • 2:03pm: Team officials still don’t know if Hiroki Kuroda will play next season and it’s complicating their search for pitching. Kuroda’s three contracts with the Yankees were signed on January 26th, November 20th, and December 7th, in case you’re wondering. At some point they have to start moving forward without him. [Bob Klapisch]
  • 1:33pm: The Pirates have agreed to re-sign Francisco Liriano to a three-year, $39M deal. The Yankees were never connected to Liriano this offseason but he is a pitching option now off the market. Also, it Liriano gets three years and $39M, you have to figure Brandon McCarthy will get less than that. [Jon Heyman]
  • 11:05am: The four-year, $65M offer for Chase Headley is a mystery — no one knows where it came from. (I think his agent floated it as a way to drive up the price.) The Yankees were originally thinking about a three-year deal at $39M but would go to four years as long as the annual salary came down. [Jon Heyman]
  • 9:30am: Chase Headley will made a decision and pick a team before the end of the Winter Meetings. The Yankees and Giants are among the three or four teams bidding for him. I’m guessing Headley will wait until after Lester signs just to see exactly how much San Francisco money has to play with. [Joel Sherman]
  • Jason Grilli‘s agent confirmed he spoke to Brian Cashman earlier this offseason but declined to say whether the two would talk again during the Winter Meetings. The Yankees could definitely use another late-inning reliever now that Robertson’s gone. [Brendan Kuty]
Aaron Judge tops Baseball Prospectus' top ten Yankees prospects list
Tuesday Night Open Thread
  • Nicholas D’Esposito

    Maybe I am in the minority, but if the Yankees use the 11-12 mil they would have used on D-Rob towards an elite pitcher, I think I would be ok with that.

  • Nicholas D’Esposito

    Maybe I am in the minority, but if the Yankees use the 11-12 mil they would have used on D-Rob towards an elite pitcher, I think I would be ok with that.

    • David Spinosa

      You arent getting an elite pitcher for 11-12 million.

      • Rick

        That’s why he said “towards.”

        • Nicholas D’Esposito

          Thank you, I was just going to say that. Paying Scherzer 26 mil a year is easier to swallow when you arent paying 20+ mil to two bullpen guys. Thats all I meant.

  • blake

    @Ken_Rosenthal: Sources: If #SFGiants lose Lester, Plan B does not necessarily include Headley. Team working on number of trades as fallback possibilities.

    Because he’s gonna be a Yankee! I hope…..

  • blake

    Peter Gammons ?@pgammo 16m16 minutes ago
    Optimism that Chase Heeadley gets done today, Yanks, Giants…but Lester/Giants negotiations a yellow light factor

    • mustang

      I didn’t realize that “yellow” was a Yankees color.
      LOL

      • Jimmy

        Insert joke about Posada’s hands here..

        • blake

          ole Pete doesn’t make sense at lot

          • Yankenstein

            Sometimes his Depends is on too tight and it throws him off.

  • mustang

    The bidding is up to 7 for 175 for Lester what’s Max going to get?
    I’m think more and more that the Yanks end up with Headley and McCathy.

    • mitch

      i’d love to get Lester, but 7/175 is ridiculous.

    • blake

      where you see that?

    • FriarFlyer

      That is OK and then just add a lesser starter and some bullpen help and maybe a bench bat…

      • blake

        ok if we are cool missing the playoffs 3 straight years…..I don’t want them to much up the future in order to contend in 2015 but if they do want to contend next year I think they need more than that

    • blake

      I don’t think it’s guaranteed that Max gets more than Lester does…… I said a few weeks ago that this may be an interesting test case on how teams value the draft pick attachment at the top of the market…..teams value that draft pick more than sometimes we think they do and sometimes more than they should. Plus I really think there is concern longterm about his delivery……if Lester does get 7/175 or something like that I don’t think it’s a given that Max beats that at all.

      • YakaTanaka

        Interest thought, but… I think it would be tough to separate out the difference in perceived talent going forward from the value of the pick. Plus different teams pick at different points (if the White Soxare only theoretically losing a 2nd to sign someone else that’s probably significantly less valuable than the Yankees’ top 20 pick). And Boras is a bit of an X factor to me too, potentially in either direction: some teams might just not want to deal with the guy if they don’t have to, or he might get in some owner’s ear about how valuable Ps are and how Scherzer deserves more than Pujols.

    • Jorge Steinbrenner

      Jesus. I get it, though. The big three pitchers are getting paaaaaaid.

      I have a feeling it’ll be BGJS that shocks us the most.

      • blake

        I hope Cherington is left holding a bag of BGJS for like 130 million….that would make me happy.

      • Basil

        Based on his post-season so-so-ishness, the shock may be as much in the lesser as in the greater direction

    • Centaur Hips

      Those prices make me want to keep McCarthy and Kuroda, and I’m not a huge fan of keeping Kuroda at his age but we need a 2nd SP.

      I really hope they keep Headley too. How else are we going to get a good player without giving up prospects? We need another hitter.

      • mitch

        Agreed. The price for Lester and Price rentals wasn’t that terrible last season. If the Yankees are legitimately one arm away from being a contender next July they should be able to acquire one.

    • Rick

      Lester also has the additional appeal of no draft pick attached – though I obviously acknowledge that’s small in the context of the caliber of player he is. However, it’s not totally irrelevant.

  • Terry Noack

    Cashman needs to make a splash. He’s getting handled here at the meetings. Didi and Miller isn’t going to cut it! I’m good with not getting Robertson at that price.

    • Jorge Steinbrenner

      LOL.

    • blake

      I’m sure there is a pool somewhere in San Diego

    • whileaway

      There was a-splishin’ and a-splashin’

      Reelin’ with the feelin’

      Movin’ and a-groovin’

      Rockin’ and a-rollin’, yeah, yeah

    • Yankenstein

      Sea World is open for business !

    • Centaur Hips

      I really don’t understand this. They already signed Miller and already have Dellin. Did you really expect them to spend on another great reliever just so they could have a 3 headed monster in the pen? That’s the last part of the team I’m worried about.

      • Terry Noack

        I’m okay with this not signing Robertson considering there are other options and a pretty good bullpen already. Needs to focus on a starter and who knows about Headley.

        • Centaur Hips

          They obviously out there making moves. Winter meetings just started.

        • mitch

          Agreed. Most of us are just willing to let it play out before we declare that Cashman is getting handled. Almost nobody has been signed at the meeting by any team.

    • Canarsie Yankee

      Other teams still have players! Cashman failed!

    • Scott

      How is Cashman getting handled?

      • Rick

        Do you really want to hear the story of the Swedish Maid in his hotel room last night?

        • Scott

          Yes!!!

      • blake

        Too…..many……jokes

  • Chip

    I think it’s possible that the Yankees wind up with Lester and Headley today. If they can only do Lester and it forces them to pass on Headley then I sign Juan Francsico, let him play 3b against RHP and can tag in either Prado (with Pirela going to 2b) or Alex (with Beltran getting some DH days) against LHP.

    • whileaway

      What is your fascination with Juan Francisco ?

      • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

        yeah it’s disturbing, I think even Juan Francisco doesn’t want Juan Francisco this much

      • Chip

        No fascination really – I just think of available FA 3b he makes the most sense after Headley.

        Power LH bat. Good enough defensively. And could be had for close to nothing.

    • Scott

      Juan is too streaky

  • blake

    John Harper ?@NYDNHarper 22s23 seconds ago
    What source isn’t saying is, if Yanks don’t sign a Scherzer-type, the entire organization will have fingers crossed about Tanaka’s elbow.

    well no shit

    • Canarsie Yankee

      I was hoping they were crossing all sorts of things regardless of who they sign.

  • blake

    If the Yankees signed Lester, Kuroda, and Headley I think they could win it all in 2015…..a lot would have to go right but I don’t see many teams that would have a better shot going in than them.

    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

      Who’s your closer?

      • blake

        One of the relievers

        • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

          if you take miller or betnces out of the roles they are used to you weaken the pen

          • blake

            Eh….they can figure it out

          • Rick

            There are plenty of Closer TM’s left on the market.

          • Havok9120

            There’s a ton of Proven Closers ™ on the market still. And if we’re assuming that the Yanks are willing to go with an asymmetrical bullpen strategy (I think it’s dumb for us to assume that, but everyone is), then Kelley or Grilli wouldn’t be the worst choices for low leverage closing work.

            • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

              Until they blow one or two.
              Rather have Soriano.
              If he’d have us for less, I’m sure Hal will say yes.

    • Masahiro Odell Nakamura Jr

      Need a ton of help from all the under-achievers from last year, but barring any injuries to the rotation, good chance. If Tanaka, Pineda stayed healthy with Lester, that would be incredible.

  • vinnieg

    What about trading Gardner, Severino, and Sanchez for J Upton and Chris Johnson? Solves some problems and gives us a bat in the middle of the order.

    • Big Game Luis Sojo

      that’s an awful lot for 1 year of justin upton and a very bad contract

      • vinnieg

        It’s funny, some people find it valuable to get one year of a player. People are usually split on this.

        • Havok9120

          It’s valuable to get one year of a player when you’re a win now team with very little long term payroll room, or when the player in question is at a point in his career that the second year could be a disaster.

          It doesn’t make sense for a player like Justin Upton coming to a team like the Yankees.

          • vinnieg

            It doesn’t make sense for a player like Justin Upton coming to a team like the Yankees.

            Why?

    • Posada_20

      NO on Severino.

    • blake

      Take out severino and id think about it but Id rather replace Johnson with someone else too……the yanks are giving up way more years of control in that deal

      • vinnieg

        I’d rather just take out Chris Johnson from the deal and put the savings to a Scherzer contract. We could be a force next year with those additions.

        Sorry but, people are consumed with getting starters signed, we were second to last in the AL in HR’s. We’re not going to be a contender unless we get a bat in the middle of the lineup with pop.

      • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

        And getting one of the few young RH power bats in baseball. You are not getting Upton without parting with Severino or Judge.

        • calripyankee

          Then they can keep Upton..

          • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

            Remember you said that when Upton hits 35 hrs in 2015 and Aaron Judge is playing in an Independent League in 2019. Or when Severino goes in for TJS.

    • TopChuckie

      The whole point of including Johnson is to bring down the price. It’s not viewed as a better package with Johnson.

      • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

        It’s still not going to be cheap and I bet that package is probably less than what the Braves would expect for Upton with or without Johnson.

  • Oops I Crapped My Pants

    I think it will be much easier to guage letting Robertson sign elsewhere once we see what the Yankees do with the 10 mil in savings. If it allows them to sign two starters, ie McCarthy and someone else or if they can stack it with another 15 mil and sign MS, then I think its a good move.
    Time will tell, were a long ways from Spring Training.

  • SweetSpot

    It’s still early in the winter but not real early and it will be a lot harder to make substantive improvements after the winter meetings if desirable players keep coming off the board. In my opinion, with all the talked about Yankee shortcomings, lateral moves like re-signing players they already had Headley are not going to be enough get it done. Hoping that older, declining players like A-Rod, Tex, Beltran and Sabathia recapture their youth and that Tanaka and Pineda stay healthy is not a good strategy if you want to win. When you look at the moves Boston, Toronto, Chicago and Seattle have made and the already powerful Angels, Detroit, etc., I just don’t see the Yankees being in the playoff picture right now.

    • andrewyf

      Boston isn’t in the playoff conversation until they acquire at least 2 above-average pitchers. And even then it’s pretty iffy. Remember that they lost more games than the Yankees did, and that was with a half year of Lester and Lackey. I would say they’ve caught up with where they were last year, and need a hell of a lot more work to even contend for 4th place, much less the playoffs.

      • Canarsie Yankee

        What? Looking at the comments section, I thought the Red Sox were the defending champs of everything from middle-finger wrestling to baseball to parchesi.

      • SweetSpot

        I don’t think so. They have ample trade chips and young ballplayers and will acquire pitching before spring training begins.

        • calripyankee

          Trade chips??? Yea, I kept reading how Middlebrooks was going to get them Samarzdja.. And all they re young SPs (with ERAs over 6.00) were gonna get them C Hamels.. The media love to fluff redsox prospects, not sure other team s GMs are buying it though..

          • TripleShortOfACycle

            Their prospects are leaps and bounds better then ours

            • Scott

              According to who? Because they haven’t performed the last two years. That is why the Sox are in the mess they are in this year. Right now, neither teams prospects are very good.
              But leaps and bounds? I’ll have some of what you are smoking.

              • TripleShortOfACycle

                Who do we have who is better then Betts or Bogarts?

            • calripyankee

              None of their pitching prospects were as good as S Greene last year, and he was way down the list..

              • TripleShortOfACycle

                Henry Owens?

                • calripyankee

                  Henry Owens?? He s two years away, with average stuff.. I m talking their great young pitchers that pitched with Boston last season.. They were all horrible.. That s why they re trying to add at least 3 SPs.. They re so desperate, they re offering J Masterson a multi year contract..

        • Havok9120

          His point (and I think it’s valid) is that they haven’t done it yet. And Samardzija is off the board.

          • Chip

            Totally agree. Now that Samardzija is gone, they can sign one of Lester/Scherzer or try to deal for Hamels. Who knows what the Phillies are doing and they might make some stupid high demand and just decide to hold on to him if it isn’t met.

            As for the young ballplayers, when is the last time they really had a young guy work out? Pedroia? Bradley is looking more and more like a 5th outfielder, Vazquez might be a solid backstop but he has hit less and less on his way up and isn’t expected to be anything special with the bat, Lars Anderson was supposed to be the next Ortiz and completely bombed, Bogaerts fell on his face in his first full season, Middlebrooks is looking like a lost cause and Holt absolutely cratered in the second half last season.

            My point is, the Boston offense is largely based on guys like Pedroia, Hanley and Napoli staying healthy and getting a huge boost from young guys. The projections are giving them 7 wins from Betts, Vazquez, Bogaerts and Swihart. That’s asking a lot from a group with no major league success outside of a half season of Betts.

            And then on the pitching side, we have a very average Buchholz with absolutely nothing of note behind him. Really, they need at least 2 and probably 3 starting pitchers and a bunch of bullpen pieces.

  • blake

    Gardner and Sanchez for Upton and Medlen

    • Rick

      Did they re-sign Medlen?

      • blake

        I meant minor

    • Centaur Hips

      There is no trade proposal more worn out than the Gardner for Upton one. It doesn’t even make that much sense.

      • blake

        It actually makes plenty of sense if the braves want now players and not prospects back…..doesn’t mean it’ll happen

        • Centaur Hips

          That makes zero sense for the Yanks. 4 years of a pretty good outfielder for 1 of an outfielder that’s a little bit better.

          • blake

            You could argue that but you assume if they deal for Upton then they think they can sign him and that’s also why I added minor into the deal to potential give them another LH starter …..just brainstorming…..trade proposal sucks….etc

            • Centaur Hips

              There’s a very low chance he signs when he’s one year away from free agency and just joined a new team he isn’t familiar with. Good chance you’re throwing 3 years of Gardner away.

              • blake

                Oh you’d have to pay him market value

                Consider though:

                Ellsbury
                Prado
                Upton
                McCann
                Beltran
                Tex
                Arod
                Refs
                Didi

                Scherzer/Lester, Tanaka, Pineda, CC, minor

                Not bad

                • Centaur Hips

                  They could have done that when he becomes a FA anyway.

                  • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

                    and you lose one of his prime years.

                    • Centaur Hips

                      Which you would have also lost Gardner in so it’s not much of an upgrade.

                • Centaur Hips

                  Not much different than withGardner. Would score more runs, but also would allow a few more. People just get mesmerized by his name in the lineup. I would love to have him too, but who’s the LFer for 2016-2018?

          • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

            a little bit better? come on buddy, Justin Upton is much much better than Brett Gardner.

            • Centaur Hips

              Upton’s the better hitter and Gardy’s the better baserunner and fielder. Upton has more potential.

              • Greggreen

                upton is also a Middle of the order bat in an age where middle of the order bats are rare

                • Centaur Hips

                  So? Gardner still closes the gap somewhat in other ways.

                  • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

                    It is a huge gap

                    • blake

                      It’s not in overall value now but Upton is much younger too

                    • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

                      Justin Upton’s overall value is much much much larger than Brett Gardner’s in every way. He is so far above Gardner in offense it’s not even funny – and for all the hype about Gardner’s baserunning, his steals suck. He is a 20-25 steal guy at best anymore and that does not make up for the fact that Upton has a higher average, slugging, OBP and OPS by a substantial margin. And I’m sure Gardner is the better defender but I’ve never seen Upton play so I can’t say how good / bad he is but there is no way that it is so bad it closes the gigantic offensive gap between the two.

                    • blake

                      Well the total package of the player is close…..but obviously I want Upton which is why I suggested the trade

                    • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

                      It’s not close though – put yourself as a Braves fan. What would you say if your GM traded Justin Upton for Brett Gardner? “Great! there overall value is pretty similar and Gardner is signed cheap for 3 more years!” Hell no, you’d be pissed b/c Gardner is a .250 hitter with 20-25 steal potential and just had his career season in terms of power and it was half of Justin Upton’s 2014.

                    • blake

                      Id say…..I got 4 years of Gardner for 1 of Upton…..they can’t sign Jups…..if they could it would be different

                      It’s why they traded Heyward and signed Markakis

                    • Centaur Hips

                      If they can’t afford Upton, that would be a great move.

                    • Centaur Hips

                      Upton 133 wRC+ and Gardy was at 110. It’s a decent gap but when taking their entire skills into account Upton isn’t a huge upgrade.

                    • Greggreen

                      even if you assume Gardner is now good for 15+ homers every year. that fact that upton is a right handed power bat that can hit 30homers. in a age of baseball when 30 dingers is what 40 used to be. You have to consider it a big upgrade

                    • Centaur Hips

                      Gardner and Upton are projected for the exact same WAR next year by Steamer. Upton hasn’t been worth more than 4 wins in the last 3 years. They’re pretty close.

                    • Greggreen

                      War factors in defense. Defense In Left field isnt the yankees problem, its the middle of the lineup offense. Yanks need upton more than they need gardner. Gardner is my favorite player and i think hes very good. But upton would be our 3 hitter and be able to take a bad offense and make it decent

                    • Centaur Hips

                      A LF can still save runs. For example I would rather have Alex Gordon than Upton. You can’t ignore defense just because it’s from a typical offensive position.

                    • Greggreen

                      im not ignoring defense im just saying its not a priority right now. yanks biggest problem is offense. Upton is a better offensive player plan and simple.

                    • Centaur Hips

                      The most important thing is how many total runs a player can produce/save, not whether they’re an offensive or defensive player.

                    • Greggreen

                      ok tell yourself that when that yankees put the same lineup on the field that was ranked last in the american league last year. while we bank our entire season on rebound years from guys in their late 30s. But Hey our war in left field will be good.

                    • Centaur Hips

                      It doesn’t matter because we would be allowing less runs. You keep focusing on runs scored. If you have a .500 team, there’s more ways to improve the team than just improving the offense to get above .500 (although I would admit it usually is the best way to do that).

                    • Greggreen

                      upgrading the offense in left would upgrade the offense of the team overall. Offense is the thing we struggled most at last year, no one seems to notice because we have big names but when your 2nd best player 328 OBP with 16 homers, you got problems

                    • Centaur Hips

                      Adding Gardner to a team and adding Upton would still provide a similar amount of talent. You keep focusing on offense. I understand Upton is better. But Gardner is still good offensively, plus better defensively, and what this is really about is the more years you would have him.

                    • Greggreen

                      i keep focusing on offense because thats the teams biggest need. If we want to get better as a team we need to fix the teams biggest problem. you have to assume we pay through the nose to keep the guy if we trade an assest like gardner

                    • Basil

                      Offense is, you’re right, “the team’s biggest need,” BUT: reliable pitching is right there behind it, given the physical question marks over CC, Tanaka, and Nova. It’ll take a lot of dough to solve all those problems, and that’s why it’s not out of the question that the Yankees may tolerate a 3rd year’s absence from the post-season, while sending Hal out with one of his messages of hollow optimism about the coming season.

                    • Dan A.

                      But the defense in the outfield can afford to take a hit. Justin Upton is a decent outfielder, Jacoby Ellsbury would be able to make up the ground lost in the switch from Gardner to Upton (personally, I think Gardner’s elite range cannibalized Ellsbury’s range a bit). Upton is a significantly better hitter than Gardner, and he would be an upgrade at the Yankees biggest place of need–the middle of the order. No matter what, Gardner’s not that.

                    • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

                      Upton’s career OPS is almost 100 points higher – that’s a huge upgrade

                  • Greggreen

                    yankees are desperate for middle of the order bats yanks need a hitter like upton more than a hitter like gardner. (i say this with gardner being my favorite player on the team)

          • mitch

            That’s a way too simplistic view. Gardner is signed for 4 years, but he’s not that underpaid. 4/52 is a good contract, but if he was a free agent he wouldn’t get a contract that’s significantly bigger….a couple more mil/year and maybe and extra year. That gap is where the value is….otherwise they could just sign a free agent OF

            • Centaur Hips

              It’s not about the contract, it’s about losing 3 years of good performance.

              Obviously if we were guaranteed to sign Upton to an extension I would do it, but it would be a risk not worth taking otherwise.

              • mitch

                The second part is a perfectly reasonable opinion but the first part is wrong. If Gardner’s deal was 4/80 they couldn’t move him and if it was 4/20 they could get a ton

                • Centaur Hips

                  The scenario I’m talking about is trading for Upton. The contract wouldn’t impact that much.

                  • mitch

                    I know. I’m trying to explain why a Gardner for Upton trade isn’t unreasonable when comparing their market value. It’s a perfectly reasonable stance to say you wouldn’t make the deal, but it would be a pretty fair deal value-wise.

  • blake

    @BNightengale: The #SFGiants officials are more optimistic than 24 hours ago that Jon Lester will pick them, while eagerly waiting final decision.

  • Scott

    Yes on trading for one of the Royals BP arms. More of that please.

    • whileaway

      at what cost to NY ?

      • Chip

        Solid bullpen arms are the one thing the Yankees seem to be able to find through their farm system. I’d rather save up my chips and get more offense

  • Chip

    So if Lester goes to SF, we should definitely get Headley right? I doubt they have the payroll to sign both

    • Centaur Hips

      Maybe. There are others involved.

    • blake

      Unless the Marlins or Astros are really offering 4/65 and he decides to take that

      • RhapsodyInBlue

        It would have to be all about the money if he picks the Lastros over the Bronx.

        • blake

          Well yea but if you’re chase Headley and Houston offers 65 million and the Yankees are offering 48 then what are you gonna do? I know what I’m doing…..I’m going to Texas and ordering a brisket sandwich to celebrate

          • Chip

            Add in the fact that Texas also has no state income tax and that 65 million is probably more like 70-72 million in comparison. I think they get all of the numbers presented to them after taxes for comparison

            • Canarsie Yankee

              Something tells me the 4/65 offer is bogus. I can’t see Houston outbidding everyone by 50% after years of being, well, the Astros.

              • Chip

                Absolutely agree. I’ll bet the biggest offer he has on the table is something like 3/36 or 4/40 and his agent is trying the whole “mystery team” crap that Boras does every year.

          • RhapsodyInBlue

            Yeah I suppose if that’s the case but it hasn’t been verified.

          • bernbabybern

            That offer seems way out of line though, hard to believe, or it’s from some team he really doesn’t want to play for. Maybe the Padres. :p

      • calripyankee

        Isn’t that what they said about Cano last year with the Ms?? Now look at them.. I d say they re much better than the Yankees right now..

        • Chip

          Yep, I don’t expect any player to leave significant money on the table when this might be the one chance for them to cash in

    • whileaway

      it´s rumored the Giants are now considering Lowrie for 3B

  • Yank88

    When is the next year you guys think there will be good-great FA?

    • mitch

      Scherzer and Lester aren’t good?

    • Mandy Stankiewicz
      • Chip

        I fully expect them to go all in on Ian Desmond if Didi doesn’t have a good year. I’d personally love to see them sign Heyward. I’m a sucker for guys with good plate discipline

    • Havok9120

      Next year.

  • Rick

    Per MLBTR: “There is “optimism” that Headley will sign a deal today, Peter Gammons of GammonsDaily.com tweets. On the other hand, Jon Lester‘s negotiations remain a “yellow light factor” for Headley’s own market, says Gammons.”

    • NYCORNERSTONE

      Sign with white sox probably

  • calripyankee

    Why are J Upton’s teams always trying to trade him?? And, why are other team’s fans always wanting their team to trade for him?? Just wondering..

    • Oy

      Because he has been the best player on two shitty teams in the last five years? An Atlanta rebuild makes so much sense.

      • vinnieg

        the two first basemens on his teams may not agree

    • Rick

      Because Atlanta doesn’t want to pay what it will cost to re-sign him?

    • blake

      Well the braves are because they can’t sign him…..the Dbacks did because he wasn’t gritty enough or something dumb

    • FIPster Doofus

      1. Kevin Towers. 2. Atlanta can’t afford him long term. 3. Other teams’ fans want him because he’s good.

      • blake

        lol pretty much yea……the Dbacks did things because Kevin Towers for awhile

  • Oy

    Lowrie as a fallback plan if Astros/Marlins/Giants sign Headley? Can play SS/2B and is willing to try 3B. Wouldn’t mind him on a 3 year 27 million deal, but he’ll probably get more from another loser of the Headley sweepstakes.

    • Masahiro Odell Nakamura Jr

      No thanks

  • Bret The Hitman

    YES, #Yankees have made an offer a certain Lefty SP. They also are going to have a terrible offense next season, so who cares?— Lost .. (@LostNYY)

    December 9, 2014

    • blake

      So the Yankees aren’t getting Lester then

    • NYCORNERSTONE

      Chris Capuano

      • Bret The Hitman

        He’s weighing his options.

        • Chip

          Maybe he decided he likes Japan and never came back. Probably kept the uniform too

    • Rick

      Whose twitter handle is that?

      • Bret The Hitman

        The son of a guy claiming to be affiliated with the Yankees in some fashion. He predicted the Tex signing.

        • blake

          And like nothing right since……I just don’t buy it anymore…..for one why can’t his kid get his own twitter handle?

          • Bret The Hitman

            He was giddy before the Arod verdict was rendered, like he knew there was disciplinary action in the pipeline long before media.

            • blake

              Just don’t get your hopes up ;)

              • Bret The Hitman

                He also knew we were finalists for Holliday.

                • Canarsie Yankee

                  And he correctly predicted Bigdan’s arrival. Mind. Blown.

                  • Chip

                    I say we stone him

                    • Canarsie Yankee

                      Totally a witch.

                • blake

                  Nah he said they might sign Holliday …..anybody could have said that

      • bernbabybern

        Some guy that used to post on LoHud that claims to have inside info. I never bought it.

      • Posada_20

        the first 4 letters ahould tell you all you need to know

    • Chip

      Yeah……I’ll wait for an actual source and not just some guy guessing on Twitter before I get too excited

  • Hankflorida

    Given the opportunity to play in October with the Wildcards, the Yankees cannot stand pat as the hand that they have now just isn’t good enough. During the DiMaggio era when you only had one shot to get to the WS, teams were out of it before July, and just because the 2nd wildcard keeps our interest into late September, doesn’t mean that Hal can have the same mentality as teams like the old St. Louis Browns.

    • Canarsie Yankee

      I would think that the Miller signing and the Gregorius trade would mean that the Steinbrenners are not looking to the Browns for inspiration. There’s quite a long way to go before that comparison could be made. Not increasing payroll doesn’t mean fourth-rate everything.

      • Hankflorida

        My point is that the Wildcards have changed the competitive nature of the sport and teams can get away with not putting their best foot forward; if the rules were only one team from each league gets to the dance floor, this Yankee team could easily drop out of contention before the summer begins.

        • Canarsie Yankee

          Knowing what we know now about injuries and the declines of certain players, that also would have held the past two years. It sucks, but I think of it more akin to the Yankees having the flu. Just have to vomit all the bad and move on, frisky and ready to chase that feather toy.

    • bernbabybern

      The offseason isn’t over yet.

      • Hankflorida

        I agree as more has to be done!

  • SweetSpot

    Will be interesting (to say the least) to find out if there were internal disagreements about trades and free agent signings. Particularly if there was anything that Cashman and the baseball ops people recommended that Hal vetoed.

    • http://batman-news.com Thunderfingers

      Yes, interesting, but we’ll probably never get anything even close to the truth on this.

      • SweetSpot

        There’s been times in the past when Cashman was pretty forthcoming about such things.

        • Havok9120

          Our list of such things is, at most, half a dozen items in his long tenure. I think it’s far, far more likely we never hear anything.

          • SweetSpot

            Maybe. We’ll see. The New York sports media is pretty adept at digging deep if they are so motivated.

            • Havok9120

              If it were that simply, though, we would get the skinny on almost every move the Yankees make. Instead we only hear when something truly extreme (the ARod extension or the Soriano overrule) happens.

  • bernbabybern

    If you want Upton get him next year when he’s a free agent and don’t give up good contracts/prospects.

    • Dan A.

      But if you get him this year, you have his value this year (his badly needed middle of the order bat), you have an inside track on re-signing him, you have the ability to judge how good he is, and how well he can handle New York, and if you lose him you get a comp pick. It makes a lot of sense to trade for those benefits.

      • bernbabybern

        I don’t think the things you mentioned are worth much. He would be good for the lineup, sure, but that’s shortsighted. I don’t believe in the “inside track”, we already know how good he is, and the comp pick is not worth giving up guys like Gardner, Severino, Judge and others I’ve seen mentioned.

        • bernbabybern

          And you hardly ever see the sign and trade anymore.

        • Dan A.

          Basically, look at what happened last year with Headley. They needed a third baseman, so they traded for him. They got his production, they saw it was a good fit. Headley, who didn’t think he would like New York, loved it. The team was able to better evaluate him (more information having a guy play every day versus having some scouts watch him every so often). And now, they’re trying to get him (and know what value to sign him to).

          Upton is better than Headley, so he’ll cost more. But the same benefits will be there.

          • bernbabybern

            They didn’t give up much for Headley.

          • Chip

            But either way, Headley is going to go where he gets paid the most. I’m sure Cano would have much rather stayed in New York but he followed the money.

            • Dan A.

              I’m not sure that’s 100% true (if it’s in the same ballpark, I could see him going to NY anyway). SEA and NYY’s offers for Cano weren’t in the same ballpark. Look at Andrew Miller, he left money on the table to come here, and he didn’t even have a prior history here.

              • The Great Gonzo

                Well, sorry to break this to you, but Bigdan thinks you’re a goddam liar.

                He told me yesterday that Cano went to Seattle because Jack Zduriencik and the braintrust in Seattle ‘HAD A PLAN” and it had less to do with the metric shit ton of money Seattle overbid the Yankees by.

          • YakaTanaka

            One exame doesn’t prove a rule (and the example is a little questionable at that).

            • Dan A.

              Okay. Same thing with McCarthy. I don’t know if they’ll sign these guys, but their time in pinstripes is definitely helping them make decisions this off season.

              • YakaTanaka

                There’s value in optionality. I am not disputing that.

                What I am disputing is the value is so great the Yankees should trade what it takes to get Upton.

                And also the logic you used. Headley and McCarthy seemed to like the NYY and played well for the team. Opposite may be true for Upton. Might help him decide to leave. Mayne that’s for the best as a Yankees fan, maybe not.

                It’s a complex thing and hard to say that it has more than marginal value for the Yankees. Has to be considered, but doesn’t mean you suddenly throw another top prospect in for Upton necessarily.

                I say that especially because I don’t think Upton is that great. I don’t think he’s any better than the Cardinals version of Beltran. There’s value in that. $15-20 million a year, no problem. Is it worth giving up significant assets and paying him all that money? I don’t think so.

                I would have just signed Hanley or Cruz, or I’d just sign Melky. Those guys are pretty comparable to Upton. Heck, I think Alex Gordon can become a FA next year.

                • Dan A.

                  But that’s my point. If Justin Upton hates NY, there’s value in knowing that and him not signing here long term. If he signs as a FA, he may hate NY and be stuck here long term.

                  I’d pay for Upton like I’m trading for a rental, the things I mentioned just add some value to what you’re getting. Is 1 year of Upton worth Gardner or 1 top prospect? I think it probably is (but it’s admittedly debatable). Is it worth a huge package of guys (Gardner and a top prospect)? No, I don’t think so.

                  • YakaTanaka

                    I think we’re on the same page. There’s some value that has to be considered, but not a ton.

                    I’m more of a Gardner guy than Upton guy personally (given contract situations), but I do think Upton has some appeal.

          • Wave Your Hat

            You can’t make a deal for Upton thinking that way. Upton gives every indication of wanting to test the market, if he won’t sign an extension as part of a trade – and he won’t because the Braves won’t agree to it, he wants to test the market and the Yanks won’t agree to the kind of extension Upton would demand – the Yanks should not give up the farm for him.

            • Dan A.

              But we’re talking two different things (I never said to trade for him and then sign him long term to an extension). I’m saying those things add value to a trade. This trade will help you assess whether to try to sign him. Having a relationship with him will help you sign him. Not once did I say extend him. I’m talking next off season.

              • Wave Your Hat

                We are talking past each other. I wouldn’t trade for Upton unless he signed an extension as part of the deal, and I don’t think that will happen.

                • Dan A.

                  Yea, that’s exactly it. I would trade for him with no promise of an extension (and the expectation he’d test Free Agency). I would value him less in terms of prospects/guys going back to Atlanta though, because he’s only signed to a 1 year deal.

            • Dan A.

              And, if I was talking extension, then I’d only do the trade if I had a negotiation window for an extension prior to closing the trade (that’s something that does happen). And if you can’t sign him long term, you don’t do the trade. (This is what the mets did with Johan).

              At that point, none of the other things I talked about would matter. You get him with no added information.

          • The Great Gonzo

            Find & Replace: “Headley” for “Ichiro” and “third baseman” for “right fielder”…

            I am not at all knocking the Headley move, as I am a fan. But the “trade for him and audition him and get him to fall in love with the city” thing might be overblown, because we’ve seen it go the other way as well.

        • YakaTanaka

          There are values in those things, but it has to be weighed against the price of acquiring him (which is basically what you’re saying).

      • Masahiro Odell Nakamura Jr

        He’s definitely hitting free agency unless they give him a crazy contract

      • YakaTanaka

        You can’t say whether it makes sense to trade for those benefits withiut knowing the costs.

        Upton’s middle of the order bat comes with poor defense at a position where the offensive bar is high. They don’t desperately need to ignore value to get anything.

  • Rick

    “The Giants are not interested in going to four years for Headley, Jon Heyman of CBSSports.com reports. With some uncertainty still surrounding the level of demand for Headley, Heyman suggests the Yankees could be increasingly well-positioned to bring him back.”

    • TB

      Some reports are indicating as well Headley is going to make his decision today

      • Rick

        Yea, I saw Gammons say that

    • Bret The Hitman

      At their price.

    • Masahiro Odell Nakamura Jr

      Fantastic!

    • Chip

      It seems to me that Headley’s agent keeps leaking bogus reports to the press. I don’t see what team could have offered him 4/65 or whatever it was. I wonder if both the Giants and Yankees have been holding at three years and the Yankees just recently tacked on the fourth

      • blake

        Maybe but that’s kinda frowned upon

        • Rick

          Agent would build himself a bad rep very quickly if that gets smoked out.

      • Havok9120

        It is starting to look that way, which is really surprising to me considering all the ways teams and the press can get retribution for such antics.

  • Bret The Hitman

    It used to be the Yankees wouldn’t double-pay for imminent free agents but their acquisition of Headley and current pursuit suggest this policy is flexible. And I think if Headley signs here at a discount, the audition blueprint should be applied to Justin Upton. Furthermore, you don’t wait for Upton when you could possibly move Gardner’s money. Otherwise, where is he going to play with Beltran in RF, Arod DH and Headley 3B? Seems like you allocate Gardner’s money towards Upton’s big contract and play Upton in LF.

    • Bret The Hitman

      Also consider the Yankees, if they end up with Headley, preserved a draft pick by trading for him in advance of his FA and likely QO. Justin Upton fits the same description.

    • Havok9120

      The two cases aren’t similar at all beyond them being “tradeable rental players.” One required a bat-first propect with no position and serious questions about his ability to hit at the upper levels. One requires taking major pieces out of a farm that’s only just getting back on its feet. One wasn’t even going to be the best FA at his position, the other has a legitimate chance to be the most sought after free agent on the market.

      EDIT: I would also point out that there’s nobody anywhere that’s as eager as you have been historically to trade Gardner.

    • YakaTanaka

      I don’t think there was ever a time they would not have made the Headley trade. It’s only “double paying” when you overpay on the front end in the trade and still have to turn around and sign the guy. They paid a reasonable trade price for Headley for the half season they got. Solarte looks like a solid UTL or below average starter and De Paula was non-tendered I believe.

      Why would they want to move Gardner’s money? Dude is underpaid. They could move that money in their sleep, or just absorb it.

      • Bret The Hitman

        Because if you sign Headley and lock up DH, Beltran stays in RF and there is no place to put Upton. Bottom line is the Yankees have to be in the market for a legit, young, middle order bat to build a lineup around long-term. They have to be one of the dozen teams on Upton willing to “double-pay” and give him that audition.

        • Wave Your Hat

          If and when you obtain/sign Upton, you move Gardner. It’s not that hard.

          • Bret The Hitman

            What’s the difference between moving Gardner now if you can vs waiting until later? Gardner preserves farm pieces now vs could be used to acquire farm pieces later.

            So the difference is you get Upton for an extra year and the chance to pitch the city and clubhouse to him like you did with the Headley audition. You increase your chances of getting Upton to commit long term. You bake in some allegiance before he’s a free agent. It seems to have worked with Headley.

            • Wave Your Hat

              In my opinion, it’s going to cost a LOT more than Gardner to get Upton.

              • Bret The Hitman

                But just imagine what it would cost without his inclusion then you see how he helps preserve prospects. If there is a match with the Braves, they have to add that young middle order bat and look to build around him. They can’t dick around with the middle of the lineup anymore. I think they’ve accepted Tex and Arod are not middle order guys anymore. No illusions.

                • Wave Your Hat

                  Maybe Judge will be that middle order bat in a few years. It’s just my opinion, but I don’t want to trade away our best kids.

                • Havok9120

                  There’s no reason to think the Braves prefer Gardner to prospects. If for no other reason than they seem resigned to the fact that they won’t contend in the next four years.

                  There’s also no reason to think Upton coming here for a year significantly improves our chances of retaining him. Again: he’s got a very good chance to be the top FA next offseason.

                  • Bret The Hitman

                    It would be nice if they did and I wouldn’t hesitate to acquire Upton if I could preserve some of my key prospects by including a 31 year old with slowing speed.

                    • Havok9120

                      You’re still speaking in completely vague terms about just what you think Gardner saves. You’re also acting as if the Braves wouldn’t realize the cons of taking on Gardner as clearly as you do.

                    • Chip

                      So is Brett Gardner good or bad? One second he’s this great trade piece that everybody wants. Next he’s worthless with the bat and is slowing down.

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      Well if you’re the Braves and you’re cheap, sure you take his leadoff production for the money. If you’re the Yankees and you need a middle order bat, you get aggressive. If the Braves prefer prospects (which they might) it all falls apart. But the Yankees should pursue it and hopefully they’re one of those dozen teams looking to “double pay”

                    • Chip

                      But why would they even want Gardner? I think its clear they don’t expect to contend next season so you’re buying the age 33 and 34 seasons of a above average but not superstar outfielder when you expect to contend. It makes no sense to me why they wouldn’t want somebody like Judge who could be just entering his prime when their window of contention opens up.

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      Obviously if they want Judge I’m out.

                    • Chip

                      Agreed. I think another club (Mariners?) would offer them a young cost-controlled piece (Walker?) that they would greatly prefer over Gardner. If you want to trade Gardner, your best bet would be to offer him to a team on the edge of contention now (or who think they are) with a hole in their outfield like the Blue Jays, Cubs, White Sox, Tigers, A’s, ect and take prospects back. At the start of the offseason, I wouldn’t have been completely against trading Gardner, Greene and Murphy for Addison Russell for instance. Probably have to add more from the Yankees side but you get the idea.

            • Chip

              You can pitch the city until you’re blue in the face. He’s still going to go wherever they pay him the most money. The whole comfortable with the city thing might make a difference in a super close situation but overall it doesn’t matter much

            • Havok9120

              Aside from the whole thing where you’re acting as if Headley already signed and that the reason for his signing has more to do with us trading for him earlier in the year than it does his market taking a hit….

              You wait because until you actually have Upton, moving Gardner takes a huge chunk out of an already bad offense.

              • Bret The Hitman

                Gardner is not and never will be a middle order bat. he’s a table setter with a career OPS around .740. That’s not a middle order bat on a great team. Now they have Ellsubry, Prado, Didi. washed up Arod, Beltran and Tex. The offense could surge with Upton.

                • Havok9120

                  He’s still a significant contributor. Upton is, of course, a better contributor, but the net gain is not as much as you’re making it out to be even if the Braves wanted Gardner and therefore trading him saves prospects (which, again, we have no reason to believe is the case).

                • Chip

                  I’m firmly in the camp that a deep lineup is better than a stars and scrubs lineup. I don’t think you need that huge bat in the middle of the order but rather need to make sure you don’t have any black holes.

          • FriarFlyer

            Tough to move someone when everyone knows you have to move your surplus…RS may find that out soon with all their supposed “extra” bats

            • Chip

              If you have a good player, people want to get their hands on them. There aren’t enough above average outfielders available that you have to beg people to take them off your hands.

            • YakaTanaka

              I don’t think that’s true at all.

              Other teams are far more worried about making their team better than the state of your team. And if there’s demand for the players, you can play multiple teams off one another. The Yankees can afford to just keep Gardner and pay him if need be, but if two teams or more want him the other teams can’t just sit back and say you’re screwed if I don’t take him.

              The Red Sox problem is that their surplus OFs aren’t all that good. Bradley has been terrible and Yoenis is an average starter and impending FA. Victorino is 34, highly paid, and coming off a lost season. Who else? Nava? Average starter at best. Castillo has proven nothing. The only one with a lot of value is probably Betts and he’s unproven and probably someo e they prefer to keep. The others have some value, but not a ton.

              • Chip

                I agree outside of Cespedes. I think a club like the Mariners would love to get their hands on him. The Red Sox problem is that they want to get somebody who can contribute immediately for him. That’s hard to do considering the acquiring team also wants players who can contribute immediately since its a one year rental. The only way I can see it really working is if the Red Sox decide to get prospects for him or if another team wants to trade from a strength to fill a need. Cespedes definitely has value though.

                • YakaTanaka

                  He has value. Maybe I shouldn’t lump him in with the rest but I just think some fans expect the Red Sox to flip Cespedes for another Lester or someone who really makes a huge dent in their rotation problems and I’m skeptical.

                  All of them do have value. As you’ve said, the Red Sox want viable SPs for 2015. That really limits their options. I’m sure they’ll swing some trades. Maybe a blockbuster, even. Maybe just some smaller moves.

                  I don’t know if the M’s would “love to get Cespedes.” They’re probably interested, but it’s one year of an average starter or a bit above who you can’t even QO. I’d probably just try to sign Melky if I were them. Cespedes is a RF who has hit a 102 and 109 wRC+ for the last two seasons after only one season above that. There’s value in what he’s done the last two years and in the possibility he has another 2012 in him. I just don’t know that teams will give a ton of value to pay him $10.5 million and either re-sign him or watch him walk.

                  I’m sure they’ll get a SP for him. But probably one year of a good one or multiple years of an ok one.

        • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

          assuming they most likely have to include Gardner in any deal for Upton – so Upton goes to LF

          and we are yet to see if ARod can even walk upright without hurting his hip so DH is by no means locked.

        • Chip

          I highly doubt that the team that trades for him will be given any advantage in free agency. You could just sign Upton next season and just give up a draft pick. Then you have Upton to play left and can flip Gardner for another need. Having too many good players isn’t a bad situation to be in. Also, I expect Beltran to be almost exclusively a DH in his final year.

        • YakaTanaka

          I understood what you said the first time.

          You didn’t understand what I said. They don’t have to move Gardner to get Upton. They could probably move him any time they want to a number of teams. I would hardly call ARod off hip surgery and a year off locking in a DH.

          I also 100% disagree that they need to be willing to double pay for Upton. It’s a terrible way to operate. Double paying isn’t just about trading for an impending free agent. It’s about how much you trade. There’s a huge opportunity cost to overpaying for Upton, who isn’t all that great.

    • http://batman-news.com Thunderfingers

      However, since the acquired Headley mid-season, the cost was less (and the cost was less due to performance as well). These 2 things aren’t identical, but you’re right, there are some similarities in the circumstances and it’s possible for the Yankees to use this model from time to time.

    • bernbabybern

      If you want to do something like this you do it for Matt Kemp, not Upton. Kemp you know you will have for 5 years and exactly how much he will cost.

      • Bret The Hitman

        I’m not opposed.

  • SweetSpot

    (11/14/14) Cashman declined to reveal his payroll/budget but did say the following:

    “It will be high, I can tell you that. It will be impressive. I’m just hopeful to have a roster that’s as impressive.”

    • Havok9120

      I mean….it already is “high” and “impressive.”

      • TB

        Not from a yankee standpoint

        • Rick

          Why not?

          • TB

            Because they are always over 200 mill

            • Rick

              Meaning that it’s already/always high and impressive.

        • Havok9120

          2nd highest in the league is still second highest in the league.

          My point is that they could refuse to spend another dime and still say that it’s “high and impressive.” It’s already north of 200 million in terms of tax hit.

          • Rick

            Exactly.

    • Canarsie Yankee

      I remain impressed over the amount of words used to say nothing.

    • bernbabybern

      Impressive to some people is the same old 200 mil payroll, to others it doesn’t start until at least 230+.

      • Havok9120

        Just so.

        And which do we think Cashman was referring to considering he’s the master of never saying anything about the team’s plans in public?

        • bernbabybern

          I don’t think you can read anything from that statement, like many other Yankee management statements.

  • blake

    @BNightengale: The Chicago #Cubs are on the verge of acquiring #Dbacks catcher Miguel Montero for prospects. Deal expected by end of day.

    • Rick

      Yup, for basically nothing in return. They swallowed the contract essentially.

      • blake

        The Cubs are a Jon Lester and maybe another starter away from contending in that division

        • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

          and production from a whole host of young offensive players that are yet to prove themselves

          and a bullpen

          • blake

            Sure ….but possible

  • blake

    @Buster_ESPN: The Yankees never made an offer to David Robertson; determined they’d rather sign Andrew Miller and get the draft pick comp for Robertson.

    • TB

      Blake yes that’s what was reported last night

    • Bret The Hitman

      Lester over Scherzer implies the same logic. You pay less and come out with your own draft pick vs. no draft pick at all.

      • Chip

        Yep, as long as they’re smart about who they draft, and they have been lately, then I’m totally fine with trying more to keep our picks. Also, due to our crappy year, we actually have a decently high pick this year.

    • Bigdan

      I believe Curry, the Yanks’ press secretary, was the first to report that last night. It seems like the Yanks wanted to make it immediately known that Drob didn’t choose the White Sox over the Yanks. Immediately after that tweet, Curry tweeted that the Yanks were interested in Drob but his price was too high.

      Seems like this is the Yanks’ strategy. To show some interest but when their alleged target makes his choice, the Yanks can turn around and say he was just asking for too much. This may be their approach with Headley as well.

      • SweetSpot

        I think you’re really disrespectful to Jack Curry, he’s very respected by his peers and is known as a hard working journalist with great integrity. He’s not a shill for anyone. He worked for the New York Times for 22 years as their national baseball correspondent and prior to that was the Yankees beat writer.

        • Bigdan

          Personally I think he’s got a great gig and I bet a lot of his contemporaries would exchange places for him in a second. He’s basically the Yanks’ personal reporter. He works for YES, a Yankee team affiliate company. No shame in that.

          • SweetSpot

            Whatever others think of his job is irrelevant. He’s not the Yankees personal reporter, that’s a lie and working for YES does not preclude journalists from taking the Yankees to task. Michael Kay does it all the time as does John Flaherty.

            • Canarsie Yankee

              Just wrong. Take it from Bigdan, the world’s biggest media sensation, to know how media work is.

            • Bigdan

              Sounds like they’ve sold you so something is working here haha!

              Next time Kay or Curry asks Hal a real journalist’s question about the Yanks’ budget will be the first time. And their last day on the job haha!

    • Chip

      Actually, this isn’t an entirely stupid thing. They likely felt that Robertson and Miller were somewhat near each other in value. If you assume that, which isn’t crazy, they saved themselves 3 million or so in AAV and got a first round draft pick. Like I said, the bullpen is the one place they can afford to build from within. If they take that money and put it towards Headley, I’ll be a happy dude.

      • blake

        If they turn the pick into their #1 prospect like they did with judge then ok

        • Chip

          If they turn the pick into any major league contribution, I’ll still call it a win. If they get a Shane Greene or John Murphy type for him, you have to be happy with that.

  • mustang

    The Yankees took the pick and 10MM less for a comparable left-handed pitcher. Its easier to deal with then Cano because unlike Cano they got a comparable replacement. Not that hard moving on.

    The longer this thing goes with Lester the more I think the Yankees will sign. Something has this guy second guessing.

    • Bret The Hitman

      Something has this guy second guessing.
      _________
      Most definitely

    • blake

      Could just be he has 4 good offers and can’t decide though

      • Yank88

        Agree… and Yankees aren’t one of those offers.

        • mustang

          And another to my “Lester call out list”
          LOL

          • Yank88

            Listen lol.. I really hope Yankees pull this off. But the way it’s going, I don’t think the Yankees are on that list.

      • Bret The Hitman

        If he can’t decide, how do you explain that BS rumor his camp likely floated about him signing before today but no earlier than 9pm last night? They made it sound like he was on the verge of making his decision. I believe the Yankees made an initial offer at 6 years and Lester’s trying to push them to 7.

        • Game 3

          Bill Simmons?

        • Chip

          There are probably a number of teams in the 6/150 range and he’s trying to push one of them to give a guaranteed 7th year.

    • The Great Gonzo

      I truly believe its the Boston effect: either he really wants to be there but they are not meeting the money, because hometown discount….

      OR they’ve made the biggest offer but after they boned the pony, he’s all like Fuck Boston.

  • Dan A.

    I really don’t get why the A’s signed Billy Butler. That is the weirdest thing about the A’s off season in light of their sellings.

    • Canarsie Yankee

      Well, Oakland has tried offense. Oakland has tried pitching. What Oakland hasn’t tried yet is a team all named Billy.

    • Game 3

      They thought he was Brett Butler. FTW!

  • TB

    Alberto Collapso to the braves — Players just leaving Oakland fast and furious

    • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

      To be fair, Callaspo was a free agent.

  • Kenthadley

    They signed Alberto Callaspo also.

  • Jorge Steinbrenner

    Busy at the moment, but this Upton stuff. Christ, bringing a guy in with a year left on his deal is bringing a guy in with a year left on his deal. I think, and think the Yankees also think, that it’s really bad practice to make that sort of high-end acquisition. The return isn’t exactly going to be Vidal Nuno or Yangervis Solarte.

    • Chip

      Yep, you can’t expect it to give you a hand up in free agency negotiations. You’re trading for one year of an above average outfielder and a supplemental first round pick. Signing him as a free agent whether he’s already on your team or not is an entirely different transaction.

    • Havok9120

      Between the Upton argument and the complete faith everyone seems to have that the Yankees are in on Lester, I’m getting a headache.

      After Upton gets traded and Lester signs, neither to/with us, the feelings of betrayal are going to build up to the point that the site crashes.

      • Canarsie Yankee

        It’s like taking that puppy that was promised for Christmas and shitting all over it. Won’t be pretty.

        • Havok9120

          Especially once people start pointing out that no such thing was promised. Or even rumored. Or winked at. Or implied.

          That’s when the real rage tends to get unleashed.

    • blake

      that’s why when Ive made proposals Ive tried to sneak in there a longer term piece with upton like Mike Minor…..I don’t think a 1 for 1 Gardner/Upton deal makes either side happy. There may no deal there at all

      • Havok9120

        I’ve still yet to see anyone give a convincing argument for why a Braves team in sell mode should want Gardner. Especially since the same people saying that they do often quickly point out that Gardner’s contract isn’t really all that far below market value, so it isn’t like he’s a steal.

        I don’t get it.

        • Canarsie Yankee

          The massive Yankees profits purchased at least four force transaction buttons. Maybe even five, now that Robertson is out.

          • Havok9120

            Gotta be five.

        • blake

          they aren’t really in sell mode….they are in retooling mode. They traded Heyward because he’s a FA in a year and they can’t sign him…..they are trading upton for the same reason. They aren’t really rebuilding…..they are trying to position themselves to compete when they open their new stadium…..and they have to sell tickets in the meantime. Gardner gives them a CFer and a leadoff hitter for 4 years…..and they need both.

          Why did they sign Markakis? Because he’s cheaper than Heyward and they have him 5 years for an affordable price.

          • Havok9120

            Yeah, but now that they’ve signed Markakis, why are we assuming they want another guy on a similar contract? Between those two exchanges, that’d be a significant increase in actual money spent in return for a significant decrease in actual production. Not sure that sells you a bunch of tickets when you’re so clearly punting until 2017.

            • blake

              I’m not assuming that….I’m just saying they could. If they want prospects for pitching for Upton then there really is no deal to be made…..but if they want a CFer that can play now and is locked up pretty reasonably then maybe there is.

              Also consider that if you put Gardner in CF then it makes in a little easier to live with Gattis in LF if they end up keeping him…..Gattis, Gardner, Markakis would be a cheap and decent outfield

  • The Great Gonzo

    So let me ask the question that I got from something I read on MLBTR this morning:

    “We heard yesterday that Jed Lowrie could be a free agent alternative to Headley at the hot corner.”

    If Headley goes elsewhere, what do we feel about this? My gut says no, but my head says…… maybe?!??

    • Oy

      Best alternative on the FA market. Sure.

    • Chip

      Wouldn’t be the worst idea in the world but it all depends on the price

    • Posada_20

      Has Lowrie ever played 3rd?

  • Bigdan

    Jack Curry ? @JackCurryYES

    I don’t know which team offered Headley 4 yrs/$65 million. But spoke to official from team that’s pursuing Headley and he insists it’s true.

    ———–

    Curry again. I think the Yanks want people to know there’s an offer out there like that. Regardless of whether it’s real. Same as Drob strategy I talked about earlier.

    • Chip

      Or that offer is actually on the table from the Marlins or Astros and he’s sick of being on losing teams? Stop acting like you have inside knowledge and aren’t just guessing along with the rest of us.

      • Bigdan

        Does this help?

        I’m guessing like rest of you! haha

        • Canarsie Yankee

          But he knew that long before the rest of us.

          • Bigdan

            I’m sure. And the fact that I’m really good at guessing.

    • blake

      it’s probably either the Astros or Marlins…..has to be somewhere he really doesn’t want to go or he would have signed that already

      • Havok9120

        That seems like the most likely explanation.

  • Chip

    Heh, Michael Ynoa is going to the White Sox in the deal. I remember when people here freaked out when the Yankees wouldn’t give him a stupid amount of money as an IFA. Now he’s 23 and having issues getting single A batters out

    • Bigdan

      Good lesson in international free agency.

      • The Great Gonzo

        He needs to be more Cuban

    • Rick

      Though I still have an irrational fear that he’ll be the next Quintana and that the White Sox will have dominated this off-season.

  • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

    Yankees clearly didn’t want Drob or Cano back.
    Most likely it’s just the money on both tho they clearly weren’t blown away on the ChiSox offer. If they wanted him the 2.5 aav wouldn;t mattered.
    They really must have something big in mind..

    • Bret The Hitman

      Hal cheap vs. something big. I’m going with something big.

      • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

        how big is big?
        headleys not big.

        • Bret The Hitman

          Lester + Moncada

          • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

            +Kuroda?

            • Bret The Hitman

              + Kemp

              • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                no room

                • Bret The Hitman

                  Get Joeman to trade Gardner

                  • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                    joeman is dead

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      No fuckin’ way

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      many from the homeland have passed

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      Pruf dead? (please say yes)

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      for some reason they cannot thrive in this environment.

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      due to death?

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      they must feel censored

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      Censored and dead?

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      censored 1st

                    • RhapsodyInBlue

                      If you’re out there Pruf we all miss you dearly. You and your choir.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      speak for yourself

                    • tomingeorgia

                      I’m still ticking.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      more like lurking

                    • tomingeorgia

                      Mister Mick,
                      Too many frickin experts around here, with way too much to say. I’ll lurk until I have something to say.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      when might that be mr t?

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      wasnt it the same at lohood?

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      This place is like if in the movie “Being John Malcovich” the main character were Jerkface.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      love that movie…youtube to follow

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      Malcovich Malcovich Malcovich, jerkface jerkface jerkface

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      he has no presense here for some reason

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      A little piece of him lives inside all of us, like candida albicans

                    • Havok9120

                      Because every time he comments more than a handful of times the regulars rise up and smite him. This is doubly true now that so many of his enemies from LoHud are here.

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      Kind of makes up for him not being smoted enough as a kid.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      wasn’t he still a kid when we left him?

                    • Bret The Hitman

                      I always thought a jackass was a donkey not a baby goat.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      depends which end youre looking at

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      In that sense the marriage of LoHood to RAB is one fuckin holy alliance.

                    • Havok9120

                      Always gotta love a Holy Alliance reference.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      1st for me. Is it from a movie?

                    • Havok9120

                      Heh. No. It was an alliance put together after the Napoleonic Wars as a means to contain republican thought.

                    • blake

                      where is Jerkface? He posts like every now and then but I’ve been dying for a Jerkface/Yakatanaka showdown.

                    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

                      you are a glutton for punishment then

                    • Havok9120

                      Egads, no.

                    • RhapsodyInBlue

                      Gun fight at OK corral.

                    • Havok9120

                      Yikes.

  • Rick

    Out of curiosity – has anyone here ever gone to the Winter Meetings? Care to share your experience if so?

    • Game 3

      It was cold.

      • Jorge Steinbrenner

        Ruben Amaro is hung like a horse.

    • Bret The Hitman

      I think Pat M is there right now and has been in the past. He lives near Anaheim so San Diego is a short flight.

      • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

        hes in a foursome with ron darling

        • Canarsie Yankee

          Finger snacks a plenty.

        • blake

          Pat M knows people

          • Bret The Hitman

            All too well apparently.

  • blake

    Ken Rosenthal ?@Ken_Rosenthal 18s18 seconds ago
    Sources: #Royals making Infante available.

    eat like half the contract and we can talk

    • Canarsie Yankee

      Available for what? Parties? Sure as hell ain’t second base or at the plate.

      • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

        blake wants everybody

    • Havok9120

      Gonna need to be more than half, methinks.

      • blake

        ok eat all of that contract and throw in Holland and we can talk

  • craig

    Pirates resign Liriano 3/39.

    • blake

      sets a pretty decent comp for a McCarthy deal right?

      • craig

        That was my exact thought. Reasonable deal for all involved. Glad we could do business…oh wait, we aren’t the agent & GM. D’oh!

        Seriously, though, that seems on-target to me. Plus McCarthy is a cool dude and his wife is hot…everybody wins!

      • Bigdan

        Should be close, but Liriano’s price was a bit depressed by the draft pick.

        • craig

          True, but he also has a better track record than McCarthy (less injured and a better peak talent).

          yes…close enough if the guy wants to come back to NYY.

          • Bigdan

            I think it’s def close enough for the Yanks to hold the line against the fourth year. To me, that’s a deal breaker.

            • craig

              I agree…the 4th year on McCarthy makes me nervous. But, I am totally good with some sort of performance vest for a 4th year. If he’s good and healthy then okay.

              • Bigdan

                That’s where it should go I think if both parties are reasonable. But vesting I don’t think can be tied to performance. I think it must be innings or starts or something like that.

  • Dan A.

    Rumor is Uggla is looking to come back. If they don’t sign Headley, I wouldn’t mind taking him on a minor league deal to compete with Refsnyeder and Pirela.

    • blake

      I’d like to play again too….anyone interested?

      • craig

        RAB isn’t that kind of site. You are looking for http://www.bigdan.com.

        • Bigdan

          Standards are very high so I don’t know.

        • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

          theres a reason they call him big.

        • blake

          can he hook my up with a try out?

          • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

            your aav would be too high

          • craig

            No…but he would be cooler if he could.

            Sadly, Bigdan is not like high school girls…

    • Canarsie Yankee

      Like Mr. Tilapia, I would want everyone on an MILB flyer, even a hedgehog with only a 30 bat tool. I think some moron will give him a cheap MLB deal, though.

      • Jorge Steinbrenner

        Hedgehog > Uggla

        • craig

          The hedgehog has a long and illustrious movie career…oh, wait, not him…nevermind…

          Blake is looking to play with someone…get the hedgehog on the phone!

        • blake

          he would K less and probably play better defense.

        • JacobyWanKenobi

          Even Sonic’s slower, fatter cousin Lumpy the Hedgehog would be better.

  • Rick

    Padres and Dodgers reportedly getting closer on a Kemp deal.

    • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

      no doubt solarte is involved

      • Bret The Hitman

        And DePaula

      • Rick

        Too much

      • Bigdan

        Untouchable.

    • blake

      bet Kemp is pumped about that……

  • blake

    if Liriano signed for 3/39 then that’s close to what my limit for McCarthy would be…..4 years makes me nervous on him…..3 does actually.

    • bernbabybern

      Takes away an option. A good, lefthanded option.

    • Rick Myles

      Cashman was hoping for 2@$22 for McCarthy. NYY seem to be in fantasy land about the market. What is wrong with these guys? Decide who you want and go get him. Why let other teams set the market? They are always penny wise and pound foolish.

      • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

        And we were told the market for Miller was that he would get 10 – 12 mil a year for 4 years and the Yankees got him for 9. Maybe they aren’t a penny wise and pound foolish?

    • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

      I don’t necessarily agree that Liriano’s deal limits McCarthy b/c Liriano had the draft pick attached to signing him and McCarthy does not. I could see someone going higher on McCarthy for a 3 year deal.

      • craig

        Yes, but Liriano is lefthanded, has a longer track record of success and a higher ceiling.

        I like McCarthy, but he should come in at 3/39 or a bit under…not over.

        • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

          He’s left handed I’ll give you that but he had a 5+ ERA in 2009, 2011 & 2012 and has only thrown over 165 innings 1 time in his career and it was 4 years ago so the injury concerns are no less than McCarthy really. I think every AL team would have been shying away from him b/c the NL Central has a tendency to make pitchers look really really good; see AJ Burnett.

          • craig

            I think Liriano has better stuff. We can agree to disagree on it.

            I do think McCarthy will end up close to this (ie. 4th year vest or 3/42 and not 5/65).

  • blake

    I really would just rather have Kuroda back for 1 year than any of these other 2nd tier guys…..I don’t like any of them enough to warrant 2 or 3 more years on the deal. Kuroda as a 4th starter for 1 year would be pretty ideal.

    • Bigdan

      So who’s the No. 3?

      • blake

        Pineda…..the question is who is the number 1/2! Ideally Scherzer/Lester, Tanaka, Pineda, Kuroda, CC. I’d take that.

        • Bigdan

          Ok, I hear you.

        • bernbabybern

          Tanaka and Pineda are 1 and 2 unless they get someone else comparable. Kuroda would be the #3 as of now. We have no idea what CC will be.

          • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

            Infinity and beyond? (CC)

      • Rick

        Didn’t want to be Captain Obvious anymore? BTW, I’m convinced you two are the same person.

        • Havok9120

          I don’t see it.

          • Rick

            Could just be me. They’re just never here at the same time and as soon as one leaves, the other is back.

  • blake

    FOX Sports: MLB ?@MLBONFOX 41s41 seconds ago
    Jon Lester’s offers are all in the 6 year/$150M range with one team willing to go 7 years.

    • Bret The Hitman

      My guess is Yankees are one of the 6 year teams and the stalling is Lester wanting the Yankees to go 7 like that one team.

      • blake

        don’t get your hopes up dude……it’s more likely that the Cubs or Giants are the 7 year team and Lester is giving Boston a chance to match.

        • Bret The Hitman

          He probably wants out of Boston and the Cubs might be a loser team for 7 years.

      • bernbabybern

        I wouldn’t go over 6 for either Lester or Scherzer.

      • michaelNYCUSA

        i would love to agree with you – ill worry about the 2020 payroll when we get there, and if the Yanks can trot out Lester/Tanaka/Pineda/CC and even McCarthy, with Phelps/ManBan?warren/Mitchell available as the season progresses, ill take my chances

      • Wave Your Hat

        That just seems so unlikely to me.

  • Bigdan

    I just want to make it clear for the record. I got no problem if the Yanks signed Lester.

    • Y’s Guy

      wait, i remember some big pronouncement at the end of the season that you were against a Lester signing even though you had been in favor of it before then. (I welcomed you as a latecomer) So your’re switching back now?

      • Y’s Guy

        …are you gonna flip back on the ‘no way they sign Headley’ pronouncement?

        • Bigdan

          Headley is only a good short term piece for the Yanks (1-2 years). If the Yanks are thinking long term, Headley is the wrong move. My position has always been consistent there.

          • craig

            So, you voted for the use of military force before you voted against it…got it!

            • Bigdan

              Maybe I wasn’t clear. I prefer the Yanks to think long term regarding their infield and pass on Headley and sign Moncada and let the kids (Refs and Pirela) play!

              But as far as what the Yanks will do with respect to Headley? Cashman called him a rental last July. Nothing has changed since.

              • craig

                But Girardi and Hal both praised Headley. Clearly this was just Cashman going off of script and then Hal got him back in line, right?

                SMH…

      • Bigdan

        Actually I think you are right there. I was in favor of signing a big No. 1 starter in the middle of last season (Lester) but then came around to the view the Yanks just don’t need any more long term contracts around October. At that time, the Yanks only needed one SP in the off season. Now that need has doubled so basically I think the Yanks are in serious trouble regarding their starting rotation and I don’t believe now one pitcher like McCarthy or Kuroda is good enough. Now would Scherzer/Lester obviate the need for a second starter? Tough question. I think the answer is no so right now I’d welcome either Scherzer or Lester. If I were certain the Yanks would sign two pitchers like Kuroda and McCarthy, I think that is preferable to just one of Lester or Scherzer.

        • Y’s Guy

          I believe the contracts for both Lester and Scherzer are going to be disasters, especially at 6 or 7 seasons (they’ll both turn 31 in the first season).
          Now the the need has ‘doubled’ as you put it, they need two quality arms, not just one, which means putting all their eggs in one basket is an even more terrible idea. They gave Tanaka $150M and he’s damaged, gave Sabathia $150M and he’s damaged now they want to give $150M to another starter? It’s crazy!

          • Bigdan

            I think that’s what I said. One arm will not do. But if Lester or Scherzer are one of the two arms, I’d rather have that than simply a McCarthy or a Kuroda.

            I don’t know if people truly appreciate how poor the Yanks roster is right now with their current starters. I doubt they’d win 80 games.

            • Y’s Guy

              They can sign McCarthy and another starter plus someone with closer experience for what Lester will cost. This team is more than a Lester away from winning this year and bringing in Lester is probably going to cost at more than one other position.
              They really do need to raise the level across the roster and putting everything into Lester is the opposite of what they should be doing.

              • Bigdan

                The Yankees absolutely don’t need to waste money on a cheap pitcher with closer experience. I covered that in the other thread. The Yanks need two quality starters for their rotation. If one them turns out to be a Lester or Scherzer, all the better. Time to open the spigot. Run prevention starts with your rotation.

                • Y’s Guy

                  thats very declarative considering you’ve changed your mind twice in two months. Losing Shane Green’s not enough to make a bad contract a good contract.

                  • Wave Your Hat

                    I will be stunned if the Yanks make a run at either Lester or Scherzer.

                  • Bigdan

                    Changing one’s mind is what reasonable people do. It was always a close question whether it would be advisable for the Yanks to target one of the Big Three. Hence my vacillation. Late last season, I referred to the Yanks’ 2015 projected starting rotation as four disabled pitchers (Tanaka, Pineda, CC and Phelps) plus Greene. Well guess what happened? The Yanks just traded their only healthy projected 2015 starter.

                    Gene Michael might refer to this as “Katy bar the door.” Others may call it a “tipping point.” But the loss of Greene changed the calculus for me and should for the Yanks too.

                    (Damn that’s good)

                • Y’s Guy

                  a cheap guy with closer experience to compete with Lindgren is a good idea, imo.

    • Y’s Guy

      you stuck with the “no way arod can get more than 50 games” all the way to the bitter end, though, iirc.

      • Bigdan

        Never ever ever said that. Always gave a range. 50-100 games.

      • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

        I was on the 0 games route because I see a lot of legal hogwash.

  • thunderdan162

    McCann’s steamer projections for 2015 251/317/445 with 27 homers. I would be ecstatic if that happens, and doesn’t seem to far fetched

    • Bigdan

      Wouldn’t he be the best offensive catcher in the league with that?

      • Rick

        Posey is likely projected better.

        • Wicomico Pinstripes

          Yeah, Posey(142), Lucroy(117), and Molina(113) are the only full time catchers projected to have a higher wRC+ than McCann’s 111. d’Arnaud and Gomes are also projected for a 111 wRC+.

          • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

            We’ll see on Travis d’Arnaud of course.

            • Wicomico Pinstripes

              The only difference offensively between his season this year and his 2015 projection is a little positive BABIP regression. He slashed .242/.302/.416(103 wRC+~.259 BABIP)this year and is projected to be at .254/.315/.429(111 wRC+~.271 BABIP). His BB and K rates are almost identical. I’d say his projection is definitely doable considering 2014 was his first full season in MLB and he’s theoretically entering his offensive prime in terms of age.

        • Bigdan

          I think anyone better like Posey are all in the National League right? I was thinking American League

      • Mayan Brickann

        That’s a “leper with the best complexion” distinction. He was below league average for C in avg and OBP, but above it in slugging. He’ll still hit homers along with guys like Yan Gomes and Zunino, plus we’ll see Martin, who was much better than McCann last year back in the AL and M. Weiters back for the O’s. The team that got the best from the catcher’s spot in 2014, and by a wide margin, was the Athletics, but their’s is a 2 headed monster. McCann will likely be among the top C’s, but not exceptional.

        • Bigdan

          I really wouldn’t count on Martin having an offensive year like he had last year. .400 OBP? I don’t think so.

    • blake

      I think he can do that easy…..actually I think he will beat the .317 OBP

      • Mayan Brickann

        He’s been a .305 OBP guy over the past 3 seasons. .317 seems quite reasonable.

        • blake

          Optimism

    • Terry Noack

      He finished not far behind that this year.. It’s the batting average that needs to improve!

    • Chip

      I would take that any day of the week

  • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

    Some guy on Twitter keeps bugging the guys who are the big guns on hot stove stuff about Dan Uggla to Yankees, saying 20 HR potential for 8 spot. The dude has no eyeballs left, what makes him even intriguing? Even changing teams didn’t help him.

    • blake

      No

      • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

        I know it’s a no, just wondering what is exactly in this dude’s head. I hate Uggla as much as anyone.

        • blake

          Probably a sox fan

        • Y’s Guy

          If uggla gets a shot, there’s a guy on my softball team who should get a shot at it, too.

    • Mandy Stankiewicz

      it has to be a joke, Uggla is garbage.

    • Canarsie Yankee

      The Yankees can assemble as many Gs in their lineup as possible, with Gregorius, Uggla, Gardner, Rodriguez, Young. All for the big G that is in perpetual spin motion.

      • dkidd

        never should have let greg golson leave

    • Wicomico Pinstripes

      The only thing intriguing about Uggla to the Yankees would be having him and Girardi as the best 1-2 forearm combo in MLB.

      • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

        When calling for a move to the bullpen?

    • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

      It’s bigdan on twitter isn’t it?

      • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

        Doesn’t seem to be. At least he is consistent, unlike Bigdan.

  • Mandy Stankiewicz

    For anyone who was shouting for Infante in 2013, the hope is still alive (yuck):
    http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2014/12/royals-looking-to-keep-bullpen-arms.html

  • blake

    @Buster_ESPN: The Tigers’ focus is on retaining Max Scherzer. They are prepared to spend big, big dollars. Want to keep Price for 2015, too.

  • blake

    @BillShaikin: I’m told #Dodgers and #WhiteSox talked Matt Kemp for Alexei Ramirez awhile back but couldn’t make money work.

    Man it sounds like the Yankees could afford kemp given the prices I keep reading about

    • Dan A.

      But do the Yankees need a true number 3 hitter who’s signed through his age 30-34 seasons at market rate?

      • blake

        Uhm double yes

      • Y’s Guy

        I had been assuming all along that the Yankees don’t have what the Dodgers would want, but as time goes it seems that’s maybe not the case.

        • blake

          Man if they are just mainly wanting to dump his salary then bring that on….his contract isn’t even that bad in this market

        • Dan A.

          I really think a deal built around Sanchez (where the Yankees take on the whole contract) could get it done.

          • blake

            I dunno but Id do that in a heartbeat

          • Chip

            Yeah, I’d take Kemp for right field in a heartbeat. If they’d take Sanchez and a filler for him I think I’d have to say yes

          • Y’s Guy

            I’m in on that!

    • Thunder2122

      Kemp is like the worst fielder on the face of the earth. I think I saw somewhere that this past season was the 3rd worst season of all time by a guy who posted at least a 120 OPS+.

      • blake

        He’d be the yanks best hitter by a mile….stick him in RF and let Ellsbury and Gardner catch everything…..it’s not like the current plan of Beltran out there is any good defensively

    • Y’s Guy

      I agree! Despite the anticipation, Heyward’s and Donaldson’s prices were’nt crazy, and Moss moved for next to nothing.
      I almost choked when I heard Kemp for Grandal +.

      • blake

        And alexi? Come on Cash…..stick your nose in there

    • Mayan Brickann

      Yankees have an everyday SS to give them?

      • blake

        No but similar values maybe…..Grandal isn’t a SS

  • Bret The Hitman

    Only 2 more years on the Tex deal!

    • Y’s Guy

      I posted the # of days till Arod’s deal ends the other day. it’s in the 1500’s.

  • Dude

    Is Fucking Kuroda holding up the works

  • Y’s Guy

    Francessa just said that if the Mets add a SS and and bench bat, they will win 90 games.

    • blake

      Heh

      • Austinmac

        I recall laughter when I suggested the Pirates were better than the Yankees before 2013. Folks laughed at Cano going to Seattle. Times have changed. Budgets for other teams have changed. I laugh at no team now.

        • blake

          I still laugh at the mets

    • Rick

      Lotta faith in the rotation

  • Austinmac

    The only ones who have thought the Yankees would go after Scherzer were Yankee fans and Boras’ schill.

    They budgeted for reliever, third baseman and I’m sure starting pitching. I see nothing they have said or done suggesting they will go over budget. Since it has been fairly steady for years, I don’t see them having the significant increase necessary for a high end guy.

    I’m just hoping for Headley, McCarthy and a rehab guy.

    • Rick

      Jon Heyman of CBS Sports reports the New York Yankees may make a run for Scherzer and that the three teams who fail to sign Lester could also be interested in trying to land Scherzer.

      • mustang

        Yea, but he said that as he was handing Boras his bathrobe.

        • Rick

          Lol I wanted to see if he caught that I cited the biggest Boras hype machine that there is

          • mustang

            Don’t know why I made that comment now I can’t get this ugly picture out my head.
            LOL

      • blake

        I really don’t get this idea that the Yanks are totally out on lester but yet they “might make a run at Scherzer”……unless they are seeing something I don’t Lester seems like a better fit.

        • Bret The Hitman

          It’s because it’s not an “idea”, it’s a lie.

          • blake

            it’s probably just Heyman doing Borat’s bidding to be honest……I think they could end up with Scherzer and I’ve said that but it makes no sense for the Yanks to leak that out right now.

            • Bret The Hitman

              Unless it is meant to curb Lester’s demands.

              • blake

                keep hope alive I guess…..if Cash swoops in on this one then it may be his stealthiest maneuver ever because he’s got every member of the media thinking they aren’t in it

                • Bret The Hitman

                  All Hal had to do was present a figure to Cashman and nobody else while telling at least one other person he would never authorize money for Lester.

        • Rick

          Agreed. Especially with the reports of how much they valued the supplemental pick with respect to Robertson

    • Wicomico Pinstripes

      Given all the health risks in the current rotation(not to mention Mccarthy’s own health concerns), I’m hoping for more than a rehab guy as the second SP.

  • YankeeFan™

    Make some moves Already !!!!!!

  • Rick

    Andy Pettitte coming out of retirement yet?

  • ChristIsKing

    With Montero gone, the could Yanks offer Romine for a pitcher

    • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

      what pitcher? Bronson Arroyo?

      • blake

        you need more than Romine to get him.

        • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

          and he’s Arizona’s worst SP – that’s the point

          • blake

            yes….you might could trade Romine straight up for Mike Hampton

      • Rick

        Kershaw, obviously

      • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

        TJS victim. Probably not free to pitch until 2016.

        • http://batman-news.com nyyankfan7

          that’s the point……

        • Rick

          I didn’t even realize he had TJ. From playing the guitar?

          • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

            Announced July 7 he would be. In effect, it’s a dead contract for the Diamondbacks, cause it should eat up a majority of his 2015 if not all.

          • Wicomico Pinstripes

            Trying to cornrow his own hair, I believe.

  • mustang

    Things on the Lester front are too quite:
    On the right side no one has yet to identify the mysterious 7 for 175 team.
    On the left side no one seem to link Lester and the Yankees.

    And still no announcements

    • Rick

      Give us your prediction.

      • mustang

        I will let you guess…LOL

        My heart says Lester and my brain says Headley and McCathey

      • Canarsie Yankee

        Mariners. Nine years, $189 million plus a 10% stake in Nintendo.

  • Rick

    Drew Butera traded. Is it just me or does that guy get traded every offseason?

  • Posada_20

    Looks like Lester is down to Cubs & Red Sox unless Yanks jump in late. Not crazy about going to west coast.

    • blake

      I just hope it’s the Cubs…..I want Cherington to have to trade with Philly or sign Shields for too much money.

    • Rick

      So he either loves Epstein or the city of Boston. I have to think he loves Boston, but wants to send a message that the low-ball offer was unacceptable.

      • blake

        Boston pretty much disrespected him last spring by making that 4/70 offer though…..I think at this point if he goes back to Boston they are going to have to pay top dollar. I doubt any discounts will be given there.

        • Y’s Guy

          I haven’t seen anywhere that the Giants or Dodgers are out of it

          • blake

            A guy from the giants just said he would say the cubs an sox are probably ahead of them

            • Y’s Guy

              they’ve been playing that game the whole way. I don’t buy it.

  • mustang

    Lester signing with the Sox will bother me more then anything that has happen so far.

  • Y’s Guy

    The O’s are out on Kemp, that’s good news. Looks like the Cubs are buying Miguel Montero’s contract + a body to make it a ‘trade.’

    • blake

      If love to get kemp…..I think of actually prefer him to Upton because he’s actually signed and because it’s what amounts to a 5 year deal

      • Y’s Guy

        It’s risky, but to me, alot less risky than Lester or Scherzer and they need hitting more than another ace.

        • blake

          I kinda agree…..

  • Bret The Hitman

    We are not in on Kemp for a reason – my bet is because of our secret pursuit of Lester. If Lester signs somewhere and the Yankees don’t get involved with talks for Kemp then they’re being every bit as stingy as BigDan wrote about months ago.

    • Wicomico Pinstripes

      Or they don’t think that he’s that good of a player overall.

      • Bret The Hitman

        Then they haven’t so much as peeked at the middle of their lineup.

        • Wicomico Pinstripes

          What does the middle of their lineup have to do with their evaluation of Matt Kemp as a player?

          Yes, the middle of their order is weak and Matt Kemp would certainly help to improve that, but they could look at his defense(or lack there of) and decide that his expected offensive production, while great, is not enough to make him anything more than a slightly above average player overall.

      • blake

        They don’t have a player close to Kemps current ability offensively ……they don’t even have an .800 OPS bat….he’s a potential .900 ops bat

        • Wicomico Pinstripes

          Yes, I agree. A great bat alone does not make him a great player though.

          • blake

            Would you call Miguel Cabrera a great player? Kemp had a 140 wRC last year ….I know he’s not a good defender anymore but I don’t buy his WAR numbers at all……

            • Wicomico Pinstripes

              Yes, I would. His offensive consistency is a part of that though. Cabrera has had a wRC+ of at least 129 every year since 2004, his second year. His 170 wRC+ over the last five years leads MLB and his lowest by far is this years 147. Kemp’s wRC+ over the same time frame is a strong 136. He’s a great hitter when healthy, no doubt, but Cabrera has simply been on another level.

              I don’t watch enough Tigers or Dodgers games each year to feel comfortable enough to make an assessment on their defense, so the only thing I have available are the defensive metrics. Neither one of them are good or even average, but Kemp has been especially bad.

              • chris hines

                To be fair to Kemp his defense is a lot better when not playing CF, the health concerns are very real though.

                • Wicomico Pinstripes

                  That’s still not saying much. He’s been one of two worst CFers the last few years. I know small sample sizes and what not, but we don’t have much else to go on and he was not much better in the corners.

                  Like I said, I don’t watch many Dodgers games, so I generally lean more heavily on the metrics. Obviously, that’s taken with a huge grain of salt given how imperfect defensive metrics are and the SSS in this particular case.

                  • chris hines

                    Well going off metrics he’s a -6.7 UZR/150 career in 1700 innings playing RF vs -13.9 UZR/150 career in CF so it’s a significant difference. He’s awful in CF, he’s still below average but passable in RF.

                    • Wicomico Pinstripes

                      I was looking more recently. Since 2012 Kemp has a -24.1 UZR/150 and -31 DRS in CF.

                      Again, these are incredibly small sample sizes and I’m not completely judging his defense on this, but his UZR/150 in LF this year was -40.3 over 44 games and 369.1 innings. In RF it was -8.8 over 59 games and 500.1 innings. Better, but still bad. I would give him an incomplete for his COF defense, but I think it’s safe to say it’s pretty bad.

                    • chris hines

                      Those mean next to nothing at those sizes, the makers of UZR admit you need almost 3 years of data to have a reasonable idea of their talent at a position. 44 games isn’t even worth referencing as a small sample size.

                    • Wicomico Pinstripes

                      Obviously, I know it doesn’t mean a whole lot. That’s why I said as much in my previous two posts on the subject. Referencing his career UZR/150 in RF is near worthless as well, given before this year he hadn’t played RF since 2009 when he was 24 and hadn’t suffered any of his injuries yet. Either way, I don’t think he’s going to go from a -24.1 UZR/150 CFer to anything more than a below average COF. But, that’s just my opinion.

        • chris hines

          He’s also now a RF only player with very real injury concerns signed through 2019.

          • blake

            sure but he’s owed 107 million dollars…..Panda just signed for 95. In this market it’s not a bad contract

            • chris hines

              Panda is also 28 and a plus defender at 3B, Kemp is 30 and a poor to average RF’er with much bigger injury concerns.

    • Y’s Guy

      Before you get too crazy, there is the possibility that the Dodgers just don’t have much love for Yankees prospects. I think they should be asking or offering, but I don’t assume if they don’t get him they are stingy.

    • Austinmac

      Don’t you think it is much more likely the Yankees think they have a full outfield, payroll limitations and needs elsewhere?

      • Bret The Hitman

        The OF could still be upgraded, the payroll limitations are still up for debate like I acknowledged and as far as needs go – they definitely need a big game lefty now that diabetes II has taken over CC and they definitely need a middle order bat now that Tex and Arod are washed up totally and completely.

        • Austinmac

          I couldn’t agree more they need a middle of the order hitter, but I don’t think they will spend $20M on one when they have other needs they seem to prioritize.

        • chris hines

          You can’t upgrade the OF without making Beltran the full time DH, which means Alex either has to start at 3B or become a bench piece. I’m sure some fans wouldn’t mind that but I can’t see the Yankees making that kind of move going into the season. They’d be much more likely to bring in a 3B than another RF’er.

  • blake

    @DCameronFG: Happy to see @mikeaxisa get recognized by @officialBBWAA. Big thumbs up to one of my favorites.

    Congrats

    • Rick

      Does this mean Mike gets a HOF fame vote?

      • blake

        One day

        • Rick

          Moose better survive a couple ballots then

          • blake

            Sadly I don’t see moose getting in anytime soon…..I believe he will one day though

            • ropeadope1

              As a visitor.

              • blake

                nah he’ll get in….check the numbers. He was a better pitcher than Tom Glavine and a lot of pitchers that are in. The Saber crowd will rally behind him when there is a lull in the quality of candidates.

      • ropeadope1

        It means Ichiro won’t go in unanimously.

  • Rick

    “Only a physical stands in the way of catcher Miguel Montero heading from the Diamondbacks to the Cubs. Young pitchers Zack Godley and Jeferson Mejia will go back to Arizona in the deal.”
    When God(ley) changes hands, that can’t be good for the rest of the league.

    • Y’s Guy

      mejia was listed as the Cubs #20 prospect. Godley didn’t make that list.

  • blake

    @redsproblems: Reds also open to trading Aroldis Chapman. Teams that have been said to be interested include New York Yankees and the Marlins! #RedsNews

    I mean that would be cool and all but lets focus our energy on the offense and starting pitching

    • Bret The Hitman

      Maybe we need Betances for a trade. The yankees also contacted Marlins and Braves for their closers.

    • Bret The Hitman

      Gardner for Aroldis Chapman. The Reds wanted Gardner for Brandon Phillips so there is precedent indicating interest.

      • blake

        I wouldn’t do that

        • Bret The Hitman

          First Kimbrel now Chapman… can’t help but think they have a team on the line with a bat asking for Betances.

    • YankeeFan™

      Omg Can You Imagine The Cuban Missele as our closer wow I would cry of joy lol

    • Bret The Hitman

      Gardner for Aroldis Chapman. Betances for Matt Kemp.

      • Mayan Brickann

        If the Reds are trading Chapman it means it’s a full blown rebuild in the Queen City. No 30+ outfielder gets it done. Go to the prospect list a couple posts ahead. That’s where the return would likely have to be from.

  • blake

    @JonHeymanCBS: hear orioles, rangers and mariners, 3 early kemp players, are all out on him. seems like might be padres or bust.

    Pounce

    • Y’s Guy

      yeah pounce.

    • Posada_20

      Dodgers want pieces each team not willing to give up. They want Walker from Mariners in any deal. O’s not willing to part with Gausman or Bundy, and Rangers will not give up pitching prospect Alex Gonzalez

      • blake

        sounds like the money is an issue too…..I’d just like to see what they’d ask for from the Yankees.

        • Chip

          Severino plus I’m sure

    • chris hines

      20M AAV for a 30 year old RF signed through 2019… run away!

      • blake

        who just posted a 140 OPS+ and is a career 128 OPS+ hitter…..on what amounts to a 5 year deal? Nah we couldn’t use somebody that can actually hit at all……

        • chris hines

          We can if he can stay on the field and play, shoulder injuries are scary for position players too. He’s heading into his decline years, making significant money, and has become a RF only option so it’s less attractive. He also has tendencies to go from hot to cold pretty rapidly for extended periods of time, he’s far from without faults for what is basically a 5 year 100M dollar deal for a guy heading to his age 30 season. If they were salary dumping him that would be one thing but I’m not giving up legit trade pieces and taking on the full responsibility for that contract which seems to be what they want.

  • Yank88

    Lets be honest… You guys would trade Betances?? He’s to valuable IMO

    • Bret The Hitman

      It does seem weird the Yankees have called on Kimbrel, Cishek and now Aroldis Chapman. Now if they could pull off Gardner for Arolidis Chapman and Betances for Kemp they’re essentially upgrading their OF from Gardner to Kemp and their pen from Betances to Chapman. Obviously it’s sheer guesswork but I suspect a team with a bat wants Betances. If it were just about the pen, they would have at least made an offer for Drob and settled the pen, but they might need the DRob money for the bat in a Betances proposal. I would guess the Braves or LAD would be all over him.

    • blake

      it would have to be special deal

      • Bret The Hitman

        So the Reds should ask a ton for Aroldis Chapman.

        • Mayan Brickann

          You’re getting one year of Chapman. Two months of Andrew Miller got the Red Sox a Top 100 prospect last season. So have a look at the Yankees Top 3-4 prospects, exclude Sanchez because the Reds are set at catcher for the next 6-7 years and go from there.

          • Bret The Hitman

            Says he’s a free agent 2017.

            • Mayan Brickann

              Two years then. Cost would be more than I thought then. Probably two high end prospects.

              • Bret The Hitman

                2015, 2016, 2017

                • Mayan Brickann

                  No. He’s a free agent after the 2016 season.

                • Canarsie Yankee

                  On B-Ref, at least, the year is noting the season following the last on contract (or team control). It is only two more years.

  • thunderdan162

    really hope they’re in on scherzer, i don’t see what the plan is without one of him or lester, at least not i plan i like

  • http://riveraveblues.com/ Mick

    Chapman is available?
    Yanks never made Drob an offer?

    • Bret The Hitman

      Curious isn’t it? They’ve now called for Kimbrel + Cishek + Chapman yet didn’t offer Drob.

      • Chip

        They wanted the draft pick and were probably concerned about Robertson holding up long term.

        • Bret The Hitman

          I’d say they were concerned about the money. Yes I know Kimbrel is expensive, but I think the call placed for him was to gauge interest in Yankees prospects which could be used for Justin Upton. Fact remains they need a middle order bat.

          • Havok9120

            Your obsession with connecting everything the Yankees do back to Justin Upton or Jon Lester may be approaching Fonz jumps the shark territory.

            • Bret The Hitman

              Don’t forget Matt Kemp, Chase Headley and Moncada.

              • Havok9120

                Moncada especially. The other two seem to be on a somewhat lower level.

                I honestly hope you aren’t taking this as an attack. If I said this to you in person, my tone would be “bemused” at worst.

      • Yankee Trader

        Called about Holland.
        Chapman rumor that he might be available is new.
        So If Lester goes to the Cubs, are the Yankees likely to lose Headley to the Giants?

  • SweetSpot

    A very interesting discussion on MLB. Despite all the late rumors to the contrary, the Yankees decided not to pursue David Robertson way back when after he turned down their $15 million qualifying offer. 1. They believe that the lefty-righty combination of Miller and Betances is as good if not better than Robertson and Betances. 2. They previously scored Judge and Clarkin with supplemental picks. 3. Miller was cheaper.

  • ScottinSJ

    If they don’t land either Lester or Scherzer (and maybe even if they do), the Yanks probably have little choice but to bring back Kuroda. At least you can depend on him to pitch every fifth day and keep you in the game.

  • Austinmac

    Isn’t Cashman having a meeting with reporters today? Not that we will learn anything other than they are open to making moves if they make sense.

    • Bret The Hitman

      Prices are high. It’s a process. We like our team. I’m not going to make a trade just for the sake of making a trade. Rinse-repeat.

      • Austinmac

        Truthfully, you don’t hear him saying he likes the team any more.

        • ScottinSJ

          Then he gets a couple of points for honesty.

          • Austinmac

            Cashman doesn’t say much, but he seems pretty honest when he does. Of course, it is usually vague enough to mean whatever you want to hear.

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    Joel Sherman @Joelsherman1 · 13m13 minutes ago
    #Dodgers have let teams know open to moving Dee Gordon. New front office likes OBP, not Gordon’s forte

    • Let’s Go Yanks

      Trade for Dee Gordon to play 2b
      Sign Headley to play 3b
      Trade Gardner for Porcello
      Prado takes over in LF
      Finish with McCarthy and Soriano/Romo

      • Wicomico Pinstripes

        I like Porcello, but Gardner’s contract has pretty good value. I don’t think I would trade that value for one year of Porcello.

        I’m not a huge fan of Dee Gordon, either.

        • CashmanNinja

          Gordon is fast, but that’s really about it. It was a career year. I’m much happier banking on Didi.

          • Wicomico Pinstripes

            Agreed. I thought he was on his way to being a AAAA guy before this year, but I’m still not convinced.

        • Centaur Hips

          I’ll never understand why fans want to trade four years of a good player for a one year rental. It’s like they’re so excited to have a tradeable contract they’ll give him up just to do a deal.

          • chris hines

            Well to be fair at 31 Gardner may be drawing the climax of his trade value, especially after showing any kind of power for the first time. I wouldn’t rush off to trade the guy but I could understand trying to get the most for him when you can, that said I don’t trust Porcello.

            • Centaur Hips

              I wouldn’t be totally against trading him. But what rental would be worth trading him for?

              • chris hines

                Justin Upton.

                • Centaur Hips

                  Not sure if sarcasm…

                  • chris hines

                    You didn’t say realistic trade you said which rental would be worth trading him for, Upton is a rental and more than worth trading Gardner+ for.

                    • Centaur Hips

                      In what world is 1 year of Upton worth 4 years of Gardner and more?

                      Upton might be worth a win over Gardner if that and then you lose 3 good years.

                    • chris hines

                      Upton turns 28 in August, Gardner turns 32 in August, pretty huge difference right there. Obviously you’d have to re-sign Upton to make it worth it but if you aren’t pulling the trigger on a deal that jettisons a soon to be 32 year old slap hitter for a potential superstar 27 year old we disagree.

                    • Centaur Hips

                      I would have to know I could sign him to do that trade and even then I would rather just keep Gardy and sign him as a FA. Otherwise it’s a dumb move.

                    • chris hines

                      Well they’re the Yankees they know they could re-sign, it would simply come down to if they want to.

                      I agree on just waiting until Upton is a free agent but If you told me he was going to sign an extension with the team he’s traded to and he would be traded before the deadline I’d make the deal. Gardner really has no where to go but down at 32 and beyond even if he stays good, Upton should theoretically only get better or stay at the same level at 27. Plus Upton fits our need better given that we already have a leadoff hitter and need middle of the order power, especially right handed power.

                    • Centaur Hips

                      “Well they’re the Yankees they know they could re-sign, it would simply come down to if they want to.”

                      Upton has a say in it you know. He might not want to come back, or not go with the highest offer. And that’s assuming the Yanks make the highest offer. We don’t necessarily need power or a middle of the order bat, just good players and Upton isn’t so much better that it would be worth potentially getting nothing from either player for .3 years

                    • chris hines

                      Very few guys turn down the highest offer and he would be 28 years old going into the following season after signing his deal. If that’s not the kind of guy you go all in on they don’t exist.

                      True they need good players but they also need offensive production. Gardner is coming off the second best full time season of his career with the bat with a wRC+ of 110, Upton is 121 career, coming off of a 133, with a 141 in his recent past. Gardner’s best skill set, his defense, should start to decline very soon if it isn’t already. Now he should remain more than viable in the field but once he’s no longer elite those scales are going to tip pretty violently in Upton’s direction. If they were similar ages you wouldn’t necessarily make the argument for the trade but there is a 4 year age gap, that’s very significant in this equation. Upton could theoretically get better with the bat over the next few seasons before you should expect any kind of dip, a 1-1 trade would be a no brainer between the two, which is why the Braves would never do it.

          • Pete22

            If you think the rental is a Benz and the 4 yr control is a Toyota, then you go with the rental. Also, the rental comes with a compensation pick (assuming the Benz is worth a QO) that can replace your Toyota if all goes well

            • Centaur Hips

              Gardner is projected for the exact same WAR Upton is. I do think Upton is a little better, but in no way is maybe a win or so upgrade for one year worth 3 more years of a 3ish win player.

          • Wicomico Pinstripes

            Gardner(6.4 WAR) and Porcello(6.3) have been equally as valuable the last two years. Gardner is due $12M in 15′ while Porcello is projected to make $12.2M in his last year of arbitration. If we assume they’re going to continue to provide similar production, this is basically a linear swap in monetary and value terms for 2015 and a salary dump of Gardner’s contract afterwards. While this trade would fill a hole in the rotation, it would also create another hole in the OF. Filling out the rotation via FA would be a lot easier than it would for the OF, so the trade doesn’t make much sense from that perspective either.

            I’m not totally against trading Gardner for a one year rental, I would just prefer the return value to be much more substantial than what was suggested.

        • Pete22

          I don’t think there is all that much surplus value at all to be honest. Assuming an annual 10% decline in f WAR from his 2 yr average, Gardner will be expected to produce, 2.9, 2.6, 2.4, 2.1 10 WAR and collect 50 million, or 5 million/WAR, Might be 10 million surplus value over 4 years or 2.5 million a year assuming 6 million/WAR market value.

          Rick Porcello had 4 WAR (run based) last year and will earn about 11 million this year in arb. Using the same 6 million /WAR as Gardners market value, he is expected to return 10 million in surplus value even if he drops to 3.5 WAR. He will also return a compensation pick that teams value at about 5 million. So Yankees come out ahead by 5 million, or at least break even if the picks a bust

          I make that deal in a heartbeat

  • Havok9120

    Holy crap, talk about selling low in that Montero trade.

    • Wicomico Pinstripes

      Yeah, they sold pretty low. To be fair, he’s 31 and was pretty bad in 13′ as well, so perhaps ARZ thought he wasn’t going to rebound.

      Still, 3/40MM is a great contract if you think he can get back to his 11/12 levels of production. I would have at least waited until the trade deadline next year, if it was me though.

      • Pete22

        He is a very good pitch framer an still hits RHP’ers well, that’s a good deal, and the pitch framing skills may help them with Lester who loves that

  • HoopDreams

    Word is the Astros offered Headley 5 years? or are they just trying to force the Yanks to overpay

    • CashmanNinja

      The Astros are just trying to screw with the Yankees at this point.

      • HoopDreams

        What I thought, mad they didn’t get Miller

        • CashmanNinja

          And ticked they also missed out on Robertson.

        • chris hines

          Or they want an upgrade over Matt Dominguez’s career 78 wRC+ and his 2014 wRC+ of 63 while playing poor defense? They have no real big commitments and if they lower the AAV over 5 years even if they have to eat the back two years they really aren’t in that bad a shape.

    • bernbabybern

      Where does it say this?

  • Brazen-NYY

    FROM LO HUD• Also from the BBWAA meeting, longtime Yankees blogger Mike Axisa of River Ave. Blues has been voted into the organization based on his work with CBS Sports. Good stuff for a good writer and smart guy. Glad he’s in.

    CONGRATS MIKE!!!!

    • CashmanNinja

      What an honor. Don’t abuse your new found power.

    • Chip

      Wowza, he’s in the big time now!

    • Austinmac

      Can we lump him in with the frequently described know nothing reporters now?

    • SweetSpot

      Congrats. Please keep out steroid users. Thanks!

    • Game 3

      He’ll be sued by Obama in 3…2…1…

    • Yankee Trader

      Mike
      Nice honor. Congratulations.

    • bernbabybern

      Undoubtedly the increased readership from LoHud put him over the top.

    • Reggie C.

      Will be known from here on out as MSM Mike …

      srsly, CONGRATS!

    • Pete22

      Now the Yankees will send him gifts and close the comment section to eliminate anti-Yankees comments.

      Seriously though, congratulations Mike

    • Mandy Stankiewicz

      One of our own is in! Congrats Mike.

  • SweetSpot

    Maybe the Yankees are smart not spending big this winter while they just make a few necessary moves. Get an inexpensive young shortstop and some middle-of-the-road starters and maybe a third baseman. If McCann, Beltran and Teixeira don’t hit; and if Tanaka, Pineda, Sabathia and Nova aren’t healthy, they’re not going anywhere in 2015 no matter who they sign now. That’s the key to their season.

    • Dude

      What a waste of the fans time

      • SweetSpot

        Fans don’t run the ball club. They can refrain from buying tickets and swag or watch on YES if they don’t like the product.

        • Dude

          So then whats the point of running a professional team if you do not intend to win and don’t care about fan participation?

          • chris hines

            Making money? Which they have done and will continue to do.

            • Dude

              You dont make money if your team sucks, fans don’t attend and people don’t subscribe to YES. I also would note it is a crime against baseball to not field the most competitive team possible.

              • Centaur Hips

                “it is a crime against baseball to not field the most competitive team possible.”

                Teams do that every year. It’s called rebuilding.

                • Dude

                  That doesn’t make it right. The spirit of the game is too put forth the highest winning effort possible.

                • Pete22

                  Its certainly justification to remove MLB’s monopoly. Write your congressman

                  • chris hines

                    The Federal League Redux!

              • Pete22

                People don’t subscribe to YES, they get Cable and have access to YES, so YES (and the Yankees) do not care all that much about rating since most of their money comes from the cable companies, and advertisements are small change by comparison

                • Dude

                  If they didn’t care why the 450 million last year which was related to the lack of attendance and lower tv ratings.

                  • Pete22

                    ???450 million what??? If you mean spending I would remind you they cut salary 30 million last year.

                • SweetSpot

                  I have DirecTV and I get YES as part of the MLB package.

              • Mandy Stankiewicz

                I WISH YES was available ala carte, via cable.

          • SweetSpot

            Who said they don’t want to win? Of course they want to win. They can’t please all the fans.

  • Mandy Stankiewicz

    Latest on Lester: Will he play for SF? “Mayyyyyybe” these updates are seriously ridiculous.

    • HoopDreams

      Lester update: I WANT MY BUTTER ON MY HAM

    • Canarsie Yankee

      Lester blew his nose. After the break, find out which logo appears to be in his snot.

  • chris hines

    I could see McCarthy getting more years than Liriano, maybe not at the 13M AAV Francisco but a lower AAV for more total money. They aren’t very similar players, Liriano has more upside in terms of pure talent but he hasn’t topped more than 163 innings since 2010. He may have only done it this past season but some team is going to project out those 200 innings for McCarthy and be willing to pay for it.

    • bernbabybern

      Liriano has thrown more innings over the past 3 years than McCarthy.

      • chris hines

        That was not my argument however. My argument was some team is going to see 200 innings this past season, and rightly or wrongly, project that out over the next couple of years and pay for it. They may get burned but we’ve seen this game play out before. Also as Yaka pointed out above no QO helps some team be more willing to take that gamble.

        • Farewell Mo and Jeet

          As we saw last year with Drew and Morales, the QO could significantly suppress a players value

  • Yankee Trader

    4 starters on Reds entering walk years.

  • YakaTanaka

    I wouldn’t assume McCarthy will get less than Liriano. I don’t know if he gets much more, but Liriano’s market was artificially suppressed by the QO.

  • Captain Obvious

    I’ve never liked Wally Matthews, but this idiocy takes the cake:

    “No team spends $21 million on two relief pitchers, not even the Yankees, and that’s what it would have cost to retain both Miller and Robertson on the roster.”

    Nah, they only spent $25M on Mo and Soriano in 2011-2012.

    • Centaur Hips

      Whether they’ve done it or not doesn’t make it wise. Soriano was a bad move that happened to work out well.

      • Captain Obvious

        Ummm, his point is “not even the Yankees” do that.

        That said, relying on Betances and Miller is bad move waiting to happen.

    • chris hines

      To be fair that was an awful deal in 2011 that was mitigated somewhat by Mo’s injury in 2012.

      • Captain Obvious

        Regardless, he’s flat out wrong and worse he references Soriano later in the piece.

  • Yankee Trader

    Another BP arm, 3/4 delivery, who the Yankees should consider is Luke Gregerson.

    What about K-Rod? 44 saves, 73 strikeouts in 68 innings, WHIP 0.985, and he’s 32

    Another starter who might hve turned the corner, Edison Volquez, 1.63 ERA over last 11 starts and 31 yo.

    Thoughts?

    • chris hines

      I’d stay far away from Volquez, the Pirates seem to get the most out of those kind of guys and I don’t trust his inability to control the ball or keep it in the park.

    • Gish

      I like the idea of K-Rod, but I think someone might give him two or three years at 5-7 million per. I’d take him for one year at 6 million tops.

  • Captain Clutch

    I just saw that the Tigers are very serious about bringing Scherzer back. It looks like if the yanks are interested they are going to have to go toe to toe with them and offer major dough.

    • bernbabybern

      Yankees say they aren’t interested, only Boras’ mouthpiece Heyman is saying this, and some others who just assume because the Yankees have a lot of money they are in on every big free agent.

  • Bo S8

    I want McCarthy back – just for the twitters. The pitching is secondary.

    Brandon McCarthy @BMcCarthy32 · Dec 5

    Hey Tigers fans @sagreeney has stupid electric stuff and you should feel lucky to get to watch him now. Terrible at fantasy football though.

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    Of for crying out loud, this is just getting silly, and the agents have not even presented the offers yet:

    The Lester sweepstakes “is nearing [the] finish line” and there is a “reasonable belief” that Lester could pick his new team by tonight, ESPN’s Buster Olney tweets. Olney adds that Lester will soon be presented with his final offers from teams, though WEEI.com’s Rob Bradford reports that Lester’s agents are not quite ready to present those final offers to their client. There’s “still a strong possibility” that Lester make his decision until Wednesday, Bradford writes.

    • bernbabybern

      Will Lester’s decision be televised, where he will tell us where he is taking his talents to?

    • Chip

      Yep, they keep saying he’s about to make a decision and it keeps just not happening

    • chris hines

      Not for one second do I think Lester doesn’t know what offers he has available to him at this point.

    • HoopDreams

      Lester seen picking nose, decision imminent

    • Dude

      This is pure Tex from 2008. He was supposed to make his decision then stated he wouldn’t be forced into a decision and then signed with Nyc out of nowhere

    • blake

      Never thought Lester would be this dramatic…..

      • Rick

        Those are the Levinson’s for you

      • Let’s Go Yanks

        All the winning bid needs is the promise that he can eat chicken and beer in the clubhouse during games regardless of whether he is pitching that day or not.

      • Pete22

        He is a showboat hound, perfect for NY

  • Pete22

    With news the Giants asst GM thinks Lester is leaning towards another team, and money won’t be the final decision maker, and my own personal belief Lester won’t go to the Cubs or Red Sox, and news the Tigers are going after Scherzer, and that Hal supposedly saying he would not consider taking the cheaper option Lester is obviously disinformation to provide cover for any secret negotiations, I am now wondering if Lester is not a real possibility to sign with the Yankees

    • Mike

      I think Lester will value being the ace of the Yankees. We can also offer the most money and the best chance to win.

      • Let’s Go Yanks

        Not sure about the best chance to win. Maybe a decade ago we could offer going to the playoffs automatically.

        • Mike

          Compared to Chicago and Boston?

          • Dude

            Id pick Chicago between the two because he could be the ace of the pitching staff of the team that ended the drought

          • chris hines

            Boston is much closer to being a contender with Lester, they’d still need to add another starter but they have more than enough trade pieces.

        • Pete22

          Do they care though. All those free Octobers where they can golf, swim, travel, etc rather than playing in the cold for a measly 300K

      • Pete22

        Not to mention endorsement revenues and staying on the East Coast

    • mustang

      Pete22 your missing things up I had you on my “Lester call out list” when/if he sign with the Yankees now you throw this out there.

      • Pete22

        I recalibrate once I get new information. Not saying its happening, just its more likely than I thought

        • mustang

          SMH
          Where is the damn delete button?

  • blake

    I hope all you guys that are reading the tea leaves as Lester is signing with the Yankees are right…..truth is though that these Yankees often mean it when they say they are out on a player.

    • Dude

      They have not said they are out. Sportswriters and sources have said that and they are often wrong.

      • NYCORNERSTONE

        His best friend is Ellsburry he wants to stay in al east Yanks may actually have a shot here

        • Mike

          I agree. Our chances are very good.

        • Bret The Hitman

          Are they really BFF’s? Where did you read that?

          • NYCORNERSTONE

            google it brett. i read the story last april it was the first time lester faced Ellsburry and i believe he tripled off of him

    • mustang

      Sadly you may be right.

    • Pete22

      Cashman refused to say he was out when asked, said it was in his best interests not to say

  • Tanaka2015CyYoung

    Reds looking to trade Chapman..?? Would’ve been nice if the Yankees were in on him few years ago…

    http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/12/09/the-reds-are-reportedly-open-to-trading-aroldis-chapman/

    • Let’s Go Yanks

      It would make a transformative and revolutionary bullpen – but it will never happen for the Yanks with Chapman coming there way.

  • Bo S8

    I want no part of Lester or Scherzer. With the state of flux within team personnel, chasing the mirage could be a killer. They need a year to distribute the chips, post elephants in the room.
    Do what you can and call it a day. Otherwise it’s wishcasting.

    • Rick

      This isn’t like the NFL or NBA where you suck, go into the draft, nail high end talent and then contend the very next year. Sucking for a year in baseball does absolutely nothing for you. The absolute best case scenario is you suck and your high draft pick makes the show in a year. Even then, they’re not going to be impacting the game all that positively for a long time.

      • Dan A.

        Sucking alone does nothing. But the team could improve their standing for the future by (1) acknowledging they’re not going to contend (2) saving their minor league talent and draft picks; (3) avoiding additional debilitating long term contracts; and (4) making trades to get younger, or going after guys who won’t be at full value until the future. These moves would hurt the team for this year (thereby they suck), but leave the team better off going forward (better minor league system, younger, more financial flexibility) than if they tried to be all in attempting to win this year.

        D-Rob for Miller illustrates this well. They got a cheaper guy who’s hopefully ascending and a draft pick, instead of a guy with a better track record who may be slightly declining. Talent wise though, it’s probably a wash.

        • Rick

          They can also just be smart about their moves and still try to contend and not hurt this time year while being able to compete.

        • Pete22

          Miller and D-Rob are about the same age. D-Rob is 1 month older.

      • Bo S8

        What I meant was – take a look at what you have post ST. Do CC, Teix and A Rod show any signs of life? Then at least you have some sort of framework to work with. There are all kinds of pitchers with one year left in their contracts. They could be dealt in season. Right now I’d focus on McCarthy and Kuroda and call it a day. The team can’t afford the big two and another possible 25 mil disaster.

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    regardless of Lester and the uphold, winter meetings so far just hyped up and much ado about nothing

    • Rick

      There’s been some decent action. Montero, Robertson, Samardzija. Not like there’s going to be a move every 25 seconds.

      • Let’s Go Yanks

        For almost two days and the hype leading up to this, it has been disappointing.

        • Rick

          I think it’s actually been more active than most of the past winter meetings. It gets hyped because all the GM’s are together. At worst, it lays the groundwork for future deals. A lot of feelers are sent out.

          • Let’s Go Yanks

            that’s the owner’s meeting is supposed to lay ground work.

            • Rick

              Huh?

            • Pete22

              They fix the prices teams can pay

        • YakaTanaka

          Probably more about unrealistic expectations and impatient than anything.

    • Pete22

      Still time left, most of the heavy lifting is done, now they are doing dinner and drinks to finalize some things, and later tonight/ tomorrow there will be more action. 3 hr time difference means you have to stay up late

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    From Sherman:

    Though he has never closed, Gregerson is viewed as the next-best reliever on the market after the exits of Robertson and Miller. The Yankees have always liked him.

    • Pete22

      He is pretty solid, I expect there is a lot of interest in him though

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    Love this melodrama of Theo against his old bosses: from Sherman

    There also was a question of whether Epstein, who left under strained relations with the Red Sox, might be personally vested to make sure the Cubs win for Lester rather Boston president Larry Lucchino, with whom Epstein had a particularly problematic relationship. One veteran agent said, “Theo might be able to handle finishing second for [Masahiro] Tanaka or [Yasiel] Puig or [Russell] Martin, but he doesn’t want to finish second to Larry.”

    • Pete22

      Theo actually was on good terms when he decided to leave, although leaving did strain relationships, as did the breaking news of chicken and beer gate in which Lester was deeply implicated.

      • Canarsie Yankee

        Chicken and beer is giving me an idea. Too bad the liquor store will close by the time I get home and I really don’t want to head to the gas station for Steel Reserve.
        Think about how much chicken and beer $150 million would buy.

        • Farewell Mo and Jeet

          You could buy a brewery and build a chicken coop out back.

        • Pete22

          Might see Lester looking like the Panda or Colon in a few years

  • Chip

    Well this was sure a lame day of non events

    • Rick

      All the big action occurred late last night. Still lots of dinner conversations to be had. Only 4 pm in San Di-Ago

    • Let’s Go Yanks

      Kudos to the ChiSox and Pirates for making aggressive moves with the guys they want and not being held up by this Lester charade.

      • Rick

        ChiSox have had an impressive offseason so far. I don’t think Liriano was really going anywhere other than Pitt. The draft pick compensation was a lot for him.

      • YakaTanaka

        Does every team deserve kudos every time they make any move?

        • Canarsie Yankee

          The Angels get a pity kudo for the Butera move.

        • Pete22

          If it makes their team better, yeah.

          • YakaTanaka

            These were based on timing…

      • Farewell Mo and Jeet

        I like what the Sox have done too with a reasonable deal for Robertson and what appears to be a pretty solid deal for Shark giving them a formidable starting trio of Sale, Shark and Quintana.

  • blake

    @BrendanKutyNJ: #Yankees tried for Jeff Samardzija, but couldn’t find deal w/ #Athletics

    • chris hines

      Makes sense if they think Semein can play SS.

    • Let’s Go Yanks

      Pretty bad job there if true. Kind of says something about depth of farm system.

      • Rick

        Can you elaborate?

        • chris hines

          #Cashmanfailed

          • Rick

            Only logical explanation

      • YakaTanaka

        A. Says something about Billy Beane and the A’s specific preferences and perceived needs as much as anything.

        B. If the Yanks had developed a SS, he’d be starting in the Bronx next year. And a late first rounder failing is what you should, on average, expect.

      • Tanaka2015CyYoung

        Culver should’ve never been picked in the 1st round… They could’ve gotten him 2-4 rd’s later.

        • CashmanNinja

          I had hope at first. Maybe they saw something nobody else did and were thinking outside the box. They need to get back inside the box because that was an awful pick in hindsight. At least they’ve got some really nice talent in the lower levels, but it’d be nice for a position player to start panning out.

        • blake

          yea him and DBJ were really terrible first round picks…..big reaches…..the good news is that since then they seem to have done a really nice job

    • TB

      How could Oakland not want Brandon Ryan

      • CashmanNinja

        I’m as perplexed as you are. There’s only 1 Brendan Ryan. Why aren’t the Twins offering Buxton for him? Certainly the Angels could at least offer Mike Trout if we ate the salary, right?

  • mustang

    Hal would really rise his stock value as owner in my eyes if pulled of Lester.
    It would be a “Boss” type move.

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    Rothschild, McCann, and the advanced scouts are going to have their work cut out for them again this year. More likely a patch work staff from the SP front. Yanks really could use a RP with closer experience to free Miller/Betances for the fireman earlier innings to save an injury riddled SP staff.

  • Pete22

    Got to admit, I am pretty impressed with Lesters agent in generating and handling the bidding war. His agency is the Levinsons ACES who was implicated to some extent with Biogenisis since
    they represented 13 of the 19 players involved. Makes you wonder.

    • mustang

      Agents had to be in on the PED thing. I remember reading a few months back how MLB might be going after them. Then that shit died out in like a day….. its like the MOB.

      • CashmanNinja

        They’re definitely in on it. I think there was a thing on Boras where he’d make up something about why a guy failed a test and what not, while being aware that they were taking this or that. Either way agents know more of the shady stuff that goes down, but they turn a blind eye on it. They’re enablers and they have every right to be since it means a bigger pay day for them in the long run. Even if a guy got caught he could still make $$ afterward. Just look at Nelson Cruz, Melky Cabrera, Jhonny Peralta, etc.

      • Pete22

        Might be one of their main job, s feeding players PED’s in a way that prevents them from testing positive, and none of these guys tested positive. Not saying all agents do this, and maybe not even the Levinsons, but you can’t rule it out. Its actually the MLBPA that certifies the agents and who could take action, but they may worry about someone blowing the whistle on players not implicated in Biogenisis. My theory MLB was hot after the records to cover up all the players who were involved, and not to find new names (the found no new names) to punish.

        Now the hot commodity is a guy coming off a contract year, same agent, and you know Biogenisis was not the only supplier. These are concerns you have with any FA really coming off a contract year though. No way to know if they were enhanced, and what they will be if they are not enhanced.

        Lester as a cancer survivor would be foolish to take PED’s, so he is probably clean

  • mustang

    There is nothing out there on Lester and the Yankees, but this mysterious 7 for 175 team hasn’t been called out.
    Still we might be going into tomorrow on this thing what’s the hold up?

    • Pete22

      Bidding war. Those who do it right keep it going as longs as the offers keep escalating. Its a balancing act since something could happen to blow it all up. Levinson probably has Lester locked in his room and has someone tasting his food before he eats, also keeping sharp objects out of Lesters hand, he probably has not shaved this week

    • Canarsie Yankee

      There’s a decent chance this offer is fake, just like I believe Headley’s 4/65 offer is also bogus.

    • Pete22

      I think its Toronto, if it exists, but I don’t think Lester wants to be there

      • Havok9120

        Based on what?

        If it’s your gut, that’s perfectly fine. I just hadn’t considered them and am wondering if I missed something.

  • YankeeFan™

    just sign someone or at least a good rumor from our side.

    • Dan A.

      Rosenthal: Sources: #Reds drawing heavy interest in Chapman as well as Cueto. Teams know that CIN needs to cut payroll – $17M is the current estimate.

      //

      Obviously the Yanks are in on both. Good enough?

      • Pete22

        Yeah, but they don’t have a lot of chips to deal

        • chris hines

          They don’t have a lot of MLB ready chips to trade, talent wise they could swing a deal for just about all the guys being talked about right now. The question really is more do they matchup with what those particular GMs have in mind as their preferred return and does it make sense to do so from our perspective.

          • CashmanNinja

            A team like the Reds would demand a lot for guys like Chapman or Cueto. I saw a thing where it said the Reds were trying to interest teams in Latos and Simon rather than Chapman and Cueto. I’ve always liked Latos, but he seems to get all of these annoying injuries. You’ll be lucky to get 180-200 IP from him. It’s 1 thing to sign him as a free agent, but we’d have to trade prospects and then hope to give a lot of money to him as well. I just don’t think he’s a good enough player for that right now.

            • chris hines

              Cueto’s only thrown 200 innings twice in his career, is about to be a free agent himself and is almost 2 years older than Latos.

          • Pete22

            I just can’t see the Yankees parting with Judge or or Severino and one of them need to be in any package, but who knows, and I am sure Cashman is checking in on them to see if there is a match

            • chris hines

              I don’t think we have any untouchables, just guys who require the right package.

              • Pete22

                I agree, just saying what I think the Yankees want to do, and their priority seems to be building up the farm system so they have a number cost controlled players on /or before 2018

        • Let’s Go Yanks

          sobering and very true

      • blake

        Well Cueto would be awesome but I doubt they have near enough for him

        • Canarsie Yankee

          Salary relief is quite the prospect.

          • chris hines

            Cueto is only making 10M for 1 year, not much to relieve.

            • Canarsie Yankee

              No, it’s not much, but eating the full amount would help if Cincinnati really is looking to cut payroll. Chapman is in line for an increase this year and the next arb year.

            • Tanaka2015CyYoung

              Think he means future salary relief…

              • chris hines

                If they don’t plan on re-signing him there is nothing to relieve them of and if they do they don’t want to trade him. You can’t relieve someone of something that doesn’t yet, and probably never will, exist.

                • Tanaka2015CyYoung

                  Was talking about Chapman since he’s most likely going to be to expensive for the Reds in 2016… Should’ve stated i was talking about Chapman,,,

                  • chris hines

                    Well Canarsie’s response was to Blake’s comment about how we don’t have the prospects to get Cueto, neither mentioned Champman.

          • blake

            cutting salary is part of it but he doesn’t make that much…..basically its a situation where if they can’t sign him they’ll want to trade him for a good return…..because that’s what most teams (besides the Yankees) do.

  • blake

    @Buster_ESPN: Source: Lester is nearing finish line. He soon will have final options to choose from; reasonable belief is that this will conclude tonight.

    • Canarsie Yankee

      I get it’s the job, but the non-updates are about as annoying as hearing absolutely nothing from the Vatican during the papal vote.

      • blake

        maybe he will send up the color smoke of the team he chooses

        • Canarsie Yankee

          That would be worth watching. Especially if some of the drapery has to be set on fire to make it.

  • Y’s Guy

    back to back open threads!
    Kind of interesting that Cashman actually admitted bidding up other teams on Drob. Everybody does it but few admit it. I think that’s also why we keep hearing that the Yankees might get in on Lester or Scherzer. Whether its the Yankees actually bidding up the price or an agent saying the Yankees are in it to bid up the price, it works to the Yankees favor!

    Now go for 8+ a nice makable option for a 9th year to Lester Cubbies!

    • pat

      Did his buddy D-Robb a solid on the way out, too.

  • pat

    If the Reds need to dump some money wonder what it would take to get Votto?

    • chris hines

      A blow to the head in order to think it’s worth taking on his salary until 2023.

    • blake

      yea that contract is bad bad bad….

    • Farewell Mo and Jeet

      I wouldn’t go near that contract that lasts until 2023 given his age and drop off in production plus injuries

  • HoopDreams

    Girardi coming up on MLB Network

    • chris hines

      Maybe we’ll get our first glimpse of new Yankee nicknames like Milley and Didiey.

      • HoopDreams

        Nuney

    • blake

      BigDan is ready to give us all the hidden meanings and subtext.

    • Pete22

      Shut it off, you won’t hear anything intelligent or enlightening, just the same old stuff

      • chris hines

        We learned he’s going to pencil in Jeter’s name on a lineup card at some point in ST to see if the coaches catch it.

        • Pete22

          Never said he can’t be entertaining, lol

        • Coney1

          You have to actually have coaches to play that prank

          • chris hines

            Well everything is filled, including assistant hitting coach, but hitting coach.

  • Y’s Guy

    Randy Wolf is looking to try a comeback. This has nothing to do with the Yankees, I just want him to make it back. I saw him pitch for el Camino Real High back in my LA days.

    • CashmanNinja

      I always liked Randy Wolf, but I don’t want anything to do with a “comeback” player like that.

  • chris hines

    CC Sabathia and Mark Teixeira are acquisitions for us now?

    • blake

      I really hate when managers and GM’s say that old hurt person X coming back is like making a trade or FA signing

      • CashmanNinja

        Yeah…almost all of the time they either take a while for the rust to get knocked off or they simply aren’t the same player they were pre-injury. It’s not as if either player is suddenly reverting to their 2009 versions. They simply aren’t those players any more.

        • chris hines

          Plus Teixeira played in 123 games this past year, the same as he played in 2012, does anyone really expect him to play in many more games than that per season going forward?

          • CashmanNinja

            Imagine if Tex could play like 140 games and be healthy during all of them. What a nice dream. The fact is that now Tex may be able to play 120+, but he’s not even completely healthy during those games. He always has some lingering injury with his wrist or hamstring that he’ll battle through, but it obviously effects his performance. I still wouldn’t undo the signing, since we won at the beginning of it, but it really does suck to wait for some of these long term deals to end when the players are obviously declining hardcore.

            • Dan A.

              And what makes it doubly worse for me, is he doesn’t go on the DL that often, even when he is hurt and missing games. So the Yankees are playing with a 24 man roster during that time, and don’t have anyone who can really play first base on the team too.

              • CashmanNinja

                There was that time last year where he missed like 2 freaking weeks, but wouldn’t go on the DL. After a week he should have gone on because it could have been retroactive to the previous week he missed, so he’d only wind up being on the DL officially for a few games…but more importantly we could have called someone up to give us some depth. But nooooo. He really milked the injuries. I’m all for players playing through cuts and bruises, but if you say you can’t play for a few days, and then it turns into a few weeks, you’re kind of a dick.

          • Havok9120

            I sure hope not. There is reason to think he might improve a bit with the bat in the second year out from the surgery, but other than that? He is what he is.

      • chris hines

        Dempster said it but I agree.

    • Coney1

      This is delusional. Mark Teixeira is almost 35 years old and is more concerned with being the next Zack Galifanakis and Sabathia is one knee setback away from retirement.

      • chris hines

        It was Ryan Dempster’s wording not Girardi’s.

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    Bryan Hoch ? @BryanHoch
    Girardi on Jon Lester: “If he wants to go to the National League, that’s OK with all of us — probably everyone in the American League.”

    Well, except for the Sox

    • Y’s Guy

      I’ve been saying that all week, I wanted the Dodgers or Giants to grab him and leave the Cubs to fight the RS for Scherzer. I’m hoping the Marlins are serious about Shields.

      • Let’s Go Yanks

        Looks as if the Tigers are going to fight the Sox for Scherzer.

        I am also very hopeful that all they are being offered for Cespedes are prospects/suspects instead of a starter for their rotation.

        • Pete22

          You mean fight the Yankees, he is supposed to be the January surprise. Red Sox won’t go near Scherzer at that money/years, Lester was considered only because he was homegrown and I don’t think they really wanted him either (just appeasing the fans), they will take the trade route with the surplus OF;’ers and prospects

        • Y’s Guy

          There is aloooot of pitching out there. I can’t imagine that paying $150M is going to be worth it. And Lester’s kind of on the fringes of the best pitchers in baseball imo. He’s an ace for sure, but there are at least a dozen guys better than him. Olney gave him honorable mention in his top 10 SP piece.

        • chris hines

          7:03pm: Tigers GM Dave Dombrowski told reporters (including MLive.com’s Chris Iott) denied Olney’s report, saying “I
          don’t know where he got that. That’s not accurate….I can 100 percent
          guarantee you that our situation has not changed whatsoever.” The Tigers haven’t had any new talks with Scherzer or gotten involved with any major free agents, Dombrowski said.

  • mustang

    Follow David KaplanVerified account?@thekapman
    Cubs meeting w/David Ross’ agent tonight. Jon Lester’s catcher in Bos. 2 very good MLB sources tell me they believe Cubs lead for Lester.

    Yea not looking good.

    • Dan A.

      As long as he doesn’t go to Boston, I’ll be happy. Him signing with the Yankees (with 0 reports tying them to him and many saying they weren’t signing him) never seemed realistic.

    • CashmanNinja

      It’s probably the best place for him to go if we don’t get him (Lester that is). Get him out of the AL and away from a team that could do some real damage with him (Giants). I’d have liked Lester, but the Cubs seem to want him more than anyone. I don’t think it’s the wisest use of money on their part because they have tons of young guys that are getting ready to make the jump, but at least that team is trying to field a competitive team. Those fans have put up with a lot over the years.

      • Pete22

        They don’t have much pitching in the system. The young position players coming up will pay for guys like Lester earning the minimum or low arb salaries

    • Yank88

      Again. not going to happen. Agree with Dan– as long as he doesn’t go to boston. Fine leave to the Cubbies.

    • mustang

      This is fucking baseball depressing

    • Bret The Hitman

      Heat traded two 2nd round picks to trade up 2 spots for Shabazz Napier, the PG Lebron considered the best in the draft.

      • Rick

        Yea, LBJ was just trying to kill his future as a GM. Shabazz has been awful so far. Anyone with any clue of the pulse of the NBA could foresee that he wouldn’t be a good NBA player.

  • Captain Obvious

    Wow, so basically they had no interest in DRob unless they failed to sign Miller. Amazing that they put a guy with a negative career WAR ahead of a prospect they developed and who did no wrong. I really hope they know something we don’t. Cause if it’s about the money and pick, they have officially become the Pirates.

    • YakaTanaka

      LOL

      • Captain Obvious

        If that’s the best you got, you truly have nothing.

        • YakaTanaka

          Not worth more effort

          • Captain Obvious

            LOL

    • http://shhhorsie.com Cheval Anonyme

      I don’t know why I’m taking this comment seriously, but Miller was converted from a failed starter to an ace reliever; like so many others, including Mo. You missed the obvious, Captain.

      • chris hines

        When was the last time Robertson started? His Freshman year of college when he started 3 of 32 appearances?

        • http://shhhorsie.com Cheval Anonyme

          Who are you talking to, that you think said Robertson was a starter?

      • Captain Obvious

        One season = ace now? Good luck with that.

        • http://shhhorsie.com Cheval Anonyme

          My calling him an ace makes a lot more sense then you adding in his WAR as a starter.

          • Captain Obvious

            Yeah, cause let’s just pretend half his career didn’t happen.

  • Coney1

    This Yankee team is a faceless, lifeless, overpriced corpse right now. With D-Rob and Jeter gone, there are only a couple of homegrown players on the team (Gardner, Murphy, Betances, Warren, Phelps, Nova). Another segment of the roster is overpriced, underachieving has-beens such as A-Rod, Teixeira, Sabathia, Beltran, and McCann. And the remaining two starters have serious arm issues (Pineda, Tanaka). This team has no natural leader, no mystique and aura, and no chance at a playoff spot.

    Why on earth would anyone pay those astronomical prices to go to a game this year to watch a team that, frankly, is not entertaining whatsoever?

    • Pete22

      Ref, Pirela, Lindgren, Mitchell, Whitley, Claiborne, Banuelos should all be on the team at some point next year

      But yeah, at this point (off season not over yet), it is not a team worth buying into

      • Coney1

        Pirela, Whitley, Claiborne, Mitchell and Banuelos are all fringe players. The only potential impact players there are Refsnyder and Lindgren, and one is a reliever.

        • chris hines

          Banuelos can be an impact player, he may end up being an impact reliever but he still has as much potential as he did before.

          • Coney1

            Again, though, only impact relievers. We just traded our only homegrown, healthy impact starting pitcher for a terrible shortstop. We have a couple of guys that potentially could be decent in a few years such as Judge and Refsnyder. However, the offensive players that were supposed to be the next wave of talent have pretty much bombed (Jagielo, Sanchez, Heathcott, Williams, Austin, Culver, Bichette, Romine, etc.).

            • chris hines

              I’m still not ruling out Banuelos as a starter and neither is the organization, but relief ace if his fallback option. He saw a rebound on his velocity slightly towards the end of the year, if he takes that a step forward this season he still has a chance.

              • Coney1

                I really hope so as I, having watched his minor league starts closely, always saw him as a poor man’s Johan Santana when healthy. But like so many of the Yankees prospects, he could not stay healthy. Given how rampant this was throughout the organization, both on the big club and the minor league affiliates, I have to assume it was an organizational problem philosophically and personnel-wise.

                • chris hines

                  He had an appendectomy and Tommy John surgery as his only real injuries, not really much you can do about either.

                  • Coney1

                    True.

                  • Farewell Mo and Jeet

                    Appendicitis? He should have been able to suck it up and pitch through that.

                    • Coney1

                      Same goes for Prado. What were they thinking? ;)

                    • Farewell Mo and Jeet

                      Roy Hobbs played with a hole from his stomach through the abdominal wall and he STILL hit a home run.

    • YakaTanaka

      How about waiting for the season to start to make such incredibly extreme recommendations?

      No natural leaders is especially ridiculous. The roster is full of vets known for leadership.

      • Coney1

        Keep drinking the kool-aid. All of these vets are not “Yankees”. They are paid mercenaries. This team has no Posada, Jeter, Rivera, or Pettitte to steer the clubhouse. It is a roster full of 2005 All-Stars now wearing Yankee uniforms. This isn’t the Yankees anymore, it’s Rock and Jock softball.

        • YakaTanaka

          Keep being completely ignorant!

          • Coney1

            Very easy to call names without any kind of supporting statement to back up your opinion.

            • YakaTanaka

              It is not a name. It’s almost definitely a fact. The supporting evidence is that you’re talking about the inner workings of a clubhouse there’s a 99.99999% chance you’re not a part of, and calling players who are traded or leave as free agents mercenaries while ignoring homegrown talent like Brett Gardner.

              Look up what ignorant means. That might help clear things up.

              • Coney1

                It’s a fact that I am ignorant by calling over-priced free agents mercenaries? It’s my opinion. This is a wholely unlikeable team IN MY OPINION. It’s a fact that Jeter, Rivera, and Posada in particular, were the elder statesmen in that clubhouse. Those guys are gone. Who has replaced them? CC? The guy who’s always hurt? McCann, who one coach has been quoted as saying “New York is not Brian. He’ll never be comfortable.” It’s a fact that the clubhouse is devoid of leadership. I have friends in the industry who are in that clubhouse on a daily basis and they noticed it last year, even with Jeter present.

                • YakaTanaka

                  Did you look up what ignorant means yet? Doesn’t seem like it.

                  • Coney1

                    I looked it up but it just said YakaTanaka

                    • YakaTanaka

                      We’re all ignorant about most things, my man. We just don’t all choose to go on wild tangents about subjects we’re completely ignorant on.

                    • Coney1

                      If you knew more about me and my connections in the industry, you wouldn’t be saying that. Again, I have friends who are in that clubhouse on a daily basis that would say the same thing.

                    • chris hines
                    • Coney1

                      Nah, these aren’t sources. They aren’t privy to the decision making of the Yankees front office, unless that are told something directly.

                    • chris hines

                      That’s what sauces are.

                    • Coney1

                      They would hear it at the same time as the general public, trust me.

                    • chris hines

                      I’m mostly just messing with you and I never pass an opportunity to post that gif.

                    • Coney1

                      Send that to Jake Wesley

                    • Farewell Mo and Jeet

                      Ask them if Arod just urinates anywhere he pleases around the clubhouse or if he actually uses the bathroom

                    • Coney1

                      I would ask the Centaur that! LOL

                    • YakaTanaka

                      If you knew anything about the reputations of the players on that team, you would not say any of this.

                    • Coney1

                      And these aren’t the types of folks that would necessarily have insight into whom the Yankees are getting this offseason, so I don’t want you to think I am going down that path. My name is not Wanzies.

                    • Farewell Mo and Jeet

                      We already have a connection as to who the Yankees are getting this offseason with Big Dan and his 14 year old twitter geek man crush.

                    • Coney1

                      Haha! Are we talking about the infamous Jake Wesley?

                    • Farewell Mo and Jeet

                      The Adam Schefter of MLB.

                    • Coney1

                      I find all these twitter geeks hilarious. Anyone who knows Brian Cashman’s modus operandi knows he operates in pretty much top secret when he is truly interested in someone. Even Randy Levine and the like don’t know until it’s brought to them for financial approval. Random folks who say the Yanks are in on Scherzer are full of crap. The yankees might be in on him, but that is just a guess on the Twitter geeks’ parts.

                    • Farewell Mo and Jeet

                      The Yanks are usually in on someone so float enough BS rumors and eventually you’ll hit on one.

                    • Coney1

                      Great point. I’d love to see how many inside “sauces” as Chris Hines calls it, had the Yankees getting Martin Prado, Chase Headley, and Brandon McCarthy last July, or Nick Swisher back in 2009 or Lance Berkman, Javier Vazquez, and Kerry Wood in 2010. But over the past few years, inside “sauces” had the Yankees getting Yu Darvish, Prince Fielder, Ryan Braun, Giancarlo Stanton, Felix Hernandez, among others.

                    • YakaTanaka

                      The opinions of your anonymous sources are not much in the way of evidence for a bunch of crazy proclamations that INCLUDED statements about what the roster will look like opening day…

                      “They have no shot at a playoff spot.” “I have no inside sources with info on what the Yankees will do.” do you not see how this verifies that you are making ridiculous proclamations out of ignorance?

            • Farewell Mo and Jeet

              I’m surprised it only took till 8:45 for Ted to start a fight with someone. What a shocker.

        • Rick

          I much preferred Rock and Jock basketball. The 10 point hoop was awesome.

          • Coney1

            Agreed. Far more entertaining.

        • Centaur Hips

          Are we seriously arguing about leadership?

          • Coney1

            Says the Centaur ;)

          • Wicomico Pinstripes

            Don’t you know the Yankees can’t win without a natural born leader? I mean… other teams can do it, sure. But, the Yankees? Fuggetaboutit!

            • Centaur Hips

              Perfectly summed up.

    • Alexandernevermind

      McCann a has been??

      • Coney1

        What McCann did you watch last year?

        • Alexandernevermind

          So because he had a bad season in his 1st year as a Yankee he’s a has been?? There’s a chance he could have a bounce back season, too early in his Yankee tenure to call him a has been.

          • Coney1

            He’s 31 years old and hasn’t had a good season since 2011!!!! This isn’t just a bad first season as a Yankee. He’s been regressing for 3 years.

            • chris hines

              Regressing and being bad aren’t the same thing. He only played in 102 games since he was rehabbing from his surgery early in the year but a 121 wRC+ in 2013 was a damn good year. 2012 he had the shoulder injury which lead to the surgery so you can write that season off to some degree, the concerning thing is he did so poorly this year without anything to pin it on other than maybe changing league and pressing to live up to the contract. Still I’d give him another year before writing him off completely.

              • Coney1

                That’s fair. But the chances that he will be what they signed him to be, i.e. a middle of the order bat, are not likely.

                • chris hines

                  With our current lineup he could be a middle of the order bat with a wRC+ anywhere at 115 or above, especially if he goes back to being strong against RHP and weak against LHP.

                  • Coney1

                    They need that to happen immensely

            • Alexandernevermind

              I will give him a chance and see what he does this year and be hopeful about the upcoming season.

  • Let’s Go Yanks

    Tigers GM Dave Dombrowski told reporters (including MLive.com’s Chris Iott) denied Olney’s report, saying “I don’t know where he got that. That’s not accurate….I can 100 percent guarantee you that our situation has not changed whatsoever.” The Tigers haven’t had any new talks with Scherzer or gotten involved with any major free agents, Dombrowski said.

  • Bret The Hitman

    Months ago BigDan wrote about Hal’s budget and the spending constraints that would impact this offseason but nobody would listen.

    • Havok9120

      That’s nonsense. A very large group of us have been talking about it since long before he ever showed up or gave his opinion on the matter. Even people like me, an ardent DRob fan, knew that money was likely too tight to be spending 20 million AAV on two relievers.

      We held out hope, sure. We’re fans, after all. But not many people have been ignoring the budget to embrace dreams of Lester/Shcerzer + Miller + DRob + Headley + supporting pieces + Moncada.

      That some were willing to keep believing a huge spending spree was imminent to the point of getting angry with people who said otherwise is not a reason to suddenly realize BigDan is a visionary. That would make me, Y’s Guy, Dalek, Retro, Rick, Cansarie and two dozen other regulars visionaries as well.

      • Bret The Hitman

        Only enough room for one visionary, sorry.

        • http://shhhorsie.com Cheval Anonyme

          Many a genius has been derided in his lifetime.

      • mustang

        Its truly hard to believe that this is the way Hal is going to run this team the hit he is going to take as far as overall revenue will be disastrous.

        • YakaTanaka

          What is the way he’s going to run the team? Supporting $200 million payrolls and giving RPs 8 figure deals?

          • Coney1

            A $200M payroll, foolishly spent, does not a championship win

            • YakaTanaka

              Do you believe that the owner makes most personnel decisions?

            • Pete22

              300 million will do it though

      • Rick

        I like being a visionary, I could get used to this.

      • YakaTanaka

        Exactly. That financial restraints will impact every single team’s offseason is just common sense, and the off-season is far from over. Cashman just had a comment today about how their payroll will he impressive, which could mean more spending is soon to come.

        • Pete22

          Cashman probably thinks last years w/o Arod was impressive, so adding Arod makes it more impressive, but not compared to 2003-2009 if you adjust for payroll inflation and revenue growth

          • YakaTanaka

            Baseless speculation…

    • YakaTanaka

      LOL!

    • http://shhhorsie.com Cheval Anonyme

      That’s got to be sarcasm.

    • Jorge Steinbrenner

      *spits out bourbon*

      Son, you gon crazy.

  • chris hines

    You have to watch PTI just for the ridiculous statements made by Tony and Michael…

    On the White Sox moves yesterday.

    “These additions make the White Sox poorer. Samardzija doesn’t win games, he has a nice ERA but he’s only had one winning and season and went 5-6 on a playoff team last year. David Robertson had a poor year taking over for (Mariano), an ERA over 3, a 4-5 record, I’m not seeing pennant here”.

    • Farewell Mo and Jeet

      Did they really cite the win/loss record of a closer as evidence of his effectiveness? My god, get a clue.

      • chris hines

        Kornheiser did, Wilbon yelled out the number of saves he had over the top of that but didn’t really refute anything except citing Jeff having played at Notre Dame and “coming home” as a plus. Wilbon hates all saber stats though so he’s not much better than Tony.

    • Wicomico Pinstripes

      I used to like PTI, but it’s been about ten years. Basically, since I figured out what type of show it was. It does have some comedic value, but that’s about it.

      I still think Cheap Seats was one of the best shows ESPN has ever produced.

      • chris hines

        Like many of the comments on the internet it has no real value but it’s entertaining.

        I liked that show as well, I’m a fan of the Sklar Bro’s comedy as well so that show was a great mix of baseball and funny. Man it’s been a while since I’ve heard someone else reference that show, thanks for the memory!

  • mustang

    Lets take a step back. At this point the agents hasn’t even given Lester all the offers so well see.

    • Rick

      I think that report that his agents are holding offers from him is the dumbest thing I have absolutely ever read. Do you know how quickly an athlete would fire his agent? This isn’t a game to the athlete, it’s their f’ing life. If Lester says keep me informed of all offers so I can decide by X day, his agents better damn well abide by that.

      • Rick

        BTW, just to be clear, that isn’t attacking you. That’s calling BS on that media report.

      • Pete22

        Not exactly witholding but preparing a nice summary/presentation to make it easier for him to decide. Players are like a CEO here, he does not want to see all the details and read through a 100 pages of offers. He wants the summary and analysis that outline the pros and cons of each offer in a manner he can quickly absorb

        • Rick

          Absolutely – I agree with that. But, on the eve of signing for a report to come out that agents are withholding offers is just a crock of shit. Maybe 3 weeks ago they held things back when, as you suggested, they didn’t want to waste his time with things he wouldn’t consider. Not now though.

  • Rick

    Would love to see the Yankees go after Medlen. I think he could be a fantastic high upside signing.

    • chris hines

      Yeah he’d be a good get on a minor league deal with plenty of incentives.

    • Wicomico Pinstripes

      Depends on the contract details, obviously. It was his second TJS and he had it in mid March, so he’s most likely not going to be ready for opening day. It’s a tricky situation, but I do like the upside.

  • Bret The Hitman

    Are the Yankees in on Max Scherzer and/or Jon Lester? “It’s not in my best interests to say,” said Brian Cashman.

    __________

    How would it negatively impact your best interests to say you were not?

    • chris hines

      Saying you’re definitely out makes sure agents can’t use you to drive the price up, something he most definitely wants if the Red Sox are trying to make a final push.

      • Bret The Hitman

        Cubs take care of that.

        • chris hines

          Adding the Yankees just further drives up the price, he just admitted to doing it to Robertson and he took Carl Crawford to dinner having absolutely no interest in him. Faking interest one way or another is a classic Cashman move.

          • Bret The Hitman

            He should take Lester to dinner, really go full kabuki

            • Coney1

              That was a slick move with Crawford for sure

              • Bret The Hitman

                Take Lester to dinner and a movie and then post pics to Instagram with captions like “Hangin’ wit my boy Les”

                • Coney1

                  With a big blank check, a la Publisher’s Clearing House, just to mess with Cherington

    • Havok9120

      Because it would drive down the price for them.

      • Bret The Hitman

        Oh so we’re out of the playoff hunt and downgraded to the role of spoiler. And the season seemed so young :(

        • Coney1

          HAHA

        • YakaTanaka

          You asked a question, and people answered it.

          What is your problem?

          • Bret The Hitman

            It’s all hypotheticals. If by protecting his best interests, Cashman means he wants to be used by agents as a price driver for these pitchers then that assumes one of them will ultimately sign the player and the only consolation is Cashman maybe inflated a little or possibly didn’t inflate the price at all. Meanwhile let’s say the Red Sox, with a crappy rotation, salvage Lester and got Cespedes for him. I’m hoping the more obvious protection of his best interests is in not admitting interest because you don’t want to cost yourself more money. At least this way there is a path to displacing CC’s fat ass and damaging the Sox rotation directly rather than just nibbling at their purse like a bunch of punks.

            • Bret The Hitman

              And that right there is “my problem” with the reason given. It’s a legitimate reason, it answers my question but my problem is if it’s the real reason.

            • YakaTanaka

              You are ascribing way too much importance to a simple “no comment.”

    • Coney1

      To drive up the price on direct competition, i.e. the Tigers and/or Red Sox

      • Bret The Hitman

        Amazing how many think we’re relegated to cashed-out spoiler. It’s fuckin’ sad if true.

        • Coney1

          Certainly looking that way right now though.

        • chris hines

          Not having interest in Lester doesn’t mean you’re “cashed out” it just means you have no interest in giving a 30 year old a 7 year deal for 150-170M. Regardless of what you do or do not plan to spend you always want your competition to spend more than they have to, it takes away their resources.

          • Bret The Hitman

            Spoiler is still a loser role.

            • chris hines

              Someone might want to tell the 2011 Yankees that because Cashman played the same game with Crawford for a team that went on to win the division with a 97-65 record.

              • Bret The Hitman

                Yay!

            • YakaTanaka

              If they wanted to play spoiler, do you think they would express public interest in a player, meet very publicly with his agent, and make it generally known they were interested… or do you think they’d sit on the sidelines and say “no comment?”

              People are answering your question, not telling you what they think Cashman is doing.

            • Coney1

              I don’t think it’s a loser role. It’s a loser role if you are only concerned with blocking other teams and not improving your own. Blocking other teams, or “spoiler” as you call it, is part of the business. No different than putting in a waiver claim in August to prevent the competition from improving. It’s defense.

              • Bret The Hitman

                I realize it, it’s a crappy reason for a no comment and I hope not the real reason. I hope the reason is because showing interest would drive up price on yourself.

                • Bret The Hitman

                  It’s the weaker reason, to be clear in the case of Lester/Scherzer.

          • Coney1

            Exactly.

        • YakaTanaka

          What are you talking about? People are just answering your question.

          They’ve reportedly been speaking with Headley and Cashman has made it pretty clear he will add more pitching somehow. Who thinks the Yankees are cashed out?

      • Pete22

        Which also drives up the price on your future acquisitions which is why this is not the reason. It may be that they are negotiating with someone else but want them to think they are in on Lester or Scherzer to drive their price down, plus the CBA I pointed out

        • chris hines

          That’s going to happen anyway, he just admitted to having no interest in signing Robertson after signing Miller, he just wanted to up the price. Whether Lester signs for 150 or 170 it won’t make the next crop of aces any cheaper next offseason.

          • Pete22

            He wanted to help D-Rob, and the Yankees had already got their man so don’t care much

    • Pete22

      Its against the CBA anti-collusion agreement. Expressing disinterest somehow could be construed as an effort to impact a players market value negatively.

      • Joey Domingues

        Yep, these are the rules! He is going to get Justin Upton via trade + sign him long term and sign Scherzer! Gardner trade possible to follow Upton addition. (sources) “my Christmas wish” lol… Would sure be nice!

  • HoopDreams

    Peter Gammons old ass is still on TV, crazy. He scouted Babe Ruth as a pitcher for the Red Sox

  • Centaur Hips

    i wish Lester would sign already. I’m anxious to see the ripple effect. Hoping it will involve Headley and McCarthy coming back.

    • chris hines

      I’d really like to see another option emerge over re-signing McCarth, a trade or something. I’m not sure it will happen but I do not want to see him in pinstripes for the next 4 years.

      • Centaur Hips

        I’m not sure he’ll get 4 years. Possible though. Maybe one of the Reds or Padres starters are available but most of those guys would take a hefty price.

        • chris hines

          It’ll be 3 for sure, probably somewhere in the 3/39 range Liriano got. Add in no QO and coming off a 200 inning season and I just have a gut feeling he’ll get 4 years. I could probably live with 3 but I’d still rather exhaust any other option first.

          You never know what can happen, no one talked about Pineda as a possible trade target before that move went down. Cashman has always done a pretty good job of getting the unknown move done.

          • Coney1

            Exactly right. Cashman does not telegraph his moves. It’s very rare. The Cliff Lee free agency pursuit was an obvious example.

    • Pete22

      Giants out now so that means they are all in on Headley

      • Coney1

        Not necessarily

  • Joey Domingues

    Any Idea on the type of package Yanks would have to throw at Atl, for Upton???

    • Centaur Hips

      *Adds tally mark

    • YakaTanaka

      Too much to make it a real consideration is my guess.

    • Pete22

      Nothing, Of is not a priority for the Yankees with their 3 starters locked in for 2,4 and 6 years, they need SPing

    • Coney1

      They don’t have anything to suit Atlanta’s needs. They want a front-line starting pitcher and a second baseman. If they still had Shane Greene around I would say a Greene, Refsnyder, Sanchez deal might start the conversation.

      • chris hines

        So you’re telling me Gardner, Judge, Severino, and Phelps couldn’t start that conversation? I think it would just about close the conversation, just doubt the Yankees would go that far for someone they could theoretically just sign next offseason.

        • Coney1

          They mentioned wanting a high-end starter and a 2nd baseman. Gardner and Judge would not interest them. Severino is at least a year away and may project as a late-inning reliever and Phelps is a filler type at this point. Mets would be a better match with Daniel Murphy and Noah Syndergaard or Zack Wheeler

          • chris hines

            Every team in the league probably has some interest in Judge, just depends on how much and they are replacing two young corner outfielders so another young one wouldn’t be bad. An OF of Gardner, Upton, and Markakis, with Judge on the way in a couple of years isn’t a bad start to rebuild. I can’t tell you what they would or wouldn’t take but I imagine they wouldn’t stop talking to you if you started with that package.

    • Jorge Steinbrenner

      For one year of Upton? Here, have Danny Oh.

  • mustang

    Dear Hal,

    Your starting rotation for next season;

    Tanaka-partially torn UCL
    CC- kneel
    Pineda- recovering from everything.
    Phelps- 2014 DL stint and 4th SP
    Nova- Tommy john
    McCarthy- not sign and a history of injuries

    These things are not good.
    Just saying.

    Your truly
    Mustang

    PS Merry Christmas unless you don’t sign Lester.

    • chris hines

      CC learned recovery kneel? Is that like rest where you lose 1-3 turns asleep or is more like roost where you regain half HP and can attack the next turn?

    • YakaTanaka

      You know that every time anyone from the org has been asked, they’ve made it very clear they’re going to add SPs, right?

    • Centaur Hips

      There are other starters out there you know.

      • mustang

        Please name them but they can’t;
        cost a pick
        cost lots of money
        no trades

        • chris hines

          I’m not suggesting any of these names but according to your criteria

          Brett Anderson, Chad Billingsley, Josh Johnson, Kuroda, Masterson, Medlen, Brandon Morrow, Alexi Ogando, Felip Paulino, Peavey, Ervin Santana, Vogelsong, Edison Volquez, and the other Chris Young.

          • chris hines

            I wouldn’t mind taking a shot at Morrow, try him at starter and if he doesn’t look good make him the closer.

          • YankeeFan™

            lots of injury prone starters ughh.

            • chris hines

              Well when you tell someone they can’t trade, sign a guy attached to a pick, or give a lot of money you sort of limit your option to that.

            • mustang

              Exaclty! Garbage pickers that what the Yankees have become.
              Take Ervin Santana of the list they he cost a pick

          • Jorge Steinbrenner

            And that’s free agency. We have no clue what this market, in fact, looks like.

            • chris hines

              Well he specifically said no trade names.

              • Jorge Steinbrenner

                Mustang, stop that.

          • YakaTanaka

            Santana got a QO.

            • chris hines

              That’s right he did, he’ll probably also get a pretty decent sized contract as well. Plus he’s just not the best fit for this park considering his tendency to get homer prone and streakiness.

        • Centaur Hips

          Lester costs lots of money so he doesn’t even fit that.

  • HoopDreams
    • Joey Domingues

      McCarthy will be ours.

    • mustang

      LOL

    • Wicomico Pinstripes

      Reminded me of Angels in the Outfield.

      “Bass sets… and sets… and sets again.”

    • Coney1

      He’s hilarious

      • Bret The Hitman

        He really does have a good sense of humor.

        • Sccrkeepr34

          Follow his wife, She’s even funnier!

    • Bret The Hitman

      Sounds like a victim of the holdup (I pray)

    • Mandy Stankiewicz

      Bahahah! Ah man I gotta’ follow him.

    • Centaur Hips

      Anyone find it odd how there hasn’t been a single rumor about him?

    • bernbabybern

      Funny, but McCarthy hasn’t signed anywhere either.

      • chris hines

        Likely waiting for leftover market after Lester and maybe Scherzer signs.

  • Dan A.

    Giants are out on Lester.— Alex Pavlovic (@AlexPavlovic) December 10, 2014

    Giants beat writer

    • Pete22

      Which probably means they know they are out and Lesters decision will be coming at any time

    • Centaur Hips

      MLBTR has Cubs as favorites.

    • Bret The Hitman

      This is the team that earlier felt better than they did 24 hours ago about their chances on Lester.

  • Coney1

    Joel Sherman
    ?@Joelsherman1

    17s17 seconds ago

    Lester called #sfgiants directly to tell them they r out of running

    0 replies

    7 retweets

    4 favorites

    • Coney1

      This is going to come down tonight then. Cubs seem to be it.

      • Pete22

        Theo reported hanging out of his hotel window

    • Bret The Hitman

      Did he call the Yankees yet?

  • ChristIsKing

    I think Lester signs with Yankees… Let the ninja Cashman praises begin..

    • Coney1

      I would like someone who is covering the meetings on-site to mention where Cashman is at this moment. That may be telling. If he is nowhere to be found, that could be interesting.

  • Rick

    Dear Lester – stay the front door out of Boston. Thanks.

  • Pete22

    Lester calling all the losers. Just a matter of time before the winner is announced. Cashman popping Champagne in his suite?

  • chris hines

    8:36pm: Lester is still finalizing his choice between the Cubs and Red Sox, Joel Sherman of the New York Post tweets.

    • Yank88

      I have a feeling– back with Red Sox… -_-

      • Pete22

        That would be so anti-climatic

    • Pete22

      Where is the mystery team? I have to pick the Cubs though if thats the choice

      • Centaur Hips

        Agree. Keep him out the division. If he does go to the RS I’d hope it’s for 10/300.

    • Bret The Hitman

      It took him this long to decide between the Cubs and Red Sox?

      • chris hines

        Sounds like it took this long to eliminate the rest of the options and take final proposals. Now he’s deciding between Sox and Cubs, if you believe the sauces.

        • Pete22

          He probably has decided from day 1 where he wants to go and the whole process has been designed to maximize dollars from them

          • chris hines

            I imagine he had a preference but if someone was going to sweep him off his feet he was going to give it every chance to happen, why wouldn’t he?

            • Pete22

              I am sure he left open that possibility, but sounds like that has not happened unless there is a mystery team

  • Bret The Hitman

    OK, deep breath, sister soulijah moment, Lester is the chicken and beer bandit whose antics helped put Terry Francona on the hot seat. Now he’s this melodramatic attention whore, about to f’up my winter meetings (Im sick of CC’s fat ass). So screw em.

  • Bret The Hitman

    So now Headley gets to spike his price tag via the SF Giants. I’m looking forward to it.

  • HoopDreams

    Scherzer wants over 200 million? phss, fuck off

    • Pete22

      I almost hope Lester does sign with the Red Sox for 120 million so the price on Scherzer drops. Nah. let him go to the Cubbies

  • Pete22

    A smart reporter should be following the roses to see what room they go to

  • Pete22

    Lesters going to diss us all and make us wait while he parties,

  • Bret The Hitman

    This post reveals nothing but the blue button got you excited.

  • ChristIsKing

    Lester is going to sign with Yankees.. I got a feeling

    • Yank88

      I wish!

    • Joey Domingues

      we should

    • YankeeFan™

      im still hooping we steal Lester from boston like we did with Tex that surprised the crap out of me.

    • Jorge Steinbrenner

      It’s probably gas.

      • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

        Probably premium.

  • Jorge Steinbrenner

    Who was it that asked what a Winter Meetings thread would look like on here? Looks like a shit ton of crazy to me.

    • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

      A shit ton of baseball foamers.

      • Jorge Steinbrenner

        OHMYGODCASHMANISNTDOINGEXACTLYWHATIWANTHIMTOWHYDOESNTHESAYTHETHINGSIWOULDSAY!!!!

    • YakaTanaka

      It’s sad

      • Jorge Steinbrenner

        Nothing but conspiracy theory and the entitled expectation that everyone with a price tag on them should be a Yankee.

        • Dude

          Oh please everyone with a price tag who is useful to the Yankees shod be a Yankee

          • Centaur Hips

            This is exactly why the fanbase is viewed as spoiled.

            • Dude

              Ok have the team lower ticket prices and allow Yes nationwide on regular cable and lower stadium food and merchandise prices.

              • Pete22

                Don’t forget free parking

                • Dude

                  Exactly catch Padres fever at Yankee Stadium.

          • Jorge Steinbrenner

            Shut up, person who may, or may not, be BGT.

            • Dude

              Who are you Hal Steinbrenner’s son? You want to follow a team with the garage starting rotation that is currently on the roster?

              • Jorge Steinbrenner

                It’s not nice to continue talking when you’ve been told to shut the fuck up, Andrew.

                • Dude

                  Thats not a denial

                  • Jorge Steinbrenner

                    Good night, Andrew.

                    • Dude

                      Good night little Hal.

          • Centaur Hips
        • Mattycakes

          I have followed this blog for years (but never posted). It seems like that is par for the course around here.

          • Jorge Steinbrenner

            Always a degree of crazy. Yeah. It’s 100 degrees of it this time around.

            • Pete22

              100 times more comments, used to be dead here

              • Mattycakes

                I love how many more people post. That’s why I decided to finally join up.

              • Centaur Hips

                If you’re new how would you know? I’m kind of new and wouldn’t say it lacks commenters at all

                • Pete22

                  I used to pop in now and again over the years, just saying there are a lot more comments now than before you know what

              • Jorge Steinbrenner

                In your fucking dreams it was.

                • Pete22

                  I used to have some fun here, but I am a corpse, or maybe it was a dream

    • bernbabybern

      If you are a New Yorker, you should be used to crazy.

      • Jorge Steinbrenner

        That’s a different crazy.

  • Dude

    I think the end is near

    • Pete22

      Yeah, its 8 pm in San Diego, dinners almost over and they like to make announcements before they get too drunk

      • Dude

        Lets go management trim payroll suckass ball club at premium price.

  • blake

    @FeinsandNYDN: For those fans out there waiting (hoping?) that the Yankees jump in late on Jon Lester, it’s not going to happen. Looks like Cubs or BoSox.

    No no….Yankees all the way

    • Mattycakes

      They need to believe in the ninja Cash magic.

    • Dude

      As previously stated very sad.

    • Pete22

      I was wavering when they said the Tigers were all in on Scherzer, but thats been shot down, so am now back to my original prediction that Lester is not going to wear pinstripes. Still hope Scherzer is the Yankees January surprise

  • mrmoss

    Go to the Cubs Lester

  • Dude

    Sad really a mult multi billion dollar sports franchise is sitting like a pitiful giant why the Red Sox lap them.

  • bernbabybern

    I thought before the offseason got started that the Yankees were going to think they already have two aces and don’t need to pay a lot for another, and I’m sticking with that prediction. #bigdan

    • Mattycakes

      I like bigdan :(

      • bernbabybern

        This was actually my prediction, I put the hashtag there because it’s sort of bigdan style.

        • Mattycakes

          Very bigdan style.

  • Dude

    They’re laughing at us in Boston

    • bernbabybern

      Boston has a crap starting rotation so they shouldn’t be laughing.

    • Dan A.

      Who cares? What Boston thinks of us is totally irrelevant.

      • Dude

        Lester, Hamels, Cueto my prediction of their top 3

    • Mattycakes

      Let them laugh. Boston will always have an unhealthy obsession with the Yankees.

  • Centaur Hips

    Feels like Lester isn’t going to sign just yet. Headley should be off the board by the end of the meetings.

    • Pete22

      Its his 1 hr with Marilyn moment, and he is milking her for what he can get

  • Dude

    June 1982 if only Steinbrenner could have convinced Bo Jackson to sign,

  • Dude

    Did you know about the three homeruns he hit in one game at Yankee Stadium?

  • mrmoss

    be minimal news tonight…all the GM’s will be watching SAMCRO

  • blake

    Wonder what Mat Latos would cost?

    • Centaur Hips

      Obviously Gardner. :)

      • Jorge Steinbrenner

        Half of Gardner for Upton, half for Latos. Where does the third half go?

        I’ll say it again: I am kinda, sorta curious what it would take to get Aroldis.

        • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

          Could you imagine Betances throwing 97-100 then Chapman throwing 100-103 back to back? R-L even.

          • ScottinSJ

            That’s nice and all, but someone needs to pitch the first 5 or 6 innings. I think we need a couple of starters first.

            • https://www.flickr.com/photos/roadgeek/ Roadgeek Adam

              Of course. I vote the Queen of England.

            • Sccrkeepr34

              Starters – we dont need no stinking starters… Just 9 elite relievers – one for each inning…;)

          • Mattycakes

            That would be a sight to see. David Phelps for Chapman. Do it Cash.

            • Chip

              Throw in Melky and IPK while you’re at it

        • Centaur Hips

          Well he would become a FA after 2016, so 2 years of an elite closer plus the chance to negotiate with him before he hits FA. They might want a major league player in return, but off the top of my head I’ll say that’s 2 top prospects and maybe a fringe guy.

          Any examples of relievers traded with 2 arb years left?

    • chris hines

      He’s in such a weird spot with his combined age, lack of team control, his four straight years of ascending games played and innings pitched, recent injury, declining K rate, and huge drop in velo related to the injury.

  • mustang

    This the list chris hines came up with after McCarthy if they even sign him.
    Brett Anderson, Chad Billingsley, Josh Johnson, Kuroda, Masterson, Medlen, Brandon Morrow, Alexi Ogando, Felip Paulino, Peavey, Vogelsong, Edison Volquez, and the other Chris Young.
    GARBAGE PICKING!!!!!
    Can’t trade for anyone of value becuase they don’t have the chips. Then they let go of DRob that could at least fortified the garbage you see above.
    Good luck filling those $325 seats!!

    • Centaur Hips

      You’ve offended Hirok.

    • Mattycakes

      I wonder if they could make a run at Eovaldi.

    • Pete22

      Kuroda would be fine, as would Masterson

      • mustang

        A 39 year old and a guy that look horrible last year. .
        Please

      • chris hines

        Masterson would be a disaster in Yankee Stadium. His lefty splits and his numbers away from Cleveland suggest he would get blowed up in NYY.

    • chris hines

      Don’t be pulling me into your hate posts mustang lol

      • mustang

        Not at all just giving you credit for the list. Thanks

        • chris hines

          Just messing with you. I would disagree we don’t have the chips though, they may not want to part with them but they could land a pretty good arm through trade,

          • mustang

            Maybe, but others have better and most of those guys are 1 year and free agents in 2016.
            Again a reason to do Lester.

            • chris hines

              Well you really can’t say most since most pitchers in baseball aren’t a year away from free agency. A lot of the ones mentioned as potential options are but that’s because they are a year from free agency, doesn’t mean they are the only players available. When Cash got Pineda his name came out of nowhere, there wasn’t a single rumor involving him being on the block which is usually his MO.

              As far as signing Lester, not having a great on hand option isn’t a good reason to commit that kind of money/years to a player who’s 30. You rarely regret letting a contract like that pass you by, especially since it would more than likely shut the rest of the offseason down for us outside of minor league deals.

    • Mattycakes

      What about Harang?

    • Chip

      Let’s say they resign McCarthy as I somewhat expect them to do.

      You have a rotation of Tanaka, Pineda, CC, McCarthy and Phelps. Nova will be back in Juneish. I’m assuming they’ll sign a guy off of that list and have him or Phelps start the season as the long man. That’s really not a bad rotation. Keep in mind that you’ll still have Bryan Mitchell and Manny Banuelos sitting in AAA to give depth and who knows how hard they’ll continue to push Severino. Also, before you dismiss those guys, consider what Greene looked like at this point only a year ago.

      • Mattycakes

        Good points. I’m hoping Banuelos can rebound. Have a prospect crush on him.

      • chris hines

        If they have to commit 4 years to McCarthy to pull that off though it’s not the best long term solution for a short term fix.

        • Chip

          I agree that 4 years is a tough pill to swallow (if indeed they need to go beyond 3 to get him) but McCarthy is exactly the type of pitcher the Yankees should look for going forward. He limits walks and is a ground ball pitcher. With the Yankees suddenly having good defensive infielders, I feel like he could have a lot of success.

          That being said, who the heck knows if he’ll still be effective if he doesn’t keep his newfound velocity. Hard to say what caused it at 32 or if its just a short lived spike.

          • chris hines

            Plus he has an injury history to match or surpass the other 3 ahead of him in that rotation. The whole thing is a bad bus ride away from a mash unit, a bad elbow, two bad shoulders, and a bad knee.

            • Chip

              And the solution to this is to sign guys to huge money contracts that will take them into their late 30s? I’m all for getting guys who can throw 200 innings a year but I don’t believe you can point to any pitcher and tell me that he’s built to last and won’t break down.

              • chris hines

                I’ve actually never favored going after Lester or Scherzer so not sure where you’re creating that strawman for me from.

                Never said that either, I was just giving my opinion that I’d rather not commit 4 years to a guy with serious shoulder injuries in his past when we already have a lot of red flags for injuries in our rotation.

                • Chip

                  My bad, I get conversations confused and thought you were one of the ones on the Lester bandwagon. My opinion is that having a pitcher be just merely adequate for 3 or 4 years isn’t a terrible downside whereas anything over that can really mess up your team so I’m comfortable with the injury risk of McCarthy.

                  • chris hines

                    That’s the point though, the downside to McCarthy is more than just him not being adequate. He could be god awful and missing most of those 4 years. I mean previous to this season he hadn’t thrown more than 135 innings since 2011 his first healthy year with the A’s. Over the last 4 years using bWAR and the current market rate of 7M per win he’s only been worth 43.4M, so if he repeats that over the next 4 years on a contract worth 44M he’d come in slightly below actual value of the deal and that includes throwing 200 innings this year.

                    I don’t mind giving mediocre innings eaters contracts like that, I can even talk myself into ace like producing injury concerns on deals like that. But McCarthy is an average talent injury risk, just not keen on ponying up something in the 4/44M+ range for that much uncertainty and lack of upside.

                    • bernbabybern

                      He had a 2.89 ERA with the Yankees last year over 14 starts. That’s his upside.

                    • Chip

                      And over those 14 starts he had a .301 BABIP and 13.7% HR/FB so that ERA isn’t a mirage. He actually underperformed his xFIP slightly

                    • chris hines

                      His HR/FB ratio was actually 12.8% and I really don’t subscribe to the xFIP notion that HRs are out of a pitchers control and therefore should be regressed to league average. His career FB/HR ration is 10.3% and it’s actually gone up each of the four years he’s been a starter, plus Yankee Stadium isn’t super pitcher friendly in that regard so I wouldn’t expect that number to ever fall under 10% with that as his home park.

                    • chris hines

                      What is a small sample size? Over the past 3 seasons he’s pitched 446 innings to the tune of a 4.00 ERA and batters have hit .282/.316/.424 off of him. For his career he’s actually a 4.09 ERA/ 4.00 FIP with batters having hit .266/.313/.418. It’s much more likely he’s those two very identical set of numbers than an arbitrary 14 start sample size.

                      The biggest concern is actually that he’s managed to log only 446 innings in 3 seasons despite one of them being a 200 inning season. If he had those kind of numbers but was throwing 200 innings, or close to it, every year with clean injury histories I’d have much less of a problem with it. I just don’t trust him to all of a sudden be a work horse who eats innings at the age of 31 going on 32. That means you’d have to trust him being healthier from age 31-35 than he was at any other point in his career, which is a pretty steep gamble for someone who’s been a rather mediocre pitcher over the course of his career.

      • Chip

        Also, I totally forgot but they have Esmil Rogers who could slide into the rotation if they start losing guys

        • chris hines

          You mean the same Esmil who has a career 5.50 ERA/4.72 FIP in 225 innings starting?

          • Chip

            Having a guy with 225 career innings in the majors as your 8th or 9th starter is actually pretty unusual. Most teams would be pulling guys straight out of AA with no experience by that time

            • chris hines

              Which would be a positive if he was effective at all. That’s well below replacement level though, so the only thing those numbers prove is that he has no business ever being in a starting rotation ever again.

              • Chip

                Yes but like I said, most teams don’t have 9 guys who are even at replacement level that could start in the majors. He’s a live arm in the bullpen who has a chance of finding an extra gear and being a solid contributor. The upside is that he can also soak up innings and you don’t need to baby him.

                • chris hines

                  Most teams don’t carry guys with that many starting innings below replacement level because there is no value to it. He has value as a middle relief option but he shouldn’t even be discussed as a rotation option. Could you theoretically throw him out once or twice? Yes you could but he’s well below replacement level so you could get the same kind of production out of just about anyone you can snatch off waivers or the minors. Waivers is how we got him in the first place after all.

                  Well if he just got plopped into the rotation mid season after relieving all year that’s exactly what you’d have to do because he wouldn’t stretched out. You can’t go from 15-20 pitches a night to 100, most guys who just get thrown into the rotation as emergency starters like that don’t make it 5 innings, not exactly soaking up innings.

  • mustang

    Max Scherzer Looking For $200MM+ Contract
    By Mark Polishuk [December 9, 2014 at 11:03pm CST]
    Max Scherzer is looking to break the $200MM threshold in his next contract, according to FOX Sports’ Jon Paul Morosi (Twitter link).
    LOL things have gotten cheaper!

    • Mattycakes

      That seems insane.

    • Sccrkeepr34

      I think it was Dempster that said that a few days ago on hot stove. He fully expected to Max to get 200. I dont understand what the yankees are doing. How do you not go after Lester, when you know full well what the alternatives are. Stupid!

      • mustang

        THANK YOU!!
        and don’t sign DRob.

        • Sccrkeepr34

          Dont mind DRob as much. They probably value the pick more than they value him. But, you think if they value the picks then they are never going to be in on Scherzer, either.

          • mustang

            “Dont mind DRob as much” i didn’t either if they went after Lester. But now no Letser and no DRob to back up the garbage SP that’s left.

      • Chip

        Pitching is actually their strength right now. I’d rather let Lester and Scherzer go this offseason if it means we sign either Heyward or Upton next offseason

        • Sccrkeepr34

          If we’re being honest, i think the yanks go after Samardjza next off season. I was looking at some rosters, i think the yankees really only match up with a few teams in terms of trades. IPK , maybe or one of the A’s younger guys, SO trades are probably not going to happen. Unless cashman pulls something out of his ass.

          • Chip

            I do think its possible that they’ll go after him. I want to see if he continues with his new found control first.

            If you’re not giving up Severino or Judge, my feeling is that the Yankees just aren’t going to get an impact bat or anything but a back end starter on the trade market

            • Sccrkeepr34

              honestly how close is judge? Im asking because i dont follow the prospects that much, except for what you guys debate about. Also, if he’s close, when do you move gardner and what can you get for him?

              • chris hines

                He finished A+ last year so he’s yet to have an AB in Trenton. If he absolutely rakes in AA this year he could see Scranton by the end of the season, but he’d have to rake. He’s probably looking at a mid 2017 call up earliest for any real kind of duties.

              • chris hines

                He finished A+ last year so he’s yet to have an AB in Trenton. If he absolutely rakes in AA this year he could see Scranton by the end of the season, but he’d have to rake. He’s probably looking at a mid 2017 call up earliest for any real kind of duties.

              • Chip

                He’ll start out next season in AA I assume. If he hits like he did last year, he’ll be in AAA in no time and then who knows what happens. I assume they’ll try Tyler Austin first if they have a long term injury in the outfield but Judge would probably be the guy after him. Wouldn’t be surprised to see Austin and Judge have a spring training competition to play right field in 2016 with Beltran being relegated to full time DH duties

    • Chip

      He’ll get it too. You’re going to have the Tigers, Dodgers, Red Sox and Cubs all in it with big money to spend. I think/hope the Yankees stay away from that one.

      • Scott

        Man I hope the Yanks don’t go for that contract. Way too much money and too many years. Scherzer will be a right handed CC in 4 years.

  • Dan A.

    Rosenthal/Bowden: Lester to Cubs. Finally

    • chris hines

      Now just need the figures.

      • Dan A.

        6/155 via Yahoo. I’m really happy he didn’t sign in Boston.

        • chris hines

          Apparently Boson topped at 6/135 and Giants went to 168ish.

          • Dan A.

            I can’t get over how they valued Lester since last year. If they made that offer to him last spring, there’s a really good chance he’d still be a Red Sock. But they low balled him, and here they are.

            • Chip

              To be fair, he had come off of three straight years of good but not great peripherals. His 2014 is a huge outlier and its hard to bank on him being that guy going forward

            • chris hines

              Not everyday you see someone turn down the most money from the reigning WS Champs. Pretty sure I would have teamed with Bumgarner on the Giants, they lost Panda but they seem to know how to get just enough offense to supplement their pitching.

              • Chip

                Thing is, he could be a part of a historic Cubs team. On the Cubs, he’ll be the big guy in the rotation even if Arrieta is better than him going forward. They have a ton of talent coming up and he could ride that wave and go on to be a legend in Chicago. Or maybe he just really doesn’t want to live in Cali

                • chris hines

                  Could be but I’m not making them anything close to the favorites for the crown in the NL let alone the whole league. Talent that young and inexperienced usually doesn’t all click that quickly.

                  • Chip

                    Well he’s got 6 years to wait around for it to click while he sleeps in his bed made of money

                    • chris hines

                      I’m not one to judge what makes someone else happy but I wouldn’t have turned down 30M+ dollars just to be a part of a hypothetical Cubs championship. The Giants seem like the better bet to win with simply because they’ve proven they can do it. He may just really like the idea of pitching mostly day games or something weird though so who knows.

              • Dan A.

                It’s so weird, they lost him and Sandoval, even though they reportedly offered the most money each time. Why are they disadvantaged with free agents this year? They just won 3/5 WS’s.

    • Mattycakes

      Yes! Didn’t go to Boston.

  • Chip

    I assume we will find out where Headley goes sometime tomorrow then.

    • chris hines

      I’d bet on McCarthy before Headley.

      • Chip

        Maybe but Headley was surely waiting on Lester so he can get a better offer from the Giants. We’ve seen a ton of rumors on him and some of them have stated that he’ll be a done deal by the end of the meetings. I’m not sure we’ve heard anything floated about McCarthy yet

        • chris hines

          McCarthy’s market is more directly tied to Lester than Headley. For all we know Headley wants to come back to NY so he’s going to wait as long as he can in order to use the Giants to draw every last penny out of the Yankees. It’s only the end of Tuesday, the end of the meetings still have a while before they get here.

          • Chip

            Aren’t the meetings essentially done Thursday after the Rule V draft? That’s only a bit over a day for the market to come together for McCarthy.

            • chris hines

              You’re right I was thinking it was running through Friday. Still if I had to wager an amount of money that mattered to me I’d say McCarthy signs first just because I think he’s the next pitcher to go. Shields may sign next but I think he and Scherzer drag this thing out a while, especially Scherzer being a Boras client seeking 200M.

          • forensic

            I would agree with Chip that I think Headley will sign before McCarthy. McCarthy was tied to Lester, but he’s also tied to Scherzer and Shields as maybe the best option after them. He’ll theoretically get better offers after they sign. I don’t think he’ll wait for Scherzer to actually sign, but maybe he will wait for Shields to and some Scherzer suitors to identify themselves. There hasn’t really been any talk about him yet. Headley was maybe only waiting to see what happened with the Giants and now there isn’t much standing in his way of really getting the negotiations going and making a decision.

  • YankeeFan™

    Lester is a Trader lmaoo

    • forensic

      Is he a looser too?

  • Centaur Hips

    Lester to Cubs? Good. RS still need pitching. However, the Cubs rebuild looks like it just sped up a ton.

  • MTU

    Glad Lester picked the Cubs over the Sux.
    Dominoes should start to fall more quickly now.

  • HoopDreams

    Ha, guess that’s what Boston gets for lowballing Lester

  • blake

    Of course as soon as I went to bed the new broke…..

    This is kinda how I saw the whole time……theo has been chasing a top starter for awhile now and he just wasn’t gonna let his guy Lester get away…..

    This is the coming out party signing for the cubs…..it’s symbolic and says we are finally ready to contend…..yes it’s a big overpay….but they can afford it. The cubs should be pretty interesting this year

  • blake

    As for Boston……this is a blow but they didn’t match top money and they insulted the guy last winter……want the big boys you have to play with the big boys.

    I am curious to see what they do now/…..everyone is sure they’ll try to trade for Hamels but I’m not so sure. The phillies have all the leverage in those talks and Boston knows it……it may be counterproductive for them to to go down that road

    They could try to sign Shields and a guy like McCarthy both for what Lester woukd have cost or make a trade other than Hamels

    • Austinmac

      I still think they will add two starters, including a top drawer one like Hamels.

      The meetings end tomorrow and the Yankees usually bolt after the Rule 5 draft, if I recall. So, today is the last really active day. Some movement from the lowest WAR team in the division would be nice.

      • blake

        I’m hoping Headley comes today….Scherzer isn’t signing anytime soon because Scott boras so it’s basically Headley or a trade that we don’t know about

  • blake

    All the writers are convinced that Scherzer is getting 200 million……I just don’t see it. There are too many concerns about his delivery IMO……I don’t think as many teams with bid on him as Lester either……

    • Y’s Guy

      but if Lester gets $170, then someone will be stupid enough to give Scheerzer $200, he’s a top 5 pitcher, Lester is not.

      • blake

        We will see…..Scherzer has more warts and less track record than other pitchers who have pushed that limit.

        If the right teams get involved it could happen absolutely…..I just don’t think it’s a given at all

        • Y’s Guy

          If teams would look at the longer term, they wouldn’t have gone bonkers for Lester either. He’s posted a 8.4 bWAR the past 3 seasons. No way that equals 6/$150. Teams get caught in a frenzy and can’t see past what they did on their best day most recently.

          • blake

            I think most of the teams bidding preferred Lester though which is why they bid….he’s left handed ….has a less stressful delivery and doesnt’ cost the draft pick.

            • YakaTanaka

              That conclusion is not supported by the evidence. Lester got $155 million and Scherzer is reportedly still asking for $200 million. Those teams may prefer Lester at $155 to Scherzer at $200, though even that’s not clear: they may be interested in both but Lester and his representatives were just more aggressive about getting a deal done earlier in the offseason.

          • YakaTanaka

            That certainly happens sometimes, but it may or may not be the case here. Cubs may not think he’s the P he was in 2014 (in fact I’d be shocked if they do), but still think adding him was worth the money. The details of revenue drivers for teams are something I’m not very familiar with and I think that goes for most fans.

  • Y’s Guy

    Very glad that the RS missed on Lester. Hamels is the better pitcher, I just hope RA sticks with his insane demands and a bidding war breaks out.

    • blake

      Oh it’ll cost them a fortune…..Pat Gillick is still around you know